[Suggestion] Anti-PvP Crafted Set

Arunei

@jaws343
My main point seems to have been missed. I was explaining the likely reason most people want to be able to complete stuff without doing PvP, that being no TES game has required that before since they've all been single player games. It should be easy to see why people coming to this TES game might be frustrated with PvP stuff in a franchise that's never had PvP before and thus never required people to take part in to complete parts of the game.

@starkerealm
I'm not saying the set(s) suggested are good ideas or anything. I was just saying that in general, "I had to do X this way so everyone else should too" is a selfish way to look at things, as someone in a previous comment literally said "If I had to do it this way then everyone else should have to as well". If everyone had this mindset things would never change or grow or develop. Things would stay stagnant, which isn't a good thing for a game, or anything really.

@EdmondDontes
I'm sorry, but just because PvP was advertised as a big selling point doesn't make ESO a PvP game. It's a mostly PvE-focused game with PvP aspects, as evidenced by the fact that most of the game is PvE zones and content. Even the PvP zones have PvE content in them, they aren't strictly "go in and kill people" (except for BGs obviously, but even then there are different game modes that focus more on objectives than on killing your opponents).

Iron_Warrior

This is not a good idea because of the cyrodill player limit, it's so laughably low right now. Even in pop locked campaigns it looks like each faction has like 60 people online, don't know the exact number but when you compare it to the old days you can see how much emptier cyrodill has become. So now if you want to add pve people with this set in cyrodill then there would be no more room left for actual pvpers

VaranisArano

DreamsUnderStars wrote: »

[snip]

This part?

"I'm only half joking in this suggestion, because I don't think ZOS would ever add it to the game, but I would use the hell out of it if they did."

When the suggested set is not only begging for a shortcut for rewards but also badly designed such that PVPers could abuse the hell out of it to the detriment of other PVPers...

I'm afraid that "I don't expect ZOS to do it" isn't a great reason not to point out the problems with this idea. It's never a good idea to stay silent about the problems just because we think ZOS won't do it - see the current kerfuffle about the card game and the account-wide achievement points, and plenty of past examples where opponents said nothing until ZOS had already decided to go ahead with a change.

[edited to remove quote]

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

Yeah, but it goes to show that another topic like this has come up (seen many over the years) and there is no solution for players who don't want to 'Play versus players', but are confronted to do so by quests/achievements.

A simple solution for Cyrodiil would be to implement the same rule as in Imperial City -> You have a blue aura after passing a door and you are invulnerable until you choose to not be. This system could be applied to the questing areas of Cyrodiil.

Either way it would be nice to see if the producer would acknowledge the ongoing demand (years now) for a simpler and less violent solution for the questers

jaws343

Youyouz06 wrote: »

Yeah, but it goes to show that another topic like this has come up (seen many over the years) and there is no solution for players who don't want to 'Play versus players', but are confronted to do so by quests/achievements.

A simple solution for Cyrodiil would be to implement the same rule as in Imperial City -> You have a blue aura after passing a door and you are invulnerable until you choose to not be. This system could be applied to the questing areas of Cyrodiil.

Either way it would be nice to see if the producer would acknowledge the ongoing demand (years now) for a simpler and less violent solution for the questers

There is no solution because there doesn't need to be a solution. Just like there is no solution for players who don't like trials to get trials gear. Just like there is no solution for players who don't like crafting to get crafting achievements.

You can't make up a problem and then complain that there isn't a solution for it.

The problem is players who don't want to participate in all aspects of the game but expect to get the rewards from all aspect. You players are the problem. Solve yourselves.

Mushroomancer

Heartrage wrote: »

@Mushroomancer
You convinced me, this can’t be fun for some people. I think everyone should have fun and not be forced to do things they don’t like.

Let’s have all pvp sets available by doing any content. Monster masks, trial sets, dungeon sets and arena sets too. You should be able to craft any sets even if you never got to loot it by doing content. Add sets loot table to fishing too, PVF guilds will finally be able to farm sets doing what they like. Make every sets drop from excavation, thieving, assassination, chests of any regions and every mobs.

Let’s also reward titles, skins, motifs and leads this way too, doing anything should give you everything because, if you can’t get everything doing anything, your experience as a player can’t be as good as for a player that challenge themselves to do harder or different content. We should make sure that every player is rewarded equally and that there are no way for a player to feel like they have accomplished something because it would mean that another player might feel that they haven’t accomplished something.

