Why do the crafted set bonuses seem to favour magicka builds? Stamina builds get the shaft

Lyall84 · June 2014

Valn wrote: »

Can you provide details please

Bonus does not give you what it says it gives you. Tool tips show no increase at all, and 3rd party add ons that show damage delt show a 5-7 damage per use increase on a 134 damage weapon, when the damage increase should be between 18-24 damage depending on if you apply the % from the set bonus to the skill equation or to the weapons damage prior to going into the equation.

If the tool tips are correct, if you look at weapon skills, about 63% of the weapons damage is added to the skills base damage. So you have two ways of reading the "Increases weapon damage by 18% when using weapon abilities" that the set bonus reads. Either (A) it increases the effect of the weapon on the skill, ie add that 18% to the 63% which results in a little more damage, for my 134 damage weapon it should be about 24 damage. Or (B) it increases the weapon damage by 18% before you add the 63% to the skill, which results in little less damage, about 18 damage for my 134 damage weapon.

So there is two issues that need to be fixed, first, the tool tip needs to update so you don't need a 3rd party modification to see the effects, and second, it increases damage by 1/3 if not 1/4 of what it should.

Wifeaggro13 · June 2014

Lyall84 wrote: »

Hunding's Rage does not buff any weapon abilities. It should, it even says it does, but it does not. The 5 set is currently broken at the moment.

I would hope ZOS is aware of the issue already but if not, here is an explanation. I crafted new sets to make sure my numbers are exact and the controls are not messed with.

Bottom line: the 5 set reads (at VR 9 white quality) "Increases weapon damage by 18% when using weapon abilities". This reads to me that it increases the weapon abilities damage by 18% of the weapon's portion of the damage.

Base Damage:

Completely ungeared (ie naked) my Executioner IV (two handed morph) deals 81 damage.

Gear: All gear listed is white, with no enchantments or traits, unless otherwise listed.

Level 13 vendor bought great sword (Green) = 40 damage.

VR9 crafted great sword = 134 damage.

VR9 crafted medium hunding's rage set (5 pieces) = 18% increase.

Test:
Naked with green level 13 sword, Executioner does 106 damage. So far it can be noted that a about 62% of the weapon's damage is added to the skill's damage.

Naked with white VR9 sword, Executioner does 166 damage. It appears that this weapon added about 63% of the weapon's damage to the skill's damage. Pretty consistent.

5 Piece Hunding's Rage set equipped with green level 13 sword. Executioner tool tip still displays 106 damage. It appears that the set has 0 effect. Set is broken and useless. Should be around 110 damage if you count the set as only increasing the weapons portion of the effect. Would be around 125 if the set counted to the ability as a whole.

5 Piece Hunding's Rage set equipped with white VR9 sword. Executioner tool tip still displays 166 damage. It appears that the set has 0 effect. Set is broken and useless. Should be around 180 damage if you count the set as only increasing the weapons portion of the effect. Would be around 195 if the set counted to the ability as a whole.

Conclusion: a crafted 6 trait requirement, 5 set bonus, that can do nothing but help any type of weapon skill or stamina build, is 100% useless.

this is exactly what i thought. At this point i dont think they are going to do anything to redeem the melee builds in the game any time soon. I wholeheartedly believe when every thing settles i would wager that im balance between magica, buggy quests , and phasing will be the top three reasons for the games early burn off and low retention.
Its very sad to see that almost 90 days into launch and they have not even remotely addressed this or even acknowledged it was an issue

phaneub17_ESO · June 2014

Valn wrote: »

Seducer [3/5] Reduce cost of spells 3%
[5/5] 14 magicka recovery

I just like to point out that the 3pc Seducer's reduced cost applies to everything not just Magicka reduction, but also Stamina and Ultimate costs as well. I don't know about that one mage guild spell that eats health though, that might be a special case.

Shaun98ca2 · June 2014

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Lyall84 wrote: »

Hunding's Rage does not buff any weapon abilities. It should, it even says it does, but it does not. The 5 set is currently broken at the moment.

I would hope ZOS is aware of the issue already but if not, here is an explanation. I crafted new sets to make sure my numbers are exact and the controls are not messed with.

Bottom line: the 5 set reads (at VR 9 white quality) "Increases weapon damage by 18% when using weapon abilities". This reads to me that it increases the weapon abilities damage by 18% of the weapon's portion of the damage.

Base Damage:

Completely ungeared (ie naked) my Executioner IV (two handed morph) deals 81 damage.

Gear: All gear listed is white, with no enchantments or traits, unless otherwise listed.

Level 13 vendor bought great sword (Green) = 40 damage.

VR9 crafted great sword = 134 damage.

VR9 crafted medium hunding's rage set (5 pieces) = 18% increase.

Test:
Naked with green level 13 sword, Executioner does 106 damage. So far it can be noted that a about 62% of the weapon's damage is added to the skill's damage.

Naked with white VR9 sword, Executioner does 166 damage. It appears that this weapon added about 63% of the weapon's damage to the skill's damage. Pretty consistent.

5 Piece Hunding's Rage set equipped with green level 13 sword. Executioner tool tip still displays 106 damage. It appears that the set has 0 effect. Set is broken and useless. Should be around 110 damage if you count the set as only increasing the weapons portion of the effect. Would be around 125 if the set counted to the ability as a whole.

