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Furnishing leads found only in PVP needs to go.
-
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »
I should not have to explain the difference between a PVP player doing PVE content and a PVE player doing PVP content. So, no its not the other way around.
PVP players doing PVE content is easily achievable. PVErs doing PVP content is not.
[snip]
Either way, in both examples it is a group of people doing content they don't necessarily care for to gain items they want. If they don't do that content, they don't get the antiquity leads.
The difference is that PVE content is a static encounter, basic combat, easy to understand and play against, even with a PVP build.
This is not the case for PVP content. A PVE build gets LITERALLY blown up in 2 seconds in PVP. Its a completely different dynamic.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 7, 2021 11:14AM1 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭They can disagree all they want, does not make their decisions correct.
FORCING PVE players to do PVP content is ridiculous.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. You could just not get the item if you are that adverse to PVP.
But excluding items as rewards for PVP activities just because some players don't want to do PVP is nonsense. PVP has its rewards and PVE has its rewards. Do the content, get the rewards. Don't do the content, you don't deserve to get the rewards.
Its the only basin in game with water in it. Locking furnishing items that are arguably the most heavily used by PVE'rs behind PVP is mindnumbing.
Housing is neither PVE nor PVP activity, so making a claim that PVE players use the items more heavily is a stretch.
Housing is an PVE activity.
No, it is not. Just like using a guild trader is not a PVE activity.
It is an activity in the game, but it is not PVE and it is not PVP. It's just an in game activity you can participate in.
Every aspect in a game any game is player vs environment, EXCEPT pvp.1 -
LadyAstrum✭✭✭✭✭
✭They can disagree all they want, does not make their decisions correct.
FORCING PVE players to do PVP content is ridiculous.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. You could just not get the item if you are that adverse to PVP.
But excluding items as rewards for PVP activities just because some players don't want to do PVP is nonsense. PVP has its rewards and PVE has its rewards. Do the content, get the rewards. Don't do the content, you don't deserve to get the rewards.
Its the only basin in game with water in it. Locking furnishing items that are arguably the most heavily used by PVE'rs behind PVP is mindnumbing.
Housing is neither PVE nor PVP activity, so making a claim that PVE players use the items more heavily is a stretch.
So is crafting a PvE or PvP activity? Is gathering materials a PvE or PvP activity? Every activity can be classified within the realms of PvE or PvP and housing is most certianly not a PvP activity, because it is comes under the category of PvE. Player versus environment doesn't have to mean there is fighting/killing and NPC mobs involved.
I agree with Raideen. It is a pain in the rear to have to partake in PvP to obtain a lead for a piece of furniture. It borders on sadistic to a degree. And it is the ONLY item that closely resembles a sink! I can construct a similar one, but there are no other bowls with water in them. I am a PvE'er who enjoys decorating. Not a PvP'er who wants to slink around the sewers.
Can we at least get a version we can get in a PvE activity if nothing else?~ "You think me brutish? How do you imagine I view you?" - Molag Bal #misunderstood ~4 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »
I should not have to explain the difference between a PVP player doing PVE content and a PVE player doing PVP content. So, no its not the other way around.
PVP players doing PVE content is easily achievable. PVErs doing PVP content is not.
[snip]
Either way, in both examples it is a group of people doing content they don't necessarily care for to gain items they want. If they don't do that content, they don't get the antiquity leads.
The difference is that PVE content is a static encounter, basic combat, easy to understand and play against, even with a PVP build.
This is not the case for PVP content. A PVE build gets LITERALLY blown up in 2 seconds in PVP. Its a completely different dynamic.
So don't run a PVE build in PVP???
I mean, I wouldn't run a build set for a trial encounter in VMA, I'd die before I could clear the first round, because that build would have zero defense, no heals, etc. And I wouldn't run my VMA build in a trial, because I would lose a ton of DPS, and would be using a bunch of defense and healing that would be unnecessary.
So in the same vein, I wouldn't run a PVE in build in PVP. It's the same concept. Build for the content you are doing. Not that difficult.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 7, 2021 11:15AM2 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭LadyAstrum wrote: »They can disagree all they want, does not make their decisions correct.
FORCING PVE players to do PVP content is ridiculous.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. You could just not get the item if you are that adverse to PVP.
But excluding items as rewards for PVP activities just because some players don't want to do PVP is nonsense. PVP has its rewards and PVE has its rewards. Do the content, get the rewards. Don't do the content, you don't deserve to get the rewards.
Its the only basin in game with water in it. Locking furnishing items that are arguably the most heavily used by PVE'rs behind PVP is mindnumbing.
Housing is neither PVE nor PVP activity, so making a claim that PVE players use the items more heavily is a stretch.
So is crafting a PvE or PvP activity? Is gathering materials a PvE or PvP activity? Every activity can be classified within the realms of PvE or PvP and housing is most certianly not a PvP activity, because it is comes under the category of PvE. Player versus environment doesn't have to mean there is fighting/killing and NPC mobs involved.
