How would you like to hide your vampirism?

Two-Dogs · October 2014

What was surprising about this was that he didn't seem to have the faintest idea that this is a popular request nor did he seem to be at all aware that many players are not happy with the vampire Stages and feel adjustments need to be made.

0 Agrees

18 LOLs

Getting kind of sick of all the "I want to hide my Vampirism" threads that are flooding the forum.

25 Agrees

2 LOLs

Mordria · October 2014

MornaBaine wrote: »

How would you like to hide your vampirism?

First - get rid of the "red" in the white part of the eyes. Makes it look too cartooney, and cartooney ESO makes me sad. They would look great with just red pupils.

As for hiding the appearance I think all vampires should look normal - until they use a skill related to the vampire skill line. After they stop using the skill line They have a 15-30 minute or longer cool down to look normal again.

Vizier · October 2014

Ooops bad post....really messed that up. Too many quotes.

Vizier · October 2014

MornaBaine wrote: »

First of all, it is already EASY to hide your vampirism on the battlefield. Plenty of armor allows for this. So the fact is that having glowing white skin is NOT ABOUT BALANCE. It is a cosmetic issue that is EASILY negated in PvP so it makes absolutely no sense to say that it's a deliberate balance for PvP. Because it's just not. Now, if your comeback is that, fine, in order to hide my vampirism I should just wear armor in cities and during roleplay sessions, I'll know you're just being bitter and have run out of actual arguments.

And as I've already said, I am completely cool with the upcoming ability to identify vampires. You'll have to spend a skill point for it and slot it and if you want to be a monster hunter, that's EXACTLY what you should have to do. They're also going to be gimping Batswarm so there's no more excuse to cry "Vamps are OP" either so THAT excuse for "I must be able to see the vamp!" is also gone.

So, once more... next argument, please.

lol- Fortunately for me alot of vamps run without their helmets and use armor that reveals skin. If they cover up in full plate with visor helm I'll have no way of knowing until skills are used. So, because people "can" cover up you should be able to look pretty? No, doesn't jive. And that the vampire population isn't in a mad rush to cover up speaks volumes about how little they care that I might silver bolt their asses. Your just trying to find a reason to justify your position. It simply doesn't work morna. Additionally it pretty much takes full plate, heavy armor to totally cover up as you suggest and most don't run with that...so lucky me. Unlucky you....try again? Just stay down...really.

Nice try.

WraithAzraiel · October 2014

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

"How would you like to hide your vampirism?"

I would not like to hide my vampirism. Not at all. It should not be hidden. The appearance is a consequence of my decision to be a vampire. We all have to live with the consequences of our decisions. I didn't have to choose to be a vampire; no one held a gun to my head. If I decide I don't like the vampire appearance, then I can get myself cured.

Right but stage 1 shouldn't make you look like you have tuberculosis.

MornaBaine · October 2014

Vizier wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

First of all, it is already EASY to hide your vampirism on the battlefield. Plenty of armor allows for this. So the fact is that having glowing white skin is NOT ABOUT BALANCE. It is a cosmetic issue that is EASILY negated in PvP so it makes absolutely no sense to say that it's a deliberate balance for PvP. Because it's just not. Now, if your comeback is that, fine, in order to hide my vampirism I should just wear armor in cities and during roleplay sessions, I'll know you're just being bitter and have run out of actual arguments.

And as I've already said, I am completely cool with the upcoming ability to identify vampires. You'll have to spend a skill point for it and slot it and if you want to be a monster hunter, that's EXACTLY what you should have to do. They're also going to be gimping Batswarm so there's no more excuse to cry "Vamps are OP" either so THAT excuse for "I must be able to see the vamp!" is also gone.

So, once more... next argument, please.

lol- Fortunately for me alot of vamps run without their helmets and use armor that reveals skin. If they cover up in full plate with visor helm I'll have no way of knowing until skills are used. So, because people "can" cover up you should be able to look pretty? No, doesn't jive. And that the vampire population isn't in a mad rush to cover up speaks volumes about how little they care that I might silver bolt their asses. Your just trying to find a reason to justify your position. It simply doesn't work morna. Additionally it pretty much takes full plate, heavy armor to totally cover up as you suggest and most don't run with that...so lucky me. Unlucky you....try again? Just stay down...really. Nice try.

To "stay down" I would have had to have BEEN down in the first place. You really don't like being challenged, do you? As your arguments run thin you do get a bit testy. LOL But nothing you have said invalidates my own contention. And there ARE light armor headgears that do cover the entire face. That no few people choose to run without such concealing gear has about zero to do with the topic under discussion. Which, in case you've forgotten, you made out to be that it's somehow "important" for you to be able to easily see who the vampires are in PvP and that you contend that the ghastly glowing white appearance has been designed to let you do just that. You further contend that this is some sort of balance issue. I've amply demonstrated that it is not. And no, I never said, "Because vamps in PvP CAN cover up their appearance I should be able to look pretty." I've already explained, at length, the reasons why I object to the current appearance and stage timers. They are nonsensical and unnecessary and serve no actual purpose. Much like your continued snarking.

