The Old Patch Notes Vs. the New Patch Notes

Joy_Division · July 31

The March 2016 v2.3.5 update gave us the Thieves Guild and the Maw of Lorkhaj trial and a Cyrodiil update (no CP campaign, forward camps, new regards of the worthy) and a gigaton of combat updates, reforms, fixes, etc., 222 in all.

The comprehensive list of combat changes can be seen in the spoiler below

General

Adjusted the snare applied to the enemy target at the beginning of all charge/teleport abilities (such as Shield Charge, Critical Charge, or Teleport Strike) to be a 60% snare for 750 milliseconds from a 100% snare for 500 milliseconds.
- Added the charge snare noted above to Dragon Leap and its morphs.
- The snare remains unpurgable, and serves to help charge abilities hit moving targets more reliably without completing locking movement down.
Adjusted all abilities to only allow them to be reflected up to 1 time, previously up to 2 times.
The damage over time effects from abilities such as Searing Strike, Twin Slashes, or Destructive Touch can now be applied to targets that fully or partially absorb the damage from a damage shield, or targets that are blocking.
Abilities that heal based on their damage done (Strife, Puncturing Sweeps, Surge, etc.) will now properly calculate their heal values when the damage is fully or partially absorbed.
The damage over time effects from bleed abilities such as Cleave, Twin Slashes, Twin Blade or Blunt Axes can now be applied to any monster, even ones formerly immune to bleeds. A unique visual effect will display for each formerly bleed-immune creature.
The damage over time effects from bleed abilities now all share a unique icon. Bleed damage will continue to bypass the target’s mitigation.
Reduced the healing from the Major Mending buff category to 25% from 30% to match the Major Berserk buff category.
Reduced the bonus movement speed from the Major Expedition buff category to 30% from 40%.
Increased the bonus movement speed from Sprint to 40% from 30%.
Fixed an issue where channeled attacks (such as Radiant Destruction), Restoration and Lightning Staff Heavy Attacks could be avoided by dodge rolling. Channeled attacks cannot be dodged.
Fixed an issue where charge abilities could still damage enemies at vastly different high elevations.
Fixed numerous ability tooltips for grammar, spelling, and formatting. Any significant tooltip revisions will be called out specifically below.
Fixed numerous issues with abilities displacing incorrect or placeholder icons in your Active Effects UI or with the buff trackers of various player-made addons.
Fixed an issue where the weapon visual effects from abilities such as Grim Focus, Siphoning Strikes, and Expert Hunter could get visually detached from the weapon.
Fixed an issue where damage over time effects were not recalculating their strength if they were recast on the same target before they expired.
For example, casting Cleave on a target, then casting Momentum, then casting Cleave again will now cause Cleave’s damage over time to be higher due to you gaining the Major Brutality buff.
Fixed an issue where Stamina Recovery in the character UI would appear as 0 if you dodge rolled and then immediately attempt to crouch.
Fixed an issue where it was possible to recover Stamina while using sprint or crouch.
Fixed an issue where the Death Recap hints for low-level jewelry would tell you to obtain a higher-level jewelry piece via crafting.
Revealing an enemy from stealth or invisibility with abilities such as Revealing Flare or Magelight now prevents that enemy from casting stealth or invisibility for the duration, rather than letting them re-enter stealth or invisibility but still be visible.
Fixed an issue where the knockbacks from abilities such as Meteor or Dragon Leap could cause you to take excessive fall damage.
Fixed an issue where the Battle Spirit buff that gets applied to you in Cyrodiil, Imperial City, or the Imperial City Sewers did not show an icon in your Active Effects window, or in the buff trackers of various player-made addons.
Fixed an issue where the range increase bonus from Battle Spirit did not allow you to move and use channeling abilities at the increased ranges.
Fixed an issue where using Weapon Swap while channeling an ability would cause you to be unable to sheathe your weapons, or interact with doors and objects.
Summoned pets will now enter stealth whenever their caster enters stealth.
Abilities which give bonuses to resurrection speed now stack multiplicatively, rather than additively. This will result in slower resurrection cast speeds when stacking multiple bonuses.
Fixed an issue where tapping Sprint and then immediately dodge rolling would not charge you Stamina for the dodge roll.
Fixed an issue where taunt abilities were not taunting the target monster if you were silenced.
Fixed an issue that was preventing you from mounting while standing near an unlooted corpse.
Fixed an issue where the Crouch stealth eye would continually close and reopen whenever an enemy was in range to detect you.
Fixed an issue where you were able to fire an Ultimate ability multiple times.
Summoned pets are now dismissed by removing the buff from your Active Effects window, or swapping ability bars.

Dragonknight

Ardent Flame
- Burning Breath (Fiery Breath morph): Fixed an issue where the Major Fracture debuff applied by this ability was shorter than the duration of the damage over time effect.
- Burning Embers (Searing Strike morph):
  - Increased the heal at the end of the damage over time to 69/71/73/75% of the total damage inflicted at Ranks I/II/III/IV, from 30/32/34/36%.
  - The heal from this morph now applies immediately if it is recast on the same target.
- Dragonknight Standard: Increased the activation range for the Shackle synergy from this ability and its morphs to 3.5 meters from 2.5 meters.
- Empowering Chains (Fiery Grip morph): This morph will now always pull you to the target instead of pulling the target to you. It will continue to grant the Major
- Empower buff after being pulled as a morph effect.
- Extended Chains (Fiery Grip morph):
  - Renamed this morph to Unrelenting Grip.
  - This morph no longer attempts to pull you to the target if the target is immune to the pull.
  - This morph will now refund 100% of the ability’s cost as Magicka if it fails to pull a target.
- Fiery Grip:
  - Extended Chains’ cost reduction and range increase effect is now a baseline effect for Fiery Grip.
  - This ability and its morphs will now grant you the Major Expedition buff for 2 seconds after casting.
  - This ability no longer attempts to pull you to the target if the target is immune to the pull.
- Inferno:
  - This ability and its morphs are no longer toggle abilities; instead, they will grant their Critical Strike rating benefit as long as they are slotted.
  - The ability can be activated to summon an aura of flames for 15 seconds, which launches a fireball at an enemy every 5 seconds.
  - The fireball has been changed to deal direct damage instead of damage over time.
  - Increased the damage from the fireball by 15%.
  - Note: The Flames of Oblivion morph will continue to grant the Weapon Critical Strike rating while slotted as a morph effect.
- Sea of Flames (Inferno morph): This morph has been renamed to Cauterize, and will now summon an Aura of Cauterizing Flames, launching a fireball at an ally to heal them instead of an enemy to damage them.
- Shifting Standard (Dragonknight Standard morph): Reduced the cost of this morph to 200 Ultimate from 250 Ultimate.

Draconic Power
- Burning Talons (Dark Talons morph): This morph now deals Flame Damage for its initial hit instead of Physical Damage.
- Deep Breath (Inhale morph): This morph no longer increases the damage of the exhale damage (the second hit) due to the baseline damage increases for Inhale, described below. It will continue to interrupt targets on the inhale (the first hit) as a morph effect.
- Draw Essence (Inhale morph): This morph will now restore 10% of the ability’s cost as Magicka per target hit with the exhale instead of restoring Magicka based on the damage dealt.
- Inhale:
  - Increased the exhale damage (the second hit) from this ability and the Draw Essence morph by 40%. The Deep Breath morph has had its exhale damage increased by 16% to match this value.
  - This ability and its morphs now hits 6 targets, increased from 3 targets, and follows standard area of effect damage guidelines for additional targets.
  - Increased the cost of this ability and its morphs by 6%.

