Decon now scales to character level, not crafting level...

UrQuan · September 2014

MasterSpatula wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Here's a conceivable benefit:
I suspect, to deal with players that were powerleveling the motif crafting skills. Particularly blacksmiths trading daggers for decon and getting to 50 in no time.

But since you couldn't think of it, then surely it is inconceivable. OK, you got me, it wasn't ridiculous hyperbole.

Except, of course, that this limitation isn't a very effective way to do that. To get to level 50 "in no time," you'll need to be deconstructing high-level items, items made from materials you wouldn't be able to craft with until you're high-level in the skill anyway. Getting those materials back doesn't really enable power-leveling, and not getting them back doesn't hurt it.

But you're right, you have successfully argued that there is a conceivable reason to do it. I guess I'll need to change my assertion to "no reason that bears up to even slight scrutiny."

Flat-out wrong. If you're not getting those materials back it absolutely screws with power leveling, because you need to spend more time finding materials of the appropriate level to craft with (or spend more time getting gold to buy them with) in order to keep trading crafted items to power level with.

Anything else you care to get badly wrong?

Zed · September 2014

After Lower Craglorn came out, I fed all the armor and metal weapons I got grinding to a level 12 alt to level the smithing skill and I do remember getting base mats back while I was deconstructing things once the alt's smithing skill was in line with the level of the items being deconstructed. I sold them and paid for a bank upgrade or two.

At least they haven't changed the way constructing items works, right? Wouldn't it be a kicker if they made it so that your character level needed to be at the level of items you wanted to craft.

Nox_Aeterna · September 2014

Well , my main is my crafter , i didnt really lose time focusing on my alts much after i noticed the amount of time it takes to lvl one char.

Granted i did increase their bags and gave them horses lvled on bag space. So i have 7 really big mules to use :P.

Probitas · September 2014

If they documented all the changes they made, people would turn into the mob from Frankenstein and burn their money with the torches.

1.
nerf
To weaken or make less dangerous. Taken from the "Nerf" brand name, which makes sports equipment toys out of a soft foam (e.g., the Nerf football is soft foam rather than the hard leather of a real football). Used frequently in the context of computer game balance changes.
"The chaingun was awesome til they nerfed it, now you can't hit poop with it."

AreoHotah · September 2014

Am I the only one to have all 6 professions maxed out on the main vr12 character?? No switching between alts no wasting time. 6 traits researched on all items, 8 traits on 20 or so... made a fortune crafting months ago bought all the bank slots now I have everything I meed, including motifs, on my main char... Easy...

Oh I also have 20 skillpoints just standing there...

Sharee · September 2014

AreoHotah wrote: »

Am I the only one to have all 6 professions maxed out on the main vr12 character??

Nope

ShadowscaleSithis · September 2014

Rune_Relic wrote: »

I assume its because your skill level should never exceed your character level.
So how would a level 30 character be able to craft level >30 gear ? Or find an area capable of dropping gear greater than their character level ? Normally you travel through levelled zones for exactly this reason. You pick up materials appropriate for you character level.

The idea is they cant....unless you use alts to bypass this. In effect its a kind of exploit that ZOS has closed the door on IMHO.

So the question becomes.....is sending high level gear to low level characters (to rapidly and artificially level their skills) an exploit ?

Uh -- Guild Store Brah. Go to store buy whatever I want.

This change is total BS. My crafters aren't even Character level 20 and honestly not even crafting above a 25-30 with the exception of my provisioner and alchemist(2 diff toons). In the past if I was on my WW and deconned a blue or purple WW item I would get the upgrade material some of the time, but I would almost always get the type of wood and style gem. Now can't even decon stuff I made at higher level to get materials back.

If t his change is permenant, I would like everything I have researched on my crafters gifted to my main. Since I have him as a main not to do crafting (he is my alchemist though - at least for now)

Srugzal · September 2014

AreoHotah wrote: »

Am I the only one to have all 6 professions maxed out on the main vr12 character?? No switching between alts no wasting time. 6 traits researched on all items, 8 traits on 20 or so... made a fortune crafting months ago bought all the bank slots now I have everything I meed, including motifs, on my main char... Easy...

Oh I also have 20 skillpoints just standing there...

And your point is???

Aenra · September 2014

i would not mind this barrier, coupled with much more, artificial as they are..

