Taking Action Against Cheaters in ESO

VonTrox

I am really getting fed up with bots farming bosses in dungeons, they are everywhere i go ! Makes me really sick and making the game less enjoyable

Elsonso

Seabhac_SHC wrote: »

One of the main setbacks for people reporting and ignoring is that the sellers are running multiple accounts that have separate purposes; advertising being a major one where this designated type of account will run under a script. Generally these "scripts" will create characters then log into the game and advertise before logging out and eventually cycling through all the characters on the account before deleting them and starting over again in an attempt to avoid ignore lists.

This results in players ignoring characters that are generally deleted in a fairly short time after being added to the ignore list which in turn fills up their list quickly. Taking the cap off the list is one way to help legitimate players in their effort to stamp out these advertising bots but; I would have to suggest that ZoS take this even further and have the ignore function work for entire accounts automatically under a "spam designation" so that any character created from that account is ignored without having to take the extra steps of adding the user id.

Doing this would go a long way in helping players permanently ignore these accounts without extra steps, of course removing or increasing the ignore cap would also be a step in the right direction. ZoS I dare say should even take this further by tying in an automated report for spam into the above command so that the entire process to report and ignore these accounts is brought down to one action for all players.

ZoS should also take steps in following the money trail for these accounts and start black listing the credit cards and payment sources that are backing these accounts. That would be a real step in the right direction and deliver a costly problem for these companies and organizations that are behind the sellers and bots.

I disagree with this on so many points that I am not sure where to start.

First, there is no reason for them to cycle through the characters on an account to avoid ignore listings because the ignores work on the account level, not the character level. Bans work on the account level, too, so even though it looks like you are reporting the character, you are actually reporting the account.

Second, there is really no need to ignore an account for spam for more than a couple of days. After that amount of time, the probability that the account is banned is quite high. I have never had more than about 10 people in my ignore list and I generally do not put anyone in there for more than a couple minutes. When I want to ignore the vast majority of the spam completely, it is easier to turn off Zone as that also turns off the Guild, WTS, and WTB spam, the non-game chatter, and the people who just like to see their character's name in the chat box. I would not be unhappy if they removed Zone from the game completely.

Third, I am against making it easier to report spam, bots, and campers. If 85% of the customer service reports are related to these things, then it is clear that a lot of reports are being generated. The volume of reports also makes it clear that it is plenty easy enough to generate these reports. More reports about the same person will not make them ban any faster, and could actually make them ban other accounts slower. Hopefully they have automated filters that delete the duplicate reports before they get to a live person. From my perspective, what people who want faster reporting are asking for is for Zenimax to have more duplicate reports to wade through and delete. The bucket is full, asking for more water is not helpful.

Fourth, you can be sure that the accounts are being purchased with stolen credit cards. Black listing will be a waste of time. On top of that, it is unlikely that they are buying the games from Zenimax directly, so no credit card information is available. They are probably purchasing the game in blocks from some third party using a stolen credit card and then using the game codes to create the accounts. They may be activating the accounts with game time purchased with stolen cards rather than giving a credit card number to Zenimax.

GambitJ79b14_ESO

Seabhac_SHC wrote: »

...
This results in players ignoring characters that are generally deleted in a fairly short time after being added to the ignore list which in turn fills up their list quickly...

Why is this such a common misconception, out of the hundreds I've ignored I've seen maybe two had a character name the same as the userID, watch the report when you ignore, also notice the ignore list name start with the @ symbol signifying the USERID, the column is identified as USERID, not the character name as it's defined in the group menu. I am baffled how it is conceived to be just the character. With my ignore list, I clear the gold sellers out every day, I've noticed some times even a few hours later those accounts are gone.

But then to step that up is these people telling ZOS what they're doing wrong or what they should be doing... it's just plain ignorance.

kasdelfini

I am copying my my comment from "The State Of Game Address". As these bots have to be stopped!!! My idea is as follows:

A double verification check for any new characters created in ESO.

Upon creation of a character user would receive a verification Email with Code to be verified through ESO software or site. If that does not help minimize bots then double verify with an SMS Code to unlock newly created character.

