Grouping - Does the game not encourage grouping or are players not interested ???

Nox_Aeterna · July 2014

Players don't want to group

timidobserver wrote: »

A major component of this is the growing use of voice chat clients. Some players, for whatever reason, are just appalled at the idea of even just listening without having to talk at all.

Also, I am finding that ESO has more anti-social players than most other MMO's I've played. Other players just break their immersion.

That is what happens when you create a MMO out of one of the most immersive RPG franchises in the market. Many are here for the single player experience on the most part.

Im happy by myself and while i dont mind others around or fighting by my side on the fly, the more i can do without a closed group the better.

I did play my share of MMOs , i do understand this is not the usual way to play one , but it is what i expect from a TES game , even a MMO TES.

SFBryan18 · July 2014

Other (Please Explain)

timidobserver wrote: »

Also, I am finding that ESO has more anti-social players than most other MMO's I've played. Other players just break their immersion.

TES was a single player game so it makes sense.

timidobserver · July 2014

Players don't want to group

Warcraft was also a single player game.

SFBryan18 wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Also, I am finding that ESO has more anti-social players than most other MMO's I've played. Other players just break their immersion.

TES was a single player game so it makes sense.

Eh, I couldn't agree that it makes sense to be anti-social in an MMO, regardless of other titles, but it is indeed how it is for many people. ZOS should take that into consideration when designing future game content, which I think they have with the announcement of the solo zone.

SFBryan18 · July 2014

Other (Please Explain)

timidobserver wrote: »

Warcraft was also a single player game.

SFBryan18 wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Also, I am finding that ESO has more anti-social players than most other MMO's I've played. Other players just break their immersion.

TES was a single player game so it makes sense.

Eh, I couldn't agree that it makes sense to be anti-social in an MMO, regardless of other titles, but it is indeed how it is for many people. ZOS should take that into consideration when designing future game content, which I think they have with the announcement of the solo zone.

If you're going to compare ESO to WoW, then you need to refer to how their game was after a similar amount of time.

Nox_Aeterna · July 2014

Players don't want to group

timidobserver wrote: »

Warcraft was also a single player game.

Uhhh ... WC3 , the WC that came before WoW , did have the solo campaing , but it was NOT a single player game.

It had TONs of people playing the normal maps AND custom maps over Bnet , to the point it even created DOTA , a mod that created a genre.

timidobserver · July 2014

Players don't want to group

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Warcraft was also a single player game.

Uhhh ... WC3 , the WC that came before WoW , did have the solo campaing , but it was NOT a single player game.

It had TONs of people playing the normal maps AND custom maps , to the point it even created DOTA , a mod that created a genre.

You grabbed that pretty quick. Editted it out of my post about 2 seconds later after I recalled that the original(first) warcraft did have a multiplayer mode though it was limited to 2 players via modem 2 modem.2.

Sabin1269 · July 2014

Players don't want to group

The grouping tool sucks! When I was questing through the main story line I was always 4-5 levels ahead of the zone so when I looked for a group for a dungeon it didn't have any of the ones I needed, just everything in the next zone. I can't tell you how many times I've looked for a group in zone chat and no one answers or even seems interested. I've found PvP is even worse to find a group and at Vr1 I still have a tough time trying to solo the first set of quest because every enemy starts at Vr5. They would do well to revamp the grouping tool and add the function for people who want to group to just explore and do quest other that just dungeons. Add them into a pool and when others are looking for the same thing everyone gets notified of the possible group match. Other than that better reward or incentives would really help the situation. I think the only time I've gotten decent rewards for grouping was in the Vaults of Madness in Coldharbor.

Evarwyn · July 2014

Other (Please Explain)

To me, it feels like my opportunity to group in the game happens quite often. The issue I've been coming into contact with is the ease of talking to other players, so we can group.

Simply put, while out in the world and questing, if I happen upon someone I notice is doing the same quest I am, the "Hold [default key] To Interact" mechanic is way too cumbersome on the fly. By the time put my reticule over the character, hold down the key to interact with they, and then choose from an option wheel which form of interaction I'd like to engage in, the person I'm trying to speak to has already run off to another mob, crafting node, or mounted their horse and left me in the dust and I'm left asking "...did anyone catch that dude's name?"

Honestly, its way too much of a pain and sine I level slowly, I'm usually far behind my guild mates or friends in my contact window to effectively group up with them.

