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Playing the Market: How to use Trading Guilds to make Pure Profit.

SFBryan18
SFBryan18
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Just a few months ago, I was kicking and screaming about being forced to join trade guilds just to sell. Well, you get what you get, and you make the best of it. I looked around the boards, and eventually found out how to join good trade guilds with trading posts. First one I got into was the Elder Scrolls Exchange, which is a great organization with three guilds, one in each faction. I eventually got a few more invites from keeping my eyes open in zone chat for recruiters. I've dropped a couple lower selling guilds for guilds with more activity, and now I am at a point in the game that has become very addictive. This back story is only to explain how you can get started if you are not yet in the ESO market. Everyone will have their own connections, and preferences on how active they want to be in trading. The purpose of this thread is to inform you on how you can make a decent profit from these traders while also helping to stabilize prices for all products. This thread is not for elite, but for the average player like myself.

Now let's picture a product. I will use a recipe as an example. New players want to learn recipes so they can craft food. How will they get these recipes? Well, they could find them in the world as we all do, but you soon learn by looking through the trade posts that there are hundreds of recipes to learn. So a customer is looking through a merchants inventory and looking for what to buy, and they see a recipe for 227g. Let's call it "Enriched Fishy Sticks". What makes this customer believe this price is fair? Well, comparing it to other merchants listings of course. The customer will want to buy the cheapest, so if in another kiosk, they can get "Enriched Fishy Sticks" for 89g, then they will buy that instead. As long as there is a supply, the merchants can keep undercutting the price until all the supply is gone, and then they can raise the price again.

This is where I, and others like myself come in to make a profit. Using a few add ons, you can get a pretty accurate idea for what items are selling for. First add on which is a must have is Deome's DataDaedra. This add on scans all the recent sales in each of your guilds, and gives the average prices for what items sold for. This is a medium between the highest and lowest, and a pretty good indicator of how valuable an item is. Remember that, the hotter your guild is, the higher their prices will be, but they will also have a larger sales history for more accurate prices.

Once you have the prices, it's time to shop. For every few players that know how much to sell an item for, there will always be that one who has no idea what they are doing. They do not visit the forums, and they do not use add ons. They just play their game and collect things, and eventually join a random guild to trade with but don't know what price the item should sell for. Some will sell for too much, and some for too little. That's where we capitalize. Using the prices from datadaedra, we can go around to different trade kiosks and look for cheap items which should be selling for much more. Another add on I use for this purpose, and also for selling my items, is AwesomeGuildStore, which allows you to easily sort the kiosk searches and even bookmark your favorites. Now remember, as a merchant, you are not looking for things you need, but for things that will sell. Every player in the game might be in need of something to improve their character, so if there is a provisioning stack, or a recipe, or maybe some materials for crafting armor, all of these items will be desired by someone.

By playing the market, you soon learn what people want. And I'm telling you right now, they want provisioning, alchemy, enchanting, recipes, and motifs. This is obvious information, but you need to remember this when scanning other kiosks, because using the numbers given by datadaedra in the tool tip, you will spot obvious profit just waiting to be claimed. I'm talking about a stack of 100 selling for 50g, which players have payed over 1,000 for. They are there if you take the time to look. Another example is a recipe that is selling for 27g, but is valued at over 100g. Since sales space is limited, I like to look for at least a 300% profit selling item, but also keep in mind if players even want to buy it. You will be suprised, and for every one item that fails to sell, there will be a few that make you a lot. No risk, no reward, but datadaedra also shows the number of these items that were sold, and these numbers only go back a month. So if many of them have been sold, you will know that the product is desired.

I like to organize each of my guilds by importance, and post the most expensive stacks in the best selling, but I also only post certain materials in the lower selling guilds so I can organize my inventory more easily. For duplicate items, I always cancel the listed item to combine the stack and then post it again to save space. Even though you will pay the listing fee, the profit will be much greater. The last add on I like to use is so I can get a good idea of where and what I have sold. Shopkeeper 1.0 (Classic) is a great tool that shows you a list of your sold items with the guild it was sold in. It also has a useful tool to show how many of those sales were from the kiosk, and how much you make a day average. You may see many prices are higher than the average from dattadaedra. This is because merchants can ask for whatever they want, but that does not mean it will sell. And while they are stuck with a store of overpriced merchandise, you can charge the average price and make profits based on selling many items.