Honestly, I think serious players like myself would have no issues reverifying our information, captchas, entering verification codes. - All so there would be fewer bots.

PS. You could also, cycle reverification of already created characters/accounts...

GambitJ79b14_ESO

kasdelfini wrote: »

A double verification check for any new characters created in ESO.

Upon creation of a character user would receive a verification Email with Code to be verified through ESO software or site. If that does not help minimize bots then double verify with an SMS Code to unlock newly created character.

Honestly, I think serious players like myself would have no issues reverifying our information, captchas, entering verification codes. - All so there would be fewer bots.

PS. You could also, cycle reverification of already created characters/accounts...

there would be fewer bots if people stop buying from them, but since even the buyers are breaking TOS they lose their accounts too, eventually the gold-sellers investment with start to turn and the companies won't have such a high turn around. It's not fair to put more restrictions and more hoops for general players just to make gold-sellers / bots jump through more. The problem with making more hoops is these gold-sellers have a knack for automating even the processes that aren't supposed to be able to. So really the only people additional restriction/hoops/checks/etc is going to hurt are the real players. All that's doing is trading one freedom for another... just no.

The only additional check I would want is simply for account security which is using an authenticator {edit} for initial login, but that would be optional. Certainly not for the sake of trying to lessen the amount of bots.

kasdelfini

@GambitJ79b14_ESO

How many characters does one user actually create? Maybe 1 main and two alts!

So, 30 seconds is too much time to wait after you just spend an hour creating your character... Even I dont get paid that much.. LOL

TomSamuel

Well , I got a crafter character . One in each faction to do all PvE stuff and a dedicated PVP Char and Healer Char = 6 for me .

Sarenia

I haven't seen a single bot for a couple of days in low level Aldmeri dungeons. I'm not sure what's going on, but ZOS seems to have rained fury down on them.

Latin

They probably have moved on to mid level ones in Grahtwood/Greenshade.

I think it is imperative for them to resolve the botting situation sooner rather than later; but the only way to rid of bot-facilitated trading afaik is to make gold bound to account. I suppose this is not what most players want...there's no easy long-term solution.

It is equally crucial not to (incorrectly) incriminate players who are doing the right thing. This doesn't always seem to be the case. Avoiding false positives might be something I hope they would improve on, particularly if the potential implications include permanent ban.

GambitJ79b14_ESO

kasdelfini wrote: »

@GambitJ79b14_ESO

How many characters does one user actually create? Maybe 1 main and two alts!

So, 30 seconds is too much time to wait after you just spend an hour creating your character... Even I dont get paid that much.. LOL

by that then why not have a popup captcha every 30-60 minutes in game? You're supposed to take a break from playing games after 2 hrs at the most anyway... what's 15-30 seconds out of 2hrs? Ya - and put a limit on the exp/loot you can get from any one type of monster and area withing an hour so you can't farm the area - you have to keep moving. Also put a 2 minute delay in zone chat, any more than that is spam and after the first warning is a ban. And how about limiting the amounts for trade even more, instead of 5 items take that down to 1, and limit the gold to just 500... then anyone trying to move more than 1000 gold per hour gets banned. And why not have a phone call verification to log in - Gmail does it, why not ZOS? Oh and the mail - put a 3 day delivery delay so ZOS support can review it before it sends. Here's the end-all ultimate to stop bots - how about having to verify the account creation by uploading your government issued ID, then when logging in you have to use your phone to rescan your ID so it can do a background check and verify against the MMO-user blacklist. Oh yeah, and I demand ZOS do this effective immediately or else I unsub... really? All these (even at this extreme) will not stop a gold-farmer, it may deter and discourage them, but if they want to push gold-selling they will still do it because there are still those willing and wanting to pay - it is the buyers that support the gold-sellers... no buyers - no product.

