Characters that got forgoten and could be added to stories ...

Lucasalex92
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You have so many in game, mini stories while doing that are not reused to just even see them in game would be nice in each expansion or at least once in a while like Dugroth, Lorka or many others, apart of telling him to be blacksmith u don't see or know whats happened to him when he went to be a warrior, if we ever had orc expansion (another) would be nice or maybe he joined dragonguard got a bit older or have kids :)) or got married to lorka :D would be amazing to see how those characters doing ,

small things that makes people happy...
Edited by ZOS_Icy on January 6, 2023 6:50PM
  • ghastley
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    They are in your past, but other players’s futures. Since ESO is taking place without advancing the calendar, they would only get confused living their lives out of order.

    Only the select few can handle that, like the five companions, Eveli, and some others that get over-used.
  • DMuehlhausen
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    Elsonso wrote: »
    No. Reusing characters is the number one reason ZOS gets into trouble with the "do it in any order you want" plan. Each story should have new characters.

    This only is an issue because the original story you killed somebody then they were just here you go they are back.

    You could bring back a character like Daini. The Khajit in Souther Elswyr that was trying to rescue her brother from a skooma dealer. You helped her get away she could show up somewhere else in the world. That or if ZoS really wants to tell a grand story, and good one, have quests that take you back to old zones where you run into characters like Daini.
  • TaSheen
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    I'm not in favor of reuse of characters personally, especially when they're as annoying as Eveli and Jakarn.
    Life is a journey, not a destination.
  • Lugaldu
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    Perhaps the problem could be solved in such a way that you can only encounter characters that you have met if you play quests/areas in the correct chronological order. Such quests could only be unlocked automatically once you have completed the basic quests. I also find it quite immersion-breaking when you meet characters you're not supposed to know yet (I started Summerset in 2018 and it was downright weird to later encounter Darien in a different context...).
  • ZOS_Icy
    ZOS_Icy
    mod
    Greetings,

    After further review we have decided to move this thread to a category we think is more appropriate for this topic.

    Thank you for your understanding.
    Staff Post
  • Syldras
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    Elsonso wrote: »
    No. Reusing characters is the number one reason ZOS gets into trouble with the "do it in any order you want" plan. Each story should have new characters.

    While this is indeed an issue, this whole forced stagnation makes the world seem less alive and reduces immersion too, in my opinion.
    @Syldras | PC | EU
    The forceful expression of will gives true honor to the Ancestors.
    Sarayn Andrethi, Telvanni mage (Main)
    Darvasa Andrethi, his "I'm NOT a Necromancer!" sister
    Malacar Sunavarlas, Altmer Ayleid vampire
  • Syldras
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    Give Rigurt and his inane quests a rest already; I can see why he's an ineffective ambassador if he's constantly travelling and bungling everything. Why does he still have a job at this point?

    While I couldn't agree more with the rest you wrote, the joke about Rigurt is that the king sends him aways as an "ambassador" to get rid of him because he causes too much trouble in his home country. That's the story told between the lines in one of the base zones (I can't remember though where I first saw him - Deshaan, maybe? It's 7 years ago for me).
    @Syldras | PC | EU
    The forceful expression of will gives true honor to the Ancestors.
    Sarayn Andrethi, Telvanni mage (Main)
    Darvasa Andrethi, his "I'm NOT a Necromancer!" sister
    Malacar Sunavarlas, Altmer Ayleid vampire
  • Tommy_The_Gun
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    The issue I think is that ZOS seems to be re-using like 2 - 4 same NPC characters over & over again (every chapter), instead of re-using other nicely designed characters (that they have plenty in the game) and those characters played a major role in certain zones, but for whatever reason never appeared again.

    Captain One-Eye could be a good example:
    She plays major role in Shadowfen main story line and later can be seen i Coldharbour during main quest, but... never appears again. She just disappears from the game. What is also weird is that even though we had Blackwood & High Isle chapters - an Argonian Pirate NPC from the base game wasn't in neither of those... ZOS went for same npcs as they do every time.

