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1.5.4 XP
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bneff84b14_ESOSoul ShrivenI'd like to take this conversation in a slightly different direction. I've currently completed the main storyline, about half the side quests, and most of the public dungeons/dolmens/etc as well as run various "farm circuits" through public dungeons for crafting... yet although I've completed Caldwell's Silver and have started the Gold version of the Vet grind... I'm VR4 right now. So clearly you've got some broken XP calculations that have wreaked havoc on veteran leveling if I've done most of the available content and am still lagging 2+ levels behind the content.
Also, I'd like to bring up a fun tidbit about your new XP adjustment. The previous xp per level requirement was 1,432,550 xp per Veteran Rank yes? Upon the change being made, I had currently saved up about 1.5mil xp INTO veteran rank 3 (so I should have been 4) because I had hit the levelup but not leveling up bug. When you implemented the change, I logged in and became VR4 with about 30% of my level already completed. Which is all well and good, and I thank you for it, but it's wrong. Plain and simple.
I had already gained 1.4 million xp points for Vet rank 1, another set of them for rank 2, and another set of them for rank 3 in addition to the 1.5million xp points i had earned while in VR3. So, do that math quick: 1,432,550 * 3 + 1,500,000 = 5,797,650 which means that with the new veteran rank level requirement being 1,000,000 xp per level. I *should* have been about 79% of the way through VR5 when I logged in, but no. Likewise, working backwards, we can see that anyone who was more than about 77% through VR9 should have instantly become VR14.
Now I understand that instantly leveling a bunch of players to max level is letting them skip "valuable" playtime (and by valuable I mean another month of subscription fees), but I'd like to point out that your current implementation of this change greatly favors players coming INTO VR ranks from here on out. I've already blown through all my pre-VR6 content and I'm only VR4 right now. So now I have to struggle my way through VR6+ being 2+ levels behind the times? Or grind for a week to catch up?
It's bs and it's a miscalculation on your part. If you want to rebalance how XP factors into leveling, then you need to make it retroactive to ALL players. Just like you aim to do with the champion system. Just because I wasn't a brand new 50 doesn't mean I should be penalized by this new update in comparison.2 -
murtrem_ESO✭✭✭I find it hilarious how many mathletes have been up in arms over this. I started a v2 zone yesterday as a fresh v2, had to go kill 3 extra mobs after I 100% completed the zone in order to hit v3. And that was before the 432k xp nerfThey're called fingers but I've never seen em fing1 -
Nihil✭✭✭bneff84b14_ESO wrote: »I'd like to take this conversation in a slightly different direction. I've currently completed the main storyline, about half the side quests, and most of the public dungeons/dolmens/etc as well as run various "farm circuits" through public dungeons for crafting... yet although I've completed Caldwell's Silver and have started the Gold version of the Vet grind... I'm VR4 right now. So clearly you've got some broken XP calculations that have wreaked havoc on veteran leveling if I've done most of the available content and am still lagging 2+ levels behind the content.
Also, I'd like to bring up a fun tidbit about your new XP adjustment. The previous xp per level requirement was 1,432,550 xp per Veteran Rank yes? Upon the change being made, I had currently saved up about 1.5mil xp INTO veteran rank 3 (so I should have been 4) because I had hit the levelup but not leveling up bug. When you implemented the change, I logged in and became VR4 with about 30% of my level already completed. Which is all well and good, and I thank you for it, but it's wrong. Plain and simple.
I had already gained 1.4 million xp points for Vet rank 1, another set of them for rank 2, and another set of them for rank 3 in addition to the 1.5million xp points i had earned while in VR3. So, do that math quick: 1,432,550 * 3 + 1,500,000 = 5,797,650 which means that with the new veteran rank level requirement being 1,000,000 xp per level. I *should* have been about 79% of the way through VR5 when I logged in, but no. Likewise, working backwards, we can see that anyone who was more than about 77% through VR9 should have instantly become VR14.
