New ways to make Gold(?)

Liquid_Time · July 2014

DeLindsay wrote: »

Buying low, selling high is the FASTEST way to make tons of gold, but it takes tons of gold to start off if you want to hit Ludicrous Speed from day 1. There's a great many players who do this with Motifs (even the el cheapos) and upgrade mats, or even Alchemy mats.

^ Sums it up...

Merching or "flipping" is one of the best ways to make money in the current open market IMO.

Within 7 days (14-17 hours of play time total) I made about 300-350k cash. Another 80k or so in potions/food that I did not sell since I use those in PvP. That may not sound like much, but it is when you consider I had only 7k at day 1...

NewBlacksmurf · July 2014

Are we really using Zenimax as a guide for right and wrong.

We are paying for an unfinished game. A company who created a promotion to buy the PC version of their game for a discount to buy the game again on the console with no details of how it works.

A company who knowingly allowed BOTs and then in embarrassment banned BOTs and real players for doing the same things.

A company who encouraged during closed beta add ons and then a week before release changed to code so that most of the add ons people spent a year perfecting would not work.

I like the game and all but I surely don't look to this company for any.moral compass.

Dayv · July 2014

Kafolarbear wrote: »

What exactly does it mean to be a "Master Crafter"?

Good call. Almost everything to people who declare themselves as being such, as far as I can tell.

Ecco · July 2014

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Ever heard of Martha Stewart

What on earth does Martha Stewart have to do with anything in this thread? She didn't go to jail for exploiting anything, she went to federal prison for Obstruction of Justice after lying to federal agents, a federal felony.

SFBryan18 · July 2014

This is as much an exploit as using alts for inventory space. In video game terms, it only matters if the developers say it does. Perhaps the addition of the junk was an indicator to their intent. Them saying, "Go ahead, but we're adding this junk to make it hard".

jeevin · July 2014

It's just like animation canceling. Not intended but an exploit that Zeni can't police so it's okay by them. Go for it exploit all you want.

KariTR · July 2014

Let's not forget that decay on containers and bosses has been heavily increased so 'farming' is not as productive as it once was.

So, you know, while ZOS may be 'OK' with it, they still took steps to limit the effectiveness of 'farming' so it couldn't be 'exploited'.

Akhratos · July 2014

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

DeLindsay wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Actually it is by definition

Before you pull out a dictionary, according to ZoS, the company who makes this game logging to "farm" Motifs isn't remotely considered an exploit therefore the previous poster was correct, it isn't an exploit.

ex·ploit
take advantage of somebody: to take selfish or unfair advantage of a person or situation, usually for personal gain
use something for benefit: to use or develop something in order to gain a benefit

As I said by definition it is an exploit. Now Zenimax forums moderators have said it won't get you banned but if you know this increases the chances of getting something so you're solely doing it to make a profit (personal gain) by definition yes it's an exploit.

Just like the bank glitch worked by design but when ppl started using it for personal gain it became an exploit.

If everyone is told this is how to obtain something that's one thing but if it's only known by a select few or even a select many the way the information is used can make it an exploit.

Ever heard of Martha Stewart

Farming is if he was using this to gain.motifs for his character. He is not using this to farm items for himself or others. It's being used ONLY for personal gain.
That's the difference.

If a person kills a NPC over and over again until they get a desired item for them that's farming. Farming for mats and gear but getting the same items over and over again using an oversight in the design in the gain to make you more money at the expense of others is morally wrong. By definition see above it fits the term exploit.

This is a computer game. The word definition from a dictionary may not be correct at all. There is something called profession argot.

Those are the first definitions, you have to jump to the 5th to get the correct one in the Oxford dictionary:

bug/bʌg
noun
1.informal
a harmful microorganism, typically a bacterium.
2.NORTH AMERICAN
a small insect.
"a thick green scum which crawls with bugs, centipedes, and worse"
.......
5.An error in a computer program or system:
"a custom program we used developed a bug"
SYNONYMS: fault, error, defect,FLAW, imperfection, failing, breakdown; virus

Now, the definition of exploit by the Oxford dictionary:
2.A software tool designed to take advantage of a FLAW in a computer system, typically for malicious purposes such as installing malware.

An exploit is the mechanic somebody uses to take advantage of a bug or undesigned/FLAWed mechanic (not a harmful microorganism, ofc..), not from a person.

