New Endeavor Activity Types?
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Necrotech_Master✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Necrotech_Master wrote: »I_killed_Vivec wrote: »We are adding additional endeavors to the pool of existing endeavors.
Oh, indeed, but still only selecting 5 each day, and three for the weeklies.
So instead of "kill a boss in a public dungeon", today we had the replacement, sorry... addition: "kill a boss in a public dungeon in Blackwood".
Not only is that more specific, and so more restrictive, as an individual endeavour, it also requires DLC ownership.
Adding to the pool but not increasing the number of options is more restrictive. ZoS knows it. We know it. Kevin knows it...
And I pity him for having to perpetuate the lie that ZoS is somehow adding "more diverse ways" of earning seals, when really they are more restrictive.
they have already had those types for awhile even before this current update
i think even just last week before the update there were a few days with "kill public dungeon bosses in a particular zone"
i agree that it will get annoying for newer endeavors if they all the sudden start requiring guild members in group to complete though, but im all for new endeavors with additional activities such as playing tribute
Or fishing...
if they did do a fishing endeavor, it might give me a reason to put more effort to continue working on the fishing achievements lol, still missing almost all dlc zones because with the current fishing mechanics not something i enjoy doing for long periods or frequentlyplays PC/NA
handle @Necrotech_Master
active player since april 2014
i have my main house (grand topal hideaway) listed in the housing tours, it has multiple target dummies, scribing altar, and grandmaster stations (in progress being filled out), as well as almost every antiquity furnishing on display to preview them
feel free to stop by and use the facilities1 -
Btoop✭✭✭✭Before now I would have been all for a new fishing endeavor...
Too bad ZOS are clearly more interested in moving endeavors in the direction of being more time consuming in an attempt to discourage actually doing them. Likely meaning we'd have to catch a mind numbing amount of fish if they did add such an endeavor.2 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Before now I would have been all for a new fishing endeavor...
Too bad ZOS are clearly more interested in moving endeavors in the direction of being more time consuming in an attempt to discourage actually doing them. Likely meaning we'd have to catch a mind numbing amount of fish if they did add such an endeavor.
They'd also probably specify the fishing node and require you to do it with a guildmate.14 -
dcrush✭✭✭✭✭Before now I would have been all for a new fishing endeavor...
Too bad ZOS are clearly more interested in moving endeavors in the direction of being more time consuming in an attempt to discourage actually doing them. Likely meaning we'd have to catch a mind numbing amount of fish if they did add such an endeavor.
They'd also probably specify the fishing node and require you to do it with a guildmate.
“Catch three blue fish from a foul fishing hole in Auridon while grouped with a guild mate below level 50 who you have been in the same guild with for at least six months.”
Maybe I shouldn’t be giving them ideas…18 -
I_killed_Vivec✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I_killed_Vivec wrote: »We are adding additional endeavors to the pool of existing endeavors.
Oh, indeed, but still only selecting 5 each day, and three for the weeklies.
So instead of "kill a boss in a public dungeon", today we had the replacement, sorry... addition: "kill a boss in a public dungeon in Blackwood".
Not only is that more specific, and so more restrictive, as an individual endeavour, it also requires DLC ownership.
Adding to the pool but not increasing the number of options is more restrictive. ZoS knows it. We know it. Kevin knows it...
And I pity him for having to perpetuate the lie that ZoS is somehow adding "more diverse ways" of earning seals, when really they are more restrictive.
According to @BenevolentBowd 's wonderful website that tracks this,
"Kill 3 Public Dungeon Bosses in Blackwood NEW (15 Seals + 1500g)" first appeared on July 7, 2022.
was lowered to "Kill 2 Public Dungeon Bosses in Blackwood (15 Seals)" on December 19, 2022
and is now lowered to "Kill 1 Public Dungeon Boss in Blackwood (15 Seals of Endeavor / 1,500 Experience points)"
Endeavors have always had tasks that required DLC ownership, not many, but it's not new.
I apologize for the poor example, but the examples from the PTS were even more specific, and even involved doing specific dungeons with a guildmate.
