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Thank you for finally listening
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Corew✭✭✭Well, we'll see.. they are rebalancing the vet zones starting on monday. It will be interesting to see if the VR zones gets more populated after that, after all once people have left the game it's much harder to get them back again.
0 -
Metacon✭✭✭
They 'announced' their plans to change. But I have not seen any change implemented in live. So personally I prefer not to get exicted about "plans" until I've seen them realized.Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »Zenimax is fixing the obscene difficulty of VR content.
The last time I got excited about plans was then the game was not released yet - and we all have seen what it turned out to be.That will get people to come back to ESO.
What makes you assume that people who have cancelled their subs and left this game would automatically flock back to this game after Zenimax just announced they will change something?
Even if they actually changed it.. I highly doubt tht all the players who have already left would be willling to pay at least 13€.. just to be able to log in and find out wether the changes are worth their money or not.
Getting former players back to re-subscribing is very difficult for most of the mmos. Would have been better to make them acutally keep their subs in the first place.
If Zenimax has lost enough subscribers and is convinced enough that their change in veteran content will make lots of people come back - you could expect them to offer a "welcome back weekend" where ALL existing player accounts would be re-activated for a couple of days to allow everyone to look for himself if the game is any good again.
I'm not sure if Zenimax is already desperate enough to feature a welcome back weekend. And if they do this it will surely not be for fixing veteran content alone.
Maybe they would do is when they finally fixed (pvp)-FPS Problems... put in usable guild shops (fulltext search), armor colourization, guild tabbarts...
But calling "Dear players, please come back... we have halved the hitpoints of V1-V5 trash mobs!"... no that would not be good enough
Any barbarian can lead a mob - but a paladin will turn a mob into an army.
Emerald Security Blog
"I used to be a PvE adventurer like you - but then I took a 'veteran content' to my knee."
"I used to be a PvP adventurer like you - but then I took patch 1.2.3 to my knee."1 -
RazielSR✭✭✭✭✭How will people find like minded people? Well, same way as now, in guilds or dungeon encounters via getting a group in zone chat / group finder.
The issue is and this is what ruined WOW for about 6 million people - to find like minded players you must actually meet them. If you don't meet them, then you can not find them.
During Vanilla the Friend List´s of people were full, as you had Elite Quest zones similar to VR´s here and grouping up for them helped you a lot. Yes you could do them solo still, but it was a real tough cookie so most players were grouping up to progress faster.
Out of that Friend List you later formed a pvp group and a guild. With that guild you then went into dungeons or started to raid.
While I don't know how easy VR will be in future, it all seems like todays WOW difficulty to me. Therefore the first and most important step for MMO´s the " early together" is skipped, but the "must together" at VR 12 in trials stays intact.
This will cause huge issues for players in the so called raid and dungeon content, because they will now rely purely on randoms and we all know that this can be tricky.
Tricky because most people never had any contact with others, therefore they don't know how to play in a group environment.
Secondly, people will know that they can just replace those people in the group and therefore they will act very rude towards the other "strangers" in the group.
Last but not least, heal and tanky Chars will be obsolete again except for Trials and Dungeons. If these two important roles are obsolete from 1-VR12, then this automatically reduces the amount of players that are willing to play these two roles, creating a massive shortcut of them at VR12 and those that might play them have zero experience with that type of Char and will make life difficult for others.
The move they do now has a lot more consequences than many people are aware of. It can destroy a great game and I am afraid that this is what will happen with ESO and its very sad as it was a wonderful experience so far.
Those who really struggled with the difficulty are going to leave at VR 12 anyways.
Its those who did not have problems however who will stay and their content is now crippled and I do not think that ESO is able to cope with that in the long run. After all we still have zero announcements for content at VR 12 which is not based on dungeons or trials.
Most ES players are used to a higher difficulty and the long levity of their game, removing this will not be in their interest, especially if no proper replacement on VR 12 is available.
You are not correct. You expected your new random mmorpg and you forget this is Elder Scrolls, this is not about just difficulty.