They already changed the way dressers and such spawned after relog, presumably adding an internal cd after motif picks. Unless you have any proof the mechanics are not working as intended or have some kind of flaw/error...

it may be a braindead/mindless mechanic, but its not an exploit.

SHADOW2KK · July 2014

Farm away

atomikrej · July 2014

Here's a couple of ways:
1) Go to Auridon - Vukhel Guard bank and in the first room to the right there is a room full of cabinets and chests. Open them all and you will usually get some crafting mats - such as daedra hearts, nickel etc. Use the relog mechanic that people have mentioned above. You can probably turn them in for a nice profit.
2) Run around Hollow City and farm the reagents that spawn. I've seen people advertise wtb columbine for 125-150g and columbine drop rate is quite common there. You will have to level up your alchemy to easily spot the plants though.
Getting crafting alts with hirelings is not a bad idea. For instance I have 7 provisioning hirelings. Every 12 hours I login to the alts and add the ingredients to my bank. They often bring back oats and tomatoes which are worth quite a lot.

Ecco · July 2014

The Oxford English Dictionary, like any other dictionary, is a reference that is used to document the language. But usage ultimately is the only authoritative source for meaning. And within the gaming community,the use of a game mechanic (whether flawed, bugged or otherwise) in order to obtain an advantage, in a way that is not contemplated by the devs, and is forbidden by the devs, is an exploit. The devs have the ultimate say on what is and what is not an exploit. Anything else is speculation.

SFBryan18 · July 2014

Archaon wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

DeLindsay wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Actually it is by definition

Before you pull out a dictionary, according to ZoS, the company who makes this game logging to "farm" Motifs isn't remotely considered an exploit therefore the previous poster was correct, it isn't an exploit.

ex·ploit
take advantage of somebody: to take selfish or unfair advantage of a person or situation, usually for personal gain
use something for benefit: to use or develop something in order to gain a benefit

As I said by definition it is an exploit. Now Zenimax forums moderators have said it won't get you banned but if you know this increases the chances of getting something so you're solely doing it to make a profit (personal gain) by definition yes it's an exploit.

Just like the bank glitch worked by design but when ppl started using it for personal gain it became an exploit.

If everyone is told this is how to obtain something that's one thing but if it's only known by a select few or even a select many the way the information is used can make it an exploit.

Ever heard of Martha Stewart

Farming is if he was using this to gain.motifs for his character. He is not using this to farm items for himself or others. It's being used ONLY for personal gain.
That's the difference.

If a person kills a NPC over and over again until they get a desired item for them that's farming. Farming for mats and gear but getting the same items over and over again using an oversight in the design in the gain to make you more money at the expense of others is morally wrong. By definition see above it fits the term exploit.

This is a computer game. The word definition from a dictionary may not be correct at all. There is something called profession argot.

Those are the first definitions, you have to jump to the 5th to get the correct one in the Oxford dictionary:

bug/bʌg
noun
1.informal
a harmful microorganism, typically a bacterium.
2.NORTH AMERICAN
a small insect.
"a thick green scum which crawls with bugs, centipedes, and worse"
.......
5.An error in a computer program or system:
"a custom program we used developed a bug"
SYNONYMS: fault, error, defect,FLAW, imperfection, failing, breakdown; virus

Now, the definition of exploit by the Oxford dictionary:
2.A software tool designed to take advantage of a FLAW in a computer system, typically for malicious purposes such as installing malware.

An exploit is the mechanic somebody uses to take advantage of a bug or undesigned/FLAWed mechanic (not a harmful microorganism, ofc..), not from a person.

They already changed the way dressers and such spawned after relog, presumably adding an internal cd after motif picks. Unless you have any proof the mechanics are not working as intended or have some kind of flaw/error...

it may be a braindead/mindless mechanic, but its not an exploit.

Some flaws are based on opinion. Bots are not a flaw with the game, but are a flaw with how the game is intended to be played. This intention is an opinion. The developers opinion. They made the game and write the rules and those rules say that bots are bad for the game.

Same could be said about any function if abused. Do you believe the developers made this game and said, "We'll have motifs drop after a certain amount of time, but if the player logs out and then logs back in, they can get as many as they want"? Very unlikely. The fact that they have a wait time shows the intention so using any means to go around this desired outcome would be considered an exploit.

DenverRalphy · July 2014

elhaocub18_ESO wrote: »

However the changes to loot tables by adding crapgear hit the droprates very hard for me (I've been relogfarming for nearly two days now without getting anything), so relogfarming motifs is hardly viable anymore.