Earthen Heart
- Eruption (Ash Cloud morph): Increased the initial eruption damage from this morph by 22%.
- Igneous Weapons (Molten Weapons morph): This morph will now grant you and your allies the Major Brutality buff for 30 seconds, in addition to the Major Sorcery buff.
- Magma Shell (Magma Armor morph):
  - This morph no longer grants a synergy to allies for a powerful damage shield; instead, it automatically applies the damage shield on nearby allies when the ability is used.
  - Increased the radius of the shield application to 8 meters from 5 meters.
- Molten Armaments (Molten Weapons morph):
  - This morph now increases your own fully-charged Heavy Attack damage by 40% for 30 seconds in addition to granting the Major Sorcery buff.
  - This morph will now apply the fully-charged Heavy Attack damage bonus to Lightning and Restoration Staves.
- Molten Weapons: This ability and its morphs now applies a 30 second Major Sorcery buff for you and nearby allies.
- Mountain’s Blessing: This passive ability now grants the Minor Brutality buff any time an Earthen Heart ability is activated. The Ultimate gain portion of the passive still can only be granted while you are in combat, and the tooltip has been updated to convey this.
- Obsidian Shard (Stonefist morph): Increased the healing from this morph by 16%.
- Obsidian Shield: Igneous Shield's increased damage shield effect is now a baseline effect for Obsidian Shield.
  - Note: The Igneous Shield morph will continue to grant you the Major Mending buff as a morph effect.
- Stonefist: Increased the range of this ability and its morphs to 28 meters from 20 meters. In addition, this ability and its morphs now deal Magic Damage, instead of Physical Damage.

Nightblade

Assassination
- Lotus Fan (Teleport Strike morph):
  - Significantly revised the tooltip of this morph to indicate that only the primary target is snared, and the damage over time is applied to the primary target and all nearby enemies.
  - The damage over time from this morph is no longer considered a bleed, and is now a standard magical damage over time. The damage can now be mitigated by normal means, but has been increased by 15% to account for this.
- Pressure Points: Fixed an issue where this passive ability was granting less Critical Strike Chance than intended.
- Teleport Strike: Fixed an issue with this ability and its morphs where the initial damage could not be dodged.
  - Note: The area damage over time from the Lotus Fan morph will continue to be undodgable.
- This morph no longer attempts to pull you to the target if the target is immune to the pull.
- This morph will now refund 100% of the ability’s cost as Magicka if it fails to pull a target.

Shadow
- Aspect of Terror: Mass Hysteria’s movement speed snare effect is now a baseline effect for Aspect of Terror. Enemies will be snared by 50% for 4 seconds after the fear ends.
  - Note: The Mass Hysteria morph will continue to apply the Minor Maim debuff to the target when the fear ends, and will let you fear an additional target as a morph effect.
- Bolstering Darkness (Consuming Darkness morph): Increased the healing from the Hidden Refresh synergy from this morph by 20%.
- Inhale:
- Dark Cloak (Shadow Cloak morph): This morph no longer removes damage over time effects due to the baseline changes for Shadow Cloak described below; instead, it grants the Minor Protection buff for 2/3/4/5 seconds after the invisibility ends at Ranks I/II/III/IV respectively.
- Manifestation of Terror (Aspect of Terror morph):
  - This morph now places two traps when it is used – one is placed at your current location, and another is placed at a ground-placed reticle location up to 22 meters away.
  - The traps created by this morph are now visible to enemies.
  - Reduced the amount of targets feared by each trap to one target from six targets.
- Path of Darkness:
  - This ability and its morphs now continue to grant the Major Expedition buff for up to two seconds after leaving the path.
  - Increased the damage of this ability and the Refreshing Path morph by 25%.
- Refreshing Path (Path of Darkness morph): Reduced the time this morph continues to heal yourself and allies to 2 seconds after leaving the path, down from 3 seconds.
- Shadow Cloak: This ability and its morphs will now suppress damage over time effects that are already applied to the caster while the invisibility is active.
  - The damage over time will remain, but will tick for 0 damage if you are invisible, and will tick for the normal damage if you come out of invisibility.
- Twisting Path (Path of Darkness morph): Increased the damage of this ability by 20%.

Siphoning
- Agony: This ability and its morphs will now apply their damage over time component to targets that are immune to the disorient portion of the ability.
- Catalyst: Increased the amount of Ultimate you gain when drinking a potion to 10/20 Ultimate at Ranks I/II from 6/12 Ultimate.
- Debilitate (Cripple morph):
  - This morph now also allows you to place Debilitate on an unlimited amount of targets.
  - Reduced the Magicka refund from this morph to 50% of the ability’s cost from 100%.
- Funnel Health (Strife morph): Reduced the application of the heal over time to you and one additional friendly target, previously two friendly targets.
- Leeching Strikes (Siphoning Attacks morph): Increased the amount of Health restored from this morph to 3% of your maximum Health from 2%.
- Siphoning Attacks (Siphoning Strikes morph):
  - Fixed an issue where this morph could proc its resource return on every tick from a damage over time effect.
  - Increased the amount of resources provided by this ability and the Siphoning Attacks morph by roughly 10%.
- Soul Shred: Increased the damage from the Soul Leech synergy from this ability and its morphs by 3%.
- Soul Siphon (Soul Shred morph): This morph now heals and applies the Major Vitality buff to yourself as well as your allies.
- Strife: Fixed an issue where you were able to dodge the friendly heal from this ability and its morphs.

Sorcerer

Dark Magic
- Crystal Blast (Crystal Shard morph): Increased the secondary splash damage of this morph by 25%.
- Daedric Tomb (Daedric Mines morph): This morph no longer places three Daedric mines in a line in front of you; instead, the Daedric mines can be placed at a ground-targeted reticle location up to 22 meters away. The mines will arm instantly in the normal triangular pattern.
- Dark Exchange: Increased the cost of this ability and its morphs by 20%, but they now return 20% more Health, Magicka, or Stamina.
- Negate Magic: Fixed an issue where this ability and its morphs would not apply crowd control immunity to monsters at the end of their stun durations.

Daedric Summoning
- Conjured Ward: Fixed an issue with this ability and its morphs where the damage shield created for your pets was not updating its value when the ability was re-cast.
- Empowered Ward (Conjured Ward morph):
  - This morph now grants the Minor Intellect buff to you and nearby allies, and will not be removed if the caster’s damage shield is removed.
  - This morph no longer provides the Minor Mending buff.
- Summon Restoring Twilight (Summon Winged Twilight morph):
  - This pet’s special ability will now empower it, granting it a buff for 15 seconds that increases the Twilight’s damage by 50% against targets above 50% Health.
  - This pet no longer passively grants the Minor Intellect buff while it is active.
  - Renamed this morph to “Summon Twilight Tormentor.”
- Summon Storm Atronach:
  - Increased the activation range for the Charged Lightning synergy from this ability and its morphs to 3.5 meters from 2.5 meters.
  - The Atronach summoned by this ability and its morphs will now cast Break Free 4 seconds after being crowd controlled.
  - The Atronach summoned by this ability and its morphs will now wait 3 seconds after being interrupted to recast its channeled zap.
- Summon Twilight Matriarch (Summon Winged Twilight morph):
  - This pet’s special ability will now cause it to heal itself and up to 2 friendly targets for 20% of your maximum Magicka.
  - This pet no longer siphons her health to you if you fall below 35% Health, due to the active ability changes for Summon Winged Twilight described below.
- Summon Winged Twilight:
  - This ability and its morphs are no longer toggle abilities; instead, they are now normal casted abilities. The first activation will summon your pet, and when morphed, the second activation will cast the pet’s special ability.
    - Note that the pet will still be desummoned if you switch ability bars without slotting it.
  - Decreased the cost to summon a pet from this ability and its morphs by 50%.
  - Increased the cast time to summon the pet to 1.5 seconds from 1.3 seconds.
  - The pet summoned by this ability and its morphs now heals itself for 3% of its maximum Health every two seconds.
- Unstable Clannfear (Unstable Familiar morph): This pet’s special ability will now heal you and the Clannfear for 35% of your maximum Health.
  - Note that this pet will no longer heal you when it dies.
- Unstable Familiar:
  - This ability and its morphs are no longer toggle abilities; instead, they are now normal casted abilities. The first activation will summon your pet, and when morphed, the second activation will cast the pet’s special ability.
    - ]Note that the pet will still be desummoned if you switch ability bars without slotting it.
  - Decreased the cost to summon a pet from this ability and its morphs by 50%.
  - Increased the cast time to summon the pet to 1.5 seconds from 1.3 seconds.
  - The pet summoned by this ability and its morphs now heals itself for 3% of its maximum Health every two seconds.
  - Added the word “Summon” to the name of this ability and its morphs so it now reads “Summon Unstable Familiar.”
- Volatile Familiar (Unstable Familiar morph): This pet’s special ability will now cause it to pulse for point-blank area of effect damage every 2 seconds for 4 seconds, with a 3 second stun on the final pulse. Each pulse will deal 8% of your maximum Magicka.
  - Note that this pet no longer stuns or deals point-blank area of effect damage when it dies.