So, the whole forums and feedback plenty of people disbanding and ragequitting because of VR, and now a minority wants them to not release this improvement? Insane.2 -
Swampster✭✭✭If all these elite players who crave challenge..and everyone else needs to L2P rather than allow the game to be adjusted for a wider demographic want to carry on having their challenge... simply put on the crappiest medium armour you can find, run around with a white bow, with no echantments etc, and a couple of similar level daggers, change all your skills to weapon/stamina based (like bow/dw) and hey presto, plenty of challenge!
Swampriel - Nightblade (Archer Build) - Ebonheart Pact - Veteran
Swampess - DragonKnight - Eboheart Pact - Lowbie Faceroller4 -
fromtesonlineb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Not at all, the rationale for the VR experience is fine, the basis the game provides for it is perfectly plausible and allows those who don't want to roll alts to see all the content on one character.People liked 1-50 because the story still made sense, character progression was at a good pace and it felt rewarding.
Unfortunately that all goes haywire once you hit VR.
I'm an altaholic so that doesn't apply to me, but I totally accept it as part of the game. Indeed, even though I've seen the content on alts playing it again is fine, if you're an altaholic it's what you enjoy if you're not you get to see the 2/3 of the game you haven't so far.0 -
brandon✭✭✭✭i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.Edited by brandon on July 4, 2014 8:31AM2 -
seneferab16_ESO✭✭✭If all these elite players who crave challenge..and everyone else needs to L2P rather than allow the game to be adjusted for a wider demographic want to carry on having their challenge... simply put on the crappiest medium armour you can find, run around with a white bow, with no echantments etc, and a couple of similar level daggers, change all your skills to weapon/stamina based (like bow/dw) and hey presto, plenty of challenge!
Agreed.
I have a hard time understanding what is so challenging about a mob that has the exact same abilities only X% more health and X% more damage. The fight plays exactly the same with the only differences being that is lasts a lot longer and that you'll die a lot. Real challenge would be adding new, interesting abilities to mobs; maybe having them work together a lot more with a few key abilities you'd need to keep an eye out for. The current "challenge" is lazy and boring.
Aerin Treerunner, pre dinner snack3 -
RazielSR✭✭✭✭✭i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.
Maybe we were living paralell realities, but the game is almost dying because of the VR thing and mainly the insane difficulty with no reward...incredible.3 -
Metacon✭✭✭fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »the rationale for the VR experience is fine, the basis the game provides for it is perfectly plausible
The games rationale is a simple sentence by Cadwell: "what IF you had woken up in another alliance".
But it does not explain why every fracking trashmob in the enemy's supposed (level 1) starting territory then hits harder than Molag Bal himself.
Would have been a fine excuse if they simply adjustes ALL mobs in your veteran territories to level 50.
Personally I found this extremely lazy game design.. "just insert one 'what if' sentence in the game dialog - then we get away with copy/pasting two entire alliances and pushing up the difficulty"
Imho: FORCING players to play at least complete cadwells silver to have access to all tamriel skyshards/dolmens/quests was no good idea.
Any barbarian can lead a mob - but a paladin will turn a mob into an army.
Emerald Security Blog
"I used to be a PvE adventurer like you - but then I took a 'veteran content' to my knee."
"I used to be a PvP adventurer like you - but then I took patch 1.2.3 to my knee."6 -
I dont see that in this moment vet levels mobs are challenging . They are boring and difficult - its pure repetition. If u solved 3 mobs math u solved it , if u solved 4 mobs math - u solved it . Its simple as that and so many encounters eat your time and actually u dont get anything back. Making mobs in the zones easier will not ruin game for nobody. I will not miss that part specially when i get killed by 3 critters. Man if i have to die it better be epic. Guy who killed me should be big guy with huge sword or some monster. I would like to end up in history books not i animal planet video . Instead of that in my opinion ZOS needs to increase difficulty for world bosses , dolmens , vet dungeons , raids, group dungeons and give better rewards for that ( xp , loot , achievements ). When u finish vet dungeon , trial or some of end vet content u need to be feeling like u accomplished something - so anyways they have to have exciting boss mechanics , longer duration, they need to ask for more strategic approach and loot by which u will be recognised on the street.
