Stamsorc getting weaker?

gariondavey

Draevik wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

Stamsorc got huge buffs this patch. Huge.

Curse. Endless fury.

^ This. And stamsorc was never in a bad place to begin with. Literally every meta every patch I've seen such a strong stamsorcs in BGs that it leaves you wonder why you didn't master the class yet.

OP, if you want to stack crystal and imbued for burst, why not using Snipe instead? It basically does the same, 0.8s of charge time and in 0.2s you have next GCD, also more damage. Check this out:

https://youtu.be/aT-_CNI_kvg

Do notice that this vid is from the previous patch. Fury deals even more damage now with bigger crit.

I have only seen 2 really strong stamsorca this patch. I have played quite a lot of BGs. Maybe all the monsters reside in Cyro

I know several very good stamsorcs on pcna. Most of them are in bgs

One_Bad_Bosmer

gariondavey wrote: »

Stamsorc got huge buffs this patch. Huge.

Curse. Endless fury.

Those are more inherent magsorc skills. How am I as a 2h STAMSORC going to run those. Again sounds like more hybrid bs or just time to switch to magsorc. They buffed nothing aside from adding 5 seconds to hurricane. SMH

Draevik

One_Bad_Bosmer wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

Stamsorc got huge buffs this patch. Huge.

Curse. Endless fury.

Those are more inherent magsorc skills. How am I as a 2h STAMSORC going to run those. Again sounds like more hybrid bs or just time to switch to magsorc. They buffed nothing aside from adding 5 seconds to hurricane. SMH

Because now all skills scale on highest stats. Theory and in practice are two different things.

I think what most of the people are saying is the only way to be a top tier PVP stamsorc is to all run the same bow build?

If i see a well played templar or DK die to a stamsorc (OTHER than this bow build) I would be amazed.

Kordai

I think people overhype the scaling. Stamsorcs inherent strong point is streak and dark deal, both mag cost skills. We always used whatever mag we had for those skills. Adding mag sustain would probably end up with those 2 skills mostly. A lot of the other stam classes were less reliant on mag than we were.

DK: Volatile armor, cauterize and frag shield. Alot now run fossilize in lieu of frag shield and with their good mag sustain with battle roar they can afford to be more liberal with their mag.

Necro: Mender and Armor. Any extra investement into mag sustain is something they can use for mag skills.

NB: Cloak and shade, will forgo any new mag skills because all investment into mag sustain would just be used to cloak more.

Warden: Ice Fortress and Polar wind, can shift stuff around for a bit of extra mag.

Templar: Purify, living dark. Unlikely to use any new mag skills.

gariondavey

Kordai wrote: »

I think people overhype the scaling. Stamsorcs inherent strong point is streak and dark deal, both mag cost skills. We always used whatever mag we had for those skills. Adding mag sustain would probably end up with those 2 skills mostly. A lot of the other stam classes were less reliant on mag than we were.

DK: Volatile armor, cauterize and frag shield. Alot now run fossilize in lieu of frag shield and with their good mag sustain with battle roar they can afford to be more liberal with their mag.

Necro: Mender and Armor. Any extra investement into mag sustain is something they can use for mag skills.

NB: Cloak and shade, will forgo any new mag skills because all investment into mag sustain would just be used to cloak more.

Warden: Ice Fortress and Polar wind, can shift stuff around for a bit of extra mag.

Templar: Purify, living dark. Unlikely to use any new mag skills.

On my stam dk I now have added coag and on my stamplar I have added honor the dead. On my stamblade I am running healthy offering.

These have all been game changers.

As for stam sorc, curse is huge. Endless fury is huge. Endless fury has mag return. Curse isn't too expensive. The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

Hescrow

Before update 33 I uses crystal weapon paired with imbue weapon and overload.

Yes it was Big burst but now I uses crystal paired with Dizzy swing and heavy attack. Overload only with crystal weapon.

However TTK against magdk magplar especially is problematic as they burst AND Big heal themselves.

I think crystal weapon should be a buff giving us 4 stacks for example to land LA or HA.

Fully charged HA should also double damage of crystal weapon with burst heal as a reward to succeed it.

With that we have balance with string burst AND heal from dk templars and others.

gariondavey

Hescrow wrote: »

Before update 33 I uses crystal weapon paired with imbue weapon and overload.

Yes it was Big burst but now I uses crystal paired with Dizzy swing and heavy attack. Overload only with crystal weapon.

However TTK against magdk magplar especially is problematic as they burst AND Big heal themselves.