Storm Calling
- Energized: Updated this passive ability’s tooltip to indicate it increases all of your Shock Damage, and not just the damage of your Storm Calling abilities.
- Lightning Splash: Increased the activation range from the Conduit synergy from this ability and its morphs to 3.5 meters from 2.5 meters.
- Power Overload (Overload morph): Fixed an issue where Rank IV of this morph was not gaining a damage bonus.
- Thundering Presence (Lightning Form morph): Fixed an issue where recasting this morph would cause the effects to disappear.
Placeholder

Templar

Aedric Spear
- Blazing Spear (Spear Shards morph): This morph now displays a hostile red telegraph if it is cast from enemy Templars.
- Crescent Sweep (Radial Sweep morph): Increased the bonus to the initial hit provided by this morph to 66% more damage dealt from 33%.
- Empowering Sweep (Radial Sweep morph): Increased the duration of the damage reduction provided by this morph to 10 seconds from 8 seconds.
- Focused Charge:
  - The damage from this ability and the Toppling Charge morph can now be dodged.
  - Made some improvements to this ability and its morphs to prevent you from getting locked out of using other abilities.
- Piercing Javelin: Increased the range of this ability and its morphs to 28 meters from 20 meters.
- Puncturing Strikes: This ability and its morphs no longer knockback and apply crowd control immunity to the nearest enemy on the final hit; instead, they now snare that enemy by 70% for two seconds.
- Puncturing Sweeps (Puncturing Strikes morph): Decreased the heal amount from this morph to 35% of the damage dealt from 40%.
- Radial Sweep: Increased the radius of this ability and its morphs to 6 meters from 5 meters.
- Radiant Ward (Sun Shield morph): Increased the shield strength bonus from this morph’s shield to 6% per enemy hit from 5%.

Dawn's Wrath
- Backlash: Increased the maximum damage limit for this ability and its morphs by 25%, but decreased their damage stored amount by 66%. In addition, this ability and its morphs can no longer be reflected.
- Eclipse:
  - This ability and the Total Dark morph can now reflect ranged physical projectiles back to the enemy, in addition to spell projectiles.
  - Revised the tooltips for this ability and the Total Dark morph to indicate that the area damage effect is separate from the self-reflect effect, and can be applied to a CC-immune target.
  - Fixed an issue where this ability and the Total Dark morph could reflect snares from ground-placed ticking abilities, such as Caltrops or Ash Cloud, and cause you to move at extremely high speeds.
- Enduring Rays:
  - This passive ability now only increases the duration of the Sun Fire, Eclipse, and Nova abilities.
  - Increased this passive ability’s bonus to 15/30% more duration at Ranks I/II from 10/20%.
- Nova:
  - Reduced the effects and visual light intensity for this ability and its morphs.
  - Increased the damage from the Supernova and Gravity Crush synergies by 16%.
  - Increased the activation range for the Supernova and Gravity Crush synergies to 3.5 meters from 2.5 meters.
- Radiant Destruction: Fixed an issue where the execute bonus damage from this ability would not apply if multiple Templars were channeling these abilities on the same target.
- Solar Flare: Increased the damage for this ability and the Dark Flare morph by 12%. The damage of the Solar Barrage morph remains unchanged.
- Unstable Core (Eclipse morph): Increased the area damage when the effect ends by 50% and can be placed on an unlimited amount of targets, but it no longer reflects single target spells back to the enemy.
- Vampire’s Bane (Sun Fire morph): Increased the damage over time duration for this morph to 9 seconds from 7 seconds.

Restoring Light
- Breath of Life (Rushed Ceremony morph): This morph now only fires one additional secondary heal, previously two heals.
- Cleansing Ritual:
  - Increased the healing from the Purify synergy from this ability and its morphs by 12%.
  - Fixed an issue where this ability and its morphs could be used to cleanse projectiles that were mid-flight. It now matches the behavior of the Purge ability.
- Focused Healing: This passive ability now grants you the Major Mending buff while standing in your own Cleansing Ritual, Rune Focus, or Rite of Passage area effects and for up to 2/4 seconds after leaving them at Ranks I/II, instead of granting you 15/30% more healing to allies standing in your own Cleansing Ritual, Rune Focus, or Rite of Passage.
- Healing Ritual:
  - Reduced the cast time for this ability and its morphs by 25%, and reduced the healing done by 25%.
  - Fixed an issue with this ability and its morphs where the visual effects would linger on your hands after casting.
- Radiant Aura (Restoring Aura morph): This morph now grants you and your allies the Major Intellect buff upon activation, as well as having an increased radius as a morph effect.
- Restoring Focus (Rune Focus morph): This morph now grants you the Minor Protection buff, in addition to granting the Minor Vitality buff as a morph effect.
- Rite of Passage: In order to prevent visual issues or issues where the channel would end prematurely, this ability and its morphs can no longer be cast in mid-air.
- Rune Focus:
  - Revised the tooltips for this ability and its morphs to indicate that all the effects provided by this ability and its morphs will now remain on you for up to 8 seconds after leaving the rune’s radius.

Weapon

Two Handed
- Critical Rush (Critical Charge morph): Fixed an issue where charging at the minimum range would reduce this morph’s damage.
- Heavy Weapons: Fixed an issue where the Axe Bleed proc from this passive ability was triggering 100% of the time.
- Momentum: Fixed an issue with this ability and the Forward Momentum morph where the heal over time would always critically strike if the caster was crouched.
- Rally (Momentum morph): Fixed an issue where the final heal value from this morph would sometimes be significantly lower than intended.
One Hand and Shield
- Defensive Stance: Fixed an issue where the visual effects of this ability and its morphs would fade earlier than the buff duration.
- Reverberating Bash (Power Bash morph): Fixed an issue where you could not reliably use Break Free against the stun from this ability and its morphs.
Dual Wield
- Steel Tornado (Whirlwind morph): Decreased the radius of this morph to 9 meters on all Ranks from 11/11.5/12/12.5 meters on Ranks I/II/III/IV. This morph now gains slightly more damage as it ranks up.
Bow
- Hawk Eye: This passive ability has been redesigned, and no longer increases the damage of your Bow abilities against off-balance enemies. It now increases the damage of your Bow abilities by 2/5% for 4 seconds after each successful Light or Heavy Attack, stacking up to 3 times.
- Scatter Shot: Adjusted the rank progression for this morph so it reduces the cost of the ability at a smoother curve.
Destruction Staff
- Blockade of Elements (Wall of Elements morph): Fixed an issue where the visual effects from this morph was fading too early.
- Destruction Expert: Fixed an issue where the caster would not restore Magicka from this passive if a weapon enchantment proc from their equipped Destruction Staff was the killing blow.
- Penetrating Magic: This passive now grants Spell Penetration to the caster’s weapon enchantment procs if they are enchanted on an equipped Destruction Staff.
- Unstable Wall of Elements (Wall of Elements morph): Increased the damage from the final explosion from this morph by 75%. We also fixed an issue where the visual effects of the explosion from this morph did not match the actual damage.
- Wall of Elements:
  - Increased the damage for this ability and its morphs by 80%.
  - Fixed an issue where Wall of Storms and its morphs were not setting concussed enemies off balance.
  - Fixed an issue where the visual effects from Wall of Flame and Wall of Frost would not be removed when they were recast at a new location.
Restoration Staff
- Essence Drain: This passive ability now also grants you the Major Mending buff for 1.5/3 seconds after completing a fully-charged Heavy Attack at Ranks I/II.
- Mutagen (Regeneration morph): Fixed an issue where the secondary heal that fires when the target goes below 20% Health could not critically strike.

