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"Forward Camps will no longer be sold by Merchants in Cyrodiil."
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DisgracefulMind✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Aoe_Barbecue wrote: »This seems like a hasty change. I suppose we will have to see how it affects Cyrodiil to pass further judgment, however. Fights will have higher risks, but winning them will have more of a sense of permanency I suppose.
Agree with hasty -- people are very used to FC-based gameplay in Cyrodil. There will be much angst. Fights will be extremely risky, yes.
Perhaps they may consider in the future allowing respawns at resources around the keeps. That would add another strategic element to sieges.
Finally, combined with the oil-pot nerf, AP-earning speed has just been dramatically reduced.
I wouldn't be opposed to a 20 respawn limit at each resource per hour. This would give value to defenders reclaiming resources before a siege ends, so they could get some reinforcements.
Yeah that is a good idea. Also, like @Aoe_Barbecue said, increasing the HP of walls by at least x2 is probably necessary to allow dead defenders to try to run back to the siege (which would, in turn, force the attackers to consider assigning a force to patrol the possible overland return routes).
Milegates/Bridges: No more dropping an FC on one side of it and then pounding it down as the defenders have further to run back from the keep.
This is definitely going to be an advantage for AD because it's alot faster to ride from Alessia to the bridge than it is to ride from Sejanus to the bridge.
We have the advantage at the Chalman milegate now.
I'd mention the Ash milegate, but we all know no PVP happens in that corridor of the map.
Funny you mention the Ash milegate, because on the DC side we just had a couple of fun battles there with some AD, so maybe now some PvP will happen in that area :P
Unfortunate magicka warden main.
PC/NA Server
Fairweather Friends
Retired to baby bgs forever. Leave me alone.0 -
Aoe_Barbecue✭✭✭✭✭dzugarueb17_ESO wrote: »Horrible change, just horrible. Melee - ruined. Glass cannons - ruined. PVPing without a guild/group - ruined (obv nobody will res you). Being in a full raid mindlessly following the crown and mashing 1 button - mandatory.
Why, why don't just add the timer to respawn? Go get a beer is not fun - riding through the same woods over and over and over and over and over IS?
Pug zergs have a lot of attrition, which is why spammable forward camps played in their favor. They could maintain their primary advantage -- numbers -- indefinitely so long as they had camps. It's why troll camps were so irritating and why zergs grew and grew and grew since they fixed forward camps bugging out.
A guild group with finely tuned team play and survivable dps'ers will dominate these zergs more readily. There will be a lot more open field combat between keeps than before, so the zerg won't be able to take advantage of its strongest terrain: the cramped quarters inside keeps and at resources. I look forward to getting on after work, personally.Edited by Aoe_Barbecue on November 3, 2014 6:46PM3 -
Agrippa_Invisus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭DisgracefulMind wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Aoe_Barbecue wrote: »This seems like a hasty change. I suppose we will have to see how it affects Cyrodiil to pass further judgment, however. Fights will have higher risks, but winning them will have more of a sense of permanency I suppose.
Agree with hasty -- people are very used to FC-based gameplay in Cyrodil. There will be much angst. Fights will be extremely risky, yes.
Perhaps they may consider in the future allowing respawns at resources around the keeps. That would add another strategic element to sieges.
Finally, combined with the oil-pot nerf, AP-earning speed has just been dramatically reduced.
I wouldn't be opposed to a 20 respawn limit at each resource per hour. This would give value to defenders reclaiming resources before a siege ends, so they could get some reinforcements.
Yeah that is a good idea. Also, like @Aoe_Barbecue said, increasing the HP of walls by at least x2 is probably necessary to allow dead defenders to try to run back to the siege (which would, in turn, force the attackers to consider assigning a force to patrol the possible overland return routes).
Milegates/Bridges: No more dropping an FC on one side of it and then pounding it down as the defenders have further to run back from the keep.
This is definitely going to be an advantage for AD because it's alot faster to ride from Alessia to the bridge than it is to ride from Sejanus to the bridge.