I think crystal weapon should be a buff giving us 4 stacks for example to land LA or HA.

Fully charged HA should also double damage of crystal weapon with burst heal as a reward to succeed it.

With that we have balance with string burst AND heal from dk templars and others.

Yeah...that sounds way too op

xylena_lazarow

gariondavey wrote: »

The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

The stronger classes don't need to invest an entire 5pc in sustain. This just compounds the class's weakness. I don't see how any "good" stamsorc wouldn't still perform better on a different class.

Draevik

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

The stronger classes don't need to invest an entire 5pc in sustain. This just compounds the class's weakness. I don't see how any "good" stamsorc wouldn't still perform better on a different class.

Agreed, the StamSorc seems like it is in a perpetual cycle of the "fast" class that comes in tries a burst combo and streaks away. I have yet to find a good way to build as a tanky brawler. Armor rarely matters anymore. Passive increases to damage reduction are hit or miss - more miss than hit...

Basically the stamsorc has been relegated to a hit and run lesser DPS version of a Nightblade. I am seeing a lot of BowSorcs and if that is the most effective way currently, well I feel bad for the class.

Although I did see a well built Powerbash Stamsorc I feel like he was successful also because of access to in-,group healing.

divnyi

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

The stronger classes don't need to invest an entire 5pc in sustain. This just compounds the class's weakness. I don't see how any "good" stamsorc wouldn't still perform better on a different class.

I roll stamsorc with sculls and no sustain sets. Sorc sustain is top-tier already.

Hescrow

gariondavey wrote: »

Hescrow wrote: »

Before update 33 I uses crystal weapon paired with imbue weapon and overload.

Yes it was Big burst but now I uses crystal paired with Dizzy swing and heavy attack. Overload only with crystal weapon.

However TTK against magdk magplar especially is problematic as they burst AND Big heal themselves.

I think crystal weapon should be a buff giving us 4 stacks for example to land LA or HA.

Fully charged HA should also double damage of crystal weapon with burst heal as a reward to succeed it.

With that we have balance with string burst AND heal from dk templars and others.

Yeah...that sounds way too op

Nope just balanced comparing to magplar and magdk for example with jabs and whip

Draevik

divnyi wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

The stronger classes don't need to invest an entire 5pc in sustain. This just compounds the class's weakness. I don't see how any "good" stamsorc wouldn't still perform better on a different class.

I roll stamsorc with sculls and no sustain sets. Sorc sustain is top-tier already.

Unless you are spamming Conversion i think you are definitely over exaggerating it a wee bit. Aside from Conversions big burst of regen. It gives you 120 stam/s or 240 stam recovery however you want to view it. You must be running all infused with stam recovery. Or heavy attacking non-stop

xDeusEJRx

Draevik wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

The stronger classes don't need to invest an entire 5pc in sustain. This just compounds the class's weakness. I don't see how any "good" stamsorc wouldn't still perform better on a different class.

I roll stamsorc with sculls and no sustain sets. Sorc sustain is top-tier already.

Unless you are spamming Conversion i think you are definitely over exaggerating it a wee bit. Aside from Conversions big burst of regen. It gives you 120 stam/s or 240 stam recovery however you want to view it. You must be running all infused with stam recovery. Or heavy attacking non-stop

Tbh sorc sustain isn't that awful if you're skillful with it. My stam sorc is using sugar skulls with only about 1200 regen but I am in 6 medium so roll dodges are pretty cheap and I use SnB backbar so back bar blocking is also cheap. It's not op sustain by any means but I can manage that because I have good enough killing power to get the 2h sustain buff active and LoS/roll dodge/jump block when necessary.
I usually position myself where I can give myself time if I'm close to being stam checked, so the low sustain never penalizes me much unless I have a literal mini-zerg of players on me. Which in that case, there's not much I can do in that instance, even with better sustain

Draevik

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

Draevik wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

The stronger classes don't need to invest an entire 5pc in sustain. This just compounds the class's weakness. I don't see how any "good" stamsorc wouldn't still perform better on a different class.

I roll stamsorc with sculls and no sustain sets. Sorc sustain is top-tier already.