IF
crafting had a point to it. And i am sorry to say it, but it currently does not. Not outside the "do it myself for the joy of it" argument.. to repeat myself:

- nothing is BoP, no need for any character to do the work. Buying it from another is just as good..and easier now with guild stores..which leads us to:
- it's a lot cheaper to guild store sell all the stacks of mats you gathered and use part of the profit to outfit yourself...than it is to burn through them all just so you can level your profession. So much cheaper in fact, the first method leaves you rish way, way beyond VR lvls, whereas the other not only hampers you, it also costs you insane amounts of time circle-farming specific areas. Because "fun"
- we already have dungeon acquired, superior to crafting gear drops. Even more to be expected soon, see HypeCon announcements. You get to that point..crafting all of a sudden becomes a big "why did i bother anyway" question mark

could have listed more, but if only the above issues were resolved..then yes, i'd be all up for artificial barriers. The more they would add, the better the value in having taken the time to lvl a crafter. As it stands now though..all i see is a big metaphorical carrot dangling in front of the OCD mmo gamer's nose..sorry

disclaimer: i -am- a crafter. Can still see beyond my own preferences however

starkerealm · September 2014

Aenra wrote: »

i would not mind this barrier, coupled with much more, artificial as they are..

IF
crafting had a point to it. And i am sorry to say it, but it currently does not. Not outside the "do it myself for the joy of it" argument.. to repeat myself:

- nothing is BoP, no need for any character to do the work. Buying it from another is just as good..and easier now with guild stores..which leads us to:
- it's a lot cheaper to guild store sell all the stacks of mats you gathered and use part of the profit to outfit yourself...than it is to burn through them all just so you can level your profession. So much cheaper in fact, the first method leaves you rish way, way beyond VR lvls, whereas the other not only hampers you, it also costs you insane amounts of time circle-farming specific areas. Because "fun"
- we already have dungeon acquired, superior to crafting gear drops. Even more to be expected soon, see HypeCon announcements. You get to that point..crafting all of a sudden becomes a big "why did i bother anyway" question mark

could have listed more, but if only the above issues were resolved..then yes, i'd be all up for artificial barriers. The more they would add, the better the value in having taken the time to lvl a crafter. As it stands now though..all i see is a big metaphorical carrot dangling in front of the OCD mmo gamer's nose..sorry

disclaimer: i -am- a crafter. Can still see beyond my own preferences however

In that sense, the only two I see that really have a purpose are alchemy and provisioning. Alchemy gives you access to a lot of potion effects you can't get elsewhere. Provisioning is actually useful. Though, if you're asking, "why would I do this instead of passing it off to another player?" That, I can't answer.

With the gear crafting, I'd say it gives you more build control, but again, that can be farmed out. Enchanting's actually a step down from what you can get through other means, at least in the range of effects you can buy. So, there, no idea.

Rune_Relic · September 2014

wwusterbarthub17_ESO wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

I assume its because your skill level should never exceed your character level.
So how would a level 30 character be able to craft level >30 gear ? Or find an area capable of dropping gear greater than their character level ? Normally you travel through levelled zones for exactly this reason. You pick up materials appropriate for you character level.

The idea is they cant....unless you use alts to bypass this. In effect its a kind of exploit that ZOS has closed the door on IMHO.

So the question becomes.....is sending high level gear to low level characters (to rapidly and artificially level their skills) an exploit ?

Uh -- Guild Store Brah. Go to store buy whatever I want.

This change is total BS. My crafters aren't even Character level 20 and honestly not even crafting above a 25-30 with the exception of my provisioner and alchemist(2 diff toons). In the past if I was on my WW and deconned a blue or purple WW item I would get the upgrade material some of the time, but I would almost always get the type of wood and style gem. Now can't even decon stuff I made at higher level to get materials back.

If t his change is permenant, I would like everything I have researched on my crafters gifted to my main. Since I have him as a main not to do crafting (he is my alchemist though - at least for now)

When you as a level 20 try to wear level 21 gear you cant...its highlighted red. Beyond your level and ability to use.

Should they just let you wear level 50 gear when you are level 20 ? Everyone on here appears to say yes. I think not.

