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775,000 Subs
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I think it's an ok sub base but I reckon they wanted way over that. The real test is to keep them.Patch 1.2.3 nerfed the game....
Zergballing wrecked pvp......
Now waiting for Camelot Unchained!!2 -
TheBucket✭✭✭✭Im still waiting for all the free to play birds that hover the forums to show up.William Reignes
Magic Nightblade - Rogue Bomber
Creator of Thirsty Thief Build (Retired 1.5)1 -
Tannakaobi✭✭✭✭✭Im still waiting for all the free to play birds that hover the forums to show up.
I think it's these people that generate so much bad publicity, I think it's some delusional attempt to make it free to play so they can play themselves.
Basically, people that want to play, what they think looks like a good game, saying that they do play and that the games sucks.
It would explain the ignorance in much of the bad publicity.3 -
Redlag✭✭✭Tannakaobi wrote: »Im still waiting for all the free to play birds that hover the forums to show up.
I think it's these people that generate so much bad publicity, I think it's some delusional attempt to make it free to play so they can play themselves.
Basically, people that want to play, what they think looks like a good game, saying that they do play and that the games sucks.
It would explain the ignorance in much of the bad publicity.
AHAHAHAHAHAH
[Snip] This game went from crowded to ghostville in the first month.
I think I'm realizing why these people are lying that the game is striving. Theyre most likely involved, alt accounts, and have a tie into the success of console sells.
Anyone who has played this game watched it turn into a ghost town. It is not thriving, the game is horrible, and anytime the devs put some promises on paper they completely screw it up on implementation in a way that no one playing the game appreciates it.
You sir, are trying to defraud people with lies in order to boost console sales.
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Trolling & Baiting]Edited by ZOS_LucasA on July 18, 2014 7:31PM11 -
mutharex✭✭✭✭✭Tannakaobi wrote: »Im still waiting for all the free to play birds that hover the forums to show up.
I think it's these people that generate so much bad publicity, I think it's some delusional attempt to make it free to play so they can play themselves.
Basically, people that want to play, what they think looks like a good game, saying that they do play and that the games sucks.
It would explain the ignorance in much of the bad publicity.
AHAHAHAHAHAH
This game went from crowded to ghostville in the first month.
I think I'm realizing why these people are lying that the game is striving. Theyre most likely involved, alt accounts, and have a tie into the success of console sells.
Anyone who has played this game watched it turn into a ghost town. It is not thriving, the game is horrible, and anytime the devs put some promises on paper they completely screw it up on implementation in a way that no one playing the game appreciates it.
You sir, are trying to defraud people with lies in order to boost console sales.
So they had what? 3 millions in the first month. [Snip]
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Trolling & Baiting]Edited by ZOS_LucasA on July 18, 2014 7:32PM1 -
Tannakaobi✭✭✭✭✭Tannakaobi wrote: »Im still waiting for all the free to play birds that hover the forums to show up.
I think it's these people that generate so much bad publicity, I think it's some delusional attempt to make it free to play so they can play themselves.
Basically, people that want to play, what they think looks like a good game, saying that they do play and that the games sucks.
It would explain the ignorance in much of the bad publicity.
AHAHAHAHAHAH
This game went from crowded to ghostville in the first month.
I think I'm realizing why these people are lying that the game is striving. Theyre most likely involved, alt accounts, and have a tie into the success of console sells.
Anyone who has played this game watched it turn into a ghost town. It is not thriving, the game is horrible, and anytime the devs put some promises on paper they completely screw it up on implementation in a way that no one playing the game appreciates it.
You sir, are trying to defraud people with lies in order to boost console sales.
It's not going to work on this board, everyone here plays ESO, they know that there are no area's like ghostville. Pretty much every zone is full of people, every bank has 20-30 player at anyone time. All villages have people, even in the wild you can't walk for more than a minute without see another player.
The only time there has been few players were in the VR area's, even they have many players these days. Go to any starter zone and you will find you are crowded.
"defraud people with lies"
You crazy fool! Made me laugh though.
Edited by ZOS_LucasA on July 18, 2014 7:20PM12 -
wrlifeboil✭✭✭✭✭ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »For a AAA game, that is bad. really bad.
Take into account a lot of those will be the 3 month subs peeps bought and have already bailed on the game.
The suit's will already be putting together their get out plans which usually consists of a large quick cash grab.
Anything below 1m for AAA game is a VERY bad thing for the gamers also as it means no Investment will be coming from the bean pushers.
