DEVS!!! Any ETA for fixing anim canceling BS?

JaJaLuka · December 2014

Macro's are the problem, not animation cancelling specifically. People should have to manually learn to weave light attacks and blocks into their play style if they want to do it, but a macro means that people can hit a button and their toon will do several attacks without the player actually putting in the effort to play the game therefor putting their opponent at a huge disadvantage if they don't themselves use a macro.

Lava_Croft · December 2014

As explained several times already, macros are very unreliable in ESO since macros are static and do not take into account anything related to framerate, latency and what not.

Macros are not a problem in ESO at all.

Cody · December 2014

Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »

Dealdrick wrote: »

Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »

Dealdrick wrote: »

Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »

LOL they nerfed shields into uselessness because of pvp crying. Have fun when every dps skill is on a global cd thanks to pvp.

It's funny that you think people don't animation cancel in PvE. There are literally guide videos on how to do it to maximize your DPS.

I could care less about dps other than I am one now thanks to ZOS killing off tanking by breaking shield.

If you don't care about animation canceling why are you commenting in a thread about it? If you want to QQ about shield start a new thread

Because they nerfed shield bash due to qqing in pvp, saying you shouldnt cancel animation to block. Well now its impossible to block in time unless you do nothing but wait to block.

im gonna stop you right there. I too hate block and casting... but shield bash was nerfed because with the right passives, players could literally shield bash you to death in combat. I remember doing a vet fungal grotto run, and a player with a shield was bash spamming the boss.... it was one of the stupidest things i had ever seen in my LIFE, on a VIDEO GAME, lol.

Kypho · December 2014

@Ragnar_Lodbrok‌

WoW really.... PVPers QQing.... maybe its because PvE hero dont need much IQ. you need to use brain 10% of the time. Seems you never fought a player, its 10 times more fun than any boss, trial, or any other PvE crap. The problem coming if the other player exploiting the weakness of the game mechanics, it can be set bug, ability bug (like your ex nub bashspam), or any other crap, thanks to the Devs who dont want, or just failing to fix.

timidobserver · December 2014

Tripwyr wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

kaer426 wrote: »

Macroing animation cancelling only makes it more reliable (ie you can't screw it up), it does not increase the amount of attacks you can get off.

Even after successfully clipping a light attack with a skill, you are still locked out from starting another light attack (or anything really) for a short time.

go ahead .. go test it for yourselves

Nah, it does provide a significant advantage. No player, no matter how good they are, is going to be able to cut all or most of the dead space between their attacks out. With macros you can control when you attacks trigger down to the millisecond. So, if there is a 1.3 second cooldown between light attacks, you can setup your macro to trigger a new light attack woven attack every 1.3 seconds. No one playing manually is capable of that.

Macros do not provide a net benefit for good players. The delay between Light Attack and spell is primarily lag, which is variable and can not be adapted for in a macro. A player can adjust his own timing when lag becomes more or less a factor, a macro can not.

kaer426 wrote: »

Even after successfully clipping a light attack with a skill, you are still locked out from starting another light attack (or anything really) for a short time.

go ahead .. go test it for yourselves

This is 100% true. You can not use animation cancelling to cast your next spell faster.

I am the realist that says that I know that macros provide benefits that are hard to duplicate manually and I don't care that they do. I am not going to pretend that they don't.

Yeh, I have tested for myself. I wouldn't have typed what I typed otherwise.

Xexpo · December 2014

Manoekin wrote: »

Yall got necro'd. Check the dates on the first page.

should have checked the date when I saw lowbei replied

Kypho · December 2014

crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, ...repeat

in 3 sec. Just an example.... This is now how it goes?

@ZOS_GinaBruno‌ @ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ @ZOS_BrianWheeler‌

its lightspeed vs rapid strike... ohh try to do that with rapid strike... ohh... and its not unfair ehh?

Kypho · December 2014

wait its more:
crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack,

thats all what Mages can do.