I solo unless I'm either using the LFG system or I've made plans ahead of time to group up with someone close to my level.

amm7sb14_ESO · July 2014

^ This is very true as well.

indytims_ESO · July 2014

The game doesnt offer enough grouping opportunities

Not only does the game not really encourage grouping, but there are parts of the game that are solo-only - whether you like it or not.

nudel · July 2014

Both

The game is not hard enough for grouping to be necessary most of the time. The little content that is hard enough (4-man dungeons) does not have enough incentive to run again. I know this is something they're addressing, but it's not here yet. Right now if you run a 4-man you've already done, especially if you've overleveled, you get absolutely nothing from it (save for maybe a red wheat or pepper drop if you're lucky).

On top of that, people simply don't seem to want to group for things. Hence the reason content isn't hard.

MrDenimChicken · July 2014

The game doesnt offer enough grouping opportunities

why the hell are people saying "players don't want to group"

that is moronic. This is an MMORPG. Lots of people play this game because they know it is ONLINE. So if grouping is worth it, and grouping is fun, PEOPLE WILL GROUP. Obviously the people left in this game/forums are solo focused players.

Currently, grouping is POINTLESS while leveling from 1-50. I'm sorry, but I tried doing 4 man dungeons. And they are just sad in this game. It probably changes post 50. But pre-50, the dungeons take like 15 minutes, and the loot is absolute garbage. But than again, itemization in this game is incredibly boring, so maybe that detriment is just by default (hooray for my purple item having +25 stamina instead of +20 stamina!!! and looking just like the other green item I had yesterday!! weeeee)

But compare the dungeons in this game to the dungeons in WOW while leveling, like wailing caverns, scarlet monastery, etc. It isn't a comparison. WOW group dungeons offered very unique looking dungeons, bosses, and ITEMS. And so people would flock to those dungeons while leveling to get the coolest stuff possible, so that their char would be OP as hell while leveling or while doing low level battlegrounds. In this game, doing dungeons feels like you are wasting time that would be better spent just doing the same old solo questing you always do.

theyancey · July 2014

Players don't want to group

I'm a solo PvE player. I vastly dislike formal groups. I do like the way we can flow in and out of informal groups though.

jelliedsoup · July 2014

Players don't want to group

I have no desire to accommodate what other people want to do, I do that in real life all day.

Nox_Aeterna · July 2014

Players don't want to group

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

why the hell are people saying "players don't want to group"

that is moronic. This is an MMORPG. Lots of people play this game because they know it is ONLINE. So if grouping is worth it, and grouping is fun, PEOPLE WILL GROUP. Obviously the people left in this game/forums are solo focused players.

Currently, grouping is POINTLESS while leveling from 1-50. I'm sorry, but I tried doing 4 man dungeons. And they are just sad in this game. It probably changes post 50. But pre-50, the dungeons take like 15 minutes, and the loot is absolute garbage. But than again, itemization in this game is incredibly boring, so maybe that detriment is just by default (hooray for my purple item having +25 stamina instead of +20 stamina!!! and looking just like the other green item I had yesterday!! weeeee)

But compare the dungeons in this game to the dungeons in WOW while leveling, like wailing caverns, scarlet monastery, etc. It isn't a comparison. WOW group dungeons offered very unique looking dungeons, bosses, and ITEMS. And so people would flock to those dungeons while leveling to get the coolest stuff possible, so that their char would be OP as hell while leveling or while doing low level battlegrounds. In this game, doing dungeons feels like you are wasting time that would be better spent just doing the same old solo questing you always do.

Yeah ... no.

I play solo because i like to play solo. I very rarely enter in closed groups and only because im forced to do part of the content , otherwise i would not even do that much.

Heh , try taking out all the solo players in this game and see what is left of the playerbase :P.

_subjectnamehere_ · July 2014

Other (Please Explain)

I group when I can. But there are just way too many group bugs right now. Grouping is unattractive, in my opinion.

The group leader mysteriously vanishes, sometimes right away as you create the group. This limits your ability to enter a queue, pass the lead to someone who has a friend to invite, kick a player for whatever reason, invite new players, etc. These are simple functions that anyone can predict to be pretty darn common in any MMO.

The grouping tool is extremely rough around the edges; no one really uses it. Phasing is extremely annoying; good luck finding someone on the exact same quest step as you.

Example: We were at the final boss in Veteran BC, trying to get the Cursed Hero achievement. We made real progress with our group, but time passed and one of our members had to go. He left, and we were unable to replace him because no one had lead (group leader bug). We all tried relogging, but that didn't work. Then we tried to drop and reform the group, which worked, but the instance kicked us out due to the "remove from area" feature. The timer did not stop ticking even though the same people were grouped in the instance (yeah, we did break, but only temporarily to try to fix the group leader bug).

