Limited Deletes - I can control myself, thanks

Erlindur · July 2014

discosoc wrote: »

That's not at all what I'm saying.

First, I had no idea there was a delete limit until I hit it. I certainly wouldn't taken the character creation path I did (and usually do with an MMO) if I knew about the limit. But since I didn't know, I'd roll up a character and play him for a about 15 minutes to get a feel for how the class abilities play, how he looks in game, etc.. Log out, maybe create a character with a new class or fix something that doesn't look quite right in-game (usually the hair color was weird), and try something else.

After trying several combinations of race, class, and weapons, I settled on one and started deleting the other characters to clean up my selection screen. After the third delete, I realized I couldn't delete any others. Unfortunately, I hadn't deleted the character that was using the name I wanted, thus my situation.

It's really not that difficult to grasp, so I'm not sure why you keep asking about why something was done.

Yes but...

Since you test tried and settled on one, you already gave a name to that one. How did you plan on using the name of another alt? Okie, no delete limit, you managed to delete the old alt. What next? How do you plan to rename the final alt with the now free name? Or delete that one again and try to recreate it from scratch? Are you sure you are not a bot?

SystemiK · July 2014

/EndFirstWorldSuffering

Kewljag_66_ESO · July 2014

hk11 wrote: »

I had my first run in with the limited delete function today. I was making a character and naturally I need to try a few times to get the correct look. I had it about right except I forgot one of the crucial steps to fixing the proportions to help with the no calves syndrome, and then BAM no more deletes and no more slots.

What is the point of this? It seems that since we pay a sub we should not have this limitation.

It's not the end of the world but having to wait (I assume 24 hrs) is sort of bad.

Its also there to help prevent someone from getting on your account and delelting ALL your charcters at the same time

discosoc · July 2014

Erlindur wrote: »

discosoc wrote: »

That's not at all what I'm saying.

First, I had no idea there was a delete limit until I hit it. I certainly wouldn't taken the character creation path I did (and usually do with an MMO) if I knew about the limit. But since I didn't know, I'd roll up a character and play him for a about 15 minutes to get a feel for how the class abilities play, how he looks in game, etc.. Log out, maybe create a character with a new class or fix something that doesn't look quite right in-game (usually the hair color was weird), and try something else.

After trying several combinations of race, class, and weapons, I settled on one and started deleting the other characters to clean up my selection screen. After the third delete, I realized I couldn't delete any others. Unfortunately, I hadn't deleted the character that was using the name I wanted, thus my situation.

It's really not that difficult to grasp, so I'm not sure why you keep asking about why something was done.

Yes but...

Since you test tried and settled on one, you already gave a name to that one. How did you plan on using the name of another alt? Okie, no delete limit, you managed to delete the old alt. What next? How do you plan to rename the final alt with the now free name? Or delete that one again and try to recreate it from scratch? Are you sure you are not a bot?

My hell, some of you can't see the forest for the trees. But sure, let me explain the incredibly nuanced and difficult answer to your question...

Once I know what class/race/look I've settled on, I just delete the character with the name I want to use, and create a new one. I'm not stuck with the "alt" that I finally decided had the right combination of things, because I only played him for 15 minutes. I just delete him, delete the guy with the name I want, and then create a new character with all the attributes and stuff that I settled on.

Eivar · July 2014

So, I'm curious, why do you have to fully create a character if you're just messing with character customization? can't you just look at what you've made and decide? Not being sarcastic or anything, I'm just genuinely curious.

Fairydragon3 · July 2014

discosoc wrote: »

Erlindur wrote: »

discosoc wrote: »

That's not at all what I'm saying.

First, I had no idea there was a delete limit until I hit it. I certainly wouldn't taken the character creation path I did (and usually do with an MMO) if I knew about the limit. But since I didn't know, I'd roll up a character and play him for a about 15 minutes to get a feel for how the class abilities play, how he looks in game, etc.. Log out, maybe create a character with a new class or fix something that doesn't look quite right in-game (usually the hair color was weird), and try something else.

After trying several combinations of race, class, and weapons, I settled on one and started deleting the other characters to clean up my selection screen. After the third delete, I realized I couldn't delete any others. Unfortunately, I hadn't deleted the character that was using the name I wanted, thus my situation.

