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A better Necromancer class rework update 41.

Grandsheba
Grandsheba
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I'm agaisnt the Necromancer's Blastbones change wholeheartedly and have taken many of your replies and comments into consideration for this final version of this rework. Thank you all for your suggestion, tips and support!

The Necromancer class in ESO is designed to embody this identity by being masters of elemental damage, protecting themselves with bone and flesh shields, and buffing themselves and others with powerful Living Death magic. The three skill lines, namely Grave Lord Skills (Elementalist), Bone Tyrant Skills (Bone Armor), and Living Death Skills (Soul Mending), are integral to this identity:

- Grave Lord Skills (Elementalist) focus on imbuing the dead with Frost, Fire, and Lightning to bring ruin upon enemies, as well as raising relentless hordes of the undead and intensifying the assault with fallen enemies.

- Bone Tyrant Skills (Bone Armor) center around bending and breaking the dead to the Necromancer's will, using their remains to create impenetrable barriers, and extending the Necromancer's own life by controlling the battlefield with the bones of the departed.

- Living Death Skills (Soul Mending) enable the Necromancer to draw from the power of life and death to replenish and restore allies, resurrect defeated comrades, and keep them in the fight.

By refining and adjusting these skill lines, We aim to enhance the Necromancer's thematic and gameplay coherence, ensuring that the class truly embodies the essence of mastering death, manipulating the dead, and balancing the forces of life and death to achieve their goals. These changes will likely bring the Necromancer closer to the envisioned identity of the class, providing players with a more immersive and engaging gameplay experience that resonates with the essence of the Necromancer in the Elder Scrolls Online.

Here are some better alternatives and some changes as requested from other players.

Necrotic Potency

Target: Area
Duration: 6 seconds
Cost: 1 corpse

Skill description
>
Embrace the power of collected souls to bolster your dark arts. For each soul absorbed, increase your Weapon and Spell Damage by 50. Sapping the lingering life from fresh corpses, grants you 6 Ultimate while healing 682 Health every 1 second for 6 seconds per additional corpse.


This ability scales off your Max Health. While slotted, your damage taken is reduced by 3%.

Change Notes:
>
Embrace the power of collected souls to bolster your dark arts. For each soul absorbed, increase your Weapon and Spell Damage by 50. The duration of this buff stacks dynamically with each additional soul collected, extending its remaining time to empower your necromantic abilities.

The revamped Necrotic Potency skill introduces a dynamic and engaging mechanic that aligns with the thematic essence of the Necromancer class. By harnessing the power of collected souls, the Necromancer gains a tangible boost to their damage potential, promoting strategic and immersive gameplay.

This change addresses the need for the Necromancer class to have a damage-buffing skill, bringing it up to par with other classes in the game. The dynamic stacking of the buff's duration encourages players to actively collect souls, fostering a sense of mastery and rewarding skilled play. Additionally, the increase in Weapon and Spell Damage per collected soul provides a meaningful and impactful boost to the Necromancer's abilities, enhancing their role in combat scenarios.

Overall, the revised Necrotic Potency skill not only enriches the gameplay experience for Necromancer players but also contributes to a more balanced and engaging class dynamic within the game.


Shocking Siphon

Duration: 20 seconds
Maximum range: 28 meters
Radius: 5 meters
Cost: 1 corpse

Skill description:
>
Violently drain the last spark of life from a corpse, dealing 14590 Shock Damage over 20 seconds to all enemies around the corpse and between you and the corpse. While slotted, your damage done is increased by 3%.

Change:l Notes:
>
The adjustment to the Shocking Siphon skill was implemented to significantly enhance its damage potential while retaining the core mechanics that necessitate the presence of a corpse and manual targeting. By increasing the skill's damage output, it now offers a more impactful and potent option within the Necromancer's toolkit. The requirement for a corpse and the need for precise targeting are fundamental aspects of the Necromancer's thematic and strategic identity, which have been preserved to maintain the class's unique gameplay experience. These modifications aim to ensure that the skill remains aligned with the Necromancer's focus on damage over time (DoT) abilities, while enhancing its overall effectiveness in combat scenarios. This change was necessary to ensure that the Necromancer's abilities are on par with those of other classes, particularly in terms of DoT capabilities, and to provide a more seamless and strategically viable gameplay experience for Necromancer players.

Blastbones

Target: Enemy/Area
Range: 28m
Cost: 2700

Skill description
>
After 2.5 seconds, summon a flaming skeleton from the ground. The skeleton pursues the target and explodes upon reaching them, dealing 3486 Flame Damage to nearby enemies. Using the reticle while summoning allows you to direct the blastbones towards a specific target. Otherwise, they will autonomously follow the Necromancer and engage the nearest target within a 10m radius. Recast to detonate.

Change Notes:>
This modification to the Blastbones ability introduces heightened flexibility and control for Necromancer players. By eliminating the requirement for a predefined target during summoning, it enables a more adaptable and strategic utilization of the skill. The additional feature allowing players to direct Blastbones to prioritize a target as needed grants enhanced control over the skeleton's actions, ultimately elevating the overall gameplay experience for Necromancers.


Stalking legion (Stalking Blastbones)

Target: Enemy/Area
Range: 28m
Limit: 3
Cost: 2700

>
Skill description: Summon a flaming skeleton from the ground. After 2.5 seconds, the skeleton runs after the target and explodes when it gets close to them, dealing 1600 Flame Damage to all enemies nearby. Every second the skeleton spends chasing its target increases the damage of the explosion by 10%, up to a maximum of 50% more damage. Up to 3 corpses can be active at a time with only 1.5 seconds cooldown between each skeleton summoning.
Recast to detonate after 3 Blastbones are present.
Creates a corpse on death.

Change Notes:
>
The reworked skill "Stalking Legion" has undergone significant changes that impact its functionality and potential in combat. Here's a brief explanation of why this change is beneficial and needed:

Improved balance: The reduction in the initial damage dealt by the exploding skeleton from 3600 to 1600 Flame Damage, coupled with the cap on the maximum damage increase, helps to balance the skill's potential burst damage.

Enhanced versatility: Allowing up to three corpses to be active at a time and reducing the cooldown between skeleton summonings to 1.5 seconds significantly enhances the skill's versatility, enabling more strategic and frequent deployment in combat situations.

Strategic depth: With the ability to have multiple explosive skeletons active and in play, players can now employ more strategic and tactical approaches to engagements, adding depth to the skill's gameplay mechanics.

Overall, these changes to "Stalking Legion" aim to promote a more balanced and versatile use of the skill while adding a layer of strategic depth to the Necromancer's toolkit thematically.



Blighted Blastbones

Target: Enemy/area
Range: 28m
Radius: 6m
Duration: 4 second
Cost: 2295

Skill description
>
Summon a decaying skeleton from the ground after 2.5 seconds. The skeleton runs after the target and explodes when it gets close to them, dealing 3600 Disease Damage to all enemies nearby and applying Major Defile to them for 4 seconds, reducing their healing received and Health Recovery by 16%.

Recast to detonat blighted Blastbones.

Creates a corpse on death, causing a putrid area of decay in a 6-meter radius. Enemies within the area suffer from a potent Disease affliction, taking 1500 Disease damage over 4 seconds. Only 2 blighted corpes may persist at at time.

Change Notes:
>
This reworked ability offers the Necromancer a strategic and thematic AoE damage option, leveraging the theme of decay and disease that is central to the class. By incorporating damage over time effects, the skill aligns with the Necromancer's identity and provides a valuable addition to their arsenal. The rework also addresses the need for more diverse damage over time abilities within the Necromancer's skill set, enhancing gameplay options and synergies for players who prefer this playstyle.

This reworked Blighted Blastbones skill not only adds thematic depth to the Necromancer class but also introduces a valuable AoE damage-over-time option, aligning with the class's identity and providing players with a more diverse and strategic skill set.


Hexproof

Target: Self
Radius: 10 meters
Cost: 1670

Skill description
>
Harness the touch of Namira and release a powerful wave of hex energy. Removing up to 4 negative effects from yourself and hexing enemies within a 10-meter radius with your negative effects. While slotted, the cost of all your abilities is reduced by 3%.

Change Notes:
[>spoiler] This change enriches gameplay by offering a versatile defensive option combined with offensive potential, empowering players with a broader range of strategic choices in combat scenarios. Additionally, the inherent cost reduction of all abilities while the skill is slotted provides a consistent advantage, further enhancing its value as a crucial addition to the gameplay experience. Thematically, Hexproof aligns with the Necromancer's mastery of dark arts and their ability to wield sinister forces to control and manipulate the battlefield. This change enriches the Necromancer's gameplay by reflecting the class's thematic depth and lore-driven abilities, harmonizing with the Necromancer's identity.[/spoiler]


Spirit Guardian

Target: Self
Cost: 4320

Skill description
>
Conjure a ghostly spirit to do your bidding and stay by your side for 16 seconds. The spirit heals you or the lowest Health ally around you every 2 seconds, restoring 718 Health. While active 50% of the damage you take is transferred to the spirit instead. Creates a corpse on death.

