House item limit is way to low.

LucyferLightbringer

It is insane how little we can put in our houses, even the biggest ones with ESO+. Even in Star WARS Galaxies, a game from 2003 we could have placed up to 1200 items in houses. The ESO limits in current times are a joke. I suggest at least doubling them.

Dragonnord

ZOS explained in the past, on several occasions, here in the forums and also on live streams and interviews, that the space limit can't be increased because it would lead to serious performance issues inside the houses.
 
It'd be kind of long to explain here, but you may want to do a search and find out exact explanation and details from ZOS.

Also, there are several other threads in this forum regarding the same matter.
 
 

furiouslog

LucyferLightbringer wrote: »

It is insane how little we can put in our houses, even the biggest ones with ESO+. Even in Star WARS Galaxies, a game from 2003 we could have placed up to 1200 items in houses. The ESO limits in current times are a joke. I suggest at least doubling them.

Apples and oranges, no? I mean, the poly count in 2003 was not awesome.

Tallon_IV

I feel like with the vast improvements to the game client's performance since housing was added to the game there's room to increase the limit, even if just a bit. Perhaps they'll address it alongside whatever housing feature is coming this year.

virtus753

ZoeliTintanie wrote: »

[Snip]

They quoted the minimum client hardware requirements as the reason for not increasing the limit.

As long as they do not raise the current minimum hardware requirements, they do not feel they can increase the limit on furnishings because those minimum hardware specs will not be able to keep up.

[Edited quote]

NoticeMeArkay

What I don't understand from a technical perspective: We cannot increase the item limit for houses we got but we can release new houses and therefore new cells with up to 700 possible items to place every year without worrying about performance. Does anybody know how these two cases differ in terms of performance?

virtus753

NoticeMeArkay wrote: »

What I don't understand from a technical perspective: We cannot increase the item limit for houses we got but we can release new houses and therefore new cells with up to 700 possible items to place every year without worrying about performance. Does anybody know how these two cases differ in terms of performance?

Clients are not loading multiple houses at once.

Malyore

ZoeliTintanie wrote: »

[Snip]

I'm not sure how much of what I'd heard is accurate, but I have heard the following: That even when the game was made in 2014, it was built upon an outdated engine. When a lot of the old developers had flushed out of the company in place for the newer teams, the new teams have been struggling to make whatever changes they can. For awhile there wasn't even room for more animations on the PlayStation? And a lot of the very slow and gradual changes being made by basically breaking the bones of the game and resetting them in different shapes is whats resulted in more content and features. Lately there has been a LOT of focus on the servers as well, both on the mechanical side and also just how much strain ESO puts on it.

So, it sounds like they're basically trying to rebuild the game, while not changing how the game plays (although I'd be all for a modern-made ESO lol), while also keeping it alive and functional during their work.

[Edited quote]

Desiato

It's less about poly count and more about limitations in the architecture of the engine and the memory limitations of consoles.

ghastley

I look at the other way round. The houses are too large for the slot limit. Give us smaller homes where the item count will fill them.

Dagoth_Rac

This conspiracy theory that ZOS could increase the furnishing limit but are not for some secret nefarious reason is laughable. Housing is a huge revenue generator for ZOS. More furnishing in houses would lead to more purchases of housing items. ZOS is not going to hurt their profit margins out of spite. No explanation makes sense other than exactly what they have told us: the confluence of asset quality, older hardware that the game client is expected to still run on, and server side code that goes back 17 years, does not allow for more furnishings.

You don't have to like it. You can feel that ZOS needs to drop support for older consoles and PCs. Or ZOS should have been more forward looking during initial development. But they are not keeping the limit in place for the lulz.

SilverBride

I've only used all 700 slots in the Grand Psijic Villa, and I'm close in the Antiquarians house. My 30 slot apartments also use all those slots.

The rest of my houses have a lot of unused slots but look complete to me.

I don't feel that I have to place something in every single empty space because empty space can be part of the decor.