Except that the drop rate of motifs and recipes hasn't been changed. The only recognizable impact is that you now see less Lockpicks in containers (which is a very good thing). The drop rate for Motifs and Recipes has been left intact.

But hey... if you want to let your current streak of bad luck act as proof positive... knock yourself out.

Soloeus · July 2014

Liquid_Time wrote: »

DeLindsay wrote: »

Buying low, selling high is the FASTEST way to make tons of gold, but it takes tons of gold to start off if you want to hit Ludicrous Speed from day 1. There's a great many players who do this with Motifs (even the el cheapos) and upgrade mats, or even Alchemy mats.

^ Sums it up...

Merching or "flipping" is one of the best ways to make money in the current open market IMO.

Within 7 days (14-17 hours of play time total) I made about 300-350k cash. Another 80k or so in potions/food that I did not sell since I use those in PvP. That may not sound like much, but it is when you consider I had only 7k at day 1...

This requires a lot of luck on drops and decon mats, hirelings. It also requires a lot of luck in finding people who are willing to pay for things in this Closed Market where Commerce is hidden behind a guildwall.

NewBlacksmurf · July 2014

Ecco wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Ever heard of Martha Stewart

What on earth does Martha Stewart have to do with anything in this thread? She didn't go to jail for exploiting anything, she went to federal prison for Obstruction of Justice after lying to federal agents, a federal felony.

Lol you sure. Cause I recall her using insider information to avoid loosing money on stocks but maybe I'm wrong.

ExiledKhallisi · July 2014

I make 6k an hr farming pub dungeons in vr6+ content

Liquid_Time · July 2014

Soloeus wrote: »

Liquid_Time wrote: »

DeLindsay wrote: »

Buying low, selling high is the FASTEST way to make tons of gold, but it takes tons of gold to start off if you want to hit Ludicrous Speed from day 1. There's a great many players who do this with Motifs (even the el cheapos) and upgrade mats, or even Alchemy mats.

^ Sums it up...

Merching or "flipping" is one of the best ways to make money in the current open market IMO.

Within 7 days (14-17 hours of play time total) I made about 300-350k cash. Another 80k or so in potions/food that I did not sell since I use those in PvP. That may not sound like much, but it is when you consider I had only 7k at day 1...

This requires a lot of luck on drops and decon mats, hirelings. It also requires a lot of luck in finding people who are willing to pay for things in this Closed Market where Commerce is hidden behind a guildwall.

Umm... I am not sure why you are saying you need luck on drops when you are buying/selling items.. not gathering them.

Anyways, I will try to try to explain it a bit better in case you misunderstood my original post.

Merching or "Flipping" is when you buy an item at a low price and sell said item for a much higher price. I will even go further and use an example of how you can do this.

Grand Soul Gems---
You use to be able to buy these at 4-6k a stack (x100 per stack) from vet players in Craglor. I would buy 100-200k worth at any given time. Then go to the other player zones and sell the stacks at 2k more per stack then what I had bought them for. Cryodiil was one of the best areas to sell since they were used frequently in PvP to assist in AP boosting.

** Keep in mind.. This item can still be flipped, but recent farm patches have made them a bit harder to obtain in bulk and prices are much higher then what I have listed above.

Yes this takes time, but it takes patience and common sense more then anything. I am sure you will say this also requires "luck", but I will disagree. If you are going to buy items with the intention of selling them for profit. Then you should do your research on what the current buy/sell price on the street is before hand.

Alphashado · July 2014

SFBryan18 wrote: »

Archaon wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

DeLindsay wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Actually it is by definition

Before you pull out a dictionary, according to ZoS, the company who makes this game logging to "farm" Motifs isn't remotely considered an exploit therefore the previous poster was correct, it isn't an exploit.

ex·ploit
take advantage of somebody: to take selfish or unfair advantage of a person or situation, usually for personal gain
use something for benefit: to use or develop something in order to gain a benefit

As I said by definition it is an exploit. Now Zenimax forums moderators have said it won't get you banned but if you know this increases the chances of getting something so you're solely doing it to make a profit (personal gain) by definition yes it's an exploit.

Just like the bank glitch worked by design but when ppl started using it for personal gain it became an exploit.

If everyone is told this is how to obtain something that's one thing but if it's only known by a select few or even a select many the way the information is used can make it an exploit.

Ever heard of Martha Stewart

Farming is if he was using this to gain.motifs for his character. He is not using this to farm items for himself or others. It's being used ONLY for personal gain.
That's the difference.