For the same reason you simply don't have the knowledge or expertise to deconstruct stuff beyond you level. Seems to work in exactly the same way to me. [Granted it should block you from deconstructing or warn you]

Imagine me vs an electrician. We both pull apart a TV. The electrician will keep almost everything and have a use for it. I might find some place mats and a couple of potential ear rings or something

His vastly superior experience has enabled him to pull lots of useful stuff he specialises in.

The only thing I see is lots of people throwing dummys out the pram because there character now has to work to get reward and not rely on hand outs for power leveling gear with massive XP..which is what you are all doing. [People without alts don't have this luxury]

At least grinding combat you actually have to use your own character and not one of your alts /facepalm.

Xeres14 · September 2014

Well I already am leveling up my crafters and they'll be able to Decon to their crafting level relatively soon.

This just seems kinda silly though. Why have a separate skill level for crafting if its tied to your character's level? Eh. Just more of the same I suppose.

AlexDougherty · September 2014

Rune_Relic wrote: »

wwusterbarthub17_ESO wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

I assume its because your skill level should never exceed your character level.
So how would a level 30 character be able to craft level >30 gear ? Or find an area capable of dropping gear greater than their character level ? Normally you travel through levelled zones for exactly this reason. You pick up materials appropriate for you character level.

The idea is they cant....unless you use alts to bypass this. In effect its a kind of exploit that ZOS has closed the door on IMHO.

So the question becomes.....is sending high level gear to low level characters (to rapidly and artificially level their skills) an exploit ?

Uh -- Guild Store Brah. Go to store buy whatever I want.

This change is total BS. My crafters aren't even Character level 20 and honestly not even crafting above a 25-30 with the exception of my provisioner and alchemist(2 diff toons). In the past if I was on my WW and deconned a blue or purple WW item I would get the upgrade material some of the time, but I would almost always get the type of wood and style gem. Now can't even decon stuff I made at higher level to get materials back.

If t his change is permenant, I would like everything I have researched on my crafters gifted to my main. Since I have him as a main not to do crafting (he is my alchemist though - at least for now)

When you as a level 20 try to wear level 21 gear you cant...its highlighted red. Beyond your level and ability to use.

Should they just let you wear level 50 gear when you are level 20 ? Everyone on here appears to say yes. I think not.

For the same reason you simply don't have the knowledge or expertise to deconstruct stuff beyond you level. Seems to work in exactly the same way to me. [Granted it should block you from deconstructing or warn you]

Imagine me vs an electrician. We both pull apart a TV. The electrician will keep almost everything and have a use for it. I might find some place mats and a couple of potential ear rings or something His vastly superior experience has enabled him to pull lots of useful stuff he specialises in.

The only thing I see is lots of people throwing dummys out the pram because there character now has to work to get reward and not rely on hand outs for power leveling gear with massive XP..which is what you are all doing. [People without alts don't have this luxury]

At least grinding combat you actually have to use your own character and not one of your alts /facepalm.

Slight mismatch in you're analogy, it's not that you don't have the same expertise as the electrician, it's that under the new system the electrician has to have spent as much time in front of the TV as you or he has to leave certain components alone.

In gaming terms it like demanding a blacksmith has to have trained as a knight in order to make armour an swords that the knights can use, or that a tailor is trained as a ranger to make leather armour for said rangers.

Epona222 · September 2014

I can't help thinking that anyone who thinks trading daggers for deconstruction is some sort of exploit, has never tried it.

Let's sort out this myth for once and for all - swapping 20 or 30 daggers with a friend does not turn you into a master crafter, you won't even get half a crafting level, and it's boring and tedious.

It is not an exploit, it is not a quick route to crafting fame and glory - just a spectacularly boring way to spend an evening or a sunday afternoon. Anyone who thinks it is an exploit, I will happily send them 20 daggers to deconstruct, without expecting anything in return. Deconstruct them and see whether you gain half a crafting level. Then come back and cry "exploit".

No, it's people co-operating (in an MMO, who would have thought it?) and working hard at something incredibly boring and repetitive for usually very small return (much like most of our jobs, I reckon).

Merlin13KAGL · September 2014

Faulgor wrote: »

My level 37 Redguard still recovers Galatite Ingots from VR armor. However, the message "You lack the skill to recover all the materials from this item." is shown anyway.

@ZOS_GinaBruno, can we get some clarification on this?

