An Improvement for Wardens(Icy Conjuror and Winterborn)

Austin6783

I've mained a warden character for a long while, and I've always disliked being backed into a corner with your set choices. Given Winterborn and Icy are really cool on paper. But when it comes to damage, they both lose out to sets that work better on Wardens such a Pillar of Nirn or even Whorl of the Depths(even thought that one itself could also use a buff).

I feel if Icy conjuror like Pillar could do its damage and apply its D.o.T in an Aoe, that would make it much more usable in much pve content. Or otherwise, do the same with Winterborn and make it work as pillar, do its first direct damage hit and then some more D.o.T.

Just small set improvements for Ice focused Warden identity I suppose.

ESO_Nightingale

Winterborn should be a more frontloaded(bursty) pillar of nirn variation and i think it's lingering pillar should apply chilled every second for 3 ticks over it's duration to act as the "dot". Icy Conjuror should auto apply chilled every tick. As a single target set, being beaten by pillar of nirn is really bad, so automatically applying chilled every tick would make it very strong for frost wardens but not overbearing.

Necrotech_Master

i used to use icy conjurer way back before they changed the proc scaling

so the tooltip for me used to read like 30-35k over 10 sec and that made it fine even though it was single target set

now it was maybe 1500 per sec, which is about the same as most dots and since thats also it does it does not really provide any additional benefit

winterborn is definitely already bursty, i see that frequently used in pvp for magicka based ranged gankers (though not necessarily wardens)

Austin6783

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Winterborn should be a more frontloaded(bursty) pillar of nirn variation and i think it's lingering pillar should apply chilled every second for 3 ticks over it's duration to act as the "dot". Icy Conjuror should auto apply chilled every tick. As a single target set, being beaten by pillar of nirn is really bad, so automatically applying chilled every tick would make it very strong for frost wardens but not overbearing.

No because that'd actually be really awesome, especially if you're weilding frost staves, it would help keep up brittle. And burst is definitely what its missing. I used to love that set.

ESO_Nightingale

Austin6783 wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Winterborn should be a more frontloaded(bursty) pillar of nirn variation and i think it's lingering pillar should apply chilled every second for 3 ticks over it's duration to act as the "dot". Icy Conjuror should auto apply chilled every tick. As a single target set, being beaten by pillar of nirn is really bad, so automatically applying chilled every tick would make it very strong for frost wardens but not overbearing.

No because that'd actually be really awesome, especially if you're weilding frost staves, it would help keep up brittle. And burst is definitely what its missing. I used to love that set.

Why'd you say no?

Austin6783

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Austin6783 wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Winterborn should be a more frontloaded(bursty) pillar of nirn variation and i think it's lingering pillar should apply chilled every second for 3 ticks over it's duration to act as the "dot". Icy Conjuror should auto apply chilled every tick. As a single target set, being beaten by pillar of nirn is really bad, so automatically applying chilled every tick would make it very strong for frost wardens but not overbearing.

No because that'd actually be really awesome, especially if you're weilding frost staves, it would help keep up brittle. And burst is definitely what its missing. I used to love that set.

Why'd you say no?

I didnt mean it like that... I meant its an awesome idea🤣

ESO_Nightingale

Austin6783 wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Austin6783 wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Winterborn should be a more frontloaded(bursty) pillar of nirn variation and i think it's lingering pillar should apply chilled every second for 3 ticks over it's duration to act as the "dot". Icy Conjuror should auto apply chilled every tick. As a single target set, being beaten by pillar of nirn is really bad, so automatically applying chilled every tick would make it very strong for frost wardens but not overbearing.

No because that'd actually be really awesome, especially if you're weilding frost staves, it would help keep up brittle. And burst is definitely what its missing. I used to love that set.

Why'd you say no?

I didnt mean it like that... I meant its an awesome idea🤣

Lol, but yeah, adding guarenteed chilled proc to frost sets like this is a fantastic way to balance them to be stronger for frost warden without making them completely over the top for the new meta for other classes. We wanna use frost sets on the frost class. Being forced into rele and everyone else's bis sets is frustrating

ESO_Nightingale

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

i used to use icy conjurer way back before they changed the proc scaling

so the tooltip for me used to read like 30-35k over 10 sec and that made it fine even though it was single target set

now it was maybe 1500 per sec, which is about the same as most dots and since thats also it does it does not really provide any additional benefit

winterborn is definitely already bursty, i see that frequently used in pvp for magicka based ranged gankers (though not necessarily wardens)