MornaBaine · October 2014

Mordria wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

How would you like to hide your vampirism?

First - get rid of the "red" in the white part of the eyes. Makes it look too cartooney, and cartooney ESO makes me sad. They would look great with just red pupils.

As for hiding the appearance I think all vampires should look normal - until they use a skill related to the vampire skill line. After they stop using the skill line They have a 15-30 minute or longer cool down to look normal again.

LOL Funny you should say that about the red eyes. My husband and I just a little while ago were lamenting over vampires having a bad case of pink eye!

I also really do like your idea. Would totally shut up the insane, "WAAAAAHHH! I haz to be able to see da vamps in PvP!!!! 'Cause...reasons!" crowd while allowing those of us who actually PLAY vampires to achieve a reasonable level of believeability.

WraithAzraiel · October 2014

Vizier wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

First of all, it is already EASY to hide your vampirism on the battlefield. Plenty of armor allows for this. So the fact is that having glowing white skin is NOT ABOUT BALANCE. It is a cosmetic issue that is EASILY negated in PvP so it makes absolutely no sense to say that it's a deliberate balance for PvP. Because it's just not. Now, if your comeback is that, fine, in order to hide my vampirism I should just wear armor in cities and during roleplay sessions, I'll know you're just being bitter and have run out of actual arguments.

And as I've already said, I am completely cool with the upcoming ability to identify vampires. You'll have to spend a skill point for it and slot it and if you want to be a monster hunter, that's EXACTLY what you should have to do. They're also going to be gimping Batswarm so there's no more excuse to cry "Vamps are OP" either so THAT excuse for "I must be able to see the vamp!" is also gone.

So, once more... next argument, please.

lol- Fortunately for me alot of vamps run without their helmets and use armor that reveals skin. If they cover up in full plate with visor helm I'll have no way of knowing until skills are used. So, because people "can" cover up you should be able to look pretty? No, doesn't jive. And that the vampire population isn't in a mad rush to cover up speaks volumes about how little they care that I might silver bolt their asses. Your just trying to find a reason to justify your position. It simply doesn't work morna. Additionally it pretty much takes full plate, heavy armor to totally cover up as you suggest and most don't run with that...so lucky me. Unlucky you....try again? Just stay down...really. Nice try.

The hate. Always so strong with this one. Let us hug it out, bro.

WraithAzraiel · October 2014

Two-Dogs wrote: »

What was surprising about this was that he didn't seem to have the faintest idea that this is a popular request nor did he seem to be at all aware that many players are not happy with the vampire Stages and feel adjustments need to be made.

0 Agrees

18 LOLs

Getting kind of sick of all the "I want to hide my Vampirism" threads that are flooding the forum.

25 Agrees

2 LOLs

All this definitively proves is the amount of nae sayers and hatemongers there are on these forums.

"I'm not happy with my life so I'm going to try and make p*ss in everyone else's Cheerios!" LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL x 25

SUFFER AS I SUFFER, WORLD!

Still_Mind · October 2014

Vizier wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

Sorry to double post but I'm going to quote from one of your other threads in response to the balance issue-

Vizier wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

I keep seeing people say that about vamps "needing" to be detectable in PvP but my question is... WHY? Why do they need to be MORE detecable than any other foe on the field? My own feeling is that "Get the healer!" is still Job One!

Because they are more powerful than your average bear. See it's like this...

You know how (maybe you don't so I'll explain..no sarcasm here) a guy, man male human has female radar. They just "know" there is a woman right there. That movement in the corner of their eye..woman. If it's not a woman they don't even bat an eye. If it is, they take note and look if they are your average horn dog guy. Trust me...they all look. Some more obvious or subtle then others but they all take note. Now what is it that makes guys "know?" We know. We pick up on the nuance of movement, gate, speed, bounce then sound and of course smell.

All that said in a video game those types of nuances a vampire hunter or survivor might pick up on are not present. All characters move the same. They have the same builds, same run, same walk same jump, same sneak, same attacks, same speed same sounds and no smell. The vampire class is more powerful overall (as evidenced by why so many choose to be one. I'm confident in my assertion that if Vamp class was weak there would be FAR fewer of them) and since it is more powerful those nuances I spoke of that vampire hunters and others intent on surviving day to day would notice are simulated through the exaggeration of physical characteristics and thus evening the playing field.

That is why it is important. Balance Grasshoppa.