Now back to the recipe. Like I was saying, the customer will look for the cheapest prices they can, so if they see "Enriched Fishy Sticks" selling for 89g, they will buy that, and you will be left with your product and no sale, which will eventually drive the price lower. However, if someone like myself goes around and plays the market, buying all the under priced items and selling them at average, I will be eliminating the supply of cheap goods and keeping the price up. The more players there are that do this, the more prices will stabilize. It is a very fun mini game to get into, and I hope this thread helps others to find a new appreciation for playing the market as I have. Recently, I have reached V1 with my main and have started an alt to play the other factions with. My main is now a full time merchant, so when I'm questing with one character, I'm buying and selling with the other. It's pretty fun and I recommend giving it a try.
Edited by SFBryan18 on January 2, 2015 12:24PM
  • Bloodystab
    Bloodystab
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    Hello,

    I give a try to the Deome's DataDaedra but it dont work at all for me, no prices tracking. Or maybe it require some time? Did few scans on the Guild Shops - relogs.

    Before i was use Guild store search - extended and worked like charm.
  • Almariel
    Almariel
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    perhaps try Shopkeeper instead of Deomes DataDaedra. That is the one i am using and it does almost the same from what i read here.
    @Sevryiel - daheim auf dem PC-EU Server
  • Bloodystab
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    Almariel wrote: »
    perhaps try Shopkeeper instead of Deomes DataDaedra. That is the one i am using and it does almost the same from what i read here.

    Showkeeper works too, i have some data on tooltips. Asked guys in Guild about this DataDeadra and they told me its bugged or something and dont work for them too.

    OP can You tell us what version are You use and how it works? :lol:
    Edited by Bloodystab on January 2, 2015 1:57PM
  • Elsonso
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    I find that if I price my stuff just low enough, compared to what people like the OP are selling for, they will come along and buy me up to try and control the market. I can sell twice as much at the lower prices by betting that someone will buy me out so they can resell it for more.
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  • SFBryan18
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    Bloodystab wrote: »
    Hello,

    I give a try to the Deome's DataDaedra but it dont work at all for me, no prices tracking. Or maybe it require some time? Did few scans on the Guild Shops - relogs.

    Before i was use Guild store search - extended and worked like charm.

    When you log in, go to settings and hit summon. Then wait, and after a few minutes you'll see each guild update with the number of sales recorded. Once it is finished, I turn off the option to run it every time you log in.

    For shopkeeper, the prices fluctuate based on how frequent the sale was. I thought this would help at first, but found that the prices went up and down too drastically from only few sales. It is a good reference but datadaedra has a more reliable average.

    If you use datadaedra and shopkeeper together, turn shopkeeper off when you update datadaedra or you'll get a conflict message in the chat box. When datadaedra is finished updating, turn shopkeeper back on. Datadaedra has its own shopkeeper, but it takes forever to load so I use the classic version.
    I find that if I price my stuff just low enough, compared to what people like the OP are selling for, they will come along and buy me up to try and control the market. I can sell twice as much at the lower prices by betting that someone will buy me out so they can resell it for more.

    Depending on where the guild gets its kiosk, some players need to sell cheaper. Better location kiosks can buy cheap and sell high. It's actually a very fun fantasy market.
    Edited by SFBryan18 on January 2, 2015 2:51PM
  • timidobserver
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    By posting this you just hurt your ability to make gold.
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  • Elsonso
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    SFBryan18 wrote: »
    Depending on where the guild gets its kiosk, some players need to sell cheaper. Better location kiosks can buy cheap and sell high. It's actually a very fun fantasy market.

    I have two primary trading guilds. One has a spot in a hot location but sometimes the prices get on the high side or they end up with a ton of inventory in the same time.

