Sword and Board: The new mandatory

Poxheart · December 2014

ads1 wrote: »

I agree with the block casting, most stupid thing in the game

Eliminating block casting would require Zenimax to completely rework tanking in PvE and I just don't see that happening.

Agrippa_Invisus · December 2014

Poxheart wrote: »

ads1 wrote: »

I agree with the block casting, most stupid thing in the game

Eliminating block casting would require Zenimax to completely rework tanking in PvE and I just don't see that happening.

Just give certain 1H+Shield and Undaunted abilities the extra ability 'May be cast while blocking'.

And tanks are already going to have to break block to light/heavy attack to continue to build ultimate.

Cody · December 2014

Players should not be able to tank in LA. its a dress for f*** sake, you are not even wearing actual armor, the survivalbility in LA should be low to make up for its high DPS value. HA should be the armor for tanking.

Lionxoft · December 2014

Cody wrote: »

Players should not be able to tank in LA. its a dress for f*** sake, you are not even wearing actual armor, the survivalbility in LA should be low to make up for its high DPS value. HA should be the armor for tanking.

Hopefully the champion system fixes this a bit since armor will have a SR stat on it as well depending on it's type and the LA spell resist passive will be removed and/or changed. At least that's how I understood it.

Mauz · December 2014

Why new? Its like that since release.

In the beginning I found it annoying. Most of the time its a DK charging into a random group and dropping his standard or is using batswarm. I wait out of range send my shades and spam shields and heals for the ppl waiting in the standard/swarm for better weather. After the standard I jump in and fear him -> DK is dead and usually doesn't get a kill.

This works nearly all the time. I'm casual, I'm old, my connection sucks so I'm not that dangerous at all in pvp. So if I can do it there actually IS a counter.

But I agree...its a bit op. I need to use a significant amount of my bar to counter it.

Xsorus · December 2014

People who still whine about block casting don't realize you'll just force everyone into Damage shield builds

c0rp · December 2014

After 1.6...the effort required to tank in LA should deter most people from doing it. ZoS has stated that LA will NOT be the end all be all...and that LA is going to feel like wearing LA. If this holds true, LA will finally be "giving away" something.

risen1981 · December 2014

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

They need to remove the reduction in block costs from the 1h/Shield line and move them into the Heavy Armor line. Make it so someone in full HA w/ 1h+Shield has the same costs as current, but the pajama wearing masses can't block for bupkiss.

No that wrecks PVE nightblade tanks and Sorc tanks.

seriously?.. hope this is a troll otherwise im scared

TheBull · December 2014

The amount of stamina used per block needs to be slightly higher and/or block should consume stamina while moving like sneak.

I have no problem with the amount of dmg it mitigates, the duration a person can do it for against a full out attack seems off though.

TheBull · December 2014

Poxheart wrote: »

ads1 wrote: »

I agree with the block casting, most stupid thing in the game

Eliminating block casting would require Zenimax to completely rework tanking in PvE and I just don't see that happening.

The up coming change to Ultimate gain will cause permablockers to drop sometimes atleast.

Jaerlach · December 2014

TheBull wrote: »

Poxheart wrote: »

ads1 wrote: »

I agree with the block casting, most stupid thing in the game

Eliminating block casting would require Zenimax to completely rework tanking in PvE and I just don't see that happening.

The up coming change to Ultimate gain will cause permablockers to drop sometimes atleast.

block-cancelling one light attack every 8s is hardly a burden, the resulting block downtime is like .25 seconds. You wil have to be actively bad to die while doing it, since you would have to have pinpoint timing to attack exactly while struck by a powerful, telegraphed one-shot attack.

Cathexis · December 2014

This thread is absurd. Stamina costs for blocking are already too high. Block/dodge/cc breaks are a deficit to stamina based builds much more than to magicka builds and that issue needs to be resolved. Personally I think it should cost whatever resource type is used to put you in that state. But back to caster blocking; caster blocking does suffer deficits when you aren't in HA. It costs significantly more. I do think light armor is imbalanced at present but if you have used light armor you would know it's not a cake walk; survival is more skill dependent, and the trade off is long term in combat survivability.

The problem lies in the fact that the offensive ability of each armor type is segregated by build types (mana/stamina/survival for la/ma/ha respectively), so you can't build for example a medium armor magicka build and have it be as effective as a medium armor stamina build. If HA builds confered an equitable offensive advantage to LA or MA there wouldn't be a problem because people could use whatever they wanted.

