Played Arcanist for the first time…

Tariq9898

… and holy *** that beam is so overpowered it feels like it belongs in a different game.

Compared to the Molten Whip:

- It does more single target DPS.
- While also doing massive AOE DPS (something the whip can’t do).
- No LA weaving.
- Can be done at a safe distance.
- And gives over 10k damage shield?!

I can see why people are asking for big changes 😅

preevious

But noo ! According to it's defenders, it's "fine", and it "makes the game fun".
Also, "99% of players would leave the game forever if it is ever nerfed in the slightest, and everyone will gets rabbies or something".

You are perfectly, totally right .. it is overpowered, and it deserves a nerf .. but still .. with that post, brace yourself for a festival of bad faith arguments.

Major_Mangle

You're 100% correct, the skill and the skilline itself is objectively overperforming and has been since it came out. Even for single target DPS runeblades is the "to go tool" when you don't wanna use fatecarver. There needs to be a balance between easy to play and how well something performs. The solution isn't to buff everyone to herald of tome level of performance (the game is already way too crazy powercrept) but to actually tune down the extreme outliers.

There is no fun going into PvE knowing that every other single playstyle,aside from fatecarver/runeblade spam, is going to be so far behind that you might as well not even bother putting it to use.

Xarc

preevious wrote: »

Also, "99% of players would leave the game forever if it is ever nerfed in the slightest".

enough of that...

We've been reading this non-stop for years about every important thing, and absolutely nothing indicates that players leave the game when an excessively strong skill is nerfed.

Perhaps we should stop with this old-fashioned blackmail...

Renato90085

The game too easy(oaken and arc) and game reward too few is main reason why I met new player leave game
2023 and 2024 many new player I teach/helped just make a HA sorc/arc>all thing easy like overland>clean all dungeon trifectas and farm all trial set>but not have exp and skill do real hard part > so leave game in 3~6month

Lord_Hev

The problem is not that it makes the game easy or accessible. The problem is that it is demanded and expected of you because it -overshadows- everything else. It needs to be balanced in a way that it is still powerful and accessible, but with a lowered top parse ceiling to everything else. For reference to my point, a hypothetical: If a non-arc-fatecarver build has a maximum top parse ceiling of say: 150k. Then an arcanist's top parse ceiling with beam should be 135k. Still great damage and attractive for aoe-heavy encounters, but balanced so that there is encouragement for build and class diversity in raids.

Xarc

Imagine you are ZOS.

- You have in one hand the veteran players who play really well because they know the game.
- And on the other hand, there are less experienced players who are less patient and want to match the old ones effortlessly.

What to do?
Our friends ZOS have therefore decided to introduce gameplay elements that allow players to easily and significantly increase their damage output without any effort.
This way, less experienced players can match their older counterparts without affecting their older players' damage output.

Everyone's happy and the game continues.
Or not.

tincanman

I suspect that sales of arcanist haven't yet reached a sufficient volume to trigger the summoning of the nerf hammer. And once that happens, if it happens, the arcanist will join the other paid classes in the meh category with a few broken skills remaining.

Unless subclassing forces a devaluing first - but I doubt this will seriously supersede the possible sales metric.

Daoin

all you need is a league of your own non-arcanists builds, problem solved nobody feels left out. arcanists are happy and left alone and old players feel uber again competing in thier own little way against each other

Jaimeh

Tariq9898 wrote: »

… and holy *** that beam is so overpowered it feels like it belongs in a different game.

- Can be done at a safe distance.

Which also synergizes great with Velothi, and gives you minor force (hence optionally saving you a slot from trap). With flail as an aoe spammable that also heals, it's just too good a setup not to use.