We have the advantage at the Chalman milegate now.
I'd mention the Ash milegate, but we all know no PVP happens in that corridor of the map.
Funny you mention the Ash milegate, because on the DC side we just had a couple of fun battles there with some AD, so maybe now some PvP will happen in that area :P
I heard a rumor once that AD and DC just rock/paper/scissors over who gets to own Ash or Roe for that afternoon and then go back to frighting along the Bleakers and Sejanus corridors.Agrippa Invisus / Indominus / Inprimis / Inviolatus
DragonKnight / Templar / Warden / Sorcerer - Vagabond
Once a General, now a Citizen
Former Emperor of Bloodthorn and Vivec
For Sweetrolls! FOR FIMIAN!5 -
Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I just really think they need to re-think soul gem cost and availability. Ressing people will be practically a necessity and you just know people will not res as long as soul gems cost what they do.You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points2 -
Aoe_Barbecue✭✭✭✭✭Operation [snip] AD is always in effect. I can't speak for DC's eminently zergish zerglings who seem to have a hate bonér for EP. As for me, I still have mild PTSD from Auriel's Bow 1.0. Only good banana dead banana!
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]Edited by ZOS_UlyssesW on November 3, 2014 8:02PM0 -
Insurrektion✭✭✭ZOS_TristanK wrote: »Forward Camps won't be sold by any merchants in Cyrodiil, @Turelus.
@ZOS_TristanK I think the question of the hour is, but will they be obtainable by a different means?
EDIT:This just in, Soul Gems are going to be a hot commodity.Edited by Insurrektion on November 3, 2014 6:51PM1 -
Lionxoft✭✭✭✭✭
✭Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Wow, this change is abit harsh imo. People dying in seconds already.
I'd rather to keep it until you fix the radius issue.
This also greatly affects the fight club style duel guilds as well. Whole thing is gonna screw up from now on.. Are you gonna pay the soulstone bills Zeni?
Inconveniencing duelers is likely one of the things that ZOS didn't bother considering.
I'm sure they considered it. The dueling guilds are a small and unimportant subset of players that don't contribute to Cyrodil gameplay. Filling gems doesn't take long at all.4 -
Oughash✭✭✭✭Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »DisgracefulMind wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Aoe_Barbecue wrote: »This seems like a hasty change. I suppose we will have to see how it affects Cyrodiil to pass further judgment, however. Fights will have higher risks, but winning them will have more of a sense of permanency I suppose.
Agree with hasty -- people are very used to FC-based gameplay in Cyrodil. There will be much angst. Fights will be extremely risky, yes.
Perhaps they may consider in the future allowing respawns at resources around the keeps. That would add another strategic element to sieges.
Finally, combined with the oil-pot nerf, AP-earning speed has just been dramatically reduced.
I wouldn't be opposed to a 20 respawn limit at each resource per hour. This would give value to defenders reclaiming resources before a siege ends, so they could get some reinforcements.
Yeah that is a good idea. Also, like @Aoe_Barbecue said, increasing the HP of walls by at least x2 is probably necessary to allow dead defenders to try to run back to the siege (which would, in turn, force the attackers to consider assigning a force to patrol the possible overland return routes).
Milegates/Bridges: No more dropping an FC on one side of it and then pounding it down as the defenders have further to run back from the keep.
This is definitely going to be an advantage for AD because it's alot faster to ride from Alessia to the bridge than it is to ride from Sejanus to the bridge.
We have the advantage at the Chalman milegate now.
I'd mention the Ash milegate, but we all know no PVP happens in that corridor of the map.
Funny you mention the Ash milegate, because on the DC side we just had a couple of fun battles there with some AD, so maybe now some PvP will happen in that area :P
I heard a rumor once that AD and DC just rock/paper/scissors over who gets to own Ash or Roe for that afternoon and then go back to frighting along the Bleakers and Sejanus corridors.
