Magcro is in dire need of buffs (PvP perspective)

techprince

The Necromancer class
1) Doesn't provide Major Sorcery/Prophecy within its toolkit.
2) Has no instant stun.
3) Its spammable has the lowest projectile speed.
4) Has no dedicated execution. The execute crit chance depends on the number of Grave Lord skills slotted which due to the above reasons isn't possible to reach its highest potential.

Currently, Magcro heavily relies on the Harmony trait and Dark Convergence. Without it, they don't do much.

Agony Totem should lose its 2-sec delay and should instantly stun. This will give them a melee stun at the very least.
Maybe add Sorcery/Brutality to Expunge/Spirit Mender skill?

Ankael07

Agony Totem isnt even 2 secons stun anymore. Its actually after 4 seconds now, first stun burst doesnt work for some reason

Melzo

This class is designed for pve content and that's why it's so weak in pvp. When developing the first four classes, the developers paid attention to pvp, but when developing the necromancer, they no longer paid attention to pvp. The increased crit chance when the enemy's health is low is only needed for the boss. The bonus to dot damage is needed mainly for pve content, since the necromancer himself has only two skills, and even then they are needed only for pve. I can only apply a 10% bonus to proc sets that cause dot damage. Playing as a necromancer, you need to prepare that you will have your hands tied behind your back) Everyone has a normal stun) You have a perverted version of a stun. Which no one wants to use) Everyone has a slowdown or immobilization, but you still have the same situation as with stun) What amazes me most is that the necromancer has only one skill that deals damage, but at the same time he was given a bunch of passive or active skills that restore resources. Necromancer is a ranged class, but it has nothing but explosive bones. If he had at least a finishing skill with low health, then I would be very happy and not with an increase in the chance of a crit with low hp. Even if you have taken 90 percent of the enemy's lives, you still have to finish off only spam with an ability that deals 30 percent less damage due to vampirism. As a result, either you play a bomber or fight in close combat. But even in close combat, you are weaker than any other class with a similar build. And in fact it is an empty class without its own gameplay. You are completely dependent on weapon or guild skills and proc sets.

What would I change:

1. Frozen Colossus now counts as pet damage. So that it works with the ritualist set and stacks with other mechanics described below.
2. The second hit from Flame Skull was 10 percent higher. And it won't make this skill very strong.
3. Remove 30% damage bonus and add slow to Avid Boneyard. So that the morph with synergy activation is only for pvp and the morph with armor reduction for pve content.
4. I don't know what to do with the Skeletal Mage skill. Before the nerf, he was too weak, and after that you won’t look at him with tears. Deals 1300 damage every two seconds. In pvp, this damage is halved and deals 600 damage. One NB critical hit deals over 6000 damage. You just think about it. My skeleton should do the same amount of damage by hitting the enemy ten times in 20 seconds.
5. Remove the 3% damage bonus from Shocking Siphon. Due to such bonuses, the necromancer has other weakened skills and useless passives.
6. Swap Death Knell's passive for increased critical strike chance when the enemy is low on health, for a normal damage bonus like 5% crit bonus or 5% spell damage or whatever.
7. Grant a 5% incoming damage reduction bonus to Summoner's Armor but remove a 10% damage reduction bonus from Spirit Guardian.
8. Remove the useless Deaden Pain skill and replace it with a new one. The new skill, when activated, puts a buff on you that absorbs one corpse around you every 2 seconds and gives a charge for the corpse. When you build up charges, you no longer automatically consume corpses and can use the skill on the enemy. Kind of like a bone hand like NPC necromancers. Deals damage as a blastbones and stun to the enemy for 2 seconds. Considering that blastbones deals 5-6 thousand damage, this skill will not be very strong.
9. Replace the useless Agony Totem skill synergy and grant area damage or health regeneration.
10. The Ghostly Embrace skill is completely useless. Nobody uses it. I just do not understand why this morph is needed. If you need a skill, then take its first morph.You need to remove the morph and replace it with a new skill or give some bonuses to it. Increasing stuns by one second is a spit in the face of necromancers.
11. Remove the Death Gleaning passive and give it a normal one. Why does a necromancer need so much regeneration? And this passive gives very little. It is only needed to put something in.
12. It is necessary to change so that the Empowering Grasp skill would not buff its pets, but debuff the enemy and he would receive increased damage from pets. It's quite strange when I have to turn around and buff pets.
13. Remove the percentage damage reduction bonus from the Spirit Guardian and double the health regeneration.
14. The Intensive Mender skill heals two targets.
15. The Enduring Undeath skill does not increase the duration of the healing, but multiplies it. Otherwise, the meaning of the fact that I will stand still for 30 seconds and where will I take so many corpses?


If the developers make at least a third of the changes, I will be glad. Even if the necromancer gets all these changes, he won't be very strong. But it will be interesting to play as a necromancer. But for now, this is an empty class. Anything a necromancer can do, a warden can do. And it does it better.

What changes would you like to see? I hope this message reaches the developers.

xDeusEJRx

Melzo wrote: »

This class is designed for pve content and that's why it's so weak in pvp. When developing the first four classes, the developers paid attention to pvp, but when developing the necromancer, they no longer paid attention to pvp. The increased crit chance when the enemy's health is low is only needed for the boss. The bonus to dot damage is needed mainly for pve content, since the necromancer himself has only two skills, and even then they are needed only for pve. I can only apply a 10% bonus to proc sets that cause dot damage. Playing as a necromancer, you need to prepare that you will have your hands tied behind your back) Everyone has a normal stun) You have a perverted version of a stun. Which no one wants to use) Everyone has a slowdown or immobilization, but you still have the same situation as with stun) What amazes me most is that the necromancer has only one skill that deals damage, but at the same time he was given a bunch of passive or active skills that restore resources. Necromancer is a ranged class, but it has nothing but explosive bones. If he had at least a finishing skill with low health, then I would be very happy and not with an increase in the chance of a crit with low hp. Even if you have taken 90 percent of the enemy's lives, you still have to finish off only spam with an ability that deals 30 percent less damage due to vampirism. As a result, either you play a bomber or fight in close combat. But even in close combat, you are weaker than any other class with a similar build. And in fact it is an empty class without its own gameplay. You are completely dependent on weapon or guild skills and proc sets.

What would I change:
3. Remove 30% damage bonus and add slow to Avid Boneyard. So that the morph with synergy activation is only for pvp and the morph with armor reduction for pve content.
4. I don't know what to do with the Skeletal Mage skill. Before the nerf, he was too weak, and after that you won’t look at him with tears. Deals 1300 damage every two seconds. In pvp, this damage is halved and deals 600 damage. One NB critical hit deals over 6000 damage. You just think about it. My skeleton should do the same amount of damage by hitting the enemy ten times in 20 seconds.
5. Remove the 3% damage bonus from Shocking Siphon. Due to such bonuses, the necromancer has other weakened skills and useless passives.
7. Grant a 5% incoming damage reduction bonus to Summoner's Armor but remove a 10% damage reduction bonus from Spirit Guardian.
12. It is necessary to change so that the Empowering Grasp skill would not buff its pets, but debuff the enemy and he would receive increased damage from pets. It's quite strange when I have to turn around and buff pets.
13. Remove the percentage damage reduction bonus from the Spirit Guardian and double the health regeneration.
14. The Intensive Mender skill heals two targets.