Chane Notes:
>
The enhanced Spirit Guardian skill now offers a more robust defensive mechanism for Necromancers by transferring 50% of the damage they receive to the conjured spirit. This change addresses the absence of a traditional damage shield for the class while maintaining a unique thematic identity. The skill's continued healing effect ensures that players benefit from both damage mitigation and periodic restoration, offering a versatile and strategic tool for managing combat situations effectively. This adjustment not only aligns the Necromancer with other classes in terms of defensive capabilities but also reinforces its distinct playstyle as a summon and discard class within the game.


Intensive Mender

Target: Self
Cost: 2160
Radius: 4m

Skill description
>
Conjure a ghostly spirit to do your bidding and stay by your side for 8 seconds. The spirit heals you or the lowest Health ally around you every 2 seconds, restoring 1438 Health.

Creates a corpse on death that release a 4m pool of soul plasm that heals 1 ally for the total amount the spirit healed while active.

Skeletal Archer

Target: Self
Cost: 2525
Duration: 20

Skill description
>
Unearth a skeletal archer from the dirt to fight by your side for 20 seconds. The archer attacks the closest enemy every 2 seconds, dealing 463 Physical Damage. Each time the archer deals damage, its next attack will do 15% more damage than the previous attack. Additionally, the type of damage the archer deals depends on which corpse is summoned. The Khajiiti archer deals bleed damage, while the Argonian archer deals poison damage. Creates a corpse on death.

Change Notes:
>
This change is a significant and necessary improvement as it adds depth and versatility to the Necromancer gameplay. By introducing specific damage types based on the summoned corpse, players will now have the option to adapt their combat strategy and tactics to various situations. This thematic change allows for a more immersive and engaging experience, aligning with the concept of a Necromancer utilizing their undead legion for strategic advantage.

Only one archer can be controlled at a time.


Skeletal Arcanist

Target: Area
Cost: 2970

Skill Description:
>
Unearth a skeletal mage from the dirt to fight by your side for 20 seconds. The mage attacks the closest enemy every 2 seconds, dealing 478 frost damage to them and all other enemies nearby. Additionally, the type of damage the mage deals depends on which corpse is summoned. The khajiti mage deals shock damage, while the argonian mage deals fire damage.

The mage also creates a corpse on death.

Change Notes:
This change is beneficial as it introduces thematic gameplay of a Necromancer utilizing their undead legion for versatility. By allowing the mage to deal damage based on the type of corpse summoned, it adds strategic depth to the skill and aligns with the class's identity of commanding and empowering undead allies. This enhancement not only enhances the thematic elements of the Necromancer class but also provides players with more strategic options during combat, making the skill more engaging and rewarding to use.

Only one mage can be conteoles at a time.


Summoner's Armor

Target: Self
Cost: 2700
Radius: 4meters

Skill description
>
With Namira's embrace wrap yourself in hardened bone, granting you Major Resolve, increasing your Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by 5948 for 20 seconds. While active, when attacked by an enemy a bone shard is summoned to the enemy's location releasing noxious fluids around itself dealing 1800 poison damage in a 4m Radius.
The damage portion of this skill scales with your highest resource.

Also reduces the cost of Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, and Spirit Mender by 15%. Creates a corpse when the effect completes.

Change notes:
>
The updated Summoner's Armor skill represents a significant improvement for both PvP and PvE scenarios, offering a unique blend of defensive and offensive capabilities. Here's why this change is advantageous:

PvP and PvE Benefits:

• PvP: In player versus player encounters, the skill's ability to summon bone shards and release noxious fluids upon being attacked adds a layer of unpredictability and area denial, making it an effective defensive and crowd control tool. The reduction in the cost of other abilities also enhances the Necromancer's resource management during prolonged engagements.

• PvE: Within player versus environment content, the skill's defensive properties, in conjunction with the offensive potential of the summoned bone shards, provide valuable support in mitigating incoming damage and contributing to group combat dynamics. The cost reduction for other abilities further amplifies the Necromancer's efficiency in sustaining prolonged engagements, thereby increasing their overall effectiveness in PvE encounters.

By comparing the updated Summoner's Armor skill with these specific examples from other classes in ESO:Dragonknight's Hardened Armor, Sorcerer's Bound Aegis, Templar's Restoring Focus, and Arcanist's Unbreakable Fate, it becomes evident that the revision was necessary to bring the Necromancer's defensive capabilities more in line with the diverse and multifaceted armor-granting skills available to other classes. The enhancements to Summoner's Armor ensure that the Necromancer class remains competitive and balanced in terms of defensive, offensive, and strategic utility, aligning it more closely with the capabilities provided by similar skills from other classes while keeping its thematic game play.


Remote Decay Totem (remote totem)

Target: Ground
Range: 28m
Radius: 6m
Cost: 3240

Skill description
>
Summon an effigy of bone for 11 seconds that bestows Minor Protection to you and your allies, reducing damage taken by 5%. After a 2-second delay, the totem initiates resource drainage from nearby enemies, siphoning 3% of their resources per tick within a 6-meter radius. Siphoned targets are snared by 20%. Additionally, allies within the 6-meter radius receive 1% of the total resource siphoned applied to their resources per tick.

Explanation: >
"Remote Decay Totem (Remote Totem)" skill offers a versatile and strategic utility to the Necromancer's repertoire. By summoning an effigy of bone, the skill provides Minor Protection to the caster and their allies, mitigating incoming damage. Furthermore, the totem's resource-draining effect places a burden on nearby enemies, siphoning their resources and applying a snare effect. Notably, allies within the totem's radius benefit from the siphoned resources, enhancing their own reserves. This skill serves as a valuable addition, offering both defensive support and resource manipulation in combat scenarios.

The cost of this skill is reduced from 6328 as the skill is ranked up.

Change Notes:
>
Moderate Resource Drain: Setting the resource drain at 3% and the resource gain at 1% of the total per tick strikes a balance between providing a meaningful effect for allies and maintaining a degree of challenge in resource management during PvE encounters.

Skill Description and Benefits:
The reworked "Remote Decay Totem (Remote Totem)" introduces a valuable and much-needed supportive skill for the Necromancer class. By combining defensive capabilities with resource manipulation, this skill enhances the Necromancer's role in group engagements. The provision of Minor Protection to the caster and their allies promotes survivability, while the totem's resource-draining effect creates strategic opportunities by siphoning resources from nearby enemies and snaring them. Furthermore, the ability for allies to benefit from the siphoned resources adds a layer of tactical synergy within group dynamics. These changes aim to enrich the Necromancer's supportive capabilities, making "Remote Decay Totem (Remote Totem)" a crucial and beneficial addition to the class's skill set.

Enhanced Strategic Support:
By incorporating these changes, the Remote Totem becomes a strategic support ability for tanks that provides protection to allies in danger while exerting pressure on enemies through resource drain, enhancing its effectiveness in both PvE and PvP scenarios.


Agony Totem
Target: Area
Cost: 4050

Skill Description:
>
Summon an effigy of bone at your feet for 13 seconds that grants Minor Protection to you and your allies, reducing damage taken by 5%. After 2 seconds, the totem begins fearing nearby enemies every 2 seconds, causing them to cower in place for 4 seconds. Consumes a corpse on cast to enable you or your allies to activate the Pure Agony synergy, causing enemies to take 2100 Magic Damage over 5 seconds and applying Minor Vulnerability to them, increasing their damage taken by 5%.

Explanation: >
This change introduces a meaningful requirement for the caster or allies to utilize the Pure Agony synergy, adding strategic depth and thematic consistency to the skill. By tying the activation of the synergy to the consumption of a corpse, the skill aligns more closely with the Necromancer class's theme of manipulating the deceased. This alteration also addresses potential balance concerns and ensures that the skill remains powerful while introducing a meaningful limitation.


Ultimate Changes

Bone Goliath Transformation

Target: Self
Cost: 250
Duration: 20 seconds

Skill Description:
>
Transform into a horrific Bone Goliath, increasing your Max Health by 30000 for 20 seconds and immediately restoring 30000 Health. While transformed, you gain Major Force, increasing Critical Damage against enemies by 20%. Additionally, all attacks apply Major Mangle, reducing the target's Maximum Health by 20%. Your damaging Light Attacks restore 319 Health, and fully-charged Heavy Attacks replenish 800 Health. This ability scales with your Max Health.[,/spoiler]

Change Notes:
>
This change is essential as it brings the Necromancer's transformation ability in line with other transformations, such as those available to vampires and werewolves. It provides a significant increase in survivability and offensive potential, ensuring that the Bone Goliath Transformation is a competitive debuff choice for tank players while maintaining thematic consistency with the Necromancer class.


Passive changes

Reusable parts >
• Rank 1: When your Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender dies, the cost of your next Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender is reduced by 25%. Additionally, their effectiveness goes up by 50% on targets under 50% health.

• Rank 2: When your Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender dies, the cost of your next Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender is reduced by 50%. Moreover, their effectiveness goes up by 100% on targets under 100% health.