The day may come as suggested in 1.5 where vamps will be readily apparent through passive abilities. If so then I would say appearance of vampires in general wouldn't matter other than as a creative prerogative of TES and ZoS.

Then I'm sure you'll forgive me for quoting myself as well. LOL

To a certain degree I can buy this. After all, as a woman I am aware of any strange man coming within range of me and I instantly assess him for potential threat. Welcome to the primary difference between boys and girls Grasshoppa.

But in an MMO how do you GENERALLY know what class (and any other variable that affects abilities) a foe is? You find out by watching what they do. You see that Aedric spear you know you are facing a Templar. You see those crazy dragon wings, hey you know you're fighting a DK. That crazy gout of blood and the enemy going limp? Um, yeah, probably a vampire. It is not actually more important for you to know who the vampire is over say, knowing who the enemy team's healer is. And if it IS that's because ZoS screwed up and THAT is what they need to fix.

I am cool with a "monster hunter" skill line that let's you highlight vamps and werewolves. Because it's not something every single player has, like that stupid add-on. The players that do have it had to make a conscious choice to take it and sacrifice something else in order to use it. And that is as it should be.

Next argument, please.

Still_Mind wrote: »

Dude, a player being a vampire is the least of your concerns in pug groups. As long as you can't see the setup and spec, vampirism is not even in top 3, unless they're the tank in a fire-heavy dungeon (damage shields don't care about fire vulnerability), but that's quite another matter...

Edit: grammar

Umm.. there is more to PvP in Cyrodiil than zerging pug groups. Did he even say anything about a pug group? Not seeing that anywhere in the text you quoted. And I'm sure batwarm with impulse/talon lock was never a problem for you. You do pvp right? For the rest of us that don't run with the herd or spend every pvp moment running from siege to siege whether or not your enemy is a vampire is actually pretty important. Right up there with know if they are a DK or Sorc.

I don't see your point.

My logic is that if it's not a pug group, you know who a vampire is in your group and who is not.

To know who the vampire is, use Evil Hunter in 1.5, easy as that. And visual ID is still not a 100% shot right now, because they can wear full headgear and you won't be able to ID them till they swarm\mistform.

About talons lock - that's best left for complaining on the class forums, don't you find?

Edit: spelling

Nerouyn · October 2014

MornaBaine wrote: »

What was surprising about this was that he didn't seem to have the faintest idea that this is a popular request nor did he seem to be at all aware that many players are not happy with the vampire Stages and feel adjustments need to be made. The following poll will not have a "leave is exactly as is option" because this poll is designed to help pinpoint the most popular view among those who WOULD like to see changes.

By specifically excluding that option you immediately surrender all credibility. If it really is so popular then you'd have nothing to fear from including that option in the poll.

So I am naturally suspicious of your claim and you could expect the developers to be equally suspicious of it. They're not idiots.

That said, my recollection of the games is that there was no way to hide vampirism other than Clavicus Vile mask in Morrowind. So I don't think being able to hide vampirism would be even remotely lore friendly.

MornaBaine wrote: »

I have nothing against a specific SKILL that permits hunters to see vampires and werewolves. But I do NOT feel that just anyone should be able to know what they are at a glance.

That's the reality of Elder Scrolls vampirism. This isn't Twilight.

MornaBaine wrote: »

So what's the logical reason for making an entire skill line inflict hideousness on a character and undo all the work the player has gone to in creating them to look a specific way? This doesn't happen to players who play werewolves.

That's the reality of Elder Scrolls vampirism. This isn't Twilight.

And as I'm sure others have already pointed out, the hideousness is optional. Feed.

Still_Mind · October 2014

Nerouyn wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

What was surprising about this was that he didn't seem to have the faintest idea that this is a popular request nor did he seem to be at all aware that many players are not happy with the vampire Stages and feel adjustments need to be made. The following poll will not have a "leave is exactly as is option" because this poll is designed to help pinpoint the most popular view among those who WOULD like to see changes.

That's the reality of Elder Scrolls vampirism. This isn't Twilight.

And as I'm sure others have already pointed out, the hideousness is optional. Feed.

That's the point. TES vampires are supposed to be able to pass for regular people.

As Lamae states, her children are everywhere, wearing rags and crowns (presumably not at the same time, that would be silly), blending into society perfectly.

Now then, as I recall, there are several strands of vampirism and lycanthropy in TES - that explains different mechanics for this or that province, or creature. Some are supposed to be ugly and disintigrate in sunlight. Lamae's children are supposed to be able to blend in seamlessly.

WraithAzraiel · October 2014

Nerouyn wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

What was surprising about this was that he didn't seem to have the faintest idea that this is a popular request nor did he seem to be at all aware that many players are not happy with the vampire Stages and feel adjustments need to be made. The following poll will not have a "leave is exactly as is option" because this poll is designed to help pinpoint the most popular view among those who WOULD like to see changes.