While it is true that if you have "do a dungeon" and you add "do a specific dungeon" and "do a specific dungeon with a guildmate" then you are clearly adding options, it's just that the new ones are more restrictive than the ones they potentially replace.
If they really wanted to give more options then instead of offering three of five it could be three of seven - that would actually give choice.
ZoS is using weasel words to make things look better, when it is clear they are worse.20 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I_killed_Vivec wrote: »I_killed_Vivec wrote: »We are adding additional endeavors to the pool of existing endeavors.
Oh, indeed, but still only selecting 5 each day, and three for the weeklies.
So instead of "kill a boss in a public dungeon", today we had the replacement, sorry... addition: "kill a boss in a public dungeon in Blackwood".
Not only is that more specific, and so more restrictive, as an individual endeavour, it also requires DLC ownership.
Adding to the pool but not increasing the number of options is more restrictive. ZoS knows it. We know it. Kevin knows it...
And I pity him for having to perpetuate the lie that ZoS is somehow adding "more diverse ways" of earning seals, when really they are more restrictive.
According to @BenevolentBowd 's wonderful website that tracks this,
"Kill 3 Public Dungeon Bosses in Blackwood NEW (15 Seals + 1500g)" first appeared on July 7, 2022.
was lowered to "Kill 2 Public Dungeon Bosses in Blackwood (15 Seals)" on December 19, 2022
and is now lowered to "Kill 1 Public Dungeon Boss in Blackwood (15 Seals of Endeavor / 1,500 Experience points)"
Endeavors have always had tasks that required DLC ownership, not many, but it's not new.
I apologize for the poor example, but the examples from the PTS were even more specific, and even involved doing specific dungeons with a guildmate.
While it is true that if you have "do a dungeon" and you add "do a specific dungeon" and "do a specific dungeon with a guildmate" then you are clearly adding options, it's just that the new ones are more restrictive than the ones they potentially replace.
If they really wanted to give more options then instead of offering three of five it could be three of seven - that would actually give choice.
ZoS is using weasel words to make things look better, when it is clear they are worse.
That's not adding options at all, as even with the initial "do a dungeon" the options to do a specific one and/or do it with a guildmate were already open to you. It is actually reducing the options available to you in that particular case, because although it doesn't replace the original Endeavour, adding the restricted one into the rotation reduces the odds and frequency of the unrestricted one being offered.3 -
hmm ok i see, i thought they would implement additional stuff, a way to earn more seals, but they are just replacing old stuff with some more specific tasks...a bit disappointing tbh
thanks for giving me this input
I don't think they are replacing old stuff. Just adding more specific endeaver content in with the random endeaver content.0 -
Btoop✭✭✭✭SithisKhajitiiLamae wrote: »hmm ok i see, i thought they would implement additional stuff, a way to earn more seals, but they are just replacing old stuff with some more specific tasks...a bit disappointing tbh
thanks for giving me this input
I don't think they are replacing old stuff. Just adding more specific endeaver content in with the random endeaver content.
Don't buy into the lie ZOS is pushing.
If they wanted more endeavor variety then they would increase how many endeavours we have to choose from too. Instead these new more limiting and time consuming endeavours replace old ones on a day by day basis, purposefully restricting the amount players can or want to do.14 -
laniakea_0✭✭✭✭I don't know about anyone else but I haven't actually seen any new endeavors yet. could it be that the list with upcoming endeavors are on the weekly or even monthly reset?1 -
SeaGtGruff✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Before now I would have been all for a new fishing endeavor...
Too bad ZOS are clearly more interested in moving endeavors in the direction of being more time consuming in an attempt to discourage actually doing them. Likely meaning we'd have to catch a mind numbing amount of fish if they did add such an endeavor.
They'd also probably specify the fishing node and require you to do it with a guildmate.
“Catch three blue fish from a foul fishing hole in Auridon while grouped with a guild mate below level 50 who you have been in the same guild with for at least six months.”
Maybe I shouldn’t be giving them ideas…
Catch a rare fish in Cyrodiil while sharing the fishing hole with a player from an enemy alliance.I've fought mudcrabs more fearsome than me!4 -
LatentBuzzard✭✭✭✭laniakea_0 wrote: »I don't know about anyone else but I haven't actually seen any new endeavors yet. could it be that the list with upcoming endeavors are on the weekly or even monthly reset?