Change notes:
>
The recent adjustment to the "Reusable Parts" passive ability was implemented to address the need for improved synergy and strategic depth within the Necromancer's skill set. Notably, the Necromancer currently lacks an execute ability comparable to those of other classes and skills in the game, which has led to a disparity in certain combat scenarios. This change aims to bridge that gap and help bring the Necromancer up to par with the fast-paced and evolving gameplay mechanics of The Elder Scrolls Online. By enhancing the effectiveness of subsequent summons based on the health of targets, this adjustment offers Necromancer players more versatile and impactful options during combat. The increased cost reduction and effectiveness boost serve to empower players with more dynamic and engaging gameplay, aligning the passive ability with the evolving gameplay mechanics and player preferences.

Rapid Rot
>
Effect
Rank 1
Increases your damage done with damage over time effects by 15%.

Rank 2
Increases your damage done with damage over time effects by 30%.

Change Notes:
The adjustment to the "Rapid Rot" passive ability was introduced to enhance the potency and effectiveness of damage over time (DoT) effects within the Necromancer's arsenal. By increasing the damage output from DoT effects, this change aims to provide Necromancer players with a more competitive edge in sustained combat encounters. As the gameplay landscape continues to evolve, the need for diverse and impactful playstyles has become increasingly apparent. This modification seeks to address that need by empowering Necromancer players to excel in the domain of damage over time effects, thereby promoting a more dynamic and engaging gameplay experience.


Death's Merchant (Death Gleaning)

>
Rank 1: Whenever someone within 28 meters dies while you are in combat, restore 333 Magicka and Stamina.

Rank 2:Whenever someone within 28 meters dies while you are in combat, restore 666 Magicka and Stamina.

Change Notes:
>
The modification to the "Death Gleaning" ability has been introduced to broaden its scope of effectiveness, allowing Necromancer players to benefit from resource restoration upon any nearby death during combat, rather than exclusively from enemy targets. This adjustment aims to provide a more versatile and inclusive mechanic, enabling Necromancers to efficiently replenish their Magicka and Stamina pools in diverse combat scenarios. By extending the utility of this ability beyond specific enemy interactions, this change seeks to enhance the overall gameplay experience for Necromancer players, fostering a more fluid and responsive resource management system that aligns with the evolving dynamics of gameplay.


Fangs of Sithis
Revised Passive Ability (Dismember Original):

>
Rank 1: Reap for Sithis, every consumed corpse grants you a stack of Death's Touch for 10 seconds, providing 75 Spell and Physical Penetration.

Rank 2: Reap for Sithis, every consumed corpse grants you a stack of Death's Touch for 10 seconds, providing 150 Spell and Physical Penetration.

Change Note:
>
The modification from the original "Dismember" passive skill to the new "Fangs of Sithis" passive skill has been implemented to align the Necromancer's mechanics with the corpse-consuming aspect, thereby creating a more cohesive and thematic synergy within the class. By integrating the Spell and Physical Penetration bonuses with the "Fangs of Sithis" skill, this alteration aims to enhance the relevance and utility of corpse consumption, offering a more immersive and engaging gameplay experience for Necromancer players. Additionally, this change is intended to introduce a more dynamic and versatile mechanic that complements the evolving dynamics of combat and resource management, thereby enriching the overall gameplay experience within The Elder Scrolls Online.


The changes to the Necromancer skill line in ESO are aimed at aligning the class more closely with the developers' vision for the Necromancer identity. The developers have described Necromancers as "Masters of death" who can call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls, weave ghastly spells to harm and heal, and manipulate the dead to empower themselves, damage enemies, and heal allies. Please remember to vote, like and comment to support. Thank you for reading.
Edited by Grandsheba on February 7, 2024 9:01PM
"The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."

A better Necromancer class rework update 41. 17 votes

I would enjoy these changes.
76%
DTStormfoxPeppo_LivesPrax3desMichaelkeirLazarus_RisingACamaroGuyPrincessOfThievesCalaindo1234necro_the_crafterAvidNecrozombievalenCordingOnyxAeltharion 13 votes
I like the changes for update 41.
23%
JoarikHottytotzoorarScarletHawke 4 votes
  • MashmalloMan
    MashmalloMan
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    ✭✭✭✭
    You clearly spent a lot of time and thought on this, so I appreciate that, but I think most people won't read through this unfortunately given it's a gigantic wall of text.

    I'd recommend using some spoiler tags to consolidate your explanations making it easier to grasp the bigger picture of what you're trying to change.
    PC Beta - 1900+ CP

    Stam Sorc Khajiit PvE/PVP Main || Stam Sorc Dark Elf PvP ||
    Stam Templar Dark Elf || Stam Warden Wood Elf || Stam DK Nord || Stam Necro Orc || Stam Blade Khajiit


    Mag Sorc High Elf || Mag Templar High Elf || Mag Warden Breton || Mag Necro Khajiit || Mag Blade Khajiit
  • Grandsheba
    Grandsheba
    ✭✭✭
    You clearly spent a lot of time and thought on this, so I appreciate that, but I think most people won't read through this unfortunately given it's a gigantic wall of text.

    I'd recommend using some spoiler tags to consolidate your explanations making it easier to grasp the bigger picture of what you're trying to change.

    Thanks, I appreciate it. I didn't know this was an option on here. I hope this is better or maybe I should just have the descriptions in spoiler tags as well.
    "The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."
  • chessalavakia_ESO
    chessalavakia_ESO
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    Disclaimer: I don't play that much Necromancer and I am generally negative/nitpicky about everything. You clearly put a ton of effort in writing all of that up.
    Are you intending to change just the Necrotic Potency Morph or are you meaning to change both morphs of Bitter Harvest?

    Would you have a cap for the amount the weapon/spell power could be boosted by the new Necrotic Potency?

    Does the ability to have non-targeted Blastbones apply to both morphs or just the base version? Ex: Can I have three Stalking Legion sitting with me waiting for something to go within 10m (If so, the time they sit waiting doesn't count as stalking time right?

    How often are players not actively targeting the thing they are fighting with the reticle? ( People might end up annoyed if they find the blastbones aren't doing anything because their reticle wasn't lined up and the enemy isn't within 10 m.)

    For Hexproof (Are you meaning to just change it or the base morph?), you might hit situations where negative effects from npcs might disrupt fights. For example, I don't do much of the harder PvE content but my understanding is sometimes you get negative effects that damage you based on your max health. Tossing something like that back on a boss might do too much damage. It might also be frustrating in PvP if you get a big DOT on someone and they use Hexproof which causes them to be cleansed of it and now you are taking the big DOT instead.

    50% damage mitigation would possibly be going a bit too far for Spirit Guardian as that's the amount of value one of the mythic items provides if I recall correctly

    Does the Necromancer actually connect with Namira lore wise at the moment?

    Are you intending the buff to summoners armor to be flat damage or to scale with stats?

    I could be mistaken but, I'm not sure NPC's necessarily have resources to siphon. When I run Symphony of Blades it tends to proc on npcs which would suggest they start under 50% resources.

    In PvP, the siphon might favor players with high regen a bit too much.

    Bone Goliath Transformation can definitely be a bit underwhelming at the present. Are you meaning to give Major Force to the user for the duration or every time they do an attack for a period of time? The Major Mangle might not be balanced when it comes to PvP.

  • Grandsheba
    Grandsheba
    ✭✭✭
    Disclaimer: I don't play that much Necromancer and I am generally negative/nitpicky about everything. You clearly put a ton of effort in writing all of that up.
    Are you intending to change just the Necrotic Potency Morph or are you meaning to change both morphs of Bitter Harvest?

    Would you have a cap for the amount the weapon/spell power could be boosted by the new Necrotic Potency?

    Does the ability to have non-targeted Blastbones apply to both morphs or just the base version? Ex: Can I have three Stalking Legion sitting with me waiting for something to go within 10m (If so, the time they sit waiting doesn't count as stalking time right?

    How often are players not actively targeting the thing they are fighting with the reticle? ( People might end up annoyed if they find the blastbones aren't doing anything because their reticle wasn't lined up and the enemy isn't within 10 m.)

    For Hexproof (Are you meaning to just change it or the base morph?), you might hit situations where negative effects from npcs might disrupt fights. For example, I don't do much of the harder PvE content but my understanding is sometimes you get negative effects that damage you based on your max health. Tossing something like that back on a boss might do too much damage. It might also be frustrating in PvP if you get a big DOT on someone and they use Hexproof which causes them to be cleansed of it and now you are taking the big DOT instead.

    50% damage mitigation would possibly be going a bit too far for Spirit Guardian as that's the amount of value one of the mythic items provides if I recall correctly

    Does the Necromancer actually connect with Namira lore wise at the moment?

    Are you intending the buff to summoners armor to be flat damage or to scale with stats?

    I could be mistaken but, I'm not sure NPC's necessarily have resources to siphon. When I run Symphony of Blades it tends to proc on npcs which would suggest they start under 50% resources.

    In PvP, the siphon might favor players with high regen a bit too much.

    Bone Goliath Transformation can definitely be a bit underwhelming at the present. Are you meaning to give Major Force to the user for the duration or every time they do an attack for a period of time? The Major Mangle might not be balanced when it comes to PvP.

    Thanks for your reply, alot of things to clarify.