Lacking the skills (assumed to be crafting level/passives) to recover all of materials from this item is somewhat ambiguous.

Does this mean base mats? Upgrade/trait mats? Some combination individually rolled %?

Does it mean we can get the mats back, just not in full quantity?

This has the potential to be huge depending on what is potentially not recoverable.

If I only get 2 ingots back instead of 5, no big deal.

If I'm guaranteed to lose my purple upgrade mats, that's a whole other story.

And if it is tied to character level, that makes even less sense.

I can make a Lute, doesn't mean I need to know how to play it?

Rune_Relic · September 2014

AlexDougherty wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

wwusterbarthub17_ESO wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

I assume its because your skill level should never exceed your character level.
So how would a level 30 character be able to craft level >30 gear ? Or find an area capable of dropping gear greater than their character level ? Normally you travel through levelled zones for exactly this reason. You pick up materials appropriate for you character level.

The idea is they cant....unless you use alts to bypass this. In effect its a kind of exploit that ZOS has closed the door on IMHO.

So the question becomes.....is sending high level gear to low level characters (to rapidly and artificially level their skills) an exploit ?

Uh -- Guild Store Brah. Go to store buy whatever I want.

This change is total BS. My crafters aren't even Character level 20 and honestly not even crafting above a 25-30 with the exception of my provisioner and alchemist(2 diff toons). In the past if I was on my WW and deconned a blue or purple WW item I would get the upgrade material some of the time, but I would almost always get the type of wood and style gem. Now can't even decon stuff I made at higher level to get materials back.

If t his change is permenant, I would like everything I have researched on my crafters gifted to my main. Since I have him as a main not to do crafting (he is my alchemist though - at least for now)

When you as a level 20 try to wear level 21 gear you cant...its highlighted red. Beyond your level and ability to use.

Should they just let you wear level 50 gear when you are level 20 ? Everyone on here appears to say yes. I think not.

For the same reason you simply don't have the knowledge or expertise to deconstruct stuff beyond you level. Seems to work in exactly the same way to me. [Granted it should block you from deconstructing or warn you]

Imagine me vs an electrician. We both pull apart a TV. The electrician will keep almost everything and have a use for it. I might find some place mats and a couple of potential ear rings or something His vastly superior experience has enabled him to pull lots of useful stuff he specialises in.

The only thing I see is lots of people throwing dummys out the pram because there character now has to work to get reward and not rely on hand outs for power leveling gear with massive XP..which is what you are all doing. [People without alts don't have this luxury]

At least grinding combat you actually have to use your own character and not one of your alts /facepalm.

Slight mismatch in you're analogy, it's not that you don't have the same expertise as the electrician, it's that under the new system the electrician has to have spent as much time in front of the TV as you or he has to leave certain components alone.

In gaming terms it like demanding a blacksmith has to have trained as a knight in order to make armour an swords that the knights can use, or that a tailor is trained as a ranger to make leather armour for said rangers.

You're missing the point....if you had deconstructed items of your appropriate level (in you levelled area) you would never have a craft level higher than your character level. This only occurred because you fed them overpowered gear that seriously over inflated your XP gains in that craft...and hence out levelled yourself.

Rune_Relic · September 2014

Epona222 wrote: »

I can't help thinking that anyone who thinks trading daggers for deconstruction is some sort of exploit, has never tried it.

Let's sort out this myth for once and for all - swapping 20 or 30 daggers with a friend does not turn you into a master crafter, you won't even get half a crafting level, and it's boring and tedious.

It is not an exploit, it is not a quick route to crafting fame and glory - just a spectacularly boring way to spend an evening or a sunday afternoon. Anyone who thinks it is an exploit, I will happily send them 20 daggers to deconstruct, without expecting anything in return. Deconstruct them and see whether you gain half a crafting level. Then come back and cry "exploit".

No, it's people co-operating (in an MMO, who would have thought it?) and working hard at something incredibly boring and repetitive for usually very small return (much like most of our jobs, I reckon).

You can send me something on the lines of warlock rings for me to deconstruct. Some really nice VR12 legendery stuff would be good

I am sure my Crafting XP and inspiration will sky rocket my craft level rather rapidly if I am/was level 10.