Unless you are spamming Conversion i think you are definitely over exaggerating it a wee bit. Aside from Conversions big burst of regen. It gives you 120 stam/s or 240 stam recovery however you want to view it. You must be running all infused with stam recovery. Or heavy attacking non-stop

Tbh sorc sustain isn't that awful if you're skillful with it. My stam sorc is using sugar skulls with only about 1200 regen but I am in 6 medium so roll dodges are pretty cheap and I use SnB backbar so back bar blocking is also cheap. It's not op sustain by any means but I can manage that because I have good enough killing power to get the 2h sustain buff active and LoS/roll dodge/jump block when necessary.
I usually position myself where I can give myself time if I'm close to being stam checked, so the low sustain never penalizes me much unless I have a literal mini-zerg of players on me. Which in that case, there's not much I can do in that instance, even with better sustain

Frontbar I am guessing is 2h? Rally? Execute? 2h gives huge increase to stam regen on kill and also rally gives minor endurance. If you are bow I assume you are just kiting around with streak. Either way comparatively. Look at DK sustain with applying poison/burn. Templars mit buff and repentance. StamSorcs no longer have a real edge on sustain.

gariondavey

Draevik wrote: »

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

Draevik wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

The stronger classes don't need to invest an entire 5pc in sustain. This just compounds the class's weakness. I don't see how any "good" stamsorc wouldn't still perform better on a different class.

I roll stamsorc with sculls and no sustain sets. Sorc sustain is top-tier already.

Unless you are spamming Conversion i think you are definitely over exaggerating it a wee bit. Aside from Conversions big burst of regen. It gives you 120 stam/s or 240 stam recovery however you want to view it. You must be running all infused with stam recovery. Or heavy attacking non-stop

Tbh sorc sustain isn't that awful if you're skillful with it. My stam sorc is using sugar skulls with only about 1200 regen but I am in 6 medium so roll dodges are pretty cheap and I use SnB backbar so back bar blocking is also cheap. It's not op sustain by any means but I can manage that because I have good enough killing power to get the 2h sustain buff active and LoS/roll dodge/jump block when necessary.
I usually position myself where I can give myself time if I'm close to being stam checked, so the low sustain never penalizes me much unless I have a literal mini-zerg of players on me. Which in that case, there's not much I can do in that instance, even with better sustain

Frontbar I am guessing is 2h? Rally? Execute? 2h gives huge increase to stam regen on kill and also rally gives minor endurance. If you are bow I assume you are just kiting around with streak. Either way comparatively. Look at DK sustain with applying poison/burn. Templars mit buff and repentance. StamSorcs no longer have a real edge on sustain.

No stamplar I know runs repentance in anything other than ravenwatch. I personally haven't used repentance in years but do see others using it in ravenwatch, but never in cp ic or bgs.

Draevik

gariondavey wrote: »

Draevik wrote: »

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

Draevik wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

The stronger classes don't need to invest an entire 5pc in sustain. This just compounds the class's weakness. I don't see how any "good" stamsorc wouldn't still perform better on a different class.

I roll stamsorc with sculls and no sustain sets. Sorc sustain is top-tier already.

Unless you are spamming Conversion i think you are definitely over exaggerating it a wee bit. Aside from Conversions big burst of regen. It gives you 120 stam/s or 240 stam recovery however you want to view it. You must be running all infused with stam recovery. Or heavy attacking non-stop

Tbh sorc sustain isn't that awful if you're skillful with it. My stam sorc is using sugar skulls with only about 1200 regen but I am in 6 medium so roll dodges are pretty cheap and I use SnB backbar so back bar blocking is also cheap. It's not op sustain by any means but I can manage that because I have good enough killing power to get the 2h sustain buff active and LoS/roll dodge/jump block when necessary.
I usually position myself where I can give myself time if I'm close to being stam checked, so the low sustain never penalizes me much unless I have a literal mini-zerg of players on me. Which in that case, there's not much I can do in that instance, even with better sustain

Frontbar I am guessing is 2h? Rally? Execute? 2h gives huge increase to stam regen on kill and also rally gives minor endurance. If you are bow I assume you are just kiting around with streak. Either way comparatively. Look at DK sustain with applying poison/burn. Templars mit buff and repentance. StamSorcs no longer have a real edge on sustain.

No stamplar I know runs repentance in anything other than ravenwatch. I personally haven't used repentance in years but do see others using it in ravenwatch, but never in cp ic or bgs.

I see it fairly often. Maybe just depends on their setup. But either way it is very high regen especially if you can get kills... Which Templars easily can.

xDeusEJRx

Draevik wrote: »

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

Draevik wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

The stronger classes don't need to invest an entire 5pc in sustain. This just compounds the class's weakness. I don't see how any "good" stamsorc wouldn't still perform better on a different class.

