Four words Zenimax probably regrets saying

badmojo · July 2014

Play how you want.

It seems like that line gets pulled into every discussion on these forums. It's almost like that old saying "the customer is always right".

I believe they originally were talking about your class not defining your character, but it seems like everyone with an opinion enjoys throwing that saying around claiming ZOS has failed to accomplish it.

Kulthax · July 2014

Agreed. Poor marketing decision in this slogan. Honestly though, you can if you choose to stay away from the internet and just log in and play the game how you want. I guess that goes with any MMO though.

Sihnfahl · July 2014

It also implies that all skill lines are viable for all content. It doesn't matter if you're a Templar master of the two-handed axe, or a shadow-specced nightblade. Because of what you bring to the table with that spec, you'd be wanted.

We know how that's gone...

ers101284b14_ESO · July 2014

What they mean is that the classes don't really define you as much as other MMO's. Look at other MMO's and you pick a class and you get a set amount of skills and set armor and set weapons. Don't really see that here. Not really sure why people have a problem with that but that's how people are. Honestly if you just play the game and never read the forums you would have never known that any build was overpowered or that anything was broken or didn't work. Took me reading the forums to find out my VR9 Templar was not able to solo VR zones. Who would of thought it.

Arsenic_Touch · July 2014

Play how you want would've actually worked if they stuck with the original elder scroll system where everyone had access to the skill lines and could pick and choose what they want. But no, they wanted to have a class system that despite what people claim, it does actually adhere to a holy trinity system where certain classes perform their rolls much better than others.

SirAndy · July 2014

Kulthax wrote: »

Agreed. Poor marketing decision in this slogan. Honestly though, you can if you choose to stay away from the internet and just log in and play the game how you want. I guess that goes with any MMO though.

I have 3 main characters (one in each faction) and shockingly, only one of them (The Sorc) wears light armor and uses a stave.

While i can certainly feel the difference in difficulty between my 3 chars, they're all enjoyable to play and the two that aren't light armor/stave users (A bow wielding Templar and a dual wielding naked Dragon Knight) are a far cry from the "unplayable" mess some here are trying to make them out to be.

kijima · July 2014

Play how you want, proving you want to wear a frock and carry a resto broom stick

Istyar · July 2014

Well, I dont think they have lied to us, not totally.
They just had some(a big one) troubles to balance the classes, thats why we can't play in our way. They will fix it - and no, I wont say "soon" because nothing in this game is "soon".

Loco_Mofo · July 2014

Well to be fair, you CAN play however you want. You just won't be as effective as other builds *cough* staff/light armor *cough*

SFBryan18 · July 2014

As if no one has ever seen a commercial with some catchy slogan before. I believe it is the individuals fault if they can not interpret the true intent of a sentence. Of course you can't play the way you want. There are always going to be limitations in every game. What if the player wants to go into PvP naked at level 10? Sure he can, but he won't have much success. If you choose certain skills, you need to understand what those skills are for, and if you have made the best choices to use that skill. You're not going to get an A, B, C, option where all three are the exact same. Each will have certain strengths and weaknesses, and it's on you to figure out what they are.

ckf12b14_ESO · July 2014

This is an MMO, something people seem to forget. There's always going to be "optimal" builds/equipment/characters/etc.

twev · July 2014

ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »

What they mean is that the classes don't really define you as much as other MMO's. Look at other MMO's and you pick a class and you get a set amount of skills and set armor and set weapons. Don't really see that here. Not really sure why people have a problem with that but that's how people are. Honestly if you just play the game and never read the forums you would have never known that any build was overpowered or that anything was broken or didn't work. Took me reading the forums to find out my VR9 Templar was not able to solo VR zones. Who would of thought it.

I'll go you one better:
If you'd just play the game without reading the forums, the adverts, the box, the reviews, or watched any online trailers --> the whole game would be one great big surprise.

