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Oakensoul Solution = Make Oakensoul PvE + Solo ONLY
MacCait
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If the concern is Oakensoul is overpowered in PvP and group content, then an easy fix would make its efficiency deterioate in a group, and make it PvE only...
Companions are already PvE only, so cannot be used in PvP.
Ring of Pale Order was nerfed to be less efective in a group... the more members, the less effective, to the point of being ineffective in a full group.
So these types of changes already exist... seems like a no-brainer. This would keep an overpowered mythic out of PvP; while allowing it to benefit players that want to solo or new players that solo often, and without heaviliy nerfing it. It seems this was its original intention anyway... for solo content and accessibility issues
EDIT: 25th July 2022
From this discussion, there maybe another solution if ZOS is open to the idea:
Perhaps the answer is to create a seperate mythic that helps players with accessibility issues in PvP (perhaps with the some of the suggested changes to Oakensoul)... while leaving Oakensoul itself in its current live state as a PvE only mythic, that will greatly assist players in PvE in a possitive way without negatively impacting PvP?
Could this be the sollution to both PvE and PvP?
Edited by MacCait on July 25, 2022 2:44AM Companions are already PvE only, so cannot be used in PvP.
Ring of Pale Order was nerfed to be less efective in a group... the more members, the less effective, to the point of being ineffective in a full group.
So these types of changes already exist... seems like a no-brainer. This would keep an overpowered mythic out of PvP; while allowing it to benefit players that want to solo or new players that solo often, and without heaviliy nerfing it. It seems this was its original intention anyway... for solo content and accessibility issues
EDIT: 25th July 2022
From this discussion, there maybe another solution if ZOS is open to the idea:
Perhaps the answer is to create a seperate mythic that helps players with accessibility issues in PvP (perhaps with the some of the suggested changes to Oakensoul)... while leaving Oakensoul itself in its current live state as a PvE only mythic, that will greatly assist players in PvE in a possitive way without negatively impacting PvP?
Could this be the sollution to both PvE and PvP?
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Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The problem isn't that Oakensoul is overpowered, it's that everything is apparently overpowered. DoTs are too strong at 20 seconds so nerfed, Atro too strong so nerfed, Oakensoul, Crystal Weapon, Molten Whip too strong so nerfed, LA and HA too strong so nerfed...the list goes on. It's all overpowered and needed a sledgehammer
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Oakensoul feels great to me in the current Live state. It gives Major Heroism, one of the funniest tools to build around.
It gives multiple powerful buffs too. A fully buffed ganker is more hard to beat than a no-buffed one... agree.
The 1 bar restriction is huge, specially in high mmr PvP. Plenty of people are dying more faster due to wearing Oakensoul, which is really fine.
Gankers are always a problem, with or without Oaken, if you don’t build properly to face them. You need mobility, tankiness, or a designated offensive strategy to take them down.
People will adapt to gankers killing 30k HP builds. Actually Caluurion's gets nerfed. Less tools to gank.
Groups wearing Oakensoul... Well, I don't know. Usually they're a problem because HoT stacking.
How about putting the restriction in Oakensoul “You cannot be healed by anyone when Battle Spirit is active”?0 -
Kardrik✭✭✭They have no problems restricting some things to PVP, I don't see why not change so some things are PVE Only7
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Matteo11✭✭✭ESO is stuck in 2008 where it still tries to balance all builds to fit both PVE and PVP. Both of the leading competitors separated the two long, long ago... adding talents and skill trees that are PVP only.
I don't think ESO would be able to make that distinction, but I think they need to separate the tuning for sure. Someone's Uncle who can barely play Solo PVE should not be getting nerfed because of try-hard gankers in PvP.
Thats exactly whats happening here too. "Accessibility" and "Play your way" go down the tubes in order to tone down meta-chasing PVPersEdited by Matteo11 on July 21, 2022 6:40PMESO needs a PUBLIC GROUP FINDER. This feature alone would bring new life to the game.
Give us a place in game to publicly post our PUG groups and receive /tells about them.