I heard a rumor that AD and EP decide via coinflip who gets to defend Sej each evening. It is a stressful coinflip, or so I've heard.1 -
Guppet✭✭✭✭✭
✭They desperately need to remove all forward camps in max 2 weeks, or EU will be an utter joke for the coming months.
They don't need to remove US ones, but broadcasting the change before it happened for EU was grossly incompetent. It's almost like we in the EU are an after thought. The longer they take to completely remove them the more they prove this.4 -
Agrippa_Invisus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Insurrektion wrote: »ZOS_TristanK wrote: »Forward Camps won't be sold by any merchants in Cyrodiil, @Turelus.
@ZOS_TristanK I think the question of the hour is, but will they be obtainable by a different means?
All signs point to "No".
Agrippa Invisus / Indominus / Inprimis / Inviolatus
DragonKnight / Templar / Warden / Sorcerer - Vagabond
Once a General, now a Citizen
Former Emperor of Bloodthorn and Vivec
For Sweetrolls! FOR FIMIAN!1 -
dzugarueb17_ESO✭✭✭✭A guild group with finely tuned team play and survivable dps'ers will dominate these zergs more readily
I loved the PVP in this game cause it's the only game where you don't need "finely tuned team play". You can be VR1 or even slightly less and play without a guild or group. You can go where you want freely and help - sieges, defence. Multiplayer PVP without responsibilities, shouts in TS, etc. Like Battlefield. You will die a lot surely - but that is not a problem. WAS not a problem.5 -
DisgracefulMind✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »DisgracefulMind wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Aoe_Barbecue wrote: »This seems like a hasty change. I suppose we will have to see how it affects Cyrodiil to pass further judgment, however. Fights will have higher risks, but winning them will have more of a sense of permanency I suppose.
Agree with hasty -- people are very used to FC-based gameplay in Cyrodil. There will be much angst. Fights will be extremely risky, yes.
Perhaps they may consider in the future allowing respawns at resources around the keeps. That would add another strategic element to sieges.
Finally, combined with the oil-pot nerf, AP-earning speed has just been dramatically reduced.
I wouldn't be opposed to a 20 respawn limit at each resource per hour. This would give value to defenders reclaiming resources before a siege ends, so they could get some reinforcements.
Yeah that is a good idea. Also, like @Aoe_Barbecue said, increasing the HP of walls by at least x2 is probably necessary to allow dead defenders to try to run back to the siege (which would, in turn, force the attackers to consider assigning a force to patrol the possible overland return routes).
Milegates/Bridges: No more dropping an FC on one side of it and then pounding it down as the defenders have further to run back from the keep.
This is definitely going to be an advantage for AD because it's alot faster to ride from Alessia to the bridge than it is to ride from Sejanus to the bridge.
We have the advantage at the Chalman milegate now.
I'd mention the Ash milegate, but we all know no PVP happens in that corridor of the map.
Funny you mention the Ash milegate, because on the DC side we just had a couple of fun battles there with some AD, so maybe now some PvP will happen in that area :P
I heard a rumor once that AD and DC just rock/paper/scissors over who gets to own Ash or Roe for that afternoon and then go back to frighting along the Bleakers and Sejanus corridors.
Haha that's something I've never seen happen :PUnfortunate magicka warden main.
PC/NA Server
Fairweather Friends
Retired to baby bgs forever. Leave me alone.1 -
Aoe_Barbecue✭✭✭✭✭dzugarueb17_ESO wrote: »A guild group with finely tuned team play and survivable dps'ers will dominate these zergs more readily
I loved the PVP in this game cause it's the only game where you don't need "finely tuned team play". You can be VR1 or even slightly less and play without a guild or group. You can go where you want freely and help - sieges, defence. Multiplayer PVP without responsibilities, shouts in TS, etc. Like Battlefield. You will die a lot surely - but that is not a problem. WAS not a problem.
In the days of bugged FC's, I was predominantly a soloist, ganker, and deulist and had great fun and success doing these. 1v2-5 was the norm outside of Bloodthorn Rules dueling. The lack of reliable FC's meant a lot of people were running from objective to objective, and this presents plentiful ganking opportunities. The appearance of spammable FC's meant there was less hoof/foot transit and this drove me to group play ... which I admittedly am now heavily biased towards.