I play 1 main and 5 alts, but I have created about 15 characters all together. And if you're spending over an hour on each one, I'd say you've got something missing. {emote:/cuckoo}

my point isn't about the 30 seconds (optimally) or so that it would add, it's about adding more hoops for a real player to go through that a bot / gold farm company isn't going to care about. There's already a captcha in the account creation, do the companies care about that, no. But I will tell you there have been problems with that email verification, when it detects you're logging in from a different IP it sends that verification... sometimes that email doesn't go through like it's supposed to. Then you have to jump through more hoops, can you imagine the rage in complaints after spending "an hour" creating a character that you still can't play because of a lost email or failed verification?
Are the companies going to care about a lost email/verification ? NO... is 1 or 2 accounts being delayed because of a lost email/verification going to put a dent in a 5-10 account per hour turnover? No - and if you don't know what that means - please don't reply. So again - in the long run the only people those extra checks are going to effect are the real players who only buy 1 account.
My point is that people need to stop being so willing and demanding to trade in their freedoms to stop unwanted activity from others.

reggielee

the botting seems to have moved into higher zones on the pve landscape, turning in quests and other repeatable actions that give some gold reward. The problem is the macroing of pathing instructions, without that freedom the bots will be decreased. they need to look at the tech side first, fix that then worry about the bandaid action of one to one reporting.

GambitJ79b14_ESO

reggielee wrote: »

the botting seems to have moved into higher zones on the pve landscape, turning in quests and other repeatable actions that give some gold reward. The problem is the macroing of pathing instructions, without that freedom the bots will be decreased. they need to look at the tech side first, fix that then worry about the bandaid action of one to one reporting.

There's nothing ZOS or any program can do about Macro's - these macros are handled by 3rd party programs - easily home made - to interrupt, change, or send input directly to the OS's input handlers (input overlay) as though you pressed the keys on the keyboard and/or used the mouse. Check out AutoHotkey. As far as the game can detect - it's detecting someone at the keyboard. The bot progs have a level of a.i. as it's watching the video frame buffer for certain images/triggers to change the actions. More advanced ones will watch the internet communication packets to get positioning and other information to make better decisions on what to do. They can even be programmed to give text responses to people trying to contact them.

The bots at this level are the way they are because they're just being lazy about it as they're trying to fill in the demand. So putting on these bandaids is just going to make them take the bots to the next level to get past detection.

MercyKilling

Seabhac_SHC wrote: »

This results in players ignoring characters that are generally deleted in a fairly short time after being added to the ignore list which in turn fills up their list quickly.

Except for one little fact that you either don't know or don't get.

If you ignore someone, you're not ignoring a single character, but the whole account. It matters not if someone wipes all 8 slots and makes new characters, you've still ignored that WHOLE ACCOUNT.

The list needs to be expanded because there's far more accounts out there than the list can accommodate.
Also, these ingame GM's need to not just kill the bots, but ban them right then and there. Then poof to the lower level zones and banhammer chat spam. Send a clear and concise message that they're not welcome here.

BadVolt

I have been reporting about bots for 1 week. And still you did NOTHNIG!!! They still in the same place, with old nicks. Why don't u, guys, just said: "We don't care about our players and all their reports we are sending to bin." That will at least make sence.

dave.g.mooreub17_ESO

Yah I am getting sick of all the spam mail I get from gold sellers, probably get at least half a dozen or more a day with titles like ESO Information, or ESO Message, etc, etc. sigh.

KaizerXul

It's been said before, and I will say it again. A live GM could ban these bots on the spot. All they have to do is go dungeon to dungeon and cave to cave and they will have PLENTY to do.

Hudine

My favorite title I keep receiving for gold spam is "hey do you remember me" or something to that effect. Yes I do remember you, and I reported you then, and I just reported you again.

KerinKor

KaizerXul wrote: »

It's been said before, and I will say it again. A live GM could ban these bots on the spot. All they have to do is go dungeon to dungeon and cave to cave and they will have PLENTY to do.

And how many GMs are you suggesting ZOS employ?

As you describe it by the time the GM has cleared out the second or third dungeon the bot swarm will be back at the first .. this is a whack-a-mole ZOS CAN'T WIN!

And this does NOTHING for the army of harvesting bots pathing, teleporting and invisi-botting crafting nodes. IMO those are far, FAR more destructive to me than boss campers, bot or otherwise.

