10 Major issues with ESO that if fixed I would actually play the game

lynix112

1. No OCE servers, There's really no point to not have at LEAST OCE instance servers for PvE content. Yes you can do content with the current setup but you basically have to be a complete sweat lord to get anywhere close to max potential.

2. Weapon swapping is and always will be, imo, a bug. It needs to go and player power needs to be adjusted accordingly. Such a poor choice for devs to leave the game like this.

3. Mount Training should be account wide... Seriously nobody wants to get on their alts and deal with a slow mount.. It's anti alt design and we all know it's just so you can sell training books.

4. Progression in ESO is so mid. At the very least being able to add more stats to our gear through enchanting (more than currently) by using mats only obtainable in higher content.

5. Sprinting past everything in dungeons should be dealt with, it's an unfun way to play for a lot of people and completely destroys immersion. By removing 1. max level rewards from normal content and 2. removing mob tethers so they don't ever reset while someone is inside the dungeon we can at the very least minimize the amount this happens improving overall player enjoyment.

6. Make crafting more robust and interesting, allow us to do crazy things like having a trait that reduces the max level required to put on the gear.

7. Double the housing furniture (yes this includes the eso+ bonus, that should be double too)

8. Make guild traders zone based, if you get a spot in the zone you just have to go to 1 guild trader to sell/buy not check 10 to find the best price or use addons.

9. Map completion should be account wide for discoveries. (if I have the wayshrine on 1 characters I should have it on all)

10. refer to number 1.

Sarannah

The only things I agree with are 1, 5, 6 and 7. Everything else would destroy the game for alts, or removes playing the actual game.

About 2: Even though I do feel ZOS needs to fix the dps/survivability/skillgap, I also feel they should not remove the things that make this game different from all other MMO's, this includes barswapping. At best they need to automate things like these: Barswapping/weaving/etc. Atleast until the player themselves can do it better manually, this way skill will always be better than automated, but at the same time reduces the gap between players.

PS: These 10 things are not issues, but personal preference.

lynix112

Sarannah wrote: »

PS: These 10 things are not issues, but personal preference.

No they are absolutely issues, weapon swapping is literally a bug they let go too far. The game was never meant to be like this and it's had a negative impact, not a positive one. The amount of people that hate it is significantly higher than those who like it.

Also [snip] are you on about it ruining the game for Alts? Having account wide PoI icons literally doesn't change anything, it just makes it so you can see the PoI without needing an addon that would does the same thing, and allow me to not waste time walking places I've already been to a million times in the case of wayshrines. I didn't say the quests would be account wide or the rewards for said quests would be...

Also nobody is having fun logging into to their alt once a day to click a mount training option. I know people that literally make a character and don't play it until they at the least have maxed out mount speed because they game just feels dumb with a slow mount that moves slower than on foot sprinting.

Lack of progression is one of the primary reasons that people avoid it as an MMO. Horizontal progress is literally one of the most boring implementations to the MMO genre ever created, the only people who enjoy it do so because they don't like to "start again" every time a new dlc or expansions releases. But if there is nothing to gain from doing the quests, dungeons or trials that get introduced, why would I do them if I'm not compelled by the story? Don't get me wrong here I do personally like ESOs stories and I do quests for that reason but you better believe most people do not do content without a reason.

These are not opinions these are facts.. The list I gave is a list of things that if are not addressed eventually ESO doesn't have a hope in hell of lasting another 10 years.

Also thought of another one

11. More of the mounts from rng crates need to be put in the game to get without crates... There's no reason why you can't have mounts be an extremely low drop rate from in game content, even if the chance to get the mount is only once a week and it's 0.01% drop chance. Things like this bring people back to the game.

[edited for profanity bypass]

MasterLanz

Pretty sure we've all been complaining about the mount system in general since launch. [snip]

[edited for bashing]

lynix112

MasterLanz wrote: »

Pretty sure we've all been complaining about the mount system in general since launch. [snip]

Well with games like wow, bringing in more and more features from other MMOs soon it will be able to scratch my housing itch too (only of the only reasons left I log into ESO). The only people who like grinds are the people that finish them. So I bid them good luck with releasing the same content over and over from the last 10 years with very little changes.