UO still has 300k subs.....it's 17 years old now and run from basically a large house. A 3 month old game with 750k? *holds head in shame*
Actually its not that bad. FF14 released on PC PS3 and PS4 and has around 400-500k subs and considered a huge success.
Agreed. If ESO was in the ballpark of 775k subs then I would consider it in an incredibly healthy position.
Yep especially with such a small team of only 250 workers. But also think about this for success. FF11 has lived on around 500k subs worldwide for over 10 years, FF14 has around 500k subs released on 3 systems worldwide and is considered a huge success. Dragon Quest X has 500k subs and only released in Japan.
So if ESO has 775k subs and its only been on PC then consoles will bump that up over a million (After the 3 month mark when the 3 month player base leaves)
Also Like I said I wouldn't take those numbers too seriously since they have no real hardcore number or any reference for where they got their numbers.
If ZOS has 250 employees, at $100k average per employee including taxes, bonuses, pensions, and overhead, etc. they would need $25 million per year just for payroll.
If that 775k number is accurate and represents monthly subscriptions, that is less than I thought (~1 million) but should be extremely healthy enough for new content development.
However, if that number represents total box and digital download sales, that wouldn't be so great.1 -
Dusty5✭✭✭From 4 million hits in beta to 775k subs. As in my other post. WE TOLD YOU SO. ZOS-Bethesda is going bankrupt.7
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Laura✭✭✭✭✭
✭I question how real this is.
If it is i'm surprised its this high to be entirely honest.Edited by Laura on July 18, 2014 7:02PM2 -
If it's true, then that's actually quite a fantastic number. Especially considering how much ESO has gotten drenched in bad publicity.
Agreed 775K is quite a good number and will only grow.....provided they avoid future stupidity like the Wolfhound issueFor the night is dark and full of terrors.3 -
Dekkameron✭✭✭✭✭Maverick827 wrote: »These numbers are below average for a AAA MMO three months out of release. They're not "the end of the world" bad, but to put it into perspective, SWTOR had 1 million more subscribers by this point.
SWTOR at it's peak had 1.2 million. Then dropped 400,000 three months later. Which would make it almost exacvtly the same amount of subs after the same period of time after launch.
So maybe that's not a good example. Or is it?
Edited by Dekkameron on July 18, 2014 7:06PM- Veteran Combat Librarian -0 -
Redlag✭✭✭Tannakaobi wrote: »Tannakaobi wrote: »Im still waiting for all the free to play birds that hover the forums to show up.
I think it's these people that generate so much bad publicity, I think it's some delusional attempt to make it free to play so they can play themselves.
Basically, people that want to play, what they think looks like a good game, saying that they do play and that the games sucks.
It would explain the ignorance in much of the bad publicity.
AHAHAHAHAHAH
That's what you are.. Delusional. This game went from crowded to ghostville in the first month.
I think I'm realizing why these people are lying that the game is striving. Theyre most likely involved, alt accounts, and have a tie into the success of console sells.
Anyone who has played this game watched it turn into a ghost town. It is not thriving, the game is horrible, and anytime the devs put some promises on paper they completely screw it up on implementation in a way that no one playing the game appreciates it.
You sir, are trying to defraud people with lies in order to boost console sales.
It's not going to work on this board, everyone here plays ESO, they know that there are no area's like ghostville. Pretty much every zone is full of people, every bank has 20-30 player at anyone time. All villages have people, even in the wild you can't walk for more than a minute without see another player.
The only time there has been few players were in the VR area's, even they have many players these days. Go to any starter zone and you will find you are crowded.
"defraud people with lies"
You crazy fool! Made me laugh though.
Blatant lies. I played for 3 hours yesterday and ran into a total of 4 other players in VR1 Auridon. It's ghostville.
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Redlag✭✭✭Tannakaobi wrote: »Im still waiting for all the free to play birds that hover the forums to show up.
I think it's these people that generate so much bad publicity, I think it's some delusional attempt to make it free to play so they can play themselves.
Basically, people that want to play, what they think looks like a good game, saying that they do play and that the games sucks.
It would explain the ignorance in much of the bad publicity.
AHAHAHAHAHAH
That's what you are.. Delusional. This game went from crowded to ghostville in the first month.
I think I'm realizing why these people are lying that the game is striving. Theyre most likely involved, alt accounts, and have a tie into the success of console sells.
Anyone who has played this game watched it turn into a ghost town. It is not thriving, the game is horrible, and anytime the devs put some promises on paper they completely screw it up on implementation in a way that no one playing the game appreciates it.
You sir, are trying to defraud people with lies in order to boost console sales.