Armor

Medium Armor
- Dexterity: Fixed an issue where this passive ability was granting less Critical Strike Chance than intended.
- Elude (Evasion morph): Fixed an issue where each recast of this morph would add additional time to the duration of the Major Evasion buff.

World

Soul Magic
- Soul Lock: Fixed an issue which was preventing this ability from proccing on some weapon skill lines.
Vampire
- Drain Essence: Fixed an issue with this ability and its morphs where you would get stuck in the animation if it was the killing blow on an enemy.
- Unnatural Resistance: Fixed an issue where purchasing this passive would not update your Health Recovery in the character UI.
Werewolf
- Fixed an issue where Werewolf Light Attacks were not proccing weapon enchantments.
- Fixed an issue where Werewolf Light and Heavy Attacks could only proc your main hand weapon enchantment when dual wielding. They now proc either enchantment at random, and each enchantment will have its own internal cooldown.

Guild

Fighters Guild
- Dawnbreaker: This ability and its morphs will now be more responsive in combat.
- Rearming Trap (Trap Beast morph): Fixed an issue where this morph’s second trap would remain active after the caster died.
- Turn Undead (Circle of Protection morph): Fixed an issue where this ability was not following the standard area of effect buff and damage guidelines for additional targets hit.
Mages Guild
- Ice Comet (Meteor morph): Reduced the movement speed reduction effect of this morph to a 50% snare from 85%.
- Magelight:
  - This ability and its morphs are no longer toggle abilities; instead, they will grant their Critical Strike rating benefits as long as they are slotted (similar to Expert Hunter).
  - Magelight can now be activated to summon a mote of magelight which exposes hidden or invisible enemies in a 6 meter radius for 5 seconds, and prevents revealed enemies from returning to stealth for 3 seconds.
  - This ability and the Radiant Magelight morph no longer decrease your maximum Magicka, due to the toggle changes noted above.
  - The Radiant Magelight morph will continue to prevent you from being stunned by stealth attacks, and will reduce damage from stealth attacks while slotted as a morph effect. Activating it also increases the radius of the activated reveal to 12 meters, and reduces the cost.
  - The Inner Light morph will continue to increase your maximum Magicka while slotted.
- Magicka Controller: Fixed an issue where this passive ability was not dynamically updating the stats on the Character UI when you added Mages Guild abilities to your skill bar.
- Meteor: This ability and its morphs can no longer be reflected. We also fixed an issue where the damage over time from this ability would appear at the wrong location when cast on a moving target.
- Might of the Guild: This passive ability can now proc the Empower buff from Magelight and its morphs.
Undaunted
- Bone Shield: Increased the activation range from the Bone Wall and Spinal Surge synergies to 3.5 meters from 2.5 meters.
- Energy Orb (Necrotic Orb morph): Fixed an issue where you were able to block the healing synergy from this ability.
- Inner Fire: The Radiate synergy from this ability and its morphs now requires the synergy user to target the enemy afflicted with Inner Fire to activate it. We also increased the damage from the Radiate synergy by 11%.
- Necrotic Orb: Fixed an issue with the synergies of this ability and its morphs not scaling with the synergy user’s highest statistics.
- Trapping Webs: The Spawn Broodlings and Arachnophobia synergies from this ability and the Tangling Webs morph have had their summoned spider’s damage reduced by 44%. The Black Widows synergy from the Shadow Silk morph has had its summoned spider’s damage reduced by 35%.

Alliance War

Assault
- Significantly reduced the amount of Alliance Points you need to advance through the ranks in this skill line.
- Inevitable Detonation (Magicka Detonation morph): Fixed an issue where this morph’s effect could not be purged or cleansed. It will continue to detonate immediately when it is removed early.
- Magicka Detonation:
  - Reduced the damage from this ability and its morphs by 15%.
  - Increased the amount of additional damage per hit to 10% additional damage per target hit from 5%
  - Increased the cap for the bonus damage to a total of 100% more damage done, from 25% more damage done.
- Rapid Maneuver:
  - This ability and its morphs now also remove their bonuses whenever you cast a friendly ability on an ally, as well as a damaging ability on an enemy.
  - Increased the duration of this ability and its morphs to 30 seconds from 20 seconds.
  - This ability and its morphs now only affect your group, instead of any friendly nearby ally.
  - Reduced the maximum amount of targets this ability and its morphs can affect to 24 targets, previously an infinite amount of targets.
Emperor
- Tactician: Fixed an issue where this passive was not increasing the damage of Siege Weapons.
Support
- Significantly reduced the amount of Alliance Points you need to advance through the ranks in this skill line.
- Barrier:
  - Reduced the amount of targets this ability and its morphs affect to a maximum of 6 targets, previously 20 targets.
  - Reduced the cost of this ability and its morphs to 200 Ultimate from 250 Ultimate.
  - This ability and its morphs will now place Damage Shields on low-health targets that are not already shielded by Barrier, instead of targets that are closest to the caster.
- Battle Resurrection: Fixed an issue where this passive ability would not function inside of Imperial City or the Imperial Sewers.
- Efficient Purge (Purge morph): Increased the cost of this ability by 32%.
- Guard:
  - This ability and its morphs no longer drain Stamina every second they are toggled on. They will continue to charge an upfront Stamina cost, charge Stamina for each intercepted attack, and disable Stamina Recovery while active.
  - Fixed an issue where this ability and its morphs would not reliably intercept projectiles.
- Purge:
  - Reduced the amount of targets this ability and its morphs affect to a maximum of 6 targets, previously 20 targets.
  - Increased the radius of this ability and its morphs to 18 meters from 12 meters.
  - This ability and its morphs now only affect your group, instead of any friendly nearby ally.
- Replenishing Barrier (Barrier morph): Increased the Ultimate restoration from this morph to 6 Ultimate per ward that dissolves from 4.
- Revealing Flare:
  - This ability and its morphs now snare any enemy revealed from stealth or invisibility by 50% for 3 seconds.
  - Reduced the time this ability and its morphs prevent a revealed enemy from returning to stealth or invisibility to 3 seconds from 8 seconds.

For you newer members of the community who don’t quite understand where the Natch Potes memes originated, it was from this time when we genuinely and eagerly awaited the publication of them like kids on Christmas morning because they had so much in them that your class, your preferences, and how you played the game was bound to get multiple updates. Everyone usually got something to improve their gaming experience.

Now we come to Update 43. A very modest amount of combat changes: just 45 (compared to 222).

Here is the brief list:

Arcanist

Herald of the Tome
- Abyssal Impact
  - Cephaliarch's Flail (morph):
    - This morph no longer gains execute scaling damage.
    - The healing from this morph now only occurs if the ability damaged a target, to ensure it can only be used aggressively, rather than at any time.
  - Tentacular Dread (morph): This morph now increases its damage done by 33% per Crux consumed, up from 20%.