We've been shouting in Craglorn for too long!11 -
merpins✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Just give it Major Slayer and Major Aegis. Still OK in pvp for people that need it, but has similar power to the pre-nerf state in dungeons, where it needs that power for disabled players.Edited by merpins on July 21, 2022 6:53PM8 -
MacCait✭✭✭✭✭
✭Holycannoli wrote: »The problem isn't that Oakensoul is overpowered, it's that everything is apparently overpowered. DoTs are too strong at 20 seconds so nerfed, Atro too strong so nerfed, Oakensoul, Crystal Weapon, Molten Whip too strong so nerfed, LA and HA too strong so nerfed...the list goes on. It's all overpowered and needed a sledgehammer
The post is specificly about the Oakensoul nerf, nothing else0 -
xHotguy6pack✭✭✭Holycannoli wrote: »The problem isn't that Oakensoul is overpowered, it's that everything is apparently overpowered. DoTs are too strong at 20 seconds so nerfed, Atro too strong so nerfed, Oakensoul, Crystal Weapon, Molten Whip too strong so nerfed, LA and HA too strong so nerfed...the list goes on. It's all overpowered and needed a sledgehammer
No, the ring is pretty busted. Play a build with and without the ring. Same gear setup with a different mythic and you will see just how overtuned it really is.2 -
MacCait✭✭✭✭✭
✭I enjoy PvP... having an overpowered one ring to rule them all in PvP isn't good... but having it as an option for solo-based PvE play doesn't hurt anyone and only benefits players, with no need to nerf it6 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This was similar to my suggestion in another thread (though I didn't say solo only).
My idea was to get rid of the no back bar drawback and make it work only for PvE normal content. So it could not be used to carry people through veteran or by groups to get crazy buffs for vet and HM trials. It will simply help all those that want to play the game solo and do the most basic content to do so.
It would be good enough to still only use one bar if you wanted, but I'd get rid of the no backbar drawback if I added the normal only PvE drawback, so the option would be there for a player to have a backbar for something if they wanted.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC0 -
Stx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MovesLikeJaguar wrote: »Just give it Major Slayer and Major Aegis. Still OK in pvp for people that need it, but has similar power to the pre-nerf state in dungeons, where it needs that power for disabled players.
I hope they do this. It's an obvious solution and an easy to implement one.4 -
HarbingerSeniorSoul ShrivenI agree Oakensoul in its current state on the live server is the best thing that has been done to narrow the gap between casual players and vets. Having a 1 bar build with all the buffs lets me concentrate on weaving and skill usage without having to manage timers on 2 bars, bar swapping, and trying not to stand in some boss's AOE. My DPS went up enough with oakensoul as it is on the live server to finally get into some vet trial groups and not feel like I am being carried through.... if PVP is the issue then leave Oakensoul as is and remove it from be used in PVP. If they really nerf the Light Attacks and Nerf Oakensoul then I am pretty sure my DPS as a causal will drop, my enjoyment will drop, my playing time will drop.... Oakensoul as it stands currently is my favorite part of the game I finally feel strong enough to do some harder content. Oakensoul is the mid tier to vet tier equalizer.4
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DrSlaughtr✭✭✭✭✭
✭They never intended 1 bar to competely supplant 2 bar builds. It was by their own admission made to allow people who can't handle bar swapping and keeping up buffs due to physical or mental limitations.
Unfortunately they greatly overestimated the power of the current live version to the point that it not only elevated people with accessibility concerns, it made the elites vastly superior to people of similar skill level who prefer 2 bars or didn't want to but the chapter.
It should never have been given any benefits you can't reasonably obtain with 2 bars, with some minor boosts to allow 1 bar to compete with 2.
It did nothing to "narrow" the skill gap. It just punished people who want to run 2 bars.I drink and I stream things.3 -
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It's an accessibility item. Kind of counter productive to then limit access while using it, don't you think? Are we just to assume that anyone who would need thus item would only be interested in PvE? Solo content at that?
I think there are also a lot of exaggeration to this point if what is needed to complete anything but top end hard mode PvE and PvP as well.3 -
MacCait✭✭✭✭✭
✭Holycannoli wrote: »
Ok... but this isn't what THIS post is about... Battle spirit suggestion is from a differnt post. This post was only about the suggestion for solo and pve only use
...not ALL nerfs... and nothing to do with battle spirit
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MacCait✭✭✭✭✭
✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »It's an accessibility item. Kind of counter productive to then limit access while using it, don't you think? Are we just to assume that anyone who would need thus item would only be interested in PvE? Solo content at that?
It's a good question you ask... but honestly if the problem a player is having is not being able to bar swap and keep up buffs etc, then I don't think Oakensoul even in its current live state would help players who struggle like that in PvP where it is a lot harder than PvE. Simply because many good PvP'ers would then also have access to oakensoul in PvP... the players that already struggle would just be even more obliterated IMO.
Also, a lot of PvE players don't play PvP at all (some like myself enjoy both of course).
I honestly think the only counter-productive thing is to nerf an accessibility item that could benefit players in the way it was intended for PvE.