Remember how endeavours initially gave a load more seals than they do today and then that number was slowly reduced over time ? This is the same tactic in that they don't hit you with all of the bad stuff straight away, they slowly introduce them in the hope that it makes them less noticeable.6 -
Kappachi✭✭✭✭hmm ok i see, i thought they would implement additional stuff, a way to earn more seals, but they are just replacing old stuff with some more specific tasks...a bit disappointing tbh
thanks for giving me this input
Just to clarify here. We are not replacing old stuff. We are adding additional endeavors to the pool of existing endeavors. We outlined this a few weeks back. Here is the quote for reference.We want to stress that the way Endeavors are currently arranged on the PTS is for testing purposes. However, when they are on the live server, they will be curated along with existing Endeavors to ensure there is flexibility in the kinds of Endeavors offered to players of various skill levels. As such, you should not see all five daily Endeavors tied to only completing dungeons, for example.
The same can be said for Endeavors that are tied to specific Chapters or content. The goal is not to make all the Endeavors for the day or week tied to owning a Chapter. The Endeavor changes on the PTS are designed to add more diverse ways to earn Seals on the live server, while also maintaining that everyone has a number of options to do them each day/week while playing the game.
No, I'm sorry but this clarification is just misleading.
These new endeavors do replace old ones as we still only have five to choose from on any given day. If this was really about "Offering you new ways to earn Seals of Endeavor" then we would also have seen the amount of endeavors we have to choose from increased.
These new additions are more time consuming by design and even if the old endeavors are still in rotation, it is clear the intent here is to discourage doing them.
Then why wasn't I confused? When I saw the patch 39 notes both PTR and Live my only thoughts were that we were getting new/different activities for endeavors, and that's exactly what we got, and to me it's a major improvement. I've already seen new ones and it really is refreshing to have new activities to do, hope we see the trial/dungeon ones soon too.
I am so for any of the ones that encourage group play as it's an MMORPG and people need more prodding to group up together, this is not a game meant to be played solo and the revamp of the endeavor system will bring some life back into some of the group content during some days.Edited by Kappachi on August 24, 2023 8:20AM1 -
Btoop✭✭✭✭laniakea_0 wrote: »I don't know about anyone else but I haven't actually seen any new endeavors yet. could it be that the list with upcoming endeavors are on the weekly or even monthly reset?
They are likely waiting and plan on having them slowly show up instead of all at once.
Like gradually boiling a frog, I imagine their expecation is that no one will notice or complain if it is done gradually over time.5 -
Btoop✭✭✭✭hmm ok i see, i thought they would implement additional stuff, a way to earn more seals, but they are just replacing old stuff with some more specific tasks...a bit disappointing tbh
thanks for giving me this input
Just to clarify here. We are not replacing old stuff. We are adding additional endeavors to the pool of existing endeavors. We outlined this a few weeks back. Here is the quote for reference.We want to stress that the way Endeavors are currently arranged on the PTS is for testing purposes. However, when they are on the live server, they will be curated along with existing Endeavors to ensure there is flexibility in the kinds of Endeavors offered to players of various skill levels. As such, you should not see all five daily Endeavors tied to only completing dungeons, for example.
The same can be said for Endeavors that are tied to specific Chapters or content. The goal is not to make all the Endeavors for the day or week tied to owning a Chapter. The Endeavor changes on the PTS are designed to add more diverse ways to earn Seals on the live server, while also maintaining that everyone has a number of options to do them each day/week while playing the game.
No, I'm sorry but this clarification is just misleading.
These new endeavors do replace old ones as we still only have five to choose from on any given day. If this was really about "Offering you new ways to earn Seals of Endeavor" then we would also have seen the amount of endeavors we have to choose from increased.
These new additions are more time consuming by design and even if the old endeavors are still in rotation, it is clear the intent here is to discourage doing them.
Then why wasn't I confused? When I saw the patch 39 notes both PTR and Live my only thoughts were that we were getting new/different activities for endeavors, and that's exactly what we got, and to me it's a major improvement. I've already seen new ones and it really is refreshing to have new activities to do, hope we see the trial/dungeon ones soon too.
