need advice for "non-meta" sets... usable on "certain" builds or decon candidate?

LiteEmUp

I know that sets like kinra's, bahsei's, tzog's, reloq's, medusa's are the ones everyone should go with if you want your life easier in the game... but i like to play around with non-meta's too to have a different experience than the rest of people playing this game... googling the eso forums or the internetz is not entirely useful, as previous patches has changed the game so much to make some old sets usable again under certain conditions...

so what is everyone's opinions on these sets?? worth keeping or straight into decon mode??

• gryphon ferocity = gives minor force like tzogvin(maybe an alt for tzog), but not backbar-able like tzogvin.. seems easier to maintain than tzogvin.. and its medium armor as well, so highly usable for stam builds.. and best part is its easier to obtain than tzogvin..
• dreugh king slayer = seems to be an alternative to kinra, due to giving 20% weap/spell damage at all times and similar bonus from 2-4 piece.. easier to maintain than kinra, but does not transfer when bar swapping.. and easier to obtain, due to droppable in fungal grotto...
• rattlecage = very similar to dreugh king as well... so another alt to kinra?
• deadland assassin = i personally compared this to NMA, due to the nearly same amount of weapon/spell damage bonus it provides.. nma has other good stats bonuses as well, in exchange for skill cost increase.. da does not provide crit chance or offensive pen, but it has a bleed dot proc and no skill cost increase... also seems easier to obtain due to being an overland set...
• pillar of nirn = seems easier to proc and maintain for a dot proc.. not sure if its really good, but i've seen some guides for deadlands dlc now recommend this for stamina builds, even for pve...
• shadow of red mountain = easier to obtain due to being an overland set.. seems to be a pvp set.. not sure if good or not, but i recall seeing a youtube video where this is recommended as possible good pvp set for deadlands dlc..
• strength of the automaton/sword dancer/sword singer = same stats for 2-4 piece bonus.. very specific sets for 2hander/dualwield... are the "high" weapon/spell damage bonus only usable for the weapon skill lines worth it????

Kwoung

LiteEmUp wrote: »

I know that sets like kinra's, bahsei's, tzog's, reloq's, medusa's are the ones everyone should go with if you want your life easier in the game...

That is absolutely not true, unless your game is only about running trials and you are so good at the mechanics, DPS is the only thing you need to care about. For almost all other content in the game and how you approach it, group, solo, duo... there are better sets/builds available, most of which do not use any of those sets, except maybe Medusa, as crit is still king and causes a lot of sets to proc.

Also, as is pointed out below... deconning is a form of keeping it, you can recreate anything you decon at any time, as long as you have the transmutes to do so.

freespirit

If you have ESO+ then maybe keeping is an option.....

However remember the "stickerbook" all items you decon or sometimes just collect go into that book, so you can always just remake an item

I decon pretty much everything but jewelry, cos that's expensive to remake!

Kwoung

As for your question... you can't look at a set in ESO and judge it on it's own for the most part. You can only judge a set on how well it performs in a complete build, under which any of them could be amazing, mediocre, or suck, depending on what you are trying to achieve.

I would suggest going and checking out Xynode, Hack and a few others who specialized in "off meta" builds geared more towards a normal player who is partaking in all the game content in one way shape or form. If nothing else, some of their videos that explain the choices they made to create the builds they came up with and how everything in the build complements all the other parts, may offer you some inspiration if you want to get creative. .

As an example, I am using Hexo's, Selenes & Medusa on my StamBlade currently. I can solo pretty much anything, and still have 65% crit chance (Hexo's procs off crits, so would suck on a non-crit build) and can dish out more than my fair share of the damage in group content without the healer having to chase me around to keep me alive. I also have numerous other builds, none of which use the "meta" trial sets. I actually found most of those meta sets to be detrimental in most content outside of trials. Yeah, you can do amazing DPS, like 10x more than is required for almost all content in the game... but you are squishy and need to rely on other players doing their role 100%, or you are pretty much screwed.

lolo_01b16_ESO

With the stickerbook and the option to reconstruct all those sets if you ever need them again I'd deconstruct them unless you plan to use them in the near future.

