Tribute random match against blocked/ignore list?

Cerulione

Hello, if I block/ignore someone, would there be chance the random match generator put me to play Tribute against this person? (same question with dungeon RND & battleground)

Katheriah

Yes

Lunatearz

Cerulione wrote: »

Hello, if I block/ignore someone, would there be chance the random match generator put me to play Tribute against this person? (same question with dungeon RND & battleground)

Yes unfortunately..... I hope they change this.. its very griefing to have to go up against people you are trying to avoid altogether.

spartaxoxo

If they allowed this it would get abused. People would just ignore people that they lose against too much, and if someone is really good they could end up having to wait a long time to get a match.

I remember they had this in Overwatch, and one of the best sniper players in the game couldn't find games in a timely fashion. He had such huge wait times they actually investigated him. They found he was actually a perfectly good sport and wasn't misbehaving, what was actually happening is he'd absolutely dominate a match and then get avoided so people didn't have to play against him and lose. The result on him was it was hard to find him a match because so many people avoided him.

The same thing would happen here.

Lunatearz

spartaxoxo wrote: »

If they allowed this it would get abused. People would just ignore people that they lose against too much, and if someone is really good they could end up having to wait a long time to get a match.

I remember they had this in Overwatch, and one of the best sniper players in the game couldn't find games in a timely fashion. He had such huge wait times they actually investigated him. They found he was actually a perfectly good sport and wasn't misbehaving, what was actually happening is he'd absolutely dominate a match and then get avoided so people didn't have to play against him and lose. The result on him was it was hard to find him a match because so many people avoided him.

The same thing would happen here.

I dont see why this would be called abuse.... im puzzled..

Games are meant to be fun not cause grief.. If that's not your first goal as a game developer you are missing your goal.

it will end up in fewer and fewer people playing ToT so the result will be that the so-called dominating players are not having people to play against either and if they do these ppl are gonna feel bad. Is that what you want? Have prey for the dominators? This by the way isn't my reason for my suggestion.

It's MY choice to block a person for personal reasons so if I have fewer ppl to play against then I can't advance and have long waiting times. isn't that my own responsibility? My own choice? instead of being forced to give up on a game because I don't want to run into a certain person that always plays in my timezone.

Another option would be to make the names hidden so you don't know who plays against who at all. Just add a report button if there's something that needs reported and only that will send the players names with the ticket and the info. But none of the players see each others names.

spartaxoxo

It's abuse to block someone for being good because it's the player that was blocked that ends up with long waiting times, not the players doing the blocking.

All those players that blocked the sniper were adding just 1 name on their list, low waiting times. No repercussions for them.

The sniper had such unreasonably long waiting times that it merited an investigation, because a ton of people had blocked him.

People who are being polite and are following the rules shouldn't have to wait a long time for matches because they are skilled and the people blocking them don't want proper competition. Blocking someone for being better than you goes against the spirit of competition and undermines the integrity of the queue in a way that is unfair for the skilled player.

Amottica

Katheriah wrote: »

Yes

This is the answer. The ignore list makes it so we do not see what they post in chat. It does not affect being grouped with the players.

I have seen in other games where the ignore list prevented players from being grouped in PvE but never in PvP. I think such a design works well.

@spartaxoxo notes why the ignore list should not affect PvP/ToT.

kevkj

What kind of card games are you people having where so much bad blood can develop between you and one other player? I recognize players all the time and neither of us have whispered each other or done anything in-game that would be remotely construed as griefing/refusing to play each other.

Rooatouille

Lunatearz wrote: »

I dont see why this would be called abuse.... im puzzled..

It would be abused by players because, as @spartaxoxo mentioned, people would just block players they lose to often or know are strong players, allowing you to trim players that outclass you from your potential match pool and essentially farm Ranked Points and victory rewards from the remaining players that you are confident playing against.

Amottica wrote: »

...The ignore list makes it so we do not see what they post in chat. It does not affect being grouped with the players.

This comment illustrates how the block/ignore function does and should continue to work. Anything more would be unreasonable.

