Reversion of Pale Order

Nebula_DooM

Since Pale Order got changed due to builds using simmering frenzy to get 100 stacks and the skill got changed to have a cap, could we get a reversion of the change to Pale Order back to what it was? Really does kill builds in PvE and PvP having a limitation due to the amount of ppl in a group

Mayrael

It wasn't made just because of the vampire. It was made that way because of the overall effectiveness of this ring in groups. You could make a DPS group of 4 that didn't need a healer because they could heal themselves with their DPS.

Treeshka

The ring is fine right now and you can still use it in a dungeon group since four percent healing from your damage is still good and enough for many content as a damage dealer.

Vevvev

I personally want to see the ring get a minimum to it's scaling. At the very least it should have a minimum of 4% healing from the damage you do, or completely disable it's "you can't be healed by others" debuff once you hit 0% healing from damage you do.

I've joined groups that were far larger than I thought they'd be, or grew as I was in them, and found myself in combat unable to be healed by the damage I do while still getting penalized for having it equipped. Either of those changes would make me happy with one keeping it somewhat useful and the other not kicking me in the teeth till I can change it out with something else.

Lenny_linguine

Nebula_DooM wrote: »

Since Pale Order got changed due to builds using simmering frenzy to get 100 stacks and the skill got changed to have a cap, could we get a reversion of the change to Pale Order back to what it was? Really does kill builds in PvE and PvP having a limitation due to the amount of ppl in a group

I can’t see this change happening, purely because the healing from pale order for top end dps is to much. Especially in 4 man content, when the dungeon damage has to be balanced around the healing of a single healer.

Take the group of , myself and my buddies for example. Currently we run a tank, healer and 2 dps while doing end game 4 man content. If dungeon mechs permit it it we will run 3 dps instead of a healer because the extra 80 k from another dps is better than the 20k dps a healer will give with buffs. Because most classes already have a lot of good ways to stay alive even without a healer, this is already quite viable. however, if we were able to take pale order, and still pull 80k dps in the dungeons each at 20% healing rate we’re talking 16 k healing a second on top of regular class heals which completely blows a healer out of the water. this just destroys end game content on a variety of fronts. Before the current change was introduced this was the case and I virtually never took the ring off. even with the cap of 2500 healing from a single source of damage.

Jestir

It should never and will not get changed back, it never should have been allowed to reach live how it was originally

Nebula_DooM

The ring was always good for organised groups. It's effectiveness in trials is something I cannot argue with, but when it comes to 4 man dungeons, unless for achievements, there was never a competitive scene to begin with. Unfortunately for healers its one of those things where if dps are wearing it, you can ask them to take it off which I have done a couple of times (most often they'd ignore what I say, so tough love, they not gonna get any support healing from me). If they die its on their hands not me.

Vevvev wrote: »

I personally want to see the ring get a minimum to it's scaling. At the very least it should have a minimum of 4% healing from the damage you do, or completely disable it's "you can't be healed by others" debuff once you hit 0% healing from damage you do.

This is something I'd compromise on if Pale Order can't get a complete reversion. Having a set reduce to 0% is so pointless. Another thing I'd suggest trying, is to scale the effectiveness of the ring per group member exponentially. What I mean is from the 2nd group member, the % reduction is multiplied by a factor of x (x being any number ZoS can think of). That way diminishing returns can come into effect. Probably have to change around a few values like the 4% reduction per group member for that to work, just some food for thought.

Nebula_DooM

Also I should've pointed out, I am speaking from a PvP PoV, can't edit my comments for some strange reason. The theorycrafting you can do by using this ring is insannnnee that's pretty much why I would like a complete conversion. I also happen to play wit a few ppl since solo pvp died out ages ago, so that's another reason why I'm asking for this change.

(Kinda forgot to include my reasoning behind the change apologies, pretty much arguing for a change with no backup info LOL)

ajkb78

Mayrael wrote: »

It wasn't made just because of the vampire. It was made that way because of the overall effectiveness of this ring in groups. You could make a DPS group of 4 that didn't need a healer because they could heal themselves with their DPS.

You still don't need a healer in 4 man groups, with or without the ring. And the ring does still offer decent heals in 4 man groups - it scales off damage done so although the percentage is lower in 4 man groups, your damage done should be higher in a 4 man group than solo because of group buffs.