[edited to remove quote]

Ezhh

While I agree with some of these things, others would also lead some of us to play less.

I've never before heard bar swapping wasn't intended in all my years playing, and I'm not sure how they would have added the ability to equip two weapons with their own sets of skills any way other than intentionally. I'd be genuinely interested in learning more if it was the case, but it doesn't change that it's how the game has played for years, and is how the combat system I came to love has worked the years I've played. It wouldn't make any sense to change it now.

Destai

Agreed on 3. It really discourages playing the character outside of dungeons for 60 days at least. Needs to be either account bound or buyable all at once.

BasP

lynix112 wrote: »

Sarannah wrote: »

PS: These 10 things are not issues, but personal preference.

No they are absolutely issues, weapon swapping is literally a bug they let go too far. The game was never meant to be like this and it's had a negative impact, not a positive one. The amount of people that hate it is significantly higher than those who like it.

Do you perhaps mean light attack weaving instead of bar swapping..?

SeaGtGruff

When you say weapon swapping, do you actually mean swapping your weapon, or do you perhaps mean animation canceling? Because I can't imagine why anyone would think that being able to switch to a different weapon is a bug. /baffled

As for the account-wide stuff, a few players kept asking in the forums for a wide number of things in the game to be changed from character-specific to account-wide. ZOS made such a change, and it was complained about by a large percentage of the playerbase. Some players think it didn't go far enough (and apparently you're one of them), while other players think it more or less destroyed the game for people who enjoy starting over with new alts. If I'm not mistaken, there were players who actually left the game because of this change. Changing it again to go even further would probably just drive even more players away.

MasterLanz

lynix112 wrote: »

Lack of progression is one of the primary reasons that people avoid it as an MMO. Horizontal progress is literally one of the most boring implementations to the MMO genre ever created, the only people who enjoy it do so because they don't like to "start again" every time a new dlc or expansions releases. But if there is nothing to gain from doing the quests, dungeons or trials that get introduced, why would I do them if I'm not compelled by the story? Don't get me wrong here I do personally like ESOs stories and I do quests for that reason but you better believe most people do not do content without a reason.

Vertical progression is bad for different reasons, though. All the content and gear gets invalidated every major expansion, and you're forced to constantly buy DLC and grind pointless levels. WoW and FF14 prove it can't be done in a way that really adds anything to the game, which is why WoW keeps going through level crunches, and FF14 just stretches its bland abilities over a bigger level range. Both just recycle the same boring grind over and over with a new coat of paint each expansion.

Taril

1) Is fair, but it's hard to say how feasible it is. Setting up and maintaining a new server isn't just flipping a switch. There would be a decent cost to do and the concern would be how many people it would facilitate.

2) Bar swapping is fine. Multiple MMO's have done it. The only notable thing that goes wrong with ESO's rendition is its combats over reliance on maintaining short duration buffs and debuffs. So you're constantly faffing around with swapping bars to re-apply 10/20s timers while continuing to use your 1 spammable between reapplications.

Meanwhile, other MMO's that have bar swapping, have more focus on using the skill appropriate for the situation (Such as swapping to a ranged weapon to attack things far away) as well as use cooldowns (Which tend to be 30-45 seconds for the more impactful skills) which reduces the need to constantly swap.

(Also, it is clearly not a bug, given that the implementation of it, the keybinds for it and the literal tutorials about it mention about swapping bars in combat)

3) It's annoying, yes. But it's not that big of a deal. Especially with the Cyro intro quests that gets you perma-Major Gallop at level 10 (Plus, eventually you can get enough CP for the mount speed increase which even a brand new character can utilize)

4) Well.. There already is something like that. Upgrading gear to Epic/Legendary requires materials that are easier to acquire at high level (Not to mention acquiring Monster Sets in the first place require Vet content)

Besides that, the type of MMO is based around being horizontal progression rather than gear treadmills. With at least ESO having the advantage that it actually releases new sets and rebalances old ones to give more reason to acquire gear (While something like GW2 once you've got Ascended gear in the stat variation you want that's it. You're done acquiring gear forever)

5) Is generally a difficult thing to solve. I know some MMO's (Like WoW and FFXIV) have tried to solve this by putting literal walls in the way, making it so you have to kill enemies for the path to open up. But the experience is no better, people just do the same thing of sprinting to the next block and then mass AoE down all the enemies.