I roll stamsorc with sculls and no sustain sets. Sorc sustain is top-tier already.

Unless you are spamming Conversion i think you are definitely over exaggerating it a wee bit. Aside from Conversions big burst of regen. It gives you 120 stam/s or 240 stam recovery however you want to view it. You must be running all infused with stam recovery. Or heavy attacking non-stop

Tbh sorc sustain isn't that awful if you're skillful with it. My stam sorc is using sugar skulls with only about 1200 regen but I am in 6 medium so roll dodges are pretty cheap and I use SnB backbar so back bar blocking is also cheap. It's not op sustain by any means but I can manage that because I have good enough killing power to get the 2h sustain buff active and LoS/roll dodge/jump block when necessary.
I usually position myself where I can give myself time if I'm close to being stam checked, so the low sustain never penalizes me much unless I have a literal mini-zerg of players on me. Which in that case, there's not much I can do in that instance, even with better sustain

Frontbar I am guessing is 2h? Rally? Execute? 2h gives huge increase to stam regen on kill and also rally gives minor endurance. If you are bow I assume you are just kiting around with streak. Either way comparatively. Look at DK sustain with applying poison/burn. Templars mit buff and repentance. StamSorcs no longer have a real edge on sustain.

Front bar 2h with rally and execute yes, back bar is SnB though. Only speed I get is from elude because I have 6 piece medium armor on my setup.
100% I'm not arguing that in the slightest, but even so stam sorc can sustain with just bare bones setup. I'm only using 5x New Moon, 3x adept, 1 markyn, 3 agility and my sustain isn't that much of a problem. I think I peak maybe 1500 in cp(without the 2h regen passive) and 1300 in no cp. But TBH you don't need insane stam regen on a stam sorc if your rotation is just -> Dizzying swing crystal weapon light attack

divnyi

Draevik wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

The stam sorc I all know are not having sustain issues. Many just back bar wretched vitality and use sugar skulls.

The stronger classes don't need to invest an entire 5pc in sustain. This just compounds the class's weakness. I don't see how any "good" stamsorc wouldn't still perform better on a different class.

I roll stamsorc with sculls and no sustain sets. Sorc sustain is top-tier already.

Unless you are spamming Conversion i think you are definitely over exaggerating it a wee bit. Aside from Conversions big burst of regen. It gives you 120 stam/s or 240 stam recovery however you want to view it. You must be running all infused with stam recovery. Or heavy attacking non-stop

I'm spamming conversions at the free time and use streaks wisely. Surely it only works if you play burst-type sorc.

I don't have infused, but ye tripple recovery glyphs and tristat pots.

You can see exact build on the start of the vid on the first page of this thread.

xylena_lazarow

divnyi wrote: »

Sorc sustain is top-tier already

divnyi wrote: »

but ye tripple recovery glyphs

DKs and Templars don't need to do that. Wretched had come up in the context of supporting the mag pool for Curse and Fury on top of Deal, Surge, and Streak. Again a problem that other specs don't need to worry about.

I've now encountered a few of these "bow sorcs" on PC/NA GH. The only one that was good used a back bar resto to stack RR with Vigor while they rolled and streaked, with that busted ult any time they were in real danger. Their procs and bow spam was a reasonable amount of offensive pressure but they lacked the burst to close the fight versus the sdk I was on.

divnyi

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

DKs and Templars don't need to do that.

I absolutely do that on both. I like having more sustain at expense of damage.
And really, tristat food with no recovery bonuses at all? I don't think this is BG setup. Might work in CP due to recovery CPs and lower lengths of actual combat situations.

Wretched had come up in the context of supporting the mag pool

I do 2x mana recovery glyphs and x1 tristat recovery.
Mana recovery = More conversions, conversions have x1.5 rate on instant stam gain.

xylena_lazarow

divnyi wrote: »

I don't think this is BG setup. Might work in CP due to recovery CPs and lower lengths of actual combat situations.

Apologies for the confusion, yes I'm coming from a CP/Cyro perspective, where stamsorc definitely needs some love.

One_Bad_Bosmer

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

I don't think this is BG setup. Might work in CP due to recovery CPs and lower lengths of actual combat situations.

Apologies for the confusion, yes I'm coming from a CP/Cyro perspective, where stamsorc definitely needs some love.

I’m in the same group as you. I’ll admit I may have cried wolf too soon. There’s ways to get stamsorc to brawler tier or whatever you want it to be. Just sacrifices must be made in terms of sets and skills. Gaze of sithis helps with stamsorcs squishy-ness per se. But then again that means no two piece monster set. But with all the sets out there and new ones coming, the combinations of the set-ups are going to be more limitless, just depends on how you want to play this class.

