"Full Loot" "Server"
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kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭@Delith I like how you are optimistic that everything from the good ole days of gaming is "coming back" but I'm staring at a the bowl of pudding and there is no proof in it.
Where are these games that are even making up 5% of the market shared? We can point all day to things that have yet to come out and assume they will be huge but where are the current games you are describing that are pulling people in left and right.
You're staring at your own reflection in a mirror, then. I just gave you a list of evidence, you just decided not to actually acknowledge it.
Your list of "evidence" is not even close to 5% market share of MMO and included games that were not MMOs. >5% market share isn't exactly coming back it is a small minority.
$50,000,000 in crowdsourced funding for a game that doesn't exist yet, and you're talking to me about market share.
Okay.
50 mill is half of one months income of WoW not exactly groundbreaking when they said they brought in 1 Billion last year alone and that is a decline. Also that is only one game when by far the majority of MMOs are not sandbox.
You're going to be in for a really, really rude awakening this time next year if you think theme park MMOs can maintain any level of subscription for more than a few months.
And when these big name sandboxes start dropping, you will watch the subscription on the theme parks drop like flies.
Pretending it isn't happening is not going to change the fact that it is happening. You can ignore as much evidence as you want by pretending that somehow WoW is indicative of anything other than the fact that people are surviving on nostalgia.
If the type of game they had made was still desirable, the constant rehashes and reskins with new properties wouldn't be flopping left and right, or surviving on name alone.
I won't be in for a rude awakening I prefer sandbox I just don't agree that the ones coming are going to make the same dent you seem to think they are going to make.
I do think the fact that WoW has more subs than all other MMOs combined is indicative of something and I think their numbers will only go up when their upcoming xpac comes out.
It is absolutely indicative of something. It's indicative of the fact that nostalgia is an incredible force for game developers to leverage in order to maintain a stable playerbase.
The problem isn't with World of Warcraft; it's a good game in it's own right. The problem is that developers keep trying to REMAKE World of Warcraft, and WoW players already have WoW, so what is the point?
To cash in on players who want a similar experience but are tired of WoW. If WoW is accurate that 100,000,000 people have tried it and they had 12,000,000 at their peak even the overflow is plenty to make a game profitable.
For example I did the beta for WoW and played it for a few years. It was a great game. I got tired of the game, the design, aesthetics, the story and some of the choices but I still like the idea of the game and the core ideas of it. For someone like me the WoW model with a new story, new aesthetics and certain design choices is appealing. I personally think that market share is far larger than those that want a sandbox game.
Honestly I would probably prefer a game like SWG PreCU over all of those but I don't think SWG even at its prime had even half a million subs.
That's why WoW redesigns keep flopping then, eh?
There are still ones making profit. Even SWTOR which was hailed as the biggest flop in history is now supposed to be very profitable. This game is more or less a WoW redesigns and look where we are.
It sounds like you would be a big fan of a game like Rust but at least everyone I talked to said the same thing .. it was fun but then you log off and all your crap gets stolen and only the people that can play 24 hours a day rule everything and it just isn't fun after that. I see that being the biggest downfall, people will play for a couple months then only the most hardcore will own everything and people will just give up out of frustration.
Look how much people complain even here at even the idea that raiders might have better gear than a casual, I don't think people have thick enough skin to play these types of games in mass numbers.0 -
Delith✭✭✭✭
http://steamcharts.com/
Oh look. It seems they do, and you're still wrong.
Nice try, though. Keep living in your bubble, carebears. It's poppin' this year whether you want it or not, and there is NOTHING you can do about it.4 -
MonkeyAssassin24✭✭✭smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »
I'm not questioning that it is in the minorty, I'm just challenging the 5% number. It seems lower than I would have guesstimated.
Yeah?
Try 0.5% that would be more precise.
5% who would play long term on an full loot server? No way.
For a month or two. For the thrill maybe. After the "shard" is opened to test it out.
You're very wrong.
Most of the people in this thread are. You guys are going to have a bad time over the next year when the sandbox MMOs start dropping. You really are.
And honestly? I cannot wait. You will see how it feels to have been ignored, like us who enjoyed vanilla UO have been ignored for the past decade, in favor of hand holding gear grinds.
Guess what? They're failing. They'll continue to fail, because everyone has already done this before, and now we're bored.