Lunatearz

Rooatouille wrote: »

Lunatearz wrote: »

I dont see why this would be called abuse.... im puzzled..

It would be abused by players because, as @spartaxoxo mentioned, people would just block players they lose to often or know are strong players, allowing you to trim players that outclass you from your potential match pool and essentially farm Ranked Points and victory rewards from the remaining players that you are confident playing against.

Amottica wrote: »

...The ignore list makes it so we do not see what they post in chat. It does not affect being grouped with the players.

This comment illustrates how the block/ignore function does and should continue to work. Anything more would be unreasonable.

LOOK I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU SAY BUT THAT DOES NOT MAKE SENSE

They would have to play in your time zone to be able to gain points from them.

I won't be able to "farm" more points than them if they are of a higher rank than me because:

IF I BLOCK THEM I CAN'T GAIN POINTS EITHER IF NO ONE ELSE IS ON. If there is someone else on that means that they can play against that person too and gain points there.

If I see the said person that I have blocked in the game I leave that area but I can't do that in ToT Unless I don't play.

As I said another option is to make the names of both players unknown to each other and in case of reporting for a bug or whatever is needed these names can be revealed to the receiver of the bug report with the game info.

Obviously, you seem to think I magically can find players they cant find.

SilverBride

Lunatearz wrote: »

They would have to play in your time zone to be able to gain points from them.

In the US for example there is only a 3 hour difference in time between the east and west coasts. Many players from all across the country are on at the same time regardless of their time zone.

SeaGtGruff

spartaxoxo wrote: »

It's abuse to block someone for being good because it's the player that was blocked that ends up with long waiting times, not the players doing the blocking.

All those players that blocked the sniper were adding just 1 name on their list, low waiting times. No repercussions for them.

The sniper had such unreasonably long waiting times that it merited an investigation, because a ton of people had blocked him.

People who are being polite and are following the rules shouldn't have to wait a long time for matches because they are skilled and the people blocking them don't want proper competition. Blocking someone for being better than you goes against the spirit of competition and undermines the integrity of the queue in a way that is unfair for the skilled player.

Not only that, but if you could avoid matches against players you lost to, in theory you could unfairly increase your odds of winning random matches, thus helping to unfairly boost your ranking. I'm not sure you could block enough players to ensure that you'd win every match, but blocking the players who you consistently lost to most often would almost certainly increase your odds of winning random matches.

Lunatearz

okay one more time.. they can still get points if you can get points when they are on in the same time zone... even when you block them.. how difficult is that to understand?

its just one person you wont be able to play against and who wont be able to gain points from you OR you from them it works BOTH WAYS!!!

and to block ppl you lost a match to you would be dumb because you wont be able to get many matches anymore if you do that all the time..

with a limit to unblock - block period say you cant ublock again for the rest of the season means you are cutting yourself in your fingers and wont be able to gain points from them.

its NOT increasing your chances more then the other person because the ammount of points will be lower too when they are lower ranked.

Lunatearz

SilverBride wrote: »

Lunatearz wrote: »

They would have to play in your time zone to be able to gain points from them.

In the US for example there is only a 3 hour difference in time between the east and west coasts. Many players from all across the country are on at the same time regardless of their time zone.

that doesnt change that you cant play against them if they are not online.. many ppl in the top 100 i never played against because im in a different timezone that means i wont lose against them or win from them.

FluffyBird

Isn't ignore list limited anyway? One hundred, or something. Its a number of online players in 1-2 guilds. So one can't significantly "trim" pool of players with that.

And if someone if ignored by everyone, I think it's a problem that should be addressed from both sides. They have the right to play, yes, but if they are THAT unenjoyable to play with/against, why should other players to be forced to play with them?

spartaxoxo

There are 5 people online.

Gina is the best player in the game. Number 1. She blocks nobody and never even talks to other players.

She faces off against Tim, brand new to Rubedite. He feels lucky to even be there. Tim decides to block Jill, because he's just not ready to fight an opponent of that caliber.

