Why ESO players are not into it?

Sporigudinai · May 16

Looking at the SteamCharts numbers, we can see that ESO have almost the same number of players online as Albion Online, Path of Exile, Black Desert, Diablo IV, etc... But, if you look at the top most watched games on Twitch (https://www.twitchmetrics.net/games) this month or any other, we can see ESO way back at the bottom of it. So, i was wondering, why that happens?
Is the game boring to watch? Need more good streamers? No time for it?

Treeshka · May 16

I believe most people who plays this game are solo players and questing mostly or doing houses. So they are mostly not watching anything but immersing themselves in the world.

TaSheen · May 16

I have personally no use for watching anyone play a game I play myself. Not only that, I don't watch tv, movies, youtube, twitch etc. SO not my thing....

ssewallb14_ESO · May 16

Substantially underdeveloped competitive side of the game when compared to others in the genre.

To be frank ZoS realized what their game was good at and what it wasn't fairly early on and played to their strengths. A lack of streamer presence is just an externality of that.

sarahthes · May 16

ESO population skews a little older. I've noticed a distinct lack of twitch interest in older gamers.

Sporigudinai · May 16

ssewallb14_ESO wrote: »

Substantially underdeveloped competitive side of the game when compared to others in the genre.

To be frank ZoS realized what their game was good at and what it wasn't fairly early on and played to their strengths. A lack of streamer presence is just an externality of that.

Yes, can be one of the reasons. That´s why streamers who play PvP on ESO are the most watched.

Nestor · May 16

Why watch a game being played when I can play the game?

I have watched specific videos to learn Boss Mechanics or find a Skyshard. This is not something I would get from a Twitch Stream.

RPGs are played in people's heads, not on someone else's screen.

Soarora · May 16

Sometimes people watch trial/dungeon streams via joining the Discord channel that the run is taking place in. I do that sometimes but personally I only watch a twitch stream if I’m actually in the run the stream is streaming. That said, obviously I’m not actively watching it, but I’ll watch parts of the VOD for funsies.

SaffronCitrusflower · May 16

Sporigudinai wrote: »

Looking at the SteamCharts numbers, we can see that ESO have almost the same number of players online as Albion Online, Path of Exile, Black Desert, Diablo IV, etc... But, if you look at the top most watched games on Twitch (https://www.twitchmetrics.net/games) this month or any other, we can see ESO way back at the bottom of it. So, i was wondering, why that happens?
Is the game boring to watch? Need more good streamers? No time for it?

U35 is what happened. That was the last straw for most of the end game streamers. You can google "Nefas U35" and see a 45 minute or so video as to all the reasons U35 was the last straw.

In a nutshell, ESO adopted a major focus on recruiting new, casual players and left the dedicated veteran players in the ditch and drove off without them.

Tandor · May 16

Steam accounts for a very small number of ESO PC players. ESO appeals to traditional CRPG and MMORPG players who don't come from a Steam background in respect of those types of games. Sure, some of us have Steam accounts but that doesn't mean that players of ESO - which didn't launch initially on Steam - would automatically think of playing it through Steam. For myself, the only games I play through Steam tend to be those that are only available through Steam.

As for streaming, again only a very small number of traditional CRPG and MMORPG players are interested in streaming others playing their game. Personally again, I don't have or remotely want a Twitch account and I use You Tube for music, I have no interest in PvP gameplay or meta build guides which are pretty much the only basis on which to want to watch others playing and/or commenting on a game.

As others have said, ESO appeals to almost entirely the wrong playerbase for streamers, its appeal being very largely to non-competitive PVErs. That is not to denigrate PvPers or competitive PVErs, it's just pointing out the obvious fact that they are in a small minority where ESO players are concerned, as they are in many other CRPGs and MMORPGs where those games weren't designed to be PvP or competitive PVE-centric in the first place. ESO appeals primarily to established TES players, and all the TES titles were non-competitive solo CRPGs. That alone goes a long way to explaining the low take-up of ESO players in respect of both Steam and streaming.

There's nothing controversial in what I've said, PvPers are the first to say repeatedly that the reason they're not being paid more attention by ZOS is because the game has become predominantly populated - and therefore designed around - casual solo RPGers. Given that, why would most players want to play through Steam or participate in streaming?

RomanRex · May 16

ESO has never been a popular game on Twitch unless people are being lured with free drops.

PvP is largely dead and that is the content which seems to do best on platforms like that.

Danikat · May 16

I suspect there's several reasons, many of which have already been mentioned.

Most of ESO is not that interesting to watch. People who like questing and PvE exploration are more likely to want to play it than watch it, and people who don't like it won't want to do either.
Areas of the game which could be interesting to watch, like trial speed-clears and Battlegrounds tend to attract a niche audience.
Even PvP can be relatively 'slow' compared to some games.
ESO's audience is older than many games and older games are less likely to watch streamers.