If the developers make at least a third of the changes, I will be glad. Even if the necromancer gets all these changes, he won't be very strong. But it will be interesting to play as a necromancer. But for now, this is an empty class. Anything a necromancer can do, a warden can do. And it does it better.

What changes would you like to see? I hope this message reaches the developers.

3. Removing the damage bonus would destroy the skill. The only reason people use it is because of it's self activation because it does burst damage, removing the damage bonus removes the one point of using the skill - burst damage. Harmony cro playstyle has already been blistered so many times, already receiving a nerf from the 50% damage down to 30%, that will just gut the damage even further. Nonsensical change.

4. I would just change the base skill of Skeletal mage to have a ramping 12% ramping damage like how the Skeletal Archer morph currently does. Then make skeletal archer tick every 1 second instead of every 2 seconds. More consistent small damaging ticks would basically make Skeletal archer equivalent to a DOT(except this ability is direct damage not a DOT)

5. I actually like shocking siphon. Shocking siphon can proc the necromancer passive Dismember giving 1500 penetration just from activating the skill for free because the ability has no cost. Removing that means necros have to have 100% uptime on one of their summons to get their full pen value and that seems like sabotaging a class you're trying to buff. Plus I like using shocking siphon as a replacement for Camo hunter/Inner light for the passive 3% damage done and basically free DoT damage it does plus you get free resources as well. I like using this as a replacement for Mortal coil, cause it's basically an offensive version of mortal coil after the tri-resource regen it does. Changing this would force every necro to use Mortal coil again.

7. Such a change would make Spirit guardian a useless skill. The reason it was desired in the first place is because it absorbs some of your damage, now it's a better heal than intensive mender due to it lasting longer and pushing out more heals gradually. Removing the damage reduction would also gut the skill because it would despawn faster when you take damage because the health of the Guardian is linked to the health of it's summoner(that being 300,000 hp for the pet) so with less damage reduction the Guardian despawns faster than it normally would because you're now squishier. Not a good change.

12. I think empowering grasp should keep the pet buff as it adds passive damage to every Necro summon. However, the empowering grasp does debuff enemies, but it's minor maim which is another defensive buff. Just change it from minor maim to an offensive buff like concussed status effect.

13. That would be a pointless change as it would just be a full replacement for Intensive mender. They already gutted that skill into oblivion so such a change would make intensive mender even more obsolete. Plus on top of that Necromancers don't need more healing power.

14. Would still be a useless skill outside of crosshealing. Why would someone choose this over Spirit guardian still when it has a better healing value than Mender and Mender despawns way faster. The only possible reason to run this suggested version of Intensive mender currently is to cross heal more, but there's better slottables to crossheal with like Undaunted Energy orb or Regeneration.

Turtle_Bot

Melzo wrote: »

This class is designed for pve content and that's why it's so weak in pvp. When developing the first four classes, the developers paid attention to pvp, but when developing the necromancer, they no longer paid attention to pvp. The increased crit chance when the enemy's health is low is only needed for the boss. The bonus to dot damage is needed mainly for pve content, since the necromancer himself has only two skills, and even then they are needed only for pve. I can only apply a 10% bonus to proc sets that cause dot damage. Playing as a necromancer, you need to prepare that you will have your hands tied behind your back) Everyone has a normal stun) You have a perverted version of a stun. Which no one wants to use) Everyone has a slowdown or immobilization, but you still have the same situation as with stun) What amazes me most is that the necromancer has only one skill that deals damage, but at the same time he was given a bunch of passive or active skills that restore resources. Necromancer is a ranged class, but it has nothing but explosive bones. If he had at least a finishing skill with low health, then I would be very happy and not with an increase in the chance of a crit with low hp. Even if you have taken 90 percent of the enemy's lives, you still have to finish off only spam with an ability that deals 30 percent less damage due to vampirism. As a result, either you play a bomber or fight in close combat. But even in close combat, you are weaker than any other class with a similar build. And in fact it is an empty class without its own gameplay. You are completely dependent on weapon or guild skills and proc sets.

What would I change:

1. Frozen Colossus now counts as pet damage. So that it works with the ritualist set and stacks with other mechanics described below.
2. The second hit from Flame Skull was 10 percent higher. And it won't make this skill very strong.
3. Remove 30% damage bonus and add slow to Avid Boneyard. So that the morph with synergy activation is only for pvp and the morph with armor reduction for pve content.
4. I don't know what to do with the Skeletal Mage skill. Before the nerf, he was too weak, and after that you won’t look at him with tears. Deals 1300 damage every two seconds. In pvp, this damage is halved and deals 600 damage. One NB critical hit deals over 6000 damage. You just think about it. My skeleton should do the same amount of damage by hitting the enemy ten times in 20 seconds.
5. Remove the 3% damage bonus from Shocking Siphon. Due to such bonuses, the necromancer has other weakened skills and useless passives.
6. Swap Death Knell's passive for increased critical strike chance when the enemy is low on health, for a normal damage bonus like 5% crit bonus or 5% spell damage or whatever.
7. Grant a 5% incoming damage reduction bonus to Summoner's Armor but remove a 10% damage reduction bonus from Spirit Guardian.
8. Remove the useless Deaden Pain skill and replace it with a new one. The new skill, when activated, puts a buff on you that absorbs one corpse around you every 2 seconds and gives a charge for the corpse. When you build up charges, you no longer automatically consume corpses and can use the skill on the enemy. Kind of like a bone hand like NPC necromancers. Deals damage as a blastbones and stun to the enemy for 2 seconds. Considering that blastbones deals 5-6 thousand damage, this skill will not be very strong.
9. Replace the useless Agony Totem skill synergy and grant area damage or health regeneration.
10. The Ghostly Embrace skill is completely useless. Nobody uses it. I just do not understand why this morph is needed. If you need a skill, then take its first morph.You need to remove the morph and replace it with a new skill or give some bonuses to it. Increasing stuns by one second is a spit in the face of necromancers.
11. Remove the Death Gleaning passive and give it a normal one. Why does a necromancer need so much regeneration? And this passive gives very little. It is only needed to put something in.
12. It is necessary to change so that the Empowering Grasp skill would not buff its pets, but debuff the enemy and he would receive increased damage from pets. It's quite strange when I have to turn around and buff pets.
13. Remove the percentage damage reduction bonus from the Spirit Guardian and double the health regeneration.
14. The Intensive Mender skill heals two targets.
15. The Enduring Undeath skill does not increase the duration of the healing, but multiplies it. Otherwise, the meaning of the fact that I will stand still for 30 seconds and where will I take so many corpses?


