I'm playing with my wife too but have no issue with scaling Group dungeons, personally I like them to bring the challenge on level and greatly increases replayability. Though we have guild where we find similar people and can group with to do the group dungeons in group. We have been running plenty of daily undaunted pledges for normal group dungeons lately.

I like the idea in theory. It keeps the content relevant as you level up. However, it should be optional. If I want to go back to a level 12 group dungeon on my V14 and stomp the crap out of it, I should be able to.

In fact, I am able to do that. I just need a low level leader in my party to remove the dungeon scaling. This right here is the reason why it should be optional... because it already is if you're willing to jump through hoops to do it. We actually have the ability to keep the dungeons at their original intended level but only if we find a lowbie to group with us before stepping in. Why not remove that barrier and just make it optional upon entry.

I am in the same boat as OP. I roll with a buddy, occasionally two; but it is rare we can get four. Now we can't do dungeons anymore.

There has to be a better way to figure this out (like what DDO did).

timidobserver wrote: »

I am all for nerfing the rewards and difficulty and calling it explorer mode or something cheesy like that and giving casuals a mode that they can enjoy. I like the hard content, but at the end of the day, casuals make up a large portion of the player base and the game needs them.

I agree... a MMO is different in everyones mind. I like to solo in MMOs and if I feel up to it on the weekends I may take the time to find a group and play some group stuff...

My wife plays, but she has a super low level and I have my duo char that I only play when she is on. Now we cant play dungeons unless we find two other players... who will hate her because she does not play very well.

My son who is 9 played a lot and has a VR11, but I will not allow him to group or team speak because he is 9... in the past I would group up and duo with him in dungeons.

most of this has changed because of the updates. My son has stopped playing because he finished silver and gold and does not like PvP. My wife stopped playing because she cant "finish" a zone without a group.

I'm still playing because I like the game and its fun to have alts, but what I have noticed is I have not grouped in a long time and now i will not even try to group up because the group tool does not work and when i take 2 hours to get a group and they wipe once and split up its frustrating.

Syntse wrote: »

I can understand the bad feeling about first having something and then it is taken away. But we are talking about _Group_ dungeons after all and they were never meant to be soloed. One can still over level public dungeon and run it through blasting pulsar for the feeling of power.

Next thing is to be able to solo trials when the group dungeons get old?

Why not have solo trials? sounds amazing!

xaraan wrote: »

Though I agree that they need to fine tune their scaling, you are talking about trying to duo 4-man content, it should be really hard to do so, if not impossible. I don't think them allowing an optional switch to turn off scaling is a bad thing (though they should disable boss head drops when someone turns off scaling IMO).

I agree, if you out lvl a Dung. then you shouldnt get drops or xp. I dont think that is really a concern. I dont care at all about the drops or xp. I want the achievement.

I agree, the dungeon scaling needs to be optional. Prior to the patch, if I wanted something slightly different to do, especially when in Vet levels, I would keep an eye on chat to see if someone was looking to group up to do the Public or Group dungeons.

Most of the time, a player was only able to find 1 or 2 other people to group with him, so we would try the dungeon with the 2-3 man party.

I actually found I had much more fun when doing this dungeons with just 1 more player so that we were doing them as a duo. It was more relaxed, we both ensured the other was good. It was easier to communicate (For those like me who don't have Teamspeak). I also found that we complimented and supported each other's fighting style much much better, as you actually thought about how to tackle the bosses and what was needed. This experience was more laid-back, thought out and fun.

In the 3-4 man groups, I actually found it to be nothing more than a spam fest. You were basically playing keep up with the member who wanted to rush through everything and didn't want to wait for the rest of the group. Strategy wasn't thought about as much because you were just trying to get enough hits in to get some loot when the boss died so you didn't have to do it again. The whole experience felt rushed and wasn't nearly as enjoyable, and often one or more group members would actually miss a step in the quest completion and they would then be left hanging to finish it on their own or waiting for another group.

Additionally, sometimes you just want the experience the story and the environment of a dungeon instead of having any real challenge, especially if you are not feeling well, or having a really bad day. Sometimes it is just extremely satisfying to one hit kill an entire dungeon, just because.

I don't think forcing players to do things a certain way or at a certain level is the way to take things for this game. Elder Scrolls games were always about Options and letting the players decide when to do things and how. The more you take this away from the player base the more this game becomes a cookie cutter MMO and less and less like an Elder Scrolls style game.