I also realized that front baring(2h) camo hunter was no where near worth slotting compared to bound armaments. That skill does so much. As does back baring razor caltrops over pierce armor or poison shot. I roll snb on my back bar, personally. And that leads me to another conclusion, back baring the psijic ulti, temporal guard is pretty much null and void when I can use the snb ulti spell wall. It’s like the old school dk wings watching all spells and ranged attacks being returned to sender is absolutely priceless lol

I found my set up for the foreseeable future. It took a lot of trial and error. And don’t read me wrong. Stamsorc is squishy, just have to make a choice of what role you want to play and stick to it. Good luck y’all

Hescrow

In PvE stamsorc does well
In PvP it is a joke comparing to magplar and magdk for example

One_Bad_Bosmer

Hescrow wrote: »

In PvE stamsorc does well
In PvP it is a joke comparing to magplar and magdk for example

And that’s exactly why I think there may not be much sorc changes in the near future. It is a heavy hitter in pve. Both mag and stam. So I guess zos’ reasoning is well there’s tons of powerful gear in the game that this class can use and maybe leave it at that? I’m not certain what else to think or say. But maybe they’ll throw us sorcs a bone but if they only make slight adjustments here or there I guess I can live with it. Like I said, I only play the stamsorc from a pvp perspective, but the class has tons of potential, just depends on how you build it.

L_Nici

Sustain really is the least of Stamsorcs problems. Its fantastic already, you can easily sustain full weapon enchantments without any Sustain sets and never run out of Stamina.

Aside that Stamsorc as class didn't exactly got weaker itself over the years, it just never got a lasting buff, while everything around it got stronger.

First (and only class related one) big change was the kill of the passive Amplitude, which ended its random chance to execute. Kill potential -> gone.

Then it became rule that a Magnecro can outspeed you with just Race against time. Stamsorc fastest class -> gone.

After that they nerfed crit to the ground, but never adjusted Critsurge. Stamsorcs passive healing -> gone.

Then they nerfed popular sets like Briarheart that replaced the loss of Critsurge, which made playing Stamsorc based on Crit pointless, which in turn lowered its healing and damage even further. Stamsorcs Burstpotential, Healing -> lowered.

Finally with the change of the CP, which to be fair hit all classes, Stamsorc lost a lot of defensive stars, which it desperately needed since its passive Skills are all offensive. Stamsorcs Survivabillity -> gone.

After that it was only played in a niche using Overload + Crystal Weapon + Crushing Weapon, which was massively OP and could nuke anything, but got nerfed now that you can't Overload out of sneak, and can't combine Crystal Weapon with any other skill of that kind. Niche -> gone

Stamsorc can only be used for a fast burst combo, which isn't even taken out of its class kit in general, but mostly bound to D Swing or similar from the weapon lines, which in todays meta where everyone runs 40k Health and 33k Armor and still deals more damage than you, is basically a lost cause. I still do play my Stamsorc and to this day no class feels more like home to me but the reward is low. You are just not competitive to any other class especially now that DoT Builds are so strong again, because Stamsorc has absolutely no counter to it. No Heal strong enough, no purge, no HoT.
Also pulling of a complete burst rotation on a fast Stamsorc build in todays lag is near impossible, because you and your opponents are constantly position desynched and its more likely you die to your D Swing being stuck till you hit the ground.

Draevik

L_Nici wrote: »

Sustain really is the least of Stamsorcs problems. Its fantastic already, you can easily sustain full weapon enchantments without any Sustain sets and never run out of Stamina.

Aside that Stamsorc as class didn't exactly got weaker itself over the years, it just never got a lasting buff, while everything around it got stronger.

First (and only class related one) big change was the kill of the passive Amplitude, which ended its random chance to execute. Kill potential -> gone.

Then it became rule that a Magnecro can outspeed you with just Race against time. Stamsorc fastest class -> gone.

After that they nerfed crit to the ground, but never adjusted Critsurge. Stamsorcs passive healing -> gone.

Then they nerfed popular sets like Briarheart that replaced the loss of Critsurge, which made playing Stamsorc based on Crit pointless, which in turn lowered its healing and damage even further. Stamsorcs Burstpotential, Healing -> lowered.