If the developers make at least a third of the changes, I will be glad. Even if the necromancer gets all these changes, he won't be very strong. But it will be interesting to play as a necromancer. But for now, this is an empty class. Anything a necromancer can do, a warden can do. And it does it better.

What changes would you like to see? I hope this message reaches the developers.

My thoughts on the changes you suggested.

1. No change to colossus, it's still one of the strongest ultimates in the game and still provides the very rare major vulnerability on a long duration and in a huge radius while dealing huge damage and proccing some of the most broken sets in the game.

2. Make this skill travel much faster. Maybe a 5% base damage increase, but just the travel speed would be good enough to allow it to actually hit enemies more reliably.

3. Wouldn't change this, this morph is what gives necro its unique class identity in pvp.

4. revert the general DoT nerf from U35 so that DoTs tick every second instead of every 2 seconds, make this ability also count as a DoT so it gets buffed by the unique 10% passive as well as by things that buff pets

5. no real direct change to this skill needed, just give necro a more reliable way to create corpses to allow this skill to be more useful in mobile fights.

6. crit damage instead of crit chance could be interesting here

7. this completely removes both mender (already mediocre after the heavy nerf) and now guardian as viable HoT options.

8. deaden pain is actually a decent skill with major protection, the issue with it is that it has to compete with the other morph that grants insane ultimate generation burst that no other ability or set can match.
- The offensive morph you suggested could be interesting, but I would not give it a stun, especially if it is going to deal as much damage as blast bones, which I have seen crit for near 20k against tanky builds in recent patches. Maybe instead do something like consumes corpses around you to deal damage over time to the target for 5 seconds and inflicts a stacking snare (max 55% snare) on the target per corpse consumed. This way, being a DoT it gets buffed by the necro DoT passive and provides a potentially potent snare to allow the other abilities to land easier.

9. AoE burst is done by boneyard (and morphs) this is DoT in an AoE + hard CC (fear). this gets buffed by the DoT passive too and essentially inflicts nearly a spammables worth of damage every second for 5 seconds + inflicts minor vulnerability. This is definitely more of a PvE ability, but it is still very strong for what it is. Reduce the delay on the first fear to 1 second instead of 2, but that's about it.

10. Change this morph to be 1 patch that is cast at the casters feet and provides an AoE stun + minor maim. This would be a very strong skill in pvp (an AoE on demand stun that also provides 5% mitigation). The other morph can be left as the pve morph with empower.

11. just change the passive to grant additional recovery for 4 seconds on dealing damage (6 to 8 second cooldown to prevent permanent up time). This way its more reliable sustain for the class that doesn't rely on getting kills.

12. make it so this buffs the pets when cast instead of being forced to hit them with it.

13. No! There's no need to bring back the old and OP intensive mender that was a free burst heal every 2 seconds. That was completely overtuned. Spirit guardian is fine as it is, its unique mitigation + a passive heal over time.

14. reduce its healing to the same amount as spirit guardian and allow it to heal 2 targets at a time. Creates an interesting in class AoE HoT, but spirit guardian would generally be better in most situations still.

Necro doesn't need much, especially defensively.
Changes that would easily make the class much stronger and less focused on the bomb builds.
1. make skulls travel faster to be more reliable
2. make the mage/archer count as both DoTs and pets so they get buffed by the passives
3. give in class access to major sorcery/brutality

The only other change the class needs outside of the 3 I mentioned above is the same change that every other class also needs, reversing the DoT nerfs from U35.

Something to consider is make skulls also leave a corpse to allow for the other abilities to proc their bonuses more often.

xDeusEJRx

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

Necro doesn't need much, especially defensively.
Changes that would easily make the class much stronger and less focused on the bomb builds.
1. make skulls travel faster to be more reliable
2. make the mage/archer count as both DoTs and pets so they get buffed by the passives
3. give in class access to major sorcery/brutality

The only other change the class needs outside of the 3 I mentioned above is the same change that every other class also needs, reversing the DoT nerfs from U35.

Something to consider is make skulls also leave a corpse to allow for the other abilities to proc their bonuses more often.

I for the most part agree with all of this, however I would probably change the base ability of Skeletal mage to have that 12% ramping damage that the archer morph has, convert it into a DoT and maybe just make the Skeletal archer tick faster or something along those lines. It would make both into viable morphs. Skeletal arcanist has 12% ramping damage and an AOE splash on original target, Archer has 12% ramping damage and attacks quicker(every 1 second instead of every 2)

Turtle_Bot

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

Necro doesn't need much, especially defensively.
Changes that would easily make the class much stronger and less focused on the bomb builds.
1. make skulls travel faster to be more reliable
2. make the mage/archer count as both DoTs and pets so they get buffed by the passives
3. give in class access to major sorcery/brutality

The only other change the class needs outside of the 3 I mentioned above is the same change that every other class also needs, reversing the DoT nerfs from U35.

Something to consider is make skulls also leave a corpse to allow for the other abilities to proc their bonuses more often.

I for the most part agree with all of this, however I would probably change the base ability of Skeletal mage to have that 12% ramping damage that the archer morph has, convert it into a DoT and maybe just make the Skeletal archer tick faster or something along those lines. It would make both into viable morphs. Skeletal arcanist has 12% ramping damage and an AOE splash on original target, Archer has 12% ramping damage and attacks quicker(every 1 second instead of every 2)

Fair enough, I left it to count as both a pet and a DoT to still allow for "petcro" builds to be an option. In general I would also prefer if pets overall were more like DoTs than pets, but that is my preference and not how everyone enjoys them hence leaving them counting as both in my suggestion.

Zekka

So many bad takes from people who clearly don't touch the class outside of midyear potato farming

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

3. Removing the damage bonus would destroy the skill. The only reason people use it is because of it's self activation because it does burst damage, removing the damage bonus removes the one point of using the skill - burst damage. Harmony cro playstyle has already been blistered so many times, already receiving a nerf from the 50% damage down to 30%, that will just gut the damage even further. Nonsensical change.

The damage bonus only applies to the DoT part which is irrelevant in PvP, not the synergy.

KilianDermoth

techprince wrote: »

The Necromancer class
1) Doesn't provide Major Sorcery/Prophecy within its toolkit.
2) Has no instant stun.
3) Its spammable has the lowest projectile speed.
4) Has no dedicated execution. The execute crit chance depends on the number of Grave Lord skills slotted which due to the above reasons isn't possible to reach its highest potential.