By specifically excluding that option you immediately surrender all credibility. If it really is so popular then you'd have nothing to fear from including that option in the poll.

So I am naturally suspicious of your claim and you could expect the developers to be equally suspicious of it. They're not idiots.

That said, my recollection of the games is that there was no way to hide vampirism other than Clavicus Vile mask in Morrowind. So I don't think being able to hide vampirism would be even remotely lore friendly.

MornaBaine wrote: »

I have nothing against a specific SKILL that permits hunters to see vampires and werewolves. But I do NOT feel that just anyone should be able to know what they are at a glance.

That's the reality of Elder Scrolls vampirism. This isn't Twilight.

MornaBaine wrote: »

So what's the logical reason for making an entire skill line inflict hideousness on a character and undo all the work the player has gone to in creating them to look a specific way? This doesn't happen to players who play werewolves.

That's the reality of Elder Scrolls vampirism. This isn't Twilight.

And as I'm sure others have already pointed out, the hideousness is optional. Feed.

Oh look another hatemonger with a repertoire so small they have to constantly repeat the same painfully old and outdated insult over and over. JOY!

If it were Twilight, my good sir, we'd all sparkle in sunlight and be angsty teenagers forever.

As it happens, being able to disguise one's affliction temporarily isn't asking much and would harm none. So why the hate, chum?

Even in PvP it would harm no one, especially now that they have a handy dandy skill that you can waste a point on and see all the vampires you like instead of using it on the morph that's actually worthwhile!

A simple recoding of Stage 1 to make the character appear as they did at creation, no harm no foul.

Hell, let them go further by making Stages 3 and 4 more monstrous. I'd happily agree to that.

Jitterbug · October 2014

I wouldn't - I'm actually considering turning vamp again just for the looks of stage 4.

Vizier · October 2014

MornaBaine wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

First of all, it is already EASY to hide your vampirism on the battlefield. Plenty of armor allows for this. So the fact is that having glowing white skin is NOT ABOUT BALANCE. It is a cosmetic issue that is EASILY negated in PvP so it makes absolutely no sense to say that it's a deliberate balance for PvP. Because it's just not. Now, if your comeback is that, fine, in order to hide my vampirism I should just wear armor in cities and during roleplay sessions, I'll know you're just being bitter and have run out of actual arguments.

And as I've already said, I am completely cool with the upcoming ability to identify vampires. You'll have to spend a skill point for it and slot it and if you want to be a monster hunter, that's EXACTLY what you should have to do. They're also going to be gimping Batswarm so there's no more excuse to cry "Vamps are OP" either so THAT excuse for "I must be able to see the vamp!" is also gone.

So, once more... next argument, please.

lol- Fortunately for me alot of vamps run without their helmets and use armor that reveals skin. If they cover up in full plate with visor helm I'll have no way of knowing until skills are used. So, because people "can" cover up you should be able to look pretty? No, doesn't jive. And that the vampire population isn't in a mad rush to cover up speaks volumes about how little they care that I might silver bolt their asses. Your just trying to find a reason to justify your position. It simply doesn't work morna. Additionally it pretty much takes full plate, heavy armor to totally cover up as you suggest and most don't run with that...so lucky me. Unlucky you....try again? Just stay down...really. Nice try.

To "stay down" I would have had to have BEEN down in the first place. You really don't like being challenged, do you? As your arguments run thin you do get a bit testy. LOL But nothing you have said invalidates my own contention. And there ARE light armor headgears that do cover the entire face. That no few people choose to run without such concealing gear has about zero to do with the topic under discussion. Which, in case you've forgotten, you made out to be that it's somehow "important" for you to be able to easily see who the vampires are in PvP and that you contend that the ghastly glowing white appearance has been designed to let you do just that. You further contend that this is some sort of balance issue. I've amply demonstrated that it is not. And no, I never said, "Because vamps in PvP CAN cover up their appearance I should be able to look pretty." I've already explained, at length, the reasons why I object to the current appearance and stage timers. They are nonsensical and unnecessary and serve no actual purpose. Much like your continued snarking.