    If it was more varied then the problem of "play any order you want" would not exists.
  • tomofhyrule
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    Syldras wrote: »
    Give Rigurt and his inane quests a rest already; I can see why he's an ineffective ambassador if he's constantly travelling and bungling everything. Why does he still have a job at this point?

    While I couldn't agree more with the rest you wrote, the joke about Rigurt is that the king sends him aways as an "ambassador" to get rid of him because he causes too much trouble in his home country. That's the story told between the lines in one of the base zones (I can't remember though where I first saw him - Deshaan, maybe? It's 7 years ago for me).

    Yeah, I know that's the reason, but then that leaves a gaping plot hole in another way. I get why Jorunn wants him gone (so do I), but is it really smart to send him to meet with actual ambassadors then? Is this maybe why all of Tamriel thinks that Nords are nothing but drunk idiots because Jorunn keeps sending Rigurt to them instead of just sending him to, I don't know, investigate the convection currents in Y'ffelon or something?
    Captain One-Eye could be a good example:
    She plays major role in Shadowfen main story line and later can be seen i Coldharbour during main quest, but... never appears again. She just disappears from the game. What is also weird is that even though we had Blackwood & High Isle chapters - an Argonian Pirate NPC from the base game wasn't in neither of those... ZOS went for same npcs as they do every time.

    Another one of my gripes with the High Isle storyline.

    "We need a sea captain from each alliance! We've obviously got Kaleen for the DC since she shows up several times throughout the story. For the AD, let's go with the comic relief characters instead of the captain that you see throughout the AD line. We'll just throw her a bone in a sidequest and people will be too busy laughing at the font of comedy that is Za'ji to notice that Jimila got done dirty. And for the Pact... uhh... well, let's just make a brand new character because [snip] the EP, amirite? We don't even need to give the new EP captain a nice costume or give the EP not-leader a custom outfit!"
    Edited by tomofhyrule on January 6, 2023 8:01PM
  • Syldras
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    Yeah, I know that's the reason, but then that leaves a gaping plot hole in another way. I get why Jorunn wants him gone (so do I), but is it really smart to send him to meet with actual ambassadors then?

    Well, I assume Jorunn is prone to making bad decisions (or really doesn't care much about everything outside his country), otherwise he wouldn't have skipped the peace talks in High Isle just because spending that time in bed with some random Nord woman seems more important to him...
    @Syldras | PC | EU
    The forceful expression of will gives true honor to the Ancestors.
    Sarayn Andrethi, Telvanni mage (Main)
    Darvasa Andrethi, his "I'm NOT a Necromancer!" sister
    Malacar Sunavarlas, Altmer Ayleid vampire
  • tomofhyrule
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    Syldras wrote: »
    Yeah, I know that's the reason, but then that leaves a gaping plot hole in another way. I get why Jorunn wants him gone (so do I), but is it really smart to send him to meet with actual ambassadors then?

    Well, I assume Jorunn is prone to making bad decisions (or really doesn't care much about everything outside his country), otherwise he wouldn't have skipped the peace talks in High Isle just because spending that time in bed with some random Nord woman seems more important to him...

    And there's another one of my major gripes with the High Isle storyline... :s
    Nobody would have allowed that in the real world. How hard would it have been for the 'excuse reason' to instead have been "He caught the Knahaten flu and is in Stormhold with the best Argonian healers, but he sent his son because he realizes the importance of these talks." But no, we instead got "LOL funny man wants to sleep with a rando woman instead of doing his job! look how useless he is! LOL"

    I will say that it's nice to see the leaders fatal flaws getting their comeuppance, I'd like to see more of that. 2E Tamriel is a harsh place, and the chaos of the interregnum goes all the way until Tiber Septim comes in 300 years later. Jorunn's not a king, he's a second-son warrior and he doesn't even have his component races united under him (and there's plenty of potential for a Telvanni Peninsula or Central Black Marsh story to fracture the Pact even further). Emeric's a bit bull-headed, and after Orsinium he's lost one race (and the stage is set for a Crowns/Forebears conflict to take the Redguards away). And then you have Ayrenn, whose naïveté has caused her to [ERROR: CONSEQUENCES NOT FOUND].