1) As the Sorc hasnt for example.
2) The Sorc has no reliable burst heal, now lets guess whats worse? Especially because there are some non class stuns while there is no non class burst heal that is as powerful as render flesh.
3) Slower than Crystal Fragments?
4) The Execute of the Sorc works only for kill stealing otherwise then that its meh and often not good enough to be used. I would argue that its not better than the execute scaling you got which at least is always active if you have at least any skill slotted. Also the execute scaling on the Necro can even be combined with (powerful) execute skills from weapon skill lines. Whats prety unique.

Melzo

[snip] All my changes were aimed at not weakening the necromancer in PvE content, but at the same time radically revising the necromancer as a pvp class.

I am especially amazed that you misunderstand what the changes are aimed at.

xDeusEJRx

3. Removing the damage bonus would destroy the skill. The only reason people use it is because of it's self activation because it does burst damage, removing the damage bonus removes the one point of using the skill - burst damage. Harmony cro playstyle has already been blistered so many times, already receiving a nerf from the 50% damage down to 30%, that will just gut the damage even further. Nonsensical change.

[snip] The 30% damage bonus is related to the activation from the corpse and is aimed at dot damage. Moreover, this bonus is aimed at balancing damage in PvE content and is absolutely useless in PvP. It doesn't enhance synergy.

5. I actually like shocking siphon. Shocking siphon can proc the necromancer passive Dismember giving 1500 penetration just from activating the skill for free because the ability has no cost. Removing that means necros have to have 100% uptime on one of their summons to get their full pen value and that seems like sabotaging a class you're trying to buff. Plus I like using shocking siphon as a replacement for Camo hunter/Inner light for the passive 3% damage done and basically free DoT damage it does plus you get free resources as well. I like using this as a replacement for Mortal coil, cause it's basically an offensive version of mortal coil after the tri-resource regen it does. Changing this would force every necro to use Mortal coil again.

This is the second balance bonus in PvE content. In particular, the above two skills are aimed at increasing dps in PVE content. Other classes receive adequate damage bonuses or the skills themselves are stronger, but bonuses such as a 30% damage bonus from the previous skill and a 3% damage increase from it make the necromancer weaker than other classes. This is why Siphon shouldn't have a 3% damage bonus. This will allow you to buff other passives or skills of the necromancer at the expense of weakening the siphon and other similar costes aimed at balancing damage in PvE content.

7. Such a change would make Spirit guardian a useless skill. The reason it was desired in the first place is because it absorbs some of your damage, now it's a better heal than intensive mender due to it lasting longer and pushing out more heals gradually. Removing the damage reduction would also gut the skill because it would despawn faster when you take damage because the health of the Guardian is linked to the health of it's summoner(that being 300,000 hp for the pet) so with less damage reduction the Guardian despawns faster than it normally would because you're now squishier. Not a good change

This change is meant to buff the weak skill compared to other classes and allow the ghost to get new changes. An 8 second duration ghost heals two targets, while a 16 second duration ghost heals the same as an 8 second duration ghost but lasts 16 and heals only one target. Reduce the 10% ghost damage reduction to 5% and give that reduction to another skill.

Further, his answer concerns pve content and I will not analyze it. And I didn't describe the healing amplification in the changes. Just a minor edit related to it.

But not amplification.

Turtle_Bot

Your answer disappointed me the most. [snip]

The colossus changes are only meant to make the set buff this skill. Why does the ritualist strengthen the skull but not the colossus?

5. no real direct change to this skill needed, just give necro a more reliable way to create corpses to allow this skill to be more useful in mobile fights.

And for what?? Well, let's say you can use this skill without corpses just do. I and other necromancers will not use it. There is another skill that deals damage in an area and puts on a synergy. And besides synergy, it gives nothing to the necromancer. What's the point of the siphon?

The skill described under number 8 gives protection by 10 percent. It is not used because it requires too many corpses, it also requires the necromancer to be less mobile due to the fact that the corpses do not run after you and are updated on the second click. As a result, with the first press you got 10 seconds of protection and reset it with the second. It also conflicts with other skills that require corpses.

I'm not a native speaker and answered for 1.5 hours ... the rest I'm too lazy to comment except for one.

Necro doesn't need much, especially defensively.
Changes that would easily make the class much stronger and less focused on the bomb builds.
1. make skulls travel faster to be more reliable
2. make the mage/archer count as both DoTs and pets so they get buffed by the passives
3. give in class access to major sorcery/brutality

I have always been against it. If you get buffs under number 3, it will be negative on the necromancer. I can get many ways to these buffs. This buff is an addition to the skill. This greatly affects the balance of skills. For example, if you give these buffs to a mage skeleton, then it will lose area damage or damage bonuses by 15 percent. You can give these buffs to a skeleton mage, but how will it differ from my necromancer drinking an elixir for similar buffs ?? You won't get any buff in pvp. I just don't understand how this will give me an advantage. Well, I will have these buffs. I will use potions that restore both stamina and mana, but this will not change my gameplay and this will not strengthen the necromancer, on the contrary, the skills will be weakened by the necromancer so that they meet all the balancing rules.

I wrote changes related to the skill that gives harmony. Specifically, I wanted a synergy-related morph for pvp content. [snip]

The Necromancer needs to change the gameplay, not buff a few skills. He won't get stronger due to the 5% skull increase. He will not become stronger from access to the buffs described above, he will not become stronger from the fact that the skeleton mage will deal point damage. Are you kidding??? The Skeleton Mage deals 600-700 damage every two seconds. With a liability it will be 660-770. Congratulations to your necromancer. In pvp, you will have a skeleton mage in 20 seconds, not 7000 damage, but 7700 .... And even if he beats that player, you will not be able to control him.

[snip] Increase spam ability by 5%. I would like to see it. Developers will not change the basic formulas of the game...It was for this reason that I weakened some skills, or rather rebalanced them.

3. give in class access to major sorcery/brutality

[snip] Because of this, some skill will suffer.

[edited for baiting]

xDeusEJRx

Melzo wrote: »

[snip] All my changes were aimed at not weakening the necromancer in PvE content, but at the same time radically revising the necromancer as a pvp class.

I am especially amazed that you misunderstand what the changes are aimed at.

xDeusEJRx

3. Removing the damage bonus would destroy the skill. The only reason people use it is because of it's self activation because it does burst damage, removing the damage bonus removes the one point of using the skill - burst damage. Harmony cro playstyle has already been blistered so many times, already receiving a nerf from the 50% damage down to 30%, that will just gut the damage even further. Nonsensical change.

[snip] The 30% damage bonus is related to the activation from the corpse and is aimed at dot damage. Moreover, this bonus is aimed at balancing damage in PvE content and is absolutely useless in PvP. It doesn't enhance synergy.