AlexDougherty · September 2014

Rune_Relic wrote: »

AlexDougherty wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

wwusterbarthub17_ESO wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

I assume its because your skill level should never exceed your character level.
So how would a level 30 character be able to craft level >30 gear ? Or find an area capable of dropping gear greater than their character level ? Normally you travel through levelled zones for exactly this reason. You pick up materials appropriate for you character level.

The idea is they cant....unless you use alts to bypass this. In effect its a kind of exploit that ZOS has closed the door on IMHO.

So the question becomes.....is sending high level gear to low level characters (to rapidly and artificially level their skills) an exploit ?

Uh -- Guild Store Brah. Go to store buy whatever I want.

This change is total BS. My crafters aren't even Character level 20 and honestly not even crafting above a 25-30 with the exception of my provisioner and alchemist(2 diff toons). In the past if I was on my WW and deconned a blue or purple WW item I would get the upgrade material some of the time, but I would almost always get the type of wood and style gem. Now can't even decon stuff I made at higher level to get materials back.

If t his change is permenant, I would like everything I have researched on my crafters gifted to my main. Since I have him as a main not to do crafting (he is my alchemist though - at least for now)

When you as a level 20 try to wear level 21 gear you cant...its highlighted red. Beyond your level and ability to use.

Should they just let you wear level 50 gear when you are level 20 ? Everyone on here appears to say yes. I think not.

For the same reason you simply don't have the knowledge or expertise to deconstruct stuff beyond you level. Seems to work in exactly the same way to me. [Granted it should block you from deconstructing or warn you]

Imagine me vs an electrician. We both pull apart a TV. The electrician will keep almost everything and have a use for it. I might find some place mats and a couple of potential ear rings or something His vastly superior experience has enabled him to pull lots of useful stuff he specialises in.

The only thing I see is lots of people throwing dummys out the pram because there character now has to work to get reward and not rely on hand outs for power leveling gear with massive XP..which is what you are all doing. [People without alts don't have this luxury]

At least grinding combat you actually have to use your own character and not one of your alts /facepalm.

Slight mismatch in you're analogy, it's not that you don't have the same expertise as the electrician, it's that under the new system the electrician has to have spent as much time in front of the TV as you or he has to leave certain components alone.

In gaming terms it like demanding a blacksmith has to have trained as a knight in order to make armour an swords that the knights can use, or that a tailor is trained as a ranger to make leather armour for said rangers.

You're missing the point....if you had deconstructed items of your appropriate level (in you levelled area) you would never have a craft level higher than your character level. This only occurred because you fed them overpowered gear that seriously over inflated your XP gains in that craft...and hence out levelled yourself.

With the exception of provisioning, none of my crafting skills are higher than my character level, I never bought or deconstructed higher level items, because I was too busy enjoying the game.

My crafting skills were and still are high enough to craft myself the gear I require (apart from enchanting which is still weak as anything but getting better now).

But I take your point.

Now my point was that the crafting always had a disconnect with what level you were, allowing people to have crafting alts, which the levelled up to equip their main. Now they are changing it, and it's like demanding that your plumber trains as a scubadiver before you let him fix the kitchen sink (it's a bad analogy but accept it).

Now personally I'm alright, because my three main characters are also my crafters. But you can see why some people are a bit miffed about it, can't you?

Anath_Q · September 2014

FYI: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/131965/deconstruction-bug#latest

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to provide some clarity on the deconstructing issue described in this thread. Previously, if your character’s level was not as high as the item you were deconstructing, you would receive an increasing penalty, which would potentially reduce the amount of material you’d get from deconstructing the item – this would depend on how far below your character level was compared to the item itself. However, there was no clear indication that this was the case.

In Update 4, we added an error message that now appears providing that information -- no change was actually made to the mechanic itself. However, based on your feedback, our team is going to change this in a future update so that we’ll check your passive skill rank level in addition to your character level, using whichever is higher to help give you the full deconstruct credit easier. As always, thanks so much for your feedback on this issue, and for helping us to improve the game.

Merlin13KAGL · September 2014

Rune_Relic wrote: »

You're missing the point....if you had deconstructed items of your appropriate level (in you levelled area) you would never have a craft level higher than your character level. This only occurred because you fed them overpowered gear that seriously over inflated your XP gains in that craft...and hence out levelled yourself.