Necrotech_Master

houses feel limited to me, but i also came from city of heroes, and i had a supergroup base with between 8,000 and 12,000 items in it lol

that game didnt start to become unstable with the bases until there were ~24,000+ items in the base

Amottica

ZoeliTintanie wrote: »

[Snip]

It’s typical, very much common, that MMORPGs limit how many decos can go into a home instance. For starters, it’s a fact of a database that such definitions are required. Not sure where this embarrassment that there is a limit when it is nor only common but a requirement.

Even the bottomless crafting bag has a limit. It’s not truly bottomless and Zenimax has even said so.

[Edited quote]

Malyore

Honestly, based on how eso even plays mechanically, I'm surprised the game can do as much as it can. Just even watching how NPCs move or how abilities work in this game, I can truly believe that ESO itself has some pretty hard limitations. Not necessarily to the fault of the console. The arcanist beam is something I'd always wanted for the game but did not think it was possible, if that says anything about my view on the game. Although I don't know how much of the clunkiness to the game is a result of not being able to change it, vs choosing to keep it the same as to not throw people off.

And as for housing specifically, yeah combat gameplay is different than environmental loads. Even though I can think the sunlight and water in ESO looks beautiful, you also can just take a look at how the grass works in this game. Or how foggy a hill looks in the distance. Or how there's secret conjuration gnomes that summon paintings and decorations once you walk 5 meters into a building.

While I'd love to have more slots for everyone, I wonder if a compromise can be made in the interim where maybe houses that are smaller can get the same current 700 cap.

LunaFlora

ZoeliTintanie wrote: »

[Snip]

Housing got added in 2017 so no it has not been 10+ years.
more like 4 years later we're still asking for something as the furnishing limit post was posted in 2020.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/512076/february-2020-furnishing-limit-status-update/p1

zos develops this game so if they can change the limits without issues they likely will.
until then we can ask for it as much as we like, but they already know we want it so it doesn't do anything.

[Edited quote]

ZOS_Volpe

Hi there,

We have removed some unnecessary back and forth that was disruptive. Please ensure you are treating others with respect on the forums even when they have views that differ from your own. If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them here.

Thank you for your understanding.

furiouslog

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

houses feel limited to me, but i also came from city of heroes, and i had a supergroup base with between 8,000 and 12,000 items in it lol

that game didnt start to become unstable with the bases until there were ~24,000+ items in the base

City of Heroes had a low poly count for its assets. When it came out, character assets from comparable games had about 1000 polys, and entire levels had fewer than 10K.

ESO is specced to work on a GTX 960. Games designed to run on that card at 1080p/30fps originally had character models of about 4000. Today, cartoony hero games are about 15K-20K per character, with current AAA games hitting over 100K per toon. Yes, there are more polys to account for, like the environment, but it gives you a sense of the order of magnitude we're talking about.

ESO's character models have considerably more polys than games like City of Heroes (I ripped my main toon for a 3D print, and it had 43K polys in it, with my toon outfitted as it currently is. Different armor, hair, cosmetics, and race all have a factor in driving this). Given that this obviously extends to housing assets, things like additional polys and textures have an effect on one's computer to properly render a house. City of Heroes and Star Wars Galaxies had a lot of simple, blocky assets. ESO, less so, but it still needs to run on that GTX 960. The max design spec for the GTX 960 is 16.7 polys (tris) at 1080p to maintain 60fps. Of course, that does not match reality, as there are a ton of variables to also consider that reduce that count. It's basically rendering a wireframe at that point. Once you add textures, animations, etc, it goes way down. One GTX 960 gamer reported that he experienced severe drop rates below 30fps once the poly count hit 9M.

Also consider the age of ESO's engine, which was already old when it came out. It can't possibly be as efficient and optimized as the engines of today, despite ZOS's best efforts to maintain and upgrade the engine to keep pace. ZOS is trying to thread the needle when it comes to creating assets that are beautiful on a current gaming PC, while also being accessible to older computers. That's a business strategy which appears to have served them well to date, since they are having a 10 year anniversary celebration and flying all over Europe and the US to show off a bit.