I am so for any of the ones that encourage group play as it's an MMORPG and people need more prodding to group up together, this is not a game meant to be played solo and the revamp of the endeavor system will bring some life back into some of the group content during some days.
Again, if they were adding both new endeavors and more endeavors to choose from then yes, this could be considered ZOS encouraging people to do other forms of content. This isn't that though.
It is no coincidence that these new endeavors are both more time consuming and limited in terms of what is required for them. The real intent behind all of this can be seen from lighyears away.
By all means you can enjoy the content that the new endeavors has had you doing but they are still arguably too constricting for the type of activity that should be quickly completable as a part of a daily task - and this is unfortunetly by design.Edited by Btoop on August 24, 2023 8:47AM6 -
Kappachi✭✭✭✭hmm ok i see, i thought they would implement additional stuff, a way to earn more seals, but they are just replacing old stuff with some more specific tasks...a bit disappointing tbh
thanks for giving me this input
Just to clarify here. We are not replacing old stuff. We are adding additional endeavors to the pool of existing endeavors. We outlined this a few weeks back. Here is the quote for reference.We want to stress that the way Endeavors are currently arranged on the PTS is for testing purposes. However, when they are on the live server, they will be curated along with existing Endeavors to ensure there is flexibility in the kinds of Endeavors offered to players of various skill levels. As such, you should not see all five daily Endeavors tied to only completing dungeons, for example.
The same can be said for Endeavors that are tied to specific Chapters or content. The goal is not to make all the Endeavors for the day or week tied to owning a Chapter. The Endeavor changes on the PTS are designed to add more diverse ways to earn Seals on the live server, while also maintaining that everyone has a number of options to do them each day/week while playing the game.
No, I'm sorry but this clarification is just misleading.
These new endeavors do replace old ones as we still only have five to choose from on any given day. If this was really about "Offering you new ways to earn Seals of Endeavor" then we would also have seen the amount of endeavors we have to choose from increased.
These new additions are more time consuming by design and even if the old endeavors are still in rotation, it is clear the intent here is to discourage doing them.
Then why wasn't I confused? When I saw the patch 39 notes both PTR and Live my only thoughts were that we were getting new/different activities for endeavors, and that's exactly what we got, and to me it's a major improvement. I've already seen new ones and it really is refreshing to have new activities to do, hope we see the trial/dungeon ones soon too.
I am so for any of the ones that encourage group play as it's an MMORPG and people need more prodding to group up together, this is not a game meant to be played solo and the revamp of the endeavor system will bring some life back into some of the group content during some days.
Again, if they were adding both new endeavors and more endeavors to choose from then yes, this could be considered ZOS encouraging people to do other forms of content. This isn't that though.
It is no coincidence that these new endeavors are both more time consuming and limited in terms of what is required for them. The real intent behind all of this can be seen from lighyears away.
By all means you can enjoy the content that the new endeavors has had you doing but they are still arguably too constricting for the type of activity that should be quickly completable as a part of a daily task - and this is unfortunetly by design.
I still get all my endeavors done just playing the game normally, nothing has really changed, it's just it will encourage group play and certain content will be more populated on some days which is good, especially if it names some trial people aren't doing then the people farming seals might be tempted to group up for that trial that day, all of these changes are very good for the game's health if you ask me.1 -
Skall66✭✭✭laniakea_0 wrote: »I don't know about anyone else but I haven't actually seen any new endeavors yet. could it be that the list with upcoming endeavors are on the weekly or even monthly reset?
I think the daily endeavours are the same on console and PC, since console didn't yet get update 39 the endeavour on PC may still be the old ones.
Mudcrab magnet
Xbox EU1 -
Btoop✭✭✭✭hmm ok i see, i thought they would implement additional stuff, a way to earn more seals, but they are just replacing old stuff with some more specific tasks...a bit disappointing tbh
thanks for giving me this input
Just to clarify here. We are not replacing old stuff. We are adding additional endeavors to the pool of existing endeavors. We outlined this a few weeks back. Here is the quote for reference.We want to stress that the way Endeavors are currently arranged on the PTS is for testing purposes. However, when they are on the live server, they will be curated along with existing Endeavors to ensure there is flexibility in the kinds of Endeavors offered to players of various skill levels. As such, you should not see all five daily Endeavors tied to only completing dungeons, for example.