I have work to do now. Enjoy the thread. But remember: You're wrong. $50 million in donations to Star Citizen is just the tip of the iceberg for how bad people want emergent gameplay and true freedom in a game world. We're just getting started.
Prepare to be killed, looted, cooked, and eaten.
People like you who think they can predict the future crack me up. You mean all those vanilla UO players who gamed during an era where gamin was nowhere near as big of a market as today? Look I love the nostalgic rose color of late 90s and early 2000s gaming as much as anyone but the fact of the matter is that anyone who claims to know what the next year or so of gaming holds, or the future of gaming (settle down JD) in general, are usually the ones who end up having a bad time. Would I love a complete open world and freedom game? Yeah probably. Will it shatter the norm of modern gaming? Doubtful. Just look at television...people want the same crap with different settings. One year will not make a difference my friend, though it could be a first step, the patience of today's gaming industry rarely allows for slow transitions.
Also this thread has derailed into a suggestion that would never ever make it live into this game to a debate on the wave of future gaming.On second thought, let's not go to the forums. 'Tis a silly place.1 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
http://steamcharts.com/
Oh look. It seems they do, and you're still wrong.
Nice try, though. Keep living in your bubble, carebears. It's poppin' this year whether you want it or not, and there is NOTHING you can do about it.
Well there is something we can do - we can choose not to buy that kind of crap and you don't get to play with us. Have fun with the 0.5%
Oh and thanks for linking us to a page full of fps single player not even pvp non-subscription games ¯\_(ツ)_/¯Edited by babylon on July 23, 2014 5:04PM3 -
Rosveen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
You are bored. Are you everyone? I don't think so.
Guess what? They're failing. They'll continue to fail, because everyone has already done this before, and now we're bored.smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »
I'm not questioning that it is in the minorty, I'm just challenging the 5% number. It seems lower than I would have guesstimated.
Yeah?
Try 0.5% that would be more precise.
5% who would play long term on an full loot server? No way.
For a month or two. For the thrill maybe. After the "shard" is opened to test it out.
I wouldn't have anything against a full-loot Cyrodiil campaign, but I'd never play in it. Full-loot in PvE? If it's even possible, it's so much redesigning for... almost no gain at all. Pointless.0 -
Tubben✭✭✭smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »
I'm not questioning that it is in the minorty, I'm just challenging the 5% number. It seems lower than I would have guesstimated.
Yeah?
Try 0.5% that would be more precise.
5% who would play long term on an full loot server? No way.
For a month or two. For the thrill maybe. After the "shard" is opened to test it out.
You're very wrong.
Most of the people in this thread are. You guys are going to have a bad time over the next year when the sandbox MMOs start dropping. You really are.
And honestly? I cannot wait. You will see how it feels to have been ignored, like us who enjoyed vanilla UO have been ignored for the past decade, in favor of hand holding gear grinds.
Guess what? They're failing. They'll continue to fail, because everyone has already done this before, and now we're bored.
I have work to do now. Enjoy the thread. But remember: You're wrong. $50 million in donations to Star Citizen is just the tip of the iceberg for how bad people want emergent gameplay and true freedom in a game world. We're just getting started.
Prepare to be killed, looted, cooked, and eaten.
I am not wrong. You mean games like https://www.wizardrythegame.com/
A game with item loot and possible permadeath ?Wizardry Online is the most hardcore fantasy MMO ever created. The difficulty level is insane. The dungeons are brutal. There is no auto-healing. You will earn your levels. Your crimes taint your soul. Your allies could betray you at any moment. And when you die, you die forever. Are you ready for the challenge?
Oh, yes last day before they close the server is the end of this month. Because that many people wanted that kind of gameplay.
Beside Eve, you will not see an successful MMO (>500k subscriber) with full item loot, full pvp (means no one can hide from pvp, since everyone is pvp flagged) and maybe even possible permadeath.
And even in Eve it's pretty hard to get really killed and podded, you can avoid zones where the pvp happens. You are not forced to leave concord area for your whole live. no need to be in null-sec areas.
So no, i am not very wrong. There will allways some kind of pvp to cater the pvp crowd. But not in the extent you think.
And i dont know why people allways come with Vanilla UO. At this time people didnt have many choices. So they played UO. But the majority hated the ganker squads.
