THIS is your defining moment ZOS. What you do now will echo in eternity.
Most people now know about the duping bug, and the reasons the guild banks have been turned off. Anecdotal evidence suggests it's been in widespread use. The fledgling economy is in tatters and people's confidence is shot. You now have to decide if you're gonna address the problem in a hard or soft manner.
Soft: Fix the problem and post some woolly request to please not exploit your game in future. Cross your fingers something similar doesn't happen again. When it inevitably does happen, wish you'd done more to dissuade people from using exploits
Hard: Fix the problem and actively track down and ban ALL accounts who used the dupe beyond, say, 100 dupes. A high enough bar so it totally removes any confusion over accidents or 'testing' and crosses well into deliberate exploitation. Then go after accounts who received an inordinate amount of those dupes even if they didn't actually dupe themselves. Not people who bought a few on the marketplace, but those who received multiple 100 stacks in the mail.
We don't need to be told about your response, we'll see it in action and hear about it on all the unmoderated third party forums.
This is your biggest test so far, so choose wisely because this will set the tone for the game for years.
Soft: Fix the problem and post some woolly request to please not exploit your game in future. Cross your fingers something similar doesn't happen again. When it inevitably does happen, wish you'd done more to dissuade people from using exploits
Hard: Fix the problem and actively track down and ban ALL accounts who used the dupe beyond, say, 100 dupes. A high enough bar so it totally removes any confusion over accidents or 'testing' and crosses well into deliberate exploitation. Then go after accounts who received an inordinate amount of those dupes even if they didn't actually dupe themselves. Not people who bought a few on the marketplace, but those who received multiple 100 stacks in the mail.
We don't need to be told about your response, we'll see it in action and hear about it on all the unmoderated third party forums.
This is your biggest test so far, so choose wisely because this will set the tone for the game for years.
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Turelus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So my theory was correct! :P
I knew (as of last night) there was an exploit in the game but not actually sure where or how, when I saw guild banks go offline this morning it clicked.
I would personally hope they at the very least find and destroy as many duped items as they can, it sucks for the people who purchased them unknowing but with stacks of 100 purple/gold crafting upgrades being sold and moved around it's somewhat painful for the game.
I hope those who knowingly abused it are banned and items removed as much as possible.@Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
"Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."4 -
I'm sure there will be some bans coming out for people exploiting it.You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.
Winston Churchill0 -
XDem✭✭✭I say "M'eh".
Every single MMORPG has had at least one dupe bug since its release. Regular players have absolutely no idea of the extent of it, and how much of the "damage" has been fixed once it's been found, fixed, and PR'ed away with "we will actively monitor blabla... permanently ban blabla..." etc.
Less than a month later, everyone forgot about it and the game didn't die from self combustion.
Yet, every single time a new major bug is fixed, you're going to have the wave of superlative filled posts about how this is the single most important event in the history of the internet.
I don't even see how it's relevant when the game is in its infancy, and new content is on its way with the typical power creep that will render all those duped items mildly relevant at best.Edited by XDem on April 18, 2014 9:32AM4 -
Etchesketch✭✭✭✭They won't do anything beyond fixing the exploit, if they can.
Exploit early, Exploit often.
It's a saying for a reason. The cheaters in these games will ALWAYS have the advantage, the best gear and the most gold.The number one rule of online gaming is now and has always been, Never play on Patch Day.1 -
raglau✭✭✭✭✭Nothing like a bit of Internet hyperbole first thing in the morning with my breakfast.revanghost wrote: »"Echo in eternity"?
A bit much, don't you think?
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Mufasa✭✭✭Seeing as this has supposedly been going on since the beta. I fear a wide spread item rollback or ban hammer would be far more devastating than fixing the issue and moving forward, allowing the economy to even itself out. The worst part is that people are reporting that they sent tickets in about this exploit in the beta even... So it has been a known issue since launch.0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Heard people have been exploiting this for weeks (since live game was released). They need to go back and check through all logs all the way back, people have been doing this exploit all along.0 -
Turelus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If this was really something they knew about since beta then they're completely moronic. I think Zenimax are starting to learn why pushing out games before they're ready hurts and why with an MMO it's an even stupider idea.
I hope we see some official statements from ZOS soon about this, I would actually like to see the head of their GM/Security staff come forward and speak about this one, no offence to the customer service reps on the forums but we eventually need to hear from the people making and managing the game again like we would see in beta.@Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
"Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."0 -
Mufasa✭✭✭If this was really something they knew about since beta then they're completely moronic. I think Zenimax are starting to learn why pushing out games before they're ready hurts and why with an MMO it's an even stupider idea.
I hope we see some official statements from ZOS soon about this, I would actually like to see the head of their GM/Security staff come forward and speak about this one, no offence to the customer service reps on the forums but we eventually need to hear from the people making and managing the game again like we would see in beta.