This is just the nature of making dungeons farm content (Which is necessary to keep them populated for new players to get groups), coupled with generous power creep (And overall defanging of dungeon content outside of specific hard modes like Mythic Dungeons in WoW) that simply makes such things possible - With it being a design goal to make dungeons easy so pleb casuals can play them.

6) Crazy crafting things isn't conducive to balance though. Making terrible balance via crazy traits is not going to make the game any fun.

7) Housing limits are mostly because the game supports dated consoles. So long as the game retains support for old consoles (Which it will for the forseable future), it will be bound by ensuring that the game remains playable for such things.

The best they can do here is up the limit for non-ESO+ players. But that's unlikely to happen given that incentivising ESO+ subscriptions is a business strategy.

8) While it would be nice, the whole "Guild Trader" system is built around better trader locations resulting in more frequent sales (Thus allowing price hikes to capitalize off people too lazy to wander around looking for the best price)

9) They literally sell this in the store. So it's not going to happen.

11) No it doesn't. No-one comes back to a game because they put in a brand new 0.01% drop chance mount they can farm once a week. Heck, no-one comes back to a game because they just added in a new shiny mount full stop.

People come back to a game when new content and features are implemented. (Which is something that people have been complaining about with this content light year)

fred4

lynix112 wrote: »

2. Weapon swapping is and always will be, imo, a bug. It needs to go and player power needs to be adjusted accordingly. Such a poor choice for devs to leave the game like this.

This was obviously due to console controller button limits. Two things. If the toggle is an issue, perhaps due to lag, set up your keyboard to use two separate buttons, one for front bar, one for back bar, rather than the default toggle button. Much better. #2 is obviously Oakensoul. It does a pretty good job of adjusting your power, if you really only want to use one bar. Personally I find 2-bar builds more engaging and versatile, especially in PvP.

4. Progression in ESO is so mid. At the very least being able to add more stats to our gear through enchanting (more than currently) by using mats only obtainable in higher content.

Once you reach CP160, progression isn't so much about upgrading, but about (a) tailoring your character to your preferred playstyle, especially in PvP, and (b) about cooperating with other players in groups. Power in ESO group play derives from not wearing the same thing as everyone else, at least for the tanks, healers, and a few of the DDs. It also revolves around having the right setup for the content you're doing. The PvP modes differ from each other. Dungeons and trials differ. The meta in Infinite Archive is completely different from everything else. While maybe only 100 out of 600 armor sets are truly relevant, it's all a big puzzle. It's not about advancing your character. CP is still about that, but otherwise it's about matching your character to the content you're doing and to the group you're playing with. Only at the casual (overland / questing) level is it merely about how you wish to play, cause everything is so easy it doesn't really matter.

I should also say that ESO (still) has a rather large skill component. It's relatively easy to make a 60K DPS DD (on a trial dummy) these days, but the best players do double that, whereas score-pushing players, whether solo or in groups, may adjust their builds for each fight and double their damage yet again.

The progression in ESO isn't so much about advancing your character. That's part of it, but the larger part is becoming fluid with the core combat - dodge rolls, blocking, weaving, bashing - and with your rotations and with trial / dungeon mechanics. Then there's PvP, which requires line-of-sighting and further experience to do well. An understanding of all classes helps with PvP too, e.g. by at least dabbling in them, so that you understand how others play and counter you.

If the above doesn't capture your interest, then maybe ESO is not for you. It is definitely not (just) about accumulating time on your character and making it passively stronger.

Sprinting past everything in dungeons should be dealt with, it's an unfun way to play for a lot of people and completely destroys immersion.

