Official Discussion Thread for "Update 45 Preview—Fallen Banners"

Stx · January 10

- The PvP thing: I’m not going to comment on other than I think it’s the wrong direction to go by stripping down skills and watering down combat instead of fixing hardware and server issues.
- Two new Dungeons: They are fine, the sets look decent but the heavy attack sets probably need to be buffed if you want them to compete with Sergeants / Noble Duelist.
- Quality of Life changes: The green CP changes are great, love these. The starter zone updates are okay but I’m not sure that’s something that should be set as dev time priority. The map changes won’t improve the game for me at all.
- Addons for console: I don’t use Addons and I don’t play console so this does nothing for me personally.
- Houses: I assume these are just more houses that cost a ton of crowns? I’m not really into player housing.

I guess my biggest takeaway from this announcement is that there were no improvements or changes to class skills, world skills, no new skill styles announced, no new scribe skills announced (this system is awesome and fun), and no new questing zones. I’m hoping these will come later in the year!

Edit: I probably couldn’t play this game without ESO+ so needing that doesn’t bother me.

SkaiFaith · January 10

Vengeance Campaign: I like the concept, just not the colors of the atmosphere but I get it's all a test.
Base game updates: Much appreciated, especially green CPs as passives and old zones visual upgrades! About the mount I'm not sure will be enough tbh... And mixed feelings about console add-ons.
Houses: Skingrad castle is a surprise, I felt "trolled" for 6 months, since this was a complaint players had since the launch of Gold Road XD you got me! But I now appreciate. I'm not much into housing but this one is on my radar.
Dungeons: Liked the "throwback" atmosphere.
All in all it was a good start!

XSTRONG · January 10

Yet again Console players need to wait 2 weeks!

Lugaldu · January 10

LordDragonSlayer wrote: »

We have a lot of people in the guilds that I belong too who cannot do specific trials or dungeons because they refuse to buy ESO plus or a one time purchase of the DLC.

And that's probably one of the reasons why they're now trying to make money with a different concept. I can understand that not everyone has a ton of money to invest in a game, but the devs don't work for free either.

Personofsecrets · January 10

Tales of Tribute not mentioned, mega fail.

Soarora · January 10

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Tales of Tribute not mentioned, mega fail.

I don’t think its usually mentioned in Q1? Usually you get a new patron with the Chapter, which means new info for ToT would be with the April(?) stream.

Supreme_Atromancer · January 11

The dungeons look interesting! Redoubt had some impressive scenery. Story-wise, there seems to be a trend of opposition to the 3-banners war, and they all seem to be bad guys. I'd love to see this thread developed beyond that.

Regarding PvP, I can't see how ZOS could possibly do this differently, so I'm supportive. Its going to be disruptive for a lot of established groups (and a lot of friends) but those people were demanding change, and I feel like ZOS is out of options.

I think the green cp changes are a very good move. The micro-management was not fun. The mount speed thing will be a blessing for poor noobs/new alts who were painfully trudging across Tamriel at snail pace trying to get skyshards, or trying to keep up with crown in Cyro!

Regarding the "starter island" changes: I realise I will have to wait til Test Server to really see. Some of it looks nice, I think the water and atmosphere things will be welcome changes. But ZOS: If going forward you want to capitalise on base game zones- and we're going to be spending more time in these zones- I hope there's room to go a lot harder with the changes with future zone refreshes.

Base-game architecture, in particular, does not match the high aesthetic quality of later zones. Also, the cities of each particular base-game province are identical, and lack personality. Meanwhile, places like Vvardenfell and the newer pve Cyrodiil zones are excellent examples of the distinct personality of each city within a province. All of those cities are a pleasure to be in. I'd say the same with vegetation, as well as rocks/mountains- compare Bangkorai with The Reach, for example. The latter looks amazing. Meanwhile, Bangkorai mountains and rocks could certainly use some work!

StihlReign · January 11

Most of the changes look good, this should be a nice patch and update.

It will be interesting to watch ZOS' approach to PvP. We have ChatGPT and other AI options and ZOS has every version of the code base and thousands of bug reports. I hope we're not stripping our current abilities to correct or find a base error code that could be analyzed by Ai while ZOS continues to ignore the community.

Blocking, healing, shields, group buffs.

I'm looking to see a list of PvP QoL improvements, ie - Balance low population scoring in a way that works on a consistent basis and also recognizes/rewards the dynamic that occurs during low pop.

Let players select the Scroll Quest they'd like to pursue at the quest giver.

Players will no longer get hung up on the steps, low walls or objects in the courtyards of Brindle, Chalman or Drake.

etc, etc, etc

BasP · January 11

Like many others, I like the upcoming basegame updates (especially the changes to the Green CPs)! The new Dungeons seem fun too, and I'm curious to see the new mechanics of the bosses.

At first glance the new Dungeon sets seem a bit underwhelming to me though. If tests on the PTS conclude that some of them are indeed subpar compared to the better Dungeon sets, I hope that feedback will be listened to and that they'll receive some buffs during the PTS cycle.