Makkir · July 2014

Loco_Mofo wrote: »

Well to be fair, you CAN play however you want. You just won't be as effective as other builds *cough* staff/light armor *cough*

I was going to say the same thing, lol. Yes you technically can play the way you want.

Alphashado · July 2014

It is a difficult task to be sure. But they aren't backing down from it. Here is a snip from the July road ahead letter released just yesterday.

Phase 1: Make sure the difficulty in Veteran zones ramps up slowly and rarely exceeds what a good player can do on their own. This change came to the live servers on July 7th. By the time you read this, you should be able to play Veteran content the same way you played from 1-50.
Phase 2: Remove the Veteran Points system and have normal experience gains direct the growth of the Veteran System. Also, we’ll increase the amount of XP granted in PvP. This will happen at some point over the summer as we transition to the new system.
Phase 3: Introduce a completely new Veteran System based on new character customization and growth mechanics. We’ll talk more about this in the near future—especially during Quakecon—but for now, be aware that we’re going to make some much-needed changes to post-50 PvE gameplay.

The primary reason for making these changes is to ensure that you have meaningful choices in the post-50 PvE game experience that reinforce the design idea that you can play the way you want to play.

DeLindsay · July 2014

badmojo wrote: »

Play how you want.

It seems like that line gets pulled into every discussion on these forums. It's almost like that old saying "the customer is always right".

I believe they originally were talking about your class not defining your character, but it seems like everyone with an opinion enjoys throwing that saying around claiming ZOS has failed to accomplish it.

The problem is people confuse "play as you want" with "everything is OP at everything". You can absolutely play as you want and some still do at VR12. Does that mean your playstyle will be the FOTM cookie cutter Trial and solo everything build, probably not, but as long as YOU enjoy it then ZoS did their job and was accurate in those 4 words. Sticks and skirts are the FOTM right now but I see TONS of players using 2H, Dual Wield, Bow, etc and having fun doing so.

I've seen Sorcs with a Bow to GREAT effect, NB's with a Destro staff to GREAT effect, watched an amazing 2H Templar, etc. All of these are things the traditional MMO elitists would say shouldn't happen as a Sorc should be a caster, a NB should be a sneaky stabby guy, a Templar should be a healer, etc. ESO gives you the option to play pretty much however you like. You probably won't be getting into a progression Trial run if you aren't FOTM build but so what, plenty of people have fun in ESO without running Trials like their life depends on it.

Traditional MMO = I make a Hunter, I'm permanently a DPS role using Bows.

ESO = I make a Sorcerer, I can choose to be a DPS, Healer, Tank, and use ANY Weapon and it's abilities available to all other Classes. Will I be the best at any of those roles, who cares because I HAVE the option to do so. Sounds pretty "play as you want" to me.

Vis · July 2014

I play exactly how I want.

Sometimes I play in a bathrobe at home, sometimes in a suit at work, and other times I play naked over a plate of hot wings. But no matter what I am doing or wearing while I am playing, it is usually because I want to play that way.

Your argument has been disproven.

Nox_Aeterna · July 2014

The point is exactly that , your class defines your role in ESO just like it does in most other MMOs.

Ofc , people come thinking this would not be the case and got burned , many left because of just that.

Balance is a huge issue in a MMO.

Elad13 · July 2014

You can play how you want to play...but they never said you could be as successful as other players...doing same things...and they didn't say you'd die more often if you don't play in light armor and a staff.
So nothing to regret.

Vis · July 2014

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

The point is exactly that , your class defines your role in ESO just like it does in most other MMOs.

My status as a member of the American working class has not dictated my role in eso. I take serious offense by that assumption.

Fuzzylumpkins · July 2014

SirAndy wrote: »

Kulthax wrote: »

Agreed. Poor marketing decision in this slogan. Honestly though, you can if you choose to stay away from the internet and just log in and play the game how you want. I guess that goes with any MMO though.