    >













    **Necrotic Potency Morph**: The intention is to alter just the Necrotic Potency Morph, not both morphs of Bitter Harvest. There's no need for a cap on the boost to weapon/spell power since the duration is short-lived and can't be over-abused due to the mechanics. It operates based on the number of souls around, typically requiring a significant amount, making it impractical for sustained power boosts in normal dungeon runs.

    **Blastbones Mechanics**: The change applies solely to the base version and its morphs. They behave similarly to the current mechanics, activating on a timer and expiring even if they don't reach a target. This adjustment aims to mitigate AI bugs and enhance gameplay by removing the need for a target, thus improving efficiency and reliability.

    **Reticle Targeting**: The reticle prioritizes targets, but it doesn't exclusively require an active target for summoning. This alteration aims to streamline gameplay and alleviate frustrations caused by current targeting issues, enhancing the overall experience for Necromancer players.

    **Hexproof Morph**: This change applies to Hexproof, the morph. While there are potential concerns in both PvE and PvP scenarios, existing mechanics and cleanses available to players mitigate these issues. Additionally, the skill's health cost in PvP acts as a balancing factor against potential overuse.

    **Spirit Guardian**
    Operates similarly to a traditional damage shield. Damage shields typically absorb 100% of incoming damage, serving as a protective barrier. They can be frequently applied and their effectiveness scales with the maximum health of the target. While most classes possess a damage shield, the necromancer's Spirit Guardian fills this role, albeit one that is a ghost instead of a bubble. The spirt Guardian has a health bar that can be deleted from too much damage as well. Functionality speaking its not much different from a damage shield except in terms of strength and the fact that damage shield buffs or cp do not give spirit Guardian any benefits at all. Here's more info on damage sheilds for a fair comparison and understanding. https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Damage_Shield

    For summoners armor the damage portion of this skill scales with your highest resource.

    Necormancers
    Necromancer's are always connected to Namira the Daedric Prince whose sphere is the ancient Darkness. She is also known as the Daedric Prince of Hunger, the Lady of Decay, the Spirit Daedra and the Goddess of the Dark. Namira is the ruler of sundry dark and shadowy spirits, and is often associated with slugs, spiders, and other things that inspire mortals with instinctive revulsion. Even if the necromancer doesn't know or acknowledge it, they fall within he sphere just as beggars and cannibals do.

    For more on it you can read in game books from various games. Skyrim has Eola and some other minor characters, reachmen, witch's and ect.

    In ESO they did a couple dlc's that made very direct connections to Namira and necromancers even more Potent than the skyrim ones. Some examples are Arum-Khal or moss rock cavern and I'm sure it's in the Elswyer Dlc as well. However necromancy is very broad and typically and form os soul manipulation is ruled as necromancy not just raising the dead. This is its own long debate both in game and irl. To avoid this rabbit holes the answer is yes and Some necrotic spells require the remains of the elderly due to the high levels of necrotic energy that is produced by the natural decay of life. According to one necromantic theory, the older a living being becomes, the more necrotic energy it naturally acquires while the body grows old and the life inside it decays. Which all falls with in Namira's sphere of influence.

    Remote totem
    You made a fair point about this as uts pretty inconsistent and I see most skills have been changed or written to just offer a fixed resource amount instead. So I'll be redoing this to post later. Tha k you for pointing this out.

    As for the PVP aspect, there is always something that favors something else in game. Armor, defense, zeros, stealth and ect. Everyone has to take the time to build around that attribute to make them effective. As long as they are not permanently immortal there's no real issue. For this skill in pvp the same rules apply as the one for pve, "stay out of the red circle". It only has a 6m raidus and only works when a target is inside it.

    Though mostly designed for tanks to save their allies that get mobbed on for example trails like AA where you might have an off tank while the other tank handles the axes and everyone is stacked dealing with the mobs. Any situations similar to this the tank could throw this totem out to save lives of their companions.

    The only change needed while ranking this skill up is the change in cost being reduces to the number that is present.

    For the ultimate I've revised it, thank you for pointing this out.
    Transform into a horrific Bone Goliath, increasing your Max Health by 30000 for 20 seconds and immediately restoring 30000 Health. While transformed, you gain Major Force, increasing Critical Damage against enemies by 20%. Additionally, all attacks apply Major Mangle, reducing the target's Maximum Health by 20%. Your damaging Light Attacks restore 319 Health, and fully-charged Heavy Attacks replenish 800 Health. This ability scales with your Max Health.
    I hope this clears it up on its functionality.

    As for PVP comparatively it seems pretty balanced when looking at what the other transformations have and how to counter them.

    For werewolves with just the transformation alone
    >
    Werewolf Berserker

    Cost: 300 Ultimate
    Cast time: 1 second
    Target: Self
    Duration: 30 seconds
    Effect
    Transform into a beast, fearing nearby enemies for 3 seconds. While transformed, your Light Attacks apply a bleed for 3716 Bleed Damage over 4 seconds, your Heavy Attacks deal 50% splash damage, and your Max Stamina is increased by 30%. While slotted, your Stamina Recovery is increased by 15%.

    Keep in mind with update 41 bleed has been changed to give up to 300% more damage.
    https://eso-hub.com/en/skills/world/werewolf

    Then vampires
    >
    Perfect Scion

    Cost: 320 Ultimate
    Target: Self
    Duration: 20 seconds
    Effect
    Transform into a monstrous creature of the night, instantly healing to full Health. While transformed, your Max Health, Magicka, and Stamina are increased by 10000, you heal for 15% of all damage you deal, and you can see enemies through walls. You also ascend to Vampire Stage 5, which grants all the benefits of Vampire Stage 4 with none of the drawbacks.
    https://eso-hub.com/en/skills/world/vampire

    With these transformations, not even touching the skills associated or some of the passives. These transformations are already extremely powerful. Add in the passvies, this means you have another set of passives that stack with whatever your current ones are which can give you massive resources and defensive ability. This is exactly why it often takes groups of people to kill these monsters and why most people will run from either of these transformations.

    However the Bone Goliath doesn't compare to them in any manner. When you transform into one you get a roughly 20% snare applied to you for the duration of the transformation. There is no damage boost or any type of offense or real defense boost at all. You just get more max hp and some minor attributes that in no way compare to the other transformations abilities listed above.

    So my point being is that the necormancer class is unique in that it's the only transformation class as well as the only class that requires a corpes for the majority of its abilities to work. It's also the only clas to have negative effects applied to themselves for using their abilities and the up sides are not equivalent to this hindrance.

    You've rasie some fair points and I'll update all of this and repost it at a later time. Thank you so much for taking the time and giving me more perspectives to look into for improvements.
    "The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."
  • Grim_Overlord
    Grim_Overlord
    ✭✭✭
    A lot of really strong ideas here, especially regarding the sad state of the transformation, but I think we can go even further in re-envisioning what the Necromancer could be. While many of the skills in the Necromancer's kit competed with Sorcerer's for least used until they themselves got a rework this patch, the passives in Necro's kit are equally underwhelming at this stage in the game's life.

    Starting with Bone Tyrant, Death Gleaning and Disdain Harm are admittedly solid passives, though given the requirement for Death Gleaning is the death of an enemy, it could do away with the requirement of having a Bone Tyrant ability slotted or at least have it active so long as one is slotted on either bar. Health Avarice and Last Gasp however are extremely underwhelming for the skill point investment. Health Avarice is nice for tanking, but given it only gives that benefit when Bone Tyrant skills are on a bar, this passive ought to also give the 1250 health that Last Gasp gives on top of that. In essence, Health Avarice and Last Gasp should be combined into Health Avarice's effect as 1250 health isn't worth 2 skill points since the buff to everyone's base health. It is still nice to have in the Necromancer's kit, but it shouldn't be its own perk. This then frees up Last Gasp to have a unique effect and is a place for Necromancer to bring some unique group utility at long last! Last Gasp then could make it so that dealing damage with a Necromancer ability applies "Minor Susceptibility" to the damaged target(aoe abilities would only apply it to the first target hit or the closest damaged enemy without the debuff already) for 6 seconds, increasing the chance them being afflicted with a Status Effect by 100%. Last Gasp could also increase the damage of your Diseased and Overcharged status effects(or whatever damage types become most common in a Necromancer's kit, I just feel that disease and magic fit best, though I also understand if only one of these gets the buff) by 428(or whatever Warden's buff to chilled currently is on PTS). This effect would scale off your highest offensive stats. This might be overtuned given the changes to Statuses seen this PTS cycle, but this was an idea I had a few years ago and still feel that, even if the numbers need changing, at its core adheres to the theme of the Necromancer and the name "Last Gasp." With the changes to statuses, I think this is the perfect time for such a debuff to be added to the game through Necromancer's kit as it isn't overpowered but would be desired in most groups.

    The Living Death passives are honestly all perfectly fine and help create the tanky nature Necromancers have come to embody in PVE and PVP. The only changes I would advocate for would be to add "Increases the duration of corpses generated from skills you cast by 100%" to help with the issue of not having enough corpses to make skills useful in fights without adds as well as helping with Siphon and Coil sometimes failing to cast due to a corpse fading out of existence after it is targeted, though the targeting fixes proposed in this thread would also aid this some. The other change, which again is more for quality of life, is for Undead Confederate to also say "Your mastery over your undead summons allows them to proc item sets and Status effects." As Necromancer summons aren't permanent, they functionally don't act like pets as Scamp, Twilight, or Bear do and as such ought to be able to proc things like any other skill.