But since i dont have an crystal ball, like you i think, all i said are only speculationsEdited by Tubben on July 23, 2014 5:05PM0 -
briandivisionb16_ESO✭✭✭✭Hi
Ugh it's hard to get a constructive comment amongst all this unneccesary rage, over-quoting and ***.
However, if anyone even bothers to sift through it, and goes this far into the thread, what I'd like to see is a consensual 1v1 duel system with full loot, catering to the hardcore, to the adrenaline seekers, or those who want to gamble with their gear. Aye, that would definitely add a spark to PvP.
..Must remember not to play drunk if this comes in! :P All consensual ofc - no harm. At all.
If your group is bigger than 6 members gain 75% damage reduction.
Write this on the back of your box and see how many sales you get!
You won't get any new PvP players until this archaic AoE crap is fixed.
I for one won't resub until:
1.) You fix lag.
2.) You remove AOE caps we voted against.
3.) 12 months have passed (this is how long we've waited for you to 'get with it')[/b]2 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭Do you mind letting me know what lotto numbers will win tonight since you have a perfect vision of the future?2
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Delith✭✭✭✭smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »
I'm not questioning that it is in the minorty, I'm just challenging the 5% number. It seems lower than I would have guesstimated.
Yeah?
Try 0.5% that would be more precise.
5% who would play long term on an full loot server? No way.
For a month or two. For the thrill maybe. After the "shard" is opened to test it out.
You're very wrong.
Most of the people in this thread are. You guys are going to have a bad time over the next year when the sandbox MMOs start dropping. You really are.
And honestly? I cannot wait. You will see how it feels to have been ignored, like us who enjoyed vanilla UO have been ignored for the past decade, in favor of hand holding gear grinds.
Guess what? They're failing. They'll continue to fail, because everyone has already done this before, and now we're bored.
I have work to do now. Enjoy the thread. But remember: You're wrong. $50 million in donations to Star Citizen is just the tip of the iceberg for how bad people want emergent gameplay and true freedom in a game world. We're just getting started.
Prepare to be killed, looted, cooked, and eaten.
I am not wrong. You mean games like https://www.wizardrythegame.com/
A game with item loot and possible permadeath ?Wizardry Online is the most hardcore fantasy MMO ever created. The difficulty level is insane. The dungeons are brutal. There is no auto-healing. You will earn your levels. Your crimes taint your soul. Your allies could betray you at any moment. And when you die, you die forever. Are you ready for the challenge?
Oh, yes last day before they close the server is the end of this month. Because that many people wanted that kind of gameplay.
Beside Eve, you will not see an successful MMO (>500k subscriber) with full item loot, full pvp (means no one can hide from pvp, since everyone is pvp flagged) and maybe even possible permadeath.
And even in Eve it's pretty hard to get really killed and podded, you can avoid zones where the pvp happens. You are not forced to leave concord area for your whole live. no need to be in null-sec areas.
So no, i am not very wrong. There will allways some kind of pvp to cater the pvp crowd. But not in the extent you think.
And i dont know why people allways come with Vanilla UO. At this time people didnt have many choices. So they played UO. But the majority hated the ganker squads.
But since i dont have an crystal ball, like you i think, all i said are only speculations
You picked a terrible game as an example, and by transitive properties, made a terrible example.
Thanks for wasting everyone's time.0 -
Rosveen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
Uhm, which game on this list is an MMO?
http://steamcharts.com/
Oh look. It seems they do, and you're still wrong.
Nice try, though. Keep living in your bubble, carebears. It's poppin' this year whether you want it or not, and there is NOTHING you can do about it.
2 -
Delith✭✭✭✭
If you don't think video games can instill human qualities in the participants, you have no business passing any judgment on any video game in history whatsoever.
There's a reason games have turned into mindless gear grinds alongside western cultures wild and uninhibited downward spiral into entitlement.
You're just too stupid to see the correlation, and that's not my problem.Edited by Delith on July 23, 2014 5:08PM3 -
Delith✭✭✭✭
You are bored. Are you everyone? I don't think so.
Guess what? They're failing. They'll continue to fail, because everyone has already done this before, and now we're bored.smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »
I'm not questioning that it is in the minorty, I'm just challenging the 5% number. It seems lower than I would have guesstimated.
Yeah?
Try 0.5% that would be more precise.
5% who would play long term on an full loot server? No way.
For a month or two. For the thrill maybe. After the "shard" is opened to test it out.