Necromancer

Added Major and Minor effects to numerous Necromantic abilities to help the class better enfeeble their foes and empower themselves with the taste of death.
The following minions/abilities will now only generate a corpse if their summoner was also in combat, in efforts to reduce the ability to generate Ultimate out of combat:
- Sacrificial Bones and Grave Lord’s Sacrifice
- Skeletal Mage and its morphs
- Bone Armor and its morphs
- Spirit Mender and its morphs
Gravelord
- Boneyard: This ability and its morphs now also apply Minor Vulnerability to enemies inside the area. The chill of death embraces those in its wake.
  - Unnerving Boneyard (morph): This ability's Minor Vulnerability and Major Breach now persist on enemies for 4.1 seconds each tick, rather than only while in the area.
- Sacrificial Bones:
  - This ability and the Grave Lord’s Sacrifice morph no longer require you to be in combat in order to cast them.
  - Fixed an issue where the damage increase from this ability and its morphs did not properly update many ability tooltips.
- Shocking Siphon: This ability and its morphs now also grant you Major Prophecy and Savagery for 20 seconds after casting. Such lack of respect for the dead spurs the spreading of more of it.
  - Detonating Siphon (morph): Fixed an issue where the damage from the explosion of this morph could not be blocked.
- Skeletal Mage: This ability and its morphs now also grant you Major Brutality and Sorcery for their active duration. Such audacious manipulation of death fuels your desire for more of it.
Bone Tyrant
- Bone Armor: This ability and its morphs now also grant Minor Resolve for their duration. The bones must've belonged to milk drinkers.
  - Summoner's Armor (morph): This morph now also lasts 30 seconds, up from 20.
- Bone Totem: This ability and its morphs now also apply Major Cowardice to enemies inside it. Such horrific sights instill hopelessness to even the mightiest of foes.
  - Agony Totem: The synergy granted from this morph, Pure Agony, no longer applies Minor Vulnerability, as Boneyard now applies it.
- Grave Grasp
  - Ghostly Embrace (morph): This morph now also deals damage equal to half of a normal area effect spammable attack to enemies in each patch. The ability now ranks up in 1.1% damage per rank, rather than adding .333ms to each negative effect per rank.
- Living Death
  - Spirit Mender
    - Intensive Mender (morph): This morph now also heals 2 additional allies within 8 meters of the original target, since the morph did not add direct power to the base ability.

Nightblade

Shifted numerous Nightblade abilities to improve their thematic tie into their skill line, while simultaneously addressing some long-standing balance issues the class has had in PvP environments. These changes are listed below, rather than explaining each change in an isolated bullet point:
- Moved Blur and its morphs out of the Assassination skill line and into the Shadow skill line. Blur is now the first ability in the Shadow line, taking the place of Veiled Strike. This means Blur and its morphs will now be treated as Shadow abilities and interact with augments that come from the Shadow skill line, rather than the Assassination skill line.
- Moved Veiled Strike and its morphs out of the Shadow skill line and into the Assassination skill line. Veiled Strike is now the first ability in the Assassination line, taking the place of Assassin's Blade. This means Veiled Strike and its morphs will now be treated as Assassination abilities and interact with augments that come from the Assassination skill line, rather than the Shadow skill line.
- Moved Assassin's Blade and its morphs to the open slot that Blur originally occupied as the 3rd ability unlocked from the skill line.
Shadow
- Shadow Barrier: This passive now grants its Major Resolve for 6/12 seconds, rather than 3/6 seconds. It now increases by 2 seconds per piece of Heavy Armor worn at either rank, rather than extending the duration by 25% per piece worn.
Siphoning
- Strife: Fixed an issue where this ability and its morphs’ healing failed to activate if the target was blocking.
  - Funnel Health (morph): This morph now heals up to 3 targets, rather than 2, so its morph power upgrade is similar to Radiating Regeneration.

Sorcerer

Daedric Summoning
- Daedric Curse:
  - This ability and its morphs now deal their full damage in an area around the cursed enemy, rather than dealing full damage to the cursed enemy and half damage in an area around them.
  - This damage can now be blocked, as this feature was never messaged on the ability and is not considered a Damage over Time, nor is its damage-based on other damaging events.
- Daedric Prey: This morph now properly mentions that it also forces your active pets to prioritize the target.

Templar

Dawn’s Wrath
- Radiant Destruction: Fixed an issue where this ability and its morphs’ visuals would appear to spill out and reflect on yourself when the abilities triggered the Overcharged status effect on the enemy target.
- Solar Flare: Increased the duration of the Sunsphere and Empower granted from this ability and the Dark Flare morph to 10 seconds, up from 5.

Warden

Winter’s Embrace
- Arctic Wind
  - Arctic Blast (morph):
    - This morph now instantly deals damage equal to a normal area effect spammable attack, rather than healing you instantly. Instead, the healing happens if no targets are affected by the stun. The Damage over Time now only starts after the 2 second delay, rather than instantly.
    - Reduced the Damage over Time by ~21% per tick, resulting in little to no changes in its total base damage dealt with the initial hit added.
    - Reduced the base chance to apply the Chilled Status effect to 10% per tick, down from 15%. The initial hit has a 25% chance to apply the Chilled status.
  - Piercing Cold: Reworked this passive to grant varying effects based on your Max Health to better align with the passive being for tanks, while continuing to offer something for damage dealers. This passive now grants Piercing Cold for 6 seconds when you deal Frost Damage, up to once every 6 seconds. If you have 30,000 or more Max Health, Piercing Cold increases the damage you block by 6/12%. If you have less than 30,000 Max Health, it grants you 4/8% damage done.

Weapon

Destruction Staff
- Ancient Knowledge: Fixed an issue where this passive could cause your Health Bar to glow permanently.
- Weakness to Elements
  - Elemental Susceptibility: Fixed an issue where this ability would break stealth and invisibility each tick.
- Dual Wield
  - Hidden Blade
    - Shrouded Daggers: Fixed an issue where the bouncing daggers were not being properly treated as a ranged attack in some instances.

Guild

Fighter’s Guild
- Silver Bolts
  - Silver Leash: Fixed an issue with this morph where it could fail to behave like other pull abilities.
Mages Guild
- Entropy
  - Structured Entropy: Fixed an issue where this morph would remove stealth and invisibility from the target each time the healing projectile was sent to the caster of the effect.

World

Werewolf
- Fixed an issue where some passives could be gained in Werewolf form when they should be disabled.
- Roar
  - Deafening Roar (morph): Fixed an issue where this morph’s taunt could apply to multiple targets at once.
Vampire
- Undeath:
  - This passive now reduces damage taken by up to 5/10%, down from up to 15/30%.
  - Removed the Stage 3 or higher requirement of this passive now that its bonuses are far less potent.

Why are the current notes so much smaller? I get it, it's a free update. So not expecting a Trial or a new system like Thieves Guild. So without any new content, all the more time for combat changes. But we're just getting a fraction of combat updates; nothing like how ZOS used to support the game.

To say this is disappointing is an understatement. I’m not playing (and paying) some indie studio (who do not offer/charge a Plus feature that for all practical purposes is needed to play). ZoS is a AAA studio and a game that according to Activeplayer.io, had over 4 million players log in the past 30 days.

It’s cool that we’re getting some content in Infinite Archive, (a system I do like), but this has mostly reminded me how bad many of the first round of class sets were and how after very clear and detailed feedback on the PTS, these sets were put on Live and serve as mostly decon fodder. This brings me to another disappointing contrast between the old patch notes and the new patch notes: Previously, ZOS used to provide substantive updates to the patch notes every week to at least give us with enough time to vigorously test different iterations of changes to help fine tune things and get the balance right. Now, we’ve got to wait three weeks [!] before any adjustments are made for us to test.

What am I going to do in IA? Let’s say I play a sorcerer (and I do. It’s my second most played class) The first sorcerer set [Monolith] was absolutely terrible and this new set [Beacon of Oblivion] is either just a small bonus if I have pets or a generic percentage bonus if I don’t. This is uninspiring and has the appearance of something thrown together at the last minute to meet a deadline.

I'm fine with a break from new systems. But there are longstanding combat issues that this was the perfect time to address.

Back in 2016, I most certainly did not agree with a number of these changes, but I respected the fact that ZOS at least tried to make our class skills more appealing and did respond to gameplay issues much more quickly than now.

I main a templar. It is clear that many of the Templar mains highly dislike the change to their iconic skill Puncturing Strikes (Jabs) made in update 35 (among many other things during that update). That was in August 2022. Here we are almost in August 2024 and we’re still in the same situation.

What have Templars received in the past 2+ years?

