U51 Feedback Thread for Nowhere Vault

ZOS_Kevin

This is the official feedback thread for the new Nowhere Vault activity. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• Was it clear how to access the Nowhere Vault and begin a run?
• Did you understand how Nowhere Keys work and when/where they could be used?
• Was it clear what you needed to do within each room in order to progress?
• How did the overall difficulty of the Nowhere Vault feel?
• If you played solo or with a group, how did the experience feel?
• Did you discover any secondary goals during your run? If so, do you have any feedback on them?
• Did the rewards feel appropriate for the time and number of keys spent within the Vault?
• Did the variety of rooms and activities make you interested in returning for additional runs?
• Is there any additional feedback on this feature?

umagon

Yes.
Yes.
Yes.

It was not that difficult for the most part, I think I cleared 4 or 5 areas. The only exception would be moonlit isles, that place was brutal. I will admit I am not the best at coordinated jumping puzzles. However, I was able to make it to the center and get the skyshard. It needs at least two more check points. One at the start of the long bridge activation just before the run up the rocks where you have to do that turn around jump on the ledge. And at the top of the platform where you need to jump back down on to the star road.

I feel there should be bridge activation on that platform. It’s not until you get to that platform before you see where you need to go, and by the time you figure it out you have run out of time to make a mad dash across all the bridges. So, you have to do the rock part again. However, I don’t think the jumping difficulty should be lowered in moonlit isles.

I played solo. I could see in moonlit isles there looks to be platform that requires a group to get to once you get to the center and have one person stay at the first check point.

I don’t think I found any of the secondary goals. Unless making it to that platform listed above is one.

Yes, the rewards were what I was expecting. I do like that the unlocked chests in the areas are worth looting.

I would run it again, right now mostly for the items to make poisons.

Moonlit isles needs a portal in the center back to the main vault lobby, I ran out of keys and could not get back. Dying only put me back at the center platform. I do like the environments, that lake house was surprising cool. And some of the traps in the mushroom area (I forget what is called) were creative.

Freelancer_ESO

Was it clear how to access the Nowhere Vault and begin a run?

Yeah.

Did you understand how Nowhere Keys work and when/where they could be used?

For the most part. I was lazy and just used a Template so I would have a bunch of them.

I used 18 keys on my run and got 3 keys during the run.

Was it clear what you needed to do within each room in order to progress?

I'm pretty terrible at puzzles so some took me longer to figure out than they maybe should have but, I did get Sage's Reward Revealed within a few hours.

I ended up brute forcing the Curio Collection and clicking on everything so I would at least know where I had been because I had a horrible time finding some of the parts.


How did the overall difficulty of the Nowhere Vault feel?

I'd say it was probably fine. I'd assume most people that have the keys to do it would also have the build to do it. I did end up using the Vampire Maxer on the PTS so I'd have Mist Form to help me with the jumping puzzles since I've been horrible at them in every MMO I have played.

If you played solo or with a group, how did the experience feel?

I played solo. It was alright overall. Some moments could have probably been more fun in a group as failing a jumping puzzle over and over is more fun when you can laugh at someone else doing it as well.

Did the rewards feel appropriate for the time and number of keys spent within the Vault?

Time wise the results felt okay at least to start with. I haven't really gotten keys on Live so I'm not sure if the return is worth the keys/grinding for keys.

Did the variety of rooms and activities make you interested in returning for additional runs?

I'm not really a big puzzle person. I think on Live I'd probably run it occasionally when I had a bunch of keys but, I probably would not go grinding for keys to do runs of the area.

Is there any additional feedback on this feature?

Story Spoiler

I'm not sure the red lines between the objects in the restored component fit with the rest of the visuals

Arunei

[*] Was it clear how to access the Nowhere Vault and begin a run?
It took me a bit of time to locate it, up until I remembered it shows up on the map. After that it was fine.

[*] Did you understand how Nowhere Keys work and when/where they could be used?
For the most part.

[*] Was it clear what you needed to do within each room in order to progress?
The Lunar Wing, not immediately. It took looking around to get where I was supposed to initially go, but after that it was kind of a pain in the ass to put it mildly. I'll go into more detail in the feedback later.

The Arcanum Wing, it's...a bit more obvious, but there are annoyances with this one as well.

[*] How did the overall difficulty of the Nowhere Vault feel?
Frustrating, though less because of inherent difficulty and more because of level design itself.

[*] If you played solo or with a group, how did the experience feel?
I'm not really sure how much of a difference going in with a group would be, other than maybe others finding things as people look around. I went in on my own.

[*] Did you discover any secondary goals during your run? If so, do you have any feedback on them?
No, I didn't spend much time in the two Wings I tried because I got a bit too annoyed.