One of most important things is that leveling process ( till the point u are able to wear best in slot gear ) is providing same chance, enjoyment and consuming same amount of time for different profiles of people so : tes guys , dungeon guys , raid guys , pvp guys, quest guys , achievers , collectors ..... All those guys have to be satisfied and it can be done.
Question is - is all that worth investing in and what place should take on priority list.
Edited by tino.antoninieb17_ESO on July 4, 2014 8:47AM1 -
RazielSR✭✭✭✭✭fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »the rationale for the VR experience is fine, the basis the game provides for it is perfectly plausible
The games rationale is a simple sentence by Cadwell: "what IF you had woken up in another alliance".
But it does not explain why every fracking trashmob in the enemy's supposed (level 1) starting territory then hits harder than Molag Bal himself.
Would have been a fine excuse if they simply adjustes ALL mobs in your veteran territories to level 50.
Personally I found this extremely lazy game design.. "just insert one 'what if' sentence in the game dialog - then we get away with copy/pasting two entire alliances and pushing up the difficulty"
Imho: FORCING players to play at least complete cadwells silver to have access to all tamriel skyshards/dolmens/quests was no good idea.
Agree, this is the biggest problem. The whole design. Do you think they will accomodate it to new quests and will forget the whole another reality thing?1 -
RazielSR✭✭✭✭✭tino.antoninieb17_ESO wrote: »I dont see that in this moment vet levels mobs are challenging . They are boring and difficult - its pure repetition. If u solved 3 mobs math u solved it , if u solved 4 mobs math - u solved it . Its simple as that and so many encounters eat your time and actually u dont get anything back. Making mobs in the zones easier will not ruin game for nobody. I will not miss that part specially when i get killed by 3 critters. Man if i have to die it better be epic. Guy who killed me should be big guy with huge sword or some monster. I would like to end up in history books not i animal planet video . Instead of that in my opinion ZOS needs to increase difficulty for world bosses , dolmens , vet dungeons , raids, group dungeons and give better rewards for that ( xp , loot , achievements ). When u finish vet dungeon , trial or some of end vet content u need to be feeling like u accomplished something - so anyways they have to have exciting boss mechanics , longer duration, they need to ask for more strategic approach and loot by which u will be recognised on the street.
One of most important things is that leveling process ( till the point u are able to wear best in slot gear ) is providing same chance, enjoyment and consuming same amount of time for different profiles of people so : tes guys , dungeon guys , raid guys , pvp guys, quest guys , achievers ..... All those guys have to be satisfied and it can be done.
Question is - is all that worth investing in and what place should take on priority list.
Yeah...priorities...I think the next step would be to redesign quests in VR. But I don't see this happening. At least, theres not a single word about it.Edited by RazielSR on July 4, 2014 8:47AM1 -
brandon✭✭✭✭i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.
Maybe we were living paralell realities, but the game is almost dying because of the VR thing and mainly the insane difficulty with no reward...incredible.
No the game is dying because of all the bugs. Most people didn't think VR was hard look. http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/115102/do-you-think-veteran-content-is-too-hard/p1
Most complaints about VR were either
A- That it goes against lore OR
B That it was a grind because you already did this on your chosen faction
Edited by brandon on July 4, 2014 8:48AM3 -
They 'announced' their plans to change. But I have not seen any change implemented in live. So personally I prefer not to get exicted about "plans" until I've seen them realized.Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »Zenimax is fixing the obscene difficulty of VR content.
The last time I got excited about plans was then the game was not released yet - and we all have seen what it turned out to be.That will get people to come back to ESO.
What makes you assume that people who have cancelled their subs and left this game would automatically flock back to this game after Zenimax just announced they will change something?
