DEAR GOLD SELLERS AND GOLD BUYERS

Saucy_Jack

If you want to risk being banned for selling or buying gold by forming your own shady guilds, bidding for your own shady traders, and organizing your own shady transactions there, that's on you.

But you're not going to use my guild for it.

SJ

redspecter23

It's nice to see trade guild GM's that keep an eye on such things. Good on you for making them work harder for their shady transactions.

karthrag_inak

How does one know that one has a gold-seller in one's trading guild? This one is GM of a trading guild and now khajiit has concerns.

vincentxavier

Saucy_Jack wrote: »

If you want to risk being banned for selling gold by forming your own shady guild, bidding for your own shady trader, and making shady sales to earn your shady profits, that's on you.

But you're not going to use my guild for it.

SJ

I am not sure what you are talking about. Could you please elaborate.

EozZoe1989

lol too much going on so many people,, and bots would ban people by accident.. that's reason why so hard track all this and i understand that.--but maybe they need find anti bullying people .. lol they do it .. to keep community clean lol

ectoplasmicninja

Ah, is this why I sometimes see a random item listed for crazy millions of gold? I've been assuming whoever listed those things was hitting the skooma bubbler, but that would make more sense.

Saucy_Jack

ectoplasmicninja wrote: »

Ah, is this why I sometimes see a random item listed for crazy millions of gold? I've been assuming whoever listed those things was hitting the skooma bubbler, but that would make more sense.

Yeah, some items DO actually go for millions of gold. But if there's 20 pages' worth of an item listed at 10k on TTC, and "magically" someone makes a sale for 750k, there's shadiness going on.

Amottica

vincentxavier wrote: »

Saucy_Jack wrote: »

If you want to risk being banned for selling gold by forming your own shady guild, bidding for your own shady trader, and making shady sales to earn your shady profits, that's on you.

But you're not going to use my guild for it.

SJ

I am not sure what you are talking about. Could you please elaborate.

A player who is buying gold from a gold seller lists an item for a crazy high predetermined price which the gold seller buys to transfer the purchased gold.

It is basically laundering the money when selling gold. I had seen a thread a while back where a player noticed odd very high prices of items that sold. Zenimax acted and the chatter that followed was that it hurt some people badly. Players were probably banned and the gold sellers' business was temporarily harmed.

It is good that @Saucy_Jack looks out for this and hopefully more leaders will do the same and report the activity to Zenimax. Gold sellers are bad for the game. Much of their activity does not add to the economy but merely increases the amount of gold in the game which drives up prices.

Saucy jack just made a post explaining a more specific transaction.

vincentxavier

Are they getting real life money for this gold? I have heard of something like this on DCUO, so I guess it makes sense that it would happen here too.

Amottica

vincentxavier wrote: »

Are they getting real life money for this gold? I have heard of something like this on DCUO, so I guess it makes sense that it would happen here too.

Yes. They are.

proprio.meb16_ESO

If on PC that could also be "just" the effect of price poisoning.

If the item is just put on sale it tricks addons registering market price (like ttc), if its also actually sold (maybe to another account belonging to the same person or a friend of him) it tricks addons registering actual sales (like mm and att).

The outcome, shortly, is the average price of the item goes up without an actual increase in demand or decrease in offer. Ive seen several such attempts at times.

DinoZavr

inflation is one thing, while unjustified prices are quite different things.
you can always query TTC (in this example i asked for Normal quality items with 1M+ price tag).
No surprise you can discover 2M+ for one potato or such..


i strongly hope Zeni's controls can and do track such the suspicious deals when the overpriced junk is actually bought.

Iselin

Weird. I always thought those outrageous prices were just posted hoping for a misclick buy since ESO has its very own, tacitly approved and sanitized, cash for gold scheme using crown gifting.

Hell I don't even see bot trains in the game any more.

Maybe I'm just naive.

Amottica

Iselin wrote: »

Weird. I always thought those outrageous prices were just posted hoping for a misclick buy since ESO has its very own, tacitly approved and sanitized, cash for gold scheme using crown gifting.

Hell I don't even see bot trains in the game any more.

Maybe I'm just naive.

Something being posted for an exorbitant amount is not the problem. It is when it sells for an outrageous amount there is likely something up.

DinoZavr wrote: »

inflation is one thing, while unjustified prices are quite different things.
you can always query TTC (in this example i asked for Normal quality items with 1M+ price tag).
No surprise you can discover 2M+ for one potato or such..


i strongly hope Zeni's controls can and do track such the suspicious deals when the overpriced junk is actually bought.

I do not think Zenimax does but they have looked into suspicious sales before and taken action.

Paulytnz

vincentxavier wrote: »

Are they getting real life money for this gold? I have heard of something like this on DCUO, so I guess it makes sense that it would happen here too.

Happens in pretty much EVERY MMO that has some sort of a trade system.

Mr_Stach

As long as Gold Sellers make money, they will keep selling Gold. There's basically nothing people can do, they're essentially Hydra.

Lysette

Iselin wrote: »

Weird. I always thought those outrageous prices were just posted hoping for a misclick buy since ESO has its very own, tacitly approved and sanitized, cash for gold scheme using crown gifting.

Hell I don't even see bot trains in the game any more.

Maybe I'm just naive.

hm, that is more the case in EVE - where the amount of zeros is often not checked by buyers and you can eventually sell an item which is like 10 million for 10 billion. But with low prices like in ESO that is not that likely.

Faulgor

Why is this an issue? The game already has legalized gold selling/buying through Crowns.

