High Isle is Jumping the Shark, not good

AwakeOhSleeper

I’m gonna finish the little bit of content I have and will wait until I do to reserve full judgement; but High Isle is bad, dude. Like really just not good, the card game is unbalanced, nothing but frustrating, and poorly designed with content and achievements locked very, very, very, very, very, very far down it’s progression. World events are like dolmens in beta version. The map is terrible with one zone pretending to be split in two, but you managed to do it worse than you did with Blackreach Caverns somehow. World bosses are okay, but they’re world bosses… and these are still to this day buggier than most. The mythic items are broken, and you’re going to end up nerfing them into unusable, un-deconnable, inventory space-wasters each in turn (and that’s IF you can even get the leads with their tragically low drop rates). And a 12 piece set?!? Just stop…

I could continue but this truly isn’t a flame post, this is me being genuinely concerned that this is ESO ‘jumping the shark’ as it were, and this coupled with the universally (and it is virtually UNIVERSAL, make no mistake) disliked combat changes coming to the next update that this game is in danger of starting its death throes.

Food for thought, I understand the amount of work that must go into this and the desire to try something new… but the end result shouldn’t be: what was old was just okay, and what was new was bad. I think most would agree it is one of those: if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it situations. As I said, food for dev thought.

Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.

Tra_Lalan

If you like to explore, the zone is great. Really beautiful and has many cool looking/well designed places.
I also like the World Bosses and their mechanics (when they finally respawn).

I think the worse thing about HI, is the feeling that we got an unfinished product. You can feel it with all the bugs, with lack of lootable containers in public dungeons, with invisible walls here and there. That is kinda sad, because our expierience with HI is hit hard with all of those.
I personally would prefer less content in the year cycle but with better quality (meaning finished product, where PTS bugs dont go live and so on).

Xenite

One thing they definitely need to improve upon is timely bug fixes. Isobel and Embers achievements are still broken this long after launch. Bunch of druids with broken robe textures, I've found numerous terrain bugs, broken antiquity dig sites and world bosses.... the list goes on.

shadyjane62

This is why you do the PTS for any incoming content you have to pay real money for. I did HI on PTS and first thing was I couldn't progress thru any content because I had done the prologue. The card game was awful just incomprehensible and you couldn't test it cuz no one was playing it.

I had to make a new char to do main quest which I finished in about 8 hours. The terrain was nowhere as beautiful as Summerset even tho a lot of it was copy pasted from Summerset.

Suffice to say I didn't waste my money.

alanmatillab16_ESO

I've finally got round to doing Blackwood, I just hope High Isle doesnt have the NPCs that talk to you as if you are a 7 year old

"Now, can you remember the plan?"
"Really? we just talked about it! You know what, give him the sodding ambitions i've had enough of you lot"

I did well, I got half way through before wanting to do the black sacrament and have Eveli Sharp Arrow stabbed in the face.

Grizzbeorn

This game has been "jumping the shark" since the day it launched if you listen to some people.
But for real since Summerset.
And for really reals when Elsweyr hit.
And DEFINITELY when Greymoor launched.
And omg, Blackwood was somehow even worse than Greymoor, according to some people.

(all of which is to say, it isn't jumping the shark.)

Kiralyn2000

Tra_Lalan wrote: »

You can feel it with all the bugs, with lack of lootable containers in public dungeons

Very few lootable containers in delves & dungeons was a thing in Blackwood/etc as well. So I think that's less of an "unfinished/buggy" thing, and more of just a bad design direction they've decided to pursue.

oregonrob

The problem I have with High Isle was that it was derivative from earlier DLCs. We had a villain threatening the three primary rulers, again. We have a recycled character from the original story, making mediocre wise cracks and serving no real purpose in the over all story other than being an annoyance, again. The story was predictable and similar in structure to the last two years chapters. It seemed that the main quest was shorter than previous years quests. It appears that more effort was put into providing a card game than in having a creative and immersive story.