Update 42: An immobilize to help tanks. Except I don’t tank and this class is still uncompetitive at tanking
Update 41: A guaranteed status effect on a mediocre skill that has a clunky mechanic; a status effect I can easily get from slotting a glyph.
Update 40: Some minor magicka return on a morph I don’t even use.
Update 39: A visual effect bug. Yeah, that’s it.
Update 38: This was our “big” update. This is what the devs had to say
- ”Zos” wrote:
  
  After the adjustments to Templar’s damage to make sure they’re more in line with other classes, we’ve seen them drop down in effectiveness in PvP situations in some areas. Rather than bloating out their damage again, we’re trying to help enable them to stay in the fray longer and keep up the pressure by adding some defensive bonuses when they dive into foes, helping them go all in before needing to peel back and turtle up.
- In short, ZOS nerfed the Templar’s damage, making them uncompetitive and undesirable in PvP. And then it went to the “this is my house” philosophy again, giving Templars some defense bonuses, which, as anybody who has fought a templar already knows, is where the class is already decent and not what Templars needed. Also, the class has zero mobility skills, so they don’t “peel back” while fighting (i.e., the whole “this is my house” mantra). These changes missed the mark.

Here were the Templar reforms from update 38

Major protection on Charge. It’s a strong buff. However, many templars have long abandoned this skill because years ago after taking over a dozen updates to finally fix the skill so it didn’t bug out, ZOS then slowed down the animation, making it clunky and unsatisfying to use. You get Javelined far more often than Charged for a reason. If Jabs were good, maybe (which I am not sure they ever will be in a PvP environment because Jabs alone of the class spammables can get reduced pretty easily by 30%).
Minor quality of life improvements to skills like Solar Flare and Backlash that failed to address the core issue with these skills.
Rune Focus. Some minor healing while moving out of the Rune made it more convenient to use. It’s a welcome change, but didn’t do anything to move the needle with respect to this update’s goal: address the issues the made templar in ZoS’s own words, “drop down in effectiveness in PvP situations.”

There was a grand total of 9 changes in an update “primarily focused on templars.” Back in 2016, we got 32 changes for Templars in an update that was *not* focused on them. In other words, Templars had more reforms during one single update in 2016 than over the past two years.

Update 38 did not address the core problem that led to the templar’s drop in effectiveness: the nerfed damage. Instead, it tried to entice Templars to use a skill they weren’t using, just so they could get into melee combat, which is where they struggled in the first place. Didn’t work.

These types of experiences are what make the lack of combat support frustrating. We have to wait so long for ZoS finally get around to trying again. After missing in update 38, updates 39, 40, 41, 42, and this upcoming update 43 amount to very little if you main a Templar.

It’s not just Templars. Sorcerers took a major hit due to hybridization and wallowed update after update in mediocrity. I won’t even bother playing my Necromancer anymore because the class feels nothing like an archetypal fantasy Necromancer. Some generic buffs on skills I don’t use (Skeletal archer and tethers are ineffective in a PvP environment) aren’t moving the needle for me.

At the end of the day, all RPG fantasy games come down to combat. I enjoyed decorating my house (and thus feel the frustration housing players have for this update), I liked finding new outfits and style customizations for my characters, I even enjoyed the quest content in Gold Road. That’s all well and good. But if my character does not hit the desired DPS on the target dummy, does not provide anything unique to my group, or is not competitive in a PvP environment, then the game ceases to be fun playing.

This is a AAA game with a AAA price tag. Please provide your customers with substantive combat support for this game like we had in the past.

It would be most appreciated.

Edit: A clarifying post can be read in reply #24.

Lykeion · July 31

ZoS seems to be very cautious about combat content updates after the disastrous U35. However, I don't think more combat content updates would be a bad thing, most of the meta in PvE hasn't changed in over a year. As long as the changes are reasonable enough (and aren't something "highly anticipated by players" as ZoS claims), I'm happy to accept them

Stafford197 · July 31

I think you make great points, but also there is an ego component to it all. ZOS has always believed they know best. Changes are made based on their own opinions and obscure metrics… not on what the players actually want.

Morrowind chapter in 2017 brought us a meta of super bad resource recovery. You and I can see why that’s a bad idea of course, but ZOS ignored feedback. They thought (no I’m not joking) that combat would be most fun if the group spams heavy attacks to get resources, and then can complete 1-2 rotations as a form of “burst dps phase”, and then recharge resources again with heavy attack spam. Naturally that was the first big exodus of endgame players.

We’ve seen this happen time and time again.
- AoE Caps
- Gap closer applying unpurgeable immobilizations
- Scalebreaker mega DoT buff
- Subsequent mega DoT nerf, nerfed to a lower value than pre-buff.
- Templar jabs changes
- U35…..
The list could be much longer.

The point is…. in 2024, they are even less receptive to feedback than ever. We can ask for changes, but certainly do not hold any hopes for things to improve.

xylena_lazarow · July 31

Lykeion wrote: »

ZoS seems to be very cautious about combat content updates after the disastrous U35

We definitely did ask them to slow down on combat changes, for a while it felt like they were trying to rework the whole game every 3 months. Would sure be nice if they responded faster to very specific pain points like Tarnished Nightmare and Hardened Ward in PvP, or finally giving Templar the kind of attention they give Nightblade.

My experience of 2016 was a boatload of sad nerfs (RIP Viper Tremor) and my personal disinterest in the PvE Justice System that was at the forefront of every update. Ended up taking a year long break from this game.

TechMaybeHic · July 31

Lykeion wrote: »

ZoS seems to be very cautious about combat content updates after the disastrous U35. However, I don't think more combat content updates would be a bad thing, most of the meta in PvE hasn't changed in over a year. As long as the changes are reasonable enough (and aren't something "highly anticipated by players" as ZoS claims), I'm happy to accept them

Kind of seems odd to me.

Players: "we hate the update 35 changes"

ZOS: "The changes we made were not popular. Let's move at a much slower pace to make addressing the most unpopular things take years to address"

Lykeion · July 31

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Kind of seems odd to me.

Players: "we hate the update 35 changes"

ZOS: "The changes we made were not popular. Let's move at a much slower pace to make addressing the most unpopular things take years to address"

That's exactly the point. After u35 zos just slowed down the frequency of those unpopular updates instead of stopping them. We still got jabs and skeletons even though they received overwhelming objections in PTS. What players really need are changes that make sense

Stafford197 · July 31

Lykeion wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Kind of seems odd to me.

Players: "we hate the update 35 changes"

ZOS: "The changes we made were not popular. Let's move at a much slower pace to make addressing the most unpopular things take years to address"

That's exactly the point. After u35 zos just slowed down the frequency of those unpopular updates instead of stopping them. We still got jabs and skeletons even though they received overwhelming objections in PTS. What players really need are changes that make sense

Exactly this^^^

Players want good changes, and then afterward for things to mostly be left alone once they’re in a good state (which is when a slowdown should happen). In other words, let us have fun. Give us new stuff like third morphs instead of ruining current builds.

Homestead patch 2017 was the last time the game was in a state where they were close to very solid gameplay.
- Heavy Attacks were actually heavy damage, like in Elder Scrolls games, and not meant to be mass resource generators. Aka recovery stats mattered.
- Sorcs were the strongest in PvE and were very fun to play. Other classes did not need many changes to be brought up to par and so we hoped for those changes to happen
- Sorc and NB were the strongest in PvP. Templar was close to being on par, while DK was farther behind. Again, with a handful of changes, this could’ve been fixed.
- PvP had enormously more players despite pitifully bad rewards, because the gameplay was actually fun. Based on ps na, it was 3 full campaigns and 3+ others that were half full or so, compared to 1 barely filled campaign now. Not even counting the population cap reduction in campaigns that have occurred between then and now.

But then combat took an entirely new direction with Morrowind, and combat continues to take new directions every 1-2 years in the form of some massive *always unpopular* shift. U35 was just one extra bad version of those shifts.

Necrotech_Master · July 31

im personally fine without major combat changes every year

i remember many of those combat updates where people would complain in zone/guilds that "such and such is gonna be nerfed for this class next patch" and in many cases it actually ended up being a buff or no change for my specific use cases

10 years into the game it shouldnt need major combat updates every year, 2016 was 2 years after the game launch when it was still getting its footing and probably needed the major changes then

im agree there are current issues with things, like i was just as confused about the blastbones change as everyone else because i dont think ive seen that requested before lol

tsaescishoeshiner · July 31

A few years ago, we got so many combat changes each Update that players requested that it slow down. People were getting tired of re-farming new gear or switching to new classes every 3-6 months. I think it was called "build fatigue".