The reason sword and board is preferred is because its the only weapon that gives direct defensive bonuses, simple as that. Even if you made block cost higher, I doubt it would deter LA use if sword and board. The defensive stats are arguably more valuable in my eyes than block itself.

Cody · December 2014

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

People who still whine about block casting don't realize you'll just force everyone into Damage shield builds

people already do that:D

and with the changes comin up in the CS, we really don't know what the game will soon be like

risen1981 · December 2014

those who still thinks blockcasting is fine.. why dont we have it so you can block and use weapon skills as well...only fair.. while we are at it why not just make it a perma block.. so we run around and perma block everything.. fun game it would be huh?..

idiots...

Galalin · December 2014

risen1981 wrote: »

those who still thinks blockcasting is fine.. why dont we have it so you can block and use weapon skills as well...only fair.. while we are at it why not just make it a perma block.. so we run around and perma block everything.. fun game it would be huh?..

idiots...

Tell us your honest opinion please... lol

Im guilty of this but as a tank if you dont your just another snipe victim in a sec flat. If they came up with a more viable solution like lowering dps in general ppl wouldn't do it.

Basically your calling ppl idiots because they use a mechanic as intended to live past the 1 sec snipe kills.

Idk which seems more idiotic?

Hmmmm wait a min.

Personally i feel like the balance of health, damage amd healing are way off and in the current state. Damage is to high. Healing is to high. If they raised the health pool or lowered the dps and lowered the value of healing i think the battles would be much better. Just my idiotic opinion

DK scrub out

Xsorus · December 2014

risen1981 wrote: »

those who still thinks blockcasting is fine.. why dont we have it so you can block and use weapon skills as well...only fair.. while we are at it why not just make it a perma block.. so we run around and perma block everything.. fun game it would be huh?..

idiots...

You realize you can use weapon skills while blocking right?

The only ones you can't use is probably the casted ones...

Joy_Division · December 2014

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

risen1981 wrote: »

those who still thinks blockcasting is fine.. why dont we have it so you can block and use weapon skills as well...only fair.. while we are at it why not just make it a perma block.. so we run around and perma block everything.. fun game it would be huh?..

idiots...

You realize you can use weapon skills while blocking right?

The only ones you can't use is probably the casted ones...

I think he means light and heavy attacks.

Xsorus · December 2014

Joy_Division wrote: »

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

risen1981 wrote: »

those who still thinks blockcasting is fine.. why dont we have it so you can block and use weapon skills as well...only fair.. while we are at it why not just make it a perma block.. so we run around and perma block everything.. fun game it would be huh?..

idiots...

You realize you can use weapon skills while blocking right?

The only ones you can't use is probably the casted ones...

I think he means light and heavy attacks.

That would be dumb, because heavy attacks return resources right now, and you can't interrupt them already.

Cody · December 2014

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

risen1981 wrote: »

those who still thinks blockcasting is fine.. why dont we have it so you can block and use weapon skills as well...only fair.. while we are at it why not just make it a perma block.. so we run around and perma block everything.. fun game it would be huh?..

idiots...

You realize you can use weapon skills while blocking right?

The only ones you can't use is probably the casted ones...

I think he means light and heavy attacks.

That would be dumb, because heavy attacks return resources right now, and you can't interrupt them already.

*cough resto heavies cough*

Domander · December 2014

You know, if you like to use class skills, which are all magicka based atm, you're probably going to be magicka powered.

There's only 3 generally good weapons for this, with some others being used in special builds.

1h and shield for defense
resto for heal abilities and passives
destruction.

I don't think it's that mind boggling that many players use a shield, I think it's a good thing actually. I would not want to see 1h and shield be seen as useless.

It's going to take a hit in 1.6 with the need of a light or heavy attack for ultimate gain. 1h and shield has a pretty limited range.

also yeah anything that's instant won't prevent you from blocking.

Light attacks, heavy attacks, and cast time/channeled attacks leave you vulnerable... which seems to be intended and works pretty well imo.

prose08b14a_ESO · December 2014

Link uses S&B while wearing LA and he's expected to bring down the King of Evil. I think you guys need to take a chill pill.

WraithAzraiel · December 2014

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

Ras_Alghul wrote: »

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

They need to remove the reduction in block costs from the 1h/Shield line and move them into the Heavy Armor line. Make it so someone in full HA w/ 1h+Shield has the same costs as current, but the pajama wearing masses can't block for bupkiss.

Shhhhhh! You're going to ruin Christmas for everyone!

It's time that being in pajamas came with the drawback that it's supposed to have -- survivability.

You want good magicka management AND good damage bonuses? Then suffer being squishy. I'm beyond tired of people in LA doing the most damage and being the best tanks. The balance in this game is awful.