Perhaps in regard to Vet zones. Otherwise, there is nothing saying you can't venture to a higher area and farm these raw mats. I recall doing so in Rivenspire when I was halfway through Stormhaven.

Had to sneak like crazy and run like heck, but the return was good.

Anath_Q wrote: »

FYI: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/131965/deconstruction-bug#latest

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to provide some clarity on the deconstructing issue described in this thread. Previously, if your character’s level was not as high as the item you were deconstructing, you would receive an increasing penalty, which would potentially reduce the amount of material you’d get from deconstructing the item – this would depend on how far below your character level was compared to the item itself. However, there was no clear indication that this was the case.

In Update 4, we added an error message that now appears providing that information -- no change was actually made to the mechanic itself. However, based on your feedback, our team is going to change this in a future update so that we’ll check your passive skill rank level in addition to your character level, using whichever is higher to help give you the full deconstruct credit easier. As always, thanks so much for your feedback on this issue, and for helping us to improve the game.

Again, which material? Base mats, all mats? It's only slightly clearer than it was.

If they mechanic itself has not changed, they should have no issue indicating the specifics of it. It's hardly an exploitable inside information.

It would be nice to know if there is more benefit to holding onto higher level blue and purples, rather than figuring out by randomly destroying half a dozen or more.

MasterSpatula · September 2014

UrQuan wrote: »

Flat-out wrong. If you're not getting those materials back it absolutely screws with power leveling, because you need to spend more time finding materials of the appropriate level to craft with (or spend more time getting gold to buy them with) in order to keep trading crafted items to power level with.

Anything else you care to get badly wrong?

I believe I've become weary of this game.

You cannot powerlevel a craft by constructing and deconstructing items, because crafting itself gives negligible inspiration points and deconstructing items of a level you can craft does not give enough inspiration points to powerlevel.

The only way to powerlevel is by deconstructing items that are way beyond your own crafting level, and even then once you approach the level of those items, you'll slow from "powerleveling' rates to "leveling" rates. If you and a friend are just trading items on your way up the skill, it's going to happen at pretty much the normal rate.

Plus, the game has never returned enough materials from deconstructing to make swapping back and forth viable. Plus plus, if you actually were powerleveling, you'd outlevel the materials you're using pretty soon and have to switch to the next tier of materials.

Not getting materials back might harm your ability to help someone else powerlevel, but it affects your own leveling almost not at all. It might make a small difference in the last couple of levels, but that is it.

That is how the game actually works. All the smug insults in the world can't change that.

starkerealm · September 2014

MasterSpatula wrote: »

The only way to powerlevel is by deconstructing items that are way beyond your own crafting level, and even then once you approach the level of those items, you'll slow from "powerleveling' rates to "leveling" rates. If you and a friend are just trading items on your way up the skill, it's going to happen at pretty much the normal rate.

I think that was exactly the kind of "powerleveling" they were seeking to curtail. Where someone is passing VR10+ daggers to a level 5, and then getting the materials back, crafting more daggers, and repeating. This way the daggers are vastly less likely to provide materials back to the crafter making it more expensive.

I'm not convinced it's a good system, but that is what it seems to be designed to counter, whether it makes sense or not.

Halke · September 2014

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

You're missing the point....if you had deconstructed items of your appropriate level (in you levelled area) you would never have a craft level higher than your character level. This only occurred because you fed them overpowered gear that seriously over inflated your XP gains in that craft...and hence out levelled yourself.

Perhaps in regard to Vet zones. Otherwise, there is nothing saying you can't venture to a higher area and farm these raw mats. I recall doing so in Rivenspire when I was halfway through Stormhaven.

Had to sneak like crazy and run like heck, but the return was good.

Anath_Q wrote: »

FYI: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/131965/deconstruction-bug#latest

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to provide some clarity on the deconstructing issue described in this thread. Previously, if your character’s level was not as high as the item you were deconstructing, you would receive an increasing penalty, which would potentially reduce the amount of material you’d get from deconstructing the item – this would depend on how far below your character level was compared to the item itself. However, there was no clear indication that this was the case.

In Update 4, we added an error message that now appears providing that information -- no change was actually made to the mechanic itself. However, based on your feedback, our team is going to change this in a future update so that we’ll check your passive skill rank level in addition to your character level, using whichever is higher to help give you the full deconstruct credit easier. As always, thanks so much for your feedback on this issue, and for helping us to improve the game.