JaJaLuka · December 2014

Have you died to this by any chance?

Kypho · December 2014

JaJaLuka wrote: »

Have you died to this by any chance?

Only 2 times yet. But i hope more and more ppl will learn it. It is awesome.

forgot to mention, use it with power surge

s7732425ub17_ESO · December 2014

Kypho wrote: »

wait its more:
crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack, crushing shock, light attack,

thats all what Mages can do.

This is all Sorcs can do because of how ZOS designed the class. Unfortunately, the only usable, damaging class skill is Crystal Fragments, and if you don't need a knockdown, crushing shock spam is much, much better.

At least with other classes you can apply some DoTs, some debuffs, and then resume crushing shock, but not with Sorc.

Kraven · December 2014

Personally I don't think animation cancelling at all should happen. But many of you complaining about it should realize that block casting is also animation cancelling.

Then again I'm weird and think Ultimates should build over time and shouldn't be farmable and spammable.

Even stranger I think melee should hands down be higher dps than any range build. Considering the risk or being in melee range and the absolute necessity of range in certain fights, but I'm okay with bow being lower dps than staves as a compensation so that over all in a sustained fight a dw/bow or a 2h/bow are the exact same dps as magicka counterparts.

Perfect world ideals, I know. But if you're going to complain about animation cancelling you have to complain about it all. Crushing shock builds, Dks blocking while casting GDB and talons then using an ulti every 20 seconds, rapid strikes with heavy attack weaving, 2h animation cancelling, hitting with any attack while using class skills, using immovable without any heavy armor equipped...the list goes on and on. Fix one and next week there will be something else to whine about.

Koensol · December 2014

I certainly don't like this LA weaving/animation canceling. It turns the game into a numbers game, in stead of legitimately activating abilities and watching normal animations. I enjoy watching my character doing his animations. I loath this cluncky, teleport-like movement with the AC. I wonder if ZOS has balanced the game towards it or not. Would be nice to get a reply on this for once ZOS!

Subtomik · December 2014

Poxheart wrote: »

Pretty damn funny, but considering I just recently caused an AD twitch streamer to report me for animation cancelling I didn't even bother to check the original post date.

Everytime I see him now I drop more teabags than Lipton.

I want people watching his stream to enjoy me enjoying dat sweet sweet booty

Poxheart · December 2014

Subtomik wrote: »

Everytime I see him now I drop more teabags than Lipton.

I want people watching his stream to enjoy me enjoying dat sweet sweet booty

Hahaha! Too funny.

Tell your brother I have a few more questions for him about his build.

Davadin · December 2014

Kraven wrote: »

.... 2h animation cancelling,...

Hmm?

Is there any 2H-specific animation cancelling that's breaking the game?

JackDaniell · December 2014

I would say good animation cancelling shows that that player is more experienced at the game. In fact it adds a sort of player skill to combat unique to this game.

Regarding PvP using a macro is a downside, they just don't react as well as an experienced PvP player can because they use predictable scripts. The only time people may find a macro helpful in PvP is if they are very new and have trouble responding to most incoming cc.

As for "OP" animation cancels, the secret to PvP is a combo, not a single skill weave. I know that any class can kill someone in a couple seconds in PvP using combos without stealth, but could never achieve this using a single skill.

With soft capped wep damage and stamina:

Poison injection (for the DOT) [300] > Magnum shot [450] > Crit Rush [800] > Executioner [500+]

You can land that combo really quickly with practice and if you animation cancel with it as well you can do well over 2500 damage without even landing a crit. Not to mention your moving around a ton with this combo giving it a huge advantage to standing still and using crushing shock.

Kraven · December 2014

Davadin wrote: »

Kraven wrote: »

.... 2h animation cancelling,...

Hmm?

Is there any 2H-specific animation cancelling that's breaking the game?

No there's not.