Vyle_Byte wrote: »

It has absolutely nothing to do with "the feeling of power". Absolutely nothing. Its about being able to do the content that they've given us, it doesn't matter that they were "made" for a group of four if it was possible to actually do them with less than. Which is FUN. They took our fun. That's my point.

I don't think the sarcasm about trails was necessary, I don't ever expect to be able to do those nor do I care, b/c I know a duo could never possibly do something made for 12.

Someone else was saying they like to go run there over level feeling powered. Well if they at some point throw in switch for scaled/non-scaled I'm not against that. Some of the dungeons most likely are possible still to do with 2 persons even scaled, not super easy but could be done and will take time. I've run few of them with group of 3, last being city of ash which was easy but took time to down the bosses because of their health pool.

Well you expect to 1-2 man 4 man dungeon but think you never can do possibly 12 man dungeon. With same theory thinking maybe 12 man dungeon should be doable with group of 4-6. Maybe in the first place should think that 1-2 manning 4 man dungeon should not be possible. Well it was because of over leveling. And I've done my share of 1 manning the dungeons for achievements.

Issue seems to be that they were not scaled from the beginning and people got the goodies of doing those alone before scaling, now that was taken away. None of this would be even under debate if they would have been group only content from the beginning. People would just think well this is MMO and grouped people should have their content too.

Syntse wrote: »

Issue seems to be that they were not scaled from the beginning and people got the goodies of doing those alone before scaling, now that was taken away. None of this would be even under debate if they would have been group only content from the beginning. People would just think well this is MMO and grouped people should have their content too.

^^ This is exactly right. For 6 months its been one way, and now its another. Sure, if they made it so that you could only go in the dungeon if you had 4 people... from the very beginning then no one would be complaining. Actually they would... but I wouldn't 'expect' to be able to do it.

Also, there is plenty of group content. Plenty. All of Crag, pretty much group only. And just b/c its an MMO doesn't constitute the forced grouping. Just means there are a mass of players online together. Its an MMO not a MGO. Just sayin.

I'm not here to argue any one else's play style. Just sucks monkey *** they took it to this level of forcing.

xaraan wrote: »

Though I agree that they need to fine tune their scaling, you are talking about trying to duo 4-man content, it should be really hard to do so, if not impossible. I don't think them allowing an optional switch to turn off scaling is a bad thing (though they should disable boss head drops when someone turns off scaling IMO).

Your argument is invalid! 4-man content is an illusionary construct. Unless it actually requires 4 bodies to perform 4 simultaneous actions like standing on plates or turning 4 keys on 4 different walls, It doesn't exist.

What you have are encounters of a certain difficulty, those encounters should be able to be done by anyone who has improved themselves to the point where they can handle it.

Elitists do it with physical dexterity and skill and casuals and solo players do it by out leveling the content and gaining more skillsets that they need to complete the encounters.

Taking that away from people is just that. It's Taking It Away. It's not making them better it's excluding them plain and simple, from what they paid real money and time to do.

A few bosses need tweaks to hp and general fixes. Annnnd.. mechanics could be a bit better suited so as not to screw over general Stamina dps builds. Taking casters is almost always 5x easier than with a Stamina build dps, and good luck with two Stamina dps.

Vyle_Byte wrote: »

Also, there is plenty of group content. Plenty. All of Crag, pretty much group only. And just b/c its an MMO doesn't constitute the forced grouping. Just means there are a mass of players online together. Its an MMO not a MGO. Just sayin.

Just mentioning in the case that it in deed is Multiplayer Online which means there are multiple people online at the same time, some them run solo and some grouped. And there needs to be content that satisfy both.

I would not mind Zenimax to make the scaling Dungeon optional (with no loot) for players that just want to be tourist in a Dungeon. It would only add more possible activities. And as we are at it, make it so we can re-do the story quest (without reward) as much as we want.

But remember that Dungeons was not intented for vacation, but to face a challenge, to experiment fights and to have to teamwork to be able to overcome it.

The Dungeon Scaling is GREAT for every players that enjoy those dungeons and enjoy a challenge. Instead of not being able to re-do those dungeon because we overlevel it and its way too easy, now we can always face the same difficulty, no matter our level. Players, have access to a dozen of Dungeon instead of the three of their levels.

Now, while you are leveling, the Dungeon Scaling is quite easy. So if you are not Veteran yet, you should be able to duo it without too much trouble. Of course, it will require you to be a minimum awake.
Once you hit Veteran, the difficulty will be normal, and you will need a group.

yeah...okay... so heres how it works... you get a patsy of whatever level gets you a dungeon you like. then you make them leader and start the instance. once the instance is set have them leave. boom you got easy mode instance.