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Bank space is limited? Why!
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kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭The real reason has nothing to do with the game but it is database limitations. They can't have an infinitely growing database and have it work quickly. Where they screwed up is having such an absurd amount of mats to deal with. If you do all the crafting and keep one stack of every mat it would take more than all the bank slots you can even buy, and that is assuming you don't keep anything other than crafting mats.0 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Laerania_ESO wrote: »- LotRO in a couple of hours create a free account = 2 characters x 45 slots + 120 personal bank slots; at lvl 15 standard house with chest upgradable up to 60 slots.
- Tibia (2D game) has unlimited store space as long as the player own a house. Free accounts with 1k slots in each city depot. I'm talking of thousands of items.
- Rift, personal vault 32 slots + 8 x Bag (biggest bag is 32 slots)
5 characters are enough to make a guild and get access to a guild bank with 105 slots per tab.
- SWTOR 80 inventory slots + cargo hold 80 x 5 bays per character.
The list of F2P games with more inventory and storage space available than ESO is very long. How can you people still have guts to defend this?
Not defending ZoS, but I am surprised you don't see the connection between "F2P" and the "magical" option they give, to purchase the enlarged bank space with real life cash.
Or to buy it with in game gold but it requires heaps of it so most just buy it with real cash.
Vaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO2 -
purple-magicb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭They need larger stack sizes for craft mats. Crafters really have to shell out for bank space.I don't comment here often but when I do, I get [snip]0 -
Logan9a✭✭✭Fairydragon3 wrote: »in what MMO is there unlimited bank space?
Hoping this is the first one that breaks the mold and does something more unique.
But if people are paying (alot!) for bank space, I'm not sure what possible objection could be had. Money sinks are good.
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indytims_ESO✭✭✭✭Wow... if 'inventory management' is sooooo difficult for some people, maybe you're playing the wrong game.
Inventory management isn't done for you, nor do you have the luxury of hoarding. No, I take that back. You CAN hoard. You just have to be selective in what you hoard.
And that's the way it should be.
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kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭Fairydragon3 wrote: »in what MMO is there unlimited bank space?
What MMO has like 400 different crafting mats, 50 trophies and allowed you to use every type of armor and weapon?
The only one I could think of is SWG and they gave you a large bank, allowed you to have10 houses that each could store like 200 items. Even in SWG to get as many crafting mats as they have here you would have to be keeping every crappy mat you would never bother to use.5 -
Logan9a✭✭✭I'm just hoping the creators are going with "Play the game as you want" rather than "People who are playing differently than me are clearly doing it wrong".1
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kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭indytims_ESO wrote: »Wow... if 'inventory management' is sooooo difficult for some people, maybe you're playing the wrong game.
Inventory management isn't done for you, nor do you have the luxury of hoarding. No, I take that back. You CAN hoard. You just have to be selective in what you hoard.
And that's the way it should be.
So people who want to be crafters are just playing the game wrong? There are more crafting mats than available bank spaces.1 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭As it stands now, I can't:
Keep any trophies
Keep any Treasure Maps
Keep any Armor set pieces around long enough to wear a complete set (3 maybe, 5 forget about it)
Store anything for research later
I have plenty of storage, I have 3 characters and 4 mules. The characters all have 100 slots or near to it, the mules all have 60, and my bank has 110. All my mules are full, my characters are constantly shuffling things around to make room for weapons and armor to deconstruct or research or just sell.
My characters are limited to two crafting professions each, but as it stands now, I can't efficiently run my characters and have the crafting materials at hand to make things for my friends or alts or just to sell. I have to choose between loot storage and crafting storage. Sure, I can move things around, but why should I have to?
I spend huge amounts of time managing my inventory and not playing the game. TES has always been a series that encourages collecting things, unique items, unique armors and weapons, and now we have trophies. Why have them if all I do is destroy them as soon as I get them? I can't be collector in this game.Edited by Nestor on July 22, 2014 2:23PMEnjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"3 -
Robotukas✭✭✭
When you find a harddrive that does not get more expensive with increasing capacity and servers that costs the same wheter they service 100 thousend request per second or a 1 Billion, tell us.Why would any rational person put a limit on bank space you can buy?
