[PC NA] My patience has run out with the harassment in PvP

SkaraMinoc

Here's the ESO Code of Conduct, Section 2.3 so you can refresh yourself on inappropriate behavior.

2.3 You may not harass, threaten, intentionally humiliate, “stream snipe”, “name and shame”, engage in acts of “griefing”, or cause distress to another user, guest, or ZeniMax staff member/teams using ZeniMax sites and Services. This includes but is not limited to verbal attacks (both text and voice chat), unwanted messaging, personal attacks, stalking or any other undesired behavior used to cause discomfort or disrupt another user’s experience. At all times users will refrain from attacking age, race, color, disability, sexual orientation, national origin, religion, lifestyle, pregnancy, gender or any other personally identifying factors protected category under applicable law.

@ZOS_Kevin Support Ticket 230322-001025





Moving forward, I will be offline when I PvP. Any attempt to harass me in chat with /s or /z will be screenshotted and you will be given a warning. Any bagging or emotes on my corpse, such as /sweep or /stomp, will be screenshotted and you will be given a warning. If the behavior continues, you will be reported. If I see you bagging ANYONE, you will be screenshotted and potentially warned based on whether the targeted player considers it harassment. If so, and the behavior continues, I will report you on behalf of the targeted player if they need help. I will not report anyone on behalf of another player, but I may guide them through the process if they need help. This mostly applies to new players. The goal is to make sure they feel welcome in ESO PvP and aren't being harassed.

Here's someone from a BALL GROUP bagging and sweeping after I almost killed their healer.



This type of repeated harassment does not belong in the Elder Scrolls Online. Either stop or go play something else.

SkaraMinoc

FYI this has been going on for months. I'm done with it.

CameraBeardThePirate

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Here's the ESO Code of Conduct, Section 2.3 so you can refresh yourself on inappropriate behavior.

2.3 You may not harass, threaten, intentionally humiliate, “stream snipe”, “name and shame”, engage in acts of “griefing”, or cause distress to another user, guest, or ZeniMax staff member/teams using ZeniMax sites and Services. This includes but is not limited to verbal attacks (both text and voice chat), unwanted messaging, personal attacks, stalking or any other undesired behavior used to cause discomfort or disrupt another user’s experience. At all times users will refrain from attacking age, race, color, disability, sexual orientation, national origin, religion, lifestyle, pregnancy, gender or any other personally identifying factors protected category under applicable law.

@ZOS_Kevin Support Ticket 230322-001025





Moving forward, I will be offline when I PvP. Any attempt to harass me in chat with /s or /z will be screenshotted and reported to ZOS. Any teabagging or emotes on my corpse, such as /sweep, will be screenshotted and reported to ZOS. If I see you bagging ANYONE, you will be screenshotted and warned. If you do it again, I will report you for harassment of another player.

Here's someone from a BALL GROUP bagging and sweeping after I almost killed their healer.



This type of repeated harassment does not belong in the Elder Scrolls Online. Either stop or go play something else.

Just as a heads up, pretty sure you can't report someone for bagging someone else, as bagging is only against the ToS if the person you're bagging has asked you to stop.

SkaraMinoc

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Just as a heads up, pretty sure you can't report someone for bagging someone else, as bagging is only against the ToS if the person you're bagging has asked you to stop.

I will confirm with the person being bagged if they are okay with it or not. This mostly applies to new players. If not, I will offer to warn and/or report the player on their behalf. Thanks for clarifying. Updated original post.

ZOS_Kevin

Thanks for sending me the ticket number, @SkaraMinoc. We'll make sure it's in the right place with customer service.

SkaraMinoc

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Thanks for sending me the ticket number, @SkaraMinoc. We'll make sure it's in the right place with customer service.

Ty Kevin. Appreciate you.

Sergykid

i'm curious if it will work out for you, tag me when you notice a change.
I am for longer than you encountering harassment ingame, made reports with proofs, players asked to stop, all that etc ..
and can confirm the players i had several reports on haven't even got a warning and still continue harassing

React

Whispers and T-bagging are one thing, but emotes? Saying you're going to report anyone that emotes on or near your corpse is a bit excessive, and I'd argue an abuse of the report system if you're not first asking them to refrain from the behavior. These things aren't always intended as a "personal attack".

acastanza_ESO

Teabagging has been pretty firmly established as something that is considered harassment and ZOS will take action on (if you follow the proper procedures - asking them to stop, reporting them with video evidence, (and more video evidence if they don't stop), I also take a zero tolerance policy there.

