This underdog bonus is SCREWING DC over again. PLEASE look at screen shots

Turelus · November 2014

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

All the people ignoring the obvious bug because they want to spill some misplaced faction pride: Take a hike, this is an actual bug report.

Its actually not, it is working as intended. It was put in place with the timers it has to prevent what I am of the understanding that EP and DC are trying to do.

Gang up on AD and take everything from them while they arent even on.

If you do that when the population is lower than yours, youre going to be penalized for the next four hours (i believe its four), even after they come back and start taking things back.

This happens at prime time too, with all factions locked, AD having Emperor and quite a lot of keeps.

Like last night on EU-TB.

Exactly this. This isn't some thing happening in the early hours when no one is online, or when AD have nothing on the map. It's been happening at peak times when all factions are locked and even when AD have held more scrolls than anyone else.

It has also more than once moved the AD up a position in the rankings, it's not stopping the AD from falling behind but actively helping them beat DC and EP for doing no work.

I understand ZOS want a mechanic to help lower population factions keep up but it shouldn't be a system which grands more points per hour than the factions actively logged in and fighting can achieve.

Manoekin · November 2014

Turelus wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

All the people ignoring the obvious bug because they want to spill some misplaced faction pride: Take a hike, this is an actual bug report.

Its actually not, it is working as intended. It was put in place with the timers it has to prevent what I am of the understanding that EP and DC are trying to do.

Gang up on AD and take everything from them while they arent even on.

If you do that when the population is lower than yours, youre going to be penalized for the next four hours (i believe its four), even after they come back and start taking things back.

This happens at prime time too, with all factions locked, AD having Emperor and quite a lot of keeps.

Like last night on EU-TB.

Exactly this. This isn't some thing happening in the early hours when no one is online, or when AD have nothing on the map. It's been happening at peak times when all factions are locked and even when AD have held more scrolls than anyone else.

It has also more than once moved the AD up a position in the rankings, it's not stopping the AD from falling behind but actively helping them beat DC and EP for doing no work.

I understand ZOS want a mechanic to help lower population factions keep up but it shouldn't be a system which grands more points per hour than the factions actively logged in and fighting can achieve.

What you're saying is you want a system where the faction that can't be on all the time can never catch up. It gives them more points so that they can catch up the points they lost while not having anyone in the campaign. How is this hard to understand. If they only make equal points then you might as well not even have a system.

Lava_Croft · November 2014

Manoekin wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

All the people ignoring the obvious bug because they want to spill some misplaced faction pride: Take a hike, this is an actual bug report.

Its actually not, it is working as intended. It was put in place with the timers it has to prevent what I am of the understanding that EP and DC are trying to do.

Gang up on AD and take everything from them while they arent even on.

If you do that when the population is lower than yours, youre going to be penalized for the next four hours (i believe its four), even after they come back and start taking things back.

This happens at prime time too, with all factions locked, AD having Emperor and quite a lot of keeps.

Like last night on EU-TB.

Exactly this. This isn't some thing happening in the early hours when no one is online, or when AD have nothing on the map. It's been happening at peak times when all factions are locked and even when AD have held more scrolls than anyone else.

It has also more than once moved the AD up a position in the rankings, it's not stopping the AD from falling behind but actively helping them beat DC and EP for doing no work.

I understand ZOS want a mechanic to help lower population factions keep up but it shouldn't be a system which grands more points per hour than the factions actively logged in and fighting can achieve.

What you're saying is you want a system where the faction that can't be on all the time can never catch up. It gives them more points so that they can catch up the points they lost while not having anyone in the campaign. How is this hard to understand. If they only make equal points then you might as well not even have a system.

Stop twisting the guy's words. He is very clearly saying that a faction that doesn't actively play should by no means get more score than a faction that actively plays, while indeed confirming than a low population bonus in itself is a good idea.

Turelus · November 2014

Not a system where they can never catch up, but defiantly not a system where they can win by not playing.

As it seems to be functioning right now it's possible for a faction which isn't playing to overtake factions which actively are playing.
While I understand not everyone can play online at the same time should we really be implementing a system which punishes those who do actively play.