Renato90085

Daoin wrote: »

all you need is a league of your own non-arcanists builds, problem solved nobody feels left out. arcanists are happy and left alone and old players feel uber again competing in thier own little way against each other

you cant,because all new pve hardmode design for arc,or you can found a log have 5-8 no arc dd do VLC/VES trifecta
but yes, we can go back play hundreds of times easy trifecta like god slayer or Dawnbringer for any class ,because someone cant give up op 50% more power thing in 30-40 cpm

Daoin

Renato90085 wrote: »

Daoin wrote: »

all you need is a league of your own non-arcanists builds, problem solved nobody feels left out. arcanists are happy and left alone and old players feel uber again competing in thier own little way against each other

you cant,because all new pve hardmode design for arc,or you can found a log have 5-8 no arc dd do VLC/VES trifecta
but yes, we can go back play hundreds of times easy trifecta like god slayer or Dawnbringer for any class ,because someone cant give up op 50% more power thing in 30-40 cpm

excuses, to play arcanist at everthing. i am sure if you are half as skillful as you think you are with all those old classes a simple timer adjustment would have been enough. its not everyones fault that a handul of people all need the same high score on the scoreboard every week and the only way to ensure that between you is with arcanists. my guess would be half of the remaining playerbase are just as skillful players yet dont care either. infact arcanist should just be completely removed just because thats exactly the kind of decision those others of the left over playbase have come to expect in eso's 'tweaks' to success (then with any luck in another 10 years we will see a rollback on subclassing) oh and erm..if you could just get the HA build buffed back upto its former glory while we are waiting through it all...would be much appreciated
it has however been duly noted that with eso's currently considered dead again playerbase that selling achievments and meta gear runs for crowns is on the rise again, why on earth selling those achievments was ever allowed to be a thing i'll never be able to wrap my head around

Renato90085

Daoin wrote: »

Renato90085 wrote: »

Daoin wrote: »

all you need is a league of your own non-arcanists builds, problem solved nobody feels left out. arcanists are happy and left alone and old players feel uber again competing in thier own little way against each other

you cant,because all new pve hardmode design for arc,or you can found a log have 5-8 no arc dd do VLC/VES trifecta
but yes, we can go back play hundreds of times easy trifecta like god slayer or Dawnbringer for any class ,because someone cant give up op 50% more power thing in 30-40 cpm

excuses, to play arcanist at everthing. i am sure if you are as skillful as you think you are with all those old classes a simple timer adjustment would have been enough. its not everyones fault that a handul of people all need the same high score on the scoreboard every week and the only way to ensure that between you is with arcanists

sure ,as a player who is this patch NA server VLC trifecta top 1 group healer and old patch top 3~5 nb do dsr trifecta player ,now doing vrg trifecta 1portal and mini skip healer ,i still can use my pure nb with my friend meta class compete in easy hardmode or trifecta,but even the more balanced U45 is actually cant play weak class do new hardmode too,why you think new meta arc have allthing and overpower,but you still can run weak build do this too,meta beam have allthing mean weak build cant own sup set help,so you in real combat weak than parse
i mean,if normal player need like me,need parse 140k in pure class or meme subclass ,and still behind meta class 50k dps and hard clean new thing, just for get rid of the overpower beam,it easy did and fun,right?
this patch leave many player,they all need feel boring and leave game,because if beam got a reasonable nerf ,someone will say 99%player will leave game
And to be honest, even though we first time be the number one team in a patch, a lot of member thought patch was boring.
because there is only one subclass that is viable,or you want go zen dk jail

Daoin

sorry but the mumbo jumbo does not impress or mean anything to me, if anything just go on and carry on playing the way you like except try to actually make the game better not worse or stuck in its own time loop while pretending to actually in reality be the best healer around. either way i would never know you as i dont ever look at the leaderboards except to see who is insulting who in normal groups and for what reason involving meta, and i am 100% sure that in eso's line up of healers you are also just a normal run of the mill healer no better or worse than anyone else. subclassing makes the game easier for experienced and new players to successfully play together especially in a declining playerbase, i dont even have to like it to know it works in its own way, i'll be damned though yes if i cared about how it effected a few players that stayed yes i care alot left but that had much more to do with the lead upto subclassing if anything else too. i also do not do trifectas because to be honest i dont want to depend on 11 other players for any personal achievment but thats me personally, that and the fact i dont have the patience to play like a robot
it is a miracle half the playerbase just stuck around after maintenance times started to excede 10 hours if anything else to me
is like shinobi as a single player game, you run around in circles doing the exact same thing with 3 lives until you do it in one
i am probably known for saying in the past experienced veteran and long time players should have something to reflect on thier experience playing the game but eso simply does not have it yet and in my opinion looking at the new direction of the game never will so its best to just deal i think and make something of the new play your own way thing that suits you guys