But emotes are not, and have never been considered as such, in fact, ZOS put into the game a specific pack of "PVP Taunt Emotes", the one exception is the pushup emote, which is treated the same as teabagging when used in that way.

But Sweeping in particular has a long tradition of use in ESO PVP and is not de-facto considered harassment. That said, a ballgroup using it like that is definitely poor sportsmanship. But poor sportsmanship isn't a TOS violation.

Something to keep in mind here - you (not anyone in particular) are not the ESO police, you aren't a moderator, if someone has a problem with something that happened to them it is on THEM to follow the procedures for reporting it, not you. You inserting yourself into someone else's situation with the intent to get someone targeted for disciplinary action could, in and of itself, be considered harrassment.

SkaraMinoc

Okay how about this.

If I see repeated bagging, /stomp, /sweep, or any other emote against a new player, then I may reach out to them asking if they are okay with the behavior or not. If not, then I will explain ESO Code of Conduct, Section 2.3, how to give the offender a warning, and how to submit a report if the harassment continues.

I won't submit any tickets on behalf of another player. It's up to them.

And yes, emotes can absolutely be a form of harassment. The only difference between an emote and teabagging is that an emote has a command whereas teabagging must be done manually. Both use character animations to potentially cause distress to another user.

rabidmyers

/shovel is a sign of respect, giving the dead a proper burial is a true blessing

SkaraMinoc

rabidmyers wrote: »

/shovel is a sign of respect, giving the dead a proper burial is a true blessing

I will exclude /shovel

VaranisArano

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

And yes, emotes can absolutely be a form of harassment. The only difference between an emote and teabagging is that an emote has a command whereas teabagging must be done manually. Both use character animations to potentially cause distress to another user.

Emotes can be, but I assume they fall under the same sort of "intent to harass/cause distress" that's why ZOS wants us to ask people to stop and then report if they continue. There's a difference between unsportsmanlike conduct and the sort of behavior that goes beyond into TOS-breaking territory.

ZOS doesn't consider the following emoted unsportsmanlike sentiments to be against the TOS on their own, because they sold them:

/flipthebird - "Show the ultimate in disdain for your adversary by flipping the bird at them."

/kissthis - "When words aren’t strong enough to express your disdain, encourage them all to “Kiss this!”"

/goquietly - "To a defeated opponent, express your concern—or lack thereof—by urging them to pass on softly and silently. Aww!"

With all that in mind, it seems to me that ZOS genuinely doesn't mind PVP players showing disdain for each other or taunting fallen opponents with emotes so long as it doesn't cross the line into harassment, which ZOS has set as "if you're asked to stop, stop."

WuffyCerulei

I'm pretty disgusted my fellow EP players are treating you like that. No one on any faction deserves such low and degrading treatment. Hope things get better for ya.

Sergykid

React wrote: »

Whispers and T-bagging are one thing, but emotes? Saying you're going to report anyone that emotes on or near your corpse is a bit excessive, and I'd argue an abuse of the report system if you're not first asking them to refrain from the behavior. These things aren't always intended as a "personal attack".

Gina herself confirmed a few years ago, but still available as far as i know, that use of emotes is harassment if the player asks the harasser to stop it.
it's easy to know and obvious if it's a personal attack, especially in bgs where you meet same players most of the time.

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

Teabagging has been pretty firmly established as something that is considered harassment and ZOS will take action on (if you follow the proper procedures - asking them to stop, reporting them with video evidence, (and more video evidence if they don't stop), I also take a zero tolerance policy there.

But emotes are not, and have never been considered as such, in fact, ZOS put into the game a specific pack of "PVP Taunt Emotes", the one exception is the pushup emote, which is treated the same as teabagging when used in that way.

zos only takes action if they want, even if you ask to stop and provide proof video of player not stopping only for them to continue over the next days when you meet again. Even after several reports on the same player, the player still acts like he never even got a warning.

emotes do in fact count as harassment if the victim asks the harasser to stop it, even though reports have apparently no effect on the harasser.