5 Piece Hunding's Rage set equipped with white VR9 sword. Executioner tool tip still displays 166 damage. It appears that the set has 0 effect. Set is broken and useless. Should be around 180 damage if you count the set as only increasing the weapons portion of the effect. Would be around 195 if the set counted to the ability as a whole.

Conclusion: a crafted 6 trait requirement, 5 set bonus, that can do nothing but help any type of weapon skill or stamina build, is 100% useless.

this is exactly what i thought. At this point i dont think they are going to do anything to redeem the melee builds in the game any time soon. I wholeheartedly believe when every thing settles i would wager that im balance between magica, buggy quests , and phasing will be the top three reasons for the games early burn off and low retention.
Its very sad to see that almost 90 days into launch and they have not even remotely addressed this or even acknowledged it was an issue

Im pretty certain the issue was acknowledged in this thread. But I just wish everybody would hurry up and leave instead of hanging around waiting for more stuff to complain about.

Mortosk · June 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We don't have details to provide yet, but this is something we're working to address. We agree that there's a need for improvements to set bonuses for stamina builds.

Who's idea was it to give several veteran sets +1 Stamina Recovery as a 3-set bonus?

Lyall84 · June 2014

phaneub17_ESO wrote: »

Valn wrote: »

Seducer [3/5] Reduce cost of spells 3%
[5/5] 14 magicka recovery

I just like to point out that the 3pc Seducer's reduced cost applies to everything not just Magicka reduction, but also Stamina and Ultimate costs as well. I don't know about that one mage guild spell that eats health though, that might be a special case.

Interesting about the seducer set.

Lyall84 · June 2014

Mortosk wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We don't have details to provide yet, but this is something we're working to address. We agree that there's a need for improvements to set bonuses for stamina builds.

Who's idea was it to give several veteran sets +1 Stamina Recovery as a 3-set bonus?

+ to this. That does seem odd. It should be a % or 1 per vet rank or something that scales.

Valn · June 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We don't have details to provide yet, but this is something we're working to address. We agree that there's a need for improvements to set bonuses for stamina builds.

Do you have any details you can provide now?

D2player87 · June 2014

tuntuns wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We don't have details to provide yet, but this is something we're working to address. We agree that there's a need for improvements to set bonuses for stamina builds.

You know that this sounds like complete lack of planning during early development stage? Guys come on... Company that manages milions of $ should afford section to regulate such things before release...

Seriously what huge budget projects have you work on that give you the know how on the complexity of making a game like eso. Do enlighten us, at the risk of making yourself look like a complete idiot.

Valn · July 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We don't have details to provide yet, but this is something we're working to address. We agree that there's a need for improvements to set bonuses for stamina builds.

Almost a month. Do you have anything you can tell us about this?

Valn · July 2014

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom

Valn · July 2014

Still no details to provide yet?

cabernetvine_ESO · July 2014

Shalidor's curse and oblivon's foe which are supposed to give magicka regen as a 3 piece bonus don't work now - only the 5 piece bonus shows up at their respective crafting stations. What gives?

Samadhi · July 2014

Valn wrote: »

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Orgnum's Scales 3 Items Adds 157 Max Health. 5 Items If below 50% Health, increase Health Revoery by 50%.

The Arena 3 Items 157 Max Health. 4 Items Adds 350 Armor. 5 Items Reduce cost of CC Break by 15%.

Kagrenac's Hope 3 Items Adds 14 Stamina Recovery. 5 Items Decrease time to resurrect an ally by 25%.

Night Mother's Gaze 3 Items Critical attacks also reduce the targets armor by 20% for 5 seconds. 5 Items Adds 5% Spell Critical.

i'm mainly listing the things specific to magicka and stamina builds, for example all classes can take use of the night mothers gaze [3/5] bonus.

Why would a pure Magicka build want to use a set that reduces Armour when their damage is impacted by Spell Resistance and Penetration though?

kelly.medleyb14_ESO · July 2014

Valn wrote: »

Magicka Builds

Twilight's Embrace [5/5] 5% spell crit

Night Mother's Gaze [5/5] 5% spell crit

Willow's Path [3/5] 5% spell crit

Ashen Grip [5/5] 14 magicka recovery

Seducer [3/5] Reduce cost of spells 3%
[5/5] 14 magicka recovery

Magnus's gift [3/5] 5% chance free spell
[5/5] Add 105 max magicka

Oblivion's Foe [3/5] 14 Magicka recovery

Spectres Eye [3/5] adds 105 max magicka
[5/5] 20% dodge for 3 seconds after using magicka

Eyes of Mara [5/5] 3% less magicka cost when using resortation staff

Shalidor's Curse [3/5] Adds 14 magicka recovery

Stamina builds:

Nights Silence - [5/5] 5% weapon crit

Hundings Rage - [3/5] 14 stamina recovery
[5/5] +20% damage with weapon abilities

Kagrenac's Hope - [3/5] Adds 12 stamina recovery

Obviously with the non-crafted sets it's a bit more equal. But crafting sets really seem to favour magicka builds. I'd really like to see more crafted sets based around stamina and melee users.

It's not just set bonuses, the whole game caters to magic/cloth users, stamina builds are a joke, a bad one, that leaves you dead in the water with zero CC break after you wasted all your stamina trying to kill a DK 10 levels lower than you and not even denting him.

Arsenic_Touch · July 2014

Pretty much all of the set items need to be reworked. Some are so pointless and some don't even match the armor type.