Hana is a sore loser. She matches against Jill 3 times in a row and gets her butt kicked every single time. She blocks Jill in a fit of rage, right after she sends Gina a rather impolite message about a falsified tryst between Hana and Gina's mother.

Miguel recognizes Gina from his guild. Gina and his girlfriend don't get along, so he blocks Gina after their match.

Kyle is a conspiracy theorist. He's pretty sure certain players always get good RNG while he always gets bad RNG. He blocks Gina to "make his matches more fair."

Mo is a cutthroat player but pretty mid skill wise. He decides to block any player significantly better than him so he can get better matches. He blocks Gina.

Mo, Kyle, Miguel, and Hana can now all match against each other and get fast games without having to worry about playing Gina. In fact, they have an easier time without her around. Gina, who has done nothing to any of these people except win, cannot find a match because there is nobody to match her with.

While this scenario is entirely fake with entirely fictional people, it is based on how other games had to disallow people from blocking people from being their opponents, because people were blocked purely for their skill. These players were not unpleasant or someone others shouldn't have to deal with. They had not been impolite or broken any rules at all. They were just good.

FluffyBird

If there are only 5 people online, then the game has more serious problem than ignore mechanic. Like, what Tim did tells me that MMR system in that game isn't good. Besides, would Gina really want to play with a bunch of sore losers and idiots?

Lunatearz

spartaxoxo wrote: »

There are 5 people online.

Gina is the best player in the game. Number 1. She blocks nobody and never even talks to other players.

She faces off against Tim, brand new to Rubedite. He feels lucky to even be there. Tim decides to block Jill, because he's just not ready to fight an opponent of that caliber.

Hana is a sore loser. She matches against Jill 3 times in a row and gets her butt kicked every single time. She blocks Jill in a fit of rage, right after she sends Gina a rather impolite message about a falsified tryst between Hana and Gina's mother.

Miguel recognizes Gina from his guild. Gina and his girlfriend don't get along, so he blocks Gina after their match.

Kyle is a conspiracy theorist. He's pretty sure certain players always get good RNG while he always gets bad RNG. He blocks Gina to "make his matches more fair."

Mo is a cutthroat player but pretty mid skill wise. He decides to block any player significantly better than him so he can get better matches. He blocks Gina.

Mo, Kyle, Miguel, and Hana can now all match against each other and get fast games without having to worry about playing Gina. In fact, they have an easier time without her around. Gina, who has done nothing to any of these people except win, cannot find a match because there is nobody to match her with.

While this scenario is entirely fake with entirely fictional people, it is based on how other games had to disallow people from blocking people from being their opponents, because people were blocked purely for their skill. These players were not unpleasant or someone others shouldn't have to deal with. They had not been impolite or broken any rules at all. They were just good.

i guess your way of thinking explains something.. more then your story lol

Lunatearz

FluffyBird wrote: »

If there are only 5 people online, then the game has more serious problem than ignore mechanic. Like, what Tim did tells me that MMR system in that game isn't good. Besides, would Gina really want to play with a bunch of sore losers and idiots?

XD

Lunatearz

spartaxoxo wrote: »

There are 5 people online.

Gina is the best player in the game. Number 1. She blocks nobody and never even talks to other players.

She faces off against Tim, brand new to Rubedite. He feels lucky to even be there. Tim decides to block Jill, because he's just not ready to fight an opponent of that caliber.

Hana is a sore loser. She matches against Jill 3 times in a row and gets her butt kicked every single time. She blocks Jill in a fit of rage, right after she sends Gina a rather impolite message about a falsified tryst between Hana and Gina's mother.

Miguel recognizes Gina from his guild. Gina and his girlfriend don't get along, so he blocks Gina after their match.

Kyle is a conspiracy theorist. He's pretty sure certain players always get good RNG while he always gets bad RNG. He blocks Gina to "make his matches more fair."

Mo is a cutthroat player but pretty mid skill wise. He decides to block any player significantly better than him so he can get better matches. He blocks Gina.