I don't think that's a bad thing however. The game and us as players benefit from people playing the game, not watching someone else play it. The only people who benefit from people watching Twitch streams are Twitch and maybe the streamer. So I think it's actually a good sign that ZOS focuses on attracting people to play the game rather than trying to attract them to go to a 3rd party site and watch someone else play it.

Araneae6537 · May 16

What games are supposedly more interesting to watch on Stream? When I do watch a Stream or video, it is for informational purposes, a first look at something, or for the Streamer and their commentary.

fizzylu · May 16

I will say, if I watch a stream it's usually of a game I do not play. If I actually enjoy a game, I want to play it myself.... but there are some I find interesting/entertaining just to watch. That being said....

Even if PvP wasn't "dead", ESO combat/gameplay is the least interesting out of all of these games. Nobody wants to watch entire ball groups of people, lagging beyond belief visually and audibly, spamming AOEs and smart heals at each other.
Then what about 1vX? Sorry, but I can't imagine there's many people so bored that they would choose to watch a handful of people chase around one person LoSing, dodge rolling around at high speeds avoiding tons of things that should kill them, and healing to full health in basically one click, all just for funsies and no real goal/objective.
And gankers? I feel like watching someone do more damage than you can visually see/track thanks to proc sets and a full class that can just fully go in out of visibility at will that is basically designed to gank so efficiently that it doesn't even feel impressive when someone does it.... well, that has to be just as not fun as when it happens to you.

So let's look at these other games (except Path of Exile, I don't know much about that one).
Albion Online: zerg/1vX/solo PvP with no smart heals, no annoying LoSing/dodging, players can't do more damage than a players health bar in less than 2 seconds, and also has high risk/high reward gameplay (full loot drops).
Black Desert Online: has one of the best, if not the best, action style combat systems across MMOs.
Diablo IV: a beloved franchise just like TES without the spammy, fast, "no one will die" PvP combat and actually challenging PvE content.

Call me crazy, but I feel like it's very obvious why ESO does not have a big streaming audience. Even as someone who does enjoy the game, in some ways.

LanteanPegasus · May 16

I'll just quote my comment to the same question in a thread from October '23, because it's still valid, I think:

I'm in my mid fourties, came to ESO from the other Elder Scrolls titles (Morrowind and Oblivion, mostly, Skyrim as well).

I have a fulltime job, and that doesn't leave unlimited spare time for hobbies. So if I want to do something ESO, I play it, I don't watch other people playing it.
But even if I had the time on my hands, I can't imagine sitting around watch other people play video games. I just don't see the appeal. I guess the reason is that what interests me in games is experiencing the world, the story, and my character, and doing that myself is a lot more fun and interesting than having someone else do it. Competitive or high-end-skill gaming doesn't interest me, so no reason to watch PvP or Trials or stuff like that.

The one and only exception in my case is one streamer I stumbled upon while having Twitch running for drops (usually muted in the background). He is mostly doing housing showcases (showing off the amazing creativity and artistic talent of people), and creates a wonderfully relaxed, friendly, positive atmosphere regarding his content and his viewers. Plus he has a great voice, diverse interests that lead to some interesting "off-topic" tangents, and is actually funny without constantly trying to be hilarious for entertainments sake. So if I happen to have an hour or two, usually on weekends, I actually watch his streams.

So, I don't know about competing MMOs (don't play them), but I could imagine that ESO is a game that attracts quite a few players like myself, who play the game for content that is best experienced directly, not via the performance of others, have certain limits on their free time, that make them picky about what to do with it, and prefer a certain maturity (for lack of a better word, it still is about fun and games, but on another level) in content and presentation that not every streamer can provide. And such players aren't the best clientele for streams. Nothing to do with ESO itself.

AzuraFan · May 16

The only time I watch someone else playing a game is when I'm stuck and I've searched for a solution on YouTube, or it's a reveal video (or stream). Otherwise I have no interest watching someone else play games.

furiouslog · May 16

sarahthes wrote: »

ESO population skews a little older. I've noticed a distinct lack of twitch interest in older gamers.

I think there is something to this, as I am an "old", and I really don't like watching many twitch streamers at all. I only watch for the drops, pretty much ever. However, I am a fan of the Game Grumps, which I watch with my teenage son, so who knows what is up there.

I'd watch ESO PVP, but when I get on and watch it, then I want to go do it, and I don't want to get banned for TOS violations due to watching PVP when I PVP, so I stop watching, which then leads to never watching.

Stamicka · May 16

I think it's the fact that so many veterans, combat oriented players, and PvPers have quit. Usually the channels I see with the most views are related to veteran trials, PvP, and other difficult/ combat focused content. I noticed that a lot of the PvPers that still stream seem really burnt out. They kind of idle around and don't do anything but talk to their chat. I don't blame them with the current state of things. It's just a very casual game these days.

Alinhbo_Tyaka · May 16

I don't follow streamers on any game I play as I am busy playing the game. There was one exception when I was in the guild of a streamer. I followed there because a lot of the guild interaction took place on stream rather than the in-game chat. I found it somewhat awkward with only having one monitor and preferring to play games full screen. I either had to ctl/tab a lot or run a smaller game window to be able to keep up with the stream.