    ...yes, I do think they ended up writing one of the alliances into a corner because they wanted to shill her character too much. I'd have loved to see some conflict in Summerset where the traditional faction of Altmer start to fragment the Dominion, or maybe have the rise of the Camorans in Valenwood since we know that they lead the 2nd AD within 300 years, but it really does feel like the AD and their leader is a little too perfect and utopian at times, which I think makes it look like bad writing in comparison.
    ...I suppose it's no coincidence that most "Who's your favorite NPC" threads have Ayrenn and Raz as the top two.
  • tomofhyrule
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    Syldras wrote: »
    And there's another one of my major gripes with the High Isle storyline... :s
    Nobody would have allowed that in the real world. How hard would it have been for the 'excuse reason' to instead have been "He caught the Knahaten flu and is in Stormhold with the best Argonian healers, but he sent his son because he realizes the importance of these talks." But no, we instead got "LOL funny man wants to sleep with a rando woman instead of doing his job! look how useless he is! LOL"

    In case it wasn't obvious: I didn't mean this seriously. Of course I don't think this whole thing makes any sense (just as sending a intellectually underdeveloped drunkard as an ambassador), it just fits ESO's current general tendency, sadly. I found the writing in 2022 a catastrophy. Random bawdiness without any sense everywhere, logic mistakes (ToT being a brand-new traditional long-established card game), lore mistakes ("Naryu saved the Tribunal and Morrowind"), and most dialogues are really, really repetative and stupid. I've been complaining about the bad writing especially in 2022 for weeks and I'm really worried how this year's chapter will turn out after this debacle. And, to return to this thread's topic, that of course also includes recurrent characters (which I'm sure there will be plenty, because it's a type of fanservice that works with many people). I really don't want to see more characters that had been likeable in older chapters ruined by the current tendency of bad, lore-breaking writing.

    Oh don't worry, I completely agree. I have been really disappointed with the quality of the main Chapter stories lately, which is surprising since I think the Q4 DLCs have been great.

    Particularly Firesong - the new characters introduced there (Laurel, Siravaen, and especially Stefan) were really compelling and I enjoyed every minute of that story. But the High Isle line with the massive catastrophe that was the 'returning characters come together for peace!' idea was... well, I'm still playing the game, but I did have to take about a month off of anything High Isle because it was that bad.

    I also thought they did make good characters as well. Ember was a lot better for me than I'd expected, especially since I'm more the boy scout type (which is why I get along so well with best bro). It seems though like returning characters are just phoned in completely, and that makes me sad.

    Hopefully ZOS will try to make more compelling new characters and try not to flanderize (or oversaturate) returning characters that much. I think the effort of trying to make huge story arcs is causing problems as well, since the small contained stories tend to be much better. Everyone always points to Orsinium, but I'll even say that Firesong felt quite disconnected from High Isle as a whole and I did enjoy it. True, there can always be connections, but lately it's felt more like leaving open threads.

  • fall0athboy
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    The issue I think is that ZOS seems to be re-using like 2 - 4 same NPC characters over & over again (every chapter), instead of re-using other nicely designed characters (that they have plenty in the game) and those characters played a major role in certain zones, but for whatever reason never appeared again.

    Captain One-Eye could be a good example:
    She plays major role in Shadowfen main story line and later can be seen i Coldharbour during main quest, but... never appears again. She just disappears from the game. What is also weird is that even though we had Blackwood & High Isle chapters - an Argonian Pirate NPC from the base game wasn't in neither of those... ZOS went for same npcs as they do every time.

    If it was more varied then the problem of "play any order you want" would not exists.

    Rigurt, Lady Laurent and Stibbons, who else?
  • fall0athboy
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    It seems though like returning characters are just phoned in completely, and that makes me sad.

    I know it's not exactly what you mean but wow did Jorunn's voice actor phone it in during Greymoor and Markarth.

  • KingArthasMenethil
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    I think my main issue of returning characters aside from being Flanderised is that their entire presence means you feel nothing for them. Because of play in any order they cannot die which in turn means there's nothing to worry about character wise because they'll be fine.