    Moving to Grave Lord, Reusable parts is fine; its thematic which is nice and does help with DPS sustain, though does little for other roles. Dismember is also decent, though Penetration is less valuable than when the class came out in 2019. If anything, I would add "and increase your chance of applying a Status Effect to an enemy by 5% for each Negative Effect on them, up to 100%" to stick with the theme of exploiting the decay afflicted on enemies the DOT passive on the class hints at. Speaking of, Rapid Rot is also perfectly fine as it is even at 10% and is the main thing keeping the class going at the moment. The problem passive in this tree is Death Knell, which has been nerfed and buffed on and off again because it takes up a weird amount of Necro's power budget. When parsing, I see my damage go up 8-10k during execute just through this passive alone. However, this makes Necromancer's really weak during fights that aren't pushed straight to execute, but nice to have in complicated execute phases as they can blow through them faster. That being said, I propose altering this ability entirely as it is clearly overly difficult to balance between mildly useless and wildly powerful. Instead, it could increase your Critical Strike Chance and Critical Damage by 1% for each negative effect on an enemy, up to 2% for each Grave Lord ability slotted. This would keep in theme with rotting enemies apart while also giving them a much smoother damage increase as the fight goes on than basically giving guaranteed crit chance during execute. At most, this would give Necromancer's an increase of 12% crit chance and 12% critical damage provided they ran an entire bar of Grave Lord Skills. In reality, this will likely give at most 8% to both as currently most builds run a weapon and guild skill of some kind on their front bars. This is much weaker than the execute passive, but more reliable.

    Anyhow, thanks for reading my long-winded passives post and I hope that these ideas could help the class fall more within the vision of Necromancers as ""Masters of death" who can call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls, weave ghastly spells to harm and heal, and manipulate the dead to empower themselves, damage enemies, and heal allies." I think they also need another summon whose morphs vary between utility and damage, but that is for another post.
    Edited by Grim_Overlord on February 7, 2024 6:31PM
  • Grandsheba
    Grandsheba
    ✭✭✭
    A lot of really strong ideas here, especially regarding the sad state of the transformation, but I think we can go even further in re-envisioning what the Necromancer could be. >
    While many of the skills in the Necromancer's kit competed with Sorcerer's for least used until they themselves got a rework this patch, the passives in Necro's kit are equally underwhelming at this stage in the game's life.

    Starting with Bone Tyrant, Death Gleaning and Disdain Harm are admittedly solid passives, though given the requirement for Death Gleaning is the death of an enemy, it could do away with the requirement of having a Bone Tyrant ability slotted or at least have it active so long as one is slotted on either bar. Health Avarice and Last Gasp however are extremely underwhelming for the skill point investment. Health Avarice is nice for tanking, but given it only gives that benefit when Bone Tyrant skills are on a bar, this passive ought to also give the 1250 health that Last Gasp gives on top of that. In essence, Health Avarice and Last Gasp should be combined into Health Avarice's effect as 1250 health isn't worth 2 skill points since the buff to everyone's base health. It is still nice to have in the Necromancer's kit, but it shouldn't be its own perk. This then frees up Last Gasp to have a unique effect and is a place for Necromancer to bring some unique group utility at long last! Last Gasp then could make it so that dealing damage with a Necromancer ability applies "Minor Susceptibility" to the damaged target(aoe abilities would only apply it to the first target hit or the closest damaged enemy without the debuff already) for 6 seconds, increasing the chance them being afflicted with a Status Effect by 100%. Last Gasp could also increase the damage of your Diseased and Overcharged status effects(or whatever damage types become most common in a Necromancer's kit, I just feel that disease and magic fit best, though I also understand if only one of these gets the buff) by 428(or whatever Warden's buff to chilled currently is on PTS). This effect would scale off your highest offensive stats. This might be overtuned given the changes to Statuses seen this PTS cycle, but this was an idea I had a few years ago and still feel that, even if the numbers need changing, at its core adheres to the theme of the Necromancer and the name "Last Gasp." With the changes to statuses, I think this is the perfect time for such a debuff to be added to the game through Necromancer's kit as it isn't overpowered but would be desired in most groups.

    The Living Death passives are honestly all perfectly fine and help create the tanky nature Necromancers have come to embody in PVE and PVP. The only changes I would advocate for would be to add "Increases the duration of corpses generated from skills you cast by 100%" to help with the issue of not having enough corpses to make skills useful in fights without adds as well as helping with Siphon and Coil sometimes failing to cast due to a corpse fading out of existence after it is targeted, though the targeting fixes proposed in this thread would also aid this some. The other change, which again is more for quality of life, is for Undead Confederate to also say "Your mastery over your undead summons allows them to proc item sets and Status effects." As Necromancer summons aren't permanent, they functionally don't act like pets as Scamp, Twilight, or Bear do and as such ought to be able to proc things like any other skill.

    Moving to Grave Lord, Reusable parts is fine; its thematic which is nice and does help with DPS sustain, though does little for other roles. Dismember is also decent, though Penetration is less valuable than when the class came out in 2019. If anything, I would add "and increase your chance of applying a Status Effect to an enemy by 5% for each Negative Effect on them, up to 100%" to stick with the theme of exploiting the decay afflicted on enemies the DOT passive on the class hints at. Speaking of, Rapid Rot is also perfectly fine as it is even at 10% and is the main thing keeping the class going at the moment. The problem passive in this tree is Death Knell, which has been nerfed and buffed on and off again because it takes up a weird amount of Necro's power budget. When parsing, I see my damage go up 8-10k during execute just through this passive alone. However, this makes Necromancer's really weak during fights that aren't pushed straight to execute, but nice to have in complicated execute phases as they can blow through them faster. That being said, I propose altering this ability entirely as it is clearly overly difficult to balance between mildly useless and wildly powerful. Instead, it could increase your Critical Strike Chance and Critical Damage by 1% for each negative effect on an enemy, up to 2% for each Grave Lord ability slotted. This would keep in theme with rotting enemies apart while also giving them a much smoother damage increase as the fight goes on than basically giving guaranteed crit chance during execute. At most, this would give Necromancer's an increase of 12% crit chance and 12% critical damage provided they ran an entire bar of Grave Lord Skills. In reality, this will likely give at most 8% to both as currently most builds run a weapon and guild skill of some kind on their front bars. This is much weaker than the execute passive, but more reliable.

    Anyhow, thanks for reading my long-winded passives post and I hope that these ideas could help the class fall more within the vision of Necromancers as ""Masters of death" who can call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls, weave ghastly spells to harm and heal, and manipulate the dead to empower themselves, damage enemies, and heal allies." I think they also need another summon whose morphs vary between utility and damage, but that is for another post.


    I appreciate the effort you've put into your suggestions for the Necromancer rework. I've taken your input into account and have developed a revised version of the rework. In this updated version, I've included several passive changes to enhance the Necromancer's gameplay experience.

    Passive changes

    Reusable parts >
    • Rank 1: When your Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender dies, the cost of your next Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender is reduced by 25%. Additionally, their effectiveness goes up by 50% on targets under 50% health.

    • Rank 2: When your Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender dies, the cost of your next Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender is reduced by 50%. Moreover, their effectiveness goes up by 100% on targets under 100% health.

    Change notes:
    >
    The recent adjustment to the "Reusable Parts" passive ability was implemented to address the need for improved synergy and strategic depth within the Necromancer's skill set. Notably, the Necromancer currently lacks an execute ability comparable to those of other classes and skills in the game, which has led to a disparity in certain combat scenarios. This change aims to bridge that gap and help bring the Necromancer up to par with the fast-paced and evolving gameplay mechanics of The Elder Scrolls Online. By enhancing the effectiveness of subsequent summons based on the health of targets, this adjustment offers Necromancer players more versatile and impactful options during combat. The increased cost reduction and effectiveness boost serve to empower players with more dynamic and engaging gameplay, aligning the passive ability with the evolving gameplay mechanics and player preferences.

    Rapid Rot
    >
    Effect
    Rank 1
    Increases your damage done with damage over time effects by 15%.

    Rank 2
    Increases your damage done with damage over time effects by 30%.

    Change Notes:
    The adjustment to the "Rapid Rot" passive ability was introduced to enhance the potency and effectiveness of damage over time (DoT) effects within the Necromancer's arsenal. By increasing the damage output from DoT effects, this change aims to provide Necromancer players with a more competitive edge in sustained combat encounters. As the gameplay landscape continues to evolve, the need for diverse and impactful playstyles has become increasingly apparent. This modification seeks to address that need by empowering Necromancer players to excel in the domain of damage over time effects, thereby promoting a more dynamic and engaging gameplay experience.


    Death's Merchant (Death Gleaning)

    >
    Rank 1: Whenever someone within 28 meters dies while you are in combat, restore 333 Magicka and Stamina.

