Imperial city pve Queue needs to happen.

AlnilamE

francesinhalover wrote: »

dinokstrunz wrote: »

For the 20th time, no it doesn't! There's no good argument for a PvE Cyro or IC.

cyro doesn't have a story mode.

Cyro has more quests than IC. All the important quest parts in IC (when you read dialogue) are in safe areas where you can take your time.

VaranisArano

Xebov wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Like it or not (and most don't like it), Imperial City was designed as a PVE/PVP space where the sewers, Districts, and quest areas mix NPC farming and the threat of Player fighting. You can't take out the PVP and claim to be playing as intended, nor that you deserve the same rewards as the people who do play in the mixed PVE/PVP environment.

Just because someone was designed in a certain way it doesnt mean that its working and viewed or used as such.
There are 2 simple options regarding it.
Either the zone gets reworked in a way that propper PvP objectives exist and the risk vs reward is actually taking place with things like zero risk ganking going out of the window and rewards fitting to the currency requirements to get ppl populate the area.
Or it gets converted into a PvE area.

No matter how you view the intention, the zone is bad for PvE and for PvP due to its design.

It's an old, free DLC that still draws bunches of players to it three times a year for event tickets.

Every time we have an event, there's a ton of PVEers begging ZOS to make it a PVE-only safe zone. Every other time, there's regular threads by PVPers asking for changes to make IC better for PVP.

Has ZOS done any of it?

Nope. Well, they've added more rewards like monster helms, to the despair of the PVE-only players. They've kept on running 3 Events that require Imperial City for tickets.


Broken or working as designed, I'd be very surprised if ZOS thinks it worth changing at this point when the current PvE/PvP setup works just fine to get players in during events (and conversely, get players to buy event tickets to avoid it - I'm cynical enough to not discount the monetization of PVP avoidance.)

Hapexamendios

Don't see the need for it myself. When events aren't happening, the sewers are practically deserted.

dem0n1k

ZOS should double down on IC & change Telvar to their own form of Crypto-coin. Make the loss from death 100% & disable all methods of porting to other campaigns. Real risk, real rewards!

It'd be fun amirite!?

francesinhalover

dem0n1k wrote: »

ZOS should double down on IC & change Telvar to their own form of Crypto-coin. Make the loss from death 100% & disable all methods of porting to other campaigns. Real risk, real rewards!

It'd be fun amirite!?

Imperial city tournments

30 players join. 10 from each faction.

The team with most telvar wins big money prize.

spartaxoxo

Jack-0 wrote: »

Absolutely dreadful idea, there’s no way in hell it should be possible to earn Tel Var with zero risk.

IC is an amazing and unique zone, and the only one we have in this game that promotes genuine risk vs reward, please stop trying to neuter it and twist it to fit your risk-free wishes.

If you don’t like IC, don’t go there.

IC absolutely does not promote risk vs reward. That is why it is dead.

It promotes risk avoidance. You either lower your risk to barely any for good rewards with either large groups or ganking (and also porting to Cyro instead of hauling it back), or you don't bother at all.

It's extremely poorly designed and that's why it's such an utter failure that you can't even get people to play it for free

orgin_stadia

Not going to happen. PvP'ers desperately need the easy kills

On a serious note, just go there off event and you'll be fine.

SammyKhajit

Like hip flaps and daily mount training, this one will never be changed

Minyassa

Nah. The answer isn't making PvP into a PvE zone, that's been discussed to death and it would never work equitably. The answer is to ask them to add more events so that PvE players don't feel obligated to do something they hate in order to get event tickets. Either that or to let us spend Endeavor points on tickets if we can't afford the Crowns. Removing that feeling of "have to" would make it so everyone in the PvP zones is there for fun and that ultimately makes a better play experience for everyone.

jaws343

Minyassa wrote: »

Nah. The answer isn't making PvP into a PvE zone, that's been discussed to death and it would never work equitably. The answer is to ask them to add more events so that PvE players don't feel obligated to do something they hate in order to get event tickets. Either that or to let us spend Endeavor points on tickets if we can't afford the Crowns. Removing that feeling of "have to" would make it so everyone in the PvP zones is there for fun and that ultimately makes a better play experience for everyone.

Add more events?? How many more PVE only events can they add before the year is completely and tediously full of them? There are more than enough events that offer more than enough tickets to obtain all of the fragments and morphs every year even while missing entire events.