I'm sorry. Did You think I was being anything other than tongue and cheek? I tried to be obvious with emotes but..shrug. Honestly your arguments for having unblemished vampires in game are pretty thin. They pretty much focus on your wants/desires and then trying to pack the square peg in the round hole. They revolve on your understanding of RL myths. ESO made a different choice. A choice as valid as any in myth or popular cultural sentiment..shrug. But you are calling me "Testy?" Please. And here I thought I was turning over a new leaf. I'm thinking this more a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

So let me see if I have this right. You "want' a pretty looking vampire without blemish. You "feel" it's as much your prerogative as any other. Vamp pvp balance pretty much demands some kind of visual indicator which is good because vampires stand out visually. Now..bear with me here. It would be easy for them to cover up thus gaining a little advantage under the fog of war so to speak, but as I pointed out, most do not cover up. Light armor, Heavy armor, Medium armor. Most veteran players with vampires make the "choice" for their characters to dress in styles they like (within the options available). They look cool. Why cover that up? The benefit of being a vampire, looking cool and being a pvp godling far outweighs the benefit of covering up. Which is good cuz it gives the hunters a chance. In this case ego works in our favor but not necessarily to our advantage..far from it. But because they "can" cover there is no issue of pvp balance and therefor you should get what you want?

apples and oranges Morna.

But I'm testy and don't like to be challenged? Is that what you see yourself as? A challenge? If you call beating your head on a brick wall challenging. I have another name for it. I am, however, finding it very difficult not to roll my eyes. I think somewhere inside me I pity you... and so I try. I truly do. I have a dream. To some day look upon these forums and see no polls on vampires looks and batswarm OPness QQ. It can happen...

WraithAzraiel · October 2014

Vizier wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

First of all, it is already EASY to hide your vampirism on the battlefield. Plenty of armor allows for this. So the fact is that having glowing white skin is NOT ABOUT BALANCE. It is a cosmetic issue that is EASILY negated in PvP so it makes absolutely no sense to say that it's a deliberate balance for PvP. Because it's just not. Now, if your comeback is that, fine, in order to hide my vampirism I should just wear armor in cities and during roleplay sessions, I'll know you're just being bitter and have run out of actual arguments.

And as I've already said, I am completely cool with the upcoming ability to identify vampires. You'll have to spend a skill point for it and slot it and if you want to be a monster hunter, that's EXACTLY what you should have to do. They're also going to be gimping Batswarm so there's no more excuse to cry "Vamps are OP" either so THAT excuse for "I must be able to see the vamp!" is also gone.

So, once more... next argument, please.

lol- Fortunately for me alot of vamps run without their helmets and use armor that reveals skin. If they cover up in full plate with visor helm I'll have no way of knowing until skills are used. So, because people "can" cover up you should be able to look pretty? No, doesn't jive. And that the vampire population isn't in a mad rush to cover up speaks volumes about how little they care that I might silver bolt their asses. Your just trying to find a reason to justify your position. It simply doesn't work morna. Additionally it pretty much takes full plate, heavy armor to totally cover up as you suggest and most don't run with that...so lucky me. Unlucky you....try again? Just stay down...really. Nice try.

To "stay down" I would have had to have BEEN down in the first place. You really don't like being challenged, do you? As your arguments run thin you do get a bit testy. LOL But nothing you have said invalidates my own contention. And there ARE light armor headgears that do cover the entire face. That no few people choose to run without such concealing gear has about zero to do with the topic under discussion. Which, in case you've forgotten, you made out to be that it's somehow "important" for you to be able to easily see who the vampires are in PvP and that you contend that the ghastly glowing white appearance has been designed to let you do just that. You further contend that this is some sort of balance issue. I've amply demonstrated that it is not. And no, I never said, "Because vamps in PvP CAN cover up their appearance I should be able to look pretty." I've already explained, at length, the reasons why I object to the current appearance and stage timers. They are nonsensical and unnecessary and serve no actual purpose. Much like your continued snarking.

I'm sorry. Did You think I was being anything other than tongue and cheek? I tried to be obvious with emotes but..shrug. Honestly your arguments for having unblemished vampires in game are pretty thin. They pretty much focus on your wants and then try to pack the square peg in the round hole. They revolve on your understanding of RL myths. ESO made a different choice. A choice as valid as any in myth or popular culture..shrug. But you are calling me "Testy?" Please. And here I thought I was turning over a new leaf. I'm thinking this more a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

So let me see if I have this right. You "want' a pretty looking vampire without blemish. You "feel" it's as much your prerogative as any other. Vamp pvp balance pretty much demands some kind of visual indicator which is good because vampires stand out visually. Now..bear with me here. It would be easy for them to cover up thus gaining a little advantage under the fog of war so to speak, but as I pointed out, most do not cover up. Light armor, Heavy armor, Medium armor. Most veteran players with vampires make the "choice" for their characters to dress in styles they like (within the options available). And so because they "can" cover there is no issue of pvp balance and therefor you should get what you want?

But I'm testy and don't like to be challenged? Is that what you see yourself as? A challenge? If you call beating your head on a brick wall challenging. I have another name for it. I am, however, finding it very difficult not to roll my eyes. I think somewhere inside me I pity you... and so I try. I truly do. I have a dream. To some day look upon these forums and see no polls on vampires looks and batswarm OPness QQ. It can happen...