Bugs like this in an MMO should be given top priority; design group content, encourage other players to group up, great! But it better be a system that works 100% of the time. This bug has existed since beta. It needs work.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler‌ @ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ @ZOS_GinaBruno‌

PBpsy · July 2014

Other (Please Explain)

Some people that like to group will never ever go with a PUGs. I tried only a single time in here and it was enough. It was the same in all MMOs I played. I actually think that the majority of group players do not ever PUG.

If you however call for people in my pve guild chat I will most of the time drop anything I am doing if I expect to be in game for the expected duration.

Con64 · July 2014

The game doesnt offer enough grouping opportunities

The grouping tool doesn't function very well...it needs to be looked over.

KariTR · July 2014

Other (Please Explain)

Aside from the main story and guild quests, the whole game is structured to be played alongside as well as with others, so to say there are not enough 'grouping' opportunities misses the point of its unique design.

I never once had any difficulty finding a group for Veteran content until it was nerfed and during the early levels I found the group tool very successful; that is, I was placed with a group almost immediately I clicked the button. (Edit to clarify: I more or less stopped doing group dungeons after third map, so have no experience of using the tool later on in game).

If the phasing issue can be sorted for at least the group dungeons, I'd say we are good to go.

MrDenimChicken · July 2014

The game doesnt offer enough grouping opportunities

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

Yeah ... no.

I play solo because i like to play solo. I very rarely enter in closed groups and only because im forced to do part of the content , otherwise i would not even do that much.

Heh , try taking out all the solo players in this game and see what is left of the playerbase :P.

I'm not saying people don't want to solo.

I'm saying that the proposed explanation for people not grouping in a massively multiplayer ORPG being, "people don't want to group" is ridiculous. Are we seriously asking ourselves this? If you had to even ask the question "why are people not grouping in an MMORPG", than the answer should IMMEDIATELY pop up into your head saying "because grouping in this game sucks".

If grouping was worth it, and was fun, than people would be grouping. Simple as that. Sure you would still have plenty of people only soloing, like you, which is perfectly fine. But if grouping wasn't trash in this game, this wouldn't even be a pertinent question.

And currently, grouping feels like a waste of time from my perspective as a pre-50 player.

indytims_ESO · July 2014

The game doesnt offer enough grouping opportunities

KariTR wrote: »

Aside from the main story and guild quests, the whole game is structured to be played alongside as well as with others, so to say there are not enough 'grouping' opportunities misses the point of its unique design.

I never once had any difficulty finding a group for Veteran content until it was nerfed and during the early levels I found the group tool very successful; that is, I was placed with a group almost immediately I clicked the button. (Edit to clarify: I more or less stopped doing group dungeons after third map, so have no experience of using the tool later on in game).

If the phasing issue can be sorted for at least the group dungeons, I'd say we are good to go.

The point is, the vast majority of the game doesn't require or instill a 'need' for grouping. I duo most content with my wife - and it's insanely easy - to the point of being -near- boring. The only 'challenges' we've faced have been in the solo instances during the main story line. We might die here or there during those portions of the game, but the rest of the game is just... super-easy.

When you add in all the grouping -issues-, such as group-bugs and phasing, there is even -less- incentive to group at all. And, as you know, a lot of the VR content was nerfed recently. Heck, even most world bosses are frequently soloable, and usually duoable.

If there -is- content at the higher VR ranks that necessitates grouping, that's great... it's just kinda sad that there's so little (if much at all) to inspire grouping before then. Yes, you -can- group, but there is no real need or incentive to do so for the majority of the game so far.

ozm8ey · July 2014

Other (Please Explain)

I group but only when I'm in the mood, I was really hoping you could go collecting materials with groups but it just doesn't work.

amm7sb14_ESO · July 2014

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

Yeah ... no.

I play solo because i like to play solo. I very rarely enter in closed groups and only because im forced to do part of the content , otherwise i would not even do that much.

Heh , try taking out all the solo players in this game and see what is left of the playerbase :P.

And this sort of mentality I'll never understand. Why would you play an online MMO game if you don't want to group with other players?

And don't take that the wrong way - I'm not saying it's wrong. I am like that a large chunk of the time too, I just want to go off on my own and do my thing with my character.

But when all that stuff can be done with offline gaming, I don't get why we're playing online games to play by ourselves.

DieAlteHexe · July 2014

timidobserver wrote: »

A major component of this is the growing use of voice chat clients. Some players, for whatever reason, are just appalled at the idea of even just listening without having to talk at all.

Also, I am finding that ESO has more anti-social players than most other MMO's I've played. Other players just break their immersion.