    Rank 2:Whenever someone within 28 meters dies while you are in combat, restore 666 Magicka and Stamina.

    Change Notes:
    >
    The modification to the "Death Gleaning" ability has been introduced to broaden its scope of effectiveness, allowing Necromancer players to benefit from resource restoration upon any nearby death during combat, rather than exclusively from enemy targets. This adjustment aims to provide a more versatile and inclusive mechanic, enabling Necromancers to efficiently replenish their Magicka and Stamina pools in diverse combat scenarios. By extending the utility of this ability beyond specific enemy interactions, this change seeks to enhance the overall gameplay experience for Necromancer players, fostering a more fluid and responsive resource management system that aligns with the evolving dynamics of gameplay.


    Fangs of Sithis
    Revised Passive Ability (Dismember Original):

    >
    Rank 1: Reap for Sithis, every consumed corpse grants you a stack of Death's Touch for 10 seconds, providing 75 Spell and Physical Penetration.

    Rank 2: Reap for Sithis, every consumed corpse grants you a stack of Death's Touch for 10 seconds, providing 150 Spell and Physical Penetration.

    Change Note:
    >
    The modification from the original "Dismember" passive skill to the new "Fangs of Sithis" passive skill has been implemented to align the Necromancer's mechanics with the corpse-consuming aspect, thereby creating a more cohesive and thematic synergy within the class. By integrating the Spell and Physical Penetration bonuses with the "Fangs of Sithis" skill, this alteration aims to enhance the relevance and utility of corpse consumption, offering a more immersive and engaging gameplay experience for Necromancer players. Additionally, this change is intended to introduce a more dynamic and versatile mechanic that complements the evolving dynamics of combat and resource management, thereby enriching the overall gameplay experience within The Elder Scrolls Online.

    I'll update this post with the revised rework. Please share, vote and like the thread to show support to the necormancer being changed in a more thoughtful and impactful way.
    Edited by Grandsheba on February 7, 2024 8:49PM
    "The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."
  • Grim_Overlord
    Grim_Overlord
    ✭✭✭
    Grandsheba wrote: »
    A lot of really strong ideas here, especially regarding the sad state of the transformation, but I think we can go even further in re-envisioning what the Necromancer could be. >
    While many of the skills in the Necromancer's kit competed with Sorcerer's for least used until they themselves got a rework this patch, the passives in Necro's kit are equally underwhelming at this stage in the game's life.

    Starting with Bone Tyrant, Death Gleaning and Disdain Harm are admittedly solid passives, though given the requirement for Death Gleaning is the death of an enemy, it could do away with the requirement of having a Bone Tyrant ability slotted or at least have it active so long as one is slotted on either bar. Health Avarice and Last Gasp however are extremely underwhelming for the skill point investment. Health Avarice is nice for tanking, but given it only gives that benefit when Bone Tyrant skills are on a bar, this passive ought to also give the 1250 health that Last Gasp gives on top of that. In essence, Health Avarice and Last Gasp should be combined into Health Avarice's effect as 1250 health isn't worth 2 skill points since the buff to everyone's base health. It is still nice to have in the Necromancer's kit, but it shouldn't be its own perk. This then frees up Last Gasp to have a unique effect and is a place for Necromancer to bring some unique group utility at long last! Last Gasp then could make it so that dealing damage with a Necromancer ability applies "Minor Susceptibility" to the damaged target(aoe abilities would only apply it to the first target hit or the closest damaged enemy without the debuff already) for 6 seconds, increasing the chance them being afflicted with a Status Effect by 100%. Last Gasp could also increase the damage of your Diseased and Overcharged status effects(or whatever damage types become most common in a Necromancer's kit, I just feel that disease and magic fit best, though I also understand if only one of these gets the buff) by 428(or whatever Warden's buff to chilled currently is on PTS). This effect would scale off your highest offensive stats. This might be overtuned given the changes to Statuses seen this PTS cycle, but this was an idea I had a few years ago and still feel that, even if the numbers need changing, at its core adheres to the theme of the Necromancer and the name "Last Gasp." With the changes to statuses, I think this is the perfect time for such a debuff to be added to the game through Necromancer's kit as it isn't overpowered but would be desired in most groups.

    The Living Death passives are honestly all perfectly fine and help create the tanky nature Necromancers have come to embody in PVE and PVP. The only changes I would advocate for would be to add "Increases the duration of corpses generated from skills you cast by 100%" to help with the issue of not having enough corpses to make skills useful in fights without adds as well as helping with Siphon and Coil sometimes failing to cast due to a corpse fading out of existence after it is targeted, though the targeting fixes proposed in this thread would also aid this some. The other change, which again is more for quality of life, is for Undead Confederate to also say "Your mastery over your undead summons allows them to proc item sets and Status effects." As Necromancer summons aren't permanent, they functionally don't act like pets as Scamp, Twilight, or Bear do and as such ought to be able to proc things like any other skill.

    Moving to Grave Lord, Reusable parts is fine; its thematic which is nice and does help with DPS sustain, though does little for other roles. Dismember is also decent, though Penetration is less valuable than when the class came out in 2019. If anything, I would add "and increase your chance of applying a Status Effect to an enemy by 5% for each Negative Effect on them, up to 100%" to stick with the theme of exploiting the decay afflicted on enemies the DOT passive on the class hints at. Speaking of, Rapid Rot is also perfectly fine as it is even at 10% and is the main thing keeping the class going at the moment. The problem passive in this tree is Death Knell, which has been nerfed and buffed on and off again because it takes up a weird amount of Necro's power budget. When parsing, I see my damage go up 8-10k during execute just through this passive alone. However, this makes Necromancer's really weak during fights that aren't pushed straight to execute, but nice to have in complicated execute phases as they can blow through them faster. That being said, I propose altering this ability entirely as it is clearly overly difficult to balance between mildly useless and wildly powerful. Instead, it could increase your Critical Strike Chance and Critical Damage by 1% for each negative effect on an enemy, up to 2% for each Grave Lord ability slotted. This would keep in theme with rotting enemies apart while also giving them a much smoother damage increase as the fight goes on than basically giving guaranteed crit chance during execute. At most, this would give Necromancer's an increase of 12% crit chance and 12% critical damage provided they ran an entire bar of Grave Lord Skills. In reality, this will likely give at most 8% to both as currently most builds run a weapon and guild skill of some kind on their front bars. This is much weaker than the execute passive, but more reliable.

    Anyhow, thanks for reading my long-winded passives post and I hope that these ideas could help the class fall more within the vision of Necromancers as ""Masters of death" who can call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls, weave ghastly spells to harm and heal, and manipulate the dead to empower themselves, damage enemies, and heal allies." I think they also need another summon whose morphs vary between utility and damage, but that is for another post.


    I appreciate the effort you've put into your suggestions for the Necromancer rework. I've taken your input into account and have developed a revised version of the rework. In this updated version, I've included several passive changes to enhance the Necromancer's gameplay experience.

    Passive changes

    Reusable parts >
    • Rank 1: When your Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender dies, the cost of your next Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender is reduced by 25%. Additionally, their effectiveness goes up by 50% on targets under 50% health.

    • Rank 2: When your Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender dies, the cost of your next Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender is reduced by 50%. Moreover, their effectiveness goes up by 100% on targets under 100% health.

    Change notes:
    >
    The recent adjustment to the "Reusable Parts" passive ability was implemented to address the need for improved synergy and strategic depth within the Necromancer's skill set. Notably, the Necromancer currently lacks an execute ability comparable to those of other classes and skills in the game, which has led to a disparity in certain combat scenarios. This change aims to bridge that gap and help bring the Necromancer up to par with the fast-paced and evolving gameplay mechanics of The Elder Scrolls Online. By enhancing the effectiveness of subsequent summons based on the health of targets, this adjustment offers Necromancer players more versatile and impactful options during combat. The increased cost reduction and effectiveness boost serve to empower players with more dynamic and engaging gameplay, aligning the passive ability with the evolving gameplay mechanics and player preferences.

    Rapid Rot
    >
    Effect
    Rank 1
    Increases your damage done with damage over time effects by 15%.

    Rank 2
    Increases your damage done with damage over time effects by 30%.

    Change Notes:
    The adjustment to the "Rapid Rot" passive ability was introduced to enhance the potency and effectiveness of damage over time (DoT) effects within the Necromancer's arsenal. By increasing the damage output from DoT effects, this change aims to provide Necromancer players with a more competitive edge in sustained combat encounters. As the gameplay landscape continues to evolve, the need for diverse and impactful playstyles has become increasingly apparent. This modification seeks to address that need by empowering Necromancer players to excel in the domain of damage over time effects, thereby promoting a more dynamic and engaging gameplay experience.


    Death's Merchant (Death Gleaning)

    >
    Rank 1: Whenever someone within 28 meters dies while you are in combat, restore 333 Magicka and Stamina.

    Rank 2:Whenever someone within 28 meters dies while you are in combat, restore 666 Magicka and Stamina.

