You should not be so distrustful of your officers. If you cannot trust your officers with information like the location of a bid then you promoted the wrong people.

As for the rest, I'm a bit torn. I understand the feeling that you want this bid to be hidden from your guild as much as possible in case of spies. However, its presence on the history tab shows that you didn't just embezzle all the gold in the bank. Excellent for transparency and building trust with your core members. Terrible of course in the case of spies.

If you're really concerned about spies, you have two options.

A) Don't bid until the last moment before bidding ends. [Risky]

Sink it in the history by moving things around in the bank.

This is still view-able in guild tab, any chance on being fixed? I apologize if it has been addressed elsewhere but I couldn't find it...

As I believe i have been sniped before myself, or had moles, as well as asked members to find out info for market research (very tempting to use but didn't). Its very easy to find even if buried by a restack or 2. And the spy and espionage issue while intriguing is very stressful and would hope, this sort of "play" wasn't being encouraged by the devs. Not only if you have a mole problem do you have to wait until last minute to bid but then you have to wait through 2-3 hour maintenance, win or lose, and if you lose, run a tizzy all over Tamriel trying to land a decent spot for your guildies so they don't accuse you of not providing them w/ a sales outlet/Trader.

Hi guys and thank you for reaching us,

We are aware of this issue, our teams are already working on it and a fix should be available in a future patch, soon.
We appreciate your help.

Have a lovely day in Tamriel!

GrooverGabe wrote: »

As I believe i have been sniped before myself, or had moles, as well as asked members to find out info for market research (very tempting to use but didn't). Its very easy to find even if buried by a restack or 2. And the spy and espionage issue while intriguing is very stressful and would hope, this sort of "play" wasn't being encouraged by the devs. Not only if you have a mole problem do you have to wait until last minute to bid but then you have to wait through 2-3 hour maintenance, win or lose, and if you lose, run a tizzy all over Tamriel trying to land a decent spot for your guildies so they don't accuse you of not providing them w/ a sales outlet/Trader.

I agree. As a trade guild GM, I find it incredibly stressful to do exactly this. Ensure that I get up early on Monday morning to place my bid at the last possible minute so that spies don't snipe and even after that you have to stay in front of the computer pretty much the whole time so that you're ready when it comes back up to try and find a 100g trader for your guild if you lost. Any "Monday Maintenance" day is sure to have me glued to the computer for up to 5 or 6 hours because I want to do my best to get a trader for my guild.

Is there any way you can move the guild trader swap day to one that isn't also maintenance day? In addition, how about raising the min buyout price over 100g? Guilds with 0 listings snatch up 100g spots because, why not? It's no real loss to them. I say kiosks in the outskirts should be 1k min, cities, 5k min and capital cities, 10k min buyouts to discourage horrible guilds from setting up shop for a week.

GM's should not be put into positions like this causing massive amounts of stress and eating up time we could be doing other things... like sleeping.

While we're on the subject of Kiosks, let's keep going!

Seeing the bid info before Mondays is definitely a problem.

You know what else I don't like?

An in-game mafia guild created by the Rawl'kha mega-shops dedicated to 'ending' the blind-bidding system ESO created, with some jaw-dropping rules like:

~ guilds in your "club" are ASSIGNED a kiosk and FORBIDDEN to leave that kiosk without permission in advance from YOU. This is being spun as "get your own permanent kiosk". To quote the e-surance commericals, "That's not how it works".

~ guilds in your "club" cannot bid against ANYONE ELSE in your club and if they dare to, that means "WAR" and they will be "BLACKBALLED"

~ if an outside guild bids against you, that means "WAR" and they will be "BLACKBALLED". Direct quote from a Rawl Guild Chat: "No guild would be stupid enough to bid against us in Rawl and if they did, it would mean war"

~ you complain about spies but the only way you'd be sure about the things you are saying is if you engaged in it personally. While concealing bid info until the transaction is completed is a great idea, really, what is the worst that could happen? You lose a kiosk for a week? ZOMG!

~ Outside guilds (and even members who don't realize they can look this info up) are being led to believe that 7 figures+ is being paid for Rawl Kiosks. The truth is that there are Kiosks in Rawl that regularly go for 170k-250k every week. One Rawl guild sent out an e-mail calling its members leeches if they didn't contribute more to support the "Up to 1.3 Million" bids, when in reality, they pay well under 1/2 that amount every week lol. It took me about 3 seconds to hit the quit button lol.

Most of the Rawl kiosks NEVER change hands because of lies, threats and intimidation.

~ Rawl guilds LOVE to brag about their "millions" of gold, but where is it? Certainly not in the guild bank! Members in any large trade guild should do some basic math now and then. Sales Tax + Contest income - Prize Gold SHOULD equal bank balance. In many of the 'big' guilds, there is a GIGANTIC disparity between gold that comes in and gold that gets spent on kiosks and contests. Those middle of the night withdrawals are very telling.

