Hrothgar calculations bugged?

Theignson

On my warden with Pariah, Hrothgar hit me for 4600. Meh, no big deal, it was about right: I had ~50k total resists, (50x.26)x.5 = 6500, plus it is mitigated.

But on My Stamblade, running solo, I was meleeing one AD when another ran up. My stamblade has 26k resists, so the max hit shou1ld be ~ 3380. Also, I was solo, and no other players were around that I saw.
My stamblade was hit for 12400 ! from Hrothgar.
So is the set bugged? Has anyone else seen this?
The player who ran up and added on was running full cheese, the first hit was frenzied momentum, then Hrothgar, then he procced Dark Convergence. Maybe some combinations of sets mess up the calculations?

Anyone else see mathematically impossible Hrothgar hits? Am I overlooking something in the calculations?

katorga

Don't get hit with the AOE damage from the person nearby with the highest armor?

Theignson

Did you even read the post? No other EP players nearby.

Also, to get a 12,400 Hrothgar damage, the player hit would have to have 97,000 total resists (ignoring mitigation). I have never seen resists that high

Zekka

Definitely bugged.
It seems that when it's triggered by an AoE stun, it uses the sum of all the stunned people's resistances in its calculation.
All the crazy 20k procs I've seen were from AoE stuns/roots (Streak, Bombard, Arctic Blast etc...).

SkaraMinoc

(12400 * 1.39) / (0.26 * 0.5) = 132584 total resist

~110k is about the max total resist you'll see on a player

It's possible you had resist debuff and the enemy player had +10%/+5% damage Berserk buff.

SkaraMinoc

Also don't forget some players have 20k+ spell penetration. So 12k hit is not unreasonable given the calculation.

(12400) / (0.26 * 0.5) = 95384 total resist

I have 48k + 46k resist in my PvP tank build before Pariah. With Pariah I have > 100k total resist.

You most likely got hit by a spell pen build and your teammate was a tank.

Nser

The set is buggy and someone people using it in pvp.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler

Nser

Nser wrote: »

The set is buggy and someone people using it in pvp.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler

so many people using it ATM*

Wing

it seems a little buggy, i feel like a number of . . .numbers, might be off this update.

in any case im making a new character specifically for using these sets, they are just too effective in pvp to bother using anything else.

Nser

Wing wrote: »

it seems a little buggy, i feel like a number of . . .numbers, might be off this update.

in any case im making a new character specifically for using these sets, they are just too effective in pvp to bother using anything else.

its not fun to using broken set

Theignson

Zekka wrote: »

Definitely bugged.
It seems that when it's triggered by an AoE stun, it uses the sum of all the stunned people's resistances in its calculation.
All the crazy 20k procs I've seen were from AoE stuns/roots (Streak, Bombard, Arctic Blast etc...).

Whoa, amazing comment, never occurred to me. If it sums ALL the resists in an AOE stun that is crazy.

I got stunned, but AFTER the Hrothgar, from Volcanic rune, which the Cheese build was using to proc Dark convergence.

Since I didn't get stunned before the Hrothgar, I guess there MUST have been other EP around that I didn't see, who got stunned by AOE and spread it to me-- even though I was running as a solo low resist NB

Theignson

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Also don't forget some players have 20k+ spell penetration. So 12k hit is not unreasonable given the calculation.

(12400) / (0.26 * 0.5) = 95384 total resist

I have 48k + 46k resist in my PvP tank build before Pariah. With Pariah I have > 100k total resist.

You most likely got hit by a spell pen build and your teammate was a tank.

Yes but with zero resists the max hit is defined by the 26% of your total resisits. On my Warden, for example, the max calculated hit was around 6500, I mitigated it to 4600. So spell penetration etc is not supposed to affect how hard this hits.

I think the other comment is more likely: the set is calculating the total resists in the entire AOE stun.

In that case, can you imagine what a leap would do?

Pymad

The main damage is not bugged but the AoE resulting from the set is bugged as it seems to ignore resistance and Cyrodiil battle's spirit. So the main target will get 4-6k (eventually more) but people around will take at least two times this value.

TimeDazzler

Something is wrong with it, I got hit for 5k one time but then 12k another time wearing the exact same gear. I know that putting fracture on the target will reduce the damage the proc deals, but does anyone know if having additional penetration will, like maces or sharpened trait?

SkaraMinoc

Pymad wrote: »

it seems to ignore resistance

Edit: I need to do more testing to confirm why this is doing so much damage.

Pymad

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Pymad wrote: »

it seems to ignore resistance

I was just going to make a separate thread about this. The player's resist is completely ignored.

40k resist target should receive 5200 damage but receives 10400 damage.

80000 * 0.26 * 0.5 * ((33000/660)/100) = 5200
80000 * 0.26 * 0.5 = 10400

It also appears Toughness is ignored as well.

Yeah I didn't do precise test about calculations but I'm sure this is the AoE which is problematic. I also see that depending on the initial target, the damage AoE will remain huge but depends (as intended) on the initial target resistance.
Seeing values I guess this come from ignoring BattleSpirit (which is not a new bug on AoE proc) and resistance. May something else is bugged but they have to work on this part.

But why are talking about Toughness ? This is a health buff (10%) this does not interfere with Hrothgar proc.

divnyi

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Pymad wrote: »

it seems to ignore resistance

I was just going to make a separate thread about this. The player's resist is completely ignored.

40k resist target should receive 5200 damage but receives 10400 damage.

80000 * 0.26 * 0.5 * ((33000/660)/100) = 5200
80000 * 0.26 * 0.5 = 10400

It also appears Toughness is ignored as well.

How can you explain 19.5k damage above with that?
Or do we have a case where it sums all armor from all the players hit by CC in a single motion, AND also ignores resists?