I wouldn't have anything against a full-loot Cyrodiil campaign, but I'd never play in it. Full-loot in PvE? If it's even possible, it's so much redesigning for... almost no gain at all. Pointless.
The failure of every WoW-like MMO to gain any where NEAR as much traction as WoW is indicative of the truth of my claims.
You're just angry that they're accurate, so you're lashing out. ^_~0 -
Delith✭✭✭✭
http://steamcharts.com/
Oh look. It seems they do, and you're still wrong.
Nice try, though. Keep living in your bubble, carebears. It's poppin' this year whether you want it or not, and there is NOTHING you can do about it.
Well there is something we can do - we can choose not to buy that kind of crap and you don't get to play with us. Have fun with the 0.5%
Oh and thanks for linking us to a page full of fps single player not even pvp non-subscription games ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
CS:GO, DOTA 2, DayZ, Rust, Unturned, Team Fortress 2 are single player and non-PVP?
You have some Googling to do.2 -
Delith✭✭✭✭This game will never have that, if you want that go play darkfall
Darkfall is a *** game with *** developers.
The problem with people like you is that you cannot see the difference between a half assed sandbox made by developers who have no idea what they are doing, and one made by triple a developers with a huge budget on the level of TESO.
You're comparing two things that have no business being compared, because you're lazy and ignorant, and just want to be right. 0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
zzz games for kids.
http://steamcharts.com/
Oh look. It seems they do, and you're still wrong.
Nice try, though. Keep living in your bubble, carebears. It's poppin' this year whether you want it or not, and there is NOTHING you can do about it.
Well there is something we can do - we can choose not to buy that kind of crap and you don't get to play with us. Have fun with the 0.5%
Oh and thanks for linking us to a page full of fps single player not even pvp non-subscription games ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
CS:GO, DOTA 2, DayZ, Rust, Unturned, Team Fortress 2 are single player and non-PVP?
You have some Googling to do.
0 -
Delith✭✭✭✭
zzz games for kids.
http://steamcharts.com/
Oh look. It seems they do, and you're still wrong.
Nice try, though. Keep living in your bubble, carebears. It's poppin' this year whether you want it or not, and there is NOTHING you can do about it.
Well there is something we can do - we can choose not to buy that kind of crap and you don't get to play with us. Have fun with the 0.5%
Oh and thanks for linking us to a page full of fps single player not even pvp non-subscription games ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
CS:GO, DOTA 2, DayZ, Rust, Unturned, Team Fortress 2 are single player and non-PVP?
You have some Googling to do.
Being wrong must be really hard for you.
Have a nice one!0 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭
If you don't think video games can instill human qualities in the participants, you have no business passing any judgment on any video game in history whatsoever.
There's a reason games have turned into mindless gear grinds alongside western cultures wild and uninhibited downward spiral into entitlement.
You're just too stupid to see the correlation, and that's not my problem.
If all else fails go straight to personal attacks! I'm sure that has nothing to do with the downward spiral .. lol2 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
zzz games for kids.
http://steamcharts.com/
Oh look. It seems they do, and you're still wrong.
Nice try, though. Keep living in your bubble, carebears. It's poppin' this year whether you want it or not, and there is NOTHING you can do about it.
Well there is something we can do - we can choose not to buy that kind of crap and you don't get to play with us. Have fun with the 0.5%
Oh and thanks for linking us to a page full of fps single player not even pvp non-subscription games ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
CS:GO, DOTA 2, DayZ, Rust, Unturned, Team Fortress 2 are single player and non-PVP?
You have some Googling to do.
Being wrong must be really hard for you.
Have a nice one!
I'm not wrong there, they're kiddie games.1 -
Rosveen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
I'm not angry.
You are bored. Are you everyone? I don't think so.
Guess what? They're failing. They'll continue to fail, because everyone has already done this before, and now we're bored.smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »
I'm not questioning that it is in the minorty, I'm just challenging the 5% number. It seems lower than I would have guesstimated.
Yeah?
Try 0.5% that would be more precise.
5% who would play long term on an full loot server? No way.
For a month or two. For the thrill maybe. After the "shard" is opened to test it out.
I wouldn't have anything against a full-loot Cyrodiil campaign, but I'd never play in it. Full-loot in PvE? If it's even possible, it's so much redesigning for... almost no gain at all. Pointless.