It does destroy immersion for beginners. It did for me. I just don't see how you can fix this. First of all there's the aforementioned skill curve. The reward for learning to play the game well is that you can steamroll some content. I see that as a net positive. You get rewarded for your skill.

How could this be any different in any game where you do the same content over and over? As an endgame player I prefer skippable mobs, either by steamrolling or cloaking past, resulting in a dungeon that can be farmed quickly. Only the boss fights retain a modicum of interest anyway, at least on vet, whereas too much trash is just a chore. Pulling everything and dealing with it all at once is the only fun, were it not for mobs getting stuck with pathfinding and impeding your progress. Players hate doors / barriers that block dungeon progress for that reason alone.

By removing 1. max level rewards from normal content

At the risk of other players rising and calling that gate-keeping.

6. Make crafting more robust and interesting, allow us to do crazy things like having a trait that reduces the max level required to put on the gear.

It's so easy to get to CP160 (the gear level cap) nowadays, this sounds pointless to me.

Wiseau

Regarding bar-swapping, how exactly is it a bug and what do you mean when you keep saying "like this"?

I_killed_Vivec

MasterLanz wrote: »

lynix112 wrote: »

Lack of progression is one of the primary reasons that people avoid it as an MMO. Horizontal progress is literally one of the most boring implementations to the MMO genre ever created, the only people who enjoy it do so because they don't like to "start again" every time a new dlc or expansions releases. But if there is nothing to gain from doing the quests, dungeons or trials that get introduced, why would I do them if I'm not compelled by the story? Don't get me wrong here I do personally like ESOs stories and I do quests for that reason but you better believe most people do not do content without a reason.

Vertical progression is bad for different reasons, though. All the content and gear gets invalidated every major expansion, and you're forced to constantly buy DLC and grind pointless levels. WoW and FF14 prove it can't be done in a way that really adds anything to the game, which is why WoW keeps going through level crunches, and FF14 just stretches its bland abilities over a bigger level range. Both just recycle the same boring grind over and over with a new coat of paint each expansion.

A bit of history for those who weren't around 10 years ago...

We had originally vertical progression in ESO - Vet Ranks. I loved VR because there was a real feel of accomplishment in being able to do things that previously you couldn't - you'd come into a zone a little under levelled, and leave a little over levelled as you move onto the next zone at the next level. Cadwell's silver took you from VR1, Cadwell's gold completed the journey to VR14 (further VR levels were added later because of complaints about an end to progression).

Apparently it was desperately unpopular: too hard, too much effort, and too much segregation of players by level.

ZoS scrapped it for CP... horizontal progression was now in, along with 1T and the "easification" of the game as a whole (particularly Craglorn, which used to be a real test).

I was not a fan, but apparently I'm in the minority. ZoS did it because unlike what the OP said, lack of progression was NOT why people avoided ESO, Vet Ranks were turning people off. Apparently 1T/CP was a success, in terms of player population.

It's possible to complain about ZoS for any number of reasons (and I do), but knowing their user base is not one. This might result in an emphasis on "casual" players, but casual player are the overwhelming majority.

lynix112

Wiseau wrote: »

Regarding bar-swapping, how exactly is it a bug and what do you mean when you keep saying "like this"?

'like this' refers to the complete jank state the game is in with bar swap, They are not going to change it because some people seem to like it for god knows what reason (It is literally just awful awful design with the implementation they went for)

Bar-swapping was originally not meant to be this way, as someone who has been playing since the very first beta testing I remember when it was considered a bug that was going to get fixed. But then tryhards decided it was fun and so zeni left it the way it was and because of that we get the terrible state the game is in today.

Players in the US don't have an issue with it because it's more smooth and actually works for them. But for anyone on the NA realms outside of the US it's like 50/50 if your bar even swaps regardless of how you bind it. The state of the game now is a perfect example of how players do not understand what good design looks like.

The only reason the community is so resistant to change now is because they've all got used to the crappiness.