[*] Did the rewards feel appropriate for the time and number of keys spent within the Vault?
A few Chests I found contained loot that did not seem very interesting or desirable. It was nice to get some Fortunes, though it was such a small amount they might as well have not even been given to me.

[*] Did the variety of rooms and activities make you interested in returning for additional runs?
I didn't even get passed the initial two rooms of the Wings I tried, so...maybe?

[*] Is there any additional feedback on this feature?
The level design is HORRIBLY suited for playing on a character with anything beyond normal running speed, it feels like. I tried it on the character I've leveled for doing things like Heists and Pickpocketing. Her normal running speed is about the same as someone's full sprint with speed boosts.

In the Lunar Wing, it's stupidly easy to massively overshoot the initial platform you need to go down to for the bridge chain. In fact, it's too easy to overshoot a LOT of the things in there, because so many of the platforms are ridiculously small. The sheer number of times I went careening off into the abyss quickly made me irritated, and it was bad enough I was constantly having to toggle my Walk on and off (I can't Sneak to slow down because my Sneak speed is about normal running speed).

In the Arcanum Wing, it's at least a lot less easy to overshoot platforms and such. However, there are still issues. It's still easy for momentum to carry you over the edge of a mushroom and into the lava, which kills you MUCH faster than Overland lava does. You have MUCH less time to find somewhere safe to get to and then you need to hope you're where you can get to the portal back to the top. There are numerous places where if you land, you have literally NO choice but to fall down into the lava and, again, hope you can get somewhere safe before you die. There's also the poisonous mushroom that kill you almost immediately, which is far too fast considering at least one seems to be blocking the path to the Skyshard. They also reset too quickly; I was unable to figure out how to get onto the little pole leading up to that Skyshard because I had NO time between the mushroom resetting over and over. Finally, the lava bursts that do AoE damage on some of the platforms are in some REALLY bad places. The portal (or at least the one I found) at the bottom that sends you up onto the wooden platforms also puts you RIGHT in the range of the lava burst, and maybe I just have horrid luck, but it seemed every single time I used that portal, a lava burst would happen as soon as I loaded in and hit me.

I get that this is meant to be challenging, and maybe I'll have better luck on a character that isn't so fast, but playing a fast character shouldn't be so frustratingly punishing. The main point of the Vault was that it doesn't focus as much on combat and instead on things like getting around the terrain in unique or interesting ways. But it's hard to do that when you're always flying off into the ether or sliding off platforms. Environmental hazards also shouldn't be able to kill you in like 2 seconds, either, because it very much inhibits the whole exploring thing when exploring is discouraged and punished by things yeeting you back to the start.

Which is another BIG problem from the bit I played. You die or mess up anywhere and you're sent all the way back to the start of the room. I don't know if maybe I just didn't get to any checkpoints or what, but there's little that's more frustrating in a game than platforming with few to no checkpoints, especially when the whole darn thing you're playing is one giant platforming game.

Aliyavana

Was it clear how to access the Nowhere Vault and begin a run? - Yeah. It makes sense that it would be in the Thieves Guild since it was the prequel.

Did you understand how Nowhere Keys work and when/where they could be used? - Yes

Was it clear what you needed to do within each room in order to progress? - It was simple enough. You had to use your head.

How did the overall difficulty of the Nowhere Vault feel? -

It was pretty easy with two exceptions.

1. Honestly, the Moonlit Isle was annoying, not difficult. Though I trivialized some sections with streak. If I did not have that skill, I think that section would have been very terrible to navigate. I think these islands should be made more forgiving or this one might be an issue.

2. I am not sure if it was the intention, or if it is just a skill issue and I am just bad, but I had an issue with the Cabinet of Curios where you had to memorize the three items and pick up the exact ones. For me it was a plain looking chalice, the Augur of Obscure, and the Memory Stone Projection Pad thing. I took the most time on this section because I simply could not find them, that I just started to purposely pick up all the wrong ones so they would not clog up any of my screen's real estate. I swear that the three items did not spawn until I purposely started to pick up the wrong ones so the correct ones could spawn in their place. Additionally, the bosses that I presume spawn in the area when you pick wrong drop a guaranteed Nowhere Key when you kill them, so I assume choosing the wrong ones are encouraged?

If you played solo or with a group, how did the experience feel? - Solo. I am glad that I could do something at my own pace.

Did you discover any secondary goals during your run? If so, do you have any feedback on them? - I need to go back.