Yep, what I'm saying is it should effectively keep it's damage but apply chilled as well with the burst and for the 2 additional seconds that the tiny 50% snare pillar remains. That may well give it the boost it needs in addition to dropping the magicka recovery boost for wep/spell damage or critical chance. This would serve to boost it a tiny bit for non wardens but would heavily increase it's value for frost wardens

Austin6783

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

i used to use icy conjurer way back before they changed the proc scaling

so the tooltip for me used to read like 30-35k over 10 sec and that made it fine even though it was single target set

now it was maybe 1500 per sec, which is about the same as most dots and since thats also it does it does not really provide any additional benefit

winterborn is definitely already bursty, i see that frequently used in pvp for magicka based ranged gankers (though not necessarily wardens)

Yep, what I'm saying is it should effectively keep it's damage but apply chilled as well with the burst and for the 2 additional seconds that the tiny 50% snare pillar remains. That may well give it the boost it needs in addition to dropping the magicka recovery boost for wep/spell damage or critical chance. This would serve to boost it a tiny bit for non wardens but would heavily increase it's value for frost wardens

I definitely would like it to be buffed in some way, idk, I just feel that certain sets that help wardens maintain their identity, especially the ice sets should definitely be buffed in some way. Hopefully in upcoming patches they'll work with us on that more.

Rugby_hook

I'm hoping in q3 since we aren't getting any new content they will balance the sets better than they currently are. I would love to use either of these sets on my magden, and they should perform better when using a frost staff to add more synergy.

It's frustrating when you think of some sets that sound like they should have good synergies with a class, only for them to be outperformed by zaan, pillar of nirn, and whorl of depths/relequen almost every time.

I know sometimes the difference isn't much and you don't "always" need to min/max for damage, but it's problematic when you have sets that are harder to get than those meta sets (icy conjurer is a much harder farm than pillar of nirn) but do significantly less damage.

There are in theory two quarters where we aren't going to get new sets (unsure what rewards the endless dungeon will have), so that time could be spent balancing the existing sets. I know a meta will always exist, but each class plays slightly differently and has different strengths and weaknesses, so there could be 7 -14 different metas.

ESO_Nightingale

Rugby_hook wrote: »

I'm hoping in q3 since we aren't getting any new content they will balance the sets better than they currently are. I would love to use either of these sets on my magden, and they should perform better when using a frost staff to add more synergy.

It's frustrating when you think of some sets that sound like they should have good synergies with a class, only for them to be outperformed by zaan, pillar of nirn, and whorl of depths/relequen almost every time.

I know sometimes the difference isn't much and you don't "always" need to min/max for damage, but it's problematic when you have sets that are harder to get than those meta sets (icy conjurer is a much harder farm than pillar of nirn) but do significantly less damage.

There are in theory two quarters where we aren't going to get new sets (unsure what rewards the endless dungeon will have), so that time could be spent balancing the existing sets. I know a meta will always exist, but each class plays slightly differently and has different strengths and weaknesses, so there could be 7 -14 different metas.

I'm of the opinion that each class should have different item sets that are bis for them

MindOfTheSwarm

Winterborn could deal shatter damage after it expires. Icy Conjuror should either apply Chilled each tick or make enemies more vulnerable to Chilled either by damage taken or increased Chilled chance.

Shadowbinder7

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Rugby_hook wrote: »

I'm hoping in q3 since we aren't getting any new content they will balance the sets better than they currently are. I would love to use either of these sets on my magden, and they should perform better when using a frost staff to add more synergy.

It's frustrating when you think of some sets that sound like they should have good synergies with a class, only for them to be outperformed by zaan, pillar of nirn, and whorl of depths/relequen almost every time.

I know sometimes the difference isn't much and you don't "always" need to min/max for damage, but it's problematic when you have sets that are harder to get than those meta sets (icy conjurer is a much harder farm than pillar of nirn) but do significantly less damage.

There are in theory two quarters where we aren't going to get new sets (unsure what rewards the endless dungeon will have), so that time could be spent balancing the existing sets. I know a meta will always exist, but each class plays slightly differently and has different strengths and weaknesses, so there could be 7 -14 different metas.

I'm of the opinion that each class should have different item sets that are bis for them

I TOTALLY agree

Seems a year on tho ZOS has different plans for class balance… sigh

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

We have closed this topic as it was originally created in May 2023. In many cases, it's better to create a new thread on a topic that you want to discuss as opposed to bumping one that is rather old.

Thank you for your understanding.