Finally with the change of the CP, which to be fair hit all classes, Stamsorc lost a lot of defensive stars, which it desperately needed since its passive Skills are all offensive. Stamsorcs Survivabillity -> gone.

After that it was only played in a niche using Overload + Crystal Weapon + Crushing Weapon, which was massively OP and could nuke anything, but got nerfed now that you can't Overload out of sneak, and can't combine Crystal Weapon with any other skill of that kind. Niche -> gone

Stamsorc can only be used for a fast burst combo, which isn't even taken out of its class kit in general, but mostly bound to D Swing or similar from the weapon lines, which in todays meta where everyone runs 40k Health and 33k Armor and still deals more damage than you, is basically a lost cause. I still do play my Stamsorc and to this day no class feels more like home to me but the reward is low. You are just not competitive to any other class especially now that DoT Builds are so strong again, because Stamsorc has absolutely no counter to it. No Heal strong enough, no purge, no HoT.
Also pulling of a complete burst rotation on a fast Stamsorc build in todays lag is near impossible, because you and your opponents are constantly position desynched and its more likely you die to your D Swing being stuck till you hit the ground.

Very accurate summary we are basically in total agreement. I guess my wording was not really on point. Because they only lost Imbued weapon stacking which I didn't even use, it simply irked me to see of all class issues that IW got taken away and then BUFFED up. Insult to injury.

WordsOfPower

Larcomar wrote: »

.
I don't know what the solution is

My response is to find interesting niche builds that could only work on a Stamsorc.

Like my Bash build that means enemies are pulled into me, smashed in the face, and then left for dust as I streak away. It's not bursty enough to score massive kills in this healing meta, but it's really fun to play and tanky as fook. In BGs it's a huge barrel of laughs

TheTruestKing

So here are my initial thoughts on Stam sorc in the ascending tide dlc.

1. Damage
So in terms of burst, on paper, the curse crystal weapon dizzy/lethal combo is vicious. It's a step in the right direction. Sorcs have always been the class you have to dodge block or take out. Your not supposed to be able to stand there and eat all the damage. But with this said the combo is lackluster even when stacking deadlands Vateshran. On paper it all seems so glorious. Curse crystal weapon vigor medium attack dizzy Dawnbreaker BOOM. But in reality if you don't one shot the target then 8/10 you arent going to kill them. Let's talk spin to win. Outside of the "Void" DC bomb build, spin to win on sorc is sub par and it's not that the void is so strong it's dark convergence is. Spin to win can be done better on 3 other classes. You could argue 4. No dots no breach no defile no spammable. You can try to remedy this with certain weapon skills. But you'll quickly learn anything Stam sorc can do other classes can do better.

2. Healing
Health recovery gutted. Crit surge unchanged when massive crit chance nerf dropped. Rally heal over time removed. They didn't shave Stam Sorcs head they beheaded him.

3. Survivability
This has always been an issue aside from warriors fury full heavy health recovery meta and Black rose DW old Major protection (30%). Stam sorc has never had a edge in tankiness but where they lacked in tankiness they made up for in speed and escape. Swift jewelry added celerity race against time. Ball of lightning gutted. Oops ZoS said as they once again peeled back the potato to far.

4. Utility
Ahhh yes mortal.... The "HOW AM I SUPPOSE TO FIT ALL THIS IN THERE"
I suggest maybe add a third bar to allow more skills on say maybe a skill like overload. Oops I forgot that used to be a thing but was deemed to strong at a time where it was not because of the third bar itself but everything surrounding it.
Which leaves us with reality.....the facts.....that melee sorcerer as it sits has nothing in it's kit worth talking about and has fallen to magblade magden levels in PvP. No breech no cleanse no escape no vitality no mending no protection no mender no hots no dots no spammable no class ulti no ulti gen. High risk low reward.

I'll end with this every dog has his day and I know ZoS will eventually address stamina sorcerer shortcomings I don't have to win every fight I don't have to do everything. There's classes that can tank heal and dps in PvP. All I want for Stam sorc is if I spec into damage to be able to deal damage effectively just on par with what the tank healers are doing in terms of damage.

Hescrow

The fact that critical surge and Dark Magic passive healing have to be buff by ZOS as they nerf critical chance and heal with battle spirit.

Another issue Comes from crystal weapon which is not really a spammable and not really a buff. Animation is also too slow and not cancelable with LA. Pitty for a supposed instant skill.

Neoauspex

I feel like stamsorc is in a better spot from a CP/Cyro standpoint than it is in BGs simply because you have access to the best ultimate for large scale PvP