I agree with Raideen. It is a pain in the rear to have to partake in PvP to obtain a lead for a piece of furniture. It borders on sadistic to a degree. And it is the ONLY item that closely resembles a sink! I can construct a similar one, but there are no other bowls with water in them. I am a PvE'er who enjoys decorating. Not a PvP'er who wants to slink around the sewers.
Can we at least get a version we can get in a PvE activity if nothing else?
Crafting - Neither PVP nor PVE
Gathering Mats - In overworld zones - PVE
Gathering Mats - In Cyrodil - PVP
But the act of crafting items is neither.0 -
LadyAstrum✭✭✭✭✭
✭LadyAstrum wrote: »They can disagree all they want, does not make their decisions correct.
FORCING PVE players to do PVP content is ridiculous.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. You could just not get the item if you are that adverse to PVP.
But excluding items as rewards for PVP activities just because some players don't want to do PVP is nonsense. PVP has its rewards and PVE has its rewards. Do the content, get the rewards. Don't do the content, you don't deserve to get the rewards.
Its the only basin in game with water in it. Locking furnishing items that are arguably the most heavily used by PVE'rs behind PVP is mindnumbing.
Housing is neither PVE nor PVP activity, so making a claim that PVE players use the items more heavily is a stretch.
So is crafting a PvE or PvP activity? Is gathering materials a PvE or PvP activity? Every activity can be classified within the realms of PvE or PvP and housing is most certianly not a PvP activity, because it is comes under the category of PvE. Player versus environment doesn't have to mean there is fighting/killing and NPC mobs involved.
I agree with Raideen. It is a pain in the rear to have to partake in PvP to obtain a lead for a piece of furniture. It borders on sadistic to a degree. And it is the ONLY item that closely resembles a sink! I can construct a similar one, but there are no other bowls with water in them. I am a PvE'er who enjoys decorating. Not a PvP'er who wants to slink around the sewers.
Can we at least get a version we can get in a PvE activity if nothing else?
Crafting - Neither PVP nor PVE
Gathering Mats - In overworld zones - PVE
Gathering Mats - In Cyrodil - PVP
But the act of crafting items is neither.
We will have to agree to disagree. Crafting and gathering are traditionally PvE activities. In Cyrodiil PvP is obviously the main activity, but the act of gathering something is interacting with the environment, not with a player.~ "You think me brutish? How do you imagine I view you?" - Molag Bal #misunderstood ~2 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »
I should not have to explain the difference between a PVP player doing PVE content and a PVE player doing PVP content. So, no its not the other way around.
PVP players doing PVE content is easily achievable. PVErs doing PVP content is not.
[snip]
Either way, in both examples it is a group of people doing content they don't necessarily care for to gain items they want. If they don't do that content, they don't get the antiquity leads.
The difference is that PVE content is a static encounter, basic combat, easy to understand and play against, even with a PVP build.
This is not the case for PVP content. A PVE build gets LITERALLY blown up in 2 seconds in PVP. Its a completely different dynamic.
So don't run a PVE build in PVP???
I mean, I wouldn't run a build set for a trial encounter in VMA, I'd die before I could clear the first round, because that build would have zero defense, no heals, etc. And I wouldn't run my VMA build in a trial, because I would lose a ton of DPS, and would be using a bunch of defense and healing that would be unnecessary.
So in the same vein, I wouldn't run a PVE in build in PVP. It's the same concept. Build for the content you are doing. Not that difficult.
The differnce is that building for PVE is easy compared to building for PVP. With 28k resist and 35 k health I was getting blown up, 10 minutes ago in seconds. TWO of us could not kill one player...it is literally impossible to farm the leads when you are constantly killled by an enemy you cant kill.
[edited to remove quote]
Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 7, 2021 11:17AM2 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭LadyAstrum wrote: »They can disagree all they want, does not make their decisions correct.
FORCING PVE players to do PVP content is ridiculous.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. You could just not get the item if you are that adverse to PVP.
But excluding items as rewards for PVP activities just because some players don't want to do PVP is nonsense. PVP has its rewards and PVE has its rewards. Do the content, get the rewards. Don't do the content, you don't deserve to get the rewards.
Its the only basin in game with water in it. Locking furnishing items that are arguably the most heavily used by PVE'rs behind PVP is mindnumbing.
Housing is neither PVE nor PVP activity, so making a claim that PVE players use the items more heavily is a stretch.
So is crafting a PvE or PvP activity? Is gathering materials a PvE or PvP activity? Every activity can be classified within the realms of PvE or PvP and housing is most certianly not a PvP activity, because it is comes under the category of PvE. Player versus environment doesn't have to mean there is fighting/killing and NPC mobs involved.
I agree with Raideen. It is a pain in the rear to have to partake in PvP to obtain a lead for a piece of furniture. It borders on sadistic to a degree. And it is the ONLY item that closely resembles a sink! I can construct a similar one, but there are no other bowls with water in them. I am a PvE'er who enjoys decorating. Not a PvP'er who wants to slink around the sewers.