    I prefer volume over price. I don't want my stuff sitting in the guild store too long. If I see that there is a jam up in one guild, I will move to another and sell at the prevailing rate in that guild. Selling more stuff for less money means more work, but it provides a more steady income.

    You are very correct in that this is a fun fantasy market. When I have stuff that is moving quickly at higher prices, I will buy cheap stuff from others and resell. When I have stuff that is moving slowly or is over priced, I will try to sell to the resellers for a quick buck.

    What makes it fun, at least for me, is that I have to decide where to buy and where to sell, in addition to the amount that I feel I can sell at.



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  • SFBryan18
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    By posting this you just hurt your ability to make gold.

    Yea, but it's just a game, and if people buy up all the cheap stuff, without the supply prices will be higher which means the stuff I find while questing will sell for more. So either way, I will make gold.
    Edited by SFBryan18 on January 2, 2015 2:19PM
  • timidobserver
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    SFBryan18 wrote: »
    By posting this you just hurt your ability to make gold.

    Yea, but it's just a game, and if people buy up all the cheap stuff, without the supply prices will be higher so either way, I will make gold.

    Exactly. That is the whole point of this thread. Getting people to buy up your stuff trying and failing to resell it. Sadly many will fall for it.
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  • SFBryan18
    SFBryan18
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    SFBryan18 wrote: »
    By posting this you just hurt your ability to make gold.

    Yea, but it's just a game, and if people buy up all the cheap stuff, without the supply prices will be higher so either way, I will make gold.

    Exactly. That is the whole point of this thread. Getting people to buy up your stuff trying and failing to resell it. Sadly many will fall for it.

    I think you misunderstood what I wrote.
    Edited by SFBryan18 on January 2, 2015 2:51PM
  • ItsGlaive
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    Wow, what a 180! I remember your rants from a few months back @SFBryan18. Glad you're enjoying it now though - it really is a minigame within the game, and very addictive!
    Allow cross-platform transfers and merges
  • dharbert
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    This works in theory, but not in practice. Guild vendors are all over the place on their prices. There is too much of a spread. For example, just last night I was at a guild vendor that had a certain item listed for 50k, then just three slots above it the same exact thing was listed by a different player for 7k. What's a fair or median price on that one?

    For most items, getting the best buying price is still obtained via zone chat. I've purchased items from players in zone chat for a couple thousand gold that were listed on guild vendors for 30k or more. There are players who either don't care what they sell stuff for and just want to get rid of it, and there are players who just don't know what they have or how much it could have sold for.
  • SFBryan18
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    Xabien wrote: »
    Wow, what a 180! I remember your rants from a few months back @SFBryan18. Glad you're enjoying it now though - it really is a minigame within the game, and very addictive!

    I would have tried to join your guild if I was on the EU server. :D
    dharbert wrote: »
    This works in theory, but not in practice. Guild vendors are all over the place on their prices. There is too much of a spread. For example, just last night I was at a guild vendor that had a certain item listed for 50k, then just three slots above it the same exact thing was listed by a different player for 7k. What's a fair or median price on that one?

    For most items, getting the best buying price is still obtained via zone chat. I've purchased items from players in zone chat for a couple thousand gold that were listed on guild vendors for 30k or more. There are players who either don't care what they sell stuff for and just want to get rid of it, and there are players who just don't know what they have or how much it could have sold for.

    The higher priced items will have a lot of fluctuation. Perhaps too much for this method. Some players list their items way too high, and they won't sell. That will not count towards the average since datadaedra only shows from things that have sold.
    Edited by SFBryan18 on January 2, 2015 3:04PM
  • Sindala
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    Playing the Market: How to use Trading Guilds to make Pure Profit.

    Easy, Don't.
    Just sell stuff in World chat. All the gold and no worries about guild trader fees ect.
    Being First is not the prize, it just mean's everyone can stab you in the back.
  • Heishi
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    I find that if I price my stuff just low enough, compared to what people like the OP are selling for, they will come along and buy me up to try and control the market. I can sell twice as much at the lower prices by betting that someone will buy me out so they can resell it for more.