Taril wrote: »

5) Is generally a difficult thing to solve. I know some MMO's (Like WoW and FFXIV) have tried to solve this by putting literal walls in the way, making it so you have to kill enemies for the path to open up. But the experience is no better, people just do the same thing of sprinting to the next block and then mass AoE down all the enemies.

This is just the nature of making dungeons farm content (Which is necessary to keep them populated for new players to get groups), coupled with generous power creep (And overall defanging of dungeon content outside of specific hard modes like Mythic Dungeons in WoW) that simply makes such things possible - With it being a design goal to make dungeons easy so pleb casuals can play them.

You do not need to put max level rewards into normal dungeons to keep them populated. Basically every other game ever has proven this to be false. I personally completely avoid dungeons on low level alts because this mentality makes them unfun, I can't be the only one that does that.. The only high level people you should see in a normal dungeon should be when someone is helping out a mate and they should be strong enough to solo, but not strong enough to just ignore everything and run to the boss... tbh that doesn't even happen in wow. I honestly challenge you to try now.

dungeons should be designed so that a group of the correct power level should be able to do the dungeon normally with somewhat ease as long as nobody stands in floor goop and frankly there should be at least some challenge in healing (As someone who plays healer normally ESO is honestly a joke, they should just remove healers they are barely needed)

MasterLanz

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

MasterLanz wrote: »

lynix112 wrote: »

Lack of progression is one of the primary reasons that people avoid it as an MMO. Horizontal progress is literally one of the most boring implementations to the MMO genre ever created, the only people who enjoy it do so because they don't like to "start again" every time a new dlc or expansions releases. But if there is nothing to gain from doing the quests, dungeons or trials that get introduced, why would I do them if I'm not compelled by the story? Don't get me wrong here I do personally like ESOs stories and I do quests for that reason but you better believe most people do not do content without a reason.

Vertical progression is bad for different reasons, though. All the content and gear gets invalidated every major expansion, and you're forced to constantly buy DLC and grind pointless levels. WoW and FF14 prove it can't be done in a way that really adds anything to the game, which is why WoW keeps going through level crunches, and FF14 just stretches its bland abilities over a bigger level range. Both just recycle the same boring grind over and over with a new coat of paint each expansion.

A bit of history for those who weren't around 10 years ago...

We had originally vertical progression in ESO - Vet Ranks. I loved VR because there was a real feel of accomplishment in being able to do things that previously you couldn't - you'd come into a zone a little under levelled, and leave a little over levelled as you move onto the next zone at the next level. Cadwell's silver took you from VR1, Cadwell's gold completed the journey to VR14 (further VR levels were added later because of complaints about an end to progression).

Apparently it was desperately unpopular: too hard, too much effort, and too much segregation of players by level.

ZoS scrapped it for CP... horizontal progression was now in, along with 1T and the "easification" of the game as a whole (particularly Craglorn, which used to be a real test).

I was not a fan, but apparently I'm in the minority. ZoS did it because unlike what the OP said, lack of progression was NOT why people avoided ESO, Vet Ranks were turning people off. Apparently 1T/CP was a success, in terms of player population.

It's possible to complain about ZoS for any number of reasons (and I do), but knowing their user base is not one. This might result in an emphasis on "casual" players, but casual player are the overwhelming majority.

I was there. People didn't like it because it railroaded everyone in the one game franchise that basically made its name by letting people go everywhere and choose where they wanted to adventure and who they wanted to fight against.

It was still horizontal progression even back then, though. Your Vet ranks grew your stats and you had gear to unlock, but your build didn't change much. You stopped getting skill points outside of skill shards, and it only took a fraction of those to get any kind of comprehensive filled-out role going. Everything past that was giving you options, not more power(ergo horizontal). The vet leveling was just a way of keeping the numbers ticking up without really adding anything to the characters or progression besides a carrot on a stick. The One Tamriel update basically turned this from a janky prototype to a much more fleshed-out(but still janky) game that took better advantage of what it had going for it, and was truer to its roots.