Play as you like and get everything even if you like to play first person with one hand on a laptop without a mouse by only light attacking.

[snip]

[snip]

The entire point of the suggestion was not to "skip content and still get the rewards", it was to be able to do the content PvErs already do in PvP areas, which is not in any way related to PvP mind you [snip], but without being able to be ganked by the one random *** who seems to always be present in the most remote places in Cyrodiil just to screw with you, not to mention those very charming people that farm quest-givers. I'm sorry, how is that engaging gameplay in any way? [snip]

[snip]

And if you are referencing the fact that I am lamenting having to get PvE sets out of PvP, I was not suggesting they should be available by crafting or some *** [snip]. I was merely pointing out that it's kinda dumb, and that saying "If you don't like the content, then don't engage in it" is a non-argument, when the thing you get from that content might be needed to do the stuff you like. Kinda like, you know, if you had to do trials to get PvP gear, but that's not the case of course.

[edited for baiting & to remove quote]

VaranisArano

Mushroomancer wrote: »

Heartrage wrote: »

@Mushroomancer
You convinced me, this can’t be fun for some people. I think everyone should have fun and not be forced to do things they don’t like.

Let’s have all pvp sets available by doing any content. Monster masks, trial sets, dungeon sets and arena sets too. You should be able to craft any sets even if you never got to loot it by doing content. Add sets loot table to fishing too, PVF guilds will finally be able to farm sets doing what they like. Make every sets drop from excavation, thieving, assassination, chests of any regions and every mobs.

Let’s also reward titles, skins, motifs and leads this way too, doing anything should give you everything because, if you can’t get everything doing anything, your experience as a player can’t be as good as for a player that challenge themselves to do harder or different content. We should make sure that every player is rewarded equally and that there are no way for a player to feel like they have accomplished something because it would mean that another player might feel that they haven’t accomplished something.

Play as you like and get everything even if you like to play first person with one hand on a laptop without a mouse by only light attacking.

[snip]

[snip]

The entire point of the suggestion was not to "skip content and still get the rewards", it was to be able to do the content PvErs already do in PvP areas, which is not in any way related to PvP mind you [snip], but without being able to be ganked by the one random *** who seems to always be present in the most remote places in Cyrodiil just to screw with you, not to mention those very charming people that farm quest-givers. I'm sorry, how is that engaging gameplay in any way? [snip]

[snip]

And if you are referencing the fact that I am lamenting having to get PvE sets out of PvP, I was not suggesting they should be available by crafting or some *** [snip]. I was merely pointing out that it's kinda dumb, and that saying "If you don't like the content, then don't engage in it" is a non-argument, when the thing you get from that content might be needed to do the stuff you like. Kinda like, you know, if you had to do trials to get PvP gear, but that's not the case of course.

[edited for baiting & to remove quote]

All the content you do in PvPvE zones is tied to the PVP. Can't do them without first using the Alliance War tab and queuing up for a zone clearly marked for PvPvE.

Even ZOS acknowledges that. Those event ticket activities?

"During the Whitestrake’s Mayhem event, you can earn up to three Event Tickets per day by completing two different PvP activities: Two Tickets come from the first Cyrodiil or Battleground repeatable quest you do each day. These can include Bounty Board quests, a Town Daily, the Conquest Board quests, or the daily Battleground quest.One Ticket if you complete a District daily from the Imperial City."

So yes, the Town Quests are PVP activities, by ZOS' own definition. Even the ones that don't take place in flagged towns.

So while you might find it unengaging to have PVP happen in the middle of PVP activity in a PvPvE zone...that's how Cyrodiil and Imperial City are supposed to work. Sorry, but nobody out in Cyro or Imperial City should have the expectation that they are doing a "PVE-only" activity.

Aldoss

Mushroomancer wrote: »

The entire point of the suggestion was not to "skip content and still get the rewards"

You want to go to these zones to get skyshards, titles, alliance points, telvar, etc. All of which are rewards for participating in a PvP environment that comes with risks. I wouldn't even be on board for this even if it meant you literally became a ghost inside Cyro or IC because it would mean that you'd be taking a spot from someone who otherwise would have liked to an actual participant.