Unblemished? no no no, keep the weird eyes and what not, just don't make my character look like he's got the Consumption at Stage 1.

And as far as PvP balance and what not goes - If they just increased the cost of Batswarm and made it immune to all Ultimate cost reduction, everything would be just dandy.

You wouldn't see Vamp Sorc Emps and others casting Bat Swarm every 5 seconds. Couple that with the upcoming removal of AOE caps (or so I've heard) which will essentially make skills like Impulse spread their damage out over the number of enemies hit rather than doing the exact same amount of damage to 6 people.

But no, instead of doing it smart they give in to the crying masses and nerf Vampire for a 3rd time.

Yea, I'm bitter. Hasn't affected my gameplay at all but I'm bitter nonetheless.

Vizier · October 2014

@WraithAzraiel‌
You get no argument from me. Balance first. My feelings on the pasty vamps second. You think I dig creating a toon to find him look like Edward Scissorhands' brother after getting bit? Had some fugly looks.

Balance first...aesthetic wants second.

Soon as there is a game mechanic (THAT WORKS) at identifying vamps, I will be the first to sign the petition to reduce the white wash given to vampires. I for the life of me can't figure how a kajiit's hair turns from black to white but... I'm rolling with it.

WraithAzraiel · October 2014

Clearly they fall into a vat of bleach during the quest.

clayandaudrey_ESO · October 2014

You can tell you are losing this debate by the tone of your posts. Your attitude is making you lose credibility. Again I think it is time to move on.

WraithAzraiel · October 2014

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

You can tell you are losing this debate by the tone of your posts. Your attitude is making you lose credibility. Again I think it is time to move on.

MornaBaine · October 2014

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Nerouyn wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

What was surprising about this was that he didn't seem to have the faintest idea that this is a popular request nor did he seem to be at all aware that many players are not happy with the vampire Stages and feel adjustments need to be made. The following poll will not have a "leave is exactly as is option" because this poll is designed to help pinpoint the most popular view among those who WOULD like to see changes.

By specifically excluding that option you immediately surrender all credibility. If it really is so popular then you'd have nothing to fear from including that option in the poll.

So I am naturally suspicious of your claim and you could expect the developers to be equally suspicious of it. They're not idiots.

That said, my recollection of the games is that there was no way to hide vampirism other than Clavicus Vile mask in Morrowind. So I don't think being able to hide vampirism would be even remotely lore friendly.

MornaBaine wrote: »

I have nothing against a specific SKILL that permits hunters to see vampires and werewolves. But I do NOT feel that just anyone should be able to know what they are at a glance.

That's the reality of Elder Scrolls vampirism. This isn't Twilight.

MornaBaine wrote: »

So what's the logical reason for making an entire skill line inflict hideousness on a character and undo all the work the player has gone to in creating them to look a specific way? This doesn't happen to players who play werewolves.

That's the reality of Elder Scrolls vampirism. This isn't Twilight.

And as I'm sure others have already pointed out, the hideousness is optional. Feed.

Oh look another hatemonger with a repertoire so small they have to constantly repeat the same painfully old and outdated insult over and over. JOY!

If it were Twilight, my good sir, we'd all sparkle in sunlight and be angsty teenagers forever.

As it happens, being able to disguise one's affliction temporarily isn't asking much and would harm none. So why the hate, chum?

Even in PvP it would harm no one, especially now that they have a handy dandy skill that you can waste a point on and see all the vampires you like instead of using it on the morph that's actually worthwhile!

A simple recoding of Stage 1 to make the character appear as they did at creation, no harm no foul.

Hell, let them go further by making Stages 3 and 4 more monstrous. I'd happily agree to that.

They've also apparently managed to "not see" where I've explained the purpose of the poll and why it does not have the option they want at least 3 times. *insert eye roll here*

MornaBaine · October 2014

Vizier wrote: »

@WraithAzraiel‌
You get no argument from me. Balance first. My feelings on the pasty vamps second. You think I dig creating a toon to find him look like Edward Scissorhands' brother after getting bit? Had some fugly looks.

Balance first...aesthetic wants second.

Soon as there is a game mechanic (THAT WORKS) at identifying vamps, I will be the first to sign the petition to reduce the white wash given to vampires. I for the life of me can't figure how a kajiit's hair turns from black to white but... I'm rolling with it.

Have you ever known me to say, "THIS is the most important thing about vamps and I want it changed before you do anything else?" Trust me, there's a ton about the mechanics of vamps I would love to see changed/improved. Partly because I know very well a lot of the childish hate leveled at this topic comes from a resentment over the mechanics of vamps. What might be better than continually arguing against a change you actually here state you are FOR would be creating a post explaining in detail what you want to see changed and why regarding the mechanics and game play of vampires. Your continued level of discontent puzzles me though since it looks very like you are going to get exactly what you want. Indeed, knowing now the only reason you are so against this and insistent on ascribing to me the desire to have a "pretty" vamp and thus belittle me is because you are unhappy with vampire mechanics just kind of makes me shake my head. And yeah, feel a little pity.