It is one of the few gold sinks in this game.
After reaching 240 spaces in the bank no more?
I would love to see how they broke the rules of Physics to archieve that.
They cannot offer more bank space at the current time. Too high cost in scaling the servers up.
The limit of bankspace is not the main issues anyway.
That you need that much bank space, is the issue.
Betwen Crafting Materials and Trophies the needed inventory space got a bit bigger then originally planned.
I am pretty sure they are putting of a "Jewelry" crafting skill until they got thier solution implemented. No point adding even more inventory sink while there is already too much.
Once they found a feasible way to store this data without too much extra server infrastrcuture, the bank and inventory space avalible will propably be appropirate.
Don't buy a game that early if you want it fully polished. If you do anyway:
Your choices. Your consequences. Welcome to the world of the Grown Ups.
Well why all items have to take space? In GW2 crafting items are seperated from bank, pets also are seperated from bank and inventory. I don't like what some ZOS people are so limitless with ideas and inspiration. This game made in 2014 and still they are using old inventory and bank system. This how you show to world how lazy and ... you are. What's why you game had so low score and earn few rewards. You bank and inventory system similar to small project games.Edited by Robotukas on July 22, 2014 3:40PM0 -
gunplummer✭✭✭The problem with the inventory management is not the number of slots its how you access the banks. Having to log in and out to shuffle stuff between characters is time consuming and frustrating. If you could view all of your character inventory at the same time and drag and drop things easily there would be a lot less complaining. Why not use a tab system for armor and weapon types and mats based on craft skills? The inventory setup is a mess.
Stack numbers are also a major hassle. Enchantment is by far the hardest skill to improve, yet most runes only stack to 20. As a previous post said why not 1000 per stacks?
Another problem is trait research. I have no problem with the length of time it takes to research, but when you have traits just sitting in your bank they can really stack up. Some traits can be difficult to find so when you do you hold on to them. It took me 2 months to find defending for shields.
Additionally, why do maps, recipes, and motifs take up inventory space couldn't they set them up like the books are?
The 2 greatest things they did are no arrows and no weight on items. I do miss the different types of arrows, but I can do without the extra research time and mats.
Bottom line is whether you agree with the current system or me for that matter there is no denying that there needs to be some serious thought and changes put into inventory system.1 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭How about all these awesome trophies I keep getting? I am keeping them in the hopes that someday I will have a house to display them in, but for now they just sit there in my inventory taking up space. Why do they take up space? I have no idea. They should be like the quest items.:trollin:0 -
Hamfast✭✭✭✭✭Personally, I would love to see a 4 tab bank system, if they want it to be a money sink, make each tab expandable at a cost...
Tab 1 - Personal Bank - Items here are only available to the individual character but only in the bank.
Tab 2 - Joint Bank - Items here are available to every character on the account but only in the bank.
Tab 3 - Crafting Bank - All Craft Materials deposited in the bank go here, they are available to all characters on the account both at the bank and at crafting locations.
Tab 4 - Trophies and Vanity Pets (mobile Trophies) open to all characters on the account, only at the bank.
As an altaholic with every crafting skill (not all on the same character) I understand that if I found an item on one character that would benefit another character, I could drop it in the bank (Joint tab) but to deconstruct it, I would have to withdraw it from the bank and carry it to the crafting area, I could make things without carrying the materials, but not destruct things, raw components would fall into the Crafting Tab.
If the price for Bank Slots was set so that Joint and Crafting slots cost somewhat more then personal and Trophy slots and items fill by type...
Only Trophy items can go in the Trophy Bank, if it's full they go into the Joint slots then the personal...
Only Crafting Materials can go into the Crafting Bank, if it's full they go into the Joint then Personal banks
if the Joint Bank is full and the item is neither crafting or trophy, then you can only put it in the personal bank...
if everything is full... well, then you have worse problems then even I do
If each tab started with say 40 slots, the cost to expand is 100/200 gold for the first 10 extra slots, second 10 slots are 300/600, followed by larger and larger values topping at say 10,000 and 30,000...