I have 3 main characters (one in each faction) and shockingly, only one of them (The Sorc) wears light armor and uses a stave.

While i can certainly feel the difference in difficulty between my 3 chars, they're all enjoyable to play and the two that aren't light armor/stave users (A bow wielding Templar and a dual wielding naked Dragon Knight) are a far cry from the "unplayable" mess some here are trying to make them out to be.

Any character is "playable." Logging in and checking a guild store is playing. But your characters by all definitions are not optimal or even by any standard group friendly. That is zos' fault and what is being slung around anytime those 4 words are brought up to dirty anything zos had stated about the gameplay.

On another note, I am positive ZoS' regrets go much deeper than 4 words.

Tyr · July 2014

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

The point is exactly that , your class defines your role in ESO just like it does in most other MMOs.

Ofc , people come thinking this would not be the case and got burned , many left because of just that.

Balance is a huge issue in a MMO.

I don't use any magic abilities at all including class abilities.
That leaves me with Bow, DW, 2H, OH&Shield, and Fighters Guild skill lines and either medium armor or heavy armor.
I get by in VR content just fine now with just that.

There are a few rare exceptions where the situation is untenable still like with non-daedric/undead groups of 3 that have a healer and a high HP mob at the same time and things like gargoyles and storm atronachs.
Other than that, you can get by VR content solo with the right gear, skill and preparation just like in other TES games while ignoring class skills altogether.

SirAndy · July 2014

Fuzzylumpkins wrote: »

But your characters by all definitions are not optimal or even by any standard group friendly. That is zos' fault and what is being slung around anytime those 4 words are brought up to dirty anything zos had stated about the gameplay.

Except, i don't care if you (nothing personal here) or anyone else claims my characters are not optimal or group friendly.

I have loads of fun playing each one of them and again, they're far from unplayable or non-competitive.

I went into Cyrodiil with all 3 of my characters before they even reached level 15 and each one of them has had some very memorable playtime there. Not once has anyone complaint about me not being able to support a group i was in.
I got plenty of kills under my belt.

Like i said, there certainly is a difference in how my characters play and the Sorc does play noticeably easier, but at no point have i ever felt the other two characters were unplayable or not enjoyable ...

butterfly442 · July 2014

Play how you want.

They didn't you wont fail.

Mescalamba · July 2014

Play as you want.

Thats till you want to do trials, then either get very nice guild, or respec to destro staff and clothes.

Actually if one studies a bit options in game, realization that magicka based chars are quite OP in this game is very easy to come to. Took me exactly one lower lvl alt to find that out.. And it isnt better later in game.

Malpherian · July 2014

Well lets be honest, even where character custimization is concerned you can;'t really play how you want, as no matter what class you are You can't use the other 4/5ths of the skills/traits in game.

You can only ever use 1/5th of the available traits (In game as a whole), and there's entire other block of traits, NO one can use but NPC's (Which is garbage).

So yea, that's pretty frakin limited and restrictive, and even there is definitely NOT play how you want. This game is basically on rails, and there is not a single thing about it that is "truly" play how you want.

You can pick up any weapon and use it, and you can use any armor. (although really its mostly impractical depending on your class).

But that's no different than many other MMOs. When it comes to classes and trait restrictions your locked out of about 60% - 65% of all traits (75%+ if you count the NPC skills No one can use).

Malpherian · July 2014

badmojo wrote: »

Play how you want.

It seems like that line gets pulled into every discussion on these forums. It's almost like that old saying "the customer is always right".

I believe they originally were talking about your class not defining your character, but it seems like everyone with an opinion enjoys throwing that saying around claiming ZOS has failed to accomplish it.

Um.. your class 100% defines your character, you have 3 trait skill lines which you can mix and match with guild and weapon/armor skill lines, but you can NEVER go beyond those 3 main class trait lines. and you are 100% locked into the theme of your class by them.