There could also be another suggestion: Just create a PvP type one bar mythic that is less powerful and available in PvP, while allowing PvE accessibility players access to Oakensoul as it is... still keeping Oakensoul out of PvP
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Starbridge84✭✭✭It's funny how people say Oakensoul is "too powerful." Any trial group I have run with really doesn't want people to have it. So the ring is already getting pushed out by a large portion of players and end game content guilds.Edited by Starbridge84 on July 22, 2022 4:06AMIf you want to see what all the craftable lights look like in ESO, use this command on PC NA./script JumpToSpecificHouse("@Starbridge84", 71)1 -
xDeusEJRx✭✭✭✭✭
✭Making it PVE only means they cut a lot of their profits from it. Lots of pvp players make "op unkillable builds" videos and you think ZOS don't want to profit off these trends?
Making it PVE only means they get less money for no feasible reason. Why would zos intentionally do that? This isn't a passion project game, it's clear zos do this for more money.Edited by xDeusEJRx on July 22, 2022 4:19AMSolo PvP'er PS5 NA player
90% of my body is made of Magblade2 -
Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Ok... but this isn't what THIS post is about... Battle spirit suggestion is from a differnt post. This post was only about the suggestion for solo and pve only use ...not ALL nerfs... and nothing to do with battle spirit
The OP says exactly this:If the concern is Oakensoul is overpowered in PvP and group content
and I'm pointing out that that's not the concern the devs had when nerfing it, nor is it groups. They nerfed it for other reasons, or we'd have slayer and aegis added to it to keep it PvE without it being OP in PvP.
You have to understand why they nerfed it before you can brainstorm how to fix it, and that understanding comes from reading the rest of the patch notes and figuring out what they're doing. They want Oakensoul weaker than it is now not because of PvP or groups but because they want damage and combat effectiveness in general nerfed. That's their goal.
That means any suggestion to buff it again for PvE but not PvP or groups falls on deaf ears (like it doesn't already lol) as it's counter to their reasoning for the nerf in the first place.
Unless they surprise us next week with patch notes that revert this disastrous patch.Edited by Holycannoli on July 22, 2022 2:16PM1 -
darkstar2084✭✭✭✭If the concern is Oakensoul is overpowered in PvP and group content, then an easy fix would make its efficiency deterioate in a group, and make it PvE only...
Companions are already PvE only, so cannot be used in PvP.
Ring of Pale Order was nerfed to be less efective in a group... the more members, the less effective, to the point of being ineffective in a full group.
So these types of changes already exist... seems like a no-brainer. This would keep an overpowered mythic out of PvP; while allowing it to benefit players that want to solo or new players that solo often, and without heaviliy nerfing it. It seems this was its original intention anyway... for solo content
Yeah, if they could make it debuff in a group or PVP that would be funny.0 -
DrSlaughtr✭✭✭✭✭
✭Starbridge84 wrote: »It's funny how people say Oakensoul is "too powerful." Any trial group I have run with really doesn't want people to have it. So the ring is already getting pushed out by a large portion of players and end game content guilds.
That's because in an elite 12 man trial group, the DDs job is to do damage, which includes dots, which means 2 bars. Healers and tanks buff. A couple DDs will wear group damage buffs. There's no reason to use it in that situation. You can absolutely parse higher with oak, but that doesn't mean it's best for a vet hm trial.I drink and I stream things.2 -
washbern✭✭✭✭✭I totally agree with this. For PVE, Oak is precisely on point in power where it needs to be. It provides ease of use without bar swap complication and allows the wearer to be competitive in harder content.
If you nerf it because of PVP, then once again people who would use this item and rely on it for support will drop in damage and survivability.
Either make all the major buffs become miminor in PVP or remove the item from PVP. Leave PVE as is.3 -
Remathilis✭✭✭✭✭
✭Meh, I've given up hope it will be fixed. Let it die. It will help some players in normal dungeons and against world bosses. Just another set to Decon0 -
renne✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭People who have accessibility issues play PvP too you know, they're not just all overland questing casuals.5 -
MacCait✭✭✭✭✭
✭Was happy to see this from 'The Tank Club'...
Some good points. Allowing this to remain in its current live state but for PvE only is a real boon to the game, without negatively impacting PvP.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDGHqySqB3E 1 -
MacCait✭✭✭✭✭
✭People who have accessibility issues play PvP too you know, they're not just all overland questing casuals.
I agree 100% with this statement
Perhaps the answer is to create a seperate mythic that helps players with accessibility issues in PvP (perhaps with the some of the suggested changes to Oakensoul)... while leaving Oakensoul itself in its current live state as a PvE only mythic, that will greatly assist players in PvE in a possitive way without negatively impacting PvP?
Could this be the sollution?Edited by MacCait on July 25, 2022 2:40AM1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4obvOIoy-AY