It's really not that difficult to grasp, so I'm not sure why you keep asking about why something was done.

Yes but...

Since you test tried and settled on one, you already gave a name to that one. How did you plan on using the name of another alt? Okie, no delete limit, you managed to delete the old alt. What next? How do you plan to rename the final alt with the now free name? Or delete that one again and try to recreate it from scratch? Are you sure you are not a bot?

My hell, some of you can't see the forest for the trees. But sure, let me explain the incredibly nuanced and difficult answer to your question...

Once I know what class/race/look I've settled on, I just delete the character with the name I want to use, and create a new one. I'm not stuck with the "alt" that I finally decided had the right combination of things, because I only played him for 15 minutes. I just delete him, delete the guy with the name I want, and then create a new character with all the attributes and stuff that I settled on.

this guy actually seemed to hit the nail on the head

mad.ferretb16_ESO wrote: »

danno816_ESO wrote: »

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

This is why I love public forums. One thread crying we are punishing honest players, and one thread saying it was a no brainier and players saying it was their idea and should have been done a month ago except for zani gross incompetence.

And people wonder what is so hard about making an MMO everyone likes.

hahaha!

Thread # 1:
"ZoS sucks! They should have implemented this idea months ago to combat the bots before everyone left the game!!!!"

Thread #2:
"ZoS sucks! They should never have implemented this stupid idea, they hate all their player base and this is the kind of stuff that is driving away all their customers!!!!

gg ESO forums.

Maybe the answer is to have a feature to automatically create a thread with the opposite argument to save time.

I personally haven't deleted any character since I started but although I understand the problem the OP encountered it's entirely a one-off issue that's more than likely not going to effect anyone else.

Maybe they could add a warning to the delete process but that's about it.

hk11 · July 2014

Eivar wrote: »

So, I'm curious, why do you have to fully create a character if you're just messing with character customization? can't you just look at what you've made and decide? Not being sarcastic or anything, I'm just genuinely curious.

What you get when you login to the game is not always the same as what it appears as in the creator due to lights etc. It's not unusual for me to make 3 or 4 tries to find and fix problems with skinny calves, no neck, weird torso, etc as I try to perfect the character. Everything may look great in the creator, but dumb when you actually move the character.

Like I said, it's not the end of the world, but it is pretty annoying that I have to wait 24hrs to try again.

Lodestar · July 2014

I gave full credit on the previous thread concerning this. And now reading this, it shows I was a tad shortsighted. Just goes to show, how easy it is to do that.

I guess they figured, not many people would need to delete so often. I do understand where the OP is coming from. I have said myself, over time, when looking with a fresh pairs of eyes, later, out in the game world, your character can look very different, than it does in character creation. Different lighting and shadows can contribute to that.

Coggage · July 2014

If you can't get a character to look right even though you can view every stage of the process before you proceed, you're beyond reasonable help.

Xnemesis · July 2014

I suggested this back in May and it finally happened I also had a poll thread on this topic which was about a 50/50 split so I didn't think It would happen. The thread is a good read and the solution is a bit less drastic than my idea but it was good to know that ZoS does every once in awhile take player driven solutions and runs with them. Sorry for all those who have been affected but this completely eliminated the bot trains from wayshrines and cut down a ton on ingame mail spam.

This is the original thread from may it has good opposing arguments and feedback on it. There are a few threads that were created after the fact mentioning this solution with a few twists so thanks for helping this become an ingame feature and we can score one for the players!
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/97570/character-creation-delay-to-help-botting/p1

ShedsHisTail · July 2014

babylon wrote: »

Arsenic_Touch wrote: »

It's to combat bots remaking characters for a turn in quest that awards gold. They can run a script that nets quite a bit of gold that way and this will cut down on it.

Why can't they just flag accounts as bot/goldfarmer accounts and leave the rest of us alone. Surely it's obvious who is who by now.

It would seem like it would be obvious that they could just count the number of deletes to locate bot accounts... Except, judging by this thread, apparently there are players who can't get by without deleting 13 characters a day.

Falmer · July 2014

Sorry, I don't see this as a problem with the game, but with a problem of people NOT reading whats posted right in front of them.

When you delete a character, it tells you all about the limitation on deletions.