Can we at least get a version we can get in a PvE activity if nothing else?
Crafting - Neither PVP nor PVE
Gathering Mats - In overworld zones - PVE
Gathering Mats - In Cyrodil - PVP
But the act of crafting items is neither.
PVE does not fall solely under the umbrella of "combat". Crafting takes place in the environment, Player vs environment. PVP takes place against other players. Player vs Player.1 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭LadyAstrum wrote: »LadyAstrum wrote: »They can disagree all they want, does not make their decisions correct.
FORCING PVE players to do PVP content is ridiculous.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. You could just not get the item if you are that adverse to PVP.
But excluding items as rewards for PVP activities just because some players don't want to do PVP is nonsense. PVP has its rewards and PVE has its rewards. Do the content, get the rewards. Don't do the content, you don't deserve to get the rewards.
Its the only basin in game with water in it. Locking furnishing items that are arguably the most heavily used by PVE'rs behind PVP is mindnumbing.
Housing is neither PVE nor PVP activity, so making a claim that PVE players use the items more heavily is a stretch.
So is crafting a PvE or PvP activity? Is gathering materials a PvE or PvP activity? Every activity can be classified within the realms of PvE or PvP and housing is most certianly not a PvP activity, because it is comes under the category of PvE. Player versus environment doesn't have to mean there is fighting/killing and NPC mobs involved.
I agree with Raideen. It is a pain in the rear to have to partake in PvP to obtain a lead for a piece of furniture. It borders on sadistic to a degree. And it is the ONLY item that closely resembles a sink! I can construct a similar one, but there are no other bowls with water in them. I am a PvE'er who enjoys decorating. Not a PvP'er who wants to slink around the sewers.
Can we at least get a version we can get in a PvE activity if nothing else?
Crafting - Neither PVP nor PVE
Gathering Mats - In overworld zones - PVE
Gathering Mats - In Cyrodil - PVP
But the act of crafting items is neither.
We will have to agree to disagree. Crafting and gathering are traditionally PvE activities. In Cyrodiil PvP is obviously the main activity, but the act of gathering something is interacting with the environment, not with a player.
But the risk is PVP if you are gathering in Cyrodil. Just like the risk of farming leads from PVE mobs in Imperial City is PVP. So contextually, they are PVP activities because you risk PVP while doing those activities.Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »
I should not have to explain the difference between a PVP player doing PVE content and a PVE player doing PVP content. So, no its not the other way around.
PVP players doing PVE content is easily achievable. PVErs doing PVP content is not.
[snip]
Either way, in both examples it is a group of people doing content they don't necessarily care for to gain items they want. If they don't do that content, they don't get the antiquity leads.
The difference is that PVE content is a static encounter, basic combat, easy to understand and play against, even with a PVP build.
This is not the case for PVP content. A PVE build gets LITERALLY blown up in 2 seconds in PVP. Its a completely different dynamic.
So don't run a PVE build in PVP???
I mean, I wouldn't run a build set for a trial encounter in VMA, I'd die before I could clear the first round, because that build would have zero defense, no heals, etc. And I wouldn't run my VMA build in a trial, because I would lose a ton of DPS, and would be using a bunch of defense and healing that would be unnecessary.
So in the same vein, I wouldn't run a PVE in build in PVP. It's the same concept. Build for the content you are doing. Not that difficult.
The differnce is that building for PVE is easy compared to building for PVP. With 28k resist and 35 k health I was getting blown up, 10 minutes ago in seconds. TWO of us could not kill one player...it is literally impossible to farm the leads when you are constantly killled by an enemy you cant kill.
I tried to Duo one of the world bosses in Deadlands that dropped an antiquity lead. The two of us couldn't do it. It was impossible to farm the lead when the enemy kept stunning and killing us.
Point is, it is supposed to be a challenge. If it were easy to get what would even be the point. I see you have logged into the game, here are all the leads you can't be bothered to farm because you don't like the content.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 7, 2021 11:18AM0 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Imagine how ridiculous it would be if I said "I don't like Kyne's Aegis trial, so please remove the lead from there and put it into crafting writ rewards so I don't have to run that content to get the lead." Completely defeats the intent of putting the lead in that content to begin with.5 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »
I should not have to explain the difference between a PVP player doing PVE content and a PVE player doing PVP content. So, no its not the other way around.
PVP players doing PVE content is easily achievable. PVErs doing PVP content is not.
[snip]
Either way, in both examples it is a group of people doing content they don't necessarily care for to gain items they want. If they don't do that content, they don't get the antiquity leads.
The difference is that PVE content is a static encounter, basic combat, easy to understand and play against, even with a PVP build.
This is not the case for PVP content. A PVE build gets LITERALLY blown up in 2 seconds in PVP. Its a completely different dynamic.
So don't run a PVE build in PVP???