New Life
Anniversary Jubilee
Deadric War
Explorers (lately multiple times)
Jesters
Thieves Guild and DB
Undaunted
Witches

Compared to: Imperial City and Whitetrake, both of which can be done for tickets without actually participating in any pvp activities outside of just entering the zones for some 3 minutes quests.

Not to mention the 4 updates each year that focus solely around PVE content. 4 Dungeons, 2 entire zones with storylines and pve content, like companions and trials and world bosses, and new incursion events.

But, how dare the PVP community get 2 PVP related events each year. How dare they.

Katahdin

jaws343 wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

Nah. The answer isn't making PvP into a PvE zone, that's been discussed to death and it would never work equitably. The answer is to ask them to add more events so that PvE players don't feel obligated to do something they hate in order to get event tickets. Either that or to let us spend Endeavor points on tickets if we can't afford the Crowns. Removing that feeling of "have to" would make it so everyone in the PvP zones is there for fun and that ultimately makes a better play experience for everyone.

Add more events?? How many more PVE only events can they add before the year is completely and tediously full of them? There are more than enough events that offer more than enough tickets to obtain all of the fragments and morphs every year even while missing entire events.

New Life
Anniversary Jubilee
Deadric War
Explorers (lately multiple times)
Jesters
Thieves Guild and DB
Undaunted
Witches

Compared to: Imperial City and Whitetrake, both of which can be done for tickets without actually participating in any pvp activities outside of just entering the zones for some 3 minutes quests.

Not to mention the 4 updates each year that focus solely around PVE content. 4 Dungeons, 2 entire zones with storylines and pve content, like companions and trials and world bosses, and new incursion events.

But, how dare the PVP community get 2 PVP related events each year. How dare they.

Also
Summerset/CWC/Morrowind event
Wrothgar Event
Elesweyr Event

There are 3-4 times more PVE only events compared to the few events that require venturing into a PVP zone

Kartalin

Dem_kitkats1 wrote: »

Or at least reduce the loss upon death in order to discourage people from just farming farmers.

It used to be 80% loss versus 20% retained upon death, instead of 50-50. This has already been sufficiently reduced. There has to be some risk/reward structure for it to function as a pve zone with pvp enabled.

EdmondDontes

How about a PvP que for every zone that is currently PvE?

Your idea is to make a PvP zone into PvE. There are only a few ways to PvP and a thousand ways to PvE in ESO.

Elendir2am

EdmondDontes wrote: »

How about a PvP que for every zone that is currently PvE?

Your idea is to make a PvP zone into PvE. There are only a few ways to PvP and a thousand ways to PvE in ESO.

Do you understand that you would spread PvPers on such wide area that they would hardly meet?

BronzeCaiman

It will all be fine when the event is over. There is not reason to rework the map, ZoS will have their hands full reworking battle spirit for PvP players several times through out the year after update 33s new skill scaling.

Maybe we should just have the PvP event on during any other events downtime, it seems like it can revive IC and Cyrodiil.

xylena_lazarow

hafgood wrote: »

You have to learn to deal with what is there, learn, adapt, overcome

The mechanics encourage experienced tryhards to deliberately seek out casuals/noobs and stomp them, while avoiding other players on their level. These sorts of toxic gameplay patterns and the "git gud" attitude from some players is why PvP is suffering so badly. You can't blame performance in IC.

lexicondevil99

francesinhalover wrote: »

Parrot1986 wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

hafgood wrote: »

No, sorry but no. Its a PvPvE zone. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean you should have it change to something you want.

IC is a PvE zone where PvP is enabled. Its similar to how games like WoW handle PvP servers.

Its not a PvPvE zone. A PvPvE zone would require PvP objectives. The only thing you have that gets close to this is the single district flag.

vesselwiththepestle wrote: »

You would have to remove Tel Var completely. Not sure if that would make sense just to do some quests and get some sky shards.

Tel Var are the core reason IC is not working at all. The core idea was that players fight for it, but you get to little compared to how much you need. If you would reduce the poor amounts further you dont create incentive to go there. What you would need is keeping the current values for PvE and multiply the values for the "normal" instance by a value of 3-4 to create some actual benefit for the risk.

