My thoughts on TESO after playing BG3

Mesite

I played BG1 and BG2 loads, but when they said BG3 was like Divinity Original Sin 2 I didn't bother because I didn't enjoy OS2. Once I played Morrowind I think I moved onto Elder Scrolls and lost interest in Balder's Gate.

Vevvev

ArchMikem wrote: »

Isn't Baldur's Gate a Top Down turn based?

Yes and no.

While the camera is in the sky it can zoom in and angle itself to the side, and the game has real time and turn based modes. Real time is good for getting around the world, but when combat begins the game enters turn based mode to give you a way to judge the situation and plan. While you can enable real time in combat it's generally speaking an incredibly bad idea with how the game mechanics work as you have to control everything individually XD.
Every second or so in real time mode is a turn for the purposes of buff timers and calculations in that game.

Hurbster

Yeah, you can muck about with the camera quite a bit.

Both shots are incredibly early on so no spoilers.



Cutscene (in-game).



This, Starfield and Alan Wake 2, along with the Cyberpunk expansion have me sorted until at least the New Year, then I'll wait to see what the new Chapter is all about while I get stuck into Rogue Trader.

With all that going on it's difficult to find time to play an MMO right now, maybe later.

Grianasteri

Completely different types of game, which as a result cannot really be compared in a meaningful way.

BG3 is widely considered as one of the best games of that type that has ever been made, and I agree.

ESO is widely considered as one of the best MMOs ever made, and I agree.

It may be more appropriate to compare BG3 with something like Skyrim/Oblivion etc, if one really wishes to make a comparison. Though again, these are actually different types of game. BG3 has real, in game RP consequences woven into its fabric... the same cannot be said for Skyrim etc.

Wolfchild07

In BG3:

1. Why is there so much RNG? Tabletop never translates well into computer games, and you can just reload the thing.
2. Why do people in an area attack me after I've already been given access by the boss?
3. Why do I start burning when I step on a tiny bit of burning/smoldering wood? (no flames)
4. Why bother with high DC's to force the character to auto-fail?
5. Why so many small burrow holes, when I'm not gonna waste a shapeshifting slot on a disgusting cat?
6. Why so many aggravating conversations that make me want to kill the people talking to me? (I always kill Astarion)
7. Why is there so much annoying micro-management of inventory?
8. Why is there so much interactable, useless junk?
9. Why is there so much 'disadvantage' in combat so the characters hardly ever hit anything?
10. Why am I always thrown into conversations with people when I'm not ready?

There's more, but I can't be bothered.

Warhawke_80

EdjeSwift wrote: »

I'm a huge fan of the Forgotten Realms and thusly had a strong interest in BG3, I had played BG1, BG2, and their expansions extensively and Neverwinter to boot.

That said, there's a strong reason I'm here playing ESO in my free time instead of BG3.

BG3 was quite underwhelming as a whole. Started off strong but fizzled out near the end. ESO may be the same gameplay/story I've played for nearly a decade, but it's still engaging enough that I can enjoy a new character/path while BG3 just felt like I had 3 major decisions to make outside of romance and that was it. As for wanting stuff from BG3 into this game, I understand that coding and engines limit a lot so I'm just here to enjoy the game, but if there is one thing I wouldn't mind, it's a little romance for the vestige.

This is right on...

in BG1 & 2, and Icewind Dale I felt like I was not only playing D&D but I was in the Forgotten Realms...I never once felt either of those in BG3.

Grianasteri

Wolfchild07 wrote: »

In BG3:

1. Why is there so much RNG? Tabletop never translates well into computer games, and you can just reload the thing.
2. Why do people in an area attack me after I've already been given access by the boss?
3. Why do I start burning when I step on a tiny bit of burning/smoldering wood? (no flames)
4. Why bother with high DC's to force the character to auto-fail?
5. Why so many small burrow holes, when I'm not gonna waste a shapeshifting slot on a disgusting cat?
6. Why so many aggravating conversations that make me want to kill the people talking to me? (I always kill Astarion)
7. Why is there so much annoying micro-management of inventory?
8. Why is there so much interactable, useless junk?
9. Why is there so much 'disadvantage' in combat so the characters hardly ever hit anything?
10. Why am I always thrown into conversations with people when I'm not ready?

There's more, but I can't be bothered.

A LOT of the "issues" listed, are actually learn to play issues.

