Selodaoc wrote: »

*Sidenote. Have anyone else noticed Nightblades seem to get more agro then other classes? Everytime me and my friends do dungeons, mobs come storming for me without me doing anything.

As a NB myself I've noticed this. Sometimes I try to play the 'would-be' tank when it happens but that doesn't last long as I can't take the steady damage.

Two things I always do now is buy lots of empty soul gems and farm to fill them before venturing off. And make lots of 3 in 1 potions and invisibility potions but Namira's Rot is pretty scarce.

Ran across some help in one dungeon today that really amazed me. They used a spell of sorts I think that I've never seen used before--a gold-yellowish column that looked and sounded a little like a skyshard. No end to the overpowering help some classes/skills have over others.

As a poor NB by myself more often then not I've also learned to take advantage of dying sometimes by resurrecting on the spot rather then a wayshrine and as soon as I can move my ghost image do so down a path and past enemies to avoid some fights. Doesn't do much good though if you time it wrong and come to life right next to a foe.

Oh, it is amazing how close I can sneak past some foes too. I feel like they will discover me so often but more often then not they don't.

NBs are doing okay except for the skills that are still bugged. Dark Cloak is way too unreliable, only seems to work 70% of the times you attempt to use it at best. It seems like some DoTs still break it, even though they should be removed. Funnel Health/Swallow Soul sometimes bugs out and only ticks for 10-15 health even though it did ~500 dmg, resulting in a rage-enducing death since this is pretty much our only heal apart from Sap Essence which only works well with higher target numbers. Impale and Ambush don't always fire and the animation can get stuck for a second or so. Last time I checked, Haste still doesn't affect Bow attacks even though fixes have been in several patch notes. There are more but I cant think of them right now. Fixing these could go a long way.

Now let's look at skills that are nigh useless imo. Blur gives 15% miss chance which bosses are immune to. Hist Bark's set bonus is at least 5 times better than this entire skill and costs no magicka. Please make Blur give a dodge chance so people can actually use it. Agony needs to be looked at as well. This should be made into a viable CC ability. Either change Malefic Wreath morph to where it can root multiple targets or make it so the other morphs don't get removed instantly upon taking dmg. Maybe cut duration in half but let targets take some dmg. Another option would be to disorient targets when the effect is broken. Talons for example is useful unlike Agony at the moment.

I like that balancing is done carefully. I don't want any class especially mine to be OP. And like I said NBs are doing okay at the moment but the skills that have been bugged for months really should be fixed at some point and looking into the least used ones would be nice as well. Please don't forget about us.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom Even nothing news in the last patchnotes, please help us !

Sangeet wrote: »

I leveld a DK, he could stun an enemy for 15 !!! seconds, i could inhale, sucking health, then aoe, i dont need a destro staff when i am a DK. I just could serve so much damage.

Sorry ZOS, please buff NB too the same level as a DK. Its also not a problem with a DK to be Vamp, i could constantly self heal, so the reduced regeneration does me not affect the slightest bit. As NB there is only a self heal with "funnel healt" when engaged in combat. No "oh ***" button, just check for yourself, how many escape abilitys the DK has. Root , selfheal, healing with ultimate placement, 10% incomming damage mitigation, each fire ability grants a new buzz to all the flame abilitys a DK has.

Do something similar to NB, make him poison based, give him lots of poision abilitys, improve poison effects with passives. Make it so, that someone has actually to fear the posion and has to place protective runes on him.

There are a lot of possiblities to make something cool out of it. The vampire cloud skill should have been in our reportouire, not for everyone to get.

yea its like a whole different team made NBs what a joke it is and the funny thing was on the quake con pvp there was no NBs and they were all about that dk they stayed on him the whole time! I was not satisfied at all

Comps been ill for a month, and being fixed. So has nothing changed for us NB since I've been away..?

RatsnevE wrote: »

It still appears to me as a solo NB in PvE VR-3 in EP that the NB is well balanced. However I wouldn't turn down some buff. As solo I can easily mess up a mob that eats me if not careful.