manukartofanu

Focusing on those who currently don’t feel like playing and want something to change to get started is generally a very bad idea. There are people who are already playing, despite all the flaws of the game. For some of them, the changes might make things worse and could be the last straw that drives them away. In return, you’ll have to try selling the game to someone else somewhere out there, while also spending resources on marketing just to replace those who left because of the changes.
If you’re going to make changes, they should address what the current players are asking for. In return, you get a satisfied player base that’s willing to promote the game to their friends on their own.

lynix112

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

MasterLanz wrote: »

lynix112 wrote: »

Lack of progression is one of the primary reasons that people avoid it as an MMO. Horizontal progress is literally one of the most boring implementations to the MMO genre ever created, the only people who enjoy it do so because they don't like to "start again" every time a new dlc or expansions releases. But if there is nothing to gain from doing the quests, dungeons or trials that get introduced, why would I do them if I'm not compelled by the story? Don't get me wrong here I do personally like ESOs stories and I do quests for that reason but you better believe most people do not do content without a reason.

Vertical progression is bad for different reasons, though. All the content and gear gets invalidated every major expansion, and you're forced to constantly buy DLC and grind pointless levels. WoW and FF14 prove it can't be done in a way that really adds anything to the game, which is why WoW keeps going through level crunches, and FF14 just stretches its bland abilities over a bigger level range. Both just recycle the same boring grind over and over with a new coat of paint each expansion.

A bit of history for those who weren't around 10 years ago...

We had originally vertical progression in ESO - Vet Ranks. I loved VR because there was a real feel of accomplishment in being able to do things that previously you couldn't - you'd come into a zone a little under levelled, and leave a little over levelled as you move onto the next zone at the next level. Cadwell's silver took you from VR1, Cadwell's gold completed the journey to VR14 (further VR levels were added later because of complaints about an end to progression).

Apparently it was desperately unpopular: too hard, too much effort, and too much segregation of players by level.

ZoS scrapped it for CP... horizontal progression was now in, along with 1T and the "easification" of the game as a whole (particularly Craglorn, which used to be a real test).

I was not a fan, but apparently I'm in the minority. ZoS did it because unlike what the OP said, lack of progression was NOT why people avoided ESO, Vet Ranks were turning people off. Apparently 1T/CP was a success, in terms of player population.

It's possible to complain about ZoS for any number of reasons (and I do), but knowing their user base is not one. This might result in an emphasis on "casual" players, but casual player are the overwhelming majority.

It really wasn't the idea of progression that was disliked. The problem was ultimately that you basically had to play the game 3 times just to get to max level If nothing else they should have just scrapped cadwells silver/gold and had the whole world open up at level 50.

You say that zeni know their player base but ultimately the player base gave up because of the grind that was associated with getting to max level.. It's was so super unreasonable to expect players to grind out 3 factions 1 - 50 worth of quests when it already took some people a couple of weeks just to hit 50... To be told they had to do that again not once but twice more... haha NOPE I even quit the game for a while there.

Believe me when I say that most potential players LOVE progression of their character. The entire reason people play alts is because they want to do the progress again... In ESO there really is no progression even playing alts and it does drive play numbers to drop whether you like it or not. The funniest part is that progression creep doesn't even have to be major to be interesting... Like just make gear that is like a TINY bit better than the current stuff.. That's all people need.. Like you don't even have to make it an increase that is actually required to do newer content.

idk tbh I think people praise horizontal progression way too much.. it doesn't keep people coming back to the game.

lynix112

fred4 wrote: »

lynix112 wrote: »

2. Weapon swapping is and always will be, imo, a bug. It needs to go and player power needs to be adjusted accordingly. Such a poor choice for devs to leave the game like this.

This was obviously due to console controller button limits. Two things. If the toggle is an issue, perhaps due to lag, set up your keyboard to use two separate buttons, one for front bar, one for back bar, rather than the default toggle button. Much better. #2 is obviously Oakensoul. It does a pretty good job of adjusting your power, if you really only want to use one bar. Personally I find 2-bar builds more engaging and versatile, especially in PvP.

4. Progression in ESO is so mid. At the very least being able to add more stats to our gear through enchanting (more than currently) by using mats only obtainable in higher content.