The original storyline, along with Morrowind, Summerset, Clockwork City were awesome. The Thieves Guild, Dark Brotherhood, and Elsweyr were good. But after than it seems the creative teams lost interest in story and were more interested in providing ancillary items such as the antiquity system, companions, and a card game.

There is so much storyline that could be developed. A whole set of new story lines could be developed for the Guilds or new guilds introduced, for example. When adding a new chapter based on a area, introduce new characters and a creative and innovative story line, as a primary focus, rather a particular gimmick being introduced such as a card game.

Hopefully the next chapter will go back to focusing on the story.

vivisectvib16_ESO

AwakeOhSleeper wrote: »

I’m gonna finish the little bit of content I have and will wait until I do to reserve full judgement; but High Isle is bad, dude.

The story is also one of the worst, most poorly written, pieces of tripe I've ever experienced in this game. How you go from the Deadlands arc, to this... is beyond me.

FluffyBird

vivisectvib16_ESO wrote: »

AwakeOhSleeper wrote: »

I’m gonna finish the little bit of content I have and will wait until I do to reserve full judgement; but High Isle is bad, dude.

The story is also one of the worst, most poorly written, pieces of tripe I've ever experienced in this game. How you go from the Deadlands arc, to this... is beyond me.

Deadlands arc wasn't that good, plot twist wasn't really impressive (but may I just point out here how awesome Fargrave is?), but HI didn't have any plot twists at all so far.

As for the overall quality, it's subpar. More unfinished, empty, buggy, reskinned and generally half-a... half-baked content with major glaring bugs that get fixed somewhere around "never" when no one cares anymore.

We got year-long story (bad decision, imo) to make it easier for the team, ZOS got bought my M$, but the product gets more and more like something made by a small indie team. Where did all the saved/provided resources go? Into hiring Kevin? (no offence, though, Kevin finally provides some communication and therefore must be treasured)

I'm not saying it's bad, I'm saying: "How dare you stand where the Daedric War arc stood?"

P.S.
Maybe it's the maintenance mode already?

asuitandtyb14_ESO

High Isle hasn't "jumped any shark". It's proven to be very consistent with ZOS's mediocre "expansions". Compare it to Blackwood and Greymoor. It's actually been very good at setting a trend.

TaSheen

Well, I love High Isle and Blackwood, and haven't much use for Morrowind, Summerset, or Wrothgar; and no use at all for Western Skyrim (other than the Antiquarian Gallery) and The Reach. Not all opinions will perfectly align with yours, you know.

NordSwordnBoard

Timbercrows and Fonzie share the same tailor!

ArchMikem

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

This game has been "jumping the shark" since the day it launched if you listen to some people.
But for real since Summerset.
And for really reals when Elsweyr hit.
And DEFINITELY when Greymoor launched.
And omg, Blackwood was somehow even worse than Greymoor, according to some people.

(all of which is to say, it isn't jumping the shark.)

At least Elsweyr was one of the best Chapters to date. I sometimes wish I could go back to its launch and relive the zone again. Same with Wrothgar and Vvardenfell. Oh man the sheer hype when Vvardenfell was announced.

Greymoor was pretty okay cause, cmon, it's Skyrim. It was Blackwood where things started to fall, and even though High Isle has beautiful scenery, mainly Amenos, I still wasn't enthralled. I'll admit the story was pretty good and it left me with questions while we wait for the finale zone. But still, Blackwood and High Isle didn't grab me like Elsweyr.

Kidgangster101

Tra_Lalan wrote: »

If you like to explore, the zone is great. Really beautiful and has many cool looking/well designed places.
I also like the World Bosses and their mechanics (when they finally respawn).

I think the worse thing about HI, is the feeling that we got an unfinished product. You can feel it with all the bugs, with lack of lootable containers in public dungeons, with invisible walls here and there. That is kinda sad, because our expierience with HI is hit hard with all of those.
I personally would prefer less content in the year cycle but with better quality (meaning finished product, where PTS bugs dont go live and so on).