You have completely missed the entire point of this discussion. No one is disputing Solo PvE. With the recent nerf to VR content, it's a joke.

Matuzes wrote: »

Yeap, Haste and Path of Darkness changes really improves NB.

Path of Darkness magnificent skill even now, just not everyone is able to use it;) But I would not mind if it even strengthened.

RatsnevE wrote: »

Jaxom wrote: »

You have completely missed the entire point of this discussion. No one is disputing Solo PvE. With the recent nerf to VR content, it's a joke.

I haven't completely missed anything. I'm promoting the solo classic PvE NB and since I haven't gotten near PvP and still don't intend too I have no idea how bad it is there. In every discussion I find on the NB I may post my opinion of my NB in solo PvE. If you end up getting the NB buffed properly for PvP how will that affect her in Veteran PvE? As an update in fact my NB isn't doing so well now solo against some single mobs or bosses and it seems to be getting quite complicated instancing group help in some quests. I'm VR-4 now finishing the last couple areas of EP still very much in PvE. The OP does not indicate this thread only concerns PvP.

If you don't like me interjecting my thoughts on the NB that you think might be out of context to a thread 57 pages long the best thing might be to ignore me and not post. I am once again faced with needing to respec the whole character again and because I still have not gotten into all the strategy details have no idea what actually needs to be done this time. No doubt it sounds like some of the skills still not working properly by the OP for the NB might have a great affect on my NB if they were fixed. If basic balances and skills still aren't worked out for the NB then this game for that class at least is still very much in beta and I resent paying for it. Hybridizing my NB to complete with other classes is just a fancy way of ZOS allowing me to exploit skills that should not belong to the NB in the first place.

No, really, you have missed the point of this thread. A Solo Classic PvE NB is fine, Bow, DW, 2H, Destro, Resto..It doesnt matter what you are using. The VR Grind is not like it was. At this point, any class should be able to go through vet content with little trouble. There is nothing to promote for that. If you are still having trouble with the recent changes to VR content, I'd be happy to help you. Send me a PM. Like you, I have respecced more times than I would like to admit, though this was when VR mobs were autoattacking for 700 damage.

Also, I never said the point of the thread was PvP. I simply stated you missed the point of the thread. NB is only viable in End Game PvE (Trials) with 1 specific build (Light Armor and Resto Staff) and some specific set ups in PvP (ganking for the most part). We want to be able to do Trials (PvE) in more than 1 specific build. We want our class skill to synergize better within themselves and with our group. We want our broken skills fixed. We want our useless skills either completely revamped or changed to make us want them. 2 out of the 3 skills that are at the peak of our trees, are completely useless. We want to be able to mix Class and Stamina skills without completely gimping damage on one or the other. Our Class skills scale with Spell Power but use Weapon Crit. There are no sets out there that accomodate this. THESE are the problems and even with these problems, VR content shouldnt be difficult to complete any longer.

Haste- Still Broken and only increases attack speed of Light and Heavy Attacks. Pointless. It should increase Light and Heavy attacks just by slotting it to make it even remotely worthwhile to put on my bar. It's the 5 skill of the Assassination Tree and does nothing to assassinate anything.

Shades- Buggy AI and recently nerfed so they no longer take agro. The only use I have found for it when I'm fighting a DK 1v1. Their auto attack will chip away at their stamina while they hold block. This skill is supposed to be the top tier in the Shadow Tree and is probably utilized by less than 1% of NB's.

Out of all of our class skills, the Siphoning Tree is in the best shape.

Jacques Berge wrote: »

I use shades all the time... Great move I love it, so funny and useful. I'm glad people don't use em. The less people who know that they're fairly harmless the better. I love watching people trying to fight them.... Almost better than killing said person hahaha

Yeah shades can do combine damage 120 which is just basically a dot plus weakens who every is attacking me damage which lets me survive longer. I have had plenty shades kill people because they thought they worthless or they did not know they cannot hit them. They are quite use for plus they aggro some of the time.