That's the thing, I never understood how someone wearing a dress ISN'T a glass cannon.

Domander · December 2014

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

Ras_Alghul wrote: »

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

They need to remove the reduction in block costs from the 1h/Shield line and move them into the Heavy Armor line. Make it so someone in full HA w/ 1h+Shield has the same costs as current, but the pajama wearing masses can't block for bupkiss.

Shhhhhh! You're going to ruin Christmas for everyone!

It's time that being in pajamas came with the drawback that it's supposed to have -- survivability.

You want good magicka management AND good damage bonuses? Then suffer being squishy. I'm beyond tired of people in LA doing the most damage and being the best tanks. The balance in this game is awful.

That's the thing, I never understood how someone wearing a dress ISN'T a glass cannon.

Do you guys realize how squishy someone in light armor is to physical damage? (that isn't blocking, and without a damage shield)

I don't think you do.

also glass cannon kind of refers to being all offense and no defense, someone in light armor that has no heals/shields will go squish.

Medium and heavy will too, though heavy will last a little longer.

risen1981 · December 2014

Galalin wrote: »

risen1981 wrote: »

those who still thinks blockcasting is fine.. why dont we have it so you can block and use weapon skills as well...only fair.. while we are at it why not just make it a perma block.. so we run around and perma block everything.. fun game it would be huh?..

idiots...

Tell us your honest opinion please... lol

Im guilty of this but as a tank if you dont your just another snipe victim in a sec flat. If they came up with a more viable solution like lowering dps in general ppl wouldn't do it.

Basically your calling ppl idiots because they use a mechanic as intended to live past the 1 sec snipe kills.

Idk which seems more idiotic?

Hmmmm wait a min.

Personally i feel like the balance of health, damage amd healing are way off and in the current state. Damage is to high. Healing is to high. If they raised the health pool or lowered the dps and lowered the value of healing i think the battles would be much better. Just my idiotic opinion

DK scrub out

As a tank i'm a victim of snipe either way. In every other game i played with this kind of sytem there has always been some kind of blockbreak.
A successful blockbreak would leave the guy vulnerable for a few sec and if failed it would leave me vulnerable instead... and if i remember correctly ( could be wrong on this ) earlier ES games had the bash working as just that.

So why not here? I think it would add much more skill and flavour to the game.
And on ESO live i got my question answered about this issue and they are working on improving the block mechanic issue but will not make it into patch 6.
Take it as you will but i sure do think this was NOT their intentions.

To be able to do full dmg output with no drawbacks ( no cc, extreme dmg mitigation and so on) is just not a good game design .. its like reward with no risk... no matter how much you lower the dmg and heals

And if you do not realize that yourself then... dunno what else to say to convince you, it is a bad game design it really is.

I really do hope you come to your senses and realize the problem cause it really is gamebreaking, i for one will leave the game if the problem doesnt get solved.

So my statement stays... its idiotic to keep this design

Asgari · December 2014

With all of the projectiles out there and melee damage s&b just has many uses ontop of a nap closer for DKs which they lack. Ontop of reverb bash that has s crazy heal debuff.

In 1.6 with all the skill changes and armor / ulti changes it should be eso 2.0 and be a completely new game. The pts will be up soon and we will know a lot more.

Rylana · December 2014

prose08b14a_ESO wrote: »

Link uses S&B while wearing LA and he's expected to bring down the King of Evil. I think you guys need to take a chill pill.

Yeah but at least his extended chains can pull him up walls.

Galalin · December 2014

risen1981 wrote: »

Galalin wrote: »

risen1981 wrote: »

those who still thinks blockcasting is fine.. why dont we have it so you can block and use weapon skills as well...only fair.. while we are at it why not just make it a perma block.. so we run around and perma block everything.. fun game it would be huh?..

idiots...

Tell us your honest opinion please... lol

Im guilty of this but as a tank if you dont your just another snipe victim in a sec flat. If they came up with a more viable solution like lowering dps in general ppl wouldn't do it.

Basically your calling ppl idiots because they use a mechanic as intended to live past the 1 sec snipe kills.

Idk which seems more idiotic?

Hmmmm wait a min.

Personally i feel like the balance of health, damage amd healing are way off and in the current state. Damage is to high. Healing is to high. If they raised the health pool or lowered the dps and lowered the value of healing i think the battles would be much better. Just my idiotic opinion

DK scrub out

As a tank i'm a victim of snipe either way. In every other game i played with this kind of sytem there has always been some kind of blockbreak.
A successful blockbreak would leave the guy vulnerable for a few sec and if failed it would leave me vulnerable instead... and if i remember correctly ( could be wrong on this ) earlier ES games had the bash working as just that.