So they had what? 3 millions in the first month. You sir can't even flame properly
If you believe that this game has 750k subs. Debating anything with you is a waste of my time. You probably think I suck at flaming because I wasn't flaming. I don't come to the forums to "flame".
Edited by Redlag on July 18, 2014 7:10PM0 -
LtCrunch✭✭✭✭✭
✭wrlifeboil wrote: »ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »For a AAA game, that is bad. really bad.
Take into account a lot of those will be the 3 month subs peeps bought and have already bailed on the game.
The suit's will already be putting together their get out plans which usually consists of a large quick cash grab.
Anything below 1m for AAA game is a VERY bad thing for the gamers also as it means no Investment will be coming from the bean pushers.
UO still has 300k subs.....it's 17 years old now and run from basically a large house. A 3 month old game with 750k? *holds head in shame*
Actually its not that bad. FF14 released on PC PS3 and PS4 and has around 400-500k subs and considered a huge success.
Agreed. If ESO was in the ballpark of 775k subs then I would consider it in an incredibly healthy position.
Yep especially with such a small team of only 250 workers. But also think about this for success. FF11 has lived on around 500k subs worldwide for over 10 years, FF14 has around 500k subs released on 3 systems worldwide and is considered a huge success. Dragon Quest X has 500k subs and only released in Japan.
So if ESO has 775k subs and its only been on PC then consoles will bump that up over a million (After the 3 month mark when the 3 month player base leaves)
Also Like I said I wouldn't take those numbers too seriously since they have no real hardcore number or any reference for where they got their numbers.
If ZOS has 250 employees, at $100k average per employee including taxes, bonuses, pensions, and overhead, etc. they would need $25 million per year just for payroll.
If that 775k number is accurate and represents monthly subscriptions, that is less than I thought (~1 million) but should be extremely healthy enough for new content development.
However, if that number represents total box and digital download sales, that wouldn't be so great.
You really don't know what your average game dev makes do you?
NerdSauce GamingLaughs-At-Wounds - Sap tanking since 03/30/14ßrandalf - Light armor tanking since 03/03/15Brandalf Beer-Belly - Tanking drunk since 12/30/162 -
wrlifeboil✭✭✭✭✭daneyulebub17_ESO wrote: »I would be skeptical, but now that the OP posted those numbers, they're in TWO places on the internetz!
They have to be true now!
Market research companies are known for 'massaging' data. For example, I didn't think WoW had over $1 billion in revenues in 2013 based on their their publicly released numbers on subscriptions, mix, financials and the fact that that 2013 was a non-expansion pack year.0 -
wrlifeboil✭✭✭✭✭wrlifeboil wrote: »ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »For a AAA game, that is bad. really bad.
Take into account a lot of those will be the 3 month subs peeps bought and have already bailed on the game.
The suit's will already be putting together their get out plans which usually consists of a large quick cash grab.
Anything below 1m for AAA game is a VERY bad thing for the gamers also as it means no Investment will be coming from the bean pushers.
UO still has 300k subs.....it's 17 years old now and run from basically a large house. A 3 month old game with 750k? *holds head in shame*
Actually its not that bad. FF14 released on PC PS3 and PS4 and has around 400-500k subs and considered a huge success.
Agreed. If ESO was in the ballpark of 775k subs then I would consider it in an incredibly healthy position.
Yep especially with such a small team of only 250 workers. But also think about this for success. FF11 has lived on around 500k subs worldwide for over 10 years, FF14 has around 500k subs released on 3 systems worldwide and is considered a huge success. Dragon Quest X has 500k subs and only released in Japan.
So if ESO has 775k subs and its only been on PC then consoles will bump that up over a million (After the 3 month mark when the 3 month player base leaves)
Also Like I said I wouldn't take those numbers too seriously since they have no real hardcore number or any reference for where they got their numbers.
If ZOS has 250 employees, at $100k average per employee including taxes, bonuses, pensions, and overhead, etc. they would need $25 million per year just for payroll.
If that 775k number is accurate and represents monthly subscriptions, that is less than I thought (~1 million) but should be extremely healthy enough for new content development.
However, if that number represents total box and digital download sales, that wouldn't be so great.
You really don't know what your average game dev makes do you?
Umm, please do tell.0 -
wrlifeboil✭✭✭✭✭Tannakaobi wrote: »Tannakaobi wrote: »Im still waiting for all the free to play birds that hover the forums to show up.
I think it's these people that generate so much bad publicity, I think it's some delusional attempt to make it free to play so they can play themselves.