This is a perfectly fine and acceptable way that seemingly has stopped the bot problem that game suffered in the beginning without it. If it causes a bit of an inconvenience for those few people who can't be bothered to read and follow instructions, I am okay with that.

thorntk421 · July 2014

I've seen ALOT less bots in the game since this started. If that's what it takes so be it..I mean realistically, how many times does a real player need to delete more that 3 characters a day??

Hypertionb14_ESO · July 2014

having limitations on creation is the single most important thing in preventing spamming of all kinds in a MMO..

it was a necessity and i am glad they implemented it..

tho it does rarely give honest players a problem, the benefit is better.

Milktray · July 2014

discosoc wrote: »

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

discosoc wrote: »

It's really annoying and I had to deal with the exact same thing last week. I ended up not being able to play for a day, while waiting on the function to return.

Also, just a heads up: you only get back one delete per day, and I'm almost positive the clock is reset after your last delete. So if you delete a character at 2pm, then 4pm, then 8pm, you won't get a new delete option until 8pm the next day, at which point you'll get a single delete. If you log in at 9pm and use that delete, you'll have to wait until 9pm the next day to get a new one.

So basically, the 24 hour thing is a best case scenario assuming you don't actually use the deletes until they all reset after 3 days. Really annoying.

Wait... You were unable to play because you couldn't delete any more characters?

I had just come back to the game and decided to start fresh (I only had a level 8 or 9 from before). Like the OP, I created several characters trying to get the look right. Unfortunately, the name I was going to use for my character was among the first few I made, but done so after using my deletes (I had no idea the limit existed). So basically I had to choose between using the name I wanted and waiting until I could free it up, or use something else and play immediately.

I know a lot of people couldn't care less about character names, but I do so it was an issue.

I always try to use the same name on main.

I came back to see what game was like now and deleted old toons, didn't play the next day, made a NB and changed mind, used that one delete up and remade to Sorc.

decided was better off with NB and it was more fun .. couldn't get name back as no more [snip] deletes

Supports answer, wait 24 hours, all i wanted was the damn name.

So I have ONE delete which gets used if i delete the Sorc and apparently seems to reset the 24 hour clock. Meaning i'll have to get EVERYTHING right or be stuck waiting for delete again.

So better off wasting more time waiting for the other 2 deletes. If they wanted to do a timer, why not do it like on EVE and set it 10 hours deletion countdown on THAT character.

If it's about bots they have 8 slots to use anyway, then if this is the solution just switch to different account while the countdown runs on the other one.

Plus they most likelt have moved to WS and are getting ready for other new upcoming mmo's, leaving ESO with less anyway.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

Arthur_Spoonfondle · July 2014

Apart from the people moaning in this thread, I suspect very few people are inconvenienced by the delete limit.

It's worth it to keep the bots down and, together with everything else Zenimax have done, it seems to be working.

alreadybaked · July 2014

There is pros and cons to everything, this has been a huge problem for me. They either need to remove it or increase the amount of toons you can make

Arandear · July 2014

I like this limit, think it's good they go to these limits to stop bots.

AlexDougherty · July 2014

Arthur_Spoonfondle wrote: »

Apart from the people moaning in this thread, I suspect very few people are inconvenienced by the delete limit.

It's worth it to keep the bots down and, together with everything else Zenimax have done, it seems to be working.

I didn't even know there was a delete limit until someone opened a thread complaining about it, I've not deleted any characters yet.

Note, I know how old this thread is, no need to pint out that it's a necro.

Tabbycat · July 2014

The game is so much better since this limit was put into place. I really am sorry that this frustrates you, OP. But believe me when I say it is for the good of the game.

UrQuan · July 2014

Milktray wrote: »

I came back to see what game was like now and deleted old toons, didn't play the next day, made a NB and changed mind, used that one delete up and remade to Sorc.

decided was better off with NB and it was more fun .. couldn't get name back as no more [snip] deletes

So with each and every delete that you did you ignored the tooltip that pops up as soon as your mouse is over the delete button:

and you ignored the warning that pops up when you click on the delete button, and that won't go away until you type in DELETE:

OK, good job, you've created your own problem despite ZOS bending over backwards to ensure that you know not to do exactly what you did. Don't expect sympathy from anyone.

Milktray · July 2014

Note OVER TIME

It is not like EVE and 10 hours from the time you deleted that character to get that delete back, or 24.