Once you reach CP160, progression isn't so much about upgrading, but about (a) tailoring your character to your preferred playstyle, especially in PvP, and (b) about cooperating with other players in groups. Power in ESO group play derives from not wearing the same thing as everyone else, at least for the tanks, healers, and a few of the DDs. *snip*

Like I said... mid.... the whole micromanagement of gear in trials is just honestly so so soooo uninteresting. Imagine playing a game where you play the hero but then get told what to wear by someone else.... there is REALLY nothing interesting about being micromanaged.

lynix112

fred4 wrote: »

It's so easy to get to CP160 (the gear level cap) nowadays, this sounds pointless to me.

I mean, not really... it's about fun, not power levelling. Also that's not the only thing they could do with it

fred4

lynix112 wrote: »

Like I said... mid.... the whole micromanagement of gear in trials is just honestly so so soooo uninteresting. Imagine playing a game where you play the hero but then get told what to wear by someone else.... there is REALLY nothing interesting about being micromanaged.

Like I said, maybe ESO, or MMOs in general, aren't for you then. You can't be 12 heroes doing their own thing in a (vet DLC) trial. You need to work together or everyone dies.

Whether you're micromanaged really depends on the group. If you don't get on, I would simply leave the group or guild until you do. That said, while you're learning, or farming in a random group, there tends to be standard gear and strategies you use at the veteran level. It's impossible to do much else within a pickup group (PUG) made via Group Finder. You don't discuss gear or strategies in such a group. You stick to standard stuff that is known to synergise. You at most coordinate some gear among the tanks and healers. You typically use the one standard strategy for the boss fights in the trial. Try doing anything more with 12 random people and see how well that works out...

This is different at true endgame where regular groups tackle hard modes or they scorepush, or indeed when you play solo. In that case you regain freedom. You may well diverge from what is commonly called meta, albeit you still do so as a group when it comes to trials.

It's true that gear is overrated. Exact optimal gear and build isn't very important in PUGs, as long as it's fundamentally sound. Mechanics knowledge and following a common strategy, understood by all 12 players, is more important. That said, if you are a tank with only 20K health, or a DD putting out only 20K damage in a vet trial, that won't do. Strangers may like to see you wearing something meta-ish, cause it's a sign you've paid attention to the combat system and that you might, therefore, be competent.

The great thing about the MMO side of the game is that it's real. No one is the hero. Of course that clashes with role-playing as one during questing.

Best, most fun, and most relaxed way of starting group content is with 3 regular friends at your own level to be fair. Avoid group and dungeon finder, unless with an already premade group. Playing a vet trial with 11 strangers, even within a training guild, can be stressful until you develop knowledge and competence.

SilverIce58

lynix112 wrote: »

Wiseau wrote: »

Regarding bar-swapping, how exactly is it a bug and what do you mean when you keep saying "like this"?

'like this' refers to the complete jank state the game is in with bar swap, They are not going to change it because some people seem to like it for god knows what reason (It is literally just awful awful design with the implementation they went for)

Bar-swapping was originally not meant to be this way, as someone who has been playing since the very first beta testing I remember when it was considered a bug that was going to get fixed. But then tryhards decided it was fun and so zeni left it the way it was and because of that we get the terrible state the game is in today.

Players in the US don't have an issue with it because it's more smooth and actually works for them. But for anyone on the NA realms outside of the US it's like 50/50 if your bar even swaps regardless of how you bind it. The state of the game now is a perfect example of how players do not understand what good design looks like.

The only reason the community is so resistant to change now is because they've all got used to the crappiness.

So your issue is more lag because you live far away from the NA servers, and less "this feature is actually a bug." Gotcha.

Bammlschwamml

SilverIce58 wrote: »

lynix112 wrote: »

Wiseau wrote: »

Regarding bar-swapping, how exactly is it a bug and what do you mean when you keep saying "like this"?

