magnusnet wrote: »

Laura wrote: »

Raash wrote: »

aha. guess I wont be resubing in the future. I was under the impression the vet levels where going away. Such a shame.

they recently said that vet ranks ARE going away

http://dulfy.net/2014/07/12/eso-paul-sage-the-road-ahead-qa-transcript/

the vr15 stuff is being created with item codes. They were originally going to make craglorn/coh vr15 but lowered it to vr12 due to PTS tester complaints and that is why vr15 stuff is in the game but unobtainable (unless there is a bug).

/thread

It doesn't say "VR ranks are removed", it says it's REPLACED by Champion system. I highly doubt they remove the ability to level up after level 50 (even if VR ranks aren't really leveling up since you don't earn any more attribute points) it's just a goal to strive for.

I bet Upper Craglorn will come with an increase of VR ranks.

Do you know what "Replaced" means? It means remove one thing to replace it with another. What do they teach in schools these days.

When the final stage of the champion system is rolled out VR will no longer be in the game in any form!!

Stx wrote: »

Damn you ESO... I thought this game might not have been another gear grind fest... sigh.

Why even bother crafting nice gear if I have to scrap it in a couple months anyway? I guess I'll just have to farm my ass off for more mats. (assuming crafting will even be able to keep up with the "season" gear...)

I agree. Rift got to the point where new gear tiers became available faster than our ability to finish acquiring the previous tier. That's when I unsubbed that game. I'll do the same here if it comes down to it.

Laura wrote: »

Raash wrote: »

aha. guess I wont be resubing in the future. I was under the impression the vet levels where oing away. Such a shame.

they recently said that vet ranks ARE going away

http://dulfy.net/2014/07/12/eso-paul-sage-the-road-ahead-qa-transcript/

the vr15 stuff is being created with item codes. They were riginally going to make craglorn/coh vr15 but lowered it to vr12 due to PTS tester complaints and that is why vr15 stuff is in the game but unobtainable (unless there is a bug).

/thread

I am happy Vr ranks will be abolished. It was a cheap trick to extend the life of their game. I have 2 v12s so its not because im a whiner .but what does concern me is they have zero control of their end game. It is a bucking bronco shooting off in every different direction. From itemization to concept . They keep changing the vision every 6 weeks. implementation and speed of which they fix major issues like melee builds .Zos is rather poor.ive had to lower my expectations again just to keep playing. Just looking at how long it took them to add dyes and put a 2 and 4 bonus to existing sets . We wont see that champion system until next year. Likely the v12 dungeon and re itemizing Vr dungeons will be next 2updates . Thats not going to retain subs though.

Guppet wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Laura wrote: »

Raash wrote: »

aha. guess I wont be resubing in the future. I was under the impression the vet levels where oing away. Such a shame.

they recently said that vet ranks ARE going away

http://dulfy.net/2014/07/12/eso-paul-sage-the-road-ahead-qa-transcript/

the vr15 stuff is being created with item codes. They were riginally going to make craglorn/coh vr15 but lowered it to vr12 due to PTS tester complaints and that is why vr15 stuff is in the game but unobtainable (unless there is a bug).

/thread

I am happy Vr ranks will be abolished. It was a cheap trick to extend the life of their game. I have 2 v12s so its not because im a whiner .but what does concern me is they have zero control of their end game. It is a bucking bronco shooting off in every different direction. From itemization to concept . They keep changing the vision every 6 weeks. implementation and speed of which they fix major issues like melee builds .Zos is rather poor.ive had to lower my expectations again just to keep playing. Just looking at how long it took them to add dyes and put a 2 and 4 bonus to existing sets . We wont see that champion system until next year. Likely the v12 dungeon and re itemizing Vr dungeons will be next 2updates . Thats not going to retain subs though.

Care to elaborate on these constant changes if direction? For me there is just one change, replacing VR with Champion system, did I somehow miss lots of other changes of direction?

1). itemization, they stated that they would have powerful double enchanted gear dropping form Vr dungeons, not sets but gear the would be some of the best in game. They stated crafting would be a competitve alternative , and a mixture of crafted and dropped items would be the best. Season gear well thats a redirection, its a gear score plain and simple. not that i think its bad i think this game needs a total overhaul in itemization. if they were to add value to there end game VR dungeon they should make gold mats drop from bosses and remove refining to get them. It would be a healthy way for the people who enjoy end game pve to make gear other then node thumping and mindless bartering. it would make the crafting community interact with other type of play styles.

2). Class and build diversity. ZOS had always said the design was to make the play style play your way, currently for end game activites its play the caster way for all classes. and with gear changes it did boost melee and tank builds a tiny bit and ever so slighty boosted the magica builds with cetain sets even more. Clearly with spell crafting and changes listed as incoming we can see the game is becoming even more directed towards meta magica builds. not really play your way but play the meta way even more then what it currently is.