Did the rewards feel appropriate for the time and number of keys spent within the Vault? - It is very good source in getting leads to scry

Did the variety of rooms and activities make you interested in returning for additional runs? - Yes, its a break from the other type of content

Is there any additional feedback on this feature? - I like seeing the architecture of various cultures from throughout the game used in the Nowhere Vault. If there are new wings opened in the future, please use more styles as I like seeing it.

I did like the usage of Memory Stones to show visions of the past of things that occurred in the vault from the perspective of explorers. I'd like it if we got similar content that showed Voernet's thoughts, even if just written notes of things Voernet did. In the Thieves Guild questline, Quen said that Voernet "Loved to study cultures from all over. The codex even mentions how he collected pieces of them." I'm curious about Voernet's journey throughout Tamriel and how he came to put chunks of it into the Nowhere Vault.

DrMedBorn

jumping puzzles are just terrible with this engine. Character movement is just bad for this kind of stuff. Always stuckin walls an then falling down etc.
then you have to wait for the switch reset. Its just bad I am sorry.

YffresTrill

I have not tried the Vault yet because I do not want to spoil it for myself completely before it goes live, but learning that there is a lot of platforming has made me much less interested in it.

I dislike platforming in most games as I am very bad at it, and it is particularly janky and difficult in ESO. I am disappointed that they decided to go this route without fixing how awkward jumping is. And with mouse and keyboard, you have very little control over your character's movement speed, compounding the difficulty. I have in the past tried to do platforming to get into off-map locations, and it is always horribly frustrating and takes far too many tries for my liking.

MartianPhoenix

There should be a wayshrine directly to the entrance area, perhaps placed on the Mundus map similarly to Eyevea. Having to go through 2 additional loading screens (Glenumbra, Daggerfall Outlaws Refuge) is too much to ask for repeated visits.

shadoza

Was it clear how to access the Nowhere Vault and begin a run?
Not from the crown shop. The store kept telling me I could not pick up the quest. I went to the vault door and held no issues getting inside.
Did you understand how Nowhere Keys work and when/where they could be used?
Yes
Was it clear what you needed to do within each room in order to progress?
I tried the lunar option. I was not clear on what was needed. I thought I was told to take out a singer, which I did, then no idea what to do next.
How did the overall difficulty of the Nowhere Vault feel?
The vault was not difficult, but it was annoying for my play style. There was targets that I was not suppose d to fight. I singer that kept moving. Traps that went off before I was close enough to the trip rope. Singer moving because of noise when I was not even moving myself.
If you played solo or with a group, how did the experience feel?
I played solo but took Sharp with me because I thought I would be fighting.
Did you discover any secondary goals during your run? If so, do you have any feedback on them?
No.
Did the rewards feel appropriate for the time and number of keys spent within the Vault? I left before I finished because the vault was more frustrating than fun. It felt like one more over-complicated thief run.
Did the variety of rooms and activities make you interested in returning for additional runs?
No. As I stated, I did not complete the first vault and find no desire to attempt the others.
Is there any additional feedback on this feature?
Not worth doing endless thief stuff to gain one keep to do more endless thief stuff. I want to make noise. I want to fight. Playing against random room mechanics is not fun for me. I will likely not look for more keys in live because this was disappointing.

Soarora

Was it clear how to access the Nowhere Vault and begin a run?
Yes
Did you understand how Nowhere Keys work and when/where they could be used?
Yes
Was it clear what you needed to do within each room in order to progress?
Very much so, yes
How did the overall difficulty of the Nowhere Vault feel?
I think its near perfect
If you played solo or with a group, how did the experience feel?
It was fine solo but the curio room made me wish I had a group. I think it'd be fun to go secret finding with friends! But of course, that's only in theory... I will have to see if I can get people to help me test how it feels as a group.
Did you discover any secondary goals during your run? If so, do you have any feedback on them?
Yes and they fit smoothly into gameplay. I don't feel lost as to what to do with the information at all.
Did the rewards feel appropriate for the time and number of keys spent within the Vault?
I was pleasantly surprised by the rewards!
Did the variety of rooms and activities make you interested in returning for additional runs?
Yes. I want to do more runs right now but the doors won't open (submitted a bug report)
Is there any additional feedback on this feature?
I certainly hope that you all continue iterating on it. I'm glad to see some really unique concepts that make ESO feel more on par with how GW2 feels.

I do have an additional feedback, though... the reward room that's full of crafting nodes feels very lacklustre. If it was survey nodes or full of upgrade mats or full of furnishing mats... then it'd mean something. Now? Whatever, ignoreable.

DoofusMax

Was it clear how to access the Nowhere Vault and begin a run?

Pretty much. Urli appeared right there in the Thieves Den for any character who had completed "The Codex Caper". I think I had one character try to pick it up from the Crown Store and recall that being told that quest was a prerequisite which prevented them from picking it up.