My opinion on the sets you listed:
- gryphon, dreugking and rattlecage all provide a buff which you can get from other sources relatively easy. So unless you explicitly want to avoid all other sources that provide these buffs, I'd rate those sets weaker than crafted hundings / julianos.
- deadland requires a heavy attack which I personally avoid as much as possible
- nirn / red mountain can be decent. An experienced player with a flawless rotation will benefit more from sets that increase his stats, but if you have slower fingers or a less optimized rotation the automatic damage can be quite useful.
- sword dancer / singer are usually weaker than crafted hundings unless you only use that specific weapon. But since there are nice powerfull skills in other trees, like your class or guilds, it's generally not worth using those sets.
- automation can be good if you only use those damage types. It's a bit weaker than the meta sets you listed, but not too bad.

markulrich1966

it really depends on your playstyle and content.

I get highest DPS with Medusa/Mothers Sorow on a dummy if I use every other option to increase the crit chance.

I however perform worse with these 2 sets in the content I play, soloing worldbosses and speed clearing delves to farm daily rewards.
I have better results with rattlecage + NMA on magplars,
and Mothers Sorrow and Torugs Pact on magsorcerers.
Another set I use on magplars and dragonknights is Dark Convergence, even after the massive nerf, as the pull allows me to kill mobs quickly dealing the damage DC is missing with puncturing strikes or fire breath.

So solo play / PVP / vet dungeons + trials are completely different pairs of shoes, as in the first 2 you usually can not keep up the rotation required for many sets. In this case, a set with 100% uptime like rattlecage or dreugh king slayer can be the better choice than getting major sorcery/brutality from skills or potions.

francesinhalover

Those 5 sec sets on main bar are for trials and maybe vet dlc dungs... If you just want to do overland, bosses , chill , normal dungs just use what ever.

Id focus on sets with visual effects like unfathomable darkness , briarheart , aurorans thunder , plague slinger ,aegis caller , shadow of red montain , defiler, syvarras scales, caluurions legacy is awesome you hear a demon laugh lol.

Vmol sets like alkosh always have effects on.

Toothrow is alright has a hundings replacement if you dont wana use potions.

Para bellum gives shields

starkerealm

LiteEmUp wrote: »

I know that sets like kinra's, bahsei's, tzog's, reloq's, medusa's are the ones everyone should go with if you want your life easier in the game... but i like to play around with non-meta's too to have a different experience than the rest of people playing this game... googling the eso forums or the internetz is not entirely useful, as previous patches has changed the game so much to make some old sets usable again under certain conditions...

so what is everyone's opinions on these sets?? worth keeping or straight into decon mode??

• gryphon ferocity = gives minor force like tzogvin(maybe an alt for tzog), but not backbar-able like tzogvin.. seems easier to maintain than tzogvin.. and its medium armor as well, so highly usable for stam builds.. and best part is its easier to obtain than tzogvin..

At this point, I'd say crunch Gryphon. It had its time, but unless you're actively using it, I'd think about trading up. If you think you might use the set someday, keep your purple (or gold) jewelry for a set, but crunch the rest.

LiteEmUp wrote: »

• dreugh king slayer = seems to be an alternative to kinra, due to giving 20% weap/spell damage at all times and similar bonus from 2-4 piece.. easier to maintain than kinra, but does not transfer when bar swapping.. and easier to obtain, due to droppable in fungal grotto...
• rattlecage = very similar to dreugh king as well... so another alt to kinra?

There's a couple of niche applications here. First, if you're on a class (and weapon) that doesn't have easy access to Brutality/Sorcery, these can be nice. Second, these do have potential use in vMA, as a damage set that can smoothly swap in pieces of heavy if you want heavy perks, and Expedition on kill is nice to have (though, less critical now that it's also available as a CP.)

So, there are uses. However, both are pretty easy to collect, so if you have reliable access to a transmute station, I'd only worry about keeping the jewelry.

LiteEmUp wrote: »

• deadland assassin = i personally compared this to NMA, due to the nearly same amount of weapon/spell damage bonus it provides.. nma has other good stats bonuses as well, in exchange for skill cost increase.. da does not provide crit chance or offensive pen, but it has a bleed dot proc and no skill cost increase... also seems easier to obtain due to being an overland set...
• pillar of nirn = seems easier to proc and maintain for a dot proc.. not sure if its really good, but i've seen some guides for deadlands dlc now recommend this for stamina builds, even for pve...

I've, legitimately, had one of the senior devs recommend Pillar as a fun set. Not necessarily, "good," but it can be entertaining to run. I'd class Deadland Assassin into the same category. If you enjoy running it, and you're not overly worried about being the best, it's cute.