Looking around reddit a bit, the average unique game asset (like a furnishing) can have between 10 and 10K polygons. I could not find any information on what an entire instance comparable to a notable home would carry, but we can safely assume that it's more than 10 polys - let's call it 500K. If we max out our notable home with high poly and animated furnishings, we're looking at over 7M polys, even without counting the house, and if the houseguests are included, you're looking at another 300K+ polys for those, plus animation, pathing, etc etc etc. That comes pretty close to the danger zone for our potato PC, but that was on a game engine that was out at the time of the GTX 960, much like the ESO engine, which has been tweaked over time to accommodate the high end but still limited at the low end.

So, it seems pretty obvious to me that there is no ridiculous conspiracy about the item placement issue. ZOS is being inclusive to people who can't afford to upgrade their computers every 3 years, while also allowing people who started the game to still play on the computer that they started it on, if they choose. Many gamers are like this - just look at CS:GO, which is one of the top games in the world, and has the lowest technical requirements. Not everyone in this community is a big PC builder type. My guild buddy still runs ESO in 720p on an 8 year old PC, and she pretty much plays only for housing. Everything she does is housing. She appreciates the limitations and views it as a creative challenge rather than complaining to ZOS about everything, and that is because she has empathy for people like her, and for the technical limitations placed on the designers.

[Snip]

[Edited for baiting]

Necrotech_Master

furiouslog wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

houses feel limited to me, but i also came from city of heroes, and i had a supergroup base with between 8,000 and 12,000 items in it lol

that game didnt start to become unstable with the bases until there were ~24,000+ items in the base

City of Heroes had a low poly count for its assets. When it came out, character assets from comparable games had about 1000 polys, and entire levels had fewer than 10K.

ESO is specced to work on a GTX 960. Games designed to run on that card at 1080p/30fps originally had character models of about 4000. Today, cartoony hero games are about 15K-20K per character, with current AAA games hitting over 100K per toon. Yes, there are more polys to account for, like the environment, but it gives you a sense of the order of magnitude we're talking about.

ESO's character models have considerably more polys than games like City of Heroes (I ripped my main toon for a 3D print, and it had 43K polys in it, with my toon outfitted as it currently is. Different armor, hair, cosmetics, and race all have a factor in driving this). Given that this obviously extends to housing assets, things like additional polys and textures have an effect on one's computer to properly render a house. City of Heroes and Star Wars Galaxies had a lot of simple, blocky assets. ESO, less so, but it still needs to run on that GTX 960. The max design spec for the GTX 960 is 16.7 polys (tris) at 1080p to maintain 60fps. Of course, that does not match reality, as there are a ton of variables to also consider that reduce that count. It's basically rendering a wireframe at that point. Once you add textures, animations, etc, it goes way down. One GTX 960 gamer reported that he experienced severe drop rates below 30fps once the poly count hit 9M.

Also consider the age of ESO's engine, which was already old when it came out. It can't possibly be as efficient and optimized as the engines of today, despite ZOS's best efforts to maintain and upgrade the engine to keep pace. ZOS is trying to thread the needle when it comes to creating assets that are beautiful on a current gaming PC, while also being accessible to older computers. That's a business strategy which appears to have served them well to date, since they are having a 10 year anniversary celebration and flying all over Europe and the US to show off a bit.

Looking around reddit a bit, the average unique game asset (like a furnishing) can have between 10 and 10K polygons. I could not find any information on what an entire instance comparable to a notable home would carry, but we can safely assume that it's more than 10 polys - let's call it 500K. If we max out our notable home with high poly and animated furnishings, we're looking at over 7M polys, even without counting the house, and if the houseguests are included, you're looking at another 300K+ polys for those, plus animation, pathing, etc etc etc. That comes pretty close to the danger zone for our potato PC, but that was on a game engine that was out at the time of the GTX 960, much like the ESO engine, which has been tweaked over time to accommodate the high end but still limited at the low end.

