Secret Nerf - You can't add a simple search feature on a guild store but you nerf searching?

chaosngn_ESO

As of today, you can no longer search guild stores. This was not in the patch notes to my knowledge.

It now says "too many searches in rapid succession"

Can we at least get an answer from devs as to why a search function (the simplest and rudimentary option on a store/auction house) was not added to this game? But when someone comes up with an addon to fix that, you nerf it?

I understand that perhaps these searches were lagging the guild store servers, but this could be alleviated by giving us an actual search function.

One would think that in designing any kind of 'store' this would be the very first thing put in place. Therefore, there must be some kind of executive decision as to why our gameplay is being gimped. Could you folks at least tell us why?

trinta

...are you serious? They seriously broke GSS?

RaZaddha

I just tested GSS, it's broken.
GG ZOS.

trinta

Ugh. Maybe the author can add speed gating to the search function. Otherwise, this might be game over for me.

KanedaSyndrome

The economy has been a big issue for ESO since the beta. It has to change or ESO will sink.

methjester

Surely this will turn the tide against the gold sellers! Surely!!

chaosngn_ESO

Normally I would disagree with you Kaneda, but we have botters flooding the market with rare items, we have botters just being a pain in the ass, we have motifs flooding the market due to the farming bug, and we have broken guild stores. While it's not economy, couple this with broken guild management (no ranks, no officer chat, no guild bank control, etc) this is not good.

I'm not doom and gloom, this is the game I've been waiting for, but there needs to be people in it for me to play, and the economy should (and I hope is) an A#1 priority.

I can't for the life of me fathom how a guild store was designed without the first and foremost feature having been added wasn't a search feature. They want to gimp us with only being able to sell to or buy from 2500 people max (and to be honest most of the people in these trade guilds are the same people in all of them), yet we can't have a search feature.

There are rumors that they are fixing the motif farming bug with the patch that is lowering the drop rate on them, but if they are going to force us to use guild stores (which I understand help curb gold selling to a degree) then we need one that works, and works well.

The gold sellers have already adjusted. They no longer see selling gold as their primary source of income, but they now sell rare mats and motifs on their websites and use the gold they farm to buy them. I've already been approached by one gold seller to buy all of my mats (it was clear several times over that this is what he was) and there is a guildie (which I do not approve of) who now knows their network and farms these items for them in exchange for gold. I am sure he's not the only one.

I've worked in a gaming studio, I understand that all of these searches going on were probably bogging down the guild servers, but please, at least give us an in-house solution to search on the guild stores.

ElliottXO

I could imagine it's because of the amount of data that is being requested. Basically the search addon simply sends a single request to every single page.

And this might be the very same reason why they did not implement the search yet. I kind of doubt it's because of the gold sellers.

Selstad

To be fair, the Guild store is a good concept and I like it, but the horrible UI for said thing is something else entirely. It was "OK" in the beginning when there were only a few items to be had, but now there are a lot of items and it just takes ages to find things.

Take Turpen per example, I tried getting some of this as my stock was running dry. I have 2 trade guilds that I wanted to look at these items for. Both are maxed out with members and have a massive amount of items. Now trying to find Turpen in this mess was like finding the needle in a haystack. Worst part is, materials showed all items that could be deconstructed for potentially the items I was looking for. I ended up spending a whole wopping hour trying to find enough Turpen to upgrade 1 item. I went afterwards to TESOElite, made a post, established connection, got the Turpen, done deal.

Not sure why Zenimax is complicating things as much as they are doing with the guild store. As said, I don't mind guild store and I don't want an AH, but at least I want some basic functionality for the guild store, if nothing else.

Marovec

As much as I enjoy the game, they should be embarrassed by the lack of functionality of the guild stores. They hyped them up so much as a design choice over auction houses, but, unfortunately.....they pretty much suck in every way imaginable.

EramTheLiar

I like the idea of the guild stores as a concept (and to be honest, in terms of "lore" it makes a lot more sense to have a bunch of decentralized guild stores than one monolithic one, even though it's a lot more inconvenient) but I have to agree the default guild store interface is terrible. Even if it *worked* it would be terrible (can't search on a name? Really?) but it's not only terrible, it doesn't *work*. I've never been able to use the search filters.

The search add-ons were genuinely useful to me. I guess if they're killing the server then I can see a justification for disabling them, but I think it would have been decent of the devs to mention they were doing that, if that's the case...

mutharex

Maybe the addon just needs to be updated, anyone checked?

Zordrage

just remove that crap and give us proper AHs.........

ShinChuck

This is painful, and something both the pro-AH and anti-AH types will pounce on you for, Bethesda. Horrid store UI + controversial Guild Store system + Powerful Lag = everyone displeased.

Greydog

So if I'm reading this correctly, some of you are saying that these new, powerful mega-servers actually cannot handle the number of requests it takes to search for items being sold even in this limited state!

It that's the case it does not bode well for the future of this game

Sidney

I can search just fine. You get that error when you hammer the search button over and over.

Press it once and be patient.

ShinChuck

Sidney wrote: »

I can search just fine. You get that error when you hammer the search button over and over.

Press it once and be patient.