If you like to explore you should really try ff14. All their expansions literally have 8x the content and zones to explore. They always release 5+ zones in their dlc compared to just 1. And guess what? It's the SAME PRICE you pay for this buggy eso. Ff14 actually delayed their dlc by 2 weeks because they wanted to fix it before it launched. Weird how the two games are polar opposites and yet people just continue to play ESO and support them.

geekboy09

Update 35 is jumping the Shark in my opinion. I'm playing a deeply flawed and almost dead game New World because the devs are listening to feedback and trying to turn the ship around. ESO will be on nerdslayer Death of a Game series within a year or 2.

Gnesnig

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Tra_Lalan wrote: »

You can feel it with all the bugs, with lack of lootable containers in public dungeons

Very few lootable containers in delves & dungeons was a thing in Blackwood/etc as well. So I think that's less of an "unfinished/buggy" thing, and more of just a bad design direction they've decided to pursue.

Nope, speaking as developer (of websites, not games), this is the typical low hanging fruit that you keep postponing, cause you can do it in 5 minutes just before release. And then don't do it.

[snip]
[edited for bashing]

geekboy09

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

Tra_Lalan wrote: »

If you like to explore, the zone is great. Really beautiful and has many cool looking/well designed places.
I also like the World Bosses and their mechanics (when they finally respawn).

I think the worse thing about HI, is the feeling that we got an unfinished product. You can feel it with all the bugs, with lack of lootable containers in public dungeons, with invisible walls here and there. That is kinda sad, because our expierience with HI is hit hard with all of those.
I personally would prefer less content in the year cycle but with better quality (meaning finished product, where PTS bugs dont go live and so on).

If you like to explore you should really try ff14. All their expansions literally have 8x the content and zones to explore. They always release 5+ zones in their dlc compared to just 1. And guess what? It's the SAME PRICE you pay for this buggy eso. Ff14 actually delayed their dlc by 2 weeks because they wanted to fix it before it launched. Weird how the two games are polar opposites and yet people just continue to play ESO and support them.

The only thing that keeps me away from FF14 is the combat and the convoluted story. I'm not a fan of tab targeting. The story seems to go way over my head after a certain point. Otherwise, I would have tried it by now.

geekboy09

kargen27 wrote: »

AwakeOhSleeper wrote: »

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

This game has been "jumping the shark" since the day it launched if you listen to some people.
But for real since Summerset.
And for really reals when Elsweyr hit.
And DEFINITELY when Greymoor launched.
And omg, Blackwood was somehow even worse than Greymoor, according to some people.

(all of which is to say, it isn't jumping the shark.)

[snip]

[snip]

You do realize half the playerbase is leaving. ESO is not even in the top 5 populated mmos anymore, and here's the solid proof.https://mmo-population.com/

[edited to remove quote]

kargen27

MMO population has never had accurate numbers. They even admit their numbers are based in large part on how many conversations are on Reddit. They also look at Steam numbers and those numbers are extremely unreliable for ESO for a variety of reasons.
The short of it being MMO Population guesses and shouldn't be considered as accurate or factual.

asuitandtyb14_ESO

geekboy09 wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

Tra_Lalan wrote: »

If you like to explore, the zone is great. Really beautiful and has many cool looking/well designed places.
I also like the World Bosses and their mechanics (when they finally respawn).

I think the worse thing about HI, is the feeling that we got an unfinished product. You can feel it with all the bugs, with lack of lootable containers in public dungeons, with invisible walls here and there. That is kinda sad, because our expierience with HI is hit hard with all of those.
I personally would prefer less content in the year cycle but with better quality (meaning finished product, where PTS bugs dont go live and so on).

If you like to explore you should really try ff14. All their expansions literally have 8x the content and zones to explore. They always release 5+ zones in their dlc compared to just 1. And guess what? It's the SAME PRICE you pay for this buggy eso. Ff14 actually delayed their dlc by 2 weeks because they wanted to fix it before it launched. Weird how the two games are polar opposites and yet people just continue to play ESO and support them.

The only thing that keeps me away from FF14 is the combat and the convoluted story. I'm not a fan of tab targeting. The story seems to go way over my head after a certain point. Otherwise, I would have tried it by now.