The same can be said for Endeavors that are tied to specific Chapters or content. The goal is not to make all the Endeavors for the day or week tied to owning a Chapter. The Endeavor changes on the PTS are designed to add more diverse ways to earn Seals on the live server, while also maintaining that everyone has a number of options to do them each day/week while playing the game.
No, I'm sorry but this clarification is just misleading.
These new endeavors do replace old ones as we still only have five to choose from on any given day. If this was really about "Offering you new ways to earn Seals of Endeavor" then we would also have seen the amount of endeavors we have to choose from increased.
These new additions are more time consuming by design and even if the old endeavors are still in rotation, it is clear the intent here is to discourage doing them.
Then why wasn't I confused? When I saw the patch 39 notes both PTR and Live my only thoughts were that we were getting new/different activities for endeavors, and that's exactly what we got, and to me it's a major improvement. I've already seen new ones and it really is refreshing to have new activities to do, hope we see the trial/dungeon ones soon too.
I am so for any of the ones that encourage group play as it's an MMORPG and people need more prodding to group up together, this is not a game meant to be played solo and the revamp of the endeavor system will bring some life back into some of the group content during some days.
Again, if they were adding both new endeavors and more endeavors to choose from then yes, this could be considered ZOS encouraging people to do other forms of content. This isn't that though.
It is no coincidence that these new endeavors are both more time consuming and limited in terms of what is required for them. The real intent behind all of this can be seen from lighyears away.
By all means you can enjoy the content that the new endeavors has had you doing but they are still arguably too constricting for the type of activity that should be quickly completable as a part of a daily task - and this is unfortunetly by design.
I still get all my endeavors done just playing the game normally, nothing has really changed, it's just it will encourage group play and certain content will be more populated on some days which is good, especially if it names some trial people aren't doing then the people farming seals might be tempted to group up for that trial that day, all of these changes are very good for the game's health if you ask me.
If that is how you feel as a side effect of what these additions are trying to do then I can only be happy for you.
I don't see this as encouraging people to do different content though, I see this as discouraging people from doing endeavors so they will go back to paying for loot boxes.
The people are already doing the stuff in the new activities will just continue doing what they are doing. The many people who don't have the time do to excessively time consuming daily tasks however will just stop doing endeavors, not be encouraged to start doing trials and such.8 -
Marcus684✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS giveth and ZOS taketh away. Endeavors are purely optional activities for purely optional rewards, the vast majority of them cosmetic and all of them at zero cost other than the time to do them. I see no reason to get my jimmies rustled over this, and suggest that anyone that is upset by it take a pause and reconsider whether or not it’s actually worth the mental strain.Edited by Marcus684 on August 24, 2023 3:16PM4 -
Btoop✭✭✭✭ZOS giveth and ZOS taketh away. Endeavors are purely optional activities for purely optional rewards, the vast majority of them cosmetic and all of them at zero cost other than the time to do them. I see no reason to get my jimmies rustled over this, and suggest that anyone that is upset by it take a pause and reconsider whether or not it’s actually worth the mental strain.
I think you are completely missing the point.
ZOS being willing to retroactively limit players in an attempt to get more people to buy loot boxes shows a lack of respect for their own game.
ZOS then giving weak excuses in an attempt to pull the wool over people's eyes shows a lack of respect for their own community.
The slippery slope is slippery, don't just shrug something off and dismiss it as unimportant just because you don't think it affects you.Edited by Btoop on August 24, 2023 3:53PM12 -
Marcus684✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS giveth and ZOS taketh away. Endeavors are purely optional activities for purely optional rewards, the vast majority of them cosmetic and all of them at zero cost other than the time to do them. I see no reason to get my jimmies rustled over this, and suggest that anyone that is upset by it take a pause and reconsider whether or not it’s actually worth the mental strain.
I think you are completely missing the point.