So, it seems pretty obvious to me that there is no ridiculous conspiracy about the item placement issue. ZOS is being inclusive to people who can't afford to upgrade their computers every 3 years, while also allowing people who started the game to still play on the computer that they started it on, if they choose. Many gamers are like this - just look at CS:GO, which is one of the top games in the world, and has the lowest technical requirements. Not everyone in this community is a big PC builder type. My guild buddy still runs ESO in 720p on an 8 year old PC, and she pretty much plays only for housing. Everything she does is housing. She appreciates the limitations and views it as a creative challenge rather than complaining to ZOS about everything, and that is because she has empathy for people like her, and for the technical limitations placed on the designers.

[Snip]

yeah im very aware of that, city of heroes was released in 2004, and eso was released 2014 so that was at least a 10 year difference there

the problem with ESO is that the count of furnishings does not account for size of furnishing

1 very small candle on a table effectively takes up the same amount of space as the incredibly giant windmill in terms of furnishing slots

so 700 slots means nothing if your trying to do a more detailed room such as a bakery, there could be 50 slots "wasted" on literally decorative food items which are very small, and is especially noticeable in some of the larger houses we have

coming up in the next update they have furnishings like a cheese rack, which is a full set of shelves with like 25-30 pieces of cheese on it, but it counts as 1 furnishing item

thats not even counting some of the extremely limited slots for collectible furnishings, i literally have years worth of eso+ freebies, but you can only put 110 collectible furnishings in a house, even though a lot of them are not any different from standard housing items (paintings, statuettes, etc)

the limitation on more interactive stuff (houseguests, mounts, pets) is more understandable, but i feel 10 is still an incredibly small limit, especially when assistants take up at least 4 of those slots if you have 1 of each type

[Edited quote]

furiouslog

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

yeah im very aware of that, city of heroes was released in 2004, and eso was released 2014 so that was at least a 10 year difference there

the problem with ESO is that the count of furnishings does not account for size of furnishing

1 very small candle on a table effectively takes up the same amount of space as the incredibly giant windmill in terms of furnishing slots

so 700 slots means nothing if your trying to do a more detailed room such as a bakery, there could be 50 slots "wasted" on literally decorative food items which are very small, and is especially noticeable in some of the larger houses we have

coming up in the next update they have furnishings like a cheese rack, which is a full set of shelves with like 25-30 pieces of cheese on it, but it counts as 1 furnishing item

thats not even counting some of the extremely limited slots for collectible furnishings, i literally have years worth of eso+ freebies, but you can only put 110 collectible furnishings in a house, even though a lot of them are not any different from standard housing items (paintings, statuettes, etc)

the limitation on more interactive stuff (houseguests, mounts, pets) is more understandable, but i feel 10 is still an incredibly small limit, especially when assistants take up at least 4 of those slots if you have 1 of each type

[Snip]

I have like 15 necrom platforms in my house. Those are probably much easier to render than the little moon sugar bong thing that I have next to my floating bed. So a small thing can be complex, and a big thing can be simple. Does that make sense?

[Edited for bait]

Araneae6537

What I would like to see is a bit more flexibility in the various limits, if that could be possible to implement, such as a tradeoff between max houseguests and max visitors (assuming these produce similar loads between polys, pathing, running around, etc. — that way a house built for a guild hall, competition, etc. could allow more players while players who prefer to create a scene/story/contained environment and want few visitors at a time, if any, could place more houseguests (and emotes for them? please, with moonsugar sprinkled on top? 🥹 )

Similarly, might it be possible to have max polys in a way, so that the current limit could be exceeded if mostly using low poly furnishings? This could be SUPER helpful for my library and maybe for those players who like to include a lot of “clutter” in their builds as well.

Just some thoughts based on what I’ve read of the reasons but zero knowledge myself of the limitations, only what I see as the pain points as a player.

