ESO with Wildstars C.R.E.D.D sytem.

METALPUNKS

For those that don't know credd is a consumable that can be bought with real money and can be sold ingame to other players for ingame gold. On the other side of that you can buy credd from other players for ingame gold. When credd is consumed it extends your sub for 30 days. So basically either you could make gold off players by selling credd or if you don't have much money but have a lot of gold you can pat for your sub with ingame gold.

So now that that's explained how would feel if this system was in eso?

Personally I think this is genius and would love to see something along these line in elder scrolls online.

Mephane

In theory the idea is nice, in practice it mostly facilitates early speculation on rising prices (and they will rise); basically, if you grind quickly to max level, grind a lot of ingame money and put all of that into credd, you not only can finance years of game time, but also a small fortune later on when you sell your surplus credd once the prices have risen ten-fold.

(I have seen the very same thing happen with GW2 gem exchange, where if you had the ingame gold to buy in bulk as long as they were cheap at the start, would never have to spend any real money whatsoever and still being able to get anything you want out of the cash shop.)

Audigy

(I have seen the very same thing happen with GW2 gem exchange, where if you had the ingame gold to buy in bulk as long as they were cheap at the start, would never have to spend any real money whatsoever and still being able to get anything you want out of the cash shop.)

Couldn't have said it better! Exactly my concern.

METALPUNKS

Well it's good to know it does not work well with other games. That's why I asked.

DenverRalphy

Two things, either this would only support the gold sellers, or it would be the same thing as ZOS selling gold for real money. If somebody were to buy Credd with real money, they'd sell it for in-game gold at a price that would only turn a profit if they could turn that gold around and sell it for more than what they paid for the Credd.

Either way, it turns the game into a "wallet warrior" system.

Alurria

No thank you it sounds just like Neverwinters system.

Attorneyatlawl

Official goldselling, not a fan of that idea at all.

Tintifax

EVE has that too. It's basically a sanctioned way to buy gold for real money and also allows people farming enough gold to play for free.
While I'm not a fan of buying gold for money too, it can have a good side if done right: By effectively setting a cap on the gold price in this way, it helps killing off illegitimate gold sellers.

METALPUNKS

Are there or was there any games that had a good working ecomony? I can't think of one.

Gaudrath

METALPUNKS wrote: »

Are there or was there any games that had a good working ecomony? I can't think of one.

Eve Online has a pretty decent economy system. It also has the option to buy PLEX (Eve's version of C.R.E.D.D.) for ingame money. People actually trade with that stuff. So it can work, but then again, Eve economy is a juggernaut compared to ESO.

METALPUNKS

Gaudrath wrote: »

METALPUNKS wrote: »

Are there or was there any games that had a good working ecomony? I can't think of one.

Eve Online has a pretty decent economy system. It also has the option to buy PLEX (Eve's version of C.R.E.D.D.) for ingame money. People actually trade with that stuff. So it can work, but then again, Eve economy is a juggernaut compared to ESO.

I also feel the eve community is on a whole different level than any other. Some of the nicest people.

Lalai

I actually wouldn't be opposed to this in some form. Tera had them back when it was sub based, but if I remember right they were set at a fixed price. So the price for them couldn't really go up. Was more just a way for players to buy a certain amount of gold in a sense, while giving folks who maybe didn't want to do the subscription a chance to play. Tera's economy always seemed okay.. even with some of the cash shop items being on the auction house, and I don't really recall a problem with gold sellers in it, at least not prior to being F2P.

Humor

The system Tera had in place was interesting, though, I don't actually think the whole "Selling" of the sub idea for gold worked too well. As I recall, those scrolls or "sub" items didn't even last that long, it seemed more of how far Bluehole/En Masse could dip their toes into the water.

I don't remember Tera having much of a "Gold Botting" problem either. I kind of wish Tera didn't go Free to Play.

Now you can't even party with anyone in that game who speaks English. Ah well, was fun while it lasted... Wasted a lotta money in the cash shop on costumes. (well, spent, wasting would have been if I didn't get my monies worth outta it.)

Thesiren

Problem being, Eve Online has had the same system (which they call PLEX) for years (and Everquest 2 has had KRONOS), and it hasn't slowed the gold farmers down one bit. They just undercut the going rates and keep stealing those credit card numbers and identities anyway. The thing with gold farmers is that they could care less about your two bucks for gold; they want your credit card numbers and ID. They're organized criminals and they'll do whatever they have to to get those.

Rotherhans

Smart of Wildstar to copy EVE Online´s Plex system.
The best system till now to effectively combat gold sellers by directly cutting into their profits.

Of course the average MMO player doesn´t understand it at first, but it works.
The real issues is that Zenimax doesn´t seem to understand it either!

And that this may be the reason why pretty much all gold selling outfits on this planet seemingly have converged on this game.

zaria

Thesiren wrote: »

Problem being, Eve Online has had the same system (which they call PLEX) for years (and Everquest 2 has had KRONOS), and it hasn't slowed the gold farmers down one bit. They just undercut the going rates and keep stealing those credit card numbers and identities anyway. The thing with gold farmers is that they could care less about your two bucks for gold; they want your credit card numbers and ID. They're organized criminals and they'll do whatever they have to to get those.