Did you understand how Nowhere Keys work and when/where they could be used?

Yes. The in-game instructions were very clear about needing keys to enter, each portal which requires keys is clearly marked as "this will consume 1 Nowhere Key", and Nowhere Chests have the same message. I have not found a Jackpot Room yet, so can't comment.

Was it clear what you needed to do within each room in order to progress?

Mostly yes, but that also means partially no. Urli's hints are useful while still remaining vague enough to make me think. I'll note that the "let the stars be your guide" in the Lunar wing wasn't especially helpful.

How did the overall difficulty of the Nowhere Vault feel?

I've generally had a good time with it. This is not something which is going to be knocked out in a short run, so it would be helpful if there were some indication of how much time the player can expect to need to set aside to complete a wing.

If you played solo or with a group, how did the experience feel?

Solo, and not horrible. ESO's engine doesn't work especially well for platforming, so those puzzles are especially frustrating and I'll put them in the "not a fan" category because of that. The problems always reduce to "can't jump high enough", "can't jump far enough," and lots and lots of "jumped too far on that one (and died, usually)."

Did you discover any secondary goals during your run? If so, do you have any feedback on them?

Yes. The Cursed Wing has a device similar to the scribing lens which needs to be used in a particular spot to activate an effect that's needed to progress that secondary goal, but I believe that effect needs to be used in an earlier section of the wing and I didn't backtrack to find it.

Did the rewards feel appropriate for the time and number of keys spent within the Vault?

Generally yes, but I'm not much of a loot sloot to begin with. I enjoy the story, I enjoy the puzzles, and pretty much consume or decon anything else. Then I repeat on other characters as the mood takes me.

Did the variety of rooms and activities make you interested in returning for additional runs?

I'm going to have to be mostly "meh" on this. I probably will, just because "completionist," but a lot of the platforming stuff needs work/tweaking to make it more than some a random chance that I miss a jump, die, and have start over at the beginning. The concept is interesting and some parts of the implementation have been exceptionally well done, but other bits leave somewhat to be desired.

Is there any additional feedback on this feature?

Y'all get a major thumbs-up from me for stepping outside of the same-old-same-old with the Vault. I am definitely not among those who are all "this is horrid and why did you ever put something like this into the game?" The concept is solid, the exploration is outstanding, the puzzles require a lot of thought, sometimes a bit of backtracking, and then more thought. Except for a couple of bosses where combat is necessary, companions are more of a nuisance and distraction than helpful and I'd generally recommend unsummoning them. To each their own, but listening to their cries of anguish as they get nailed by something gets annoying after a very short time. I'm definitely looking forward to seeing what tweaks and fixes show up in the next iteration and will definitely be spending some time in the Vault once it hits the live servers next month.

Nestor

I would like to run the Nowhere Vault again, but it seems to be locked behind RNG to get another Nowhere key.

DoofusMax

Nestor wrote: »

I would like to run the Nowhere Vault again, but it seems to be locked behind RNG to get another Nowhere key.

If you want to farm your own keys, then go hit up Delve Bosses, World Bosses, Thieves Troves, Rumors, Favors, Treasure Chests (probably map-based since I've got none from regular overland stuff), Heists, and DEs. The drop rates for all of them are decent now but a few of the Rumors seem to be guaranteed drops in addition to the three keys each from the 10th and 20th favor from each notable.

If you'd rather just go run it again, make a throw-away Template character and put their stack of 200 into the Bank. Maybe keep them around because they have a coffer that drops another 200 each time you open it, but 200 is plenty for what's currently available.

Aliyavana

The Gallery of Curios is way too time consuming. Lots of effort have been put onto these maps and have discovered 5 secrets so far and love the fun ways that discovering them has been implemented, but anytime I get to the Gallery of Curios, my journey through the nowhere vault slows down. My time in the Gallery of Curios can stretch to 30 minutes to an hour, while other maps don't give me this trouble.

I was so happy when I finished it the second time, but I accidentally exited through the wrong portal and ended up back to the nexus, and when I walked back through the Gallery of Curious reset and I had to find the objects again. I was very disappointed that I had to find the items again.

I would like it if there was some kind of indicator that makes the objects more obvious to find. This specific area is a HUGE time sink potentially. Can we please maybe add something like a whistle that prop hunt games use to make it more obvious where the objects are? I end up just brute forcing through all the glowing objects just so I can keep track of what areas I have inspected.

P.S. Quick lore question. One of the objects you are asked to recover from this room uses the Augur of Obscure model. Sage Voernet was a Psijic Monk, so did he interact with the Augur of Obscure at one point?