For instance, no#9 as one an example. There are a wide range of ways you can gain "advantage" in combat situations and learning how to do so, in different situations, with different characters/classes/builds, is part of the game. I do admit it can be frustrating.

Beyond learning to play, it does not really sound like RPG games like BG3, are for you. Which is fine.

DrNukenstein

Game totally crutches on it's cut scenes. Like half the play through time is just watching cut scenes.

In these cut scenes, my character would frequently make guitarist-slug faces. Which made it very difficult to take the dialogue seriously.



Like I kind of get what the AAA devs were saying. If RPGs as a genre choose to crutch on cut scenes to that degree, that will cut into the quality of the game otherwise.

Then get to the end, and try to simp for the story.

TaSheen

Personally, I don't like games with cutscenes. Not at all.

rpa

I'm not that much into turn based games (I think last one I played extensively was Ultima IV at early stone age) and I strongly dislike cutscenes. I may give it a try in few years when the version with all updates is very heavily discounted at GOG but it's not at all on top of my shopping list.

FluffyBird

DrNukenstein wrote: »

Game totally crutches on it's cut scenes. Like half the play through time is just watching cut scenes.

Maybe if you rush the story and count all the dialogue scenes. Because there's really few actual cutscenes that are not just dialogue with something happening. I know, because my PC chokes on those.
But it definitely is dialogue-heavy.

Also, it's kind of funny, how in BG3 there is actually something wrong in out head, but, unlike ESO, being an idiot in dialogues is a conscious choice one can make.

TheImperfect

I love both games a lot but they are different things. If ESO can take good ideas from BG3 and apply them in an ESO way then fine but ESO is great already.

notyuu

No offence OP but your topic might as well read "My thoughts on apples are eating an orange"

the only thing that ESO and BG3 have in common is that they are both videogames.
other than that they are both different genres with different play styles from different generations with vastly differet lore and different budgets with different target audiences and were made by companies with vastly different policies

sure there's a few neat things in BG3 that eso could learn from but honestly don't get your hopes up over it happening

MudcrabAttack

Whenever ES6 comes out in 2050 (just joking I hope) I wonder if ESO would still exist in one form or another. It would be fun if they swapped engines to whatever ES6 uses, add in corpse carrying and toilets

p_tsakirisb16_ESO

LunaFlora wrote: »

same developers yes, but no.
Baldur's gate 3 is dungeons and dragons Forgotten Realms

You keep repeating the same mistake 3+ times.
It is FORGOTTEN REALMS.

kyatos_binarini

The only thing that confused me after bg3 - low quality of graphic and npcs mimics. It was like play TES3 after TES5

Lumsdenml

MrGarlic wrote: »

You really should be comparing BG3 with whatever comes next, not that which has passed.

Compare it with ESO2, if it ever happens.

Well, zos is working on a new mmo... have been for a couple years now...

JemadarofCaerSalis

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

same developers yes, but no.
Baldur's gate 3 is dungeons and dragons Forgotten Realms

You keep repeating the same mistake 3+ times.
It is FORGOTTEN REALMS.

Actually Forgotten Realms is part of the Dungeons and Dragons' fantasy role playing setting.

TaSheen

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

same developers yes, but no.
Baldur's gate 3 is dungeons and dragons Forgotten Realms

You keep repeating the same mistake 3+ times.
It is FORGOTTEN REALMS.

Actually Forgotten Realms is part of the Dungeons and Dragons' fantasy role playing setting.

This. Ed Greenwood was the originator of D&D scenarios set in the Forgotten Realms (a world of his own making to begin with though IIRC others in the various companies did add to the lore and available playable scenarios).

The orignal D&D was a generalized framework for people to use to work up their own worlds and scenarios. I did quite a bit of that myself back in the mid-70s, creating scenarios in my own worlds for my daughter and her friends from school. In the late 80s, with the kids off to college, I found the Forgotten Realms CRPGs, the Gold Box games from SSI - and that was when I discovered not only computers and CRPGs, but building my own machines.

Been an interesting hobby for a LOT of years now (got my first machine in 1985, built my first one in about 1988).

JemadarofCaerSalis

TaSheen wrote: »

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

same developers yes, but no.
Baldur's gate 3 is dungeons and dragons Forgotten Realms

You keep repeating the same mistake 3+ times.
It is FORGOTTEN REALMS.

Actually Forgotten Realms is part of the Dungeons and Dragons' fantasy role playing setting.