Necrotech_Master

furiouslog wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

yeah im very aware of that, city of heroes was released in 2004, and eso was released 2014 so that was at least a 10 year difference there

the problem with ESO is that the count of furnishings does not account for size of furnishing

1 very small candle on a table effectively takes up the same amount of space as the incredibly giant windmill in terms of furnishing slots

so 700 slots means nothing if your trying to do a more detailed room such as a bakery, there could be 50 slots "wasted" on literally decorative food items which are very small, and is especially noticeable in some of the larger houses we have

coming up in the next update they have furnishings like a cheese rack, which is a full set of shelves with like 25-30 pieces of cheese on it, but it counts as 1 furnishing item

thats not even counting some of the extremely limited slots for collectible furnishings, i literally have years worth of eso+ freebies, but you can only put 110 collectible furnishings in a house, even though a lot of them are not any different from standard housing items (paintings, statuettes, etc)

the limitation on more interactive stuff (houseguests, mounts, pets) is more understandable, but i feel 10 is still an incredibly small limit, especially when assistants take up at least 4 of those slots if you have 1 of each type

[Snip]

I have like 15 necrom platforms in my house. Those are probably much easier to render than the little moon sugar bong thing that I have next to my floating bed. So a small thing can be complex, and a big thing can be simple. Does that make sense?

that might apply in some cases, but not all

sure the skooma bubbler might have more processing its animated an all that, but there are also small housing items which are non-animated that again are small and simple that still take up the same amount of "space" as the giant animated windmill

my main point is that the size of the houses is too large for the amount of furnishing slots to adequately furnish with any level of detail, or without blocking off half of the house that you had no more slots to decorate

if they dont want to give more slots than we have now, they need to make the houses smaller to accommodate that limit

[Edited quote]

furiouslog

Araneae6537 wrote: »

What I would like to see is a bit more flexibility in the various limits, if that could be possible to implement, such as a tradeoff between max houseguests and max visitors (assuming these produce similar loads between polys, pathing, running around, etc. — that way a house built for a guild hall, competition, etc. could allow more players while players who prefer to create a scene/story/contained environment and want few visitors at a time, if any, could place more houseguests (and emotes for them? please, with moonsugar sprinkled on top? 🥹 )

Similarly, might it be possible to have max polys in a way, so that the current limit could be exceeded if mostly using low poly furnishings? This could be SUPER helpful for my library and maybe for those players who like to include a lot of “clutter” in their builds as well.

Just some thoughts based on what I’ve read of the reasons but zero knowledge myself of the limitations, only what I see as the pain points as a player.

[Snip]

I don't know the answer to that question at all, but if I were to guess it's that setting the limits as a hard line ensures a simpler player experience - if we had tradeoff stuff that had to be configured by each player, I'm not sure how the community would react, but it would likely provide another barrier to understanding for newbie housing enjoyers, create more work for ZOS, require more things to go through QA with patches, and there would be more things to fix if something goes wrong.

If you envision a system where each furnishing is individually scored by is complexity and then a setup where the ceiling was on the total complexity count, it seems like that would work, but would only require work to categorize those assets - so like a points system for furnishings where the points are being counted instead of the number of assets?

[Edited for bait]

Araneae6537

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

furiouslog wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

yeah im very aware of that, city of heroes was released in 2004, and eso was released 2014 so that was at least a 10 year difference there

the problem with ESO is that the count of furnishings does not account for size of furnishing

1 very small candle on a table effectively takes up the same amount of space as the incredibly giant windmill in terms of furnishing slots

so 700 slots means nothing if your trying to do a more detailed room such as a bakery, there could be 50 slots "wasted" on literally decorative food items which are very small, and is especially noticeable in some of the larger houses we have

coming up in the next update they have furnishings like a cheese rack, which is a full set of shelves with like 25-30 pieces of cheese on it, but it counts as 1 furnishing item

thats not even counting some of the extremely limited slots for collectible furnishings, i literally have years worth of eso+ freebies, but you can only put 110 collectible furnishings in a house, even though a lot of them are not any different from standard housing items (paintings, statuettes, etc)

the limitation on more interactive stuff (houseguests, mounts, pets) is more understandable, but i feel 10 is still an incredibly small limit, especially when assistants take up at least 4 of those slots if you have 1 of each type

[Snip]

I have like 15 necrom platforms in my house. Those are probably much easier to render than the little moon sugar bong thing that I have next to my floating bed. So a small thing can be complex, and a big thing can be simple. Does that make sense?

that might apply in some cases, but not all

sure the skooma bubbler might have more processing its animated an all that, but there are also small housing items which are non-animated that again are small and simple that still take up the same amount of "space" as the giant animated windmill

my main point is that the size of the houses is too large for the amount of furnishing slots to adequately furnish with any level of detail, or without blocking off half of the house that you had no more slots to decorate

if they dont want to give more slots than we have now, they need to make the houses smaller to accommodate that limit

More small houses, sure, but not only. I like having options while the smaller houses are a more defined space. Plus, I don’t have to place furnishings everywhere to enjoy a property. For instance, I enjoy hiking around my Varlaisvea Ayleid Ruins with only a couple hundred larger furnishings added.