Now I understand that instantly leveling a bunch of players to max level is letting them skip "valuable" playtime (and by valuable I mean another month of subscription fees), but I'd like to point out that your current implementation of this change greatly favors players coming INTO VR ranks from here on out. I've already blown through all my pre-VR6 content and I'm only VR4 right now. So now I have to struggle my way through VR6+ being 2+ levels behind the times? Or grind for a week to catch up?
It's bs and it's a miscalculation on your part. If you want to rebalance how XP factors into leveling, then you need to make it retroactive to ALL players. Just like you aim to do with the champion system. Just because I wasn't a brand new 50 doesn't mean I should be penalized by this new update in comparison.
How I understood the bug is it didn't let people level period, so are you asking for exp to be compensated to you before the patch where they adjusted exp for all aspects of the game? They never said they were going to back log exp gained before the update to 1.5 and give veteran ranks (only tracking exp for champion system), and if you think about it if they used the exp (and the broked quests) you could actually of deleveled (and a lot of people who craglorn grind probably would of)....
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Rodario✭✭✭✭✭WraithAzraiel wrote: »Completing the requirements of Cadwell's Silver/Gold should be enough to get you at least a Veteran Level or pretty close to one before moving on to the next zone. Everything else in said zone should be a bonus.
Ok, that's taking it one too far. I got around 1.2 VRs from completing everything in a zone before 1.5.2 and I was very OK with that. VR gain per zone should be brought back up to ~1 per zone.
But to get a complete rank-up just from doing a zone's main quests? That would mean around two hours per rank and around three ranks per zone for completionists...
Until the CS is out, they should just allow us to progress at the previous pace, that's all we should be asking for.Victoria Lux - Templar Tank
{EU/DC}3 -
spryler✭✭✭Don't you think it would be appropriate to credit our accounts with compensatory gametime while all this is going on?
You might be able to keep more customers that way.[/quote]
Seriously Babylon, every single post from you is either - This game is terrible or They should give me money back. Now those are legitimate opinions to have, definitely your right to have those opinions and express them. But do we need to read the same posts 100 times?6 -
AaronMB✭✭✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »WraithAzraiel wrote: »I started a thread about this after the fact so I'll just post it here so it doesn't get lost in the piles of threads already out there.
They've reduced the necessary XP required to level from 1.4 million and some change down to an even 1 mill. That's cool. They tweaked monster kill XP, that's great.
But did they fix the erroneous cap that was placed on quest XP resulting in people needing to complete 2 zones to achieve 1 Veteran Rank?
I don't see it mentioned anywhere in the patch notes.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Known Issues for Update 5
Miscellaneous- There's currently an issue where you are not gaining as much XP as intended while progressing through Veteran Ranks.
- STATUS: Potentially fixed in patch 1.5.4
The above bold is the matter to which I'm referring.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone,
As reported earlier this week, we have identified a couple issues surrounding experience gain:- Monsters that are well below your level give slightly less experience than intended. This will be fixed in our next incremental patch.
- The experience that you receive at the conclusion of a particularly difficult quest can reach a limit, and thus gets capped off. While the cap is there intentionally, it was set to level 50 values rather than VR values. This is being adjusted.
I saw no mention of this particular problem within the patch notes.
Any clarification on this would be greatly appreciated as I would like to start leveling my V1 Sorcerer again and would like it to not be an unreasonable hassle.
Completing the requirements of Cadwell's Silver/Gold should be enough to get you at least a Veteran Level or pretty close to one before moving on to the next zone. Everything else in said zone should be a bonus.
The part you bolded will be addressed in our next patch. Once that is published, we'd like everyone to play around with the Veteran XP changes for a bit and let us know how it feels as there's been a lot of moving parts recently.
@ZOS_GinaBruno are you saying that there is still a recognized experience bug and therefore a leveling-calculation error?Edited by AaronMB on November 13, 2014 10:25PM0 - There's currently an issue where you are not gaining as much XP as intended while progressing through Veteran Ranks.
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ferzalrwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭mandragor1996 wrote: »So now were on to the sky is falling aftermath? It's a game not a malpractice suit. Events for bonus XP are good in general as promotion for getting people online to play. Use those for what they are good for.