Nerouyn · October 2014

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Oh look another hatemonger with a repertoire so small they have to constantly repeat the same painfully old and outdated insult over and over. JOY!

I'm not a hatemonger - though there's certainly substantial hate in your response.

If I've said things which other people have also said - possibly that's because right and it's obvious.

In ESO lore vampirism ain't pretty. That's just how it is.

And it is laughable that the OP did not include an option in the poll for any form of disagreement with the idea but asserts with great conviction that their idea has much support. Ha ha ha ha ha.

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

As it happens, being able to disguise one's affliction temporarily isn't asking much and would harm none. So why the hate, chum?

*rolling eyes* Chum? Really? You're a prickly one aren't you.

Look pumpkin (ha ha) someone can disagree with an idea without any component of hate.

The potential harm is blindingly obvious.

I happen to have a very liberal view and think anything that goes on between consenting adults is their own business and not my concern. But when dealing with shared environments - which is what ESO is - conflicting wants simply cannot be satisfied.

ESO lore is clear. Vampirism isn't pretty or easy to hide. While I can appreciate some players might want to be pretty vampires, allowing that could lessen the enjoyment of those who want an immersive Elder Scrolls experience.

No it's not as bad as drowning puppies but it is harm nonetheless.

MornaBaine · October 2014

Nerouyn wrote: »

ESO lore is clear. Vampirism isn't pretty or easy to hide. While I can appreciate some players might want to be pretty vampires, allowing that could lessen the enjoyment of those who want an immersive Elder Scrolls experience.

.

You are a thousand times wrong. I am beginning to wonder if the people who keep saying this have ever played any of the previous ES games. Stage 1 vampires in Skyrim/Dawnguard are SUBTLE. They DON'T look all that different from regular humans except in the eyes. And THAT is why NPCs don't freak out about them until the latter stages are reached. TONS of lore exists speaking of various strains of vampires hiding in plain sight. Lamae herself in the vampire quest IN THIS GAME speaks of her children going unseen among both paupers and kings. THE ARTISTS GOT IT WRONG. Plain and simple.

OrangeTheCat · October 2014

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

"How would you like to hide your vampirism?"

I would not like to hide my vampirism. Not at all. It should not be hidden. The appearance is a consequence of my decision to be a vampire. We all have to live with the consequences of our decisions. I didn't have to choose to be a vampire; no one held a gun to my head. If I decide I don't like the vampire appearance, then I can get myself cured.

Right but stage 1 shouldn't make you look like you have tuberculosis.

My comment was not limited to just one phase or even a subset of phases. If you don't like how some phase(s) looks, if it really bothers you, get cured and stop complaining.

MornaBaine · October 2014

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

"How would you like to hide your vampirism?"

I would not like to hide my vampirism. Not at all. It should not be hidden. The appearance is a consequence of my decision to be a vampire. We all have to live with the consequences of our decisions. I didn't have to choose to be a vampire; no one held a gun to my head. If I decide I don't like the vampire appearance, then I can get myself cured.

Right but stage 1 shouldn't make you look like you have tuberculosis.

My comment was not limited to just one phase or even a subset of phases. If you don't like how some phase(s) looks, if it really bothers you, get cured and stop complaining.

If you feel your class of choice is gimped or some aspect of it is not to your liking just delete that character and reroll a new one of another class and stop complaining. See how that works? Oh yeah, it doesn't.

BBSooner · October 2014

MornaBaine wrote: »

Nerouyn wrote: »

ESO lore is clear. Vampirism isn't pretty or easy to hide. While I can appreciate some players might want to be pretty vampires, allowing that could lessen the enjoyment of those who want an immersive Elder Scrolls experience.

.

You are a thousand times wrong. I am beginning to wonder if the people who keep saying this have ever played any of the previous ES games. Stage 1 vampires in Skyrim/Dawnguard are SUBTLE. They DON'T look all that different from regular humans except in the eyes. And THAT is why NPCs don't freak out about them until the latter stages are reached. TONS of lore exists speaking of various strains of vampires hiding in plain sight. Lamae herself in the vampire quest IN THIS GAME speaks of her children going unseen among both paupers and kings. THE ARTISTS GOT IT WRONG. Plain and simple.