[Edited quote]

TaSheen

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

furiouslog wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

yeah im very aware of that, city of heroes was released in 2004, and eso was released 2014 so that was at least a 10 year difference there

the problem with ESO is that the count of furnishings does not account for size of furnishing

1 very small candle on a table effectively takes up the same amount of space as the incredibly giant windmill in terms of furnishing slots

so 700 slots means nothing if your trying to do a more detailed room such as a bakery, there could be 50 slots "wasted" on literally decorative food items which are very small, and is especially noticeable in some of the larger houses we have

coming up in the next update they have furnishings like a cheese rack, which is a full set of shelves with like 25-30 pieces of cheese on it, but it counts as 1 furnishing item

thats not even counting some of the extremely limited slots for collectible furnishings, i literally have years worth of eso+ freebies, but you can only put 110 collectible furnishings in a house, even though a lot of them are not any different from standard housing items (paintings, statuettes, etc)

the limitation on more interactive stuff (houseguests, mounts, pets) is more understandable, but i feel 10 is still an incredibly small limit, especially when assistants take up at least 4 of those slots if you have 1 of each type

[Snip]

I have like 15 necrom platforms in my house. Those are probably much easier to render than the little moon sugar bong thing that I have next to my floating bed. So a small thing can be complex, and a big thing can be simple. Does that make sense?

that might apply in some cases, but not all

sure the skooma bubbler might have more processing its animated an all that, but there are also small housing items which are non-animated that again are small and simple that still take up the same amount of "space" as the giant animated windmill

my main point is that the size of the houses is too large for the amount of furnishing slots to adequately furnish with any level of detail, or without blocking off half of the house that you had no more slots to decorate

if they dont want to give more slots than we have now, they need to make the houses smaller to accommodate that limit

More small houses, sure, but not only. I like having options while the smaller houses are a more defined space. Plus, I don’t have to place furnishings everywhere to enjoy a property. For instance, I enjoy hiking around my Varlaisvea Ayleid Ruins with only a couple hundred larger furnishings added.

I'm just not interested in anything smaller than notables. The small/medium ones are too hard to furnish without seeming cramped.

[Edited quote]

Araneae6537

furiouslog wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

What I would like to see is a bit more flexibility in the various limits, if that could be possible to implement, such as a tradeoff between max houseguests and max visitors (assuming these produce similar loads between polys, pathing, running around, etc. — that way a house built for a guild hall, competition, etc. could allow more players while players who prefer to create a scene/story/contained environment and want few visitors at a time, if any, could place more houseguests (and emotes for them? please, with moonsugar sprinkled on top? 🥹 )

Similarly, might it be possible to have max polys in a way, so that the current limit could be exceeded if mostly using low poly furnishings? This could be SUPER helpful for my library and maybe for those players who like to include a lot of “clutter” in their builds as well.

Just some thoughts based on what I’ve read of the reasons but zero knowledge myself of the limitations, only what I see as the pain points as a player.

I don't know the answer to that question at all, but if I were to guess it's that setting the limits as a hard line ensures a simpler player experience - if we had tradeoff stuff that had to be configured by each player, I'm not sure how the community would react, but it would likely provide another barrier to understanding for newbie housing enjoyers, create more work for ZOS, require more things to go through QA with patches, and there would be more things to fix if something goes wrong.

If you envision a system where each furnishing is individually scored by is complexity and then a setup where the ceiling was on the total complexity count, it seems like that would work, but would only require work to categorize those assets - so like a points system for furnishings where the points are being counted instead of the number of assets?