    I do this alot myself. I also break stacks into 20's which seem to sell faster. I know if I'm in a crafting pinch and need just maybe 15 more of an item, I won't buy a full stack. I'll piece together cheaper smaller stacks/individual items. So by selling 20 it's not a commitment to having a full stack sitting around in inventory, but a more digestible 20. Maybe you need 30 items to finish off that armor set, great, buy two of the 20 stacks and you're covered.

    I know many players just craft for themselves and only get items as they need them for a current level. 100 stacks primarily cater to other crafters and merchants who are probably playing the same game OP mentioned. The market is full of people doing that, but if you cater to a different market that is much less played out, you can make some good money.
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  • renton1x1x1
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    i prefer just shopkeeper on it's own the average overall isn't great but it does give you a baseline to work with.

    I really like the search because you can look at the prices at which items you want to sell have sold for recently.
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  • Pallmor
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    Pallmor's 3-Step Gold-Producing Program:

    1) Collect Nord underpants
    2) ?
    3) Profit!
  • Psychobunni
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    I find that if I price my stuff just low enough, compared to what people like the OP are selling for, they will come along and buy me up to try and control the market. I can sell twice as much at the lower prices by betting that someone will buy me out so they can resell it for more.

    ^^THIS! I use both shopkeeper and data daedra and usually try to price just under going rate(s). So I'm getting both the regular sales and the sales of those attempting to resale. For me its simply about making enough gold to do what I need to do for myself.

    Another solid sales point to being in a good trade guild is items like columbine in which buyers hawk zone chat to buy for 120 per...I would never, ever sell for that knowing I can easily get 200 per in my trade guilds, even more as shopkeeper shows me stacks of 100 being sold for 30k.

    I know it drives those buying for 120 per absolutely nuts (see rants in zone chat), but* why should I take a loss unnecessarily?

    *typo edit
    Edited by Psychobunni on January 2, 2015 11:28PM
    If options weren't necessary, and everyone played the same way, no one would use addons. Fix the UI!

  • Cuyler
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    I find that if I price my stuff just low enough, compared to what people like the OP are selling for, they will come along and buy me up to try and control the market. I can sell twice as much at the lower prices by betting that someone will buy me out so they can resell it for more.

    ^^THIS! I use both shopkeeper and data daedra and usually try to price just under going rate(s). So I'm getting both the regular sales and the sales of those attempting to resale. For me its simply about making enough gold to do what I need to do for myself.

    Another solid sales point to being in a good trade guild is items like columbine in which buyers hawk zone chat to buy for 120 per...I would never, ever sell for that knowing I can easily get 200 per in my trade guilds, even more as shopkeeper shows me stacks of 100 being sold for 30k.

    I know it drives those buying for 120 per absolutely nuts (see rants in zone chat), by why should I take a loss unnecessarily?

    Anybody stating a specific buying price (For example: Columbine 120g) in chat is trying to undercut the market and take advantage of desperate or unknowing sellers. It is however "fair game" in a free/open market.

    I'd never do it personally as I can probably farm them faster than finding someone to sell it at that price.

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  • Psychobunni
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    I was thinking about this thread a few minutes ago. The primary argument against AH is that it will bottom out the economy, however usage of the two addon's mentioned is almost as good as an auction house.

    I was in Craglorn for not even 5 minutes before I saw the usual "WTB Columbine 120 per" zone message....however a quick check through shopkeeper shows within the last 2 days alone 4 stacks of Columbine sold for...30k. So the player not using these addons and selling low because that's what they see all the time in zone, is missing out BIG time.

    Also, a player was offering a V12 Pendant of the Shadow Walker for 17k. A quick hover over shows that sales average is 22k. A bargain for one needing or even a little resale value.

    I don't personally know the makers of these addons, but especially for anyone who wants an AH, or simply wants the most bang for their buck, they are awesome! This was a really good info post for anyone struggling with gold. kudos!

    Edit: these 2 addons combined with major trade guild membership.
    Edited by Psychobunni on January 15, 2015 2:58PM
    If options weren't necessary, and everyone played the same way, no one would use addons. Fix the UI!

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