Exactly. Though I hope if they do go after people, which I would guestimate conservatively that there are probably over 20,000 people who have done it worldwide. That they fix the missing bank bug for people first, before putting that much man power in checking/banning. Would be insulting to those who have no items/cant play.
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Arreyanne✭✭✭✭If this was really something they knew about since beta then they're completely moronic. I think Zenimax are starting to learn why pushing out games before they're ready hurts and why with an MMO it's an even stupider idea.
I hope we see some official statements from ZOS soon about this, I would actually like to see the head of their GM/Security staff come forward and speak about this one, no offence to the customer service reps on the forums but we eventually need to hear from the people making and managing the game again like we would see in beta.
LMAO
The bank bug, where you loose items and slots, was also reported in BETA they didnt fix that either
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Hilandra✭✭first thing i'm reading about this.. Can't believe they found a way to dupe items on an MMO.. Ridiculous..1 -
Laerian✭✭✭People still believing in Santa holding a ban hammer.
an AH probably would ruin the economy they say...1 -
South_of_Heaven✭✭✭Well unfortunately ZOS will try and bury this whole thing.
It would be nice if they could track and punish the cheaters but it's not going to happen.
In the meantime enough legendary materials have already been produced for a good amount of the population. I guess we will see these people one-shotting us in Cyrodiil and then remember about this again.1 -
Mufasa✭✭✭South_of_Heaven wrote: »Well unfortunately ZOS will try and bury this whole thing.
It would be nice if they could track and punish the cheaters but it's not going to happen.
In the meantime enough legendary materials have already been produced for a good amount of the population. I guess we will see these people one-shotting us in Cyrodiil and then remember about this again.
Um, you do realize how little making something legendary actually changes its stats right? A rank 5 weapon that is epic may go from 120dmg to 125. That is all.... Please calm down.
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South_of_Heaven✭✭✭
Stats, enchantments, perks on each item, whole sets of these items *will* make a difference. Not only stats are affefcted. The rest of us will bleed for these upgrades. Oh and don't forget nearly infinite money.South_of_Heaven wrote: »Well unfortunately ZOS will try and bury this whole thing.
It would be nice if they could track and punish the cheaters but it's not going to happen.
In the meantime enough legendary materials have already been produced for a good amount of the population. I guess we will see these people one-shotting us in Cyrodiil and then remember about this again.
Um, you do realize how little making something legendary actually changes its stats right? A rank 5 weapon that is epic may go from 120dmg to 125. That is all.... Please calm down.
And all these to a significant part of the population, since this exploit is active a long time now.
These people are more likely to become emperors as well and complete every other achievements far more easily.
But yea, what's the big deal...
Just don't come back complaining when they kick you from parties for being undergeared or being one-shot in Cyrodiil.Edited by South_of_Heaven on April 18, 2014 1:29PM0 -
Mufasa✭✭✭South_of_Heaven wrote: »
Stats, enchantments, perks on each item, whole sets of these items *will* make a difference. Not only stats are affefcted. The rest of us will bleed for these upgrades. Oh and don't forget nearly infinite money.South_of_Heaven wrote: »Well unfortunately ZOS will try and bury this whole thing.
It would be nice if they could track and punish the cheaters but it's not going to happen.
In the meantime enough legendary materials have already been produced for a good amount of the population. I guess we will see these people one-shotting us in Cyrodiil and then remember about this again.
Um, you do realize how little making something legendary actually changes its stats right? A rank 5 weapon that is epic may go from 120dmg to 125. That is all.... Please calm down.
And all these to a significant part of the population, since this exploit is active a long time now.
These people are more likely to become emperors as well and complete every other achievements far more easily.
But yea, what's the big deal...
Just don't come back complaining when they kick you from parties for being undergeared or being one-shot in Cyrodiil.
Lol, mass amounts of money to do what with??? Buy some mounts. Upgrade bank space. Calm down.
I am assuming you are not into the Vet ranks. Just by ignorance alone. Say I make everything legendary. I have just increased my stats, statistically by only 4-6% over epic. That is not enough to even consider an unfair advantage lol.
Also, you wont ever be Emperor because people abused the "Kill 20 Players" quest in the first few days netting so many Alliance Points, you wont ever catch up. Did Zeni reset everyone's AP when they changed the quest, let alone ban those people who are now so high up on the list you wont ever catch up statistically until the campaigns reset in 2 months? Nope.
So, again, calm down. You are being overly dramatic.
Edited by Mufasa on April 18, 2014 1:39PM0 -
South_of_Heaven✭✭✭South_of_Heaven wrote: »
Stats, enchantments, perks on each item, whole sets of these items *will* make a difference. Not only stats are affefcted. The rest of us will bleed for these upgrades. Oh and don't forget nearly infinite money.South_of_Heaven wrote: »Well unfortunately ZOS will try and bury this whole thing.
It would be nice if they could track and punish the cheaters but it's not going to happen.