Only difference is that in these cases, ZOS is not making a cut.

Meiox

Faulgor wrote: »

Why is this an issue? The game already has legalized gold selling/buying through Crowns.

Only difference is that in these cases, ZOS is not making a cut.

In your case its a exchange crowns for gold, but a gold seller want money for their gold.

PvP_Exploiter

DinoZavr wrote: »

inflation is one thing, while unjustified prices are quite different things.
you can always query TTC (in this example i asked for Normal quality items with 1M+ price tag).
No surprise you can discover 2M+ for one potato or such..


i strongly hope Zeni's controls can and do track such the suspicious deals when the overpriced junk is actually bought.

That's like less than 1€, who would do it for that much. Unless there using multiple that's probably just someone messing about.

Ermiq

PvP_Exploiter wrote: »

DinoZavr wrote: »

inflation is one thing, while unjustified prices are quite different things.
you can always query TTC (in this example i asked for Normal quality items with 1M+ price tag).
No surprise you can discover 2M+ for one potato or such..


i strongly hope Zeni's controls can and do track such the suspicious deals when the overpriced junk is actually bought.

That's like less than 1€, who would do it for that much. Unless there using multiple that's probably just someone messing about.

Just googled for some reference on RTM prices in ESO, and it seems like they sell 1M gold for a bit more than 1€ on PC. For consoles the prices are ten times higher, so 1M gold would be 10+ €.
A lot of people consider it does worth the effort to earn a couple of euros. Sure, for someone in US or Europe, for example, it looks worthless, but people still do it, and it means there are people for whom it does worth it.

biovitalb16_ESO

karthrag_inak wrote: »

How does one know that one has a gold-seller in one's trading guild? This one is GM of a trading guild and now khajiit has concerns.

A super easy way to see is when you look at MM/ATT sales data and you see something like,.

Basic white weapon with no trait - 5,000,000 gold - Sold 1 day ago

Obviously a 40g vendor trash item shouldn't be selling on your trader for 5M

Unknown_Redemption

Saucy_Jack wrote: »

If you want to risk being banned for selling or buying gold by forming your own shady guilds, bidding for your own shady traders, and organizing your own shady transactions there, that's on you.

But you're not going to use my guild for it.

SJ

Arnt you the Number 2? Lady A is the boss =P

Amottica

Faulgor wrote: »

Why is this an issue? The game already has legalized gold selling/buying through Crowns.

Only difference is that in these cases, ZOS is not making a cut.

@Faulgor

Simply because the gold sellers use bots and such to farm their gold. And it’s a direct violation of the TOS per Zenimax official statement since it is trading a real work item for an in-game item. Zenimax considers crowns an in-game item which means crown trading is all in-game and therefore acceptable.

Yes, the last point is splitting a hair but a Zenimax owns this world so it is their hair to split.

Iselin

Amottica wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

Why is this an issue? The game already has legalized gold selling/buying through Crowns.

Only difference is that in these cases, ZOS is not making a cut.

@Faulgor

Simply because the gold sellers use bots and such to farm their gold. And it’s a direct violation of the TOS per Zenimax official statement since it is trading a real work item for an in-game item. Zenimax considers crowns an in-game item which means crown trading is all in-game and therefore acceptable.

Yes, the last point is splitting a hair but a Zenimax owns this world so it is their hair to split.

That's the thing though. It has been literally months if not years since the last time I ran into mats (usually wolves lol) harvesting bot trains of 4 or more identical jabby-jabby templars running an obvious terrain script. I used to see them frequently in their favorite secluded spots but not these days.

That's what made me think that the 3rd party gold selling market was essentially dead here. If they're not botting to make gold to sell how the heck are they making their gold?

Paulytnz

Iselin wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

Why is this an issue? The game already has legalized gold selling/buying through Crowns.

Only difference is that in these cases, ZOS is not making a cut.

@Faulgor

Simply because the gold sellers use bots and such to farm their gold. And it’s a direct violation of the TOS per Zenimax official statement since it is trading a real work item for an in-game item. Zenimax considers crowns an in-game item which means crown trading is all in-game and therefore acceptable.

Yes, the last point is splitting a hair but a Zenimax owns this world so it is their hair to split.

That's the thing though. It has been literally months if not years since the last time I ran into mats (usually wolves lol) harvesting bot trains of 4 or more identical jabby-jabby templars running an obvious terrain script. I used to see them frequently in their favorite secluded spots but not these days.

That's what made me think that the 3rd party gold selling market was essentially dead here. If they're not botting to make gold to sell how the heck are they making their gold?

Maybe they all went to consoles? They are still a big thing on PS. Go to any starter map and even Auridon on PS EU and you will see trains of them.

Mr_Stach

Lots of Sorc Bots

tim77

Iselin wrote: »

If they're not botting to make gold to sell how the heck are they making their gold?

good question. maybe flipping or telvar. (just kidding)

Mr_Stach

Scarcity of Mats raises the price of mats, so they can sell at their leisure for however much they want

chessalavakia_ESO

tim77 wrote: »

Iselin wrote: »

If they're not botting to make gold to sell how the heck are they making their gold?

good question. maybe flipping or telvar. (just kidding)

I think flipping is a possibility.

The PC price is far lower than the price on other devices which suggests that either the price on the sites is rubbish, they can only do what they are doing on PC with a high level of effectiveness, or the thing they are doing is market related.

ForzaRammer

I’d just be happy with the 3.5% cut