DC have been doing an amazing job this season in EU Thornblade and the other night they had their first place position taken from them for no reason other than AD didn't have anyone online.

A (terrible) analogy of the situation would be having a racing championship where one driver doesn't turn up for three races, but because they want to make sure he stays competitive they give him three race wins worth of points so he's back at number one place. Which does nothing but punish the drivers who turned up and worked for the points.

The most common bonus we have seen is pushing AD to +500 points, the highest we've seen is +800.

+800 points is two hours worth of 100% map control.
+500 points is 20 Elder Scrolls, or 50 Keeps.

If we look at this screenshot here

1st DC +187 Points/hour
2nd AD +136 Points/hour (+408 Population Bonus)
3rd EP +76 Points/hour

Why in this situation where AD is very strong and competitive should they receive a bonus in points which places them above the DC after the next score evaluation?

*edited for my horrible over use of "I mean". :disagree:

Manoekin · November 2014

Turelus wrote: »

If we look at this screenshot here

1st DC +187 Points/hour
2nd AD +136 Points/hour (+408 Population Bonus)
3rd EP +76 Points/hour

Why in this situation where AD is very strong and competitive should they receive a bonus in points which places them above the DC after the next score evaluation?

*edited for my horrible over use of "I mean". :disagree:

I don't know what time frame this is since the screenshot doesn't show that, but the most obvious answer to your question is because they got stomped with a lower population earlier and were thus at a disadvantage as far as the score goes.

heng14rwb17_ESO · November 2014

Divine punishment to the purple alliance

michaelb14a_ESO2 · November 2014

Rylana wrote: »

Here is a solution - stop purpling up on AD overnight and this wouldnt happen in the morning.

Take everything from AD, when AD is 1 bar vs 2 bar EP/DC each, overnight, and for the next four hours watch yourselves fall farther behind.

Time for red and blue to start actually fighting each other again.

PROTIP - AD was 1 bar from 4-7am, that lowpop bonus is from that timeframe when were outnumbered 4-1

^^ 100% correct! It's a problem of their own making.

MrGhosty · November 2014

The problem I'm seeing here is that people speak about this problem from the perspective that each faction is controllable. While there have been some alliances, more often than not these "gang ups" are just a natural product of three faction warfare. No one controls the pugs, they will duckling to wherever someone leads and those who lead aren't always in concert with one another.

I think what may need to happen is the campaigns that see consistent rates of population need to have the bonus removed entirely while remaining in place for the ghost town campaigns where the bonus is what helps low pop factions remain competitive. I can't speak for the EU servers, but I can't imagine any of the three factions would have a hard time fending for themselves on Thornblade, off peak hours see spikes in faction pop at different times with a consistent pop lock during peak hours. This leads me to believe the scoring would work itself out without needing to have a low pop bonus.

If the bonus cannot be removed, then perhaps they need to modify the code so that it checks for pop imbalance more often in order to accurately reflect the true state of things. I think this system is working perfectly fine on the buff servers where there is far less fluctuation in pop but on servers like NA Thornblade the low pop bonus seems redundant.

I don't feel that any faction should have an advantage, I love the dynamic give and take. This back and forth makes the fights all the more epic and intense, but the above stated problem does truly seem like a miscalculation when applied to a consistently busy server.

Turelus · November 2014

EU Thornblade is pretty much what you stated.

There seems to be one period at around 04:00 - 06:00 where AD are not active but DC and EP still have one or two raids going and are getting the bonus for this reason.
However there is very little doubt from anyone on EU Thornblade that AD are the strongest faction and if they want to take the map they can at any time. I fully expect the last week and weekend to be the same as last month and see AD push from 3rd place to 1st creating a massive 2-6k gap.
The sad thing being that push had they not received population bonus the last two weeks would balance them out vs those who have been here the whole time, instead they're able to ride it casual until the last week and still hold on to second place.

ZOS_UlyssesW · November 2014

Greetings, everyone.
In an effort to consolidate discussions on the same topic, we're closing this thread, as a larger thread about this topic already exists. We're interested in your feedback and to easily gather it, please head there to post.