Again, which material? Base mats, all mats? It's only slightly clearer than it was.

If they mechanic itself has not changed, they should have no issue indicating the specifics of it. It's hardly an exploitable inside information.

It would be nice to know if there is more benefit to holding onto higher level blue and purples, rather than figuring out by randomly destroying half a dozen or more.

Just base mats are affected by how this works.

twev · September 2014

Rune_Relic wrote: »

AlexDougherty wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

wwusterbarthub17_ESO wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

I assume its because your skill level should never exceed your character level.
So how would a level 30 character be able to craft level >30 gear ? Or find an area capable of dropping gear greater than their character level ? Normally you travel through levelled zones for exactly this reason. You pick up materials appropriate for you character level.

The idea is they cant....unless you use alts to bypass this. In effect its a kind of exploit that ZOS has closed the door on IMHO.

So the question becomes.....is sending high level gear to low level characters (to rapidly and artificially level their skills) an exploit ?

Uh -- Guild Store Brah. Go to store buy whatever I want.

This change is total BS. My crafters aren't even Character level 20 and honestly not even crafting above a 25-30 with the exception of my provisioner and alchemist(2 diff toons). In the past if I was on my WW and deconned a blue or purple WW item I would get the upgrade material some of the time, but I would almost always get the type of wood and style gem. Now can't even decon stuff I made at higher level to get materials back.

If t his change is permenant, I would like everything I have researched on my crafters gifted to my main. Since I have him as a main not to do crafting (he is my alchemist though - at least for now)

When you as a level 20 try to wear level 21 gear you cant...its highlighted red. Beyond your level and ability to use.

Should they just let you wear level 50 gear when you are level 20 ? Everyone on here appears to say yes. I think not.

For the same reason you simply don't have the knowledge or expertise to deconstruct stuff beyond you level. Seems to work in exactly the same way to me. [Granted it should block you from deconstructing or warn you]

Imagine me vs an electrician. We both pull apart a TV. The electrician will keep almost everything and have a use for it. I might find some place mats and a couple of potential ear rings or something His vastly superior experience has enabled him to pull lots of useful stuff he specialises in.

The only thing I see is lots of people throwing dummys out the pram because there character now has to work to get reward and not rely on hand outs for power leveling gear with massive XP..which is what you are all doing. [People without alts don't have this luxury]

At least grinding combat you actually have to use your own character and not one of your alts /facepalm.

Slight mismatch in you're analogy, it's not that you don't have the same expertise as the electrician, it's that under the new system the electrician has to have spent as much time in front of the TV as you or he has to leave certain components alone.

In gaming terms it like demanding a blacksmith has to have trained as a knight in order to make armour an swords that the knights can use, or that a tailor is trained as a ranger to make leather armour for said rangers.

You're missing the point....if you had deconstructed items of your appropriate level (in you levelled area) you would never have a craft level higher than your character level. This only occurred because you fed them overpowered gear that seriously over inflated your XP gains in that craft...and hence out levelled yourself.

Complete Nonsense.
My lvl 30 (I was actually about a lvl 27 NB at that point, I'm a 31 NB now) NB leveled BS crafting from 47 to 50 in Grahtwood at Eldenroot 2nd floor, specifically gathering the crap pickup armor and weapons in the Mages and Fighters guilds, and breaking them down for the XP.

I did it just because I felt like doing it that way.
Took me a week to ten days.
Most of my friends had bailed on the game by that point and I was just in a seriously pizzy mood and needed to keep mindlessly busy or unsub.

No overpowered stuff from other 'toons, no quest gear, and only the very occasional green piece of garbage that randomly spawned.

Merlight · September 2014

twev wrote: »

Complete Nonsense.
My lvl 30 (I was actually about a lvl 27 NB at that point, I'm a 31 NB now) NB leveled BS crafting from 47 to 50 in Grahtwood at Eldenroot 2nd floor, specifically gathering the crap pickup armor and weapons in the Mages and Fighters guilds, and breaking them down for the XP.