5. I actually like shocking siphon. Shocking siphon can proc the necromancer passive Dismember giving 1500 penetration just from activating the skill for free because the ability has no cost. Removing that means necros have to have 100% uptime on one of their summons to get their full pen value and that seems like sabotaging a class you're trying to buff. Plus I like using shocking siphon as a replacement for Camo hunter/Inner light for the passive 3% damage done and basically free DoT damage it does plus you get free resources as well. I like using this as a replacement for Mortal coil, cause it's basically an offensive version of mortal coil after the tri-resource regen it does. Changing this would force every necro to use Mortal coil again.

This is the second balance bonus in PvE content. In particular, the above two skills are aimed at increasing dps in PVE content. Other classes receive adequate damage bonuses or the skills themselves are stronger, but bonuses such as a 30% damage bonus from the previous skill and a 3% damage increase from it make the necromancer weaker than other classes. This is why Siphon shouldn't have a 3% damage bonus. This will allow you to buff other passives or skills of the necromancer at the expense of weakening the siphon and other similar costes aimed at balancing damage in PvE content.

7. Such a change would make Spirit guardian a useless skill. The reason it was desired in the first place is because it absorbs some of your damage, now it's a better heal than intensive mender due to it lasting longer and pushing out more heals gradually. Removing the damage reduction would also gut the skill because it would despawn faster when you take damage because the health of the Guardian is linked to the health of it's summoner(that being 300,000 hp for the pet) so with less damage reduction the Guardian despawns faster than it normally would because you're now squishier. Not a good change

This change is meant to buff the weak skill compared to other classes and allow the ghost to get new changes. An 8 second duration ghost heals two targets, while a 16 second duration ghost heals the same as an 8 second duration ghost but lasts 16 and heals only one target. Reduce the 10% ghost damage reduction to 5% and give that reduction to another skill.

Further, his answer concerns pve content and I will not analyze it. And I didn't describe the healing amplification in the changes. Just a minor edit related to it.

But not amplification.

1. Shocking siphon is indeed used to boost numbers in PVE, but just because it's good for PVE content doesn't mean it can't be also applied to PVP. It's not a "great" pvp skill, but it's still free and I don't see much of a reason changing shocking siphon the way functions when fundamentally the weak point of Magcro is it's class damage is the weakest part of it. It seems like a nonsensical change from a free skill. It provides passive damage increase that stacks with other buffs and free sustain, which allows for some leeway to play around with. I stand by my point that such a change is nonsensical. You claim it causes "weakened skills and passives", which I'm sure you're referring to Rapid Rot. I'm not sure why this skill can't both be a thing and a change to passives such as Rapid Rot. Because once again as I said, the damage portion is what is lacking the most, so it seems counter-intuitive to change that skill when it's mostly just for passive buffing. It passively gives a damage buff, plus it activates necro passive that increases necromancer penetration, plus it provides sustain and free weak damage.
Not an OP skill, also not terrible for a skill that's literally free to use.

2. On intensive mender and spirit guardian thing, I understand what your intent is, but it's still a pointless change for both skills. Turning intensive mender into a multi-heal seems useless in the long run because having it heal 2 targets instead of 1 seems pointless when there's way better heals for cross-healing. Mender always smart heals so not everyone gets the heal. Why use intensive mender when I can use energy orb, an AOE heal that heals EVERYONE near the orb or use regeneration which heals 3 targets all at once? Not only that, the ability heals once every 2 seconds which is 4 ticks of healing, plus the ability only heals when your HP reduces on top of that. Whereas Regen or Energy orb are always ticking heals on you when active. It still seems like a useless change to intensive mender when better cross healing options exist. If I was a necro healer I would still choose to go with Guardian and a better cross heal over this such a change in intensive mender

Spirit guardian on the other hand, I did originally miss when you said moving the 5% damage reduction elsewhere. However, removing the 5% and putting it somewhere else sounds cool but necromancer doesn't need a more passive tankiness.
Though I realize after re-reading you said you intend to move 5% reduction elsewhere, but again that seems like a pointless change. I don't believe necromancers need any sort of change to their tankiness nor healing, it's fine how it is other than intensive mender underperforming. They are not lacking defensively or in terms of healing power

[edited to remove quote]

Zekka

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

1. Shocking siphon is indeed used to boost numbers in PVE, but just because it's good for PVE content doesn't mean it can't be also applied to PVP. It's not a "great" pvp skill, but it's still free and I don't see much of a reason changing shocking siphon the way functions when fundamentally the weak point of Magcro is it's class damage is the weakest part of it. It seems like a nonsensical change from a free skill. It provides passive damage increase that stacks with other buffs and free sustain, which allows for some leeway to play around with. I stand by my point that such a change is nonsensical. You claim it causes "weakened skills and passives", which I'm sure you're referring to Rapid Rot. I'm not sure why this skill can't both be a thing and a change to passives such as Rapid Rot. Because once again as I said, the damage portion is what is lacking the most, so it seems counter-intuitive to change that skill when it's mostly just for passive buffing. It passively gives a damage buff, plus it activates necro passive that increases necromancer penetration, plus it provides sustain and free weak damage.
Not an OP skill, also not terrible for a skill that's literally free to use.

It's not free, you're wasting a precious skill slot on a completely useless skill for a pitiful 3% damage modifier, on a class with horrible bar space issues, you would be better off slotting Camo hunter.
It's not even a good PvE skill these days thanks to hybridization, PvErs use Detonating siphon now.

xDeusEJRx

Zekka wrote: »

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

1. Shocking siphon is indeed used to boost numbers in PVE, but just because it's good for PVE content doesn't mean it can't be also applied to PVP. It's not a "great" pvp skill, but it's still free and I don't see much of a reason changing shocking siphon the way functions when fundamentally the weak point of Magcro is it's class damage is the weakest part of it. It seems like a nonsensical change from a free skill. It provides passive damage increase that stacks with other buffs and free sustain, which allows for some leeway to play around with. I stand by my point that such a change is nonsensical. You claim it causes "weakened skills and passives", which I'm sure you're referring to Rapid Rot. I'm not sure why this skill can't both be a thing and a change to passives such as Rapid Rot. Because once again as I said, the damage portion is what is lacking the most, so it seems counter-intuitive to change that skill when it's mostly just for passive buffing. It passively gives a damage buff, plus it activates necro passive that increases necromancer penetration, plus it provides sustain and free weak damage.
Not an OP skill, also not terrible for a skill that's literally free to use.

It's not free, you're wasting a precious skill slot on a completely useless skill for a pitiful 3% damage modifier, on a class with horrible bar space issues, you would be better off slotting Camo hunter.
It's not even a good PvE skill these days thanks to hybridization, PvErs use Detonating siphon now.

Part of bar space problem could be fixed by giving them an access to a class Brutality and sorcery. Every class has access to it at least somewhere in their class kit now except Necromancer. Part of hybridizatiion changes was to give more leeway hence why Jabs now provides sorcery/brutality (not sure why the magic morph doesn't do the same). Part of it could be solved by giving Necro access to that in the class kit somewhere so Entropy/Rally/sorcery and brutality pots are required on a setup.