I was imagining houses coming with preset default limits as currently for visitors and houseguests, for instance, but with options to change the ratio. My thinking is that way it wouldn’t be additional up front complexity and barrier to entry, but could be changed by players who wish to do so.

That’s a good point about complexity — it would be more complicated and perhaps a lot of work to implement. I certainly would not want anyone to lose current builds that they have or the ability to make them with any system of categorization, and certainly not additional sub groups with limits. I just would like to see options where it could be changed or expanded with some trade-off, perhaps some very simple furnishings counting as 1/2 a furnishing, except that terminology doesn’t make sense… 🤔

Nerouyn

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Plus, I don’t have to place furnishings everywhere to enjoy a property. For instance, I enjoy hiking around my Varlaisvea Ayleid Ruins with only a couple hundred larger furnishings added.

Agreed.

Many large spaces in homes are awesome on their own.

I didn't buy it but I've seen people complain about the Jode's Embrace planar section as an enormous burdensome space which further eats into the too small furnishing limit.

I've walked around in it in preview and I'd add almost or possibly absolutely nothing. I'd treat it as a generous meditation / ritual and or meeting space.

Grand Psijic Villa is another common source of complaints.

Its huge outside area only needs a dozen or two large and small trees, and some lights, to look magnificent.

Hall of the Lunar Champion - the views in all 3 of the non-entry spaces are so magnificent that additions risk detracting from them. I'm not a fan of the skanky wood in the house on the hill section and have replaced them with solid stone fences. Looks much better. But the loss of views is regrettable. In the Halls of the Colossus section, I've put down a fountain and Azura statue and that's all it needs. I'm still mid furnish but I expect to finish this house and not even come to close to the furnishing limit.

Necrotech_Master

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

furiouslog wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

yeah im very aware of that, city of heroes was released in 2004, and eso was released 2014 so that was at least a 10 year difference there

the problem with ESO is that the count of furnishings does not account for size of furnishing

1 very small candle on a table effectively takes up the same amount of space as the incredibly giant windmill in terms of furnishing slots

so 700 slots means nothing if your trying to do a more detailed room such as a bakery, there could be 50 slots "wasted" on literally decorative food items which are very small, and is especially noticeable in some of the larger houses we have

coming up in the next update they have furnishings like a cheese rack, which is a full set of shelves with like 25-30 pieces of cheese on it, but it counts as 1 furnishing item

thats not even counting some of the extremely limited slots for collectible furnishings, i literally have years worth of eso+ freebies, but you can only put 110 collectible furnishings in a house, even though a lot of them are not any different from standard housing items (paintings, statuettes, etc)

the limitation on more interactive stuff (houseguests, mounts, pets) is more understandable, but i feel 10 is still an incredibly small limit, especially when assistants take up at least 4 of those slots if you have 1 of each type

[Snip]

I have like 15 necrom platforms in my house. Those are probably much easier to render than the little moon sugar bong thing that I have next to my floating bed. So a small thing can be complex, and a big thing can be simple. Does that make sense?

that might apply in some cases, but not all

sure the skooma bubbler might have more processing its animated an all that, but there are also small housing items which are non-animated that again are small and simple that still take up the same amount of "space" as the giant animated windmill

my main point is that the size of the houses is too large for the amount of furnishing slots to adequately furnish with any level of detail, or without blocking off half of the house that you had no more slots to decorate

if they dont want to give more slots than we have now, they need to make the houses smaller to accommodate that limit

More small houses, sure, but not only. I like having options while the smaller houses are a more defined space. Plus, I don’t have to place furnishings everywhere to enjoy a property. For instance, I enjoy hiking around my Varlaisvea Ayleid Ruins with only a couple hundred larger furnishings added.

[Edited quote]

i would agree with that, a lot of it is personal preference

the thing that annoys me the most with the housing limits is collectible furnishings, the limit on those is so low i cant even display all of my undaunted trophies + busts in a single house to actually set up a kind of grand trophy room

Alinhbo_Tyaka

Rather than a hard set item limit I would prefer to see something similar to the Fallout 76 housing system where you have a budget. The more complicated and large pieces will take up more budget than the small incidentals that make a dwelling complete for me.