Soarora

Addendum to my previous feedback now that I've completed the vault:

Soarora wrote: »

Did you discover any secondary goals during your run? If so, do you have any feedback on them?
Yes and they fit smoothly into gameplay. I don't feel lost as to what to do with the information at all.

I do think that the rumors are well-balanced where it can take a few runs but never becomes a point of major frustration. Despite me mostly knowing what I need to do next (in some cases even exactly), every step felt rewarding.

However, I feel like they work as an introduction to secrets in the vault and shouldn't be the final goal. I was expecting there to be secrets that'd take a while for people to figure out-- secrets people would have to put their heads together for. I'm not disappointed by the gryphon seal puzzles but I am disappointed that there's no puzzles of higher difficulty. (Unless there is... then I'll keep looking... but re-watching the June dev updates... I don't see a point in continuing to sniff every wall?). Things like discovering the importance of the side rooms in the room with The Prisoner and the sinking sands courtyard... and I'm very focused on the "camel room" in the Gallery of Curios. I feel like the line in the Artist's Lens note: "hidden paths descend" as well as the room layout (suspicious camels... suspicious torches... suspicious door...) imply there's something to discover there...

Soarora wrote: »

Did the variety of rooms and activities make you interested in returning for additional runs?
Yes. I want to do more runs right now but the doors won't open (submitted a bug report)

Now having completed the rumors, I don't think I'd continue to run it solo for the activities alone (unless my fixation on The Camel Room is actually meaningful) but I guess I'd rope friends into it just to see their impressions. Of course, also for the unbound lead grind... yummy...

Arunei

Very long post inbound

Okay, tried with another character who doesn't go zoom-zoom. I realized after reading some other peoples' posts that the Wings have individually named rooms, which...should have been obvious, but sometimes my brain no work.

I went back into the Lunar Wing this time and got a different starting room than the Moonlit Isles. It was one with the Cantor's and singing, didn't think the check the name of it. That one was neat and I really liked the sound design on the Cantors' singing. Seemed pretty straightforward, I poked around some but didn't seem to find any secrets. It was a bit short, would have been nice if it was longer.

The next room was one where you had to protect lanterns to light the room to the next, well, room. Didn't think the check the name for that one, either. It was VERY straightforward after just a bit of looking around, and seemed almost too easy to figure out. It was also very short and I think it would have been cool if you had to do some puzzle solving to find more bells to ring to summon the lights you need. One spawned at first and then all the other ones I needed spawned in a big group, which made it go by really fast. Not sure if that was a bug or not.

The third room was Moonlit Isles my behated. I'll say it, I HATE this room. The platforming is awful and it goes on for too long for how finicky jumping, momentum, and collision physics work in this game. After seeing someone else mention using Streak to get around that one to make it a little more bearable, I went into the Vault on my Sorc this time. The room is definitely easier to navigate with it, but even then wonky collision (such as when you jump against a surface and then slide along it horizontally until your jump ends and then you land on the ground) can get you stuck in spots where you have to jump into the void and reset your position. Please, for the love of everything, make the platforms a bit bigger. Even with my normal movement speed Sorc and toggling Walk, it's still too easy to overshoot the initial platform you have to drop onto.

The next room was what I assume to be a Treasure Room, called Magicka Flow Junction. Pretty simple, a LOT of Chests here, including a couple of the Wondrous ones that took some Keys.

I went into the Arcanum Wing next and got the same room this time I did before, Fungal Chasm. The spot where the mushroom was blocking what I thought was the Skyshard but turned out to be a checkpoint was gone this time?

Not sure if that's a bug or if it's intended for those mushrooms to have their locations randomized upon a new run. There's also a spot where you can jump onto what seems to be an invisible platform; I tried to get a screenshot but fell off before I could get one, and I couldn't get back to that spot without going clear back. I'll have to try to get it on another character since once you clear a Wing you can't go back into it. Anyway I got through this one fine this time, and Regenerative Shield came in handy for tanking the mushrooms and lava bursts.

The next room was the Hunt of the Watchers, which apparently has no map? It was pretty straightforward once I found one of the Glyphs and realized I was essentially collecting keys for the way out.

Custodian's Repository was the next room, I couldn't find whatever was supposed to be hidden, so I just went to the next room lol. Felt bad for mister Brain in a Jar, he seemed nice

The next room after that I forgot to check the name of because I got a call in the middle of it. Basically just a "survive several waves of mobs while tanking environmental damage" thing. It was pretty easy even without using the little Wisps that give you a bubble, since I had Regenerative Ward.

I have to agree that the Meditative Garden is...underwhelming as a reward room, especially compared to the Magicka Flow Junction's slew of Chests. The mat nodes need to function more like Survey nodes, they need to give like 40 of their respective mat and the Heavy Sacks should be double. There should also be at least a few Chests, including one Wondrous Chest.