In the meantime enough legendary materials have already been produced for a good amount of the population. I guess we will see these people one-shotting us in Cyrodiil and then remember about this again.
Um, you do realize how little making something legendary actually changes its stats right? A rank 5 weapon that is epic may go from 120dmg to 125. That is all.... Please calm down.
And all these to a significant part of the population, since this exploit is active a long time now.
These people are more likely to become emperors as well and complete every other achievements far more easily.
But yea, what's the big deal...
Just don't come back complaining when they kick you from parties for being undergeared or being one-shot in Cyrodiil.
Lol, mass amounts of money to do what with??? Buy some mounts. Upgrade bank space. Calm down.
I am assuming you are not into the Vet ranks. Just by ignorance alone. Say I make everything legendary. I have just increased my stats, statistically by only 2% over epic. That is not enough to even consider an unfair advantage lol.
Also, you wont ever be Emperor because people abused the "Kill 20 Players" quest in the first few days netting so many Alliance Points, you wont ever catch up. Did Zeni reset everyone's AP when they changed the quest, let alone ban those people who are now so high up on the list you wont ever catch up statistically until the campaigns reset in 2 months? Nope.
So, again, calm down. You are being overly dramatic.
You are being suspiciously calm. Figures if you are one of them. The difference is not 2% and it's not epic to legendary it's more like white/green to legendary.
Infinite money does not only include maxing out every money sink in the game but also controlling the market, getting all motifs, daedra etc included and every goodie that will ever be sold besides "just the best" items.
If that does not seem like a big deal to you -"ah it's ok they just earned months of effort with a cheat, no harm done" - I am really glad, but it KINDA is when the rest of us will be playing for months and farm and bleed for that stuff.
Edited by South_of_Heaven on April 18, 2014 1:43PM1 -
Mufasa✭✭✭South_of_Heaven wrote: »
If that does not seem like a big deal to you -"ah it's ok they just earned months of effort with a cheat, no harm done" - I am really glad, but it KINDA is when the rest of us will be playing for months and farm and bleed for that stuff.
Still being far too over dramatic. You suggest a roll back? Ok, you just lost thousands of customers because they lost their valuable time invested.
Ban thousands and thousands of players, since this is being reported to have been a known, ticketed exploit since the beta. Well you just lost tens of thousands of monthly subscribers, who most likely wont come back after investing the time they spent in game prior to this being publicized.
Be rational.
Note: Upgrading from epic to legendary is a 4-6% increase. Again, you are obviously low level. Half of my gear is epic from drops and trades alone. It is not possible to one hit someone in the current pvp system, since stats scale up or down to even the playing field, as the current model stands.
Edited by Mufasa on April 18, 2014 1:54PM0 -
South_of_Heaven✭✭✭South_of_Heaven wrote: »
If that does not seem like a big deal to you -"ah it's ok they just earned months of effort with a cheat, no harm done" - I am really glad, but it KINDA is when the rest of us will be playing for months and farm and bleed for that stuff.
Still being far too over dramatic. You suggest a roll back? Ok, you just lost thousands of customers because they lost their valuable time invested.
Ban thousands and thousands of players, since this is being reported to have been a known, ticketed exploit since the beta. Well you just lost tens of thousands of monthly subscribers, who most likely wont come back after investing the time they spent in game prior to this being publicized.
Be rational.
Note: Upgrading from epic to legendary is a 4-6% increase. Again, you are obviously low level. Half of my gear is epic from drops and trades alone. It is not possible to one hit someone in the current pvp system, since stats scale up or down to even the playing field, as the current model stands.
I know the theorycraft, the soft caps, everything - they are not exactly as you make them out to be. It's still months of work no matter how "negligible" you want to make them look.
And you are even against banning all the exploiters/dupers because they are "many" and ZOS will lose subs? am beginning to seriously think you are one of them.
At any case the best solution that comes to mind with this duping madness, is a separate server clean start.
A rollback will never happen I know.Edited by South_of_Heaven on April 18, 2014 3:02PM0 -
Mufasa✭✭✭You can "thing" all you want. Obviously you do not know about the hireling abuse that is netting people 64 hireling chest per account per week then. Which is allowing people to fully upgrade their gear as well. Stop freaking out and sit down kid. Come back when you are VR5+ and have some experience in the game. Under 50 is nothing. Epics drop like candy.0
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South_of_Heaven✭✭✭You can "thing" all you want. Obviously you do not know about the hireling abuse that is netting people 64 hireling chest per account per week then. Which is allowing people to fully upgrade their gear as well. Stop freaking out and sit down kid. Come back when you are VR5+ and have some experience in the game. Under 50 is nothing. Epics drop like candy.
You can call me kid and point out a misspelled word all you want. These will surely make everyone else believe that I am a kid and you are not hehe.
Obviously you knew about that exploit and almost admitted that you also exploited it. Probably happy with your ill-gained superiority right now?
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