I tend to work with small and medium houses. Where I run into problems with ESO is all of the smaller items I use to make the dwelling look like it is actively lived in or used. A drink or plate of food on an end table, a buffet spread or a desk complete with writing tools and papers. In my emporium it is small items on the shelves, breads and sweets in the bakery and a fully equipped tailor's shop. The small things add up quickly in an item based housing limit but don't use much space in a budget system. As I never expect to see a budget based system in ESO I'll settle for adding more slots to allow me to flesh out the various items needed for a lived in look.

freespirit

TaSheen wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

furiouslog wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

yeah im very aware of that, city of heroes was released in 2004, and eso was released 2014 so that was at least a 10 year difference there

the problem with ESO is that the count of furnishings does not account for size of furnishing

1 very small candle on a table effectively takes up the same amount of space as the incredibly giant windmill in terms of furnishing slots

so 700 slots means nothing if your trying to do a more detailed room such as a bakery, there could be 50 slots "wasted" on literally decorative food items which are very small, and is especially noticeable in some of the larger houses we have

coming up in the next update they have furnishings like a cheese rack, which is a full set of shelves with like 25-30 pieces of cheese on it, but it counts as 1 furnishing item

thats not even counting some of the extremely limited slots for collectible furnishings, i literally have years worth of eso+ freebies, but you can only put 110 collectible furnishings in a house, even though a lot of them are not any different from standard housing items (paintings, statuettes, etc)

the limitation on more interactive stuff (houseguests, mounts, pets) is more understandable, but i feel 10 is still an incredibly small limit, especially when assistants take up at least 4 of those slots if you have 1 of each type

[Snip]

I have like 15 necrom platforms in my house. Those are probably much easier to render than the little moon sugar bong thing that I have next to my floating bed. So a small thing can be complex, and a big thing can be simple. Does that make sense?

that might apply in some cases, but not all

sure the skooma bubbler might have more processing its animated an all that, but there are also small housing items which are non-animated that again are small and simple that still take up the same amount of "space" as the giant animated windmill

my main point is that the size of the houses is too large for the amount of furnishing slots to adequately furnish with any level of detail, or without blocking off half of the house that you had no more slots to decorate

if they dont want to give more slots than we have now, they need to make the houses smaller to accommodate that limit

More small houses, sure, but not only. I like having options while the smaller houses are a more defined space. Plus, I don’t have to place furnishings everywhere to enjoy a property. For instance, I enjoy hiking around my Varlaisvea Ayleid Ruins with only a couple hundred larger furnishings added.

I'm just not interested in anything smaller than notables. The small/medium ones are too hard to furnish without seeming cramped.

[Edited quote]

I like to build "extra bits" and I must admit I enjoy smaller homes because the large platforms and walls available allow me to add those items in small numbers but still create large useable "extra" space

I looked at Sword Singer's Redoubt and immediately started to look for ways to make it smaller....... Kinda annoyed that huge tent isn't moveable.

I would love more spaces and I might even start to want some of the huge Crown Houses, if extra slots were added, however it does suit my rl budget that I can look at them and immediately think "nope too big".

As far as performance goes, my PC is now just about 7yrs old, I cannot afford to replace it and one of my storage houses already makes my graphics card's fans go nuts........ admittedly it does currently house close to 700 light furnishings and if I turn the lights off my PC is happy once more.

My point being it is actually fairly easy to see the complexity of adding more spaces, when you can easily upset a fairly old but when new top of the range PC just by using excessive numbers of lights!!

Nerouyn

freespirit wrote: »

As far as performance goes, my PC is now just about 7yrs old, I cannot afford to replace it and one of my storage houses already makes my graphics card's fans go nuts........ admittedly it does currently house close to 700 light furnishings and if I turn the lights off my PC is happy once more.

I can relate.

Right now I have a better machine but before, a fully furnished but unsubbed (so half limit) Snugpod would cause my game to crash about a third of the time.