Mushroomancer wrote: »

I'm sorry, how is that engaging gameplay in any way?

It clearly irks you. That's the unfortunate reality that makes it engaging for those players looking to gank you. You can get back at them by no longer being gankable. I think you should try it. It's unbelievably satisfying standing over your attempted-ganker's corpse.

Mushroomancer wrote: »

I was merely pointing out that it's kinda dumb, and that saying "If you don't like the content, then don't engage in it" is a non-argument, when the thing you get from that content might be needed to do the stuff you like. Kinda like, you know, if you had to do trials to get PvP gear, but that's not the case of course.

Powerful Assault Ice Staffs are extremely challenging to farm for. You could easily blow 100k+ telvar on crates gambling for one. Amassing that much telvar deserves appropriate compensation. Powerful Assault is also one of the best sets in the game for group content. The fact that trial groups like it doesn't suddenly make it PvE and thus, PvErs are entitled to get it. Either strap on some PvP gear, learn the ropes of how to PvP and farm the crates yourself, or support the PvP community who do choose to gamble their telvar on it. There are so many ways to get gold in this game without doing any PvP.

Also, Olorime remains a BIS set for PvP magplars. 100% guarantee those that obtained their perfected versions didn't talk down to their raid groups and demand that they keep their spot in the raid even though they were in their PvP spec. They saddled up, changed their specs, and blended into the ranks of the PvErs.

This game is not a PvE only game nor is it a PvP only game. It's both. People need to stop acting like one doesn't matter.

starkerealm

VaranisArano wrote: »

So while you might find it unengaging to have PVP happen in the middle of PVP activity in a PvPvE zone...that's how Cyrodiil and Imperial City are supposed to work. Sorry, but nobody out in Cyro or Imperial City should have the expectation that they are doing a "PVE-only" activity.

More than that, as PvE only activities, the towns are, actually, pretty dull. I mean, we literally have, "kill 10 goblins," quests in Cyrodiil.

The town quests are structured as one of 3 things. Go someplace, kill some dudes and/or take their stuff. Go do a delve. Wander around the town doing stuff for a minute. The structure of all three is intended to promote PvP.

Most of the, "go someplace and kill a dude," will drag you across a path between keeps.

Staying in towns is pretty self-explanatory, you're more likely to encounter hostile players that way than just wandering around the countryside.

The delves you get routed to tend to have one way in and out, so going in there to do the quest will mean that if anyone follows you in, you'll need to slip past them or fight to leave. (In many cases, the quest tied delves actually offer advantage to the players entering the delves vs. the ones that are already in there.)

Lumenn

I personally wouldn't touch pvp the first few years I played simply because due to previous games pvp = no life neckbeards who's only thrill in life is to grief other players through corpse camping etc. I also suffer from arthritis so my fingers aren't as swift as some of the younger folk playing in pvp. (RIP heavy attack sorc build) But I don't think I'd agree to this set, or even a pve version of cyro. After playing in bgs when they first came out and then breaking into cyro it's fun I love it. At least until we all manage to get every set/skill nerfed including heavy attacks...( Har har) but zos won't put enough resources in cyro as it is to ensure it functions correctly.

I just don't think it's fair to ask that pvp players wait longer in a que or deal with even more lag so that pure pve can skip through the flowers and collect skyshards. Add this change and all year will be like the event with waiting in que just to find 3/4 of the players are pve and you can't pvp today as there is no one to play against. Add another server just for pve? Nope, throw those resources to pvp thank you, it's needed.

Hvíthákarl

Lumenn wrote: »

Add another server just for pve? Nope, throw those resources to pvp thank you, it's needed.

The whole point of adding a dedicated Cyro + IC PvE sv is exactly that. ZoS could change anything they wanted in both without having to take PvE ppl into account since they would've already got a dedicated experience. They could also remove skyshards and some other redundant stuff from pvp servers so the experience is more focused around PvP.

So... both are true. By adding a PvE server, ZoS could actually allocate more resources into making deeper pvp changes w/o worrying about balancing PvP and PvE fun.

At this point, any MMO dev should've learned that mixing PvE and PvP up *doesn't* provide a fun experience for *most* players. Splitting them results in better management and a smoother, more refined experience.