If a person kills a NPC over and over again until they get a desired item for them that's farming. Farming for mats and gear but getting the same items over and over again using an oversight in the design in the gain to make you more money at the expense of others is morally wrong. By definition see above it fits the term exploit.

This is a computer game. The word definition from a dictionary may not be correct at all. There is something called profession argot.

Those are the first definitions, you have to jump to the 5th to get the correct one in the Oxford dictionary:

bug/bʌg
noun
1.informal
a harmful microorganism, typically a bacterium.
2.NORTH AMERICAN
a small insect.
"a thick green scum which crawls with bugs, centipedes, and worse"
.......
5.An error in a computer program or system:
"a custom program we used developed a bug"
SYNONYMS: fault, error, defect,FLAW, imperfection, failing, breakdown; virus

Now, the definition of exploit by the Oxford dictionary:
2.A software tool designed to take advantage of a FLAW in a computer system, typically for malicious purposes such as installing malware.

An exploit is the mechanic somebody uses to take advantage of a bug or undesigned/FLAWed mechanic (not a harmful microorganism, ofc..), not from a person.

They already changed the way dressers and such spawned after relog, presumably adding an internal cd after motif picks. Unless you have any proof the mechanics are not working as intended or have some kind of flaw/error...

it may be a braindead/mindless mechanic, but its not an exploit.

Some flaws are based on opinion. Bots are not a flaw with the game, but are a flaw with how the game is intended to be played. This intention is an opinion. The developers opinion. They made the game and write the rules and those rules say that bots are bad for the game.

Same could be said about any function if abused. Do you believe the developers made this game and said, "We'll have motifs drop after a certain amount of time, but if the player logs out and then logs back in, they can get as many as they want"? Very unlikely. The fact that they have a wait time shows the intention so using any means to go around this desired outcome would be considered an exploit.

Fact is that it's not a banable offense. Therefore it comes down to your own opinion on the moral compass that lies within each and every one of us. If you find 20 bucks lying in the street, do you put it in your pocket and consider it your lucky day, or do you leave it there since it clearly wasn't intended for you?

Wolfshead · July 2014

Maverick827 wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

Maverick827 wrote: »

Kitsy wrote: »

crislevin wrote: »

Elad13 wrote: »

I'm confused....you used an exploit to make money...now you can't do that anymore you want another exploit?

farming things is not an exploit.

No, but what OP is saying is that he used an exploit to get better chances of getting stuff wich is not intended.

What exploit did the OP use?

He would login, search a building full of chests and desks, logout, login, search the same building, repeat....

That's not an exploit.

It is very much a exploit if reset everytime you login that mean it is bug for it game don't reminder that chest have been take so yeah i would say it exploit even if you don't think it is and you can be banned for it for use it.

For it gave person more money which mean he can gear up faster then anyone else.

SFBryan18 · July 2014

Alphashado wrote: »

SFBryan18 wrote: »

Archaon wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

DeLindsay wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Actually it is by definition

Before you pull out a dictionary, according to ZoS, the company who makes this game logging to "farm" Motifs isn't remotely considered an exploit therefore the previous poster was correct, it isn't an exploit.

ex·ploit
take advantage of somebody: to take selfish or unfair advantage of a person or situation, usually for personal gain
use something for benefit: to use or develop something in order to gain a benefit

As I said by definition it is an exploit. Now Zenimax forums moderators have said it won't get you banned but if you know this increases the chances of getting something so you're solely doing it to make a profit (personal gain) by definition yes it's an exploit.

Just like the bank glitch worked by design but when ppl started using it for personal gain it became an exploit.

If everyone is told this is how to obtain something that's one thing but if it's only known by a select few or even a select many the way the information is used can make it an exploit.

Ever heard of Martha Stewart

Farming is if he was using this to gain.motifs for his character. He is not using this to farm items for himself or others. It's being used ONLY for personal gain.
That's the difference.

If a person kills a NPC over and over again until they get a desired item for them that's farming. Farming for mats and gear but getting the same items over and over again using an oversight in the design in the gain to make you more money at the expense of others is morally wrong. By definition see above it fits the term exploit.

This is a computer game. The word definition from a dictionary may not be correct at all. There is something called profession argot.