I'll clarify for you the problem people are having.

First, it's not simply if you "hammer the search button over and over". There is a long wait after a single push, lag that was not there before the patch. If you want to hit "Next" to go to the second page immediately, or even third or forth, as is entirely reasonable for a variety of reasons, you are told "too many searches in rapid succession".

This is not "hammering the search button over and over".

This is not standard. This was not here before. This is not something most MMOs do. This is not "working smarter", it's "working harder" for no reason, and it is a significant change that was not explained to the playerbase.

Second, it kills the Guild Store Search addon, which many people use and would like to continue to use in lieu of a more in-depth, user-friendly UI, as again, the current one is not up to standards, as even anti-AH people fairly universally agree. Tens of thousands of people have downloaded that app and it's variants alone, to more actively participate in the economy and enhance their enjoyment of the game in a way that's beneficial to all.

kasain

Doesn't it feel like many of the game functions are like 2005? I mean no search, an outside mod fix we needed. No real HP/MPP numbers, So really you cant see your armor bonuses. You really can't see dmg you do. It almost feels like we going back to Atari 2600 days.

It just baffles me as programing should of evolved in the past ten to twenty years. A mega server was probably made because ESO was to cheap to buy many vs maintain one.

Sarenia

Have not dug around int his addon or used it, but I posit that said addon used an API function that was being abused. Not necessarily by that addon.

Sometimes the most innocuous seeming tools (in this case API functions) can be used in very creative, detrimental ways. Just off the top of my head, I could create an addon to filter guild store items based on item type and cost, and automatically buy anything that's profitable to resell. Just one example.

It's very unlikely someone at ZOS just said "Rawr, they're searching guild stores... lets kill it!"

Don't be surprised if you see all sorts of addons being broken over time, as they refine the public API system. Some will be reborn with future, more secure API updates. This addon may be reborn in such a way. Life goes on.

Tabia

ShinChuck wrote: »

If you want to hit "Next" to go to the second page immediately, or even third or forth, as is entirely reasonable for a variety of reasons, you are told "too many searches in rapid succession".

This is happening without having the addon. I don't have an addon installed and I was getting that same message when trying to click next.

Shamusangus_24

i ran into this issue this morning - (i dont have the addon just normal browsing) i found i could click "next" if i dragged the scroll bar right to the top (or bottom) of the search results without any delay. It kind of works like when you dont read the Terms and Conditions of your iphone update...

chaosngn_ESO

@syndey This is not true. I press Retrieve just once and I get the error.

drschplatt

The guild store idea is simply a horrible idea, no getting around it. Why on earth do they think it's a good idea to only be able to trade with 500 other people who's only purpose to join the group was to sell their stuff? How is that going to work?

It's like living in a town where every store is owned by Costco and the only people who know to get a membership are sales men looking to offload their stuff. To who?

AlexanderTheGreat

It's like they took all the *** parts of Skyrim, namely its UI, and shoved them into a MMO.

Blackwolfe5

The guild store looks and functions like something the Khajit dragged in, GSS made it bearable, and now they ruin it? *sigh*

Lalai

I submitted a bug report in game for this one, I encourage everyone to do the same as it doesn't just happen with the addon (if it were just the addon I'd probably advise waiting for the addon to get updated). If you go to the next page quickly in the store you'll also see the error.

In the bug report I included that with the lack of ways to refine your search (specifically when searching for materials) not being able to quickly go to the next page is a pretty big hindrance.

clocksstoppe

maybe if they provided us with proper guild store searches we wouldnt have to use algorithms that have high complexity and generate a bit of load on the server

snigernissen

nerfing search time ?

*Edited: insults aren't allowed*

nuff said....

wyrdob16_ESO

If games like GW2 can have an auctionhouse which encompasses each and every server of that game, pulling the excuse of "too many people will slow it down" just does not work anymore.

While I do agree that having multiple smaller guild stores does have some advantages, the current implementation is nothing but horrible. 500 people per trading guild is not enough to start with. 5000 might be more like it.

Furthermore, you are forced to chose between the option of being able to trade at all or having a social guild instead. Bad choice. Finally, I have yet to see a single guild store being open to the public in Cyrdodiil. The complete lack of polish to the guild store UI is just the last drop. I am not happy at all with the current system.

Morthur

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Turial

Morthur wrote: »

chaosngn_ESO wrote: »

One would think that in designing any kind of 'store' this would be the very first thing put in place. Therefore, there must be some kind of executive decision as to why our gameplay is being gimped. Could you folks at least tell us why?

I can explain:

Manager: "How many man hours do you think you'll need to design a decent guild store UI?"
Developer: "About 15 hours"
Manager: "But we're releasing the game in 3 weeks!"
Developer: "... well I guess I could do it in 12 hours...?"
Manager: "You have 2 hours! Just do whatever you can - it's only a computer game geared at gullible12 year old console morons after all - who are they going to complain to...? Their nannies?"
Developer: "...but!"
Manager: "And now stop causing problems with your negativity... I have to go to the bank on the way to my 3 o'clock golf appointment!"

Would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

Would be funny if it wasn't wrong on all aspects.