    And honestly this "Play in any order" must make returning characters a right pain writing wise. They cannot change and they cannot die or be maimed they stay exactly the same through the entire season.
    Edited by KingArthasMenethil on January 7, 2023 9:34AM
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  • Shardan4968
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    I always feel awkward when I have to pretend to remember what I did with the Forgettable Character #358614.
    PC/EU
  • Syldras
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    I always feel awkward when I have to pretend to remember what I did with the Forgettable Character #358614.

    I can't remember each single one, but a few were remarkable. In older chapters even without making them one-dimensional stereotypes (what, I'm afraid, is what ZOS considers effective character writing today).

    Edited by Syldras on January 10, 2023 5:14PM
    @Syldras | PC | EU
    The forceful expression of will gives true honor to the Ancestors.
    Sarayn Andrethi, Telvanni mage (Main)
    Darvasa Andrethi, his "I'm NOT a Necromancer!" sister
    Malacar Sunavarlas, Altmer Ayleid vampire
  • Xarc
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    In glenumbra I met a woman, Gloria Fausta, strong soldier helping Duke Sebastien (exiled leader of Camlorn)

    She proposed her sacrifice to save him, I refused and tried to find another way (pure elder scroll moment, hard choice),
    then I saw her again in stormhaven.

    f8jb6voh1enb.jpg

    I reworked her with an AI and photoshop
    Edited by Xarc on January 10, 2023 6:27PM
    FR-EU-PCsince april 2014
  • fall0athboy
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    ghastley wrote: »
    They are in your past, but other players’s futures. Since ESO is taking place without advancing the calendar, they would only get confused living their lives out of order.

    Only the select few can handle that, like the five companions, Eveli, and some others that get over-used.

    I mean, they could absolutely just have the prior quest be required before doing the new content.

    For example, I really want Sun-in-Shadow to show up in whatever Telvanni land we get in the future inevitably. Since Morrowind is free and essentially base-game, they could just make Heart of a Telvanni required for her potential Telvanni-Lands questline.
  • Elsonso
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    .
    ghastley wrote: »
    They are in your past, but other players’s futures. Since ESO is taking place without advancing the calendar, they would only get confused living their lives out of order.

    Only the select few can handle that, like the five companions, Eveli, and some others that get over-used.

    I mean, they could absolutely just have the prior quest be required before doing the new content.

    For example, I really want Sun-in-Shadow to show up in whatever Telvanni land we get in the future inevitably. Since Morrowind is free and essentially base-game, they could just make Heart of a Telvanni required for her potential Telvanni-Lands questline.

    Unfortunately, I suspect that if ZOS does a Telvanni chapter, she will show up like debris washing in on the tide. :neutral:
  • Hurbster
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    I really dislike the 'everything happens at the same time' thing the devs are so proud of.
    So they raised the floor and lowered the ceiling. Except the ceiling has spikes in it now and the floor is also lava.
  • colossalvoids
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    I'd love having arcs and consequences but any reoccurring encounter is rendered useless and absolutely killed by "play in any order you like!" nonsense. It would not work the way we want most likely.

    Eveli is a great example, from having an arc in Orsinium she turned into akorn-brain in Blackwood that lead people disliking actually pretty well written character from before. She wasn't favourite by any stretch but now it's a Stuga tier material. And remember when Naryu turned up in Morrowind people thought it wasn't a good cameo, oh jolly times, little we knew of what's to come.

    Not writing it to go against other posters or the op but if some of the writers ever turning their heads forum side they're should be 100% aware of issues some of us having. Personally I see only two ways out, either we need more new original stories and characters (better new and uninspired than good old and made uninspired) or time line needs to move forward somehow.
  • Syldras
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    time line needs to move forward somehow.

    It's interesting to think about, actually. According to this clock (that has been around since the start of ESO and counts the day and night cycles in game) we would already be in 2E 618, which means that 36 years have passed since the beginning of the Planemeld.
    @Syldras | PC | EU
    The forceful expression of will gives true honor to the Ancestors.
    Sarayn Andrethi, Telvanni mage (Main)
    Darvasa Andrethi, his "I'm NOT a Necromancer!" sister
    Malacar Sunavarlas, Altmer Ayleid vampire
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