Amottica

gabbo1928 wrote: »

etchedpixels wrote: »

You could just skip the event. It's a lot simpler 8)

The event exacerbates the problem, but this isn't specifically about the event. There are skyshards, PvE missions (including 1 in IC that grants a skill point), and PvE achievements (such as Imperial Anchor Shatterer and Tamriel Anchor Destroyer) that players must go to those zones for.

There are plenty of players who can solo world bosses, but won't last 5 seconds against a PvP regular 1v1. When you adventure in a PvE zone and encounter a tough enemy, you can avoid them. If the wrong player spots you in Imperial City, they will hunt you down and kill you. When you die in a PvE zone, you can respawn where you stand. If you're killed by a player in Cyrodiil and no one in your faction is nearby, your only choice is to respawn far from your objective.

It ruins the gaming experience when you're focused on a mission objective, and you get ambushed by someone you stand no chance against. And for the PvP player, where's the honor in killing a player who isn't there to fight?

No, it does not. The event is PvP because PvP is part of the game. Considering the overwhelming majority of events are strictly PvE this is a fair balance.

Also, it is clear that Zenimax made a very conscious choice to put those sky shards, PvE quests, dolmens, and dungeons into Cyrodiil, a zone they made into a full-time Pvp zone. Just as it is clear that another 50 skill points are locked behind PvP.

While I respect your choice to not engage in PvP, this is not a problem with the game's design as it is clearly on purpose.

Forgot to mention that this event is a great time to grab those sky shards and do some of the quests to get the title. There are added campaigns that have a low population, and during off-hours have pretty much no one. Even then, most are not interested in actual PvP. This significantly lowers the risk of PvP.

Tyralbin

FluffWit wrote: »

I wouldnt really care if they gave you guys a pve Cyrodiil and IC.

But no, you can't have ghost mode in competitive pvp.

I think PVE cyro and IC are a good idea.

Removing the AP/Telvar rewards from the PVE versions would make sense.

Make the skyshards that are normally locked behind enemy gates some type of arena or dungeon.

Indigogo

Hvíthákarl wrote: »

Lumenn wrote: »

Add another server just for pve? Nope, throw those resources to pvp thank you, it's needed.

The whole point of adding a dedicated Cyro + IC PvE sv is exactly that. ZoS could change anything they wanted in both without having to take PvE ppl into account since they would've already got a dedicated experience. They could also remove skyshards and some other redundant stuff from pvp servers so the experience is more focused around pvp

You know pvpers need a butt load of skill points too? Why should they have to leave their open world zone to get basic necessities they need?

Cyrodiil exists as a self contained climate. You can level up fighters/mages/skill lines, harvest resources etc while still engaging in pvp.

It's not there solely to entice poor little lamb pve-ers. I feel like when my dogs look at me pleadingly when I eat my dinner and I have to gently chide them, "It's not for you".

Tommy_The_Gun

I had very similar idea long time ago, but it was , kinda different.

It was a crafted gear set that occupied all 12 gear slots and had an extreme kiss-curse effect. Each regular bonus to stat, was in fact a penalty. So for example 1206 max health gear set bonus was a "minus" 1206 penalty to max health.

All 12 slots occupied means that you could not use other sets. Each having a penalty means that PvE in Cyro or IC would actually be very hard. The final bonus was basically similar to what OP mentioned, but in a different way.

In order for this set to work, you would need to equip it before entering Cyro or IC. When inside a campaign, you could not unequipped it. It would be locked till you leave those zones. The set bonus would be something like this:

2 items: Takes away 1206 max health
3 items: Takes away 1487 Armor
4 items: Takes away 1096 Maximum Stamina
5 items: Takes away 1096 Maximum Magicka
6 items: Takes away 129 Weapon Damage and Spell Damage
7 items: Takes away 129 Weapon Damage and Spell Damage
8 items: Takes away 129 Health Recovery, Magicka Recovery and Stamina Recovery
9 items: Takes away 129 Health Recovery, Magicka Recovery and Stamina Recovery
10 items: Takes away 657 Critical Chance
11 items: Takes away 1487 Offensive Penetration
12 items: Adds Minor Breach, Cowardice and Defile to you.
While in Cyrodiil or Imperial City, you can not interact, see, deal damage and heal other players, but they can not also interact, see, deal damage or heal you. You can not gain Alliance Points or Collect Tel-Var stones from all sources. While in Cyrodiil or Imperial City, this set can not be unequipped. This set can only be crafted as a maximum level set.