Caribou77

Agree with OP 100%. It’s a certain type of player (usually cheese build, marginal skill) that engages in this behavior.

tsaescishoeshiner

Emotes are like "haha, you died"—sometimes annoying, sometimes funny, but at worst they're just a put-down. Whereas teabagging has weird sexual/dominant energy. It might seem inoffensive to some, but it's pretty gross and impolite, and even disturbing to some people.

Personally I can brush it off and report it, but I know people who don't PvP because teabagging epitomizes everything they don't want out of the experience. I try to be friendly in PvP and find it much more fun and easier to focus that way.

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Just as a heads up, pretty sure you can't report someone for bagging someone else, as bagging is only against the ToS if the person you're bagging has asked you to stop.

I believe that's true, and it's easily the most awkward and ridiculous thing I've ever had to do in PvP lol. Like ... how do I ask someone to not teabag me and come off sounding normal lol. Where's the Community Guide for that, huh?

Luede

i have no problems with whisper, nor with bagging, although bagging should hardly fall under any guidelines and i certainly kill a lot more people than those who complain here. there are some very simple rules, generally do not respond, neither to whisper, nor to actions. so i don't have to read the whisper it goes on ignore, but as soon as you respond to something like this, you are a victim.

Reporting is of course free for everyone and should also be used for hate speech, but responding to it is a mistake.

CameraBeardThePirate

I'm gonna be real - and this isn't intended to be disrespect, bait, or anything of the sort - people need to realize this is a game. That goes for both sides - teabagger or teabaggee. This is a game, one with a dying PvP population at that. [snip]

[edited for minor baiting]

Mansquito

I know people who have been threatened to be stabbed and reported it to no avail. I myself have been told to kill myself, quite persistently, amongst other abuse from one particular player (who is known to send abusive whispers) yet they still roam free, even after being reported with evidence.

[snip]

[edited for bashing]

Deter1UK

wrote:

"CameraBeardThePirate;c-7835697"- people need to realize this is a game. That goes for both sides - teabagger or teabaggee. This is a game, one with a dying PvP population at that

Indeed it is.
So, someone is wary of PVP and not sure whether to try it. What do people say?

“It’s not PVE, dying does not mean you did badly, everyone dies don’t take it personally.”

And then they fall over and someone teabags them and have just made it personal. Exit new player, and the population is falling you say…

It’s wouldn’t happen after a game of chess or a game of golf would it? Because retaliation would be swift. But they are just games too.
Like our local laser tag and paintball matches , it doesn’t happen there either.

The ONLY reason it happens is because there is no comeback and that is the lowest form of bullying.

Caribou77

Honestly, ZOS needs to take a stronger role in leading the community on this issue. That’s the only way it’s going to improve.

Mankeyyyyy

Of all the problems in the game, teabagging isn't a big deal in my opinion. You can't control what other people do but you can control how you react. Just respawn and go about your day.

Theignson

They should just ban Tbag and be done with it.

Think about what Tbag is supposed to represent. It is so obscene that if I described it on the forums, I would be banned from the forums.

That should be a clue telling ZOS to ban it.

OBJnoob

I respect everyone's right to express discomfort with the act and file reports on an individual basis, depending on the longevity and severity of the harassment.

In a more general sense though I encourage everybody to have thicker skin about the issue. People are toxic in life... It is unfortunately not isolated to video games much less only ESO. I think it's a little over the top to link it to real life acts of ***, literal t-bagging, or even bullying. It's really no different from little kids flipping the bird or telling yo mamma jokes. It's distasteful and certainly not a part of culture we should be proud of but also not something we should take too seriously.

Trying to have a crusade against it really might just waste your own time and accidentally glorify their actions in a way.

And I'm not saying this pretending to be a "higher road," type of guy. Quite the opposite-- I generally tell people exactly how I feel and sometimes get in trouble for it. I get upset sometimes when I'm bagged, sure. But not for long. Not for as long as it would take to gather some clips and produce a report, is my point. Much less become the defender of everyone around me.