Even if they actually changed it.. I highly doubt tht all the players who have already left would be willling to pay at least 13€.. just to be able to log in and find out wether the changes are worth their money or not.
Getting former players back to re-subscribing is very difficult for most of the mmos. Would have been better to make them acutally keep their subs in the first place.
If Zenimax has lost enough subscribers and is convinced enough that their change in veteran content will make lots of people come back - you could expect them to offer a "welcome back weekend" where ALL existing player accounts would be re-activated for a couple of days to allow everyone to look for himself if the game is any good again.
I'm not sure if Zenimax is already desperate enough to feature a welcome back weekend. And if they do this it will surely not be for fixing veteran content alone.
Maybe they would do is when they finally fixed (pvp)-FPS Problems... put in usable guild shops (fulltext search), armor colourization, guild tabbarts...
But calling "Dear players, please come back... we have halved the hitpoints of V1-V5 trash mobs!"... no that would not be good enough
I agree totally. If ZOS wants them back - they have to offer them piece of meat.
Edited by tino.antoninieb17_ESO on July 4, 2014 8:53AM1 -
RazielSR✭✭✭✭✭i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.
Maybe we were living paralell realities, but the game is almost dying because of the VR thing and mainly the insane difficulty with no reward...incredible.
No the game is dying because of all the bugs. Most people didn't think VR was hard look. http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/115102/do-you-think-veteran-content-is-too-hard/p1
Most complaints about VR were either
A- That it goes against lore OR
B That it was a grind because you already did this on your chosen faction
Dude...I'm not gonna quote the whole topics here talking about the VR difficulty/boredom....That is just one poll.
Have you read the ZOS post about it? If there was not people complaining, why are they chaging it? I mena, just read the beginning of the post in development section.
Anyway i agree with your two points. But I feel that is more difficult for them to fix. I realy would like them to fix it.Edited by RazielSR on July 4, 2014 8:53AM0 -
ferzalrwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭.i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.
Maybe we were living paralell realities, but the game is almost dying because of the VR thing and mainly the insane difficulty with no reward...incredible.
It's not the difficulty level that's the problem. And "insane"? Really? It's not that hard. It's really not.
Even candycrush gets harder as you get further in.3 -
RazielSR✭✭✭✭✭ferzalrwb17_ESO wrote: ».i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.
Maybe we were living paralell realities, but the game is almost dying because of the VR thing and mainly the insane difficulty with no reward...incredible.
It's not the difficulty level that's the problem. And "insane"? Really? It's not that hard. It's really not.
Even candycrush gets harder as you get further in.
True that it is not THAT hard, but if you have in mind the amount of quests and what TES univese means, and how makes your boredom fest forget that you are playing a TES game, yes it is too hard. It distracts you too much from the immersion of TES universe.3 -
Metacon✭✭✭tino.antoninieb17_ESO wrote: »They are boring and difficult - its pure repetition.
And this is one of the core problems.. because as of my understanding the idea of playing games is to *entertain* the one who plays.
This is even more true if were talking about a subscription based game. Because if the game stops entertaining... and rather feels like a stupid. boring repetive grind. players will starts to ask themselves why they are even paying for this....
In modern civilization there is a special name for boring repetive taske you basically dont like: "work".. and modern civilization also agrees on the fact that YOU need to be paid for work... and not pay the employer for being allowed to work.
On a sidenote:
I found it funny when some Zenimax member stated the reason for overdifficult veteran content.. they wanted to "encourage" players to group play.
So when you as a player choose singe player PvE style.. after level 50 you get "encouraged" to group (through being smacked in the face repeatetly by trash mobs)
On the other hand, when I choose to to group/mass play PvP/PVE style in I have to face, lag, "phasing problems", mass disconnects on large groups and framerates ranging from 0.5 to 4.... is THAT the way Zenimax tries to "encourage" PvP players to experience single player?
It sounds absurd to 'encourage' players who chose single PvE entertainment to "group" while at the same time there are severe technical problems who 'encourage' PVP/groupplay players to go single player.