IC launched specifically as a PvP zone for players to go to out with Cyro that have rewards such as tel var. that’s a fact and still valid regardless of the lack of pvp objectives. That’s not down to the zone and more down to zos complete lack of investment into pvp in general

it was supposed to provide risk and reward, which wouldn’t exist in pve instance only. Every boss is solable even molag bal the rewards for very little risk. The rewards are of pretty high value witb 5k stones letting you buy hakeijo and selling a glyph for nearly 70k gold on pc eu.

For a PVE IC or Cyro then it should be a reflection of the other pve zones so gear drops and quests. No pvp currency.

Yes it lauched has a pvp zone, was a pvp zone for years, failed and now it's free because players hated it.
believe it or not most people play mmorpgs for the pve not the pvp, pvp is a minority and the zone is garbage for the vast majority of players.
Giving it a pve mode with or without telvar would help it.

Literally every other zone other than BG's, IC and Cyro is PvE. Every. Single. One. There is a new chapter starting soon, which is 100% PvE. We have already been told there will be no additions to PvP until after the code is rewritten, which will be a minimum of one year from now, quite possibly two years or more from now. There will still be new zones, dungeons, trials etc released during this time, 100% of which will be added PvE content. And you are here asking that ZOS take away 1/3 of all PvP content because you get killed occasionally? Can't we please at least keep what little we have?

xylena_lazarow

lexicondevil99 wrote: »

Can't we please at least keep what little we have?

How would a PvE instance detract from the PvP instances? There's no reason to want to fight PvEers.

francesinhalover

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

lexicondevil99 wrote: »

Can't we please at least keep what little we have?

How would a PvE instance detract from the PvP instances? There's no reason to want to fight PvEers.

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

lexicondevil99 wrote: »

Can't we please at least keep what little we have?

How would a PvE instance detract from the PvP instances? There's no reason to want to fight PvEers.

From what i understand , some people just wana bully other players that don't do pvp to feel good about themselves.
In current imperial city we barely make telvar.
I asked to have telvar for pve players reduced by 75% and they still cried about it. Its obviously not the telvar.
We all know why ppl want pve on imperial city. Its clearly not for a good 1vs1 because i can promise you ganking nightblades and backstabbers arent looking for one

francesinhalover

lexicondevil99 wrote: »

francesinhalover wrote: »

Parrot1986 wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

hafgood wrote: »

No, sorry but no. Its a PvPvE zone. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean you should have it change to something you want.

IC is a PvE zone where PvP is enabled. Its similar to how games like WoW handle PvP servers.

Its not a PvPvE zone. A PvPvE zone would require PvP objectives. The only thing you have that gets close to this is the single district flag.

vesselwiththepestle wrote: »

You would have to remove Tel Var completely. Not sure if that would make sense just to do some quests and get some sky shards.

Tel Var are the core reason IC is not working at all. The core idea was that players fight for it, but you get to little compared to how much you need. If you would reduce the poor amounts further you dont create incentive to go there. What you would need is keeping the current values for PvE and multiply the values for the "normal" instance by a value of 3-4 to create some actual benefit for the risk.

IC launched specifically as a PvP zone for players to go to out with Cyro that have rewards such as tel var. that’s a fact and still valid regardless of the lack of pvp objectives. That’s not down to the zone and more down to zos complete lack of investment into pvp in general

it was supposed to provide risk and reward, which wouldn’t exist in pve instance only. Every boss is solable even molag bal the rewards for very little risk. The rewards are of pretty high value witb 5k stones letting you buy hakeijo and selling a glyph for nearly 70k gold on pc eu.

For a PVE IC or Cyro then it should be a reflection of the other pve zones so gear drops and quests. No pvp currency.

Yes it lauched has a pvp zone, was a pvp zone for years, failed and now it's free because players hated it.
believe it or not most people play mmorpgs for the pve not the pvp, pvp is a minority and the zone is garbage for the vast majority of players.
Giving it a pve mode with or without telvar would help it.

Literally every other zone other than BG's, IC and Cyro is PvE. Every. Single. One. There is a new chapter starting soon, which is 100% PvE. We have already been told there will be no additions to PvP until after the code is rewritten, which will be a minimum of one year from now, quite possibly two years or more from now. There will still be new zones, dungeons, trials etc released during this time, 100% of which will be added PvE content. And you are here asking that ZOS take away 1/3 of all PvP content because you get killed occasionally? Can't we please at least keep what little we have?