Fullenglish

Last night on Stonefalls EU there were a group of bots camping Jute spawns in a low risk area, this caused the nodes to bug and all instantly respawn when gathered. A small group of heroes (myself included) decided enough was enough and began kiting mobs to the bots which had AoE skills thus killing a few of them, however eventually i stumbled upon a bot that after a while started to move out of the AoE.

He then started chatting in zone chat declaring he was 'good at avoiding the damage' and stating that he 'loved our money' so he would keep on doing it [Botting].

I would quite like to know where the GM specifically for eradicating bots was at this point as he hadn't sent his usual server wide message saying he was online and taking PM's

I would also like to mention that If anyone from Zenimax ever reads the forums there were several of us who if asked would have no problem in policing the bots ourselves part time for free, we love the game, we want the bots gone and obviously nobody can be online 24/7 taking requests for bot removal.

(blatantly copy pasting this in every relevant thread i find, sorry)

Elirienne

Keep at it, good job. I always religiously report cheats. Eventually they will give up.

KerinKor

I've never seen one of these fabled 'system messages'.

unicorn1844

Fullenglish wrote: »

Last night on Stonefalls EU there were a group of bots camping Jute spawns in a low risk area, this caused the nodes to bug and all instantly respawn when gathered. A small group of heroes (myself included) decided enough was enough and began kiting mobs to the bots which had AoE skills thus killing a few of them, however eventually i stumbled upon a bot that after a while started to move out of the AoE.

He then started chatting in zone chat declaring he was 'good at avoiding the damage' and stating that he 'loved our money' so he would keep on doing it [Botting].

I would quite like to know where the GM specifically for eradicating bots was at this point as he hadn't sent his usual server wide message saying he was online and taking PM's

I would also like to mention that If anyone from Zenimax ever reads the forums there were several of us who if asked would have no problem in policing the bots ourselves part time for free, we love the game, we want the bots gone and obviously nobody can be online 24/7 taking requests for bot removal.

(blatantly copy pasting this in every relevant thread i find, sorry)

I was also in Stonefalls and reporting all those bots with the rapid jute spawns. There so many of them it was unbelievable. When I stop to think how long it takes one of my characters to gather 100 raw jute and how fast these guys were getting it, it just made my blood boil. I almost rage quit.

Not only do they just gather lots of raw mats but they also process it for the rare upgrade materials. Further anger ensues on my part.

I tried to lure over some netch and ended up freezing up my game and having to reload.

I took screen shots of an invisible node harvester, a lvl 3 bot ffs! Why arent certain areas level restricted?

It is so obvious to legitimate players who and where the bots and spammers are, why can't ESO find them and get rid of them?

These things are worse than fleas and twice as irritating.

Apophiss

Now the parasites are blatant enough to send mass messages through OFFICIAL ESO message systems.

I am certain that I am not the only one that has received these messages.



This is really getting out of control!

christhomas4preeb18_ESO

It's incredibly simple to resolve....do not allow gold to be traded, sent, transferred, deposited...etc. There is no reason for you to have to transfer gold to another character..If you create an Alt..it should be for the purpose of playing not as a storage device. Alt's can earn their own gold by playing just the same as any other character....If they did this Gold spammers would disappear as they would not be able to trade..Simple

So the Question is...why do you need to give any other player/character gold?

KerinKor

christhomas4preeb18_ESO wrote: »

So the Question is...why do you need to give any other player/character gold?

You don't have any friends, do you?

Loxy37

christhomas4preeb18_ESO wrote: »

It's incredibly simple to resolve....do not allow gold to be traded, sent, transferred, deposited...etc. There is no reason for you to have to transfer gold to another character..If you create an Alt..it should be for the purpose of playing not as a storage device. Alt's can earn their own gold by playing just the same as any other character....If they did this Gold spammers would disappear as they would not be able to trade..Simple

So the Question is...why do you need to give any other player/character gold?

The best way is to devalue gold. Make it very easy to come by, make no major purchases like a horse or make the horse level restricted like other MMOs.

They shot themselves in the foot by making gold very hard to come by at low levels, a bigger mistake making the horse available at level 1 because most people want one on each character so they buy gold.