It seems as if regardless of the choice you had taken, the game wants to to play the exact opposite.
Rephrasing the Devs mantra:
"Play the opposite as you want."
Wouldnt it be easier and more fun if offering different ways of entertainment to all the players and NOT try to convince them to play any different?
Edited by Metacon on July 4, 2014 8:56AMAny barbarian can lead a mob - but a paladin will turn a mob into an army.
Emerald Security Blog
"I used to be a PvE adventurer like you - but then I took a 'veteran content' to my knee."
"I used to be a PvP adventurer like you - but then I took patch 1.2.3 to my knee."1 -
brandon✭✭✭✭i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.
Maybe we were living paralell realities, but the game is almost dying because of the VR thing and mainly the insane difficulty with no reward...incredible.
No the game is dying because of all the bugs. Most people didn't think VR was hard look. http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/115102/do-you-think-veteran-content-is-too-hard/p1
Most complaints about VR were either
A- That it goes against lore OR
B That it was a grind because you already did this on your chosen faction
Dude...I'm not gonna quote the whole topics here talking about the VR difficulty/boredom....That is just one poll.
Have you read the ZOS post about it? If there was not people complaining, why are they chaging it? I mena, just read the beginning of the post in development section.
Anyway i agree with your two points. But I feel that is more difficult for them to fix. I realy would like them to fix it.
Did you even check the poll? Polls are meant as a representation of what people want. The poll shows that the majority thought VR wasn't difficult.
In case you didn't check here are the results as of me posting this.
Do you think veteran content is too hard?
Yes 38%
No 61%
As you can see the majority don't think it's too hard. Also whose to say no one in this thread hadn't already voted in the poll?Edited by brandon on July 4, 2014 9:00AM1 -
tino.antoninieb17_ESO wrote: »They are boring and difficult - its pure repetition.
And this is one of the core problems.. because as of my understanding the idea of playing games is to *entertain* the one who plays.
This is even more true if were talking about a subscription based game. Because if the game stops entertaining... and rather feels like a stupid. boring repetive grind. players will starts to ask themselves why they are even paying for this....
In modern civilization there is a special name for boring repetive taske you basically dont like: "work".. and modern civilization also agrees on the fact that YOU need to be paid for work... and not pay the employer for being allowed to work.
On a sidenote:
I found it funny when some Zenimax member stated the reason for overdifficult veteran content.. they wanted to "encourage" players to group play.
So when you as a player choose singe player PvE style.. after level 50 you get "encouraged" to group (through being smacked in the face repeatetly by trash mobs)
On the other hand, when I choose to to group/mass play PvP/PVE style in I have to face, lag, "phasing problems", mass disconnects on large groups and framerates ranging from 0.5 to 4.... is THAT the way Zenimax tries to "encourage" PvP players to experience single player?
It sounds absurd to 'encourage' players who chose single PvE entertainment to "group" while at the same time there are severe technical problems who 'encourage' PVP/groupplay players to go single player.
It seems as if regardless of the choice you had taken, the game wants to to play the exact opposite.
Rephrasing the Devs mantra:
"Play the opposite as you want."
Wouldnt it be easier and more fun if offering different ways of entertainment to all the players and NOT try to convince them to play any different?
Agree totally !!!
I would add that most important things for each individual player are:
1) Being able to identify with your char and
2) Feeling of being successful
Those two points takes us to the class and stam/mag balancing.Edited by tino.antoninieb17_ESO on July 4, 2014 9:09AM1 -
RazielSR✭✭✭✭✭i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.
Maybe we were living paralell realities, but the game is almost dying because of the VR thing and mainly the insane difficulty with no reward...incredible.
No the game is dying because of all the bugs. Most people didn't think VR was hard look. http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/115102/do-you-think-veteran-content-is-too-hard/p1
Most complaints about VR were either
A- That it goes against lore OR
B That it was a grind because you already did this on your chosen faction
Dude...I'm not gonna quote the whole topics here talking about the VR difficulty/boredom....That is just one poll.