I think I had better put my pipe down now, this dream will never happen...Of all the things I have lost, I miss my mind the most...3 -
Vunter✭✭✭Uhm.. Why would you need more than 240 spaces, really.
You know you can upgrade your char carry capacity, right?
And you can buy a horse for this too?
I keep all the trophies of quests AND costumes. I have 2 character, one for crafting and one for playing the game.
So.. Crafting mats go in the first one's inventory (except for gems and upgrading items, i keep them in the bank), everything else on the other.
In the bank i keep also weapons and armor for researching trait
When I finish my inventory space, i just swap to my crafting char and it will research or deconstruct some items, then i'm good to go.
I have 140 carry capacity per char, thanks to the imperial horses fed only for this.
(imperial horse = common horse, but free :P).
I have 110 spaces in the bank. One char is VR5, the crafting one is 43, but i keep on it the VR crafting mats too.3 -
Korinth✭✭✭Another classic "I have no problem so there is no problem" post. An even better specimen than the earlier one, even.
You have two vet level toons that you craft for and your bank is full? There's the first indication of a problem right there.
Not everyone only wants to play vet levels. Or two toons. If you had 7 toons of various levels that you wanted to craft for, your bank situation would be a lot different, wouldn't it?
In fact, this sums up the whole problem.....This ridiculous inventory system is supposed to limit crafting all crafts. But it doesn't. What it does limit is people just being able to play the game with the 8 character slots that they pay for. If your bank is full that means every new char has to always carry everything. It's absurd.
You don't care to keep your trophies and destroy them? Good for you. Not everyone wants to destroy unique items they've earned.
The items and gear "you will never use" is easy to sort out when you limit yourself to two of eight characters.
I'm happy that it works for you. But to present yourself as typical of the hundreds of thousands of people playing this game or to suggest this is how everyone should Olay simply because of bank limitations is ridiculous.
QFT..
I have a VR 3, 1 lvl 40 and a lvl 35, and THREE mules. The problem is when leveling multiple toons of different levels, you WANT all the crafting stuff for most levels. If you level all at the same time (both Crafting levels, and level) this isn't an issue as you just throw away the crafting mats you don't need.
Again I remind people TESO was sold on the premise "play the way you want to play". I like crafting, I like having new toons of various levels (get bored easily). Current bank system does not allow this.
Couple the bank issue with the "there is only one way to have skills that will work to get you thru vet content" baloney...seems more like "play the way you want to play, as long as it fits the devs ideas of how you should play".
Edited by Korinth on July 22, 2014 3:47PM2 -
Robotukas✭✭✭Personally, I would love to see a 4 tab bank system, if they want it to be a money sink, make each tab expandable at a cost...
Tab 1 - Personal Bank - Items here are only available to the individual character but only in the bank.
Tab 2 - Joint Bank - Items here are available to every character on the account but only in the bank.
Tab 3 - Crafting Bank - All Craft Materials deposited in the bank go here, they are available to all characters on the account both at the bank and at crafting locations.
Tab 4 - Trophies and Vanity Pets (mobile Trophies) open to all characters on the account, only at the bank.
As an altaholic with every crafting skill (not all on the same character) I understand that if I found an item on one character that would benefit another character, I could drop it in the bank (Joint tab) but to deconstruct it, I would have to withdraw it from the bank and carry it to the crafting area, I could make things without carrying the materials, but not destruct things, raw components would fall into the Crafting Tab.
If the price for Bank Slots was set so that Joint and Crafting slots cost somewhat more then personal and Trophy slots and items fill by type...
Only Trophy items can go in the Trophy Bank, if it's full they go into the Joint slots then the personal...
Only Crafting Materials can go into the Crafting Bank, if it's full they go into the Joint then Personal banks
if the Joint Bank is full and the item is neither crafting or trophy, then you can only put it in the personal bank...
if everything is full... well, then you have worse problems then even I do
If each tab started with say 40 slots, the cost to expand is 100/200 gold for the first 10 extra slots, second 10 slots are 300/600, followed by larger and larger values topping at say 10,000 and 30,000...