So why not here? I think it would add much more skill and flavour to the game.
And on ESO live i got my question answered about this issue and they are working on improving the block mechanic issue but will not make it into patch 6.
Take it as you will but i sure do think this was NOT their intentions.

To be able to do full dmg output with no drawbacks ( no cc, extreme dmg mitigation and so on) is just not a good game design .. its like reward with no risk... no matter how much you lower the dmg and heals

And if you do not realize that yourself then... dunno what else to say to convince you, it is a bad game design it really is.

I really do hope you come to your senses and realize the problem cause it really is gamebreaking, i for one will leave the game if the problem doesnt get solved.

So my statement stays... its idiotic to keep this design

Im not saying the design is not idiotic or should not be changed... I'm saying im not an idiot for using block but quite the opposite... as you were calling ppl idiots. Sure i think it should be worked on but it there in the game and working as designed. I would be an idiot not to block

Cody · December 2014

Domander wrote: »

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

Ras_Alghul wrote: »

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

They need to remove the reduction in block costs from the 1h/Shield line and move them into the Heavy Armor line. Make it so someone in full HA w/ 1h+Shield has the same costs as current, but the pajama wearing masses can't block for bupkiss.

Shhhhhh! You're going to ruin Christmas for everyone!

It's time that being in pajamas came with the drawback that it's supposed to have -- survivability.

You want good magicka management AND good damage bonuses? Then suffer being squishy. I'm beyond tired of people in LA doing the most damage and being the best tanks. The balance in this game is awful.

That's the thing, I never understood how someone wearing a dress ISN'T a glass cannon.

Do you guys realize how squishy someone in light armor is to physical damage? (that isn't blocking, and without a damage shield)

I don't think you do.

also glass cannon kind of refers to being all offense and no defense, someone in light armor that has no heals/shields will go squish.

Medium and heavy will too, though heavy will last a little longer.

people in light armor should not be tanking: either in PvP or PvE.

risen1981 · December 2014

Galalin wrote: »

risen1981 wrote: »

Galalin wrote: »

risen1981 wrote: »

those who still thinks blockcasting is fine.. why dont we have it so you can block and use weapon skills as well...only fair.. while we are at it why not just make it a perma block.. so we run around and perma block everything.. fun game it would be huh?..

idiots...

Tell us your honest opinion please... lol

Im guilty of this but as a tank if you dont your just another snipe victim in a sec flat. If they came up with a more viable solution like lowering dps in general ppl wouldn't do it.

Basically your calling ppl idiots because they use a mechanic as intended to live past the 1 sec snipe kills.

Idk which seems more idiotic?

Hmmmm wait a min.

Personally i feel like the balance of health, damage amd healing are way off and in the current state. Damage is to high. Healing is to high. If they raised the health pool or lowered the dps and lowered the value of healing i think the battles would be much better. Just my idiotic opinion

DK scrub out

As a tank i'm a victim of snipe either way. In every other game i played with this kind of sytem there has always been some kind of blockbreak.
A successful blockbreak would leave the guy vulnerable for a few sec and if failed it would leave me vulnerable instead... and if i remember correctly ( could be wrong on this ) earlier ES games had the bash working as just that.

So why not here? I think it would add much more skill and flavour to the game.
And on ESO live i got my question answered about this issue and they are working on improving the block mechanic issue but will not make it into patch 6.
Take it as you will but i sure do think this was NOT their intentions.

To be able to do full dmg output with no drawbacks ( no cc, extreme dmg mitigation and so on) is just not a good game design .. its like reward with no risk... no matter how much you lower the dmg and heals

And if you do not realize that yourself then... dunno what else to say to convince you, it is a bad game design it really is.

I really do hope you come to your senses and realize the problem cause it really is gamebreaking, i for one will leave the game if the problem doesnt get solved.

So my statement stays... its idiotic to keep this design

Im not saying the design is not idiotic or should not be changed... I'm saying im not an idiot for using block but quite the opposite... as you were calling ppl idiots. Sure i think it should be worked on but it there in the game and working as designed. I would be an idiot not to block

Alright then you misunderstood what i was actually saying.. quoting my self here

"those of you who still thinks block-casting is fine..."is the start of my post
i never said anywhere that those who use it is an idiot...

dermottib14_ESO · December 2014

I run sword and board, not because i want to, because i have to. Something defintly needs to change as i feel its the only way to survive in teh current meta.