ZOS being willing to retroactively limit players in an attempt to get more people to buy loot boxes shows a lack of respect for their own game.
ZOS then giving weak excuses in an attempt to pull the wool over people's eyes shows a lack of respect for their own community.
The slippery slope is slippery, don't just shrug something off and dismiss it as unimportant just because you don't think it affects you.
It affects everyone exactly as much as you let it affect you. I choose to let it affect me not at all.0 -
Alinhbo_Tyaka✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ZOS has gotten pretty far from how they originally pitched Endeavors as something that would passively complete as part of your daily activities. I never really pursued them but the addition of more specific Endeavors to the pool while not increasing the number option choices pretty much kills any interest I might have had in them.2 -
JavaRen✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »
And how is the game not being free relevant? Endeavors are a mechanism to get free stuff from the crown store.1 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »
And how is the game not being free relevant? Endeavors are a mechanism to get free stuff from the crown store.
Because gameplay is not free. Crown store items have an additional fee, but anything that requires us to play the game is also paid. This is double true for endeavors that require a dlc purchase. The idea that people are complaining about free things rather than critiquing a paid purchase is simply not the case.Edited by spartaxoxo on August 25, 2023 12:04AM2 -
JavaRen✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
And how is the game not being free relevant? Endeavors are a mechanism to get free stuff from the crown store.
Because gameplay is not free. Crown store items have an additional fee, but anything that requires us to play the game is also paid. This is double true for endeavors that require a dlc purchase. The idea that people are complaining about free things rather than critiquing a paid purchase is simply not the case.
Hmm, it appears we have a fundamental difference in our view points. Have a good day and happy gaming.1 -
rpa✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I'll never buy crown crates or farm the free ones and as far as I remember I have never opened any of crates stuffed in my collection. There are very few items in crates I actually would want. I would not ride exploding mount which sprinkles fairy dust if paid for it so not doing all endeavors every day is not a big deal for me.
Some of the more laborous endeavors like the WB weekly can be pretty good for giving opportunity to do content. (I myself did all Necrom WB. Too bad about AWA.) Overtly spesific like N delve bosses at Zone X or kill N cheese atronachs are boring because a limited number of trivial prey and kill with class/weapon ability tediouly require changing how one plays. And siege damage and such are pure cheese.
The new ones glanced at PTS appear combine laborous with overtly spesific. Add to that the "when grouped with guild member" and it starts give to impression someone wants to discourage players doing their endeavors.1 -
Btoop✭✭✭✭ZOS giveth and ZOS taketh away. Endeavors are purely optional activities for purely optional rewards, the vast majority of them cosmetic and all of them at zero cost other than the time to do them. I see no reason to get my jimmies rustled over this, and suggest that anyone that is upset by it take a pause and reconsider whether or not it’s actually worth the mental strain.
I think you are completely missing the point.
ZOS being willing to retroactively limit players in an attempt to get more people to buy loot boxes shows a lack of respect for their own game.
ZOS then giving weak excuses in an attempt to pull the wool over people's eyes shows a lack of respect for their own community.
The slippery slope is slippery, don't just shrug something off and dismiss it as unimportant just because you don't think it affects you.
It affects everyone exactly as much as you let it affect you. I choose to let it affect me not at all.
By all means, all the more power to you if you choose not to be affected. Just don't go around dismissing the complaints of those who don't appreciate changes that are being made, not to improve the game but to push the purchase of loot boxes.Edited by Btoop on August 25, 2023 7:23AM2 -
Btoop✭✭✭✭Oh noes! It might take longer to get free stuff! My life is ruined.
Yes, because not getting 'free stuff' is the issue here... Not the fact that ZOS is willing to retroactively make aspects of the game worse in an attempt to boost loot box sales...Edited by Btoop on August 25, 2023 7:21AM4 -
MidniteOwl1913✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭What I don't like is the selling of something that like it a feature when actually it's a bug. I get that they want to change endeavors. I would have more respect for them if they just came out and said we have reason X for doing this. You may not like it but this is what we are doing. Rather than trying to make me believe that they are doing it *for* me rather than *too* me.
PS5/NA4