I think I had better put my pipe down now, this dream will never happen...
Slots it takes more server resource. We don't need so much tabs. One tab is bank, another tab is for crafting materials, trophies and pets. All these tabs are cross account. Idea is it show all trophies, materials and pets but they are all in grey colour. When put materials in to bank so material icon became colorful and show numbers how much it is. Crafting materials, trophies and pet (better will like unlockable skill) you can deposit from anywhere. Now I use my character or guild as bank. This is horrible idea that ZOS made.0 -
Mightylink✭✭✭
Guild Wars 2 isn't unlimited but it does it very very well, all crafting materials go into its own window which stacks up to 255 each which leaves your main bank free for just armor and weapons and special items.Fairydragon3 wrote: »in what MMO is there unlimited bank space?
Mightylink - Nord Battlemage (Sorcerer)1 -
Robotukas✭✭✭Mightylink wrote: »
Guild Wars 2 isn't unlimited but it does it very very well, all crafting materials go into its own window which stacks up to 255 each which leaves your main bank free for just armor and weapons and special items.Fairydragon3 wrote: »in what MMO is there unlimited bank space?
GW2 extended to 1000 with three upgrades but is not free. You spend money more in ESO than in GW2 and what you get? ESO isn't worth subscription, they didn't use futures that it comes in 2014. They still made game with old system. You can't compare ESO and GW2 at all. In ESO I don't see nothing impressive comparing with past.Edited by Robotukas on July 22, 2014 4:29PM1 -
Catches_the_Sun✭✭✭✭✭Akiainavas wrote: »And why would anyone expect an unlimited bank inventory ? Sry but this is a ridiculous idea.
To get to the current max you have to spend something on the order of 800k.
If someone has the means and wants to spend more than that, why limit them? Why would you care one way or the other?
As said before, it just boggles the mind that aside from a few boss fights here and there, the most consistently challenging thing in this game is just keeping the stupid inventory sorted out because some dev thinks it's some kind of check on crafting...In a game that's just ridiculously easy in every other respect.
I'm betting this is a Matt Firor pet project. I have no idea if he was behind similar decisions in DAoC but this smacks of that stupidity. In that game there was no market system for the longest time....when they finally put it in they made it so others part of housing which was very expensive and gold was not as easy to come by as it is here. If you played certain classes you were either extremely limited in your ability to farm cash, if you could at all or you had to roll alts to do it. Basically, participation in the marketplace as a seller was a luxury. And everybody scratched their heads as to why the economy always sucked. Meanwhile, there was a limit on the amount of gold an individual character could have, ostensibly to combat gold sellers. The list goes on and on...
And it's like deja vu all over again, here. And just as ridiculous.
Heck, at least in DAoC you had a shared bank, a personal bank, and you could get extra storage in your house. This is just a complete joke.
Yeah, 400 inventory slots just won't do. What in the world are you guys hoarding? Seriously? I don't have my bank close to max yet and I don't even have to try to manage inventory...don't even have to pay attention to it really.
Catches-the-Sun - Argonian Templar - Master Smith, Provisioner, Chemist & Tailor
Valaren Arobone - Dunmer Flamewalker - Master Woodworker, Provisioner, Assassin
Kazahad - Khajiiti Arcane Archer - Master Thief
V'orkten - Redguard Swordmaster
Finnvardr the Frenzied - Werewolf Berzerker1 -
Innocente✭✭✭✭Well, 'unlimited' is probably a stretch. But in a game where there is ONE bank for all the player's characters, it has to be a LOT bigger than what it is. And, a lot cheaper to expand. In addition, certain items, like crafting, trophies, etc. should have their own, dedicated, bank slotting system.
GW2 go this 100% correct. It is to bad ZOS developers never looked outside of the small, constrained box they seem to live in.0 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Catches_the_Sun wrote: »
Yeah, 400 inventory slots just won't do. What in the world are you guys hoarding? Seriously? I don't have my bank close to max yet and I don't even have to try to manage inventory...don't even have to pay attention to it really.