Not accusing any of this of breaking the terms of service. But let's at least be truthful about what you are doing and why:

100% of this is aimed at making sure that the Rawl Kiosks (and other popular hubs) never, ever change hands and are secured as cheaply as possible by leading the rest of the server to believe they are too expensive or the consequences will be too big if they dare. Any good-sized guild that might pose a threat is recruited into the mafia and then forbidden to bid on Rawl.

Brilliant plan. Really, it is. Hats off.

Whether or not it works in the long-term is really up to other Trade Guilds having the testicular fortitude to create real competition in Rawl and other hubs instead of letting the Kiosk Mafia run it all.

I can tell you this, I'm having none of it. You've been warned. See you in Rawl real soon!

ZOS_LenaicR wrote: »

Hi guys and thank you for reaching us,

We are aware of this issue, our teams are already working on it and a fix should be available in a future patch, soon.
We appreciate your help.

Have a lovely day in Tamriel!

Honestly, this should have gone in with 1.5. Spies in the guild should not be allowed to be become thing even for 5 minutes.

wow Bat, bitter much?

Thanks for your reply addressing 1/2 of one point made in my post.

I assume your lack of response to the rest means you aren't denying any of it?

And even your reply is false. At least 2 guilds have already been blackballed by the Rawl Mafia. (and by blackballed I mean members having a gun put to their head and forced to choose between the Mafia guilds or the blackballed one)

Not trolling when it's true!

I am curious as I would assume many others are, what do you mean by "gun to their head and forced"

Bat, are you saying that your guild doesn't take precautions against people who might be looking to gather information as to your means? If you knew of a guild that was reputed to spy on bids, would you want them to have access to any information by way of having common members?

Guild money fluctuates. As for withdrawals, what about guild money used to purchase prizes for raffles and such? If a guild has withdrawal permissions on their bank, they're not going to keep prizes in there where any member could withdraw them. It's unreasonable to expect that this all be itemized; it's simply not feasible with the bank structure, nor is it even necessary. If a guild has faith in their leaders, they shouldn't have to be concerned with it. Bottom line, if you don't trust the leadership, why would you bother staying with a guild? You're not being forced to stay.

This insinuation towards traders in Rawl is just plain rude. It's not unheard of for guild leaders to communicate with each other, especially in the case of unscrupulous players; if anything the communication helps improve the trading community.

BatOutta wrote: »

Thanks for your reply addressing 1/2 of one point made in my post.

I assume your lack of response to the rest means you aren't denying any of it?

And even your reply is false. At least 2 guilds have already been blackballed by the Rawl Mafia. (and by blackballed I mean members having a gun put to their head and forced to choose between the Mafia guilds or the blackballed one)

Not trolling when it's true!

"gun put to their head and forced"

thebeater72 wrote: »

BatOutta wrote: »

Thanks for your reply addressing 1/2 of one point made in my post.

I assume your lack of response to the rest means you aren't denying any of it?

And even your reply is false. At least 2 guilds have already been blackballed by the Rawl Mafia. (and by blackballed I mean members having a gun put to their head and forced to choose between the Mafia guilds or the blackballed one)

Not trolling when it's true!

"gun put to their head and forced"

BatOutta wrote: »

Wow, so much deflection without addressing actual points.

Re-read my post again. It says Sales Tax + Contest Money - Prizes should equal the bank balance. These guild leaders routinely brag about having "millions" but that gold sure isn't in most of the guild banks, is it? And then there's the middle of the night 6 figure withdrawals that have nothing to do with contesting.

I'm not insinuating anything, I'm quoting truth.

It's one thing to root out spies, it's another thing to go through the entire guild list of a guild you don't like, note every single player in common and then tell every one of them to drop the other guild or be booted.

Communication is one thing. Inviting guilds into the mafia, then informing them they aren't allowed to bid against any other mafia guilds (especially rawl) or there will be consequences is a very different thing.

I'll say it again: this guild mafia exists so that Rawl guilds can protect their Rawl kiosks with deceit and intimidation. The intention is a blind bidding system where highest bidder wins, not for anyone to have a guaranteed permanent kiosk or to declare war on anyone who dares to bid against them.

Oh..and FYI...for those considering Rawl bids, one went for under 135,000 this week and 2 went for under 325,000. It's not as expensive as they'd have you believe lol. The guilds raking in the most cash are spending some of the lowest prices for any major city, let alone Rawl. Happy Bidding.

Wow, you suck.

BatOutta wrote: »

Wow, so much deflection without addressing actual points.

Re-read my post again. It says Sales Tax + Contest Money - Prizes should equal the bank balance. These guild leaders routinely brag about having "millions" but that gold sure isn't in most of the guild banks, is it? And then there's the middle of the night 6 figure withdrawals that have nothing to do with contesting.

When successful trade guilds talk about their "millions in sales" they're not talking about the money in the bank. They're talking about millions of gold earned amongst their members. Remember, trade guild members are there to make gold for themselves. Trade guilds are an outlet for them to make money with, as well as buy things they may need themselves, and network with other traders to make money.

GM's of trading guilds are advertising the success of their members, not the size of their guild vault.