GambitJ79b14_ESO

christhomas4preeb18_ESO wrote: »

It's incredibly simple to resolve....do not allow gold to be traded, sent, transferred, deposited...etc. There is no reason for you to have to transfer gold to another character..If you create an Alt..it should be for the purpose of playing not as a storage device. Alt's can earn their own gold by playing just the same as any other character....If they did this Gold spammers would disappear as they would not be able to trade..Simple

So the Question is...why do you need to give any other player/character gold?

Why not get rid of chat, and the mail system, and the official forums too since those are the places gold sellers are advertising... why not just go back to a single player game then? Locking gold trade will also require locking down the auction houses, all buying and selling... say bye to the market.
With that said - I can earn 48k gold to buy a new horse a lot faster as a Veteran Rank than I can at level one. I don't want to have to go through all the same grind to get a horse for my alts just because you can't handle the gold sellers. Same with helping out my friends in getting their horses, It sucks trying to help a friend with questing a new character when they move so slow - buying them a horse is the biggest help in power leveling.

You want to get down to the root of the problem - look at the buyers. If the gold sellers don't make any sales they will eventually drop their aggressive marketing campaign because there's not enough ROI (return of investment) to support it. Don't be so eager to give up your freedoms to get a false sense of security.
- If you lock gold trading - there's always account selling/transferring - then you can get a pre-leveled character too... and the bots/gold sellers will still be there.

Marricus

GambitJ79b14_ESO wrote: »

by that then why not have a popup captcha every 30-60 minutes in game? You're supposed to take a break from playing games after 2 hrs at the most anyway... what's 15-30 seconds out of 2hrs?

Just no, what if that pop up appears in dungeon when your team are reliant on your heals etc. I do however like the idea of diminishing returns on a boss mob, kill it more than 10 times and you get no loot. As each solo dungeon boss, generally has 1 named blue item, make that drop on first kill as a one off drop per character. So farming a particular mini boss would only net Soul Crystals, Potions and random loot after the first kill. XP drop off could be a lot quicker, no xp after 5 kills.

At least this would allow players to collects a few pots and crystals when entering a new zone and leveling within the zone.

The bots are winning right now and it spoiling the game experience for many honest gamers. I still see the same bots I reported in lower levels zone now in Cold Harbour. I have never seen a GM in Zone Chat or online in game on EU. The bots are so easy to spot I honestly don't think it would take much effort to ban them quickly.

Right now I feel like cancelling subs and trying again in 3-6 months, when hopefully they have things sorted out. PvP is becoming a joke with the speed hackers and exploiters. Saw three yesterday in one hours play. Shame really as this game has the best RvR since DAOC. That game also had its fair share of exploiters with radar exploiters but at least we saw the GM's in game and taking action.

KerinKor

Loxy37 wrote: »

The best way is to devalue gold. Make it very easy to come by, make no major purchases like a horse or make the horse level restricted like other MMOs.

They shot themselves in the foot by making gold very hard to come by at low levels, a bigger mistake making the horse available at level 1 because most people want one on each character so they buy gold.

The fundamental problem is that MMO developers insist on trying to create an 'economy' and gate access to many desirable/must-have features on a currency.

Take mounts, basing them an a currency that's hard to get certainly encourages the buyers, as you say. To avoid that make them cheap, but then you'll get howls of complaints from the 'achievers' who'll spout the tired-old "silver platter" meme.

As long as MMO developers base item acquisition on something that can be transferred between two players you'll have RMT somewhere.

So, gate items by quests or other game mechanics perhaps?

Nope, as a section of the toxic ESO community shows with the Vamp/Werewolf situation RMT will monopolise whatever gating mechanic is used and make their real-world cash that way.

BANNING BUYERS is the only long-term solution, one ZOS is refusing to take; they've been asked, they refused to answer.

christhomas4preeb18_ESO

KerinKor wrote: »

christhomas4preeb18_ESO wrote: »

So the Question is...why do you need to give any other player/character gold?

You don't have any friends, do you?

I have plenty, but I don't give them gold...they are quite happy progressing and getting their own...sounds to me like you have leechs not friends if they ask you for gold...