    Change Notes:
    >
    The modification to the "Death Gleaning" ability has been introduced to broaden its scope of effectiveness, allowing Necromancer players to benefit from resource restoration upon any nearby death during combat, rather than exclusively from enemy targets. This adjustment aims to provide a more versatile and inclusive mechanic, enabling Necromancers to efficiently replenish their Magicka and Stamina pools in diverse combat scenarios. By extending the utility of this ability beyond specific enemy interactions, this change seeks to enhance the overall gameplay experience for Necromancer players, fostering a more fluid and responsive resource management system that aligns with the evolving dynamics of gameplay.


    Fangs of Sithis
    Revised Passive Ability (Dismember Original):

    >
    Rank 1: Reap for Sithis, every consumed corpse grants you a stack of Death's Touch for 10 seconds, providing 75 Spell and Physical Penetration.

    Rank 2: Reap for Sithis, every consumed corpse grants you a stack of Death's Touch for 10 seconds, providing 150 Spell and Physical Penetration.

    Change Note:
    >
    The modification from the original "Dismember" passive skill to the new "Fangs of Sithis" passive skill has been implemented to align the Necromancer's mechanics with the corpse-consuming aspect, thereby creating a more cohesive and thematic synergy within the class. By integrating the Spell and Physical Penetration bonuses with the "Fangs of Sithis" skill, this alteration aims to enhance the relevance and utility of corpse consumption, offering a more immersive and engaging gameplay experience for Necromancer players. Additionally, this change is intended to introduce a more dynamic and versatile mechanic that complements the evolving dynamics of combat and resource management, thereby enriching the overall gameplay experience within The Elder Scrolls Online.

    I'll update this post with the revised rework. Please share, vote and like the thread to show support to the necormancer being changed in a more thoughtful and impactful way.

    I like the idea these are headed in, but Rapid Rot being anymore than 10% is going to cause problems as these kinds of buffs in classes never exceed 10%, which is why it was lowered to that number from 15 a few years ago. The change to Death Gleaning working off of allies is interesting, though I am unclear as to why the rename was required. Same goes for the name change on Dismember, though that one feels like a major nerf as it takes 10 corpses to get 10 seconds of the penetration we currently have just for having Blastbones, Mage, or Siphon active.
  • Grandsheba
    Grandsheba
    ✭✭✭
    I like the idea these are headed in, but Rapid Rot being anymore than 10% is going to cause problems as these kinds of buffs in classes never exceed 10%, which is why it was lowered to that number from 15 a few years ago. The change to Death Gleaning working off of allies is interesting, though I am unclear as to why the rename was required. Same goes for the name change on Dismember, though that one feels like a major nerf as it takes 10 corpses to get 10 seconds of the penetration we currently have just for having Blastbones, Mage, or Siphon active.


    The adjustments to Rapid Rot were made following several premature adjustments to the Necromancer class in the past. However, since then, the game and its classes have undergone numerous changes. Other classes have received buffs in their passives that surpass the current state of Necromancer abilities. For instance, the Arcanist class features passives that provide standard buffs of 5%, 10%, and 15%, alongside additional passives with Crux that offer an additional 15%, 99%, 129%, and more. With three Crux generated, Arcanists can gain a 15% weapon/spell damage buff. Additionally, utilizing Arcanist's Domain grants another 15% to weapon and spell damage, resulting in a total increase of 30%. Fate Carver, when combined with Crux alone, provides up to a 99% damage increase. Similarly, Harnessed Quintessence with Hideous Clarity yields a 15% increase in weapon and spell damage, and adding Arcanist's Domain on top further boosts the damage by 15%, totaling a 30% increase.

    The Molten Whip ability further illustrates the disparity. It inflicts 2323 Flame Damage on an enemy target and, if the target is immobile or stunned, sets them Off Balance. With each activation of a different Ardent Flame ability during combat, the user gains a stack of Seething Fury. This increases the damage of the next Molten Whip by 20% and boosts Weapon and Spell Damage by 100 for 15 seconds. These effects stack up to three times, resulting in a total bonus damage of 60% and an additional 300 bonus Weapon and Spell Damage, surpassing anything available in the Necromancer kit without the expressed changes.

    Regarding the Dismember change, while it may initially appear as a nerf, it introduces dynamic gameplay mechanics. Through active play and strategic corpse management, players can accumulate and retain up to 7k or more Penetration. This harmonizes well with the Necrotic Potency changes, enabling Necromancers to leverage souls and corpses more efficiently without disrupting combat flow or losing resources when abilities are on cooldown. The adjustments aim to address one of the major issues with Necromancer—its sluggish pace and restrictive mechanics. Each change is designed to synergize with others, promoting a balanced approach that prevents abuse while requiring skill and strategic thinking inherent to the Necromancer class.

    Additionally, the renaming of certain abilities serves to clarify changes from the original, mitigating confusion and ensuring players understand the adjustments made.
    Edited by Grandsheba on February 10, 2024 12:36PM
    "The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."
  • Grandsheba
    Grandsheba
    ✭✭✭
    To your comment
    I like the idea these are headed in, but Rapid Rot being anymore than 10% is going to cause problems as these kinds of buffs in classes never exceed 10%, which is why it was lowered to that number from 15 a few years ago.

    **The Arcanist** has **Psychic Lesion**:
    - Your attacks wound the mind with heretical knowledge, increasing damage dealt by Status Effects by 15% and Status Effect Chance by 75%.

    **Dragon Knights** possess **Battle Roar**:
    - When you cast an Ultimate ability, you restore 50 Health, 50 Magicka, and 50 Stamina for each point of the Ultimate spent.

    This is its 25k resource return equal to a transformation for vampire. It's a passive that no necro cna compete with with out the expressed changes above.

    **Combustion**:
    - Increases the damage of your Burning and Poisoned status effects by 33%. When you apply Burning to an enemy, you restore 1000 Magicka. When you apply Poisoned to an enemy, you restore 1000 Stamina. These effects can occur once every 3 seconds, individually of each other.

    **World in Ruin**:
    - Increases the damage of your Flame and Poison attacks by 5%.

    **Searing Heat**:
    - Increases the damage over time of your Fiery Breath, Searing Strike, and Dragonknight Standard abilities by 25% and the duration by 4 seconds.

    That's between 58 and 63% bonus from passives alone

    **Templars** benefit from **Light Weaver**:
    - When you heal an ally under 50% Health with a Restoring Light ability, you grant them 2 Ultimate. While you are channeling Rite of Passage, you gain 33,000 Physical and Spell Resistance. Which is a 50% damage mitigation.

    **Nightblades** possess **Shadow Barrier**:
    - Casting a Shadow ability grants you Major Resolve for 6 seconds, increasing your Physical and Spell Resistance by 5948. This duration is increased by 25% for each piece of Heavy Armor equipped.

    A 175% bonus.

    **Master Assassin**:
    - Increases your Physical and Spell Penetration against enemies you are flanking by 2974. Increases the duration of the stun from Sneak by 100%.

    **Sorcerers** have **Daedric Protection**:
    - Increases your Health and Stamina Recovery by 20% while you have a Daedric Summoning ability slotted.

    With the **Fatecarver** skill, the damage per second is approximately 28,689.34. This mechanism is akin to Necromancers', which currently deals 229 damage per second with Tether at base. Casting **Exhausting Fatecarver** consumes all Crux and increases damage done by 33%, duration by 0.3 seconds, and snare by 15% per Crux spent.

    To calculate the total damage and effects of the skill "Exhausting Fatecarver," we'll factor in the specified attributes and modifiers:

    Base damage per hit: 4322
    Base duration: 4.5 seconds
    Snare effect without consuming Crux: 15%

    When consuming 3 Crux, we find:

    - Damage increase with 3 Crux consumed: 99%
    - Total damage increase: 4322 + (4322 x 99%) ≈ 8606.78 per hit
    - Duration increase with 3 Crux consumed: 0.9 seconds
    - Total duration: 4.5 + 0.9 = 5.4 seconds
    - Snare effect increase with 3 Crux consumed: 45%
    - Total snare effect: 15% + 45% = 60%

    Therefore, when consuming 3 Crux, the skill "Exhausting Fatecarver" would deal approximately 8606.78 damage per hit, have a duration of 5.4 seconds, and apply a 60% snare effect to enemies hit.

    To calculate the damage dealt per second:

    - Total damage over 5.4 seconds: 8606.78 (damage per hit) * 18 (hits) ≈ 154920.84
    - Average damage per second: Total damage / Total duration ≈ 154920.84 / 5.4 ≈ 28689.34

    Therefore, when consuming 3 Crux, the skill "Exhausting Fatecarver" would deal approximately 28689.34 damage per second over the extended 5.4-second duration.
    Edited by Grandsheba on February 10, 2024 12:36PM
    "The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."
  • Grim_Overlord
    Grim_Overlord
    ✭✭✭
    You seem to have taken offense somewhere to my criticism of the percentage increase, and I apologize for not articulating my point more clearly. My point was that as Rapid Rot already sat at a higher value and it was nerfed, alongside similar buffs that increase types of damage are mostly sitting around 5 or 10 percent, thinking about Sorcerer's shock and physical boost as well as DK's 5% to poison and flame. I would absolutely LOVE to see a boost to DoT damage on Necromancer at 30%, but I merely doubt that such a thing would happen when the norm seems to be 10% when it comes to generic damage boosts. Even Warden, when moving from a 10% boost to Frost damage gets an extra 10% now for wielding a frost staff. The percentage increases you list above vary from boosts to specific skills based on class or skill mechanics or boosts to defenses, not damage done. The other issue such a boost would create is a lack of buffs elsewhere to the class kit of so much of their damage economy would be bound up in that 30% boost that it would likely lead to what we see on PTS already but in an even more dramatized state, where everyone is running as many non-class DOTs as possible to capitalize on that bonus from the passive and Grave Lord's Sacrifice.