This. Ed Greenwood was the originator of D&D scenarios set in the Forgotten Realms (a world of his own making to begin with though IIRC others in the various companies did add to the lore and available playable scenarios).

The orignal D&D was a generalized framework for people to use to work up their own worlds and scenarios. I did quite a bit of that myself back in the mid-70s, creating scenarios in my own worlds for my daughter and her friends from school. In the late 80s, with the kids off to college, I found the Forgotten Realms CRPGs, the Gold Box games from SSI - and that was when I discovered not only computers and CRPGs, but building my own machines.

Been an interesting hobby for a LOT of years now (got my first machine in 1985, built my first one in about 1988).

Yeah I just read a bit of that, and I grew up reading Forgotten Realms and playing those games. D&D tends to, if I recall correctly, refer to the ruleset of the fantasy settings rather than being its own distinct fantasy setting. (though I have never actually played the table top game, only games based around the rulesets)

TaSheen

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

same developers yes, but no.
Baldur's gate 3 is dungeons and dragons Forgotten Realms

You keep repeating the same mistake 3+ times.
It is FORGOTTEN REALMS.

Actually Forgotten Realms is part of the Dungeons and Dragons' fantasy role playing setting.

This. Ed Greenwood was the originator of D&D scenarios set in the Forgotten Realms (a world of his own making to begin with though IIRC others in the various companies did add to the lore and available playable scenarios).

The orignal D&D was a generalized framework for people to use to work up their own worlds and scenarios. I did quite a bit of that myself back in the mid-70s, creating scenarios in my own worlds for my daughter and her friends from school. In the late 80s, with the kids off to college, I found the Forgotten Realms CRPGs, the Gold Box games from SSI - and that was when I discovered not only computers and CRPGs, but building my own machines.

Been an interesting hobby for a LOT of years now (got my first machine in 1985, built my first one in about 1988).

Yeah I just read a bit of that, and I grew up reading Forgotten Realms and playing those games. D&D tends to, if I recall correctly, refer to the ruleset of the fantasy settings rather than being its own distinct fantasy setting. (though I have never actually played the table top game, only games based around the rulesets)

Yes, that's the "ruleset" (though I've never used anything past AD&D first edition or whatever it was called originally) - and the later ones seem to have branched rather far from the tree, according to my Austrian friend who still uses one of the earlier editions (3 maybe? not sure).

I really enjoyed the FR novels as well as the games - my first game was Pools of Radiance. I actually still know where all the good loot is, and how to live over all the orcs in that temple on an island in a river....

JemadarofCaerSalis

TaSheen wrote: »

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

same developers yes, but no.
Baldur's gate 3 is dungeons and dragons Forgotten Realms

You keep repeating the same mistake 3+ times.
It is FORGOTTEN REALMS.

Actually Forgotten Realms is part of the Dungeons and Dragons' fantasy role playing setting.

This. Ed Greenwood was the originator of D&D scenarios set in the Forgotten Realms (a world of his own making to begin with though IIRC others in the various companies did add to the lore and available playable scenarios).

The orignal D&D was a generalized framework for people to use to work up their own worlds and scenarios. I did quite a bit of that myself back in the mid-70s, creating scenarios in my own worlds for my daughter and her friends from school. In the late 80s, with the kids off to college, I found the Forgotten Realms CRPGs, the Gold Box games from SSI - and that was when I discovered not only computers and CRPGs, but building my own machines.

Been an interesting hobby for a LOT of years now (got my first machine in 1985, built my first one in about 1988).

Yeah I just read a bit of that, and I grew up reading Forgotten Realms and playing those games. D&D tends to, if I recall correctly, refer to the ruleset of the fantasy settings rather than being its own distinct fantasy setting. (though I have never actually played the table top game, only games based around the rulesets)

Yes, that's the "ruleset" (though I've never used anything past AD&D first edition or whatever it was called originally) - and the later ones seem to have branched rather far from the tree, according to my Austrian friend who still uses one of the earlier editions (3 maybe? not sure).

I really enjoyed the FR novels as well as the games - my first game was Pools of Radiance. I actually still know where all the good loot is, and how to live over all the orcs in that temple on an island in a river....

I have that book somewhere... and I think I may have that game on a DVD though whether it would actually play on my computer is a different question altogether. May even have it on GoG, but not sure... Along with the other games in that general series. I had a forgotten realms archive DVD of games that had a great many of those old games. Sadly a lot of them are *too* old for me now, I have gotten spoiled by luxuries such as maps, and journals.