Have you read the ZOS post about it? If there was not people complaining, why are they chaging it? I mena, just read the beginning of the post in development section.
Anyway i agree with your two points. But I feel that is more difficult for them to fix. I realy would like them to fix it.
Did you even check the poll? Polls are meant as a representation of what people want. The poll shows that the majority thought VR wasn't difficult.
In case you didn't check here are the results as of me posting this.
Do you think veteran content is too hard?
Yes 38%
No 61%
As you can see the majority don't think it's too hard. Also whose to say no one in this thread hadn't already voted in the poll?
OMFG dude...read:One of the topics we frequentlyget feedback on is ESO’s Veteran content. Some of you may have seen our recent comments about changes we have in store for ESO’s post-50 experience. We want you to know we’ve been listening to your suggestions and concerns, but more importantly, we want to tell you what we’re doing about them. Today, we have an update from the ESO Dev Team to share with you.
Some of the concerns you’ve called out are: Veteran content is too much of a departure from the level 1 to 50 experience, playing and leveling through it is too much of a grind, and that the rewards you get don’t match the effort you have to put in to progress.
Why in the world should a company change something if it was not important?
Because of that poll?
...
Edited by RazielSR on July 4, 2014 9:08AM2 -
Hilgara✭✭✭✭✭The change is aimed at 'middle ground' so as long as it doesn't slide further when the real no hopers are still complaining after the nerf (which they will) I'm happy. Of more concern is the fact that ZOS assumed we would all just buddy up. So Craglorn is all group content. Vet was group content (for many)
ZOS seem to be assuming we all want to do group content all the time. WorryingEdited by Hilgara on July 4, 2014 9:03AM1 -
brandon✭✭✭✭i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.
Maybe we were living paralell realities, but the game is almost dying because of the VR thing and mainly the insane difficulty with no reward...incredible.
No the game is dying because of all the bugs. Most people didn't think VR was hard look. http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/115102/do-you-think-veteran-content-is-too-hard/p1
Most complaints about VR were either
A- That it goes against lore OR
B That it was a grind because you already did this on your chosen faction
Dude...I'm not gonna quote the whole topics here talking about the VR difficulty/boredom....That is just one poll.
Have you read the ZOS post about it? If there was not people complaining, why are they chaging it? I mena, just read the beginning of the post in development section.
Anyway i agree with your two points. But I feel that is more difficult for them to fix. I realy would like them to fix it.
Did you even check the poll? Polls are meant as a representation of what people want. The poll shows that the majority thought VR wasn't difficult.
In case you didn't check here are the results as of me posting this.
Do you think veteran content is too hard?
Yes 38%
No 61%
As you can see the majority don't think it's too hard. Also whose to say no one in this thread hadn't already voted in the poll?
OMFG dude...read:One of the topics we frequentlyget feedback on is ESO’s Veteran content. Some of you may have seen our recent comments about changes we have in store for ESO’s post-50 experience. We want you to know we’ve been listening to your suggestions and concerns, but more importantly, we want to tell you what we’re doing about them. Today, we have an update from the ESO Dev Team to share with you.
Some of the concerns you’ve called out are: Veteran content is too much of a departure from the level 1 to 50 experience, playing and leveling through it is too much of a grind, and that the rewards you get don’t match the effort you have to put in to progress.
Why in the world should a company change someghing if it was not important?
Because of that poll?
...
If you haven't already noticed the devs seem to do the opposite of what people want. Like I said before polls are meant to show what everyone wants. Most people didn't think VR content was difficult. So why don't you READ the results and stop acting like MOST people think VR is hard when the majority said it wasn't.1 -
RazielSR✭✭✭✭✭The change is aimed at 'middle ground' so as long as it doesn't slide further when the real no hopers are still complaining after the nerf (which they will) I'm happy. Of more concern is the fact that ZOS assumed we would all just buddy up. So Craglorn is all group content. Vet was group content (for many)
ZOS seem to be assuming we all want to do group content all the time. Worrying
Let's hope NOT PLEASE!1 -
Malpherian✭✭✭✭✭Those of you who are saying this is a bad idea for group based content concerning VR are not wrong... However...