Reame · January 11

@ZOS_Kevin I have a serious question.

At december 2024, there was huge sale on crowns. Nearly every email about ESO contains phase like "Add Crowns to your account now..." or "...stock up on Crowns today!".

And now, people which stock up on that Crowns can't buy new dungeons because to play them, you need ESO+?

Why does everything you do seems anti-consumer? And you act surprised when people are angry and "toxic" towards you...

XSTRONG · January 11

Reame wrote: »

@ZOS_Kevin I have a serious question.

At december 2024, there was huge sale on crowns. Nearly every email about ESO contains phase like "Add Crowns to your account now..." or "...stock up on Crowns today!".

And now, people which stock up on that Crowns can't buy new dungeons because to play them, you need ESO+?

Why does everything you do seems anti-consumer? And you act surprised when people are angry and "toxic" towards you...

I dont think Zos ever said that players should buy/stock up on Crowns to buy future dungeons/dlc there are alot more to buy in crownstore then dlc

Typical_Tim · January 11

I'm all for them looking at fixing pvp but the math is already clearly not working there so why is that not just addressed? For example ball groups that stack heals/barriers that takes a whole server to be stacked to kill 12 people seems like the math isnt mathing.

Another good example a ball group that uses every ultimate in the game at the same time resulting in the game crashing for a large portion of the enemy alliance.

How are these changes going to effect console servers since the live release is later?

Can we not have a better solution for pvp players to make gold from pvp? Or a have a means to take fights from the same never ending circle looping for emp? For example an artifact weapon that only has a range use of a portion of the map that takes the fights to different places on the map.

Sakiri · January 12

virtus753 wrote: »

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Sakiri wrote: »

Danikat wrote: »

I'm concerned about the proposed mount speed change. I know for most players mounts are strictly a way to get where you're going as fast as possible and any speed increases are good, but I really like the middle ground of being able to go a bit faster than running but still having time to watch my surroundings for anything interesting.

I've only ever trained more speed up to +10% on any of my characters and now I'm concerned that will be too much for me. Especially since PC doesn't have the same option consoles have to go slower than the maximum speed by not pushing the stick all the way forward - our options are only full running speed or sprinting.

It might be fine if it's a trivial increase, but I assume not because that would be disappointing for most players. Ideally I'd like some version of the controls consoles have but that's difficult to do without an analogue input (and no I'm not going to use a controller just for this). But something to give us more control instead of assuming everyone wants maximum speed at all times would be very helpful.

There's a run/walk toggle.

And you can run faster on foot than on a mount at the start. I'm glad they're fixing it.

Not for running, and only for sprinting if you’re on an Orc. Without any buffs, mounts “run” (i.e. not sprint) at 115% of running on foot; mounts sprint at 145%, while footspeed sprint is 140% (unless on Orc, whose innate sprint buff makes sprinting on foot slightly faster).

The disadvantage on the mount is not initial speed but *access* to that speed and to extra speed. You aren’t going to be sprinting for very long at all with that tiny amount of initial mount stamina, and the only way to improve that is through the 60-day time gate/pay gate of mount training. (Compare adding stamina to a player character with attributes, glyphs, etc.) You don’t get speed training on a mount without a 60-day timegate or paying in crowns. (You can get an easy sprint boost via medium armor.) Once your account has CP (which can be invested on any character, even a new one), you don’t get access to the CP mount speed buff until way up the green tree - where it is much more expensive and roughly half as powerful as the footspeed buff, which is immediately accessible.

There also isn’t a Minor Gallop, whereas there is a Minor Expedition.

I’m also still constantly surprised by how many players don’t know about Major Gallop from Continuous Attack, although a set like Adept Rider can get you both Major speed buffs earlier than the level 10 requirement for Continuous Attack.

This is true, and I'm fully CP'd into speed right at the start. Horses are barely worth using until level 10 when you can get the continuous attack passive, or 30 days when you get a noticeable number of trainings in.

I'm glad they're changing it. Still.

Avoriaa · January 12

As I saw commented a bit, I'm a lil concerned with the old zone updates, do people really hangout there? is there a long term goal of updating the actual experience in those areas? the quests kinda suck for the most part and I definitely want those areas updated but the cosmetics aren't my priority.

MartinKrpan · January 12

Above it says "The dungeon DLC will NOT be available for purchase for crowns at launch."

Like all previous years, I bought an extra 21000 Crowns for our family in the New Year's sale for this and similar useful purposes, as I am not prepared to pay ESO+ subscription fees for all of us. So I would like to ask if this dungeon DLC will be available for Crowns later and when?

Lugaldu · January 12

Avoriaa wrote: »

As I saw commented a bit, I'm a lil concerned with the old zone updates, do people really hangout there? is there a long term goal of updating the actual experience in those areas? the quests kinda suck for the most part and I definitely want those areas updated but the cosmetics aren't my priority.

An update of the starter zones makes sense. New players who don't immediately buy all the newer chapters but just the base game will primarily see the starter areas and if the graphics look so "old-fashioned" then it doesn't necessarily make the most attractive impression.