LiteEmUp wrote: »

• shadow of red mountain = easier to obtain due to being an overland set.. seems to be a pvp set.. not sure if good or not, but i recall seeing a youtube video where this is recommended as possible good pvp set for deadlands dlc..

PvP is a very different situation. However, if Red Mountain fits with what your build is doing, go for it. If you're on a werewolf, choose Ashen Grip instead, it is freakin' hilarious to watch it proc while transformed.

LiteEmUp wrote: »

• strength of the automaton/sword dancer/sword singer = same stats for 2-4 piece bonus.. very specific sets for 2hander/dualwield... are the "high" weapon/spell damage bonus only usable for the weapon skill lines worth it????

In general, no. The single line/damage type sets are not likely to be worth using unless you specifically build for them. However, if you have a build where all your damage is physical anyway (Stam Sorcs will see this sometimes) then Automaton may be a legitimate pick. Swamp Raider might be worth using on a Werewolf or DK. But, these are really unusual circumstances.

There is an adjacent exception, Blood Drinker can be pretty useful on the right setup, but that's because it's +15%, and not just +600 weapon damage.

francesinhalover

I run rele , briarheart , stormf , ma bow.

Why rele? Cuz im stam sorce and it makes tornados.
Why briar... Cuz i lack the gold for other sets lol cLuurions looks fun [snip]

[edited for profanity bypass]

Ippokrates

It is all math.

The more numbers you gather, the better result you will have. So basically sets with bonuses you can obtain from skills or potions, will rather be inferior to sets with "unique" bonuses.

But there is plenty of non-meta sets that could pull some nice numbers, like Azure, Neren/Stormfist, Master's 2h, Dragonguard Elite, Maelstrom DW, Yandir - you just need to check what fits which of them will work for you - on PTS you can do it easily (except jewelry traits ;p ) and without wasting materials.

Kwoung

Ippokrates wrote: »

It is all math.

The more numbers you gather, the better result you will have. So basically sets with bonuses you can obtain from skills or potions, will rather be inferior to sets with "unique" bonuses.

But there is plenty of non-meta sets that could pull some nice numbers, like Azure, Neren/Stormfist, Master's 2h, Dragonguard Elite, Maelstrom DW, Yandir - you just need to check what fits which of them will work for you - on PTS you can do it easily (except jewelry traits ;p ) and without wasting materials.

Whats up with jewelry traits on PTS, this some recent issue? I don't go there too much, but never had an issue with jewelry there previously.

CasgarTheSomnolent

I support playing around 100%. Actually, I just installed PTS for the first time, because I wanted to go experiment with a bunch of my hypotheses for free. (I don't know why I didn't do this long ago.)

So, the thing about "the PVE meta" in ESO is that it's all trials.* And the trial-spinoff minigame of dummy humping. There are some fine solo builds out there, but there are absolutely zero four-man builds. Zero. This, in my opinion, is an absolute failure of the ESO content creation community and a major disservice to a huge number of players who are NOT interested in high-level trials.

See, the weird thing is that ZOS really likes making dungeons. 4-man dungeons. They make four DLC dungeons per year, and they actually advertise and market them. They only make one trial a year, and it's buried in the chapter release. Yet, there is zero thought put into builds for 4-man content. For example, every single stam build has [Perfected] Relequen as their indisputable top stam set. Relequen is a great set...for single stationary damage sponges. Trial bosses and the trial dummy. It's absolutely worthless in a dungeon, because you'll almost never be able to concentrate all your stacks on one target and keep them up while you're moving around and surviving. Secondary stam meta set forever was Advancing Yokeda (Berserking Warrior.) It's a set that is even more worthless in anything but trials given how hard the stacks are to keep up. After blindly following all the advice out there for a while, I started to actually think about what any of my gear and skills were doing to help me in dungeons and arenas. Almost nothing was the answer. You'll probably have the same experience pursuing what you want to do.

So, given the complete lack of any guidance for all but a niche within a niche in the ESO playerbase, what are we to do? Experiment, that's what. And that's fine. And kind of fun. You are your own content creator, because there isn't anyone else. So, have at it. Ask questions like "What do I really need?" and "With what I'm doing, is this practical or not?" Slot heals. Play 2H for the survivability. DW is, again, mainly only useful for trials and dummies. I suggest using solo builds as a base to build off of. Alcast doesn't neglect to publish solo builds, and they're way closer to the vast majority of content.