So you think bonus xp to make up for what they nerfed xp down to, for like a week of bonus time then it goes back down to the nerfed rate which is far less than it was before they "promised" to make vet leveling faster, would make up for any of this?
No, they need to fix the rate so it's actually faster, like they said they were going to.
Lying is unacceptable.
They said in general it would be faster, how it would be faster was never said.
It's faster in no way. There is no method that makes it faster than doing almost anything before. I'm not sure where the said "in general" it would be faster. Are you making that up? What they actually said, of course, was
when they increased the amount of time it takes by a factor of 2 (at minimum).We expect this to reduce the amount of time it takes to gain a Veteran Rank.
To turn this mess into something that is even as fast as the previous system will take some serious effort. Making it "faster" as promised is beyond them I would think.
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Palidon✭✭✭✭✭
✭ferzalrwb17_ESO wrote: »mandragor1996 wrote: »So now were on to the sky is falling aftermath? It's a game not a malpractice suit. Events for bonus XP are good in general as promotion for getting people online to play. Use those for what they are good for.
So you think bonus xp to make up for what they nerfed xp down to, for like a week of bonus time then it goes back down to the nerfed rate which is far less than it was before they "promised" to make vet leveling faster, would make up for any of this?
No, they need to fix the rate so it's actually faster, like they said they were going to.
Lying is unacceptable.
They said in general it would be faster, how it would be faster was never said.
It's faster in no way. There is no method that makes it faster than doing almost anything before. I'm not sure where the said "in general" it would be faster. Are you making that up? What they actually said, of course, was
when they increased the amount of time it takes by a factor of 2 (at minimum).We expect this to reduce the amount of time it takes to gain a Veteran Rank.
To turn this mess into something that is even as fast as the previous system will take some serious effort. Making it "faster" as promised is beyond them I would think.
I don't see where it is faster. I have been loosing Veteran XP points while playing today. Started with 1,114,135 after patch 1.5.4. Increased to 1.127,498 during game play. Then dropped to 1,124, 576. Of course I am VR14 so the points just accumulate but in my case they are going down for some reason.
Edited by Palidon on November 13, 2014 10:33PM0 -
spryler✭✭✭A guy said in a post earlier on that he played for an hour (just messing around) and got 1/10th of a level. Someone countered saying it wasn't about time, but about each zone giving you 1 VR rank. Now someone else is saying it should be about time....and around and around we go
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ferzalrwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭A guy said in a post earlier on that he played for an hour (just messing around) and got 1/10th of a level. Someone countered saying it wasn't about time, but about each zone giving you 1 VR rank. Now someone else is saying it should be about time....and around and around we go
It's about both.
Levelling via questing is slower than it was previously
Overland Vetzone Mob-grinding, whilst faster than questing, is slower (and lonelier) than Craglorn grinding was previously.
It's slower and more boring no matter which way you look at it which is, surely, the opposite of what everyone wants.
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spryler✭✭✭"It's slower and more boring no matter which way you look at it which is, surely, the opposite of what everyone wants."
Be careful what you assume. People may want to level up faster, but then if they make it faster the people who already are v14 may complain.
Personally I like a little challenge. My first MMO (not counting MUDs) was Everquest, where the leveling was ridiculously slow. Also you couldn't solo past lvl 30ish unless you were a kiting class (druid or necromancer). If you had two max level chars in Everquest you seriously had no life.
In contrast WoW made everything much easier to attract more casual players (and thus more money). I hated how easy they made WoW, but EQ was probably too far the other way. Anyway I guess my point is that faster xp gain is not necessarily better.4 -
TequilaFire✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It is just getting very tiresome waiting the week out for a patch that is supposed
to fix the quest xp and now on patch #2 since screw up and now they still say it won't be fixed till the next patch.
I could of sworn they stated the xp problem was their top priority.0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Seriously Babylon, every single post from you is either - This game is terrible or They should give me money back. Now those are legitimate opinions to have, definitely your right to have those opinions and express them. But do we need to read the same posts 100 times?
I haven't been answered once, thanks for your opinion though, it's of no use at all here.
Why do "people" whiteknight for a company instead of supporting their fellow players? It's sad. Nobody likes a brown noser.