I mean, I wouldn't run a build set for a trial encounter in VMA, I'd die before I could clear the first round, because that build would have zero defense, no heals, etc. And I wouldn't run my VMA build in a trial, because I would lose a ton of DPS, and would be using a bunch of defense and healing that would be unnecessary.
So in the same vein, I wouldn't run a PVE in build in PVP. It's the same concept. Build for the content you are doing. Not that difficult.
The differnce is that building for PVE is easy compared to building for PVP. With 28k resist and 35 k health I was getting blown up, 10 minutes ago in seconds. TWO of us could not kill one player...it is literally impossible to farm the leads when you are constantly killled by an enemy you cant kill.
The difference is that you are fighting players who are used to killing other players who have 35k health and 28k resists. Like, that sounds like an okay PVP build as long as you have some impen. The problem is that logically PVPers fight other PVPers. We know how to kill tanky players. There isn't a build that you can slap on and call it good when you are fighting other intelligent players. A tanky build like yours makes it easier to recover from your mistakes while you learn to play better in a PVP environment. It doesn't guarantee safety. Far from it - PVPers in that type of build die all the time. And, no offense, but if you only play PVP casually for rewards, you're making a lot of "mistakes" in combat. I know I did when I started, and I was using a tanky build not much different from yours.
No, PVP isn't forgiving to players who waltz in casually only when they want whatever shiny reward ZOS stuck in there this time. The Devs know that! Its not like they are ignorant that players pour out buckets of salt every time there's an IC event. They don't forget that. They intend for players to go to IC when they want these leads. They expect that you'll have a rough learning curve if you only PVP casually for rewards.
So where does that leave us?
Well, you can beg the Devs, and wait, hoping they change things despite them showing no signs of doing so.
Or you can persevere and practice your PVP skills so that the next time ZOS sticks a shiny reward you want in PVP content, you're better prepared. Fair warning - on PTS, ZOS is requiring Imperial City for Whitestrakes Mayhem event once more.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 7, 2021 11:19AM3 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭VaranisArano wrote: »Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »
I should not have to explain the difference between a PVP player doing PVE content and a PVE player doing PVP content. So, no its not the other way around.
PVP players doing PVE content is easily achievable. PVErs doing PVP content is not.
[snip]
Either way, in both examples it is a group of people doing content they don't necessarily care for to gain items they want. If they don't do that content, they don't get the antiquity leads.
The difference is that PVE content is a static encounter, basic combat, easy to understand and play against, even with a PVP build.
This is not the case for PVP content. A PVE build gets LITERALLY blown up in 2 seconds in PVP. Its a completely different dynamic.
So don't run a PVE build in PVP???
I mean, I wouldn't run a build set for a trial encounter in VMA, I'd die before I could clear the first round, because that build would have zero defense, no heals, etc. And I wouldn't run my VMA build in a trial, because I would lose a ton of DPS, and would be using a bunch of defense and healing that would be unnecessary.
So in the same vein, I wouldn't run a PVE in build in PVP. It's the same concept. Build for the content you are doing. Not that difficult.
The differnce is that building for PVE is easy compared to building for PVP. With 28k resist and 35 k health I was getting blown up, 10 minutes ago in seconds. TWO of us could not kill one player...it is literally impossible to farm the leads when you are constantly killled by an enemy you cant kill.
The difference is that you are fighting players who are used to killing other players who have 35k health and 28k resists. Like, that sounds like an okay PVP build as long as you have some impen. The problem is that logically PVPers fight other PVPers. We know how to kill tanky players. There isn't a build that you can slap on and call it good when you are fighting other intelligent players. A tanky build like yours makes it easier to recover from your mistakes while you learn to play better in a PVP environment. It doesn't guarantee safety. Far from it - PVPers in that type of build die all the time. And, no offense, but if you only play PVP casually for rewards, you're making a lot of "mistakes" in combat. I know I did when I started, and I was using a tanky build not much different from yours.
No, PVP isn't forgiving to players who waltz in casually only when they want whatever shiny reward ZOS stuck in there this time. The Devs know that! Its not like they are ignorant that players pour out buckets of salt every time there's an IC event. They don't forget that. They intend for players to go to IC when they want these leads. They expect that you'll have a rough learning curve if you only PVP casually for rewards.
So where does that leave us?
Well, you can beg the Devs, and wait, hoping they change things despite them showing no signs of doing so.
Or you can persevere and practice your PVP skills so that the next time ZOS sticks a shiny reward you want in PVP content, you're better prepared. Fair warning - on PTS, ZOS is requiring Imperial City for Whitestrakes Mayhem event once more.
So, I am forced to PVE for content I use in PVE (housing). It's dumb, not fun.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 7, 2021 11:20AM1 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Just don't use the furnishings with leads in PvP areas. It's very simple.
Except this furnishing type, which is a basin/sink, does not exist anywhere else in game. Why a housing item that caters to the housing community is locked behind PVP content is literally mind numbing. Other games figured this out over a decade ago.2 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Just don't use the furnishings with leads in PvP areas. It's very simple.