I mean if the pve players on imperial city are doing quests and you murder them. Its clearly not pvp just bullying. Making a pve ip would bring all pvp players together.
For fair fights... But you dont want fair and neither do most people defending non pve imperial city.

Pvp= player vs player. One against the other. Like ufc. However if the other person doesnt fight back its clearly not pvp. Theres no vs.

Read posts above.

francesinhalover

BlackArgonian wrote: »

It will all be fine when the event is over. There is not reason to rework the map, ZoS will have their hands full reworking battle spirit for PvP players several times through out the year after update 33s new skill scaling.

Maybe we should just have the PvP event on during any other events downtime, it seems like it can revive IC and Cyrodiil.

1 month of feedback on pts and barely any changes.

Get ready for a full years of horrible pvp with inmortal players.

Also easy trials since 140k dps is possible now. Unless the carve nerfs nerfed it a bit.

VaranisArano

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

lexicondevil99 wrote: »

Can't we please at least keep what little we have?

How would a PvE instance detract from the PvP instances? There's no reason to want to fight PvEers.

If it has none of the same rewards as the PVP instances, nothing would be lost.

If this PVE instance offers the same rewards as the PVP zone, then it is nothing more than a shortcut to getting those rewards while avoiding the intended way the zone was meant to be played.

PVP would most certainly lose something to that shortcut. I'm one of the players who only dipped my toes into Cyrodiil because there was no other, easier way to get the fish I wanted for Master Angler. If there'd been a PVE-only safe zone option to get what I wanted, I highly doubt I'd have tried PVP. Even now that I am an experienced PVPer, the last time I ran for Cyrodiil Skyshards on my alt, I'd be hard pressed to say it wouldn't make more sense to do it on a PVE-only safe zone Cyrodiil if such a thing existed. Even experienced PVPers would use the shortcut. That's a loss for the PVP/PVE zones.

So I include ALL rewards, such as achievements, skyshards, event tickets, monster helms, Tel Var, fish, etc. in that.

Give the PVE version its own unique rewards, and I'll be happy to play that zone too. There's no justification for putting the same rewards in that doesn't boil down to people wanting to avoid PVP desiring a shortcut to get what they want while skipping the intended risk.

Amottica

No

Removing the telvar completely would be one of the first requirements and even then it is unlikely. That zone is designed and intended to have some risk involved. That risk should remain and anyone who wants to venture in has to accept that risk. No different than Cyrodiil.

Brrrofski

Elendir2am wrote: »

EdmondDontes wrote: »

How about a PvP que for every zone that is currently PvE?

Your idea is to make a PvP zone into PvE. There are only a few ways to PvP and a thousand ways to PvE in ESO.

Do you understand that you would spread PvPers on such wide area that they would hardly meet?

Well, according to this forum, PvP players just like ganking PVE players. So that's fine.

Apparently we hide in a town for 3 hours just to gank one person, so we can do that in Daggerfall bank too, no problem.

xylena_lazarow

VaranisArano wrote: »

If it has none of the same rewards as the PVP instances, nothing would be lost.

There wouldn't be a faction district control multiplier in a PvE zone, which would greatly reduce telvar gain.

xylena_lazarow

Amottica wrote: »

intended to have some risk involved

You can gain massive amounts of telvars with literally zero risk under the current design.

VaranisArano

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

If it has none of the same rewards as the PVP instances, nothing would be lost.

There wouldn't be a faction district control multiplier in a PvE zone, which would greatly reduce telvar gain.

This does not address my concern in any substantial way, given my broader point that ALL the rewards in this new PVE-only zone need to he unique from the original PvPvE zone.

VaranisArano

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

intended to have some risk involved

You can gain massive amounts of telvars with literally zero risk under the current design.

Zero risk of losing your own Tel Var? Yeah. Gankers do that. Always could do that.

[snip]
[edited for minor baiting]

xylena_lazarow

VaranisArano wrote: »

[snip]

I don't want PvEers to risk anything, because I do not want to fight PvEers. Do you?

[edited to remove quote]

jaws343

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

[snip]

I don't want PvEers to risk anything, because I do not want to fight PvEers. Do you?

There is no such thing as a PVEr in a PVP enabled zone. If you are there, you are selectively a PVPer. If you don't want to encounter PVP then you shouldn't be in the zone.

[edited to remove quote]