Disagree. Stage ones were paler than their normal selves, without red eyes. ESO stage one is pale (granted more than previously) with red eyes. Things are different with this curse. We can also walk around sunlight with no negatives, as well as undergoing an actual ritual for transformation to become a "scion" instead of just "turning". There is already precedent for change with the curse based on the disease - the art style is fine (even awesome to some).

Everybody has opinions, changing the art style to suit the tastes of a vocal forum poster is no more in the right than changing the templar skills to glow purple for a vocal forum poster.

BBSooner · October 2014

MornaBaine wrote: »

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

"How would you like to hide your vampirism?"

I would not like to hide my vampirism. Not at all. It should not be hidden. The appearance is a consequence of my decision to be a vampire. We all have to live with the consequences of our decisions. I didn't have to choose to be a vampire; no one held a gun to my head. If I decide I don't like the vampire appearance, then I can get myself cured.

Right but stage 1 shouldn't make you look like you have tuberculosis.

My comment was not limited to just one phase or even a subset of phases. If you don't like how some phase(s) looks, if it really bothers you, get cured and stop complaining.

If you feel your class of choice is gimped or some aspect of it is not to your liking just delete that character and reroll a new one of another class and stop complaining. See how that works? Oh yeah, it doesn't.

Change for balance != change for taste. Vampirism isn't "gimped" just because your characters skin pigment is lighter than you'd like. You might as well complain that being a nightblade doesn't make you emanate smoke from your person under the guise that it makes you gimped.

I should also make clear that vampire isn't a class. You are not a vampire that happens to be a nightblade. You are a nightblade that happens to be a vampire (who is apparently self conscious over fair skin and should wear a mask).

OrangeTheCat · October 2014

MornaBaine wrote: »

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

"How would you like to hide your vampirism?"

I would not like to hide my vampirism. Not at all. It should not be hidden. The appearance is a consequence of my decision to be a vampire. We all have to live with the consequences of our decisions. I didn't have to choose to be a vampire; no one held a gun to my head. If I decide I don't like the vampire appearance, then I can get myself cured.

Right but stage 1 shouldn't make you look like you have tuberculosis.

My comment was not limited to just one phase or even a subset of phases. If you don't like how some phase(s) looks, if it really bothers you, get cured and stop complaining.

If you feel your class of choice is gimped or some aspect of it is not to your liking just delete that character and reroll a new one of another class and stop complaining. See how that works? Oh yeah, it doesn't.

Deleting a character is much more extreme of an action than getting vampirism cured. And the state of being "gimped" applies to skills & abilities, not appearance. Nice hyperbole @MornaBaine‌. See how that works? It doesn't.

MornaBaine · October 2014

BBSooner wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

Nerouyn wrote: »

ESO lore is clear. Vampirism isn't pretty or easy to hide. While I can appreciate some players might want to be pretty vampires, allowing that could lessen the enjoyment of those who want an immersive Elder Scrolls experience.

.

You are a thousand times wrong. I am beginning to wonder if the people who keep saying this have ever played any of the previous ES games. Stage 1 vampires in Skyrim/Dawnguard are SUBTLE. They DON'T look all that different from regular humans except in the eyes. And THAT is why NPCs don't freak out about them until the latter stages are reached. TONS of lore exists speaking of various strains of vampires hiding in plain sight. Lamae herself in the vampire quest IN THIS GAME speaks of her children going unseen among both paupers and kings. THE ARTISTS GOT IT WRONG. Plain and simple.

Disagree. Stage ones were paler than their normal selves, without red eyes.

Yes, which is FAR MORE SUBTLE than what we get in ESO which is exactly as i have just said.

BBSooner wrote: »

ESO stage one is pale (granted more than previously) with red eyes. Things are different with this curse. We can also walk around sunlight with no negatives, as well as undergoing an actual ritual for transformation to become a "scion" instead of just "turning". There is already precedent for change with the curse based on the disease - the art style is fine (even awesome to some).

Stages 1 and 2 DO "look awesome" to me. That's not the point. The point is that they are far too obvious and 3 and 4 are so incredibly obvious and freakish, that it makes absolutely no logical sense. The style is completely at odds with the information we receive in the quest itself, which tells us that Lamae's children GO UNNOTICED. How the Hades are they going unnoticed when they GLOW even in Stage one and look like phosphorescent ZOMBIES within a matter of half an hour?

As for the walking around in the sun, ZoS really dropped the ball there. There are half a dozen better (and more challenging and balanced) ways to have dealt with the issue of all vampires taking damage from sunlight.

BBSooner wrote: »

Everybody has opinions, changing the art style to suit the tastes of a vocal forum poster is no more in the right than changing the templar skills to glow purple for a vocal forum poster.

I like how y'all keep insisting I'm a lone voice crying in the wilderness. It's funny. I guess since it let's people pretend they AREN'T the bullies they truly are. Well...whatever let's ya sleep at night man.