3). the Dumbing and watering down of content is leaning more towards a solo centric game style more solo less MMO this is a by product of imbalances actually . not having the resources or tie to fix melee and armor lines they reduced difficulty on everything in VR content . making original VR zones that were supposed to be ultra challenge for the soloist and encourage grouping and community. Completely moved away form that with the reduction of diffculty to accomdate the melee imbalance.the recent changes to Trials and VR dungeons only solidifies this

those are three precise examples of having a lose grip on their end game and how to implement it. i know you will likely not agree with me but over half the subscription base agreed and have left this game 750k subs 2 weeks ago is still bleeding the game is no where near stable as far as population. And the most of them are leaving due to the melee imbalances and lack of diversity in builds, if people wanted to play a DPS game with zerg type end game they would still be playing GW2.

Guppet wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Laura wrote: »

Raash wrote: »

aha. guess I wont be resubing in the future. I was under the impression the vet levels where oing away. Such a shame.

they recently said that vet ranks ARE going away

http://dulfy.net/2014/07/12/eso-paul-sage-the-road-ahead-qa-transcript/

the vr15 stuff is being created with item codes. They were riginally going to make craglorn/coh vr15 but lowered it to vr12 due to PTS tester complaints and that is why vr15 stuff is in the game but unobtainable (unless there is a bug).

/thread

I am happy Vr ranks will be abolished. It was a cheap trick to extend the life of their game. I have 2 v12s so its not because im a whiner .but what does concern me is they have zero control of their end game. It is a bucking bronco shooting off in every different direction. From itemization to concept . They keep changing the vision every 6 weeks. implementation and speed of which they fix major issues like melee builds .Zos is rather poor.ive had to lower my expectations again just to keep playing. Just looking at how long it took them to add dyes and put a 2 and 4 bonus to existing sets . We wont see that champion system until next year. Likely the v12 dungeon and re itemizing Vr dungeons will be next 2updates . Thats not going to retain subs though.

**Care to elaborate on these constant changes if direction? **

For me there is just one change, replacing VR with Champion system, did I somehow miss lots of other changes of direction?

---

Heh, the 180-degree change from having challenging Vet content to provide a pathway for mid to upper level training as people head up to the endcap content. THAT was a major change in direction and reversal of plans they originally designed this MMO for from over several years ago.

It wasn't chewed on for like say, the first year of the game, melding it with further content to see how it panned out. It was an ABRUPT reversal and dilution of zones of content which directly affects endgame in this MMO.

That it was later explained as being the first part of implementing the Champion system doesn't belie the fact that there was little information provided to the paying subscribers about this major change so it was indeed a 'surprise'. The little we know about the Champion system definitely looks like it will help players grow their characters stronger and more effective, especially those who have played the longest/the most - that is exciting to some players.

Why adjustments and rewards couldn't address motivation for grouping content in Vet+ is a question that still lingers. Instead of going forward with incremental adjustments and changes for grouping motivation as ZOS says they wish to do and are doing with other mechanics/stats in this MMO, they just nerfed the mobs.

The Vet+ content dilution/Nerf most definitely has affected subscribers plans and at the very least many people are watching ZOS much more closely after this 'new' seemingly rushed decision. Many wonder nervously what ELSE about the literal path 'ahead' is going to be majorly changed.

There is also discussion amongst subscribers in guilds, in chat, in voice-com which shows concern whether in fact this turn away from providing challenging, interesting mid-to-upper level group content will mesh with the playstyle reasoning those PvE vet players used in order to decide in the first place whether to purchase this MMO and whether/how long to subscribe to it.

Anastasia wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Laura wrote: »

Raash wrote: »

aha. guess I wont be resubing in the future. I was under the impression the vet levels where oing away. Such a shame.

they recently said that vet ranks ARE going away

http://dulfy.net/2014/07/12/eso-paul-sage-the-road-ahead-qa-transcript/

the vr15 stuff is being created with item codes. They were riginally going to make craglorn/coh vr15 but lowered it to vr12 due to PTS tester complaints and that is why vr15 stuff is in the game but unobtainable (unless there is a bug).

/thread

I am happy Vr ranks will be abolished. It was a cheap trick to extend the life of their game. I have 2 v12s so its not because im a whiner .but what does concern me is they have zero control of their end game. It is a bucking bronco shooting off in every different direction. From itemization to concept . They keep changing the vision every 6 weeks. implementation and speed of which they fix major issues like melee builds .Zos is rather poor.ive had to lower my expectations again just to keep playing. Just looking at how long it took them to add dyes and put a 2 and 4 bonus to existing sets . We wont see that champion system until next year. Likely the v12 dungeon and re itemizing Vr dungeons will be next 2updates . Thats not going to retain subs though.

**Care to elaborate on these constant changes if direction? **

For me there is just one change, replacing VR with Champion system, did I somehow miss lots of other changes of direction?

---

Heh, the 180-degree change from having challenging Vet content to provide a pathway for mid to upper level training as people head up to the endcap content. THAT was a major change in direction and reversal of plans they originally designed this MMO for from over several years ago.