In terms of actually playtesting your creations and modifications, I suggest vet Maelstrom and vet Vateshran. Those will put you through your paces and expose weaknesses and strengths in your design to a major degree. That's where you can really learn stuff at your own pace without feeling like you're hindering the rest of your group. Don't spend too much time on dummies, and spend even less time on the trial dummy. That's for standardizing parses, but it's not realistic in most content where you have to provide your own penetration, sustain, survival, and other buffs. The 6M dummies are a better test.

With any suggestions you see, ask yourself or someone else why choices were made. Why this skill instead of that one? Why this set instead of that one? What do you get from each thing, are there any overlaps, are there damage tradeoffs you're willing to make for sustain and survival and group utility? Yeah, group utility. You're not a unitasker. Even though I'm a stamblade DPS, I never enter a vet dungeon trying to do a no-death or trifecta run without having Reviving Barrier on my back bar, because you never know if someone else has it and when you might need it. It's saved our butts countless times. Don't take anything as incontrovertible gospel, because, again, most of that stuff is only perfectly applicable in incredibly specific situations. Everything is simply a template that you will be smarter at adapting to yourself.

Ok, that turned into a bit of a rant, but it's right in line with what I've been doing recently: deconstructing and reconstructing my character builds based on my playstyle. I've learned a lot. And it's been kind of fun. If you want to try something, give it a shot. And it you want to try lots of things, give it a shot on PTS, so you don't bankrupt yourself. You have my full permission and support to buck the meta and go come up with your own better solution.

---

* No, I didn't forget about my asterisk. There are some suggestions in this thread of creators that don't go exactly parallel with the grain, and I think that's good, and they're worth checking out. Xynode's very good at explaining his reasoning behind his builds, so you can actually learn his logic behind everything as opposed to having to try to dissect a Combat Metrics parse screenshot. Look for advice like that, compare with other builds, listen to your gut about what feels more right to you, and don't let anyone tell you that "so-and-so doesn't make good builds." I also really do think Alcast does an excellent job of giving you options. Look at his solo builds and his alternate builds for each class for comparison and contrast. His personal website is an absolute wealth of information and eso-hub.com, which he also runs, is another trove of more general game information. In the end, by putting in the effort to diversify your data input (including from yourself), you'll be rewarded by creating something that feels really good to you. Good luck.

RaptorRodeoGod

Pillar of Nirn is one of the best proc sets now. You should absolutely keep it. People be sleeping on it hard right now

colossalvoids

I'd say keep deadlands for pvp, pillar of Nirn is really good for pve currently and shadow of a red mountain can be not bad for both pve and pvp if you're going for a theme, even after the nerfs it got.
Automaton can be still used well on a stamsorc I'd assume when lacking any better options and running exclusively physical damage sources.

Kwoung

CasgarTheSomnolent wrote: »

<snip>

That was quite awesome, thanks for writing all that out. It is actually quite sad that the content creators have mostly convinced everyone that wearing Trial gear is the only way to go. I can't tell you how many folks I know that think slapping on whatever the current trial meta is will work in everyday content, most of those folks never having stepped in a trial and having no intentions of doing so. It is really a disservice to the community at large.

colossalvoids

Kwoung wrote: »

CasgarTheSomnolent wrote: »

<snip>

That was quite awesome, thanks for writing all that out. It is actually quite sad that the content creators have mostly convinced everyone that wearing Trial gear is the only way to go. I can't tell you how many folks I know that think slapping on whatever the current trial meta is will work in everyday content, most of those folks never having stepped in a trial and having no intentions of doing so. It is really a disservice to the community at large.

The thing is that most of creators are actually putting spoilers in their videos, like it's trial oriented build performing best in optimised, 12 man group scenarios etc. but players just pretend if it's hitting best on a fully debuffed dummy it would do same for any dungeon or arena. And it's not, obviously, and content creators are not much going into options for that kind of stuff nowadays a lot as to them it's a given to have different build for such activities, they just do different thing. Also there build levels are different now, one can go "old school" way into arena or a dungeon and some would go full on with vamp and burn bosses in couple of seconds. Before it was a bit different as people were generally running pfg/vo at any player skill level there but it's not a thing anymore. So there's a lot of freedom to choose from accordingly to your playstyle.