I think you will find your small gank groups and solo efforts will be rewarded thanks to the absence of FC's.Edited by Aoe_Barbecue on November 3, 2014 7:00PM1 -
Agrippa_Invisus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Daoc never had forward camps. seiges weren't trivial either. Good change imho.
Yup. In DAOC the attackers had to win or wipe. They had to eventually commit to trying to overrun the keep and that's when it was at the point they were all in on their choice.
If they wiped entering the courtyard or trying to kill the lord, that was typically that. The defenders won, and got to repair the keep.
We don't have that in ESO in 1.4 in earlier. It was wave after wave of bodies exhausting you, either as defense or offense.Agrippa Invisus / Indominus / Inprimis / Inviolatus
DragonKnight / Templar / Warden / Sorcerer - Vagabond
Once a General, now a Citizen
Former Emperor of Bloodthorn and Vivec
For Sweetrolls! FOR FIMIAN!2 -
Giraffon✭✭✭✭✭
✭I love this change. It changes everything! I feel like I'm getting a new game!Giraffon - Beta Lizard - For the Pact!2 -
DisgracefulMind✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭dzugarueb17_ESO wrote: »A guild group with finely tuned team play and survivable dps'ers will dominate these zergs more readily
I loved the PVP in this game cause it's the only game where you don't need "finely tuned team play". You can be VR1 or even slightly less and play without a guild or group. You can go where you want freely and help - sieges, defence. Multiplayer PVP without responsibilities, shouts in TS, etc. Like Battlefield. You will die a lot surely - but that is not a problem. WAS not a problem.
Ah, yes, I don't play with a guild, but I suppose I should start looking for one. I was enjoying being solo all the time and being able to decide when and where I wanted to be, buuut perhaps it is time.Unfortunate magicka warden main.
PC/NA Server
Fairweather Friends
Retired to baby bgs forever. Leave me alone.0 -
FluffiestOne✭✭✭✭Glad I made 500k gold from these before they are gone. Ty trolls and spies, I enjoyed the profitsFluffy
Senior Fluffykins, Daggerfall Liberator of Haderus, Dragonknight.
Fliffers, Daggerfall Liberator of Hopesfire, Templar.
Prophet Fluffy of Death, Casual of the Dominion, Sorceror.
Nozdorumu The Timeless, Daggerfall. Dragon. Nightblade.
All my toon names are subject to change.
" Ignorance must be bliss because I can't imagine why anyone would live in it. " -Fluffy2 -
CoolsHisHands✭✭✭Maybe now I'll actually be able to sell stacks of 100 Soul Gems for more than you can buy 100 empty ones from the vendors.
100 Grand Soul Gem (Empty) costs 12,100g. Stacks of 100 Grand Soul Gem (Filled) sit in my various guild stores for days unless I price them 10,000g or less. That's how much ressing was worth in Cyrodiil with all the FC nonsense: negative gold.6 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Daoc never had forward camps. seiges weren't trivial either. Good change imho.
Yup. In DAOC the attackers had to win or wipe. They had to eventually commit to trying to overrun the keep and that's when it was at the point they were all in on their choice.
If they wiped entering the courtyard or trying to kill the lord, that was typically that. The defenders won, and got to repair the keep.
We don't have that in ESO in 1.4 in earlier. It was wave after wave of bodies exhausting you, either as defense or offense.
On the other hand, the distances between keeps were much smaller in DAoC(compare the size of the keeps to the distance between them: http://camelotherald.wikia.com/wiki/Hadrian's_Wall?file=Hadrians_Wall_map.jpg).
Also, you did not consume any limited resources rezzing, only mana.
We'll see how this works out in teso, altho i have a positive feelling about the change.Edited by Sharee on November 3, 2014 7:08PM1 -
dzugarueb17_ESO✭✭✭✭I think you will find your small gank groups and solo efforts will be rewarded thanks to the absence of FC's.