That being said,
You have to have people actually playing in the VR areas, in order to get any type of group. Which is currently, NOT happening, the VR areas are ghost towns with no one doing the VR stuff because of the difficulty level even "if" and "while" attempting it in groups. Let alone the nightmare it is for solo individuals without a very specific Cookie Cutter Build. (Which goes against the "Play the game as whatever you want" mentality of ESO anyway).
As others have said, having to adapt is one thing, being forced to entirely respec your class to one of a very few set of very specific rotations builds and gear sets utterly destroys the point of the customizable play as you want system which ESO touts.
So either way the current VR system is utterly broken, and this change is undoubtedly a good one..Edited by Malpherian on July 4, 2014 9:12AM1 -
RazielSR✭✭✭✭✭i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.
Maybe we were living paralell realities, but the game is almost dying because of the VR thing and mainly the insane difficulty with no reward...incredible.
No the game is dying because of all the bugs. Most people didn't think VR was hard look. http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/115102/do-you-think-veteran-content-is-too-hard/p1
Most complaints about VR were either
A- That it goes against lore OR
B That it was a grind because you already did this on your chosen faction
Dude...I'm not gonna quote the whole topics here talking about the VR difficulty/boredom....That is just one poll.
Have you read the ZOS post about it? If there was not people complaining, why are they chaging it? I mena, just read the beginning of the post in development section.
Anyway i agree with your two points. But I feel that is more difficult for them to fix. I realy would like them to fix it.
Did you even check the poll? Polls are meant as a representation of what people want. The poll shows that the majority thought VR wasn't difficult.
In case you didn't check here are the results as of me posting this.
Do you think veteran content is too hard?
Yes 38%
No 61%
As you can see the majority don't think it's too hard. Also whose to say no one in this thread hadn't already voted in the poll?
OMFG dude...read:One of the topics we frequentlyget feedback on is ESO’s Veteran content. Some of you may have seen our recent comments about changes we have in store for ESO’s post-50 experience. We want you to know we’ve been listening to your suggestions and concerns, but more importantly, we want to tell you what we’re doing about them. Today, we have an update from the ESO Dev Team to share with you.
Some of the concerns you’ve called out are: Veteran content is too much of a departure from the level 1 to 50 experience, playing and leveling through it is too much of a grind, and that the rewards you get don’t match the effort you have to put in to progress.
Why in the world should a company change someghing if it was not important?
Because of that poll?
...
If you haven't already noticed the devs seem to do the opposite of what people want. Like I said before polls are meant to show what everyone wants. Most people didn't think VR content was difficult. So why don't you READ the results and stop acting like MOST people think VR is hard when the majority said it wasn't.
Oh, ok then. Good explanation. I leave it XD2 -
AngryNord✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭seneferab16_ESO wrote: »It's not like the factions are bound to the races right now anyways.
For those who didn't buy the Early Edition or whatever it was called, they are.
1 -
brandon✭✭✭✭i laugh a lot while reading some people sayign "oh no! now the hardcore will leave!...VR areas were deserted and those hardcore disbanding and now the game is gonna have a lot more players and it will be a lot more interesting to play. Many people forget that this is supposed to be an Elder Scrolls, not nother game. The immersion and exploration is the most important, not the difficulty.
Anyway, I would like to know if the rewards will be better and there will be some more soul in npcs and you will have new quests making you feel like you already killed Molag Bal. I guess no, but just asking...
I agree that it's an elder scrolls game, but it's also an mmo.
But this one is different or it should be. It is based in a franchise existing since many years ago, completely established and with a very big fanbase behind. And its an mmo, but should not be another random mmo clone. If not, the name would be another one. But no, the name is Elder Scrolls.