A tight skill bar is typically only something harmony cro's have problems with, being forced to use boneyard, blastbones, possible rally or entropy and a spammable like D swing/Arterial burst/Ele weapon, and maybe an execute like whirling blades and executioner.
Playing non-harmony necro typically always has a laughable looking front bar a lot of the times it's just a half buff bar with maybe 2 or 3 actual damaging skills.
Hence why I think a change is silly, Necromancers suffer from a lack of offensive options in their kit which limits viability if you want to deviate from the harmony dps meta.

Most changes here don't even seem to fix the weakest part of the necro toolkit, that being the offensive kit.

I think the best solutions would be to:
1. Give them brutality/sorcery somewhere in the toolkit as to make it fair with every other class having at least 1 source found in the kit
2. Make necro summons count as pets and then allowing them to be buffed by pet related sets
3. Change Skeletal mage's base ability to have a ramping 12% damage buff. Currently only the archer morph has this applied to it. I think the base ability should have seeing as how weak a skill it already is. Perhaps keep arcanist morph as AOE and archer maybe tick every 1 second as opposed to 2
4. Flame/Venom skull honestly both need a travel time increase. Too many skills suffer from extremely slow travel times, this being a skill that does. I would much rather be a bow necro than use this as a spammable because bow abilities have a way faster travel time. Hell I even think warden's birds travel times are faster.
5. You guys seemed to correct me about boneyard's damage, so I concede that point. However I don't see much as to why boneyard removing 30% is even a relevant change or is necessary. It seems to add nothing at all to the skill in PVP
6. Perhaps turn empowering grasp into a conal AoE around the caster kind of like how DK talons would work. It can still have multiple patches, instead it slowly expands outward and the 3rd set of patches stun still. Kind of like how it currently function, so it has a better chance of actually hitting people and can be used better for positional crowd controlling like how Talons can be used on DK. (Maybe this one is a little much)

Turtle_Bot

Turtle_Bot

Your answer disappointed me the most. [snip]

I'm not sure where the necro was designed only for ranged combat, it was clearly designed to have options to fight both up close and at range (see plar and warden who have similar options)

The colossus changes are only meant to make the set buff this skill. Why does the ritualist strengthen the skull but not the colossus?

You missed over the fact that colossus is already one of the strongest ultimates in the game that also provides a very rare debuff (major vulnerability) in a large AoE alongside dealing a lot of damage and it can be cast at range.
It doesn't need a buff at all, let alone be changed to allow a set to buff its damage by a unique 16% on top of the already 10% increase it gets on the second and third slams from the major vulnerability it also inflicts.

5. no real direct change to this skill needed, just give necro a more reliable way to create corpses to allow this skill to be more useful in mobile fights.

And for what?? Well, let's say you can use this skill without corpses just do. I and other necromancers will not use it. There is another skill that deals damage in an area and puts on a synergy. And besides synergy, it gives nothing to the necromancer. What's the point of the siphon?

Siphon gives another DoT option, that either grants sustain or deals a burst of damage at its end (needs to be tested if "ending" counts when recast as that could get quite strong if used as part of a combo). It is also a free skill, it literally costs 0 resources to use it.

The skill described under number 8 gives protection by 10 percent. It is not used because it requires too many corpses, it also requires the necromancer to be less mobile due to the fact that the corpses do not run after you and are updated on the second click. As a result, with the first press you got 10 seconds of protection and reset it with the second. It also conflicts with other skills that require corpses.

deaden pain (skill in number 8) still provides major protection for free which is a very rare buff that is only provided by 2 ultimates and a few 5 piece set bonuses. I explained that the reason it's not used is because it has to compete with the other morph that generates ultimate, which will always win out over any other buff (see old oakensoul when it had major heroism and DKs that build ultigen builds that do well).
Also most of my points were not "negative" at all and even added or gave alternate options to your suggestions. The only one that might have came close was about the changes to spirit guardian that were essentially turning it into the old intensive mender which was extremely overtuned.

I'm not a native speaker and answered for 1.5 hours ... the rest I'm too lazy to comment except for one.

Necro doesn't need much, especially defensively.
Changes that would easily make the class much stronger and less focused on the bomb builds.
1. make skulls travel faster to be more reliable
2. make the mage/archer count as both DoTs and pets so they get buffed by the passives
3. give in class access to major sorcery/brutality

I have always been against it. If you get buffs under number 3, it will be negative on the necromancer. I can get many ways to these buffs. This buff is an addition to the skill. This greatly affects the balance of skills. For example, if you give these buffs to a mage skeleton, then it will lose area damage or damage bonuses by 15 percent. You can give these buffs to a skeleton mage, but how will it differ from my necromancer drinking an elixir for similar buffs ?? You won't get any buff in pvp. I just don't understand how this will give me an advantage. Well, I will have these buffs. I will use potions that restore both stamina and mana, but this will not change my gameplay and this will not strengthen the necromancer, on the contrary, the skills will be weakened by the necromancer so that they meet all the balancing rules.

Not sure why you would be against having an in class access to major sorcery/brutality. Just because an ability gets those common buffs, doesn't mean that it will guaranteed be nerfed in some other way. I also never said which specific ability should get those buffs, I left that up to others to decide where to put those buffs, I just pointed out that those buffs and changes were things that are missing from the necro kit. I also put forward things that would directly help with the issues you mentioned, such as making skulls travel faster so that they hit targets better, also pointed out that more corpse generation options need to be a thing as well to help with how many corpses are consumed by the necromancer abilities and the pets counting as both pets and dots means they get buffed by both the rapid rot passive and sets like ritualist.

I wrote changes related to the skill that gives harmony. Specifically, I wanted a synergy-related morph for pvp content. [snip]

The Necromancer needs to change the gameplay, not buff a few skills. He won't get stronger due to the 5% skull increase. He will not become stronger from access to the buffs described above, he will not become stronger from the fact that the skeleton mage will deal point damage. Are you kidding??? The Skeleton Mage deals 600-700 damage every two seconds. With a liability it will be 660-770. Congratulations to your necromancer. In pvp, you will have a skeleton mage in 20 seconds, not 7000 damage, but 7700 .... And even if he beats that player, you will not be able to control him.

[snip] Increase spam ability by 5%. I would like to see it. Developers will not change the basic formulas of the game...It was for this reason that I weakened some skills, or rather rebalanced them.

3. give in class access to major sorcery/brutality

[snip] Because of this, some skill will suffer.

[snip]
[edited for minor baiting & to remove quote]

Zekka

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

You missed over the fact that colossus is already one of the strongest ultimates in the game that also provides a very rare debuff (major vulnerability) in a large AoE alongside dealing a lot of damage and it can be cast at range.
It doesn't need a buff at all, let alone be changed to allow a set to buff its damage by a unique 16% on top of the already 10% increase it gets on the second and third slams from the major vulnerability it also inflicts.