Except this furnishing type, which is a basin/sink, does not exist anywhere else in game. Why a housing item that caters to the housing community is locked behind PVP content is literally mind numbing. Other games figured this out over a decade ago.
Because it is a PVP reward. [snip] but did you know PVP players actually participate not only in PVE content but also in PVE/PVP neutral content like housing. [snip] It almost like the game is providing a reward to players who participate in PVP and housing...
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 7, 2021 11:27AM2 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Just don't use the furnishings with leads in PvP areas. It's very simple.
Except this furnishing type, which is a basin/sink, does not exist anywhere else in game. Why a housing item that caters to the housing community is locked behind PVP content is literally mind numbing. Other games figured this out over a decade ago.
Because it is a PVP reward. [snip] but did you know PVP players actually participate not only in PVE content but also in PVE/PVP neutral content like housing. [snip] It almost like the game is providing a reward to players who participate in PVP and housing...
I'd like to see the numbers on that. Because I bet hands down the vast majority of the housing community has little to no interest in PVP (even PVPers in ESO these days have no interest in PVP).
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 7, 2021 11:28AM2 -
aetherial_heavenn✭✭✭✭✭Just don't use the furnishings with leads in PvP areas. It's very simple.
Except this furnishing type, which is a basin/sink, does not exist anywhere else in game. Why a housing item that caters to the housing community is locked behind PVP content is literally mind numbing. Other games figured this out over a decade ago.
Because it is a PVP reward. [snip] but did you know PVP players actually participate not only in PVE content but also in PVE/PVP neutral content like housing. [snip] It almost like the game is providing a reward to players who participate in PVP and housing...
I'd like to see the numbers on that. Because I bet hands down the vast majority of the housing community has little to no interest in PVP (even PVPers in ESO these days have no interest in PVP).
Go visit PvPers houses. Some of the best in the game are made by players who mostly PvP. Seems like you have a very narrow view of who does what in this game. Since 'housing is end game' the serious housing aficionados play all aspects of the game. Most housing streamers I watch have furnishings from trials, dungeons, farming mats, doing master writs, PvPing and farming antiquities. Therefore I dispute your claim based on watching hours o9f housing streams. (And based on my own houses. And on my guidies houses.)
Why don't we see people who don't like leads dropping in PvP complaining 'on behalf of the housing community' as vehemently about leads or actual housing items or even style motifs only being in trials or dropping at a higher rate in vet DLC dungeons, when the majority of players don't do trials or hard vet content? Seems like the agenda here is a 'them v us' mentality regarding PvP rather than a genuine complaint about accessibility.
By the way there a literally dozens of sink cobbles in the housing threads. One of the most loved aspects of housing by the housing community is creating our own unique furniture. If you were serious about 'needing' a sink but not serious enough to make a group to farm the lead drop in IC, I would have thought you'd take joy in creating one instead.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 7, 2021 11:29AMQuoted for truth
"In my experience, the elite ones have not been very toxic, and the toxic ones not very elite." WrathOfInnos5 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭aetherial_heavenn wrote: »Go visit PvPers houses. Some of the best in the game are made by players who mostly PvP. Seems like you have a very narrow view of who does what in this game. Since 'housing is end game' the serious housing aficionados play all aspects of the game. Most housing streamers I watch have furnishings from trials, dungeons, farming mats, doing master writs, PvPing and farming antiquities. Therefore I dispute your claim based on watching hours o9f housing streams. (And based on my own houses. And on my guidies houses.)
Thank you for taking the time out of your day to visit my post. I am amazed, actually extremely astonished how many folks came out today to have a debate in this subforum that has not seen many visitors lately. And yourself, who rarely posts on the forums. I really appreciate you coming here to take part in this discussion.
I have seen many of these houses and frankly, I have not seen any that are that impressive. Most of them have garish colors, terrible placement of items, with a bad flow of traffic. Of course this is my opinion and is subjective, as is anyone who has an opinion.
Like these?aetherial_heavenn wrote: »Why don't we see people who don't like leads dropping in PvP complaining 'on behalf of the housing community' as vehemently about leads or actual housing items or even style motifs only being in trials or dropping at a higher rate in vet DLC dungeons, when the majority of players don't do trials or hard vet content?
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6854480#Comment_6854480
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6916591#Comment_6916591
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6808401#Comment_6808401
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6804943#Comment_6804943
What? LOL, no, not at all. I have no issues with PVP players, I am one of them...just not in ESO. My issue is legitimately about accessibility. But when I get dogpiled in a thread, I have an innate right to defend my position.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »Seems like the agenda here is a 'them v us' mentality regarding PvP rather than a genuine complaint about accessibility.
I do a fair amount of cobbling myself. Been creating my own furniture in games years before Homestead launched. The difference between creating in those games and eso was there was no limitation in those games. Due to heavy furnishing slot restrictions implemented in ESO I try to find 1 item solutions and not always resort to cobbling as it not only creates render issues for some players, like the light bug currently plaguing many, but it eats up the precious slots we have FAST, even with ESO+.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »By the way there a literally dozens of sink cobbles in the housing threads. One of the most loved aspects of housing by the housing community is creating our own unique furniture.