Mo, Kyle, Miguel, and Hana can now all match against each other and get fast games without having to worry about playing Gina. In fact, they have an easier time without her around. Gina, who has done nothing to any of these people except win, cannot find a match because there is nobody to match her with.

While this scenario is entirely fake with entirely fictional people, it is based on how other games had to disallow people from blocking people from being their opponents, because people were blocked purely for their skill. These players were not unpleasant or someone others shouldn't have to deal with. They had not been impolite or broken any rules at all. They were just good.

I wonder how GIna got her points when she got no one to play against O.o just an observation...

FluffyBird

Oh, and by the way, what's stopping all those people from just going "oh no, it's her again" and abandoning the match? It's event worse than having no one to play with, imho.

Psilent

FluffyBird wrote: »

Oh, and by the way, what's stopping all those people from just going "oh no, it's her again" and abandoning the match? It's event worse than having no one to play with, imho.

If they concede right away you still get credit toward the daily and rank points. They lose rank points.

SilverBride

FluffyBird wrote: »

Oh, and by the way, what's stopping all those people from just going "oh no, it's her again" and abandoning the match? It's event worse than having no one to play with, imho.

I've done that. For a few days I would get matched with the same player two or three times each evening. It was miserable playing them so I finally just conceded to not have to be subjected to them again. If I could have blocked them I would have, even though I agree that it would be a bad idea to implement this.

Lunatearz

Psilent wrote: »

FluffyBird wrote: »

Oh, and by the way, what's stopping all those people from just going "oh no, it's her again" and abandoning the match? It's event worse than having no one to play with, imho.

If they concede right away you still get credit toward the daily and rank points. They lose rank points.

oh.. whats stopping anyone to play with a second account just to boost their own .......

hmmmmm oh yeah thats an option too right?

Lunatearz

SilverBride wrote: »

FluffyBird wrote: »

Oh, and by the way, what's stopping all those people from just going "oh no, it's her again" and abandoning the match? It's event worse than having no one to play with, imho.

I've done that. For a few days I would get matched with the same player two or three times each evening. It was miserable playing them so I finally just conceded to not have to be subjected to them again. If I could have blocked them I would have, even though I agree that it would be a bad idea to implement this.

I get matched like that too its just not fun....

Amottica

Rooatouille wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

...The ignore list makes it so we do not see what they post in chat. It does not affect being grouped with the players.

This comment illustrates how the block/ignore function does and should continue to work. Anything more would be unreasonable.

I would suggest the GF should prevent grouping with players on one's ignore list for the basic reason the players in a dungoen do have to work together more. I have seen it used this way for PvE but was not in play for PvP.

Lunatearz

On a side note..... the "winners"you get now from ppl who conceded simply because they dont want to play against a person doesnt make that person a good player.... and it makes the rank list extremeley skewed LOL

SilverBride

Lunatearz wrote: »

On a side note..... the "winners"you get now from ppl who conceded simply because they dont want to play against a person doesnt make that person a good player.... and it makes the rank list extremeley skewed LOL

I believe the rank list is skewed anyway because of the varied amounts of points that are awarded for wins. Players can get 110, 210 or 310 for a win and while there has been speculation as to why this is, nothing has been verified by ZoS.

RedTalon

Narrows the chances and also helps if the other person has you on ignore also just like battlegrounds, doesn't really work if you are the only one blocking too well.

Lunatearz

SilverBride wrote: »

Lunatearz wrote: »

On a side note..... the "winners"you get now from ppl who conceded simply because they dont want to play against a person doesnt make that person a good player.... and it makes the rank list extremeley skewed LOL

I believe the rank list is skewed anyway because of the varied amounts of points that are awarded for wins. Players can get 110, 210 or 310 for a win and while there has been speculation as to why this is, nothing has been verified by ZoS.

aggreed.. I would like to know too how we ca n get points and how many for what...

Lunatearz

also it keeps saying after a match +0 when i win on xbox..... tho i do go up in ranking when i check in the ranklist so thats still broken