Maximum level set, means that it would have to be CP 160 set, to avoid players running level 1 set for lower penalties.

On top of all that, you would still get Battle Spirit penalties. Basically, if you want to avoid PvP - you will get "Dark Souls" PvE

As for the player count in Cyrodiil/IC - those with this set would basically not even be rendered, so there might be a separate, hidden instance for them. Besides, they would also not be rendered for themselves, so pretty much solo PvE only - to avoid defeating bosses in large groups, as it defeats the whole idea.

hafgood

What is it that brings out the toxic PvErs at this time of year? Oh wait, its a PvP event.

Out trot all the opinionated entitled "I only PvE" brigade who feel they are special and should have access to a PvP zone in a manner in which they can't be killed by the "sweaty no neck PvPers".

I have news for you, I have a neck, I do sweat but I bathe regularly so smell quite nice.

I was one of you, I was one of the I only PvE Brigade. I did not want to PvP, experiences of PvP in other games told me I didn't like it. In the end though I tried it.

And you know what I fell on my feet. I got in a good PvP guild and started to make friends and learn the PvP game.

Then I started vet trials and switched back to PvE for the last six months or so.

And then MYM came around again. This time, for the first time ever, I made a PvP build in the armoury. I equipped it and have had a blast.

Got my third star on day 1 (yes I had ranked to 44 on a PvE build) and yesterday got my 4th. Won't get my final one this MYM but boy have I had a lot of fun. Yes I'm sure I've killed PvErs during the event but only ones taking part in assaulting keeps, etc. Those clearly questing have been left alone, not interested in them at all, but they still have to take the risks and rightly so.

PvP is exciting and nothing like I imagined. I love it and would encourage people to try. I get some have and didn't like it, that's fine, but others shout and scream without trying it.

No, to PvE IC & Cyro. Why? Because that would stop many from trying PvP and finding that it's not what they thought and can be a lot of fun

Tyralbin

I myself love the event and some aspects of PVP.

But I can see why others would want a PVE version of the event.

What annoys me most is those that say no to this then moan that pvers are ruining their PVP experience. Not pointing fingers at anyone in this current thread but I have seen this before.

People can't have it both ways.

Remathilis

So the other day, I tried doing the quests in Vlastrus on my EP toon. We had the town, but no surrounding keeps. I got though all the khajiit quest givers quests and went to do the elf in the house. I got 7 quests in when I had to do the delve quest to kill the boss. When I got to the delve, the boss was dead and I had to wait whatever time it was for him to respawn. By the time he did, the town has flipped back up yellow. I tried to get though the door just to hand in the quest, but the guards aggroed me and I couldn't use the door. That allso triggered any yellows to run over for their free AP. After death, the closest I could respawn was EP territory on the other side of the map. I abandoned the quest and any hope I of getting the 10 dailies done.

I'd have absolutely loved some toggle that would have let me turn in my quest without harassment as it was the boss respawn time that was the factor in not finishing the quests. I guess the advantage of the Global Achievements is that my DC character who did them all once now will count and don't need to exercise in frustration of getting 8/10 quests done before being denied the last two.

hafgood

@Remathilis

Quick question - why did you not pick up a quest from each quest giver at the same time? Would have reduced your total time spent questing.

Sadly though the delve one is a pain, she takes a long time to respawn.

You aggroing a guard would.not cause yellows to pour into the town for free AP. You probably run into a yellow questor who fancied himself as a PvPer

hafgood

Tyralbin wrote: »

I myself love the event and some aspects of PVP.

But I can see why others would want a PVE version of the event.

What annoys me most is those that say no to this then moan that pvers are ruining their PVP experience. Not pointing fingers at anyone in this current thread but I have seen this before.

People can't have it both ways.

I certainly wouldn't say PvErs are spoiling the PvP experience directly. Indirectly they may be, but even then I don't blame them.

Why indirectly? I play in Blackreach, it is noticeable during the event that there are more grey players in Black at the moment, why? Simply because they can't get in Grey because the queue time has increased massively.

Would be better if PvErs went in the new campaigns rather than the established ones, they would get in quicker for one thing, but I don't blame the PVers, Grey is top of the list.