Due to the house I am working on now being at furnishing cap, but still needing to decorate a Christmas tree, the item I posted in my OP is 'needed' as it will open up 2 slots for me. I can get rid of the cobble I had and fit it with a 1 piece solution.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »By the way there a literally dozens of sink cobbles in the housing threads. One of the most loved aspects of housing by the housing community is creating our own unique furniture.
I did make a group for farming IC and we wiped every time and no lead...because we do not enjoy PVP in ESO. It's the worst PVP I have ever encountered in an MMORPG and all I have ever done in MMORPG's since 2004 is PVP. High Warlord in WOW. Gladiator in WOW. Preordered Warhammer Online, PVP'd on my Black Orc. Same in SWTOR. Huttball, Voidstar, Illum. But in ESO...its just stale to me and I have tried to like it, but its just bad. Leveling in PVP was OK, but at 50...ya, its just simply not fun. The combat all looks the same, same animations, same cheese sets if you intend to win. I literally can not find one redeeming value in ESO's pvp.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »If you were serious about 'needing' a sink but not serious enough to make a group to farm the lead drop in IC, I would have thought you'd take joy in creating one instead.
As far as creating a sink, I did have one cobbled, it was quite nice but it cost extra slots that I can use elsewhere and the sink in the OP buys me slots.2 -
katanagirl1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I don’t want to get into the PvE vs PvP discussion, I do both.
I would recommend to any other PvE only folks who want this lead to wait until an IC or Midyear Mayhem event and farm the nearest sewer boss near your faction’s base to get the lead.
I don’t do a lot of IC but I think I have about a dozen of these furnishings now.
The one that really sucks is the Alessia statue. I only have one of those.
ADDITION:
I would love to get that vet trial lead for the boat too.
There is a guy in the Housing section on PS NA trying to get a group of housing people together to do it, if you’re interested.
I don’t do trials but I’d willing to give it a go and die 100 times just to get through and get it.
Edited by katanagirl1 on December 7, 2021 5:16AMKhajiit Stamblade main
Dark Elf Magsorc
Redguard Stamina Dragonknight
Orc Stamplar PVP
Breton Magsorc PVP
Dark Elf Magden
Khajiit Stamblade
Khajiit Stamina Arcanist
PS5 NA1 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I don't see a problem with a piece of furniture that is easy to workaround being placed into PvP. I don't like PvP much, but it's still fine. It's not like it's something needed to do any PVE content.Edited by spartaxoxo on December 7, 2021 6:54AM0 -
aetherial_heavenn✭✭✭✭✭aetherial_heavenn wrote: »Go visit PvPers houses. Some of the best in the game are made by players who mostly PvP. Seems like you have a very narrow view of who does what in this game. Since 'housing is end game' the serious housing aficionados play all aspects of the game. Most housing streamers I watch have furnishings from trials, dungeons, farming mats, doing master writs, PvPing and farming antiquities. Therefore I dispute your claim based on watching hours o9f housing streams. (And based on my own houses. And on my guidies houses.)
Thank you for taking the time out of your day to visit my post. I am amazed, actually extremely astonished how many folks came out today to have a debate in this subforum that has not seen many visitors lately. And yourself, who rarely posts on the forums. I really appreciate you coming here to take part in this discussion.
I have seen many of these houses and frankly, I have not seen any that are that impressive. Most of them have garish colors, terrible placement of items, with a bad flow of traffic. Of course this is my opinion and is subjective, as is anyone who has an opinion.
Like these?aetherial_heavenn wrote: »Why don't we see people who don't like leads dropping in PvP complaining 'on behalf of the housing community' as vehemently about leads or actual housing items or even style motifs only being in trials or dropping at a higher rate in vet DLC dungeons, when the majority of players don't do trials or hard vet content?
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6854480#Comment_6854480
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6916591#Comment_6916591
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6808401#Comment_6808401
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6804943#Comment_6804943
What? LOL, no, not at all. I have no issues with PVP players, I am one of them...just not in ESO. My issue is legitimately about accessibility. But when I get dogpiled in a thread, I have an innate right to defend my position.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »Seems like the agenda here is a 'them v us' mentality regarding PvP rather than a genuine complaint about accessibility.
I do a fair amount of cobbling myself. Been creating my own furniture in games years before Homestead launched. The difference between creating in those games and eso was there was no limitation in those games. Due to heavy furnishing slot restrictions implemented in ESO I try to find 1 item solutions and not always resort to cobbling as it not only creates render issues for some players, like the light bug currently plaguing many, but it eats up the precious slots we have FAST, even with ESO+.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »By the way there a literally dozens of sink cobbles in the housing threads. One of the most loved aspects of housing by the housing community is creating our own unique furniture.