Those are the first definitions, you have to jump to the 5th to get the correct one in the Oxford dictionary:

bug/bʌg
noun
1.informal
a harmful microorganism, typically a bacterium.
2.NORTH AMERICAN
a small insect.
"a thick green scum which crawls with bugs, centipedes, and worse"
.......
5.An error in a computer program or system:
"a custom program we used developed a bug"
SYNONYMS: fault, error, defect,FLAW, imperfection, failing, breakdown; virus

Now, the definition of exploit by the Oxford dictionary:
2.A software tool designed to take advantage of a FLAW in a computer system, typically for malicious purposes such as installing malware.

An exploit is the mechanic somebody uses to take advantage of a bug or undesigned/FLAWed mechanic (not a harmful microorganism, ofc..), not from a person.

They already changed the way dressers and such spawned after relog, presumably adding an internal cd after motif picks. Unless you have any proof the mechanics are not working as intended or have some kind of flaw/error...

it may be a braindead/mindless mechanic, but its not an exploit.

Some flaws are based on opinion. Bots are not a flaw with the game, but are a flaw with how the game is intended to be played. This intention is an opinion. The developers opinion. They made the game and write the rules and those rules say that bots are bad for the game.

Same could be said about any function if abused. Do you believe the developers made this game and said, "We'll have motifs drop after a certain amount of time, but if the player logs out and then logs back in, they can get as many as they want"? Very unlikely. The fact that they have a wait time shows the intention so using any means to go around this desired outcome would be considered an exploit.

Fact is that it's not a banable offense. Therefore it comes down to your own opinion on the moral compass that lies within each and every one of us. If you find 20 bucks lying in the street, do you put it in your pocket and consider it your lucky day, or do you leave it there since it clearly wasn't intended for you?

I'm no saint. I'll take advantage of a good opportunity, but my point was strictly for grammar clarification.

Soloeus · July 2014

Liquid_Time wrote: »

Soloeus wrote: »

Liquid_Time wrote: »

DeLindsay wrote: »

Buying low, selling high is the FASTEST way to make tons of gold, but it takes tons of gold to start off if you want to hit Ludicrous Speed from day 1. There's a great many players who do this with Motifs (even the el cheapos) and upgrade mats, or even Alchemy mats.

^ Sums it up...

Merching or "flipping" is one of the best ways to make money in the current open market IMO.

Within 7 days (14-17 hours of play time total) I made about 300-350k cash. Another 80k or so in potions/food that I did not sell since I use those in PvP. That may not sound like much, but it is when you consider I had only 7k at day 1...

This requires a lot of luck on drops and decon mats, hirelings. It also requires a lot of luck in finding people who are willing to pay for things in this Closed Market where Commerce is hidden behind a guildwall.

Umm... I am not sure why you are saying you need luck on drops when you are buying/selling items.. not gathering them.

Anyways, I will try to try to explain it a bit better in case you misunderstood my original post.

Merching or "Flipping" is when you buy an item at a low price and sell said item for a much higher price. I will even go further and use an example of how you can do this.

Grand Soul Gems---
You use to be able to buy these at 4-6k a stack (x100 per stack) from vet players in Craglor. I would buy 100-200k worth at any given time. Then go to the other player zones and sell the stacks at 2k more per stack then what I had bought them for. Cryodiil was one of the best areas to sell since they were used frequently in PvP to assist in AP boosting.

** Keep in mind.. This item can still be flipped, but recent farm patches have made them a bit harder to obtain in bulk and prices are much higher then what I have listed above.

Yes this takes time, but it takes patience and common sense more then anything. I am sure you will say this also requires "luck", but I will disagree. If you are going to buy items with the intention of selling them for profit. Then you should do your research on what the current buy/sell price on the street is before hand.

Now I get it. Ugh. I would rather commit suicide than "haggle" so much. Really. Can you tell I hate working with customers in real life? I would kill them too. All of them, let the divines sort them out!

I suppose the only "luck" is in the ability to find buyers. I have lots of stuff I have been trying to sell for months; I am just not like "desperate" enough to sell a Barbaric Motif for 5k or a stack of 100 Columbine for 500 gold.

I wish there were an In-Game way to make this kind of money without being forced to have an RL Skill that many people don't have. For example if I am an auto-mechanic, I shouldn't get in-game benefits non Auto-Mechanics are denied. I kinda feel like socialite salesmen have an unfair advantage over everyone else and I don't want the game to feel like real life.

Besides I tried that for a little bit and I got burned out by all the trolls, troll offers, price shaming techniques, community toxicity... It just drove me into being an anti-social solo player that I have evolved into... I wasn't always this way in MMO's I promise.