It wasn't chewed on for like say, the first year of the game, melding it with further content to see how it panned out. It was an ABRUPT reversal and dilution of zones of content which directly affects endgame in this MMO.

That it was later explained as being the first part of implementing the Champion system doesn't belie the fact that there was little information provided to the paying subscribers about this major change so it was indeed a 'surprise'. The little we know about the Champion system definitely looks like it will help players grow their characters stronger and more effective, especially those who have played the longest/the most - that is exciting to some players.

Why adjustments and rewards couldn't address motivation for grouping content in Vet+ is a question that still lingers. Instead of going forward with incremental adjustments and changes for grouping motivation as ZOS says they wish to do and are doing with other mechanics/stats in this MMO, they just nerfed the mobs.

The Vet+ content dilution/Nerf most definitely has affected subscribers plans and at the very least many people are watching ZOS much more closely after this 'new' seemingly rushed decision. Many wonder nervously what ELSE about the literal path 'ahead' is going to be majorly changed.

There is also discussion amongst subscribers in guilds, in chat, in voice-com which shows concern whether in fact this turn away from providing challenging, interesting mid-to-upper level group content will mesh with the playstyle reasoning those PvE vet players used in order to decide in the first place whether to purchase this MMO and whether/how long to subscribe to it.

Its a bit of bummer people do not understand the impact this will have on longevity. Right now it looks like a mad scramble to design the end, sadly some of the things they envisioned are not translating well at all to actuall game play. Word to the wise . Dont try to re invent the wheel just make it better.

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Laura wrote: »

Raash wrote: »

aha. guess I wont be resubing in the future. I was under the impression the vet levels where oing away. Such a shame.

they recently said that vet ranks ARE going away

http://dulfy.net/2014/07/12/eso-paul-sage-the-road-ahead-qa-transcript/

the vr15 stuff is being created with item codes. They were riginally going to make craglorn/coh vr15 but lowered it to vr12 due to PTS tester complaints and that is why vr15 stuff is in the game but unobtainable (unless there is a bug).

/thread

I am happy Vr ranks will be abolished. It was a cheap trick to extend the life of their game. I have 2 v12s so its not because im a whiner .but what does concern me is they have zero control of their end game. It is a bucking bronco shooting off in every different direction. From itemization to concept . They keep changing the vision every 6 weeks. implementation and speed of which they fix major issues like melee builds .Zos is rather poor.ive had to lower my expectations again just to keep playing. Just looking at how long it took them to add dyes and put a 2 and 4 bonus to existing sets . We wont see that champion system until next year. Likely the v12 dungeon and re itemizing Vr dungeons will be next 2updates . Thats not going to retain subs though.

Care to elaborate on these constant changes if direction? For me there is just one change, replacing VR with Champion system, did I somehow miss lots of other changes of direction?

1). itemization, they stated that they would have powerful double enchanted gear dropping form Vr dungeons, not sets but gear the would be some of the best in game. They stated crafting would be a competitve alternative , and a mixture of crafted and dropped items would be the best. Season gear well thats a redirection, its a gear score plain and simple. not that i think its bad i think this game needs a total overhaul in itemization. if they were to add value to there end game VR dungeon they should make gold mats drop from bosses and remove refining to get them. It would be a healthy way for the people who enjoy end game pve to make gear other then node thumping and mindless bartering. it would make the crafting community interact with other type of play styles.

2). Class and build diversity. ZOS had always said the design was to make the play style play your way, currently for end game activites its play the caster way for all classes. and with gear changes it did boost melee and tank builds a tiny bit and ever so slighty boosted the magica builds with cetain sets even more. Clearly with spell crafting and changes listed as incoming we can see the game is becoming even more directed towards meta magica builds. not really play your way but play the meta way even more then what it currently is.

3). the Dumbing and watering down of content is leaning more towards a solo centric game style more solo less MMO this is a by product of imbalances actually . not having the resources or tie to fix melee and armor lines they reduced difficulty on everything in VR content . making original VR zones that were supposed to be ultra challenge for the soloist and encourage grouping and community. Completely moved away form that with the reduction of diffculty to accomdate the melee imbalance.the recent changes to Trials and VR dungeons only solidifies this

those are three precise examples of having a lose grip on their end game and how to implement it. i know you will likely not agree with me but over half the subscription base agreed and have left this game 750k subs 2 weeks ago is still bleeding the game is no where near stable as far as population. And the most of them are leaving due to the melee imbalances and lack of diversity in builds, if people wanted to play a DPS game with zerg type end game they would still be playing GW2.

Season gear had to be implemented. It's part if the champion system. In the current VR system there is already season gear, it's when ever they increase the VR level.

Class build diversity has never been delivered, so that's no change if direction.

The dumbing town is part of the champion system replacing VR.

So again it's just the VR system being replaced that has been a design direction change. It's just a large change.