Due to the house I am working on now being at furnishing cap, but still needing to decorate a Christmas tree, the item I posted in my OP is 'needed' as it will open up 2 slots for me. I can get rid of the cobble I had and fit it with a 1 piece solution.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »By the way there a literally dozens of sink cobbles in the housing threads. One of the most loved aspects of housing by the housing community is creating our own unique furniture.
I did make a group for farming IC and we wiped every time and no lead...because we do not enjoy PVP in ESO. It's the worst PVP I have ever encountered in an MMORPG and all I have ever done in MMORPG's since 2004 is PVP. High Warlord in WOW. Gladiator in WOW. Preordered Warhammer Online, PVP'd on my Black Orc. Same in SWTOR. Huttball, Voidstar, Illum. But in ESO...its just stale to me and I have tried to like it, but its just bad. Leveling in PVP was OK, but at 50...ya, its just simply not fun. The combat all looks the same, same animations, same cheese sets if you intend to win. I literally can not find one redeeming value in ESO's pvp.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »If you were serious about 'needing' a sink but not serious enough to make a group to farm the lead drop in IC, I would have thought you'd take joy in creating one instead.
As far as creating a sink, I did have one cobbled, it was quite nice but it cost extra slots that I can use elsewhere and the sink in the OP buys me slots.
Thanks for your detailed reply. (Used spoiler tags to shorten the post.) We do see a lot more of 'the PvPers don't do housing or wear fancy costumes so don't put any non combat rewards in PvP' threads than others, so I guess I am a little sensitive on the subject of generalisations about people who play the whole game, including PvP.
While I agree taste does very I'd hate to think my main home is garish (although the throne room/scroll room is very bright andd the garden is glowy!) or that some dear friends who PvP and are amazing real life artists all suffer from the problems you describe
I do understand the frustration of rare drops of ubiquitously useful items that only require one slot being locked behind certain content. I would like some everyday items being more available or even just the flexibility to reallocate special collections /collectibles slots as 'traditional furnishings' instead, if ZoS can't increase the total slot numbers.
I personally loathe grinding dailies and I really want the abyssal pearl for an aquatic scene...so periodically I return and do those tedious, repetitious, daily quests despite having much more fun things to do like PvP and trials. One day I'll finish them because I also believe the principle of getting players to at least try the whole game is a sound one. Even if repeating the same content is actually not a motivator for me. Housing is one driver for some to try new types of game play and unique rewards can be great motivators.....YMMV on how motivating other requirements are!
I think we can both agree some single slot bathroom and kitchen items would be grand. Good luck. I hope it drops for you soon.
Edited by aetherial_heavenn on December 9, 2021 7:58AMQuoted for truth
"In my experience, the elite ones have not been very toxic, and the toxic ones not very elite." WrathOfInnos0 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
I generalized because in general people who spend most of their time in PVP do not spend most of their time on outfits, or housing and this is industry wide. Evidence can be seen in the characters names themselves. Many, if not most players who engage mostly in PVP often wear the most ridiculous outfits, often play female toons to reduce their size, and overall care most about the engagement in PVP, not the lore behind their character, their house/decorating/appearance etc. Its not to say that there are not hard core PVPers who do not also enjoy outfits or housing, but those are far and few between and this is easily observable in every MMORPG that offers reasonable character customization and or housing.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »Thanks for your detailed reply. (Used spoiler tags to shorten the post.) We do see a lot more of 'the PvPers don't do housing or wear fancy costumes so don't put any non combat rewards in PvP' threads than others, so I guess I am a little sensitive on the subject of generalisations about people who play the whole game, including PvP.
I have always been a pretty hard core pvper (when the PVP is good) and as a designer/artist I also enjoy decorating and housing, but in my adventures spanning multiple MMORPG's coming up on two decades, folks like you and me are a rare breed and definitely do not define the average player type we are talking about. This is why I find this specific item, that looks like a sink, in fact the only one in game for players to use, to be gated behind PVP. If the item in discussion was a ballista, an "Elder Scroll", Trebuchet, Siege Engine, Catapult, Battering Ram etc I would not have made the post. The item fits the zone.
I appreciate the explanation given by Aranas talking about why this comes from imperial city, but that does not change the fact that the core of the player base that this specific item appeals to, are not PVPers nor care to engage in it.