This, it might stop the more respectable gold sellers who sell 100k gold for 15-20$ not the criminals, the ones who spam you in game is criminals as their accounts get banned so fast they will not make profit using regular accounts for this.

Rotherhans

Uh not this.
@Thesiren‌ has no idea what she´s talking about.
The PLEX etc. is the only way to effectively combat gold selling because it allows the user a clear legal path to acquiring said goal(gold).

And thus cuts directly into the goldseller´s profit.

But explaining the intricacies of this is like explaining why drug legalization is the only effective way of fighting drug abuse.
Simply impossible to explain to people with a certain, lets say "judgemental" mindset.

Catches_the_Sun

So it's pay 2 win. Have fun with that.

zaria

Rotherhans wrote: »

But explaining the intricacies of this is like explaining why drug legalization is the only effective way of fighting drug abuse.
Simply impossible to explain to people with a certain, lets say "judgemental" mindset.

However smuggling of cigarettes is big business many places and smoking is legal, here the cigarettes is heavy taxed so the smugglers undercut the price.

Gaudrath

Catches_the_Sun wrote: »

So it's pay 2 win. Have fun with that.

Haha, no it isn't. It is actually the opposite - you can extend your sub just by playing the game a lot (or if you're smart and do station trading and pile up billions, but that means pouring over excel sheets instead of blowing up ships). So if you're an avid player, you get to play for free.

Also, people who want quick access to a pile of ingame currency have two options.

1. Go give their credit card info to a bunch of shady Chinese goldsellers
2. Buy it from the same company that runs the game

ESO currently offers only choice #1.

Gwarok

can be bought with real money and can be sold ingame to other players for ingame gold

P
2
W

Starts just like this.

Shiaxi

Gwarok wrote: »

can be bought with real money and can be sold ingame to other players for ingame gold

well it's not as bad as you'd think; like many ppl mentioned before it works well in EVE..

although I don't think this'll work in ESO in it's current state.

zaria

Shiaxi wrote: »

Gwarok wrote: »

can be bought with real money and can be sold ingame to other players for ingame gold

well it's not as bad as you'd think; like many ppl mentioned before it works well in EVE..

although I don't think this'll work in ESO in it's current state.

One issue in ESO is all the one time gold sinks for horse, bank and bag space in the start of the game.
starting the game with 250K will make it easier and more pleasant.
in most other games 250K at level 10 would be pretty useless unless you spent like an drunken sailor in the AH.

Turial

CREDD system? You mean the PLEX system right?

Uviryth

METALPUNKS wrote: »

Are there or was there any games that had a good working ecomony? I can't think of one.

WoW

vyndral13preub18_ESO

The question i have is, would it be cheap enough. And only the player base could settle that . Say for example the 15 dollar sub you buy only nets you 25k. But you can buy 100k from a fold seller for that much? Isn't really much of a deterrent for people who would cheat anyway.

Then you look at the options you have to sell them. With no global ah selling the stupid things could be a pain in the rear. Unless i am confused about how this works. In tera you bought an item then sold said item in the AH.

wrlifeboil

METALPUNKS wrote: »

Are there or was there any games that had a good working ecomony? I can't think of one.

Eve and WoW. No surprise. Otherwise they wouldn't be able to charge a monthly sub if the economies in their games sucked over the long term. Eve is probably the better example. Their economy is ten times larger than the typical realm economy in WoW.

Cry_Wolfe

although i would embrace such a system if it were introduced, I'd like to add a caveat: in my humble (and lay) opinion, PLEX sales for isk has inflated EvE's economy into the high roller dominated state it is today.
Players will throw large sums of money at the game to sell for gold, and the influx of capital will inflate the game economy to the point where rarer items will be prohibitively expensive to acquire... some people will embrace and applaud such an environment, personally i'd prefer a more egalitarian economic ecosystem.
IMH(lay)O

edit: paying a sub is good, having the developer(CCP) manipulate the game to force players to buy currency(on top of paying a sub) in order to remain competitive, is not good.

Alurria

This discussion is moot. Since this is not a loot centric game there is no need to introduce a system into the game that would require the reworking of loot. Since you can craft, not every game has to be about gear. Because some people do not want to pay a monthly sub. If a person can not afford the 15$ a month then they have larger problems that need attention.

I personally don't play these games to be a financial wizard.

KerinKor

Uviryth wrote: »

METALPUNKS wrote: »

Are there or was there any games that had a good working ecomony? I can't think of one.

WoW

What economy does WOW have? I've played for years, rarely bought/sold anything, never had to.

KerinKor

pieceofyarnb14_ESO wrote: »

This discussion is moot. Since this is not a loot centric game there is no need to introduce a system into the game that would require the reworking of loot. Since you can craft, not every game has to be about gear.

Too early to tell I think, when originally released LOTRO was like this where crafting was a viable means to obtain raid gear .. Turbine changed course at the first expansion and made gearing up for raiding the same tired old gear-grind model, time will tell if ZOS cave in to the elitists like Turbine did.