Also, learn to quote. Also, stop stalking my posts. Okay, that's you out of the way, hopefully won't have to put you on ignore ok.
And yes we do deserve a) good (and honest) communication and b) some kind of compensation for our wasted game time - this is not a beta, we are paying a subscription and any patch that effectively stops us playing is something they need to either fix immediately or compensate the player base for.
This debacle stops us playing, because there is only a limited amount of content in the game in the form of quests, and not getting the right xp would mean we were behind where we should be in the game.Edited by babylon on November 13, 2014 11:03PM5 -
Palidon✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well every Veteran experience point I accumulated today has been lost somewhere. Started out with 1,114, 135 xp. Increased to 1,127,498 during game play. Dropped to 1,124,576 while in Cyrodiil Dah.....?. Logged off for a while. Logged back it and my xp was back to 1,114,135. Now ain't that a kicker.............. Whats the sense of playing if I am going to be loosing xp gained. Cannot level up anymore am I VR14 and the way it was explained to me is the xp just accumulates towards the Champion system. Ya right...........0 -
ferzalrwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭"It's slower and more boring no matter which way you look at it which is, surely, the opposite of what everyone wants."
Be careful what you assume. People may want to level up faster, but then if they make it faster the people who already are v14 may complain.
Personally I like a little challenge. My first MMO (not counting MUDs) was Everquest, where the leveling was ridiculously slow. Also you couldn't solo past lvl 30ish unless you were a kiting class (druid or necromancer). If you had two max level chars in Everquest you seriously had no life.
In contrast WoW made everything much easier to attract more casual players (and thus more money). I hated how easy they made WoW, but EQ was probably too far the other way. Anyway I guess my point is that faster xp gain is not necessarily better.
And slower levelling is not necessarily more challenging. And in the case of ESO it definitely isn't. It's a faceroll. (Remember they nerfed Vet zone difficulty to faceroll level and even less people played it and now they won't change it back).
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babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭There's almost nobody in the game right now, areas that are usually packed are empty. This is a mess.3 -
Bars✭✭✭Champion system lol I just might drop by and see was it worth the damage it caused
ps I hated vet levels but I would take them back
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Blud✭✭✭✭✭stefan.gustavsonb16_ESO wrote: »Content in the last non-VR zones give significantly higher XP than similar content in VR zones at the moment. That seems more than a little strange.
The VR7 world boss Short-Tusk in Deshaan, killed solo at level, just rewarded me with 910 XP. It takes quite some time to kill it, it hits hard and is reasonably tough to solo, and it has around 20,000 HP. A regular VR7 kagouti roaming the area, having one tenth of the HP and being easily spam-killable in seconds, gave me 683 XP.
Soloing a dolmen at level in the same area (with great effort and lots of dying involved, I am a squishy NB) gave me a total of around 3,500 XP. I could just as well have killed five kagouti. That would have been much faster and involved absolutely no risk at all.
I would appreciate some official word on whether the developers think this is properly balanced and aptly rewarding. I think it's seriously messed up.
I'm afraid Kagouti xp will be nerfed now.
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babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Stuffedduck wrote: »
Another one coming up next week too. And they're working so hard to keep us.1 -
ferzalrwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Stuffedduck wrote: »
People still play that thing?
Anyway, it's only going to get worse as there are a bunch of releases of all genres in a row. This is not a good time to punch your own game in the groin. Nice timing ZOS.
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Grunim✭✭✭✭✭There's almost nobody in the game right now, areas that are usually packed are empty. This is a mess.
I've been staying out of vet areas and leveling up my non vet AD templar. Malabal Tor has plenty of people, so perhaps the vet areas are empty and with good reason, why play them while vet quest XP hasn't been fixed yet?
Am a whimsical Generation Jones gamer. Online RPGs hooked me since '94 and no sign of stopping soon...4 -
Robocles✭✭✭✭✭I think that we'd benefit a lot by seeing some real data on what real yields are like, not guessing. We've seen claims here varying by 2x in exp / mob, for instance.