I have not seen their homes, or pictures of their homes (not that pictures in ESO EVER do the property justice, its usually the opposite), but if they are spamming different colored lights everywhere, with little balance of positive and negative space, or not using lighting for the amazing effect that lighting can do for an environment in creating mood, well then if the shoe fits...you know the adage. I too have a current home that has lights blasting in 3 rooms, but its not that I actually want them to, its a necessity because the space between floors does not block light (as they should) so as with anything its a case by case basis. I am sure your throne room looks nice. But, in general light spam rarely looks good (and is a massive performance killer which is why New World limits the amount of lights able to be used in their homes).aetherial_heavenn wrote: »While I agree taste does very I'd hate to think my main home is garish (although the throne room/scroll room is very bright andd the garden is glowy!) or that some dear friends who PvP and are amazing real life artists all suffer from the problems you describe
I just think that being asked to do specific content for furnishing item leads is out of the scope of what it means to do housing in ESO. For all the "play your way" ZOS espouses, I find it hard to play my way when I have to do specific content for a furnishing lead. At the minimum allow for PVP leads to be found in PVE zones as well, due to the massive difference in playstyle between the two (its infinitely easier for a PVP player to adapt to PVE content in most cases, than the reverse).aetherial_heavenn wrote: »I do understand the frustration of rare drops of ubiquitously useful items that only require one slot being locked behind certain content. I would like some everyday items being more available or even just the flexibility to reallocate special collections /collectibles slots as 'traditional furnishings' instead, if ZoS can't increase the total slot numbers.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »I personally loathe grinding dailies and I really want the abyssal pearl for an aquatic scene...so periodically I return and do those tedious, repetitious, daily quests despite having much more fun things to do like PvP and trials. One day I'll finish them because I also believe the principle of getting players to at least try the whole game is a sound one. Even if repeating the same content is actually not a motivator for me. Housing is one driver for some to try new types of game play and unique rewards can be great motivators.....YMMV on how motivating other requirements are!
I agree that players should try a variety of content within the game, but I draw the line between PVE and PVP. Sending a PVE skilled and geared player into a PVP environment leads to one thing, pure hate and frustration for PVP that can manifest into pure hate and frustration for the game as a hole and even the publisher as a whole....this is NOT how the game should go about enticing players to try different content. ESPECIALLY in ESO where building for PVP and PVE is so fundamentally different that there would ever be little chance for the PVE player to succeed in their endeavor.aetherial_heavenn wrote: »I think we can both agree some single slot bathroom and kitchen items would be grand. Good luck. I hope it drops for you soon.
Sincerely not trying to be rude or "bait", but if you actually read through all my posts you would have seen I obtained the lead within an hour or two of my OP. However, thank you for the wishes
The sucky part is my GF saw it and wanted one and we wasted 3 hours farming it with no luck due to drop rate and ganking. She is not pleased either and I see her interest in ESO weening once again which sucks when you consider the thousands of dollars we have each poured into this game.Edited by Raideen on December 9, 2021 3:11PM0 -
TelvanniWizard✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Like the Elder Scroll replica furnishing, locked behind one of the longest amd most tedious grinds in the game
2 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TelvanniWizard wrote: »Like the Elder Scroll replica furnishing, locked behind one of the longest amd most tedious grinds in the game
Unless you are suggesting that Grand Overlords shouldn't have any housing reward for that achievement, something was always going to be locked behind that grind.
YMMV, but the two Grand Overlords I knew had that Elder Scroll proudly displayed in their house.0 -
katanagirl1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭VaranisArano wrote: »TelvanniWizard wrote: »Like the Elder Scroll replica furnishing, locked behind one of the longest amd most tedious grinds in the game
Unless you are suggesting that Grand Overlords shouldn't have any housing reward for that achievement, something was always going to be locked behind that grind.
YMMV, but the two Grand Overlords I knew had that Elder Scroll proudly displayed in their house.
That’s because the Elder Scrolls exist in Cyrodiil. They can be taken by enemy factions and then retaken and returned to the scroll temple. It’s a big part of winning the campaign if you keep yours and take some of the other faction’s scrolls.
I just got my Grand Overlord rank and first thing I did was put one in my house.
There is a lot of (virtual) blood, sweat, and tears behind that achievement for this old gal.
Khajiit Stamblade main
Dark Elf Magsorc
Redguard Stamina Dragonknight
Orc Stamplar PVP
Breton Magsorc PVP
Dark Elf Magden
Khajiit Stamblade
Khajiit Stamina Arcanist
PS5 NA3 -
Amottica✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Just a wild guess based on a couple of things I have observed in the game, Zenimax likes to use different things to entice us into experiencing Cyrodil and PvP in general. Skill points, titles, some skills, even event tickets. I almost forgot that I was informed that PvP is the most efficient way to earn crystals for recreating gear. I am really not sure if that or doing some quick random dungeons is better, but since I have only three characters so far I do both.
I was just informed that getting the Tamriel Hero title and fishing title one has to spend time in Cyrodiil. I also had to do some PvP on my tank to obtain an ultimate that is only available from a PvP skill line.Edited by Amottica on December 11, 2021 5:51AM1 -
katanagirl1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Thanks for reminding me, I forgot that all my stamina toons have to go to Cyrodiil to get Vigor from one of the alliance skill lines.
Also, if you want all the skyshards for the achievement you have to go to Cyrodiil.
It was because of wanting the Explorer title and the Tamriel Hero title that I got into PvP later so their tactic does work.
Khajiit Stamblade main
Dark Elf Magsorc
Redguard Stamina Dragonknight
Orc Stamplar PVP
Breton Magsorc PVP
Dark Elf Magden
Khajiit Stamblade
Khajiit Stamina Arcanist
PS5 NA2