I am surprised myself how it fills up. Each of my characters I play and craft with have about 30 to 40 slots free, which is really not enough to go on a loot run through a dungeon. I can pare that down so only about 20 slots are used when I set out, so that gives me two trips through a Public Dungeon or a few solo dungeons until I am full and have to go back home to the bank/merchant/crafting station. Just to note, these 3 characters have upgraded bags and horse bags.
My Mules are all full, two of them with Provisioning Mats, one with Armor/Weapon Mats/One with Alchemy/Enchanting Mats. Note, none of these Mules do any crafting, they just hold the mats for the 3 characters that do craft. Each of these characters can only handle two craft lines each, one tried 3 but the inventory issues were just too much. My mules have upgraded bag slots, just not as much as my main characters. But, I am loathe to spend gold on a character that will get deleted at some point
Now, I don't keep Maps, Trophies or Armor/Weapon Set pieces because I have no room to do so. I do have some crafted armor sets for low level characters to provide to my new characters as they level up, but right now I only have two sets of I had to deconstruct my other sets because of space issues. So, I have to make those sets again and the trait gems for Training (used on the lower level sets) are few and far between.
Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"1 -
Zorrashi✭✭✭✭✭You have 240? What the heck do you even use those spaces for?
I can deal with around 90 bank for all of my crafts (only ditched enchanting) and still have enough space for a few extra full sets of armor and research pieces.
But then, this is all on one character...perhaps it may be a problem if you have an alt. You do have a decent amount of person bag space upgraded right? If you don't have bank space, use bag space.
No person really needs those 240 bank spaces, they just want it. Just manage it a tad bit better. The data space can't be infinite.2 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭Alchemy - 7 solvents and 18 Reagents - 25 base mats
Blacksmithing - 4 upgrade mats, 8 ores, 14 style stones 16 trait stones *8 more if you have a stack of unrefined and refined ores 42 *50 if you keep unrefined and refined which most do
Clothier - 4 upgrade mats, 18 leathers and cloth unrefined, 14 style stones (all shared between crafts) 8 armor traits (shared between blacksmithing) 22 Unique 40 if you keep both refined and unrefined mats
Woodworking - 4 upgrade mats, 9 unrefined woods, shared armor and style traits. 13 unique 21 with both refined and unrefined
Enchanting - 3 apsect runes, 28 potency runes, 17 Essence Rune 48 Runes
Provisioning - I believe 32 different ingredients might be a little off
So say you do all crafting which I do and only keep one stack of each item and no unrefined mats at all. 182 with no duplicates. Now if you are like most people and have unrefined until they get to 10 and refined which keeps you with a stack of both usually because you almost never end up with exactly 10 217 with no duplicates.
So for exactly one stack of all crafting mats including refined and unrefined 217 bank slots.
You start with 60 slots on your person and 60 bank slots ... how is it hard to figure out why this adds up?
Edited by kitsinni on July 22, 2014 4:55PM3 -
Hamfast✭✭✭✭✭Alchemy - 7 solvents and 18 Reagents - 25 base mats
Blacksmithing - 4 upgrade mats, 8 ores, 14 style stones 16 trait stones *8 more if you have a stack of unrefined and refined ores 42 *50 if you keep unrefined and refined which most do
Clothier - 4 upgrade mats, 18 leathers and cloth unrefined, 14 style stones (all shared between crafts) 8 armor traits (shared between blacksmithing) 22 Unique 40 if you keep both refined and unrefined mats
Woodworking - 4 upgrade mats, 9 unrefined woods, shared armor and style traits. 13 unique 21 with both refined and unrefined
Enchanting - 3 apsect runes, 28 potency runes, 17 Essence Rune 48 Runes
Provisioning - I believe 32 different ingredients might be a little off
So say you do all crafting which I do and only keep one stack of each item and no unrefined mats at all. 182 with no duplicates. Now if you are like most people and have unrefined until they get to 10 and refined which keeps you with a stack of both usually because you almost never end up with exactly 10 217 with no duplicates.