My educated guess is that you don't need to grind, but since "normal" mob kills have boosted exp you will level significantly faster if you clear mobs in the way rather than avoiding them, and that the slower leveling people may just be relying on quest exp instead. So, you may need to go a bit slower and adjust a bit to see what you need to do.
Dude... I see you keep posting, and not listening. People are showing you real yields... and their personal experience.
How about this: YOU go test it, and come back, instead of spewing opinions about something you obviously know nothing about.
Capiche?1 -
Robocles✭✭✭✭✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »
The part you bolded will be addressed in our next patch. Once that is published, we'd like everyone to play around with the Veteran XP changes for a bit and let us know how it feels as there's been a lot of moving parts recently.WraithAzraiel wrote: »I started a thread about this after the fact so I'll just post it here so it doesn't get lost in the piles of threads already out there.
They've reduced the necessary XP required to level from 1.4 million and some change down to an even 1 mill. That's cool. They tweaked monster kill XP, that's great.
But did they fix the erroneous cap that was placed on quest XP resulting in people needing to complete 2 zones to achieve 1 Veteran Rank?
I don't see it mentioned anywhere in the patch notes.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Known Issues for Update 5
Miscellaneous- There's currently an issue where you are not gaining as much XP as intended while progressing through Veteran Ranks.
- STATUS: Potentially fixed in patch 1.5.4
The above bold is the matter to which I'm referring.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone,
As reported earlier this week, we have identified a couple issues surrounding experience gain:- Monsters that are well below your level give slightly less experience than intended. This will be fixed in our next incremental patch.
- The experience that you receive at the conclusion of a particularly difficult quest can reach a limit, and thus gets capped off. While the cap is there intentionally, it was set to level 50 values rather than VR values. This is being adjusted.
I saw no mention of this particular problem within the patch notes.
Any clarification on this would be greatly appreciated as I would like to start leveling my V1 Sorcerer again and would like it to not be an unreasonable hassle.
Completing the requirements of Cadwell's Silver/Gold should be enough to get you at least a Veteran Level or pretty close to one before moving on to the next zone. Everything else in said zone should be a bonus.
...
So... let's throw a bunch of stuff at the wall... and let our players figure out if it works.
No thanks.3 - There's currently an issue where you are not gaining as much XP as intended while progressing through Veteran Ranks.
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Robocles✭✭✭✭✭murtrem_ESO wrote: »I find it hilarious how many mathletes have been up in arms over this. I started a v2 zone yesterday as a fresh v2, had to go kill 3 extra mobs after I 100% completed the zone in order to hit v3. And that was before the 432k xp nerf
BS.2 -
Ysne58✭✭✭✭✭I don't know about you all but I have been loosing XP today. Started out with 1,114,135 after the 1.5.4 patch. It increased to 1,127,498 during some game play. Went to Cyrodiil and was playing there. Completed some Bounty Quests, happened to check my XP total and it had dropped to 1,124,498. Dah..........
Did you /bug in game and/or open a support ticket?0 -
Robocles✭✭✭✭✭@ZOS_GinaBruno
Ok... so based on what you just posted, we should wait to level our VR toons, since the XP we need to progress is still not right. And I don't just mean to get the next VR level, I mean XP we are supposed to be banking for the CS system we know almost nothing about. If we complete zones now, we will be losing out on significant XP we will never be able to recover.
Is it still your contention we should continue to level or VR toons? Will we be reimbursed for the XP we lose because we play when the system is bugged?
The question isn't really for me, since I'm gone once my sub is up... can't keep on this merry go round with you all, sorry. It's for the vast majority of your subs that never come here and just kept moving along thinking you were doing it right. They end up at a disadvantage when the CS treadmill shows up.2 -
Hazadus76✭✭✭I feel like I have been played. I thought the experience bug was fixed. Instead of coming out and saying specifically what they plan to fix, it's more ambiguity.2 -
crislevin✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I just find it fascinating this type of silly problem even happens.ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »Did you all not read the patch notes?
"Known Issue: Your progress bar will still show that 4,000,000XP is needed to gain a Veteran Rank. This is strictly a UI issue, and will be addressed in our next patch."
It's right there.
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