Lumenn

The only thing about pure pve that may "ruin" pvp play imo is the hour(or two! ) That you wait to get in. But please do go see cyro, try it for a spell and hopefully get hooked. Low pop pvp is BOOOORING.

Remathilis

hafgood wrote: »

@Remathilis

Quick question - why did you not pick up a quest from each quest giver at the same time? Would have reduced your total time spent questing.

Sadly though the delve one is a pain, she takes a long time to respawn.

You aggroing a guard would.not cause yellows to pour into the town for free AP. You probably run into a yellow questor who fancied himself as a PvPer

Once the guards came running, any yellows who were still the area ran over. Even if I could have taken the guards, the guards and 6 AD toons wasn't in the cards.

Moral of tale is there needs to be a better way to hand in quests if ZoS intends to keep PVE stuff to Cyrodiil, especially for Mayhem. One that allows you to hand in the quest after you've gotten it.

Aldoss

Remathilis wrote: »

Moral of tale is there needs to be a better way to hand in quests if ZoS intends to keep PVE stuff to Cyrodiil, especially for Mayhem. One that allows you to hand in the quest after you've gotten it.

The quest you were doing is not PvE nor is it designed for PvErs. It's a quest, inside a PvP zone, that requires you to perform PvP related tasks in order to access the quest giver, and receive PvP gear as a reward. The event is not a PvE event, thus ZOS is not "keeping" anything from anyone.

If you want to return a cyro quest without doing any fighting, do the scout mission. Ride on your horse in the country away from keeps, arrive at the resource and stay at max range, and perform the scout. It will take you 10 min or less depending on how progressed your riding skills are.

deleted221106-002999

gabbo1928 wrote: »

...
5 Items: You become impervious to damage and snares from enemy players, and are unable to damage or snare them yourself. You cannot heal other players. You cannot capture flags, and all AP gain from group player kills or flag capture is disabled....

This looks like just another 'make a pve cyrodiil' request.

Lumsdenml

gabbo1928 wrote: »

As a PvE player, there are few things more frustrating than having to venture into a PvP zone for skyshards/skillpoints, or to earn Event Tickets, only to be swiftly killed by another player when you clearly aren't there for PvP combat. I'm only half joking in this suggestion, because I don't think ZOS would ever add it to the game, but I would use the hell out of it if they did.

Crafted Set: Skyshard Hunter
Location: All faction bases in Cyrodiil, Imperial City, and any future PvP zones.
2 Items: Whatever
3 Items: Whatever
4 Items: Whatever
5 Items: You become impervious to damage and snares from enemy players, and are unable to damage or snare them yourself. You cannot heal other players. You cannot capture flags, and all AP gain from group player kills or flag capture is disabled.

The set could have a unique visual effect -- such as a long pole with a white flag -- to identify non-combatants to other players. And if they could make it so you can only equip/unequip this set while inside your faction base, that could stem abuse. Alternately, a font placed in faction bases that grants this same function as a 2hr "I'm Only Here For the Skyshards" buff would also be acceptable.

That would be fine, as long as you also add on the 5pc bonus that you "can not complete quests or gather skyshards"

Kwoung

Let's boil this (and every other post like it) down to it's base, as it really isn't about PVE or PVP...

"I don't want to participate in game mode X for reason Y, but desire reward Z."

X could be Trials, Arenas, Undaunted Dungeons, BG's, Cyrodiil, IC or whatever.
Y could be physical limitations, lack of skill, desire to play solo, lack of desire/ability to git gud at that mode, or usually... simple entitlement.
Z could be skyshards, skill points, gear, titles, achievements, houses, mounts, skins, or whatever. (most of those are actually achievements)

So realistically, how exactly can ZOS solve that issue?

For me it is "I don't want to participate in vet Trials because I can't git gud at DPS/mechanics due to physical limitations, but would really like the mount reward from some of them." Someone else can substitute some activity/reward that exists in a PVP zone, but it is no different than my issue. Nor is it different than anyone else that has issues with some part of the game they do not enjoy, yet wants the rewards. I could easily say that skyshards in delves are unobtainable for me, because I find delves so easy, it is a literal insult asking me to even enter and traverse one, and I don't like the feeling of having to waste my precious game time doing it. Or maybe I just enjoy crafting gear, but don't want to earn the money to buy materials, nor do I want to go collect them myself.