    Regarding the Dismember change again as well, I understand the goal, but penetration isn't as valuable as it is made out to be by that change. While you could get to 7k pen as you stated, how often would that happen? The number of corpses needed would be immense and most likely to occur when fighting trash or in solo arenas in terms of locations where such a thing as that would matter because in dungeons and trials, most of the pen is brought by the tank via Major and Minor Breech, Crusher, Crimson Oath, or even a DPS in Alkosh. The 1500 is more than most Necromancers need in those situations, though it does help. Going back to solo content where it would matter more, you might get a burst of that big pen but it would be very inconsistent as Necromancers do not, even with the other changes proposed in this thread, have the corpse production to support sustaining that much penetration. I could see buffing the flat amount of penetration gotten from the current passive to 2k, but asking Necromancers who already struggle with corpses to now also think about getting at least 10 corpses during bosses, again in solo content here, to maintain the old 1500 penetration they used to have is a huge ask. If it was 1500 per corpse instead of 150, what you are going for might work as well, or even 750 per corpse consumed because it, as you've stated, creates another moment for dynamic corpse management to impact their performance. Right now though, 150 is just far too low to be viable unless at least 10 enemies are dying around you every ten seconds.
  • Grandsheba
    Grandsheba
    ✭✭✭
    You seem to have taken offense somewhere to my criticism of the percentage increase, and I apologize for not articulating my point more clearly. My point was that ...

    Thank you for sharing your insights regarding the proposed adjustments to the Necromancer class. I appreciate your concerns, and I'd like to delve deeper into the mechanics to provide a clearer perspective.

    Firstly, let's address the mechanics of corpse consumption. Necromancers heavily rely on corpse consumption for their skills. This mechanic acts as a cornerstone for their abilities, facilitating the refreshment of passive buffs with each consumption. With Necromancers frequently engaging in corpse consumption during combat, the passive buffs would indeed be refreshed consistently, allowing them to maintain the desired bonuses effectively throughout battles.

    Now, turning to the boost to Rapid Rot, it's crucial to acknowledge the disparity in passive buffs between Necromancers and other classes. While classes like Arcanists, Dragon Knights, Templars, Nightblades, and Sorcerers boast powerful passive buffs for damage, Necromancers primarily rely on their ultimate for damage amplification. Therefore, the adjustment to Rapid Rot aims to address this imbalance by providing Necromancers with a more competitive edge in combat situations.

    Let's take a closer look at some of the examples I've provided. The Arcanist class, for instance, benefits from Psychic Lesion, increasing damage dealt by status effects by 15%. Which can by stacked with their Crux and other passives as well as a 99% damage boost ontop when using theirnfate carver skill.

    Dragon Knights possess 2 pasaives that bring their damage up to 50-60%+ damage boost alone. These passive buffs significantly enhance their damage potential even before considering active skills.

    Contrastingly, Necromancers have limited active damage boosts, primarily relying on their ultimate for damage amplification. Therefore, the adjustment to Rapid Rot seeks to bridge this gap by providing Necromancers with a more substantial passive damage boost, aligning them more closely with other classes in terms of damage potential.

    Moving on to the Dismember change, I understand your concerns about the practicality of maintaining significant penetration levels, particularly in group content. However, the mechanics of corpse consumption offer Necromancers the opportunity to refresh passive buffs, including penetration bonuses, with each consumption. This dynamic gameplay element encourages strategic corpse management and rewards skilled play, enhancing the depth and versatility of the Necromancer class. As a Necromancer player I can attest to the fact that I can constantly maintain my corpes consumption especially if their is a benefit as well as if the changes detailed in this thread are utilized. As all the changes were designed with synergy with one another. For example being able to summon BB even with out a target and being able to detone the BB by recasting allows for corpse consumption. As when a necormancer raise the dead, it becomes a tool to be used for their needs. From other corpes from fallen enemies, allies and summoned minons and abilities, it will be more than enough to stack and refresh when your rotation becomes advanced.

    Lastly, I want to assure you that your feedback is valued and that there's no offense taken whatsoever. Your insights contribute to a constructive discussion aimed at improving the Necromancer class for all players.
    "The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."
  • Grandsheba
    Grandsheba
    ✭✭✭
    You seem to have taken offense somewhere to my criticism of the percentage increase, and I apologize for not articulating my point more clearly.

    Regarding the Dismember change again as well, I understand the goal, but penetration isn't as valuable as it is made out to be by that change. While you could get to 7k pen as you stated, how often would that happen?... 150 is just far too low to be viable unless at least 10 enemies are dying around you every ten seconds.

    In a dungeon in my first mob I went from 4 corpes giving me 600pen for 10 seconds to killing them and getting 19 corpes giving me 3,450pen for 10 seconds. From there I just used my bone armor and ghost to spawn and kill within the 10 seconds to stack more pen and refresh the timer.

    Now admittedly this did become a bit difficult and resource draining especially with the slow casting speed and the 5 seconds to wait until ypu can respawn and generatea corpes. However with some of the skill changes I've made the resource should be managed easier. Never the less, upon further review I've noticed the struggles with maintaining it. I could see raising the duration to 15 seconds since the timer completely refreshes to 15 however anymore and it would become a balancing issue as there needs to be a risk for this reward to prevent the abuse during gameplay.

    @ZOS_ChrisStrasz , @ZOS_Kevin, @ZOS_BrianWheeler, @ZOS_EricBuhlman, @ZOS_JessicaFolsom and @ZOS_RichLambert what do you think about this?
    Edited by Grandsheba on February 11, 2024 10:42PM
    "The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."
  • Grim_Overlord
    Grim_Overlord
    ✭✭✭
    The issue with the penetration passive isn't the cap, but the average. Now, reading what you have here, it seems to work differently than worded. The duration of 10 seconds read to me as falling off per stack rather than being refreshed, which does change the implementation quite a bit, though honestly given the goal of bridging the power gap between the classes, I'd rather see the 1500 pen left alone and add to it your stacking concept but with Weapon and Spell damage rather than the capped stat of penetration. Having the passive give pen and then also a stacking Weapon and Spell damage buff, up to 10 perhaps but 150 W/S dmg per stack could be interesting.

    I also agree that compared to other classes their damage is sorely lacking. As someone who has played a Necromancer in PVE since its inception, the constant nerfing of its damage is very much felt. However, I just feel that giving them something more engaging, such as the corpse mechanics discussed for the Dismember change, would give them a more varied form of power in their kit. Allotting so much of their damage economy into one passive just feels uninspired when instead, Rapid Rot could be left at 10% and other buffs could be placed elsewhere, such as increased damage and application chance for Diseased status effect or extra benefits against enemies with statuses on them.
  • Grandsheba
    Grandsheba
    ✭✭✭
    The issue with the penetration passive isn't the cap, but the average. Now, reading what you have here, it seems to work differently than worded.....
    I also agree that compared to other classes their damage is sorely lacking. As

    While I value your perspective, it's essential to consider the potential balance implications of any proposed changes to Necromancer abilities. Introducing additional bonuses such as weapon and spell damage alongside penetration could indeed present challenges in maintaining balance within the game's mechanics. Increasing Rapid Rot, however, offers a strategic avenue to enhance DPS through impactful damage over time effects and the gradual buildup of corpse-related damage bonuses.

    By augmenting Rapid Rot, we aim to address the disparity in class performance by providing Necromancers with consistent access to penetration improvements without solely relying on Grave Lord skills. This parallels the continuous elemental bonuses enjoyed by Dragon Knights and Wardens, ensuring that Necromancers can benefit from their passive mechanics without depleting precious resources.

    Balancing the potency of skills and passives is crucial to avoid confusion and maintain a fair gameplay experience. Our goal is to preserve the uniqueness of the Necromancer class while optimizing the utility of corpse and soul consumption mechanics. Implementing a non-capped stacking system for penetration bonuses, coupled with manageable stack durations and moderate values, ensures versatility across all roles and encourages diverse playstyles.

    This approach not only distinguishes Necromancers from other classes but also underscores the strategic depth and creativity inherent in their gameplay mechanics. By fostering a symbiotic relationship between resource management and combat effectiveness, we aim to empower Necromancer players to explore new tactical possibilities while maintaining balance within the broader game environment.

    Your insights are invaluable in shaping these discussions, and I appreciate your dedication to refining the Necromancer class for all players.
    "The Tower touches all the mantles of Heaven and by its apex one can be as he will. Be as he was and yet changed for all else on that path for those that walk after. This is [CHIM] the secret of how mortals become makers, and makers back to mortals."
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