ArchangelIsraphel · May 16

In order to even consider watching a twitch stream, I require a bribe in the form of a drop- crates, exp scrolls, emotes, mounts, or other rewards. Even then, I run twitch on my phone, playing in a quiet corner, with the volume as low as possible. Preferably in another room I am not currently occupying.

That's honestly how annoying I find twitch and all of the noise and randomness going on during the course of it. I'm not trying to bash the streamers or the platform- I genuinely find it and most modern social platforms which involve constant, incessant distractions incredibly grating. They aren't even a good representation of the game they're trying to promote due to all of the...things happening on the screen which often cover or drown out the actual game play.

People tend to attribute this point of view to older audiences, but I'm not even that old. I just don't enjoy this kind of "entertainment". Watching other people play a game I would rather be playing is not fun for me.

The only exceptions to this rule are:
1. Official ZOS or Bethesda (or other gaming companies) hosting streams which have sneak peaks or host an event. I watch the preview streams with genuine enjoyment.

2. Matygon and IcyIC are highly enjoyable streamers to watch. I like their personalities and the way they engage their audience. They have fairly quiet streams with a minimum of distraction from the actual game. Maty is a fun guy and I love his musical skills- also the cooking he does is enjoyable. Icy does some amazing things with houses and often does previews of furnishings and new homes.

Even so, I don't tune into their channels while I am playing, since I prefer to immerse myself in what I am doing in the moment rather than distracting myself with multiple things at once. I only watch them when I'm not playing, but feel like engaging with ESO related content. I don't really tune in unless there is a new patch/new things they're showing off. (Which means I'm maybe watching...once or twice every 3-4 months lol)

Vonnegut2506 · May 16

Watching someone else play a video game would be like watching someone else watch a movie. I'll just cut out the middle man and play the game or watch the movie myself, thanks.

Dax_Draconis · May 16

I've never really understood why people would want to spend their time watching others play a videogame. I mean, obviously many people like to, and that's ok. I just find it to be an incredibly boring waste of my time.

I only watch the official ESO streams for new chapters and updates.

DigiAngel · May 16

Zero interest in watching, more interested in playing.

Necrotech_Master · May 16

as others noted, steam is only a fraction of the playerbase (i have 2 accounts and neither one is through steam but through zos directly)

i also could care less about whats popular on twitch, never had a twitch acct and never really enjoyed watching people on twitch (i even tried a couple of times and it was just awful boring)

Hapexamendios · May 16

I don't watch Twitch or any other streaming platform. I want to play the game myself not watch someone else. It's boring to me.

Arrodisia · May 16

omg... I can't imagine watching a lone wolf ganker only video and not getting bored it's like 3-5 seconds of action and sitting around forever until they find someone to gank. There isn't enough caffeine in the world to keep me awake for that. I'd fall asleep in my chair before anything happens. gn all have fun in game

SalamanNZ · May 16

If they set up a pvp arena type league and fixed the pvp lag it would rapidly move up the Twitch list. Noone wants to watch someone finding furniture plans and where to place the painting in their house or farming ore and cloth.

Araneae6537 · May 16

SalamanNZ wrote: »

If they set up a pvp arena type league and fixed the pvp lag it would rapidly move up the Twitch list. Noone wants to watch someone finding furniture plans and where to place the painting in their house or farming ore and cloth.

Actually, housing is one of the things I do watch for as it’s incredible to see what others have been able to create in this game.

But of course that’s watching a tour and discussion of the finished creation, not deliberating on where to hang a painting (although I could imagine watching someone build could be informative as to their process, come to think of it).

Personally, I don’t see why PvP would be most interesting to watch. PvE can be informative because the mechanics of particular enemies/challenges will be the same. Idk, in wither case, I’d much rather play than watch, unless something specific is being demonstrated.

SilverBride · May 16

I don't see what anyone gets out of watching someone else play.

I remember looking up a boss fight once and found a video supposedly showing how to defeat them, but all I saw was a player running around and different effects going off. It was impossible to figure out what there were doing. How is that helpful or entertaining?

tsaescishoeshiner · May 16

Here are my thoughts. MMOs don't make for good streams. The camera angle, pace, and style of combat just isn't that rewarding to follow. ESO's is too fast. Watching an ESO duel tournament or trial run wouldn't be good TV compared to esports.

On top of that, people spend time "earning" or grinding content rather than actually playing. That's why PvP streams are relatively popular—they're actually playing and performing at a pretty high level.

A lot of popular ESO streamers do community events, or people watch for their personality and energy in a familiar game setting. A lot of people also put streams on in the background rather than actually focusing on them, so even the viewers don't find it worth their whole attention.

Partly an MMO thing. Even WoW stream numbers pale in comparison to how many people actually play it.

CrashTest · May 16

Because ESO is mostly casual.