'like this' refers to the complete jank state the game is in with bar swap, They are not going to change it because some people seem to like it for god knows what reason (It is literally just awful awful design with the implementation they went for)

Bar-swapping was originally not meant to be this way, as someone who has been playing since the very first beta testing I remember when it was considered a bug that was going to get fixed. But then tryhards decided it was fun and so zeni left it the way it was and because of that we get the terrible state the game is in today.

Players in the US don't have an issue with it because it's more smooth and actually works for them. But for anyone on the NA realms outside of the US it's like 50/50 if your bar even swaps regardless of how you bind it. The state of the game now is a perfect example of how players do not understand what good design looks like.

The only reason the community is so resistant to change now is because they've all got used to the crappiness.

So your issue is more lag because you live far away from the NA servers, and less "this feature is actually a bug." Gotcha.

I am pretty sure lags and bugs are the root of most issues people are having with this game.

That's why i don't like discussions like this one. They are implying that we need millions of horrible changes that nobody asked for. And every time the devs listen to these ideas everything gets worse.

Just fix the awesome game we already have and love. Stop wasting time and resources with ideas like "if you paint the car yellow, it won't matter that the engine is not working and the tires are flat"...

DigiAngel

....what's an OCE server?

Taril

DigiAngel wrote: »

....what's an OCE server?

Servers for the Oceania region.

I.e. Australia, New Zealand, Polynesia etc.

They normally get shunted to NA severs without their own dedicated servers, which means they will get poor ping and as a result lots of lag.

AzuraFan

I agree with 2. Dumb mechanic.

I don't agree with 5. Punishing everyone who only runs normal dungeons isn't the way to go. Max level rewards should be available in normal dungeons, otherwise you'll be drastically decreasing the enjoyment (and the motivations to do dungeons) for a subset of the playerbase. I don't know how to solve the speedrunning problem. There may not be a fix for it. But I've been running dungeons daily for a few months now and I'd say it's not a huge problem. Maybe 5% of the time I end up with a speedrunner in a pug. I think when you're pugging, you need to be willing to accept what you get and go with it.

A huge NO to 9. There's already too much complete on the map for alts.

Anyway, this sounds like a personal wishlist more than a practical way to improve the game for everyone. There are bigger fish to fry, as others have pointed out. Tweaks aren't going to do it.

ellmarie

Definitely agree with some, which is why I will be walking away slowing probably at the end of the year.

I'm on console, and after all these years, I'm miffed that I can't have an addon to do surveys and treasure chests. It's so tedious now when you have so many, I just don't have time to spend looking many of them up that I can't remember.

Agree with the mounts. 60 each lesson, I still have high level characters that aren't maxed. 6 months for each character?! Wow.

Also agree with housing.

kevkj

Assuming you've listed them in order of importance, you can probably give up on ever playing the game then. Your first 2 points are never going to change at this stage in the game's life, number 3 as well most likely.

Desiato

lynix112 wrote: »

2. Weapon swapping is and always will be, imo, a bug. It needs to go and player power needs to be adjusted accordingly. Such a poor choice for devs to leave the game like this.

If you don't want to bar swap, you don't have to. It's a pretty easy game and they've made it so players who don't like to bar swap can basically do everything.

But I love bar swapping in ESO and will never play another mmo with traditional mmo bars like wow again.

Tandor

To be honest, I'd rather listen to the views of those who are playing the game because they like the way it is rather than those who say that if the game was changed to how they would like it to be then they would play it.

SilverBride

manukartofanu wrote: »

Focusing on those who currently don’t feel like playing and want something to change to get started is generally a very bad idea. There are people who are already playing, despite all the flaws of the game. For some of them, the changes might make things worse and could be the last straw that drives them away. In return, you’ll have to try selling the game to someone else somewhere out there, while also spending resources on marketing just to replace those who left because of the changes.
If you’re going to make changes, they should address what the current players are asking for. In return, you get a satisfied player base that’s willing to promote the game to their friends on their own.

Tandor wrote: »

To be honest, I'd rather listen to the views of those who are playing the game because they like the way it is rather than those who say that if the game was changed to how they would like it to be then they would play it.

I agree with both of these posts 1000%.