The failure of every WoW-like MMO to gain any where NEAR as much traction as WoW is indicative of the truth of my claims.
You're just angry that they're accurate, so you're lashing out. ^_~
To think any WoW clone would reach WoW sub numbers was folly. But this is not a failure, those that survived are making a profit. Don't get me wrong though, I agree that we don't need more clones. I just don't think full loot, permadeath and whatever else people are trying to drag out of long dead MMOs is the way to go.
Now that's ignorant.
zzz games for kids.
http://steamcharts.com/
Oh look. It seems they do, and you're still wrong.
Nice try, though. Keep living in your bubble, carebears. It's poppin' this year whether you want it or not, and there is NOTHING you can do about it.
Well there is something we can do - we can choose not to buy that kind of crap and you don't get to play with us. Have fun with the 0.5%
Oh and thanks for linking us to a page full of fps single player not even pvp non-subscription games ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
CS:GO, DOTA 2, DayZ, Rust, Unturned, Team Fortress 2 are single player and non-PVP?
You have some Googling to do.
2 -
Innocente✭✭✭✭Well, since there are no shard servers in ESO, it is never going to happen as you describe.
But, how about this:
When the new Justice System is in place, if a Criminal is killed by a Guard player, the Guard player can take all the Criminal's stuff! Conversely, if the Guard player happens to be killed by the Criminal, the Criminal player can take all the Guard player's stuff!
Real PvP consequences for the PvP lovers out there! Won't that be fun? The chance to lose all your Epic and Legendary gear! It is what you have always said that you wanted, so campaign for it!1 -
MonkeyAssassin24✭✭✭
I'm not angry.
You are bored. Are you everyone? I don't think so.
Guess what? They're failing. They'll continue to fail, because everyone has already done this before, and now we're bored.smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »
I'm not questioning that it is in the minorty, I'm just challenging the 5% number. It seems lower than I would have guesstimated.
Yeah?
Try 0.5% that would be more precise.
5% who would play long term on an full loot server? No way.
For a month or two. For the thrill maybe. After the "shard" is opened to test it out.
I wouldn't have anything against a full-loot Cyrodiil campaign, but I'd never play in it. Full-loot in PvE? If it's even possible, it's so much redesigning for... almost no gain at all. Pointless.
The failure of every WoW-like MMO to gain any where NEAR as much traction as WoW is indicative of the truth of my claims.
You're just angry that they're accurate, so you're lashing out. ^_~
To think any WoW clone would reach WoW sub numbers was folly. But this is not a failure, those that survived are making a profit. Don't get me wrong though, I agree that we don't need more clones. I just don't think full loot, permadeath and whatever else people are trying to drag out of long dead MMOs is the way to go.
Now that's ignorant.
zzz games for kids.
http://steamcharts.com/
Oh look. It seems they do, and you're still wrong.
Nice try, though. Keep living in your bubble, carebears. It's poppin' this year whether you want it or not, and there is NOTHING you can do about it.
Well there is something we can do - we can choose not to buy that kind of crap and you don't get to play with us. Have fun with the 0.5%
Oh and thanks for linking us to a page full of fps single player not even pvp non-subscription games ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
CS:GO, DOTA 2, DayZ, Rust, Unturned, Team Fortress 2 are single player and non-PVP?
You have some Googling to do.
Completely this. Claiming this type of gameplay will make a comeback to the forefront is laughable at best, it will remain a trend in niche gaming with small cult followings. Blame the new era of gamers, blame Bush, blame Canada, blame whoever you want but it will never happen. Gaming can trend towards open-world absolute freedom but will never succeed at 100% freedom, there are too many keyboard commando's who would only ever seek to grief others all the time. The hardcore aspects that a few people in this thread wish to have again just won't cater enough to a majority of people to make the AAA companies go for it.On second thought, let's not go to the forums. 'Tis a silly place.1 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭You can't argue logic with someone who has a perfectly accurate crystal ball to tell the future with. You are all in for a rude awakening!!!1
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ZOS_AlanGadminThis discussion has gotten quite heated, and rather inflammatory. Please remember to keep debate civil, and disagreement constructive. It's perfectly acceptable to discuss PvP ideas like "full loot," but this topic needs to cool off and get back on topic.
If problems persist, those who continue these issues may be warned.Forum Rules | Promoting Constructive Discussion | Code of Conduct | Terms of Service | Help Site
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