So for exactly one stack of all crafting mats including refined and unrefined 217 bank slots.
You start with 60 slots on your person and 60 bank slots ... how is it hard to figure out why this adds up?
there are 19 essence runestones, Lire and 1 other (I am drawing a blank on the name) show up with a ? even if you know them all, they only come from hirelings...Of all the things I have lost, I miss my mind the most...0 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭Alchemy - 7 solvents and 18 Reagents - 25 base mats
Blacksmithing - 4 upgrade mats, 8 ores, 14 style stones 16 trait stones *8 more if you have a stack of unrefined and refined ores 42 *50 if you keep unrefined and refined which most do
Clothier - 4 upgrade mats, 18 leathers and cloth unrefined, 14 style stones (all shared between crafts) 8 armor traits (shared between blacksmithing) 22 Unique 40 if you keep both refined and unrefined mats
Woodworking - 4 upgrade mats, 9 unrefined woods, shared armor and style traits. 13 unique 21 with both refined and unrefined
Enchanting - 3 apsect runes, 28 potency runes, 17 Essence Rune 48 Runes
Provisioning - I believe 32 different ingredients might be a little off
So say you do all crafting which I do and only keep one stack of each item and no unrefined mats at all. 182 with no duplicates. Now if you are like most people and have unrefined until they get to 10 and refined which keeps you with a stack of both usually because you almost never end up with exactly 10 217 with no duplicates.
So for exactly one stack of all crafting mats including refined and unrefined 217 bank slots.
You start with 60 slots on your person and 60 bank slots ... how is it hard to figure out why this adds up?
there are 19 essence runestones, Lire and 1 other (I am drawing a blank on the name) show up with a ? even if you know them all, they only come from hirelings...
Apparently the last two were duplicates and should no longer come from hirelings. They were in one of the last couple patch notes. They had separate names but the same effect as two of the others.0 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Provisioning - I believe 32 different ingredients might be a little off
Close to 90 Provisioning Mats across all the alliances. I did a rough count, it might be more like 96 total
http://tamrieljournal.com/eso-provisioning-ingredients/
True, low level mats don't help high level players. But, low level players can't use high level foods, so if I am going to provide for all my alts, I am going to need some serious space just for Provisioning.
Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"1 -
kitsinni✭✭✭✭✭Provisioning - I believe 32 different ingredients might be a little off
Close to 90 Provisioning Mats across all the alliances. I did a rough count, it might be more like 96 total
http://tamrieljournal.com/eso-provisioning-ingredients/
True, low level mats don't help high level players. But, low level players can't use high level foods, so if I am going to provide for all my alts, I am going to need some serious space just for Provisioning.
Holy crap I guess I was way off. I only collected from one alliance I guess lol. So if you collect one stack of everything for crafting alone that is almost 300 slots.1 -
Obscure✭✭✭✭✭The real reason has nothing to do with the game but it is database limitations. They can't have an infinitely growing database and have it work quickly. Where they screwed up is having such an absurd amount of mats to deal with. If you do all the crafting and keep one stack of every mat it would take more than all the bank slots you can even buy, and that is assuming you don't keep anything other than crafting mats.
Me thinks you aren't that familiar with modern technology. Say each item is 1kb of data, pretty large for a few lines of code, but bare with me on this example. How many kilobytes are in a terabyte? 1 Billion! If you obtained one item every second how long would it take you to reach a terabyte? Roughly 31.7 YEARS!
I have right now inside my PC, purchased for a little under $30, room to store every item I will ever find in ESO even if I found one every second from now until 2046.
No it's not a technological limitation. It's a limitation of the talent, skill, and ability to innovate by a developer. It's a copy and pasted inventory management system that's over 15 years old, from back in a day when data storage was an issue once upon a time. Modern servers and databases move more data in a minute than all stored data in known existence prior to 1990.
Don't blame my precious beautiful tech, it's in no way responsible for ESO's bull *** inventory system.4