Oddly, when it comes to skill points at least, ZOS has added so many at this point and ways to manipulate them on the fly, you literally don't have to enter any game mode you dislike and can still have more than enough to create any build you want. So quite honestly, they shouldn't even be on the list of things to desire. So other than the PVP currencies and "some" gear sets, this basically leaves achievements and the associated rewards. Since by definition, an achievement, is something you worked at and achieved, not something that was handed to you, where should ZOS start? I guess they would need to stop calling them achievements first off. Then they would need to program in a bypass to actually earning them, probably put a simple button at every zone entry point you could press and collect all the rewards, without having to interact with that content.

And what do you end up with, because now it isn't really a game, just run around, press all the buttons, reap the rewards and be done with it. Alternatively they could create a game you have to play, where you are forced to overcome your personal issues with some game mode if you really desire a particular reward, and make everyone work for it... which is apparently the path they chose.

For me personally, I like it this way. I have come to grips with the fact that there are things in this game, and every other game ever, that I will not achieve, and that is okay. There are things, many things, IRL I will not achieve either, and that is okay too. The world doesn't owe me a 10 bedroom home, a Ferrari, a yacht or even a raise because I simply showed up at work. I have however, managed to earn the things in game and life that matter to me, I was capable of earning, and am proud of what I achieved. I guess there was a point in my life I desired items others had, but I matured, realized if I wanted them I had to earn them, and overcame the obstacles in order to do so. My life would be rather empty and meaningless had it all been simply handed to me... as would my time in game.

xDeusEJRx

I don't agree with a set that lets you go into pvp and just not interact with PVP. I'd rather have a PVE instance instead. Imagine how many people will go in to do sight-seeing, skyshard collecting, fishing. Or low level players that come in because of that "welcome to cyrodiil message" when you hit level 10. Lots of PVE'ers will come in an fill up queues or make people think a campaign is active when its mostly pve players just questing. Which will be a waste of time for people who are looking to play PVP. I'd rather just have a PVE instance for them to go to.

Remathilis

Aldoss wrote: »

Remathilis wrote: »

Moral of tale is there needs to be a better way to hand in quests if ZoS intends to keep PVE stuff to Cyrodiil, especially for Mayhem. One that allows you to hand in the quest after you've gotten it.

The quest you were doing is not PvE nor is it designed for PvErs. It's a quest, inside a PvP zone, that requires you to perform PvP related tasks in order to access the quest giver, and receive PvP gear as a reward. The event is not a PvE event, thus ZOS is not "keeping" anything from anyone.

If you want to return a cyro quest without doing any fighting, do the scout mission. Ride on your horse in the country away from keeps, arrive at the resource and stay at max range, and perform the scout. It will take you 10 min or less depending on how progressed your riding skills are.

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Death_to_the_Crone

Quick Walkthrough
Speak to Nelerien.
Travel to Nisin Cave (delve) and kill Barasatii (delve boss).
Return to Nelerien.

I'm sorry, do you consider going into a Cyrodiil delve and killing the delve boss to be PvP? Do you really think camping out on top the boss waiting for it to respawn and then handing in the quest is REMOTELY similar to taking a keep? It's a stupid PvE quest stuck in a PvP zone designed with an artificial time gate (boss respawn).

Here's an idea: set up a wandering NPC in the wilderness near each town. The NPC can accept any completed quests for the nearby town but cannot hand out new ones. That way, people who do a quest and come back to find the map has flipped in 10 minutes it takes for the boss to respawn don't have a completed quest sitting in their queue. Or maybe make the boss respawn timer in Cyrodiil only 5 minutes. Or maybe have the boss spawn when you reach the quest destination like other Cyrodiil quest encounters do. Or maybe just get rid of the damn PvE quests in Cyrodiil altogether.

jaws343

Remathilis wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

Remathilis wrote: »

Moral of tale is there needs to be a better way to hand in quests if ZoS intends to keep PVE stuff to Cyrodiil, especially for Mayhem. One that allows you to hand in the quest after you've gotten it.

The quest you were doing is not PvE nor is it designed for PvErs. It's a quest, inside a PvP zone, that requires you to perform PvP related tasks in order to access the quest giver, and receive PvP gear as a reward. The event is not a PvE event, thus ZOS is not "keeping" anything from anyone.