Yes, you have more of an openness and option to mix and match this is true. But you can never be a Rogue with stealth on your sorcerer, or have access to the trait lines which benefit from sneaking and being a stabby stabby.

If you want those you MUST roll a Night blade. The same is true for all other classes. Just like you can NOT summon Daedra, unless you roll a Sorcerer.

Classes in ESO do not simply give your character a push in the direction they theme, No, that's what Skyrim, Morrowind, and Oblivion classes did for you.

ESO classes 100% absolutely LOCK you into your 3 trait trees for that class, which are 100% different, then the other classes Traits. Forceing you to roll an Alt should you want an actual "Change in your main class thematic's.".

khele23eb17_ESO · July 2014

Malpherian wrote: »

But that's no different than many other MMOs. When it comes to classes and trait restrictions your locked out of about 60% - 65% of all traits (75%+ if you count the NPC skills No one can use).

It is quite different. Other mmos dont lock you out of your preferred playstyle. In other MMOs youre still experiencing the playstyle which generally aligns with your chosen class. You might be forced to use axes over swords or a crit build over a power build, etc. but youre not forced into a mage playstyle on your warrior.

indytims_ESO · July 2014

None of my characters wear light armor, or use a staff - and I find the PVE content to still be fairly easy.

Stick & Pajamas might give players an edge in PVP or something (I really don't know), but in PVE, you really can play 'how you want'... within the confines of the game itself. To me that's just common-sense. Ripping on Zeni for 'play how you want failure' is being quite nitpicky, in my opinion.

khele23eb17_ESO · July 2014

indytims_ESO wrote: »

None of my characters wear light armor, or use a staff - and I find the PVE content to still be fairly easy.

Stick & Pajamas might give players an edge in PVP or something (I really don't know), but in PVE, you really can play 'how you want'... within the confines of the game itself. To me that's just common-sense. Ripping on Zeni for 'play how you want failure' is being quite nitpicky, in my opinion.

Cloth and stick provides 30-100% more dps than other playstyles... its not common sense but thats how it is.

Liquid_Time · July 2014

Vis wrote: »

I play exactly how I want.

Sometimes I play in a bathrobe at home, sometimes in a suit at work, and other times I play naked over a plate of hot wings. But no matter what I am doing or wearing while I am playing, it is usually because I want to play that way.

Your argument has been disproven.

Today Vis. You win. haha

Malpherian · July 2014

indytims_ESO wrote: »

None of my characters wear light armor, or use a staff - and I find the PVE content to still be fairly easy.

Stick & Pajamas might give players an edge in PVP or something (I really don't know), but in PVE, you really can play 'how you want'... within the confines of the game itself. To me that's just common-sense. Ripping on Zeni for 'play how you want failure' is being quite nitpicky, in my opinion.

1.) So if you roll a DK your telling me you can summon Daedra if you want to be a Tanky pet totting Range tank Bow shooting DK?

The answer is no, you can't.

2.) So your Sorcerer Gets 300% bonus to damage when attacking a target below 25% health, Or can go invisible, and have a trait which does a stun/damage bonus when attacking your target from sneak?

"Again, the answer is NO, you can't."

3.) So your NightBlade wants to be a healer? Can you res people and create soul gems in the process 50% of the time, or heal anywhere near as effectively as a Restoration Templar?

Yes you can use a resto staff to heal (sort of), but weapons do not have badass channel healing ultimate's. And your Nightblade most certainly doesn't. A full heal spec Templar will out heal you any day of the week. Because (and here is the point) HIS CLASS, is DESIGNED to... HEAL. And yours ISN'T.

So,

"No, you can't"

4.) Can your Templar pull people from walls, and do massive AOE damage while simultaneously stunning people in place, as well as taking Massive amounts of damage and reflecting 90% of all damage back to your attackers?

"No, you can't"

I can go on, and on, and on.

So go ahead tell me how Un-restrictive your class is and how your not locked into your roles and you can "Play your character and develop it how you want".

Oh wait... You can't.