I absolutely hate ganking. First: I've rolled a totally wrong class - my class can't gank anyone. Second: when I'm riding and ganker shots me off the horse (especially with that nice Lethal Arrow crit) - I'm done.
Before the patch it was - "Oh well, thanks for delivering me to the camp, now I can be useful - heal, throw people to the ground with my shield, do a bit of dmg". After the patch - you guess.1 -
Aoe_Barbecue✭✭✭✭✭Healing as a role is sorta group dependent lol. I'm assuming you're a templar? You have some pretty solid solo and 1vMany options. But, they're not healing builds at all.0
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Xsorus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Absolute best change in the game in a long time.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXpX7JMwRXtczc5GTrIYRIw
ESO and GW2 PvP videos6 -
Rooty✭✭✭I'm thoroughly put off by this change...No Mercy
Rooty, Rooty-san, Rooty-sama, Rooty-chan, Rooty-senpai
Reality is for people who don't play video games.
WHERE IS SHE?!
#FreeBraidas7 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I think this stinks...forward camps and face paced action is part of the reason i liked pvp so much, it was never boring.
This will do nothing but slow the pace of the game, whihc IMO is not a good thing...Forward camps made keep battles and such "Battles of Attrition" a test of wills so to speaks which I like.
I helped defend Fort Roebeck the other night from the Dominion, we held of the Dominion attack, and then the Pact Showed up, we held them off, then the Dominion and the Pact both started working together, and us DC people still held them off, and pushed them both back out of the keep and routed them after about 40 minutes or more worth of battling.
Forward Camps made such an epic battle possible! without them, I would not have gotten to experience something so great....
Anyone who was there with me at Roebeck when we were doubled teams by the Pact and Dominion and we held them off, I salute you fellow Solider. Its was a great job by everyone period!
Sadly without forward camps, we will never get any epic moments like that anymore...we were outnumber 5 to one and we still beat them...we beat them because we were better players then them plain and simple....taking away forward camps is going to take a big part of these epic battles like this away, and IMO thats just a shame....Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak4 -
Icy✭✭✭✭Oh god. Do you know what this really means though?
NO ONE WILL EVER CHARGE THE BREACH.
It's hard enough to get people to jump in at the moment; I'm often the only person standing there, flailing away, but it's OK because I can die and come back and maybe (just maybe) someone will follow me.
NOW WHAT HOPE IS THERE???!!!!
All those archers and ranged attackers? It's no good if someone doesn't actually go through the gap to the other side._____________________________________________________________________________________________________
Greetings, Outlanders from -Icy (@IcyIC)
twitch.tv/IcyIC | youtube.com/HulloItsIcy
ESO Stream Team (not ZOS_Icy on the forums)
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________4 -
serenenightmare✭✭✭ThyIronFist wrote: »
How dare you, sir!v14 Sorcerer: Aerendyl Merith
Former Empress of Volendrung, first cycle.
Former Empress of Thornblade, fourth cycle.
v14 Templar: Aeren-chan
v1 Dragonknight: Aelrindel Merith
v1 Nightblade: Arendelle Merith
No Mercy.
Aeren Cartel, Best Drugs North America0 -
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Guys it's not that bad. I thought it would be but I just had a really intense 2hr fight at chalamo just now. I recorded the first 10 minutes of the Chalamo defense for you below. Get ready for EPIC fights!!
Edited by Armitas on November 3, 2014 10:22PMRetired.
Nord mDK7 -
Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »Nox_Aeterna wrote: »You have seen farming simulator , digger simulator , goat simulator...
Now ESO presents the walking simulator.
Incorrect. Horse riding simulator.
Incorrect. Bolt Escape Simulator.
Dont forget about this:Guys it's not that bad. I thought it would be but I just had a really intense 2hr fight at chalamo just now. I recorded the first 10 minutes of the Chalamo defense for you below. Get ready for EPIC fights!!
Edited by Ezareth on November 3, 2014 10:09PMPermanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube5
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