I have been able on a few occasions to do a bit of cancelling with 2h but not with any consistency and not enough to even approach the dps of others weapon types that rely on cancelling.

That might just be me though, maybe someone else can figure how to hit 2k single target sustained with 2h but for me it is just plain under performing when compared.

Kraven · December 2014

JackDaniell wrote: »

I would say good animation cancelling shows that that player is more experienced at the game. In fact it adds a sort of player skill to combat unique to this game.

I'd have to disagree. PvP wise weaving skills together to create a good combo that wrecks is fun, and generally anyone who spends time in Cyrodiil will find a skill set that works for them. Unless they only zerg, then they're just fodder for the rest of us.

The problem with animation cancelling is that it actually removes individuality. Otherwise there wouldn't be so damn many CS builds. These sheep see high dps and ask "How?" then they copy and paste the exact same build, if they can't get similar numbers they go back and ask "How?" Then they copy and paste the exact same rotation.

Large groups having each member push AT LEAST 1500 single target dps with carbon copy builds. ZOS answer? To introduce content that requires 1300+ single target dps, further promoting cookie cutter builds.

I hit 1200 single target sustained dps as a stamina build, and yes in order to do so requires some animation cancelling. Still 1200 is nothing comparatively. I may not like it but it is a required part of end game content. I crafted my build, I built it, it's mine and I put the time in to raise my dps. I dealt with the frustration of stamina under performing and I dealt with being over looked for trials due to class/build.

None of that matters when compared to Herp-Derp over there who couldn't do anything for himself so he grinded to max copied someone elses build and rotation then set up a macro. When your end game content starts requiring the dps provided by unintentional mechanics and starts requiring that you have the buffs from your factions PvP buff server... Then your game has already started to cannibalize itself.

Kas · December 2014

animation cancelling is fine and a great part of games like dota (2). i also like it in eso. in pvp it's almost a non-factor. macro'd cancelling is an entirely different story. e.g., making all crystal shards proc or general optimizations to beat manual efforts in efficiency. tbh I used to think this was not only forbidden and a bannable offense, but actually already fixed several patches ago.

Thechemicals · December 2014

Basically its the manual player versus the macro player. The macro player will win everytime btw. Unless your me because i faceroll my keyboard faster than a macro.

stylepolice · December 2014

JackDaniell wrote: »

I would say good animation cancelling shows that that player is more experienced at the game. In fact it adds a sort of player skill to combat unique to this game.
..snip...

As in "I would say that exploiting geometry to hide inside stones shows that that player is more experience at the game"?

Yes, with more experience usually comes better knowledge regarding exploitable mechanics - that does not mean those mechanics are fine. There are different opinions regarding whether anim canceling should be legit or not - but in the end, zenis lack of attention to PvP will mean its a moot point.

Gorthax · December 2014

Subtomik wrote: »

Poxheart wrote: »

Pretty damn funny, but considering I just recently caused an AD twitch streamer to report me for animation cancelling I didn't even bother to check the original post date.

Everytime I see him now I drop more teabags than Lipton.

I want people watching his stream to enjoy me enjoying dat sweet sweet booty

nice reference to ERB.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgVwv0ZuPhM

eventide03b14a_ESO · December 2014

tylarthb16_ESO wrote: »

Example i has last night was a sneak heavy arrow attack 850, poison arrow 330, light 250, poison arrow 330, poison arrow 330, poison arrow 330. i didn't even get up from the sneak cc effect. However the nice thing with the death blow other than the attacks, is the attacker named, all were from same player, so i reported them for exploiting.

LMAO. You reported someone for spamming poison arrow? You realize that's a very quick attack, and 330 is pretty meh as far as damage goes.

eventide03b14a_ESO · December 2014

Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »

Dealdrick wrote: »

Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »

Dealdrick wrote: »

Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »

Dealdrick wrote: »

Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »

LOL they nerfed shields into uselessness because of pvp crying. Have fun when every dps skill is on a global cd thanks to pvp.