In the patch where they added "crap pickup armor and weapons", they explicitly stated that deconstructing them gives very little inspiration. Tried it once and the bar didn't even move, so I just ignored them thereafter. Now you made me look closer. With my blacksmith, who is level 35 and coincidentaly has blacksmithing level 35, I picked up a few of those crap items at southern high rock (all orichalc level 35 items). Each gave +158 inspiration. In order to get through blacksmithing level 35, which consists of 95600 IP, I'd have to pick and deconstruct 605 items. Sounds like fun.

Hypertionb14_ESO · September 2014

and here we have reason for why i never actually made my unleveled alts anything more than storage mules.

and why i have 4 VR characters.

UrQuan · September 2014

MasterSpatula wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Flat-out wrong. If you're not getting those materials back it absolutely screws with power leveling, because you need to spend more time finding materials of the appropriate level to craft with (or spend more time getting gold to buy them with) in order to keep trading crafted items to power level with.

Anything else you care to get badly wrong?

I believe I've become weary of this game.

You cannot powerlevel a craft by constructing and deconstructing items, because crafting itself gives negligible inspiration points and deconstructing items of a level you can craft does not give enough inspiration points to powerlevel.

The only way to powerlevel is by deconstructing items that are way beyond your own crafting level, and even then once you approach the level of those items, you'll slow from "powerleveling' rates to "leveling" rates. If you and a friend are just trading items on your way up the skill, it's going to happen at pretty much the normal rate.

Plus, the game has never returned enough materials from deconstructing to make swapping back and forth viable. Plus plus, if you actually were powerleveling, you'd outlevel the materials you're using pretty soon and have to switch to the next tier of materials.

Not getting materials back might harm your ability to help someone else powerlevel, but it affects your own leveling almost not at all. It might make a small difference in the last couple of levels, but that is it.

That is how the game actually works. All the smug insults in the world can't change that.

OK, so by not understanding how the trading works for power leveling you're once again demonstrably wrong. Allow me to direct you to this:

starkerealm wrote: »

MasterSpatula wrote: »

The only way to powerlevel is by deconstructing items that are way beyond your own crafting level, and even then once you approach the level of those items, you'll slow from "powerleveling' rates to "leveling" rates. If you and a friend are just trading items on your way up the skill, it's going to happen at pretty much the normal rate.

I think that was exactly the kind of "powerleveling" they were seeking to curtail. Where someone is passing VR10+ daggers to a level 5, and then getting the materials back, crafting more daggers, and repeating. This way the daggers are vastly less likely to provide materials back to the crafter making it more expensive.

I'm not convinced it's a good system, but that is what it seems to be designed to counter, whether it makes sense or not.

@starkerealm understands how this makes it more difficult to power level.

So @MasterSpatula do you have anything else to say that's going to make it obvious that you haven't thought any of this through?

AlnilamE · September 2014

When my friend who was VR was sending me batches of Calcinium daggers back in May/June, I would maybe get 1 or 2 calcinium ingots out of a dozen daggers because I was still in the high 20s. I'd get trait stones and racial stones (but sometimes get nothing), but very rarely was I able to send her back more than a few base mats.

Wreuntzylla · September 2014

AreoHotah wrote: »

Am I the only one to have all 6 professions maxed out on the main vr12 character?? No switching between alts no wasting time. 6 traits researched on all items, 8 traits on 20 or so... made a fortune crafting months ago bought all the bank slots now I have everything I meed, including motifs, on my main char... Easy...

Oh I also have 20 skillpoints just standing there...

While you were peddling small time, some of us had 8/8 traits on everything quite some time ago. It's all a matter of perspective.

MasterSpatula · September 2014

UrQuan wrote: »

@starkerealm understands how this makes it more difficult to power level.

So @MasterSpatula do you have anything else to say that's going to make it obvious that you haven't thought any of this through?

No, I'm going to yet again do just the opposite. Perhaps this time I won't have to deal with even more misinformation presented with a self-congratulatory tone.

As I stated in my previous post which you quoted, deconstructing materials, even when you are at a level where it returns materials, does not return enough materials to make this work. An item that required 5 bars of whatever might return 2 bars, 1 bar, or even none. If you use 100 ingots, you might get 40 back if you're exceptionally lucky. If your luck holds, that's 16 back on the next pass. Let's be generous and say you get 6 back on the next pass.

It's not a perpetual motion machine. You will always need new materials.