Basically, people that want to play, what they think looks like a good game, saying that they do play and that the games sucks.
It would explain the ignorance in much of the bad publicity.
AHAHAHAHAHAH
That's what you are.. Delusional. This game went from crowded to ghostville in the first month.
I think I'm realizing why these people are lying that the game is striving. Theyre most likely involved, alt accounts, and have a tie into the success of console sells.
Anyone who has played this game watched it turn into a ghost town. It is not thriving, the game is horrible, and anytime the devs put some promises on paper they completely screw it up on implementation in a way that no one playing the game appreciates it.
You sir, are trying to defraud people with lies in order to boost console sales.
It's not going to work on this board, everyone here plays ESO, they know that there are no area's like ghostville. Pretty much every zone is full of people, every bank has 20-30 player at anyone time. All villages have people, even in the wild you can't walk for more than a minute without see another player.
The only time there has been few players were in the VR area's, even they have many players these days. Go to any starter zone and you will find you are crowded.
"defraud people with lies"
You crazy fool! Made me laugh though.
Blatant lies. I played for 3 hours yesterday and ran into a total of 4 other players in VR1 Auridon. It's ghostville.
It's not ghostville but the banks in VR++ zones don't have many players either.0 -
0
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Samadhi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Tannakaobi wrote: »Tannakaobi wrote: »Im still waiting for all the free to play birds that hover the forums to show up.
I think it's these people that generate so much bad publicity, I think it's some delusional attempt to make it free to play so they can play themselves.
Basically, people that want to play, what they think looks like a good game, saying that they do play and that the games sucks.
It would explain the ignorance in much of the bad publicity.
AHAHAHAHAHAH
That's what you are.. Delusional. This game went from crowded to ghostville in the first month.
I think I'm realizing why these people are lying that the game is striving. Theyre most likely involved, alt accounts, and have a tie into the success of console sells.
Anyone who has played this game watched it turn into a ghost town. It is not thriving, the game is horrible, and anytime the devs put some promises on paper they completely screw it up on implementation in a way that no one playing the game appreciates it.
You sir, are trying to defraud people with lies in order to boost console sales.
It's not going to work on this board, everyone here plays ESO, they know that there are no area's like ghostville. Pretty much every zone is full of people, every bank has 20-30 player at anyone time. All villages have people, even in the wild you can't walk for more than a minute without see another player.
The only time there has been few players were in the VR area's, even they have many players these days. Go to any starter zone and you will find you are crowded.
"defraud people with lies"
You crazy fool! Made me laugh though.
Blatant lies. I played for 3 hours yesterday and ran into a total of 4 other players in VR1 Auridon. It's ghostville.
I logged in and ported to VR1 Auridon just now and saw 5 other players actively at keyboard before I even moved away from the wayshrine.
traveling between the wayshrine and the bank, I passed 3 other players.
In the bank there were 4 other players.
The numbers are not astronomical, but there is player presence."If you want others to be happy, practice compassion. If you want to be happy, practice compassion." -- the 14th Dalai Lama
Wisdom is doing Now that which benefits you later.
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DungeonGrind✭✭✭Bottom line is sustainability. Sorry no links to show you the private ZoS financials.0 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭8 years ago, an MMO with 100k subs was considered very successful. ESO has a bigger budget but still even with 750k subs, that still over $11 Mil per month. Not bad if you ask me.
So if the numbers are right or wrong I don't think it matters, the game is doing good. It's going to be doing good for at least the next 8+ years. Be it sub or F2P, it's not going anywhere.
8 years ago a MMO did not cost $200M to make.
Heck, there had been 1 MMO that was made by *1* person alone!Vaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO0 -
Maverick827✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Those numbers are incorrect.Dekkameron wrote: »Maverick827 wrote: »These numbers are below average for a AAA MMO three months out of release. They're not "the end of the world" bad, but to put it into perspective, SWTOR had 1 million more subscribers by this point.
SWTOR at it's peak had 1.2 million. Then dropped 400,000 three months later. Which would make it almost exacvtly the same amount of subs after the same period of time after launch.
So maybe that's not a good example. Or is it?
SWTOR had 1.7 million two and a half months after release and 1.3 million five months after release. It didn't take until July, about eight months after release, for the numbers to fall below 1 million, which caused EA to decide to make the game go free to play.1 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭wrlifeboil wrote: »It's not ghostville but the banks in VR++ zones don't have many players either.
VR9+ can't do anything but solo...