It is unfortunately an emotional "crime," that has two solutions. Ban everyone who does it... Or stop letting it bother you emotionally. As such it becomes a matter of philosophy -v- practicality. Which method will solve your problem fastest? And which solution will solve your problem more permanently and extend beyond ESO to similar instances you might encounter?

axi

Someone needs to grow a thicker skin.

Some people will take more satisfaction from one message asking them to stop tbagging than they would from 100 tbags.

Theignson

The whole problem with "just ask them to stop" is a lot of these trolls run offline. So there is no way to "ask them to stop".

ZOS really needs to stop being so reluctant to act and should just ban Tbag. Again, if the behavior is so obscene that you aren't allowed to describe it on the forums, it should be a bannable offense.

After all , what does Tbag actually represent? It is "the jamming of a player's ^%^&^% into the mouth of a dead person". Isn't that despicable? Maybe some players who are only 11 or 12 don't really understand what they are doing, but that is no excuse.

Sergykid

"just ban tbag" is too much, many don't even care and the harasser should be given a warning. Problem is they don't even give warnings, i have several reports on various players for harassment, with proof and ask to stop, and they still continue. If i ask zos support what is wrong they give no answer, just close ticket. Or they give "we will look into it" but those players aren't even getting a warning to stop it.

Theignson wrote: »

The whole problem with "just ask them to stop" is a lot of these trolls run offline. So there is no way to "ask them to stop".

ZOS really needs to stop being so reluctant to act and should just ban Tbag. Again, if the behavior is so obscene that you aren't allowed to describe it on the forums, it should be a bannable offense.

After all , what does Tbag actually represent? It is "the jamming of a player's ^%^&^% into the mouth of a dead person". Isn't that despicable? Maybe some players who are only 11 or 12 don't really understand what they are doing, but that is no excuse.

on the store game is rated 18, and u need to pay money to play it except free weekends which i haven't seen in a long time, so any "11 or 12 just playing around" is not an excuse. Everyone harassing someone else despite that player asking him to stop is doing so voluntarily and many players i know are very serious about harassing someone else, and yes they still continue because as mentioned above they are not even getting a warning.

Sythen88411

Sometimes I leave junk in chest I loot

hhk

If you get triggered by that, you really have to work on that... Honestly.. best thing is, get on with your life as an adult and let Kidz tbag.

Amottica

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Here's the ESO Code of Conduct, Section 2.3 so you can refresh yourself on inappropriate behavior.

2.3 You may not harass, threaten, intentionally humiliate, “stream snipe”, “name and shame”, engage in acts of “griefing”, or cause distress to another user, guest, or ZeniMax staff member/teams using ZeniMax sites and Services. This includes but is not limited to verbal attacks (both text and voice chat), unwanted messaging, personal attacks, stalking or any other undesired behavior used to cause discomfort or disrupt another user’s experience. At all times users will refrain from attacking age, race, color, disability, sexual orientation, national origin, religion, lifestyle, pregnancy, gender or any other personally identifying factors protected category under applicable law.

@ZOS_Kevin Support Ticket 230322-001025





Moving forward, I will be offline when I PvP. Any attempt to harass me in chat with /s or /z will be screenshotted and reported to ZOS. Any teabagging or emotes on my corpse, such as /sweep, will be screenshotted and reported to ZOS. If I see you bagging ANYONE, you will be screenshotted and warned. If you do it again, I will report you for harassment of another player.

Here's someone from a BALL GROUP bagging and sweeping after I almost killed their healer.



This type of repeated harassment does not belong in the Elder Scrolls Online. Either stop or go play something else.

Just as a heads up, pretty sure you can't report someone for bagging someone else, as bagging is only against the ToS if the person you're bagging has asked you to stop.

Pretty much this. Harassment has to be reported by the person who is being harassed. We do not have the capacity to know if the person on the receiving end of being t-bagged has objected to it.

As for hate or angry whispers, just ignore them. They are trying to get the person riled up. If someone responds to such texts thinking they are outsmarting the other person, well they are not. All that does is tell them they were successful and that they beat you.

Just ignore their whispers and imagine their head exploding with the frustration they are failing.