Maybe there's lack of content creators of a more wider range compared to what we had 3-4 years ago (also a lot of players who helped out just left) and how they overall present their builds but it's a player issue also, not to mention zenimax changing stuff up every time rendering their efforts useless so quick trial build showcase is what's getting released the most.

wheresbes

Gryphon's Ferocity + Rattlecage (jewellery & weapons) seem amazing for "lazy" stamina DDs out there. Imagine keeping up only 3 dots and forgoing pots, yay! For normal/solo stuff would work great.

I don't enjoy much proc sets, so I use Rattlecage in PVP, it boosts SP/WP a lot.

Red Mountain visually is awesome not very useful IMO.

francesinhalover

Kwoung wrote: »

CasgarTheSomnolent wrote: »

<snip>

That was quite awesome, thanks for writing all that out. It is actually quite sad that the content creators have mostly convinced everyone that wearing Trial gear is the only way to go. I can't tell you how many folks I know that think slapping on whatever the current trial meta is will work in everyday content, most of those folks never having stepped in a trial and having no intentions of doing so. It is really a disservice to the community at large.

I mean... Outside vet trials and vet dung... You dont really need dmg... Unless you mean vma (alcast has builds focused on vma).

Relequeen takes a while to apply full effect but is just a really good dps set, i dont see a reason to ever unequip it.
And that ring that restores hp (you get it from scrying) hard carrys you.


I do wish quest bosses had higher hp though. I try nerfing my dmg but i still melt all quest stuff.

That being said you can use many diff things on the main bar i guess.

Kwoung

francesinhalover wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

CasgarTheSomnolent wrote: »

<snip>

That was quite awesome, thanks for writing all that out. It is actually quite sad that the content creators have mostly convinced everyone that wearing Trial gear is the only way to go. I can't tell you how many folks I know that think slapping on whatever the current trial meta is will work in everyday content, most of those folks never having stepped in a trial and having no intentions of doing so. It is really a disservice to the community at large.

I mean... Outside vet trials and vet dung... You dont really need dmg... Unless you mean vma (alcast has builds focused on vma).

Relequeen takes a while to apply full effect but is just a really good dps set, i dont see a reason to ever unequip it.
And that ring that restores hp (you get it from scrying) hard carrys you.


I do wish quest bosses had higher hp though. I try nerfing my dmg but i still melt all quest stuff.

That being said you can use many diff things on the main bar i guess.

Sounds like you are probably a pretty decent player, maybe even better than that. Sadly though, most players in ESO don't seem to be, and builds more attuned to their type of play really need more "air time". And while Relequen is a great set, the 3 piece bonus is lost on the folks who don't do that content, many also don't have access to Mythic's like Ring of the Pale Order and it takes doing Trials in the first place to even get Rele. Luckily there are still a few content creators out there I mentioned previously, who have stuff like one-bar and really amazing solo builds, that don't require a Mythic or Trials. My current build is pretty much unkillable unless I really screw up (25K health + 22K Shields), and it is a overland / easy dungeon set mix that almost anyone can obtain, and doesn't require expensive food or weapon damage potions, because those buffs are built in.

I haven't bothered parsing it, because it does what it is supposed to, and I also can pretty much one-hit an AE pull with it in normal dungeons, and burn bosses down with ease in short order. Soloing world bosses has never been easier or quicker, because when I soloed them in trial builds, there was a lot to worry about and it could go south real fast, because that ring can't help you if you miss the wrong block.

Jazraena

Even Veteran Dungeon are a very different ballpark to an optimized trial group, in particular if you don't have a static 4 man team whose builds sync up perfectly.

The differences in provided sustain and penetration alone are already a reason to build differently on the DPS side. Tanks and Healers too - I tend to err on the side of a lot more self-reliance for dungeons.

Ippokrates

Kwoung wrote: »

Ippokrates wrote: »

It is all math.

The more numbers you gather, the better result you will have. So basically sets with bonuses you can obtain from skills or potions, will rather be inferior to sets with "unique" bonuses.

But there is plenty of non-meta sets that could pull some nice numbers, like Azure, Neren/Stormfist, Master's 2h, Dragonguard Elite, Maelstrom DW, Yandir - you just need to check what fits which of them will work for you - on PTS you can do it easily (except jewelry traits ;p ) and without wasting materials.

Whats up with jewelry traits on PTS, this some recent issue? I don't go there too much, but never had an issue with jewelry there previously.