But yeah, I have boxes and boxes of forgotten realms books, both my dad and I loved them (though I sort of liked Dragonlance a bit better, except for the ending)

TaSheen

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

same developers yes, but no.
Baldur's gate 3 is dungeons and dragons Forgotten Realms

You keep repeating the same mistake 3+ times.
It is FORGOTTEN REALMS.

Actually Forgotten Realms is part of the Dungeons and Dragons' fantasy role playing setting.

This. Ed Greenwood was the originator of D&D scenarios set in the Forgotten Realms (a world of his own making to begin with though IIRC others in the various companies did add to the lore and available playable scenarios).

The orignal D&D was a generalized framework for people to use to work up their own worlds and scenarios. I did quite a bit of that myself back in the mid-70s, creating scenarios in my own worlds for my daughter and her friends from school. In the late 80s, with the kids off to college, I found the Forgotten Realms CRPGs, the Gold Box games from SSI - and that was when I discovered not only computers and CRPGs, but building my own machines.

Been an interesting hobby for a LOT of years now (got my first machine in 1985, built my first one in about 1988).

Yeah I just read a bit of that, and I grew up reading Forgotten Realms and playing those games. D&D tends to, if I recall correctly, refer to the ruleset of the fantasy settings rather than being its own distinct fantasy setting. (though I have never actually played the table top game, only games based around the rulesets)

Yes, that's the "ruleset" (though I've never used anything past AD&D first edition or whatever it was called originally) - and the later ones seem to have branched rather far from the tree, according to my Austrian friend who still uses one of the earlier editions (3 maybe? not sure).

I really enjoyed the FR novels as well as the games - my first game was Pools of Radiance. I actually still know where all the good loot is, and how to live over all the orcs in that temple on an island in a river....

I have that book somewhere... and I think I may have that game on a DVD though whether it would actually play on my computer is a different question altogether. May even have it on GoG, but not sure... Along with the other games in that general series. I had a forgotten realms archive DVD of games that had a great many of those old games. Sadly a lot of them are *too* old for me now, I have gotten spoiled by luxuries such as maps, and journals.

But yeah, I have boxes and boxes of forgotten realms books, both my dad and I loved them (though I sort of liked Dragonlance a bit better, except for the ending)

Oh, I loved Dragonlance too, and the Icewind Dale ones, and the first Neverwinter one; also Menzoberranzan and the Drow ones, Savage Frontier, the Beholder ones. Loved them all.... played them so many times.

And then - in 1994.... I discovered The Elder Scrolls: Arena. And TES is my real home universe now.

JemadarofCaerSalis

TaSheen wrote: »

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

same developers yes, but no.
Baldur's gate 3 is dungeons and dragons Forgotten Realms

You keep repeating the same mistake 3+ times.
It is FORGOTTEN REALMS.

Actually Forgotten Realms is part of the Dungeons and Dragons' fantasy role playing setting.

This. Ed Greenwood was the originator of D&D scenarios set in the Forgotten Realms (a world of his own making to begin with though IIRC others in the various companies did add to the lore and available playable scenarios).

The orignal D&D was a generalized framework for people to use to work up their own worlds and scenarios. I did quite a bit of that myself back in the mid-70s, creating scenarios in my own worlds for my daughter and her friends from school. In the late 80s, with the kids off to college, I found the Forgotten Realms CRPGs, the Gold Box games from SSI - and that was when I discovered not only computers and CRPGs, but building my own machines.

Been an interesting hobby for a LOT of years now (got my first machine in 1985, built my first one in about 1988).

Yeah I just read a bit of that, and I grew up reading Forgotten Realms and playing those games. D&D tends to, if I recall correctly, refer to the ruleset of the fantasy settings rather than being its own distinct fantasy setting. (though I have never actually played the table top game, only games based around the rulesets)

Yes, that's the "ruleset" (though I've never used anything past AD&D first edition or whatever it was called originally) - and the later ones seem to have branched rather far from the tree, according to my Austrian friend who still uses one of the earlier editions (3 maybe? not sure).

I really enjoyed the FR novels as well as the games - my first game was Pools of Radiance. I actually still know where all the good loot is, and how to live over all the orcs in that temple on an island in a river....