It does feel like we've been getting changes that are almost too steady, while some concerns (lukewarm necromancer dps, too-strong warden PvP) have been addressed in the patch notes, but seemingly not all the way shored up.

But overall, I think we're in a good spot for class viability in general--class balance tapers off when you get to the most competitive levels of play, like trial trifectas or 1vXing in PvP.

chessalavakia_ESO · July 31

The issue you run into is if you release lots of combat changes without much content the people that don't like the combat changes aren't going to be pleased because the update can easily end up making the experience worse.

I think you'd find you have significant sections of the game that do not like ESO's combat design but put up with it. Making changes for the people that like the design for the most part may end up running the people that are putting up with it off.

BananaBender · July 31

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

But overall, I think we're in a good spot for class viability in general--class balance tapers off when you get to the most competitive levels of play, like trial trifectas or 1vXing in PvP.

So the class viability is good at the level where viability doesn't matter. Sure, you can play what ever class and spec well if you aren't partaking in the harder side of content like dungeons, trials and PvP, but hasn't this always been the case?

Pelanora · July 31

A good and thoughtful report OP and I wonder if anything like it gets created and talked through in Zos.

Alaztor91 · July 31

I don't know how long this position has been vacant, the first time I saw a post mentioning it was probably like a year ago, but I assume that it's part of the reason why we have recently received stuff like U35, Jabs/Flurry change, Grim Focus permaglow, Necro/Templar issues being mostly ignored, etc.

One would at least expect more robust combat changes being made in Q3/Q4 if they ''sacrificed'' the Q3 Dungeon DLC and the Q4 Zone DLC we used to get.

Theist_VII · July 31

Stafford197 wrote: »

- Sorc and NB were the strongest in PvP. Templar was close to being on par, while DK was farther behind. Again, with a handful of changes, this could’ve been fixed.

While I agree with the majority of what you wrote, I think you’re a little hazy on this one. Homestead was the patch when Magicka Dragonknights finally became playable again and were sitting pretty. There was no cooldown on Burning Talons, and whenever your opponent was rooted, you got Power Lash.

Honestly, playing a DW/Resto Dragonknight nowadays doesn’t hold a candle to the flame that it did back in early 2017.

As far as PvE, Stamina Dragonknights were still meta for content thanks to Maelstrom DW and Venomous Claw, and were harder to play in PvP than a Nightblade back then, but were at par when played well.

Stafford197 · August 1

Theist_VII wrote: »

Stafford197 wrote: »

- Sorc and NB were the strongest in PvP. Templar was close to being on par, while DK was farther behind. Again, with a handful of changes, this could’ve been fixed.

While I agree with the majority of what you wrote, I think you’re a little hazy on this one. Homestead was the patch when Magicka Dragonknights finally became playable again and were sitting pretty. There was no cooldown on Burning Talons, and whenever your opponent was rooted, you got Power Lash.

Honestly, playing a DW/Resto Dragonknight nowadays doesn’t hold a candle to the flame that it did back in early 2017.

As far as PvE, Stamina Dragonknights were still meta for content thanks to Maelstrom DW and Venomous Claw, and were harder to play in PvP than a Nightblade back then, but were at par when played well.

That’s fair!! Such a long time ago now I’m definitely hazy on the meta back then. I remember I played Mag Sorc a bunch and had so much fun with it all. Had a pretty much all Mag Sorc DPS vMoL HM prog and also played it in PvP a bunch

ToRelax · August 1

We used to get a lot more changes - and too many of them were absolutely terrible. Players rightfully criticize changes today as well, but there really is no comparison. I'll take the current balancing efforts over 2016 any day, even while disagreeing with many of them.

xylena_lazarow · August 1

ToRelax wrote: »

We used to get a lot more changes - and too many of them were absolutely terrible. Players rightfully criticize changes today as well, but there really is no comparison. I'll take the current balancing efforts over 2016 any day, even while disagreeing with many of them.

I'm in the same boat. I'd rather put up with another few months of Tarnished Nightmare and Hardened Ward, then have to relearn the game every 3 months for a massive arbitrary pile of confusing and unnecessary twiddling. The 2016 dev strat would've had Warden's entire kit mangled as badly as whatever they just did to Arctic Blast.

Tinkerhorn · August 1

This is the first update in a long time where I don't feel like I have to take my entire Necro build back to the drawing board so I suppose that's a positive.

SeaGtGruff · August 1

From what I've seen, players tend to complain whenever there are major changes, because they don't enjoy having to adjust their builds every time something changes. Not only does it take time to analyze the changes and figure out what kinds of adjustments they'll need to make in their skill bars and rotations, but they don't enjoy having to replace their gear.

To be sure, players love to ask for changes-- buff this, nerf that-- and they're disappointed when things don't change, at least not in the ways that they've been asking for.

But they also want to keep playing as they've been doing, and tend to resent changes which affect their carefully-planned builds. They even have a name for it-- "change fatigue."

BananaBender · August 1

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

From what I've seen, players tend to complain whenever there are major changes, because they don't enjoy having to adjust their builds every time something changes. Not only does it take time to analyze the changes and figure out what kinds of adjustments they'll need to make in their skill bars and rotations, but they don't enjoy having to replace their gear.

To be sure, players love to ask for changes-- buff this, nerf that-- and they're disappointed when things don't change, at least not in the ways that they've been asking for.

But they also want to keep playing as they've been doing, and tend to resent changes which affect their carefully-planned builds. They even have a name for it-- "change fatigue."

There are as many opinions about the game's direction as there are players playing it. Inevitably some people will be calling for changes, others are hoping things to stay as is. People who are pleased are rarely the ones to post on the forums or reddit etc. so all the posts you end up seeing is of people being displeased about new changes.

I don't necessarily mind the slower pace of the changes, but it's just the quality of them as of late that I've been displeased with. Changes are needed, some people are going to like it, others wont, but if the game doesn't change people are going to get bored playing the same class and build over and over again. Updates are one the reason why people prefer MMOs over single player titles, there is always something new to discover.

Right now in PvE the meta has been revolving around Arcanists for over a year and there doesn't seem to be an end in sight. The newest changes with Gold Road only made things worse and now it's not uncommon to see 8 Arcanists in an organized trial.

TechMaybeHic · August 1

There has to be a middle ground between completely upending combat update 35 and earlier, and barely touching anything except buff NB and 1 other class at a time.

Theist_VII · August 1

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

There has to be a middle ground between completely upending combat update 35 and earlier, and barely touching anything except buff NB and 1 other class at a time.

If Scribing was a free Q4 system available to everyone, any time a developer wanted to make a drastic change to a skill like…

Stalking Blastbones > Skeleton Hugs
Biting Jabs > Vampire Shovel

…the combat devs could have just left the skills alone and added whatever new iterations they wanted into the game through that system. This way people that hate sweeping changes don’t have to stress, while theorycrafters like me have the opportunity to chase new ideas.

BasP · August 1

I'd definitely prefer more combat/ balance changes each patch than what we've gotten lately. Now I don't want each patch to be a major update like U35, of course, but I'd like it if underperforming or overperforming classes/ skills would receive small and targeted buffs and nerfs respectively on a regular basis.

For example, I believe Nightblade DDs are widely considered to be the worst DDs for endgame PvE for a while now? With Update 42 ZOS tried to remedy that a bit by making Dark Shade only deal AoE damage. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe that has really accomplished their goal. So in this patch ZOS could have, I don't know, increased the damage of Twisting Path and/or the DoT of Lotus Fan to add some more cleave damage to Nightblades without really effecting their performance in PvP.

Joy_Division · August 1

For clarification: the update cycles between the updates in the late 20s and in the 30s (basically from 2020 to early 2023), I felt were bad enough that I left the game and was inactive for about three years.