GW2 similarly has way more zones and content per expansion, and at the same price point. It has action combat, though the skills have cooldowns.

shadyjane62

Kahnak wrote: »

geekboy09 wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

AwakeOhSleeper wrote: »

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

This game has been "jumping the shark" since the day it launched if you listen to some people.
But for real since Summerset.
And for really reals when Elsweyr hit.
And DEFINITELY when Greymoor launched.
And omg, Blackwood was somehow even worse than Greymoor, according to some people.

(all of which is to say, it isn't jumping the shark.)

Take your opinion and make it your truth, I guess, family… I stated mine, and from the looks of the reactions on the topic I’m in the pretty overwhelming majority here. I’ve watched every chapter you listed drop, and it’s never felt this lack-luster both personal play through and from the grumblings in-game/online. Of course your post could have just been the obligatory ‘stir the pot’ dissenting opinion post though, since it really wasn’t substantive at all, if that’s the case… then thanks for stopping on by, I suppose. lol

Don't confuse people agreeing with you as somehow representing a majority. Human nature being what it is we tend to comment more on things we see as a problem. When we are content we tend to just go about our way. You don't call the manager over to tell them your soup was the perfect temperature. You call the manager over when the soup was served cold.

And these forums are a very miniscule part of the game population. I have no solid proof but experience tells me if you were to poll players that post in the forums and players that do not about how the game plays you would see vastly different results.

You do realize half the playerbase is leaving. ESO is not even in the top 5 populated mmos anymore, and here's the solid proof.https://mmo-population.com/

[snip]

Probably what the devs at Star Wars Galaxies thought too.

[edited to remove quote]

Dawnblade

kargen27 wrote: »

MMO population has never had accurate numbers. They even admit their numbers are based in large part on how many conversations are on Reddit. They also look at Steam numbers and those numbers are extremely unreliable for ESO for a variety of reasons.
The short of it being MMO Population guesses and shouldn't be considered as accurate or factual.

I wouldn't take it or any of the other publically available data as being accurate enough to confirm a game's actual population - though trends, especially if similar across a number of different sources, are probably at least directionally accurate.

Carcamongus

I liked the new zone and most of its quests. Yes, it resembles Summerset, but then the Systres aren't far from the Yellowmer islands. The focus on shipbuilding, coral decorations, whale skeletons and druidic ruins was very pleasing (to me). Gonfalon Bay's beautiful and I love to watch the ships sail by. I found the main story fun, if short, and the side quests were mostly entertaining (again, to me). Rigurt once again showed me he should be crowned emperor of Tamriel.

Edited for grammar.

Tesman85

I don't really understand this griping on High Isle. Personally I like the expansion very much and think it's very good. It's baffling how so many posters here moans like it's the end of the world.

The main story might be a bit short (although still long enough for my tastes), but it's good. It's very refreshing that it isn't yet another Daedric plot to meld Nirn with some Oblivion realm, but more down-to-earth political storyline. The new NPCs are likable, if not always on the same level as in e.g. the Gates of Oblivion storyline. The only serious gripe I have is that the publicly stated motivations of the Ascendant Order are dismissed as lies too soon. It would have been interesting if the player would have been for a longer time led to believe that the order is a genuinely democratic revolutionary movement. Otherwise, the story was enjoyable. I'm looking forward to the concluding DLC and possible epilogue later in this year to see how it ends.

As for Tales of Tribute, it is actually great fun. I've played it almost every day since I first tried it a few weeks ago. The game is surprisingly deep strategy-wise, since different approaches can lead to victory (for instance, I remember one game versus a human player where most of the points were earned by amassing coins and spammin the Duke of Crows). The differing decks add some spice to the game, and I'll be sure to collect at least most of them. Also, the rewards are very nice. No wonder it's been so hooking for me.

The zone itself is very beautiful and I love Gonfalon Bay as a city. Aesthetically the expansion leaves little to be desired.

Lastly, Isobel is good addition to the companions. I like both her personality and her potential to be helpful in combat from the few hours I've played with her.