I don't agree with it getting buffed by Ritualist but an ultimate that needs the most broken set in the game to be useable is not "one of the strongest ultimates in the game" (no good solo necro slots it without dark convergence, they all slot dawnbreaker on non convergence builds).
It looks good in its tooltip, so do lots of bad ults like soul assault.

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

Siphon gives another DoT option, that either grants sustain or deals a burst of damage at its end (needs to be tested if "ending" counts when recast as that could get quite strong if used as part of a combo). It is also a free skill, it literally costs 0 resources to use it.

The explosion does happen if recasted early, if you don't know how a PvE skill you claim has any use in PvP works...
It's completely useless for PvP (and shocking siphon just useless these days), there are no "combos" to perform with it.

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

deaden pain (skill in number 8) still provides major protection for free which is a very rare buff that is only provided by 2 ultimates and a few 5 piece set bonuses. I explained that the reason it's not used is because it has to compete with the other morph that generates ultimate, which will always win out over any other buff (see old oakensoul when it had major heroism and DKs that build ultigen builds that do well).

Major protection is nowhere near as rare as you make it to be. Deaden pain is a dead morph, it was already the less popular morph back when major protection was 30% mitigation now it's just a joke. Anyone who really wants major protection slots Flare which gives it just for having it on your bar.
And stop calling corpse consuming skills free, you still need to spend resources to produce corpses.

Only point I agree with is access to major sorcery/brutality.

Ankael07 wrote: »

Agony Totem isnt even 2 secons stun anymore. Its actually after 4 seconds now, first stun burst doesnt work for some reason

I just tested it since it has not been on my bar for years now and holy ***, you're right lmao.
That's the skill people here claim they use to CC people in a graveyard and get a full spammable worth of damage from it btw.

Melzo

You missed over the fact that colossus is already one of the strongest ultimates in the game that also provides a very rare debuff (major vulnerability) in a large AoE alongside dealing a lot of damage and it can be cast at range.
It doesn't need a buff at all, let alone be changed to allow a set to buff its damage by a unique 16% on top of the already 10% increase it gets on the second and third slams from the major vulnerability it also inflicts.

[snip] Why can't a set buff a skill?? I can replace this set with the Burning Spellweave set. It gives 490 spell damage. This is enough to compete with the Riualist. Set ritualist buffs the sorcerer's pet and it is also an ultimate. Why is this set needed if it is useless?? I can get more versatile sets that provide damage bonuses and still deal more damage with all skills and not just pet skills. If it doesn't provide a unique bonus to a limited number of pet-related skills, then why even bother with it? That's why they don't play with this set. He's not nearly as strong as you think.

Siphon gives another DoT option, that either grants sustain or deals a burst of damage at its end (needs to be tested if "ending" counts when recast as that could get quite strong if used as part of a combo). It is also a free skill, it literally costs 0 resources to use it.

AND?? Well, it will be free. It will deal area damage. But why would anyone use it? The skill is useless. I don't need a free skill. Do you think if it's free then it's effective? In addition to this skill, there are other skills that deal dot damage in an area. I and other players do not use them, not because they are expensive in terms of cost, but because they are useless.

deaden pain (skill in number 8) still provides major protection for free which is a very rare buff that is only provided by 2 ultimates and a few 5 piece set bonuses. I explained that the reason it's not used is because it has to compete with the other morph that generates ultimate, which will always win out over any other buff (see old oakensoul when it had major heroism and DKs that build ultigen builds that do well).
Also most of my points were not "negative" at all and even added or gave alternate options to your suggestions. The only one that might have came close was about the changes to spirit guardian that were essentially turning it into the old intensive mender which was extremely overtuned.

Well, what can I say ... You can't break your logic. This morph is meant to protect the necromancer, not to gain ultimate points. I'm ready to completely abandon the ult point gain, if only this skill would be more effective. And top it all off. The morph linked for scoring ultimate points is taken only by necromancers with bomb builds. The rest don't need it. I will say more that in pvp morphs that give a lot of ultimate points show much worse than Mortal Coil or Resolving Vigor. If you don't play with bomb builds then scoring ultimates is pointless. You will have less self-healing and defense, and the ultimate colossus deals extremely mediocre damage when you are not using crowd-killing special builds. This is the point of gaining ultimate points, but the morph that gives 10 percent protection is frankly weak. I play solo and for defense I take Resolving Vigor or mortal coil. Not because I don't like the skill, but because it's weak.

Skills take depending on your playstyle. In this case, one morph is designed to gain ultimate points and kill the crowd, and the other to protect the necromancer. [snip]

Not sure why you would be against having an in class access to major sorcery/brutality. Just because an ability gets those common buffs, doesn't mean that it will guaranteed be nerfed in some other way. I also never said which specific ability should get those buffs, I left that up to others to decide where to put those buffs, I just pointed out that those buffs and changes were things that are missing from the necro kit. I also put forward things that would directly help with the issues you mentioned, such as making skulls travel faster so that they hit targets better, also pointed out that more corpse generation options need to be a thing as well to help with how many corpses are consumed by the necromancer abilities and the pets counting as both pets and dots means they get buffed by both the rapid rot passive and sets like ritualist.

I'll give an example. If you add one of the buffs to the mage skeleton then the mage skeleton will be more useful than degeneration. There are general skills that allow you to complement your build in the absence of certain class buffs. This allows you to create distinct classes. If every class will have the same thing then what's the point of playing eso ? I play a necromancer, not a sorcerer or dk. Each class must be special. But why is it special if each class has the same buffs. Then it's easier to remove them altogether and play without them. This will allow you to create unique skills and not stupid abilities that give the same buffs. Your argument to give a necromancer these buffs just because he doesn't have them is very strange. I don’t see the point in the class system and universal skills if there is such stupidity as the same buffs for all classes.

The most important thing is that the skills have a certain weight. For example, Skeleton Mage deals the same damage as Degeneration, but has additional effects. You are simply replacing the additional effect with the buff you need, thus, with a high probability you will ruin the skill. It might be good for you, but for me, using general skills and potions will only make things worse.

[snip]
[edited for baiting]

Melzo

I want to add one more thing. Even if the developers do what you want, the warden will still be stronger than the necromancer. the necromancer does not have its own adequate mechanics for pvp. And the necromancer, in fact, is just a pathetic parody, even with all the changes offered to you on the warden. Any build other than the bomb is just a weaker version of the warden. I just don't see the point in this class. It doesn't provide anything special. You do not feel this class just do. As if you are a monkey outside the window, repeating the actions of a person (warden) but anyway you are not and do not surpass him. The Necromancer needs a significant gameplay change. Instead of offering such stupid things as increasing the damage of the skull or its speed, as well as adding buffs to the skills that you can get anyway ....In other games, classes evolve and in eso they are adjusted....