I actually tried the third Wing this time and started in the Sinking Courtyard. Breaking the crystals is easy, but it's also super easy to get turned around. Luckily I managed to destroy the last crystal right before the first one would have respawned, otherwise I can see that one getting frustrating.

The Prison was a bit neat, asking the Prisoner for advice about his, well, prison, was a funny bit of dialogue, got a chuckle out of me. Despite him pointing out something about a painting, there didn't seem to be anything I could interact with in that room. Maybe I'm just dum and/or blind.

Haunted Undercroft was a bit repetitive but simple enough.

Gallery of Curios, I got the same items someone else did, Chalice, Stone Projection thing, and the Augur. This may well have been the MOST ANNOYING room after the Moonlit Isles. The first two Curios glowed blue, but the last one did not, and I spent probably at least thirty or so minutes just running around aimlessly picking up other Curios at random. That's not the annoying thing, though; the annoying thing was that it seemed at least a solid 70% of the time, interacting with a Curio would spawn a random enemy. It become very irritating. It would be fine if only the chests scattered around had the chance to summon enemies, but making it such a high chance for the Curios to do it too makes the whole thing take so much longer.

All that said, something odd happened. I don't recall seeing any Orrery Pieces in the first Wing. I got them from the other two Wings but only ended up with 5/8 after I was done. And because you can't go through a Wing again once you've done it (at least not right now, I imagine that's a bug), I'll have to do it again on another character and see if I actually get all the Pieces.

Now about the rewards. They are much better than what I was getting from the random dinky Chests scattered here and there through most of the rooms (aside from the Wondrous Chests, those were good). Of note after all three Wings I got:

11 Spectral Dissolution Ampoule
3 Chameleon Tincture Phial
Gem of Cunning
A whole slew of Gear for the Stickerbook
A whole slew of Furnishing Plans I didn't know yet
A number of Furnishings
Several Treasure Maps
Numerous Gold Gear to decon
LEADS:

I do like that Leads can be sold, that's nice, and it prevents a person from being buried under Leads that they'll never both trying to get. Or Leads that a person might want to get a couple of times (namely Furniture) but then not need a million of. The rewards do seem good, and I would certainly run the Vault numerous times considering how much stuff I can use in some way or sell if I don't need it I can get. Please, PLEASE do not mess with the drop rates of these things! The rewards here are a perfect example of how to do things, having RNG that actually favors the player instead of working against them. It encourages people to keep going through rather than frustrating them and driving them away.

Is it safe to assume there will be more Wings in the future, perhaps? There were other doorways that currently either don't work or can't be reached, so I'm guessing (and hoping) this will be expanded on in the future. Maybe there can be rooms that make use of grapple points or something? Perhaps a few more things with puzzles?

Aliyavana

I have collected all the secrets of the Nowhere Vault, and I gotta say I liked what I saw in here. Arcanum wing seemed to be a combined Telvanni/Apocrypha Style, Lunar Path was Khajiiti, and Haunted Castle was Yokudan. I do hope that we see more wings in the future in different architectural styles. While it is not confirmed the exact amount of time that Voernet lived for, I believe he was born in the Merethic Era and was at minimum still alive around 1E 1100 as a knight from Wayrest visited him, and possibly even later depending on when the Twilight Cantors came about. He traveled through Tamriel and his long life does leave a lot of potential for exploring various cultures he interacted with and may have taken inspiration for his vault for.

I was fine with the Moonlit Isle after doing it more than once. The first time around I did have issues finding what parts of the sky islands to drop down to. Maybe add some visuals like some glowing mushrooms or glowing plants that are growing downwards to the sections to drop to can be a useful hint that can help first timers.

Please add a noise indicator like something from the prop hunt games to the Gallery of Curios as that one eats so much time. Doesn't matter how many times I do it, as I will probably always have an issue as there will always be RNG on where it spawns, and at least a noise would tell me where to go.

As a Breton fan, thank you for introducing Sage Voernet as he filled that role of being that powerful Breton mage that we have asked for. I will take good care of his Quasigriff.

For anyone that wants to know the Nowhere Vault's secrets, I wrote a walkthrough below. Mods, if revealing them here is inappropriate, please feel free to delete that portion of my comment.

Note: The levels are randomized so you may have to go through the Nowhere Vault several times to discover them all. I recommend you go through Arcanum Wing, Lunar Path Wing, and then Haunted Castle Wing.
==Arcanum Wing==
===Hunt of the Watchers===
Pick up the object resting on one of the hills. Lure one of the Watchers to the start where there is a green sigil symbol and activate it to take away their immunity. Then kill the watcher to pick up its gills.