The issue with those updates is that the were spearheaded by a new combat team who were determined to implement a new vision for the game, which meant radical changes, uprooting an established and stable systems, and numerous cases of testing certain concepts on Live and quickly reversing them if they were not well received (e.g., DoTs). It was not the number of changes that was the problem. It was that they were so drastic and I did not agree to the gutting of class identity/distinctiveness in favor of a standardized spreadsheet approach. I still think the latter was a mistake; I don't like it when people refer to DPS, they do in reference to sets (e.g., Relequen, Pillar, Whorl, etc.), rather than the abilities and passives that make up our classes. These are not the sort of updates I want a return to.

To be sure, ZOS has gotten a lot more cautious when it comes to combat balance, but it to the point where it is a paralytic caution. It wasn't the number of changes, it was their radical nature that was frustrating for me. In 2016, I was not forced by nerfs, standardization, or a radical design experiment to change my Templar build. I remember that patch. The biggest adjustments I had to make was that ZOS fixed certain bugs that were allowing Templar skills to over-perform (remember cleaning meteors

), and the change to the Charge-Jabs mechanic. Since Charge already stunned, the knockback/CC on Jabs was potentially redundant (also not sure its a good idea for a spammable to stun). ZOS also finally made Eclipse useful to cast again. At the end of the day, I still wore the same gear, still had the same champion points, still basically played the same way. What changes I did make were precisely the ones I wanted to make: "Hey, they improved Eclipse, let's give it a try" (as opposed to "ugg, the nerfed the crap out of Eclipse, now I have to take it off my bar").

From my perspective, now that I am resubbed to the game, I do not think I am getting the value of the subscription the way that I felt back in say 2016. This did not mean ZOS did everything to my liking. To be sure, I (and many others) deeply disliked the Summer 2017 Morrowind update as that too was a radical change to the combat system, once again ZOS attempting to impose a new vision on its player-base despite a large amount of negative feedback. Eventually, they did back off from the low resource recovery vision, and in a reasonable amount of time precisely because the combat team was attentive to player complaints and issues.

And it's not just the lack of combat changes. I PvP, and back then I could look forward to a new battleground map, reforms in Cyrodill, and took some comfort that ZOS actually had a full time PvP developer whose job was just PvP. Now that same developer is in charge of combat, which explains why we haven't received a battleground map since update 21 (!), nothing in Cyrodiil since the Hammer (2019!), and not even any feedback regarding the results of the population increase tests that happened over 8 months ago. If I have to wait in a que for an hour to play on a dead map in which organized groups have too strong of a presence because of a low population, I feel the least I can ask for my subscription is that I don't have to wait over a year and a half to play a class like a Templar or Necromancer that ZOS's own combat team admits have become undesirable to play because of a decline in effectiveness.

Necrotech_Master · August 1

i agree its been awhile since they did any major pvp updates, but they literally have been telling us most of this calendar year the Q4 is a pvp update

as to what that will entail, we dont know yet for probably another 6-8 weeks when it goes on the PTS (Q3 update is releasing august 19 and its usually about 2-3 weeks after the release the next update goes on the PTS)

ToRelax · August 1

Templar had been in the absolute gutter in 2015. Probably unimaginably bad for those calling necro unplayable today. To praise ZOS for also getting them out of there after first pushing them in is... strange.
Sorc was very strong at that time and even more complained about. I, rightfully as it turned out, had to be worried about ZOS coming out with crazy schemes to completely gut the class.
Today we do not have a lead combat designer explaining excitedly on stream his newest plan anyone with a modicum of pvp experience can see will do the literal opposite of what he claims. You have rose-tinted glasses.

Also Morrowind was an overall positive combat update and would have been better without the heavy attack cop-out to sustain, and no one will change my mind about that.

YandereGirlfriend · August 1

I would like to see them constantly updating the sets that see basically zero use.

They obviously have (or SHOULD have) the data on individual set usage and that data would likely say that about 100 sets account for like 85% of all sets currently worn in the game.

So, simply start at the bottom, and update the 10 least-used sets every patch cycle. Most of that is simply changing a single value in a 5-piece set description, not exactly quantum physics.

Joy_Division · August 1

ToRelax wrote: »

Templar had been in the absolute gutter in 2015. Probably unimaginably bad for those calling necro unplayable today. To praise ZOS for also getting them out of there after first pushing them in is... strange.
Sorc was very strong at that time and even more complained about. I, rightfully as it turned out, had to be worried about ZOS coming out with crazy schemes to completely gut the class.
Today we do not have a lead combat designer explaining excitedly on stream his newest plan anyone with a modicum of pvp experience can see will do the literal opposite of what he claims. You have rose-tinted glasses.

Also Morrowind was an overall positive combat update and would have been better without the heavy attack cop-out to sustain, and no one will change my mind about that.

The (early) 2015 Templar was superior to what it is today. Blinding Flashes, Chain stunning enemies, Reflect that reflected back everything (even Dawnbreakers and damage over time), Radiant Destruction when first released was absolutely busted, Puncturing Sweeps that tripled dipped in restoring health, cleansing projectiles, unnerfed Breath, etc., all were abilities that enabled the class to punch higher than its paper statistics. All of these mechanics were repeatedly nerfed for a reason. These capabilities were both potent and made playing the class feel distinctive. My only complaints about the class this period were that its ultimates were terrible (easily mitigated by slotting Meteor and Dawnbreaker) and too often Toppling charge would bug out (but the skill was so good, it was used anyway). My grievances with ZOS came afterward when it took them so long to fix the bug that made Radiant Destruction dodgeable, slowed down the Charge skill, made Eclipse into a weird HoT, and then the whole "house" concept. I was very satisfied with the class early-mid 2015. That's not nostalgia. If you look at my posting history, the majority of my complaints at that time were directed at the over-nerfing of DKs after the 1.6 changes.

I have many reservations of both the combat teams of 2016 and the regime of today. People are entitled to their opinion regarding their work, but I did not quit the game for three years under the previous regime whereas I did under the current combat team. That's not nostalgia, that's putting my time and money where my mouth was. Procs were too strong then and too strong now. Sorcerers were very strong then and very strong now. Both regimes I felt were unresponsive during the PTS process. There is a lot of continuity between these regimes that does not fill me with confidence in the direction of the game, notwithstanding personality differences.

I am not seeking to change anyone's mind about Morrowind. I sure there were others who, liked ZOS, felt this was a good direction for the game. That's fine. What I am saying is that the low resource-recovery system was the most common complaint and caused a large decline in the end-game PvE community (which I was a part of at that time). Zos was not long in backing away from it, and the current combat team has been content for years in basically allowing players to not run out of resources for casting their skills.

But the point here was not to compare what the Templar was to what it is now. It is too point out the differences in the value I got form my subscription in 2016 (lots of content and combat changes, even if I did not agree with many of them) was higher than what I am getting now (less of everything, with me still not agreeing with ZOS's decisions).

Iuppiterr · August 1

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

We used to get a lot more changes - and too many of them were absolutely terrible. Players rightfully criticize changes today as well, but there really is no comparison. I'll take the current balancing efforts over 2016 any day, even while disagreeing with many of them.

I'm in the same boat. I'd rather put up with another few months of Tarnished Nightmare and Hardened Ward, then have to relearn the game every 3 months for a massive arbitrary pile of confusing and unnecessary twiddling. The 2016 dev strat would've had Warden's entire kit mangled as badly as whatever they just did to Arctic Blast.

The question would be: what about tarnished nightmare and hardened ward stay another 2 years like this?

xylena_lazarow · August 1

Iuppiterr wrote: »

The question would be: what about tarnished nightmare and hardened ward stay another 2 years like this?

Versus 2 years of meta whiplash every 3 months? No thanks, I'm still sticking with the devil I know.

Pelanora · August 1

We don't like meta whiplash....... but I think we also don't like wondering WHAT actually everyone in zos is DOING?? Because everything seems to have reduced to a trickle.