If you want to return a cyro quest without doing any fighting, do the scout mission. Ride on your horse in the country away from keeps, arrive at the resource and stay at max range, and perform the scout. It will take you 10 min or less depending on how progressed your riding skills are.

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Death_to_the_Crone

Quick Walkthrough
Speak to Nelerien.
Travel to Nisin Cave (delve) and kill Barasatii (delve boss).
Return to Nelerien.

I'm sorry, do you consider going into a Cyrodiil delve and killing the delve boss to be PvP? Do you really think camping out on top the boss waiting for it to respawn and then handing in the quest is REMOTELY similar to taking a keep? It's a stupid PvE quest stuck in a PvP zone designed with an artificial time gate (boss respawn).

Here's an idea: set up a wandering NPC in the wilderness near each town. The NPC can accept any completed quests for the nearby town but cannot hand out new ones. That way, people who do a quest and come back to find the map has flipped in 10 minutes it takes for the boss to respawn don't have a completed quest sitting in their queue. Or maybe make the boss respawn timer in Cyrodiil only 5 minutes. Or maybe have the boss spawn when you reach the quest destination like other Cyrodiil quest encounters do. Or maybe just get rid of the damn PvE quests in Cyrodiil altogether.

Considering killing that delve boss gives you a boost to AP gains. And the only way to even pick up that quest is to queue into a PVP zone through an option in your menu directly available for PVP zone access. Yes. Everything in Cyrodil and Imo City is PVP. All of it. It's all PVP, because PVP is the risk you have to take to do the content.

starkerealm

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

I had very similar idea long time ago, but it was , kinda different.

It was a crafted gear set that occupied all 12 gear slots and had an extreme kiss-curse effect. Each regular bonus to stat, was in fact a penalty. So for example 1206 max health gear set bonus was a "minus" 1206 penalty to max health.

All 12 slots occupied means that you could not use other sets. Each having a penalty means that PvE in Cyro or IC would actually be very hard. The final bonus was basically similar to what OP mentioned, but in a different way.

In order for this set to work, you would need to equip it before entering Cyro or IC. When inside a campaign, you could not unequipped it. It would be locked till you leave those zones. The set bonus would be something like this:

2 items: Takes away 1206 max health
3 items: Takes away 1487 Armor
4 items: Takes away 1096 Maximum Stamina
5 items: Takes away 1096 Maximum Magicka
6 items: Takes away 129 Weapon Damage and Spell Damage
7 items: Takes away 129 Weapon Damage and Spell Damage
8 items: Takes away 129 Health Recovery, Magicka Recovery and Stamina Recovery
9 items: Takes away 129 Health Recovery, Magicka Recovery and Stamina Recovery
10 items: Takes away 657 Critical Chance
11 items: Takes away 1487 Offensive Penetration
12 items: Adds Minor Breach, Cowardice and Defile to you.
While in Cyrodiil or Imperial City, you can not interact, see, deal damage and heal other players, but they can not also interact, see, deal damage or heal you. You can not gain Alliance Points or Collect Tel-Var stones from all sources. While in Cyrodiil or Imperial City, this set can not be unequipped. This set can only be crafted as a maximum level set.

Maximum level set, means that it would have to be CP 160 set, to avoid players running level 1 set for lower penalties.

On top of all that, you would still get Battle Spirit penalties. Basically, if you want to avoid PvP - you will get "Dark Souls" PvE

As for the player count in Cyrodiil/IC - those with this set would basically not even be rendered, so there might be a separate, hidden instance for them. Besides, they would also not be rendered for themselves, so pretty much solo PvE only - to avoid defeating bosses in large groups, as it defeats the whole idea.

So, simple problem with this set... you can still turn it on and off in Cyrodiil.

Player characters have 12 active set slots, but, you actually have 14 equip slots. You can toggle off 11 and 12pc bonuses by simply slotting a maelstrom weapon on your back bar and swapping to and from as you want. After that, the penalties aren't significant enough to make up for being able to simply go immortal whenever you want.

Actually, while I could be wrong about this, I'm pretty sure wall of zap, razor legos, and endless hail would continue to do damage after swapping to the immunity bar. You wouldn't get AP if they died while you were on that bar, but you could certainly abuse them with it.