===Murky Grotto===
Stay on top of the plant you activated to start the waves and don't fully kill off the waves that spawn or the challenge will end too soon. Do not kill any toxic plants at all. Heal yourself through the upcoming damage, and stand on top of the aoe damage circle that will pop up and eventually a secret boss will spawn. After killing it, you will obtain fungal vision needed for the Fungal Chasm

===Fungal Chasm===
I recommend subclassing into Sorc's streak so you can get through the level easier. With fungal vision from the Murky Grotto level, a transparent green staircase will appear towards the left side of the map from where you first enter. I recommend streaking into the green staircase as jumping onto it is sort of hard. At the top is the Subjugating Mindspore needed for the secret in the Haunted Castle wing but you will get to that later.

===Custodian's Repository===
You will need the Astralight Lumen from the Eclipsed Hall to collect the Gryphon Seal from this level which can be found on the astral tear on the right.

==Lunar Path Wing==
===Moonlit Isles===
I recommend Sorcerer's streak skill to get through some of the trickier jumps and it does help with the timed bridges. At the very last floating island are three pillars you can turn to get bridges to spawn in an island in front of you. Once you get the correct combination, race to those islands and cross their bridges and you will collect the resonating core secret needed for the Twilight Maze level.

===Twilight Maze===
Stealth is required. If you are not stealthy, I believe the cub will despawn when the Twilight Cantors do. Ignore the main objective and avoid aggroing any mobs and accidentally activating any traps. When you get close enough to a senche cub named Little Soft Boots will become visible. I found him on the left side after activating the gong assistance (I cannot confirm yet if he only spawns on the left side), and you follow him as he takes you to the other side of the room with some crumbled rocks. You will then place the resonating core into the stone statue in the secret room to get the Cantor's Starsong for the next room.

===Eclipsed Hall===
You need the Cantor's Starsong from the Twilight Maze. After defeating the Eclipsed Hall, take the mallet located by the portal and then you will go back into the room you were just in and you will see some of the bells are now a sickly blue. Use the prompts to ring the middle bell, and also the side ones that are blue, and only the bells that are blue. You will then unlock the

===The Lakehouse===
You require Connossiur's Vision obtained from the Haunted Undercroft from the Haunted Castle Wing to unlock the Gryphon Seal.

==Haunted Castle==
===Gallery of Curios===
In one of the corners of one of the smaller rooms you will notice a purple color. Read The Destroyed Painting tablet and next to it is a pile of rubble to get the Artist's Lens. You MAY need one of the other secrets to interact with the pile of rubble, or maybe the pile appears in a random location but this needs confirmation. After interacting with the pile, go to the southeastern room which is the biggest one, and use the telescope prompt on the top of the stairs that lead down to the crypt. You will then unlock the Artist's Touch secret.

===Sinking Courtyard===
You will need the Gallery of Curio's secret to interact with the three rain totems in this area. When you activate all three you will unlock the Carafe of Salt Water secret needed for the next level.

===Haunted Undercroft===
You will need the Carafe of Salt Water to interact with the cauldron on the middle which will summon the Stewmaster which you kill to unlock the Connossiur's Vision secret.

===Prison of the Unrepentant===
You need the Subjugating Mindspore from the Fungal Chasm from the Arcanum Wing to interact with the secret to unlock the Gryphon Seal of this level. It is on one of the side rooms.

Corbinek

• Was it clear how to access the Nowhere Vault and begin a run?
  Not really. The entrance is tucked behind multiple areas, which makes returning to the Vault more cumbersome than it needs to be. I would strongly prefer direct access through a Wayshrine. You already showed us the exterior of the Vault itself during the Thieves Guild questline, and that would make an excellent staging area for the Vault. Give that exterior its own Wayshrine and have the Vault entrance lead from there. Something similar to the Wayshrine area used for the Scribing system would make the Vault feel much more like its own permanent destination rather than an activity hidden inside another hub.
  
• Did you understand how Nowhere Keys work and when/where they could be used?
  
  Yes, though some of the doorways were slightly bugged and required me to reset the instance before I could properly use the keys.
  
• Was it clear what you needed to do within each room in order to progress?
  Somewhat. The initial starting point of the Moon Path room was difficult to discover at first.
  
• How did the overall difficulty of the Nowhere Vault feel?
  Modest, and about right for general play. Nothing felt overly taxing. The jumping/platforming mechanics of the engine caused the most trouble. I experienced situations where I overshot gaps, failed to jump when intended, or completely lost momentum before a jump, resulting in falling into lava or off the course. The difficulty itself wasn't the problem; the movement system occasionally made some of the challenges feel more frustrating than difficult.
  