Renato90085

Daoin wrote: »

sorry but the mumbo jumbo does not impress or mean anything to me, if anything just go on and carry on playing the way you like except try to actually make the game better not worse or stuck in its own time loop while pretending to actually in reality be the best healer around. either way i would never know you as i dont ever look at the leaderboards, and i am 100% sure that in eso's line up of healers you are also just a normal run of the mill healer no better or worse than anyone else. subclassing makes the game easier for experienced and new players to successfully play together especially in a declining playerbase, i dont even have to like it to know it works in its own way, i'll be damned though yes if i cared about how it effected a few players that stayed yes i care alot left but that had much more to do with the lead upto subclassing if anything else too. i also do not do trifectas because to be honest i dont want to depend on 11 other players for any personal achievment but thats me personally, that and the fact i dont have the patience to play like a robot
it is a miracle half the playerbase just stuck around after maintenance times started to excede 10 hours if anything else to me

but that's exactly what we doing,hope zos balance for save the player dont leave game
i mean,the beam overpower,if today they lost 20% dmg ,maybe 30-40k dps ,beam still better than 80% build and still easy use in pveendgame
and normal/no exp player like you still not feel the difference,because your 40k dps lost 20% is 8k
overland mobs still will dean in 3sec
they 2k dmg still cant broken your 12-16k shield
all dungron still easy,because they are design in old balance patch
and real hard part ,the normal player can't do it regardless of whether there is balance or not.
so why your normal will leave because a reasonable nerf?
are they not feel,oh,now i finally can in dungron use my fun subclass do dmg,not just have team member use beam burn allthing in 1sec and you only can watch?
and dont forget,the game lag/dc ,lost many player from arc and azureblight op patch
why you only think player leave just because old arc shield nerf 8%

Daoin

D Wos ere <--- graffiti

ADarklore

People seem to forget, the ENTIRE Arcanist class is 'designed around' Fatecarver. If they nerfed Fatecarver, they would have nothing else that hits hard enough and would basically gut the entire class. Also keep in mind that NO OTHER CLASS has a system like the crux system- which is also why Fatecarver performs so well. Yet, even with crux, no other skill in Arcanist class would be able to compete with other classes. So yes, Fatecarver is a 'one size fits all' for Arcanist, whereas other classes have other skills/weapons they can use... but weapons don't work with the crux system. So as you can see, crux is truly the crux of the problem.

preevious

ADarklore wrote: »

People seem to forget, the ENTIRE Arcanist class is 'designed around' Fatecarver. If they nerfed Fatecarver, they would have nothing else that hits hard enough and would basically gut the entire class. Also keep in mind that NO OTHER CLASS has a system like the crux system- which is also why Fatecarver performs so well. Yet, even with crux, no other skill in Arcanist class would be able to compete with other classes. So yes, Fatecarver is a 'one size fits all' for Arcanist, whereas other classes have other skills/weapons they can use... but weapons don't work with the crux system. So as you can see, crux is truly the crux of the problem.

That's plain wrong. Arcanist is overperforming AoE wise. If fatecarver is nerfed in that regard, it would only bring arcanist on par with the other classes. That is not "gutting the class".

I repeat : NERFING OVERPERFORMING STUFF TO BRING IT ON PAR WITH THE REST IS NOT GUTTING.

Can we please, now, as a community, stop using that completely bad faith argument?