The new gear sets, on the other hand, are a bit disappointing. None of them are that exciting. But really, with so many sets to juggle balance-wise, that's no suprise. There are already so many effect variations that by now it must be hard to invent something new that isn't overpowered. I suspect this set aspect is the thing that irks the hard-core competitive crowd most and thus elicits much of the criticism even when it's unjustified.

So, no, the expansion's not jumping the shark.

Treselegant

It's baffling how so many posters here moans like it's the end of the world.

Even outside the forums I've noticed that the reaction to High Isle has been on the whole quite muted and 'meh'. When Blackwood launched there was decent social media buzz about it with continued engagement after it released but with High Isle - not as much. What ESO content I'm seeing in the places I frequent online tends to be the same sort of thing as before its release (fashion/houses/screenshots) with not much variation. What praise I see seems pretty mild with particular focus on the environment being quite pretty. So, I'm seeing a lot of Sunflower pictures but not as much discussion about the story or characters for example. I don't think it's the end of the world but I think a lot of people have noticed that this expansion is somewhat lacking.

Geldauran

Treselegant wrote: »

It's baffling how so many posters here moans like it's the end of the world.

Even outside the forums I've noticed that the reaction to High Isle has been on the whole quite muted and 'meh'. When Blackwood launched there was decent social media buzz about it with continued engagement after it released but with High Isle - not as much. What ESO content I'm seeing in the places I frequent online tends to be the same sort of thing as before its release (fashion/houses/screenshots) with not much variation. What praise I see seems pretty mild with particular focus on the environment being quite pretty. So, I'm seeing a lot of Sunflower pictures but not as much discussion about the story or characters for example. I don't think it's the end of the world but I think a lot of people have noticed that this expansion is somewhat lacking.

I also noticed that there isn't that much buzz/hype about High Isle compared to some of the other expansion. It lacks nostalgia-bait like other expansions, no new classes or skill lines. There's the card game, but that was met with rather lukewarm reception when 1st announced and I'm not sure how many people like it now that its been released. If anything more people cared about Oakensoul

SerDinadan

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

Tra_Lalan wrote: »

If you like to explore, the zone is great. Really beautiful and has many cool looking/well designed places.
I also like the World Bosses and their mechanics (when they finally respawn).

I think the worse thing about HI, is the feeling that we got an unfinished product. You can feel it with all the bugs, with lack of lootable containers in public dungeons, with invisible walls here and there. That is kinda sad, because our expierience with HI is hit hard with all of those.
I personally would prefer less content in the year cycle but with better quality (meaning finished product, where PTS bugs dont go live and so on).

If you like to explore you should really try ff14. All their expansions literally have 8x the content and zones to explore. They always release 5+ zones in their dlc compared to just 1. And guess what? It's the SAME PRICE you pay for this buggy eso. Ff14 actually delayed their dlc by 2 weeks because they wanted to fix it before it launched. Weird how the two games are polar opposites and yet people just continue to play ESO and support them.

ESO expansions have always been a comparatively poor value compared to other MMO's expansions. I suppose that's not too surprising though, since ESO's chapters were pretty much just DLC recategorized so that they could be charged separate from ESO Plus.

Czeri

I disagree. I really like High Isle. It's the only main quest in any expansion that I actually care about because it carries the promise of ending the war. Everywhere else I was just a tourist in for the ride. I love Jakarn, so seeing more of him was great. Same with Emeric. I also love so many of the new characters introduced, from Lady Arabelle to the ones we meet on the side quests. And the zone is very pretty.

I'm going back and forth on the Tales of Tribute game. I've managed to slog to level 4 so I can now play proficient NPCs, and the games got a lot more interesting. That makes the concept of completing the storyline not as daunting as it used to be.

I might have been lucky, but the only bug I encountered was when killing a WB didn't register for the daily achievement. It did work the second time, though, so it didn't block my progress.

I just wish there were houses I could buy for gold in the zone.

Urvoth

Chapter quality has gone down year after year since Elsweyr

ZOS_Icy

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