This is a major one. If you don't have or won't use Team or whatever, you're not wanted. Being that I can't hear very well, I don't even have the set-up plus, as was mentioned above, the idiocy that gets spewed.

We managed to group without stuff like that for years so...meh.

My "excuse" is my playstyle, I have to afk a lot and no way I think it fair to do that to a group. So, mainly solo or duo with my spouse. Not anti-grouping, per se, just don't like the drama, confusion, attitudes etc. that I've encountered over the years.

R1ckyDaMan · July 2014

Players don't want to group

darkmadman187 wrote: »

ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »

Seems people just don't want to. The vet zones where supposed to be group oriented and people just complained about it til they where made to be soloed. I still see complaints about there being group dungeons where you have to have 4 people to complete it.

That is ridiculous.... of course you should have a 4 man group for a GROUP dungeon..... its the whole idea of them. I will admit when I first reached Vet zones I did struggle but then I changed one skill in (rune focus) & all was solved it was still a challenge to defeat a quest boss but I managed it. I don't think they should of been nerfed as it encourages players to change their builds to improve their efficiency as a solo & group player

Not everyone strives to be efficient.

DieAlteHexe · July 2014

amm7sb14_ESO wrote: »

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

Yeah ... no.

I play solo because i like to play solo. I very rarely enter in closed groups and only because im forced to do part of the content , otherwise i would not even do that much.

Heh , try taking out all the solo players in this game and see what is left of the playerbase :P.

And this sort of mentality I'll never understand. Why would you play an online MMO game if you don't want to group with other players?

And don't take that the wrong way - I'm not saying it's wrong. I am like that a large chunk of the time too, I just want to go off on my own and do my thing with my character.

But when all that stuff can be done with offline gaming, I don't get why we're playing online games to play by ourselves.

All MMO means is that multiple people are simultaneously playing. That's it. It does not mean "must group", nor does it mean "must socialise", it simply means "here's a place where many, many people can log in and play however the game allows.".

I've tried, over the years, grouping, PUGs, guilds etc. and I just can't take the drama, lack of forethought and craziness. I play games to relax, not get irritated. Too, just because I'm not grouping doesn't mean I'm not socialising. I socialise all the time, just not running about the countryside in a group.

Katinas · July 2014

The game doesnt offer enough grouping opportunities

Grouping up to do quests in Craglorn is depressing and discouraging. It is quite literally impossible to group up and do quests, and by that I mean not just completing one quest, but grouping up on a day to day basis and competitively doing one quest after another. They need a major major rethinking before they put their second adventure zone live. This cannot continue as it is now because that kind of endgame content will be impossible to complete and enjoy at the same time.

reggielee · July 2014

Both

at first I was excited to run with groups thru dungeons and content. then phasing ruined much of th pve grouping with my real life friends and family, the whole bot fiasco in public dungeons, and then dungeon grouping became difficult due to the limited game group finder and the fact that once done dungeons were written off peoples to do list.

since that time all my bad experiences with the game have been group instanced based, whether due to the long wait to get a group, or bad attitudes within the group, players being unprepared or too underleveled for it, or phasing issues to the group, or just unpleasantness due to grouping in general like being pressured to rush thru the content in order to keep up, lack of appreciation for healers, rude folks.

its just not my idea of a good time. im done with grouping once i get my achievs

Xeres14 · July 2014

Players don't want to group

Well I'm one of those people who don't like grouping while leveling. There's a few reasons for this:

1. I'm leveling and instead of sitting around waiting for a group, I'd rather be doing quests. The gear I *might* get from dungeons is only temporary and will be replaced in a few levels anyway.

2. I'm a flaky leveler. I'll go afk for a while for whatever reason. I don't want to hold up a group because of that.

3. Most achievements mean nothing to me. Seriously. In this game or another. The only ones that do mean something are the tough ones. The ones worth "showing off". So I didn't kill the boss in the first dungeon. I won't lose sleep over it.

So that's really it. End game is totally different. But leveling and grouping, no thanks. The incentive would have to be massive to get me to group while leveling. Either very good gear (purple+) or very good mats to make very good gear.

Sabin1269 · July 2014

Players don't want to group

Don't remember if I commented on this post or not. The Grouping tool in the game is incredibly broken, when I at I'm usually a few levels over the content and the game does not recognize what zone your in just your level. Cyrodill has been a joke for me to try and group in as well. I've been trying for a week now to find a guild or group to do some of the quest since all the enemies are Vr5 or better which makes it impossible for me to solo. I don't really think there are many people going into Cyrodill solo or looking to group for the quest. I would recall love to level up my Vr and don't want to grind the EP quest line since I've already done it with my first toon so it's incredibly hard to get into.