Anyway I don't get the poing of being more mmo or less mmo if the VR are more difficult or less. If you mean, because it forced you to group...well, the whole VR post 5 was a desert and people was grinding Craglorn like mads. So...
It is it's own mmo. Most if not all mmos in recent years have been far to easy. One of the reasons people liked this game is because it wasn't a cookie cutter mmo. I have played other TES games before though. Love the series.
Maybe we were living paralell realities, but the game is almost dying because of the VR thing and mainly the insane difficulty with no reward...incredible.
No the game is dying because of all the bugs. Most people didn't think VR was hard look. http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/115102/do-you-think-veteran-content-is-too-hard/p1
Most complaints about VR were either
A- That it goes against lore OR
B That it was a grind because you already did this on your chosen faction
Dude...I'm not gonna quote the whole topics here talking about the VR difficulty/boredom....That is just one poll.
Have you read the ZOS post about it? If there was not people complaining, why are they chaging it? I mena, just read the beginning of the post in development section.
Anyway i agree with your two points. But I feel that is more difficult for them to fix. I realy would like them to fix it.
Did you even check the poll? Polls are meant as a representation of what people want. The poll shows that the majority thought VR wasn't difficult.
In case you didn't check here are the results as of me posting this.
Do you think veteran content is too hard?
Yes 38%
No 61%
As you can see the majority don't think it's too hard. Also whose to say no one in this thread hadn't already voted in the poll?
OMFG dude...read:One of the topics we frequentlyget feedback on is ESO’s Veteran content. Some of you may have seen our recent comments about changes we have in store for ESO’s post-50 experience. We want you to know we’ve been listening to your suggestions and concerns, but more importantly, we want to tell you what we’re doing about them. Today, we have an update from the ESO Dev Team to share with you.
Some of the concerns you’ve called out are: Veteran content is too much of a departure from the level 1 to 50 experience, playing and leveling through it is too much of a grind, and that the rewards you get don’t match the effort you have to put in to progress.
Why in the world should a company change someghing if it was not important?
Because of that poll?
...
If you haven't already noticed the devs seem to do the opposite of what people want. Like I said before polls are meant to show what everyone wants. Most people didn't think VR content was difficult. So why don't you READ the results and stop acting like MOST people think VR is hard when the majority said it wasn't.
Oh, ok then. Good explanation. I leave it XD
I don't know why I bother trying to explain this to you. It's obvious nothing I say is going to change your mind. You are so blind to facts it's laughable. Zenimax needs to stop trying to please people who clearly don't know what they are talking about and start fixing the bugs in this game. People are leaving because of the BUGS. Yes some people leave because for them it's to difficult but for most people leaving it is a lot of other things.Edited by brandon on July 4, 2014 9:15AM1 -
Loco_Mofo✭✭✭✭✭Malpherian wrote: »Those of you who are saying this is a bad idea for group based content concerning VR are not wrong... However...
That being said,
You have to have people actually playing in the VR areas, in order to get any type of group. Which is currently, NOT happening, the VR areas are ghost towns with no one doing the VR stuff because of the difficulty level even "if" and "while" attempting it in groups.
So either way the current VR system is utterly broken, and this change is undoubtedly a good one..
It's a solution, I don't think it's the correct one though.
I would rather ZoS stick to their vision and instead make VR more rewarding, add more progression and fix grouping. I imagine changes like these would bring more players to VR zones, rather than simply dropping the HP & damage of mobs so that players can breeze through blindfolded instead.
It may be too late for such changes though. As you say, VR zones are basically ghost towns now. The population of the game might be too low for these fixes to change much at all.1 -
Corew✭✭✭If you haven't already noticed the devs seem to do the opposite of what people want. Like I said before polls are meant to show what everyone wants. Most people didn't think VR content was difficult. So why don't you READ the results and stop acting like MOST people think VR is hard when the majority said it wasn't.
I'd agree with you if I thought that a poll on this forum in any way represented the player base as a whole. That said it's not that it's hard, it's a boring grind.
Imho.
1