The agro on shades was recently changed. They can no longer pull agro in PvE, at least the last time I used them a few weeks ago. The problem I have with shades is that, I only have 10 slots to use. They may be worth having on my secondary bar in some specific scenario's but as a full time skill, I'm hard pressed to replace a skill for it. This is with my playstyle. If you are able to make it work for you then I applaud you. For me, it's just not worth it and only really know 1 NB I play with who uses it.

The reason they toyed with the aggro is because a single NB could cast shades on a group of mobs and simply walk pass them... The developers apparently didn't like this, that's why the aggro system is jacked. I feel like our aggro may be set naturally higher as a lazy quick fix. I have no numbers to back this up, however, I've had 2 party members run past a guard and the sob runs straight at me, 50 yards away, in stealth...

And about shades, it's a good move, but it's main effect isn't in it's discription. Above all else, it causes shear panic in all but the most experienced players. (There's no in-game defense against confusing the player). I had a DK that I killed say it was way OP (ROTFLMAO right?) people say that the NB has to resort to gimmicks and cheap tricks and ganking to win, but is that so bad? Using the class the way most would consider its intended design.... We have no instana heals and one, decent ranged dps move. I'll stick to my cheap tricks... I'm just holding my breathe for the stealth system (including the much hated Magelight) to be adjusted. I'm afraid I may die of suffocation though haha.

Jacques Berge wrote: »

I have no numbers to back this up, however, I've had 2 party members run past a guard and the sob runs straight at me, 50 yards away, in stealth...

Sounds like the old "Wi Flag" from my Asheron's Call days

Some feedback from a NB that de-subbed and re-subbed to try out the changes thus far.

I wanted an illusionist/siphon mage, but the opener nature of stealth, high cost of shadow cloak, and lack of AOE spells (damage or CC) prevented that from working well. I ended up having to just kite bosses around plinking them with arrows where possible.

Before the changes I was playing mostly as shadow/siphon/bow 20/20/9 Mag/Health/Stam. Since returning I've played both this and respected to a more assassin/shadow/DW set to test it out in VR as a comparison, still 20/20/9 stats.
After respecting I tried (again) to get into some of the more melee abilities and it does feel better, but still could use some tweaks for VR.

Assassination
Assassin line was/is pretty much useless with bow, but with melee works ok.

-Assassins blade and morphs function pretty much as they should. Just needs responsiveness improvements.
-Teleport strike and morphs again works as it should, though if I had to change one thing it would be an increase on the radius of lotus fan, its too small (5 meters?) and rarely hits a group of enemies.
-Blur hasn't changed and is still very meh. Should be useable on bosses and % increase 1% per rank.
-Mark target I still don't use, I don't need the penetration buff/debuff, what I get passively from weapon traits and armour passives is enough. Could use an additional crit buff or something with that cost (high magicka plus self debuff).
-I haven't tried haste since respecing. All I would want is for it to be working with all weapons.

Passives are all fine, thanks for the fixes to master assassin and pressure points.

Shadow
-Shadow Cloak is still too glitchy for an ability that is virtually required to take advantage of other skills/passives. Also please consider either extending the duration or decreasing the cost a little (or both).
-Veiled Strike and morphs feels fine, just responsiveness improvements required.
-After the buff to path of darkness it works better but I feel its missing a tiny snare vs enemies, like 15-25%, now that its visible it needs something to make it sticky for players trying to escape the damage.
-Aspect of Terror, was/is fine.
-Summon Shade, was/is unappealing, particularly for a high level skill. You could increase the damage debuff a little, give players a reason to dispel them.

Passives are were/are ok.

Siphoning
Was the most functional set, mostly just in need of tweaks and bugfixes.
Only skill change I'd ask for is Drain power and its morphs should increase both spell and weapon power to match master assassin changes and the siphoning strikes debuff. This would make it worth the magicka cost for the lowish damage spell it is. It would also give players more build flexibility, which is desperately needed with nightblade.

Passives were/are ok, though Catalyst is very situational given the need to use consumables with universal cooldowns and it could use an extra effect like poison/disease resistance or something.

Can anyone link a video with fights NB vs DK, without horse gank?