You have only basic traits on jewelry and quite limited number of TC. For few sets it is fine, but for more, you need to create new alt -_-

DinoZavr

The set you have listed:
- Gryphon is very nice for low level toons. I decon it as there are other sources of Minor Force
- DKS: good farming set, but Major Brutality is so easy on WW just by slotting Hircine's Bounty. i decon it
- Rattlecage. i decon for the same reason
- Deadlands Assassin - i avoid heavy attacks and prefer DragonGuards Elite, so decon for me
- Pillar of Nirn - i keep it for PVP where it is still fun set to use
- Red Mountain is kinda niche for DKs
- Automaton is OK on sorcerers, also kinda niche
- Sword Dancer and Sword Singer are decon for me, especially Sword Singer - you get more from NMA or Diamond Victory

Larcomar

As others have said, what might be meta for trials often isn't good for dungeons. In particular I find sets that ramp up / need you to maintain stacks don't work that well in dungeons where stuff dies pretty fast. You're better off with something more basic then.

gryphon ferocity = not backbar-able like tzogvin but I think tzog has a ramp up. Might well to better in faster content. Ive never gotten aroudn to using it though. Barbed trap is pretty good for stam dps.

rattlecage = very niche. I use on my magplar for light tanking when I want a bit of heavy and don't have the bar space (or can't be bothered) to run entropy. Tbh though, she gets better jabs runnign something liek deadly even without major sorcery.

deadland assassin = tried it a coupel of times. It synergies well in pvp with vateshran 2h. Might be worth keeping but I prefer other builds.

strength of the automaton = I run it on my stamsorc. Almost all his dps is physical. Its not meta obv but he does pretty well with that and briarheart

sword dancer/sword singer = played around with the 2h one occasionally when Im bb a snb but tbh was underwhelmed. Doesn't buff you're other stuff, and on most stam toons there's a lot of that eg shalks, blastbone, grim focus....

AuraStorm43

Alcast and Xynode “builds” are pretty mediocre, Alcast barely updates his website and Xynode has builds that don’t work

We actually have a diverse meta with plenty of options yet people still want “off meta” builds which, why? Do you like ignoring objectively good sets?

tzaeru

In the end, the difference between DPS on the best meta setup vs very good setup is, at most, around 10%.

That wont stop you from doing everything you want if you are otherwise a very solid player. I'm sure a top guild could even shoot for the leaderboards with some of their DDs dropping a potential 10% of their damage by playing a setup they enjoy more than the current top meta.

One thing is that a good off-meta setup quickly becomes a meta setup, just not the top meta setup.

Aside of what you mentioned, you totally can also run Mantle of Siroria, Mother’s Sorrow, False God’s Devotion, monster sets like Nerien'eth's etc.

Even things like War Maiden and Burning Spellweave can be made to work with a good build and a player who knows what they're doing.

Maybe you'll end up parsing 80k instead of 90k, but really.. So what? Even if you are playing for the leaderboards, if you hate running the same thing that everyone else runs, you're better off losing some potential damage over gaining a lot more motivation. Motivation keeps you running a tight rotation and from becoming too sloppy.

If you were a raid leader, and someone went "ugh I'm tired of running this Bahsei + Kinras + Kilt thing, and I can do 95% of that damage on this another setup I created" would you rather let them run that set or kick them out?

Grandchamp1989

AuraStorm43 wrote: »

Alcast and Xynode “builds” are pretty mediocre, Alcast barely updates his website and Xynode has builds that don’t work

We actually have a diverse meta with plenty of options yet people still want “off meta” builds which, why? Do you like ignoring objectively good sets?

Builds that don't work? lol what, how?

AuraStorm43

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

AuraStorm43 wrote: »

Alcast and Xynode “builds” are pretty mediocre, Alcast barely updates his website and Xynode has builds that don’t work

We actually have a diverse meta with plenty of options yet people still want “off meta” builds which, why? Do you like ignoring objectively good sets?

Builds that don't work? lol what, how?

A heavy armor healing build doesn’t work

Kwoung

Ippokrates wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

Ippokrates wrote: »

It is all math.

The more numbers you gather, the better result you will have. So basically sets with bonuses you can obtain from skills or potions, will rather be inferior to sets with "unique" bonuses.

But there is plenty of non-meta sets that could pull some nice numbers, like Azure, Neren/Stormfist, Master's 2h, Dragonguard Elite, Maelstrom DW, Yandir - you just need to check what fits which of them will work for you - on PTS you can do it easily (except jewelry traits ;p ) and without wasting materials.