Sergykid

so much wall of text, [snip]

if u just tinker damage numbers u hurt pve. It needs better functionality.

[edited for baiting]

techprince

What if colossus smash leaves an AOE effect on the ground? So necros will actually use their own ult for damage other than debuff which is now readily available to everyone via armour/monster set.

CameraBeardThePirate

Necro needs 2 main things.

1) Access to one of, if not both of, major sorc/brut or major proph/sav through their class skills. You could add this to the archer/arcanist since after the most recent 50% stealth nerf to these skills there's no real reason to use them. This would help free up some much needed bar space while also letting necro utilize their strong class passives.

2) More offensive viability through their class skills besides Avid Boneyard. Blastbones is a good ability, but outside of that and Avid Boneyard, Necro is forced to use weapon/guild skill lines for their main offense. Their spammable is horrendous as the animation is difficult to weave and the projectile is horribly slow, while also not providing much incentive to use it over other ranged spammables. A total rework of skulls would be nice, but a simple projectile speed increase would go a long way. The fact that they're now the only class without access to an on demand stun through their class kit also hurts them offensively because it shoehorns them into specific weapon combinations. Their DoT passive doesn't do much for them unless you run Proc DoTs, because they only have access to 2 class DoTs, neither of which are sticky DoTs which hinders their usability in PvP. Important to note that the Archer/Mage do not count as DoTs and are therefore not buffed by the passive - this is ludicrous, especially given the inconsistencies of this ability's targeting and the fact that you cannot command them like normal pets. Finally, fix Empowering Grasp. All abilities granting Empower should be looked at in PvP, but this ability is absolutely atrocious. They tried to buff it by letting the pet bonus apply to blastbones, but actually hitting your pets with it in the middle of combat is impossible. It should give its buff either passively while slotted or on cast - regardless of whether you hit your pets or not.

TL;DR: Give them access to one of, if not both of, the major offensive buffs (power and crit), as well as an on demand stun. Rework some of their offensive and utility class skills to give more incentive to use them over weapon skills. The class doesn't need much help as they have excellent passives, they just don't really have much of a reason to use many their own class abilities.

xDeusEJRx

Melzo wrote: »

Not sure why you would be against having an in class access to major sorcery/brutality. Just because an ability gets those common buffs, doesn't mean that it will guaranteed be nerfed in some other way. I also never said which specific ability should get those buffs, I left that up to others to decide where to put those buffs, I just pointed out that those buffs and changes were things that are missing from the necro kit. I also put forward things that would directly help with the issues you mentioned, such as making skulls travel faster so that they hit targets better, also pointed out that more corpse generation options need to be a thing as well to help with how many corpses are consumed by the necromancer abilities and the pets counting as both pets and dots means they get buffed by both the rapid rot passive and sets like ritualist.

I'll give an example. If you add one of the buffs to the mage skeleton then the mage skeleton will be more useful than degeneration. There are general skills that allow you to complement your build in the absence of certain class buffs. This allows you to create distinct classes. If every class will have the same thing then what's the point of playing eso ? I play a necromancer, not a sorcerer or dk. Each class must be special. But why is it special if each class has the same buffs. Then it's easier to remove them altogether and play without them. This will allow you to create unique skills and not stupid abilities that give the same buffs. Your argument to give a necromancer these buffs just because he doesn't have them is very strange. I don’t see the point in the class system and universal skills if there is such stupidity as the same buffs for all classes.

The most important thing is that the skills have a certain weight. For example, Skeleton Mage deals the same damage as Degeneration, but has additional effects. You are simply replacing the additional effect with the buff you need, thus, with a high probability you will ruin the skill. It might be good for you, but for me, using general skills and potions will only make things worse.

Every class has access to major brutality/sorcery now. Though templar only have it on stam version of jabs, but the point being that it exists in every other class toolkit but necromancer. Giving them a class access to brutality/sorcery means they have more options to play around with.
I could choose to use a set like Innate axiom, which specifically buffs class abilities, degeneration and rally doesn't fit into that set because they are non-class abilities.
Giving a class brutality/sorcery gives necro a lot more room to play around with builds and have more freedom, which is a good thing. It doesn't devalue the class, it just gives more options.

Also degen is tied to mages guild passives so you could get more max mag/regen if you so wanted to for your build so there's a use in it still. Same for Rally/forward momentum, the rally skill is tied to a powerful arena weapon, the Frenzied momentum 2h arena weapon. So that adds more viability and use to rally/momentum as well outside of being a heal.

So neither skill would be made obsolete just by adding in a class source of brutality/sorcery. Would less people be running degen? Yeah, most likely but this supposed to be buffing MagCro and giving them more options to be a stronger class is a good thing.

Melzo

Each class has its own characteristics. What is special if you give the same buff to a necromancer?? And Sense then from the general skills?? And even if you give bonuses to the skeleton mage, he will still remain a sucky skill. Since nothing damages. Everyone wants to give the necromancer what others have, but I want this class to have its own unique gameplay that can defeat other players. The necromancer has nothing unique. Any build of a necromancer can be repeated by another class and they will perform much better.

Melzo

I suggest replacing the morph from the second branch that gives 10 percent protection with a new unique skill similar in mechanics to the sorcerer's knives. Click on it and you will automatically consume the corpses around you. After consuming 4 corpses, you can deal damage with a bone hand from underground to an enemy at a distance and stun. The skill will deal about the same amount of damage as blastbones, crystals, curses, or cockroaches. Approximately the same damage and stun for 3 seconds. Given that you can only get a corpse every 3 seconds, you can only use the skill every 12 seconds. And even if this skill can be dodged or blocked, I will still be insanely happy with the new damage dealing skill. And then in fact you have only one skill and this is blastbones. You can safely throw out the first bunch of skills if you are not a bomber ...

katorga

Major sorcery/brutality as a class passive, active while pet is up. Every single class has native access to this buff now, except Necro.

Blastbones needs to work 100% of the time. It still fails to function at all much of the time and just stand there until it expires. It needs to jump up/down from keep walls. afaik, warden and necro delayed burst skills are the only ones totally useless on keep walls. If they stay limited, then BB needs to do damage comparable to merciless resolve.

Shocking siphon and morphs need to be a normal targeted DOT, from target to corpse. Not from caster to corpse.

Archer needs to stop being punished as a dot, it is direct damage. If it is a dot, then it needs to targeted, and stay on the target, not "whatever enemy is closest".

Agony totem needs to stun instantly on cast and every 2 seconds after. Right now it has a 4 second delay, the first pulse rarely happens.

Empowering grasp and morphs needs to be replaced and reworked.

Flame skull and morphs needs to give passive minor expedition, set opponents off balance every third cast, and buff damage 10%...stam morph needs to 100% crit every 3rd cast...