I have that book somewhere... and I think I may have that game on a DVD though whether it would actually play on my computer is a different question altogether. May even have it on GoG, but not sure... Along with the other games in that general series. I had a forgotten realms archive DVD of games that had a great many of those old games. Sadly a lot of them are *too* old for me now, I have gotten spoiled by luxuries such as maps, and journals.

But yeah, I have boxes and boxes of forgotten realms books, both my dad and I loved them (though I sort of liked Dragonlance a bit better, except for the ending)

Oh, I loved Dragonlance too, and the Icewind Dale ones, and the first Neverwinter one; also Menzoberranzan and the Drow ones, Savage Frontier, the Beholder ones. Loved them all.... played them so many times.

And then - in 1994.... I discovered The Elder Scrolls: Arena. And TES is my real home universe now.

I never got to finish Menzoberranzan, and I loved NwN, though I never g ot to finish 2 (bugs)

I tried Arena back in the day, but never got into it that much (still remember those first sewers and rats though), for me it was Morrowind. Once I played MW, I was hooked.

TaSheen

Oh, and then there was Undermountain. That game was supposed to be so buggy you couldn't finish it. I'm the only one I know who never had any bugs in it.... but then, I very seldom have bugs in games.

Morrowind was my least favorite of the ES single player titles - I'm just not a Dunmer fan, never have been. Redguards, Bretons, Bosmer, Imperials, Khajiit - those races are my go tos.

JemadarofCaerSalis

TaSheen wrote: »

Oh, and then there was Undermountain. That game was supposed to be so buggy you couldn't finish it. I'm the only one I know who never had any bugs in it.... but then, I very seldom have bugs in games.

Morrowind was my least favorite of the ES single player titles - I'm just not a Dunmer fan, never have been. Redguards, Bretons, Bosmer, Imperials, Khajiit - those races are my go tos.

*gasp* I am not sure I can continue talking to you if you didn't like MW....

At the time I hadn't really put two and two together and came up with Arena was the same universe as MW, so I went into it rather blind and didn't really know anything about the races.

For me, I would say Oblivon was my least favorite. I loved Martin and the main quest (with one obvious exception), but for the rest, I have a hard time remembering the specifics about the places and most of the people in it.

I usually don't run into bugs, but occasionally I have, and sadly a lot of them are usually game stoppers. (or 'oh no you have to go back 7 hours and redo everything to get to this point).

TaSheen

Well, a series like TES will have people who love or hate some of the games. My sister loves Skyrim, but the rest of them are just not her cuppa (she did play Oblivion but not all the way through). I never finished Morrowind, it was just too much; not just the Dunmer, but the Morag Tong - that's a kind of content I never play in any game - which leads me to say that my absolute favorite NPC in ESO is.... Elam Drals.... I know, how weird, right? But his patented brand of snark is pretty much just like my own....

JemadarofCaerSalis

TaSheen wrote: »

Well, a series like TES will have people who love or hate some of the games. My sister loves Skyrim, but the rest of them are just not her cuppa (she did play Oblivion but not all the way through). I never finished Morrowind, it was just too much; not just the Dunmer, but the Morag Tong - that's a kind of content I never play in any game - which leads me to say that my absolute favorite NPC in ESO is.... Elam Drals.... I know, how weird, right? But his patented brand of snark is pretty much just like my own....

I haven't played the Dark Brotherhood in this game, and usually that is one of the last factions I play, and usually only because they give good rewards. I did like Elam from what I saw of him in Blackwood. It just isn't usually my type of content either.

Still have to do the murkmire content as well.

I liked morrowind because it was fresh (at the time) and it had soooo much to collect and it allowed me to collect and display what I collected. I also got into the modding aspect a great deal.

Cirran

Baldur's Gate 3 is just Divinity Original Sin with a VERY thin coat of D&D thrown on it.

It does not feel anything like the original Baldur's Gate games.

It has all the hallmarks of a Larian Studios game.

Extreme Edge Lord story.

Horribly annoying companions.

Tedious, boring and pointless mechanics.

Cirran

TaSheen

Well, after Morrowind, when I got to Skyrim, I blew off the TG (don't like that either), and blew away the DB. I would have loved for ESO to have offered "get rid of the TG and DB", but no such luck.

Yeah. I'm a goody two-shoes. The farthest off chaotic good I ever get is slanting marginally toward chaotic neutral. To balance the "no I don't play evil" thing, I also don't play lawful anything, even good or neutral.