Anyway it is huge and needs to be nerfed asap @ZOS_GinaBruno

Pymad

divnyi wrote: »

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Pymad wrote: »

it seems to ignore resistance

I was just going to make a separate thread about this. The player's resist is completely ignored.

40k resist target should receive 5200 damage but receives 10400 damage.

80000 * 0.26 * 0.5 * ((33000/660)/100) = 5200
80000 * 0.26 * 0.5 = 10400

It also appears Toughness is ignored as well.

How can you explain 19.5k damage above with that?
Or do we have a case where it sums all armor from all the players hit by CC in a single motion, AND also ignores resists?

Anyway it is huge and needs to be nerfed asap @ZOS_GinaBruno

I test it for the sum of all players and this is not that. But this is ignoring resistance (10400 in this example) and the 0.5 multiplier from battle spirit (so 20800 in this case).

SkaraMinoc

Pymad wrote: »

But why are talking about Toughness ? This is a health buff (10%) this does not interfere with Hrothgar proc.

Sorry I meant Protection. Actually need to do more testing with this to confirm.

Pymad

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Pymad wrote: »

But why are talking about Toughness ? This is a health buff (10%) this does not interfere with Hrothgar proc.

Sorry I meant Protection. Actually need to do more testing with this to confirm.

Ah yeah, this is possible.

Zekka

Update: the new theory is that the AoE part of Hrothgar completely ignores battle spirit sometimes.
That would explain why I never took a direct 20k proc, it was always from the AoE part.

Penta

Please fix this Zos, getting hit for 11-12k damage from Hrothgar's in BGs is no fun. =( Nobody on my team was even tanky, 4 glass cannon casters.

Theignson

Update on the Hrothgar proc bug.

I ran it on my DK. I hit 6 people with Talons and procced Hrothgar in Cyrodil. Each was hit between 5-7k damage. So, nowehre near the 12k of the original post. Also, it did NOT add the sum of their reisst and apply it to eahc person.

BUT I was hit by another DK who used Talons to proc it. Three of EP were hit. I was hit for 19400 !!

Of course a 19.4k hit is impossible given the set description. That implies 149,000 resists!!

BUT here is the key: the other DK had hit his corrosive armor ulti. Corrosive now ignores spell resists.

Maybe this is one of the bugs; if the person wearing hrothgar casts Corrosive it bugs the calculation

Valgar0r

@GinaBruno, @ZOS_BrianWheeler, Working as intended ? I try to figure out how 1 tick of Hrothgar's Chill set can deal 21K damage on my stamplar with 20K resistance

SkaraMinoc

Hrothgar is bugged. It's doing double what it should.

80k total resist should never receive more than 5-6k yet it hits for 10-12k consistently.

Theignson

Update.

I tested Corrosive armor-- it did not cause the huge Hrothgar hit.

But later, I hit 2 players with talons. One was hit for 4500, the other one for 15000.

Another player I hit for 19k. No idea why

Many other times it is 3-7k

Seems completely random. I can't figure it out yet

Greek_Hellspawn

Theignson wrote: »

But later, I hit 2 players with talons. One was hit for 4500, the other one for 15000.

Maybe it hits harder the more enemies you hit? Like the first person gets hit for his armor value then the second gets hit for both his and the first opponents armor value.

Theignson

Greek_Hellspawn wrote: »

Theignson wrote: »

But later, I hit 2 players with talons. One was hit for 4500, the other one for 15000.

Maybe it hits harder the more enemies you hit? Like the first person gets hit for his armor value then the second gets hit for both his and the first opponents armor value.

No, see a couple posts up. I hit 6 players ( you can see it in combat metrics scroll mode) and none was higher than 7k. But another DK hit me and 3 players with Talons and I got hit for 19k.

Can't see a pattern yet

Marcus_Aurelius

Just been hit for 12k while having Major+Minor protection

Can we have an update? Cause this thing is broken

spacefracking

8% from the new frostbite set
an extra 4% if chilled
10% if warden from passive
10% + 10% from whatever of the top right warfare passives apply
5% + 10% from major/minor berserk
+15% for that champion point when attacking someone with a shield on
+10% from destro staff passive
or +15% from dual wielding, hitting a disabled target
major/minor vuln, 15%

and probably some other un-named damage buffs I can't remember. That sums up to 99%-104%. Hit with full balorgh proc for full pen, which mean (resist-pen)/3300 = armor damage mitigation.

It could be bugged, and I think the strength and instant nature is significantly out of step damage and effect size with other Magicka procs like caluurion's and icy conjuror.

It's also possible that the damage calculation for this seems like it should be really simple to do, and obvious, as the tooltip claims it's just based off a stat you, the target, have access to. Damage calculation in this game is fairly complicated as there are a ton of potential modifiers. Learning allll of the ins and outs would take forever, but it is valuable to look into relevant ones, and talk to people who nerd out on this stuff, when putting together a build. A lot of the stuff around are something accidentally meta-ish that a truly gifted player poasted on YouTube with some clips. Spent like 8 hours over the last 2 days developing something awful with new mechanics that I need to practice in pve before annoying some people in pvp, if it works as well as I think it should. Thinking way too hard can pay off!

(And yeah, I know I probably got some stuff wrong with the napkin math above, but I'm not going to figure out which are additive/multiplicative and whatever else zos has done. Demonstrates the point tho)

SkaraMinoc

I'm making a Stam Sorc build for the first time and found Berserker Strike can give the player up to ~100k total resist extra.

https://eso-skillbook.com/skill/berserker-strike



So if the player already has 40k/40k total resist and uses Berserker Strike on an enemy tank with 50k/50k resist, the player's new total resist will be 80k+100k = 180k.

This would explain some of the insane Hrothgar hits we see.

180000 * 0.13 = 23400 damage before mitigation