It's funny that you think people don't animation cancel in PvE. There are literally guide videos on how to do it to maximize your DPS.

I could care less about dps other than I am one now thanks to ZOS killing off tanking by breaking shield.

If you don't care about animation canceling why are you commenting in a thread about it? If you want to QQ about shield start a new thread

Because they nerfed shield bash due to qqing in pvp, saying you shouldnt cancel animation to block. Well now its impossible to block in time unless you do nothing but wait to block.

Um, no, not even close. The nerf to shield bash damage had nothing to with the block being used to cancel animation. You do realize that you don't have to have a shield equipped to cancel animations, right? Block/bash works to cancel attacks with a staff equipped just fine

If you dont use a shield why are you commenting, it makes you sound facetious

Tripwyr · December 2014

Davadin wrote: »

Kraven wrote: »

.... 2h animation cancelling,...

Hmm?

Is there any 2H-specific animation cancelling that's breaking the game?

Kraven wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

Kraven wrote: »

.... 2h animation cancelling,...

Hmm?

Is there any 2H-specific animation cancelling that's breaking the game?

No there's not.

I have been able on a few occasions to do a bit of cancelling with 2h but not with any consistency and not enough to even approach the dps of others weapon types that rely on cancelling.

That might just be me though, maybe someone else can figure how to hit 2k single target sustained with 2h but for me it is just plain under performing when compared.

Yes there is. You can start charging a heavy attack after beginning a Wrecking Blow wind, then let go when Wrecking Blow releases and the partially-charged heavy attack will land at the same time. This is what we call medium-attack weaving and you can do it on most spells.

All of this is done manually. Macros are detrimental to animation cancelling for skilled players. Unfortunately it seems many unskilled players have resorted to macroing to improve their performance:

timidobserver wrote: »

Tripwyr wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

kaer426 wrote: »

Macroing animation cancelling only makes it more reliable (ie you can't screw it up), it does not increase the amount of attacks you can get off.

Even after successfully clipping a light attack with a skill, you are still locked out from starting another light attack (or anything really) for a short time.

go ahead .. go test it for yourselves

Nah, it does provide a significant advantage. No player, no matter how good they are, is going to be able to cut all or most of the dead space between their attacks out. With macros you can control when you attacks trigger down to the millisecond. So, if there is a 1.3 second cooldown between light attacks, you can setup your macro to trigger a new light attack woven attack every 1.3 seconds. No one playing manually is capable of that.

Macros do not provide a net benefit for good players. The delay between Light Attack and spell is primarily lag, which is variable and can not be adapted for in a macro. A player can adjust his own timing when lag becomes more or less a factor, a macro can not.

kaer426 wrote: »

Even after successfully clipping a light attack with a skill, you are still locked out from starting another light attack (or anything really) for a short time.

go ahead .. go test it for yourselves

This is 100% true. You can not use animation cancelling to cast your next spell faster.

I am the realist that says that I know that macros provide benefits that are hard to duplicate manually and I don't care that they do. I am not going to pretend that they don't.

Yeh, I have tested for myself. I wouldn't have typed what I typed otherwise.

JaJaLuka wrote: »

Macro's are the problem, not animation cancelling specifically. People should have to manually learn to weave light attacks and blocks into their play style if they want to do it, but a macro means that people can hit a button and their toon will do several attacks without the player actually putting in the effort to play the game therefor putting their opponent at a huge disadvantage if they don't themselves use a macro.

Feel free to provide proof of any of these false claims. Prove that macros can do something manual input can not.

Kas · December 2014

Tripwyr wrote: »

tage if they don't themselves use a macro.

Feel free to provide proof of any of these false claims. Prove that macros can do something manual input can not.[/quote]

there was a time where they could make every crystal shard an instant cast. afaik, this has been fixed, though (or all users have been reported and banned). At least I never meet such sorcs anymore

morvegil · December 2014

I animation canceled and got 2800 DPS