Whats up with jewelry traits on PTS, this some recent issue? I don't go there too much, but never had an issue with jewelry there previously.

You have only basic traits on jewelry and quite limited number of TC. For few sets it is fine, but for more, you need to create new alt -_-

Yeah... you need to create a max level character there and grab the transmute & jewelry stations from the crown store. You get an unlimited supply of all mats, transmutes and have every skill unlocked/trained on PTS chars, if you choose the create at max level option in the upper left corner, so you can then make or change anything you want. Other wise you are limited to whatever your main char can do, if that char is even on the PTS (it isn't 1/2 the time). I actually prefer re-making characters and a small home base over there than having my chars transferred.

etchedpixels

AuraStorm43 wrote: »

A heavy armor healing build doesn’t work

If you go into PVP it most certainly does, and in fact a light armoured healer is basically only useful as a walking target in PVP. You can get sustain by doing a lot of ranged heavy attacks. I love those enemy sorcs with their pets and the newbs who stand on the edge of battlements so I can use them as magicka pools.

In PvE it works too - but significantly less effectively than a light armour healer, so it's not a good build there for any kind of speed. A sword/board and resto staff heavy armour healer is however pretty decent when soloing dungeons. Also quite useful sometimes in pug runs because you can queue as tank and you don't care if you get yet another fake healer.

As to the sets they sometimes have niche uses or work well when levelling. Dreugh King is a great set when you are like level 15 and climbing the hill the first time because at that point you probably don't have a good source for the buff, ditto things like treasure hunter. Not all sets are designed for level 50 end game. Two pieces trainee for example is often best to 45, and then one piece trainee/one piece monster shoulders to 49.

Sword Singer is another good levelling set for new players because the jewellery is easy to get and the other couple of pieces can be found in delves, and chests etc. It's no relequen or kinras but it'll get you going.

Dagoth_Rac

Ippokrates wrote: »

Kwoung wrote: »

Ippokrates wrote: »

It is all math.

The more numbers you gather, the better result you will have. So basically sets with bonuses you can obtain from skills or potions, will rather be inferior to sets with "unique" bonuses.

But there is plenty of non-meta sets that could pull some nice numbers, like Azure, Neren/Stormfist, Master's 2h, Dragonguard Elite, Maelstrom DW, Yandir - you just need to check what fits which of them will work for you - on PTS you can do it easily (except jewelry traits ;p ) and without wasting materials.

Whats up with jewelry traits on PTS, this some recent issue? I don't go there too much, but never had an issue with jewelry there previously.

You have only basic traits on jewelry and quite limited number of TC. For few sets it is fine, but for more, you need to create new alt -_-

I am pretty sure the crafting material boxes on PTS are recursive. That is, each one contains a copy of itself. So if you run out, there should always be another box to open. I no longer have PTS installed, but I seem to recall transmuting stuff on PTS without worrying about running out of crystals.

AuraStorm43

etchedpixels wrote: »

AuraStorm43 wrote: »

A heavy armor healing build doesn’t work

If you go into PVP it most certainly does, and in fact a light armoured healer is basically only useful as a walking target in PVP. You can get sustain by doing a lot of ranged heavy attacks. I love those enemy sorcs with their pets and the newbs who stand on the edge of battlements so I can use them as magicka pools.

In PvE it works too - but significantly less effectively than a light armour healer, so it's not a good build there for any kind of speed. A sword/board and resto staff heavy armour healer is however pretty decent when soloing dungeons. Also quite useful sometimes in pug runs because you can queue as tank and you don't care if you get yet another fake healer.

As to the sets they sometimes have niche uses or work well when levelling. Dreugh King is a great set when you are like level 15 and climbing the hill the first time because at that point you probably don't have a good source for the buff, ditto things like treasure hunter. Not all sets are designed for level 50 end game. Two pieces trainee for example is often best to 45, and then one piece trainee/one piece monster shoulders to 49.

Sword Singer is another good levelling set for new players because the jewellery is easy to get and the other couple of pieces can be found in delves, and chests etc. It's no relequen or kinras but it'll get you going.

His build is primarily meant for PVE, and even in PVP being in heavy armor as a healer is a waste, same with using a sword and board

Just use crafted sets while leveling they’re easy to make