• If you played solo or with a group, how did the experience feel?
  I played solo. I don't feel that groups add much to the actual room gameplay beyond potentially allowing additional runs through shared key usage or increasing the speed at which rooms are completed. The discovery of the Vault's secrets may provide a stronger reason for social/group play, however, since solving those together could be a more interesting cooperative experience. Though as mostly a solo player, I intend to do that solo as well.
  
• Did you discover any secondary goals during your run? If so, do you have any feedback on them?
  I deliberately avoided pursuing most of the secondary goals so that I would have something to discover and look forward to when the content is actually released. I would also like to experience some of the secret content organically, rather than spoil all of it during PTS testing.The mount is the main driver for me to pursue these secrets. I don't actively hunt achievements, but I am a big fan of Gryphons and Quasigriffs, and the coloration on this one is particularly appealing. It feels like a reward that will be well worth the inevitable hassle of uncovering all of the secrets, especially as I will be doing so solo.
  
• Did the rewards feel appropriate for the time and number of keys spent within the Vault?
  After four full runs, I encountered a Jackpot Chest Room twice. The loot from those rooms was well worth the time and key investment. The normal runs were less exciting by comparison, but I think that gamble is part of the appeal of the system. The Meditative Gardens, however, was mostly a letdown as a special room. I expected at least survey-quality resource nodes, especially when comparable resources can be gathered in Cyrodiil without spending keys or solving puzzles. I think this room would be much more interesting if it contained higher-quality resource nodes, perhaps even some unique nodes specifically for furnishing materials such as Hardwood. That would give the room its own identity as a resource Jackpot rather than simply providing a collection of standard resource nodes. The Antiquity Lead drops were also more annoying than helpful. For multi-part Antiquities, I would strongly prefer a single tradeable item that awards one of the pieces you do not already possess rather than having every individual lead exist as its own inventory item. This would substantially reduce both inventory clutter and Guild Store clutter.
  
• Did the variety of rooms and activities make you interested in returning for additional runs?
  For the puzzles and lore, no. For the loot, yes. The randomized room rotation helps keep the experience from being completely static, but if the primary purpose of the rotation is simply to make players replay the same small collection of rooms, I worry that the novelty will wear off fairly quickly. The loot system is what currently gives me the strongest reason to return.
  
• Is there any additional feedback on this feature?
  I'm curious whether the Nowhere Vault is intended to be an evergreen system or primarily a one-off activity. When I first heard about the Vault, I assumed it was going to be a framework that could be expanded over time. The ability to add additional Wings, potentially with a yearly release of new Wings leading toward a new hidden reward, was my original interpretation of what the Vault could become.
  
  As it stands, if the Vault is simply a permanent key-to-loot converter, I feel that would be a significant waste of its potential. The Wing format seems particularly well suited to expansion. A Wing could be relatively small and self-contained while allowing you to experiment with unusual mechanics, environmental puzzles, traversal mechanics, or other gameplay ideas without having to build an entire dungeon or zone around them.
  
  It could also easily become a recurring activity tied to the larger yearly theme, with new Wings eventually leading to a new unique reward in the Sage's Trove. This would give the Vault a role similar to the other new systems being introduced: Dynamic Encounters can receive new world events, Favors can receive new mini-questlines, and Rumors can introduce emergent activities.
  
  I very much expected the Vault to eventually become another evergreen content framework rather than simply a loot generator. With the shift from Chapters toward the Tome model and the resulting reduction in the frequency of large traditional content releases, I think the Vault has the potential to fill a very useful niche: a permanent, expandable, puzzle/exploration activity that can receive small additions throughout the year. The current Vault is a good foundation. I'd just hate to see the system simply stop there.
  

Aliyavana

Thank you for acknowledging the Moonlit Isles and Cabinet of Curios feedback on Week 2's summary. I do agree with the others that the Meditative Gardens can use a buff to its rewards, and making the Nowhere Vault entrance more convenient to access would be appreciated.

DoofusMax

People believe as they believe on the inconvenience issue and I'll disagree a bit. Since Nowhere Vault is associated with the Daggerfall Thieves Guild stuff, then "Reacquisition board in the Den and look left" doesn't strike me as a huge ask. But I'll grant the multiple transitions as being an annoyance. The Hew's Bane Den at least has a moderately convenient exterior entrance, but Daggerfall requires passing through the Outlaw Refuge to reach.

Aliyavana

I do like the name puns on the npcs close to Voernet. It looks like Urli's name is a pun on the word "early", while the Ancient Direnni Quasigriff Mount's default name is Finullie which sounds like "finally".