Basically since VR5-6 when I find 2-3 guys we quickly do all the zone's bosses, dolmens and public dungeon because we know that we are not going to have a similar chance for days afterwards.Edited by Vahrokh on July 18, 2014 7:35PMVaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO0 -
Tannakaobi wrote: »Tannakaobi wrote: »Im still waiting for all the free to play birds that hover the forums to show up.
I think it's these people that generate so much bad publicity, I think it's some delusional attempt to make it free to play so they can play themselves.
Basically, people that want to play, what they think looks like a good game, saying that they do play and that the games sucks.
It would explain the ignorance in much of the bad publicity.
AHAHAHAHAHAH
That's what you are.. Delusional. This game went from crowded to ghostville in the first month.
I think I'm realizing why these people are lying that the game is striving. Theyre most likely involved, alt accounts, and have a tie into the success of console sells.
Anyone who has played this game watched it turn into a ghost town. It is not thriving, the game is horrible, and anytime the devs put some promises on paper they completely screw it up on implementation in a way that no one playing the game appreciates it.
You sir, are trying to defraud people with lies in order to boost console sales.
It's not going to work on this board, everyone here plays ESO, they know that there are no area's like ghostville. Pretty much every zone is full of people, every bank has 20-30 player at anyone time. All villages have people, even in the wild you can't walk for more than a minute without see another player.
The only time there has been few players were in the VR area's, even they have many players these days. Go to any starter zone and you will find you are crowded.
"defraud people with lies"
You crazy fool! Made me laugh though.
Blatant lies. I played for 3 hours yesterday and ran into a total of 4 other players in VR1 Auridon. It's ghostville.
You are rather clueless aren't you? Most casual players (which make up the bulk of the player base) are not VR1 yet. Every time I go to any of the level 1 to 50 zones there are a ridiculous number of people. Besides, if you had any clue as to how the server works, it creates and destroys instances to keep the world populated.
I recently turned VR1 and yes, those zones are not heavily populated, but as I said, all I have to do if go to the level 40 to 50 zones and it is jammed pack.3 -
p_tsakirisb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭wrlifeboil wrote: »Umm, please do tell.
Depends the country they are based. In US no more than $50K. In UK no more £30K. India & China $3-6K.
And usually the majority of the game devs are sacked the moment a project is done.
Normal software developers like myself, do make much more than game developers and indeed we border the $100K/£50K. Contractors earn even more, and pay less taxes.
1 -
Alphashado✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Lol, you can all word it how you want. For a brand new AAA MMO only 3 months old....it's bad.
Not really. There are dozen's of MMOs on the market right now and only a limited number of gamers. If those numbers are correct considering the rocky start ESO has had, then 700k+ is actually quite spectacular.
1 -
wrlifeboil✭✭✭✭✭p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »wrlifeboil wrote: »Umm, please do tell.
Depends the country they are based. In US no more than $50K. In UK no more £30K. India & China $3-6K.
And usually the majority of the game devs are sacked the moment a project is done.
Normal software developers like myself, do make much more than game developers and indeed we border the $100K/£50K. Contractors earn even more, and pay less taxes.
Depending on the state, a decent health/dental insurance plan takes up ~$5-6k for a single person and close to double that for workers with families. Throw in a 401(k) match. Add in the employer portion of Social Security taxes, and ui/workers comp insurance. If the total outlay for the average game dev is $50k, then what you're saying that the average base pay is under $35k. Nope, you are way off the mark.0 -
ers101284b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭wrlifeboil wrote: »p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »wrlifeboil wrote: »Umm, please do tell.
Depends the country they are based. In US no more than $50K. In UK no more £30K. India & China $3-6K.
And usually the majority of the game devs are sacked the moment a project is done.
Normal software developers like myself, do make much more than game developers and indeed we border the $100K/£50K. Contractors earn even more, and pay less taxes.
Depending on the state, a decent health/dental insurance plan takes up ~$5-6k for a single person and close to double that for workers with families. Throw in a 401(k) match. Add in the employer portion of Social Security taxes, and ui/workers comp insurance. If the total outlay for the average game dev is $50k, then what you're saying that the average base pay is under $35k. Nope, you are way off the mark.
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/average-2012-us-dev-salary-84000/1100-6406397/0 -
Snit✭✭✭✭✭
✭That seems to be a solid number. But then, I have no clue about their projections, development costs or current cost structure. $140m/ year could be anything between "Woohoo!!" and "uh-oh."
At least it's not The Secret World. I loved that game in beta and right through launch. It's awesome. When I found out they only sold about 150k total units, I was both baffled and sad.Snit AD Sorc
Ratbag AD Warden Tank
Goblins AD Stamblade0