It seems to be 24 and you get one, then wait 24 for another, or if i use the 1 I have now, it might reset it all over again and I have to start all 3 from now.

If it was 24 hours to get all 3 back, fair enough, it isn't. So that one delete you wanted to make before, you then have to wait 24 hours to use and then have 0 left and the counter restarts from the time you used that 1 deletion.

So no they haven't bent over backwards. They have made a poor attempt at controlling bots when the bots had basically started to move anyway and will continue to when more mmo's get released, just leaving a small amount.

If you were wanted to get rid of them you'd ban the account, not the character.

And if they are banning accounts, the character deletion shouldn't be a problem with bots. It's fine for those who have decided on their toon and are good into their levels, they won't use the deletes that often.

for newer players which i'm presuming ESO wants, it'll just annoy. Keep the delete in fine but at least put it on a 24 hour timer for THAT delete, so if you use them all then in 24 hours you can get them all back.

khele23eb17_ESO · July 2014

I just think they should just allow the deletes to accumulate over time beyond the limit of 3. It would be just as effective against bots if the limit was 10.

nerevarine1138 · July 2014

khele23eb17_ESO wrote: »

I just think they should just allow the deletes to accumulate over time beyond the limit of 3. It would be just as effective against bots if the limit was 10.

No, and there is literally no situation in which you should need to delete 3 characters in a day.

Phantax · July 2014

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

khele23eb17_ESO wrote: »

I just think they should just allow the deletes to accumulate over time beyond the limit of 3. It would be just as effective against bots if the limit was 10.

No, and there is literally no situation in which you should need to delete 3 characters in a day.

@nerevarine1138
Not exactly true. Some players are very fussy about their characters looks. The character creation screens do not always give a true representation of how your character looks in game. I think made about 5-6 attempts at my character (noting down the chosen traits each time) before I was completely happy with its looks.
I do however appreciate why zeni did what they did. Unfortunately I don't see a better alternative for them than the delete mechanic we have now !

amm7sb14_ESO · July 2014

indytims_ESO wrote: »

Mablung wrote: »

Yep. To combat bots we are going to punish our paying customers.

While this is not a problem for me, I do understand that it is for a lot of people who test out looks and whatnot with the character creator. It is one of the bright spots in this game but like all other good things, it got nerfed.

Sorry, I don't buy that at all.

You can -see- your character just fine during creation. If that's not good enough... tough.

There is no 'punishment' in having this feature. Please dig deeper in order to find more to complain about, Mablung. You fail on this one.

The character DOES look different in game than in the character creation screen.

I had to remake a character over hair color, which looked one way in the character creation screen, and looked completely different in the actual game.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO · July 2014

oh for the love of god.

I really don't care if your breton's abs don't sparkle the way they did in the character select screen. I haven't gotten a goldspam email since this change and have seen all of one bot.

I have used 3 deletes total, all in one day to clear out unused alts. If I had had to wait another day, or two, or three, or four, it would not have been a big deal.

amm7sb14_ESO · July 2014

mulv wrote: »

wow, just wow, really?? All people seem to do on here is moan about something, as soon as the Devs try to sort something or indeed do sort something then there is instantly another moan.

We moan about bots constantly......they try to help fix it with this delete limit, but no that is not good enough for some, so we will moan about the delete limit.

It really is not a big deal and quite a nice idea, and if you do screw up and use all your deletes you can't play for a WHOLE day, wow it is just ONE day of no gaming, surely we all have enough of a life to lead that we can't survive one day with out gaming??

In a game that we are paying regularly to play, we shouldn't miss out on time played due to features of said game

Tamanous · July 2014

This will sound harsh but:

Only a VERY small percentage of players will take more than 2-3 tries at making a character. Bots and gold spamming is a serious issue in any mmo. This is a counter mechanic to such threats. Simply be aware of this when making a character but the greater community health far exceeds your need to nurture your OCD.

amm7sb14_ESO · July 2014

Eivar wrote: »

So, I'm curious, why do you have to fully create a character if you're just messing with character customization? can't you just look at what you've made and decide? Not being sarcastic or anything, I'm just genuinely curious.

1.) The look in the character creation screen doesn't always translate to the in game world

2.) There's more to creating a character than appearance. There's also class skills, racial skills, etc... that people may like to scout and research to determine what they want to play.