XSTRONG · January 12

Avoriaa wrote: »

As I saw commented a bit, I'm a lil concerned with the old zone updates, do people really hangout there? is there a long term goal of updating the actual experience in those areas? the quests kinda suck for the most part and I definitely want those areas updated but the cosmetics aren't my priority.

When the new seasons start you might have a reason to visit these old mostly dead zones so they might not only polish them for new players.

ArchMikem · January 12

MidniteOwl1913 wrote: »

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DietDrKelp2 wrote: »

I hope that PVP stuff is really just a "test" because it would take a lot of usefulness and creativeness away from pvp and a lot of sets. Eso has a very unique pvp imo and wouldn't want to see it changed that drastically.

I agree. Although I'm only a casual PVPer (transmutes and AP for Hacjiko) but I know that crafting a build is a good part of the skill set that makes for a successful player. Doing away with that sounds like a very bad idea to me.

My opinion that no one asked for? Real PvP is in the theory crafting and putting the build together. The "successful" part is when you just press a couple buttons and your sets win fights for you.

I fully welcome a more level playing field where player skills comes down to how you use the sets everyone else has access to.

VoxAdActa · January 12

ArchMikem wrote: »

The "successful" part is when you just press a couple buttons and your sets win fights for you.

Exactly. The only way to "git gud" at PvP is by grinding out specific sets and specific skill lines. If you pop into Cyrodiil or a Battleground without them, you're not helping your team; you're just luggage. There are like four different builds. Anything else is either just fine-tuning one of them, or a total meme.

That's 40% of why PvE players avoid PvP altogether. You can't be in any way useful, no matter how good you are with buttons, positioning, etc, if you show up wearing all crafted gear. AND, some of those required sets can only be accquired from playing PvP, so you're doomed to spend your first XX hours just being a jobber for the sweat crowd while you "earn" the gear you have to have.

(The other 60% of the reason PvE players avoid PvP is because PvP attracts some of the most obnoxious people in existence. Some of us would be fine walking face-first into failure for a month if we didn't have to put up with the comments, DMs, group chat abuse, and vulgar emotes from the people we're forced to interact with.)

Scaletho · January 13

So... could this "PvP Testing" or "Champions"be just a huge Battleground on Cyroddil?

All this smell as more of the same. I'm very worried.

LadyLethalla · January 14

Green tree passives - yes please. But... why only nine? Why do the others still need to be slotted??

It's a start. I hope it continues.

Soarora · January 14

LadyLethalla wrote: »

Green tree passives - yes please. But... why only nine? Why do the others still need to be slotted??

It's a start. I hope it continues.

To be fair, with these being no longer slottable it opens up the ability to slot the rest without having to change things out. You're basically down to the ones like the out of combat speed bonus, repair cost decrease, and mount stamina.

OldStygian · January 15

Still putting out new content that is group walled, yay awesome.

Ekzorka · January 16

Kyip wrote: »

For the rp community, I think the biggest positive is how the story in the two new dungeons explicitly says the Three Banners War has been going on for over ten years. Real-time progression of the ESO calendar in-game is now canon. It's not all the same year anymore. This is wonderful.

Yeah, but Eveli in 2021 dungeon says that Leovic died 5 years ago, so at least 2014-2021 content is still in 2E 582. 🙃

sans-culottes · January 17

Ekzorka wrote: »

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Kyip wrote: »

For the rp community, I think the biggest positive is how the story in the two new dungeons explicitly says the Three Banners War has been going on for over ten years. Real-time progression of the ESO calendar in-game is now canon. It's not all the same year anymore. This is wonderful.

Yeah, but Eveli in 2021 dungeon says that Leovic died 5 years ago, so at least 2014-2021 content is still in 2E 582. 🙃

It’d be nice if they’d try to keep this consistent.

tomofhyrule · January 19

Kyip wrote: »

For the rp community, I think the biggest positive is how the story in the two new dungeons explicitly says the Three Banners War has been going on for over ten years. Real-time progression of the ESO calendar in-game is now canon. It's not all the same year anymore. This is wonderful.

The new DLC is the only thing that's canonically after the start of the war. Everything else in ESO is canonically in 582.
(there are parts of Orsinium that were nominally in 583, but those may have been retconned if they've all been touched.

But since the new dungeons are 10 years after the war started (the war started in 580), that puts this DLC around 2E590-ish. And only this set of dungeons.

VidmaVirtual · January 28

Hello!
I appreciate that you are trying to change, but......
Just because of such a landscape, you don't want to try it!

And the change in the combat system, completely thoughtless ❌ They could have left the environment and the combat system as it is, you just need to take it and really think about it, try to find a balance between classes, races and groups of balls, maybe reduce visual effects ?! ⚖ It seemed that he did everything in a hurry and didn't think at all what he was doing! I probably don't have a real person who understands Cyrodiil, maybe ZoS is more interested in PVE ? !

I wish you the best of luck!